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IT HAPPENED: One defective lithium-ion battery cell just killed 22 people | Auto Expert John Cadogan
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The chemicals released from a lithium battery fire, are far worse than petrol, oil or wood fires....
And people don't realize that it's not just inhalation that's dangerous. Simply getting the smoke on your skin can give you cobalt poisoning.
The chemicals released from a burning Lithium Thionyl Chloride battery (which is what was involved here) are far worse than an LFP EV battery or NMC for that matter. For starters, they include highly poisonous chlorine gas, hence people passing out after one or two breaths. In any car fire, including electric, the biggest source of toxins is burning plastic and rubber.
I don't know.
My farts can be pretty gruesome sometimes
Well, petrol/oil/wood needs to be on fire to release energy, whereas batteries, being on fire isn't a part of normal operation. A battery on fire is a failure; whereas combustables by definition require being on fire to operate.
Yup, going this route was just a bad idea from an overall ecology standpoint. We should be focusing on low emissions biofuels and hydrogen. Batteries are an easy short term solution. But the waste is large and dangerous.
Another nasty thing about Li-ion battery fires is that they can spontaneously reignite later.
So just for any reason at all that is impossible to predict? Tell us more, chemistry guy...
@@madmaxfzz I invite you to do a simple internet search.
@@madmaxfzz Yes, it's impossible to predict. Unless you put the battery into salt water, which nobody does...
@@madmaxfzz
Lithium reacts with water and water vaopur, hot enough directly with oxygen.
+10 Kelvin = around double reaction speed.
Hot enough lithium will reignite with oxygen.
But that in a enclosed space like battery case and the expanding gases will eventually explode the container.
Oh yeah the gas from the water reaction is hydrogen so highly volatile with oxygen.
YEP! There are stories of cars lighting back up 3 days after a major fire
I've been saying this for years, sadly. Ban ALL EV from ferries, tunnels, and parking garages, especially in apartment buildings....
sTEAM GUYS SAID SAMRE THING ABOUT PETROL CARS.. 1974 Ford Pintos blew up from simple rear end contacts.. Chevy and Ford put the fuel tanks IN the passengers cabin, many fried.. Ever seen an oil refinery blow up and burn? BANNING is not the way to solve problems..
Sooner or later the insurance companies will do just that
They now want more mega batteries to store power from solar and wind for towns and cities... this is not going to end well.
@@tonywheeldon1466 No different than fuel storage and refineries.. Ever seen an fuel refinery go up? They do.. and often..
@@ginog5037 we should all demand this ban be put into law.
Only after a politician's child goes full crispy critter in a Tesla will there be any kind of response to EV fire safety standards.
B b b b but muh Tesla and muh fake climate conspiracy. I love my EV, everyone should be forced to have one because reasons. Have to go now, need my 12th untested booster. 🇺🇦♥️SLAVA UKRAINI
Stop hiding your head in the sand, there are things going on in the world that you have no knowledge of.
The problem is Gavin Newsome flies a helicopter he doesnt drive an electric car
@@pippip8744 The absolute madness of social media politics. Its pretty common knowledge that people with 🇺🇦 in bio were mask wearing, vaxx pushing, rainbow fascists. Which is appropriate, because Ukraine has rehabilitated Hitler and Bandera. Even more appropriate is you trying to revise history and marry 🇺🇦 with the based crowd. Uh-uh.
I assume insurance have more power then any politician when it comes to what cars they will or will not insure. Insurance pulled out of california. Im sure they could refuse to insure evs. Not many can afford to self insure especially when such high risk of servere damage.
Every politician should be forced to keep 2 EVs, 3 Scooters, and a Recycled Battery Bank Solar Storage in a garage under their bedroom.
at least the ones who support all this nonsense like Gavin newsome. But wait......He flies a helicopter every day.....Oh and mandates his people to driver electric the hypocrite.
Even the ones that are against lithium ion batteries?
@@ToolHombre Sounds a bit fashy, fashy.
lol
Little gas car's are more reliable.
EV environmental friendly my foot
The big money grab. 💯💯💯👁️👁️🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🌎
You should take your foot out of your mouth.
@@Kickatubealong I don't have my foot in my mouth I'm a critical thinker tell me where I'm wrong. Do you realize how much is actually going to cost the United States of America. Something like 2 to 3 trillion dollars. Wake up
@@Kickatubealongewe drank the kool-aid. Good job
@@junglejarred6366 I do not want to argue with an idiot, you will take me down to your level and beat me with experience..
When Lithium batteries ignite things go bad very quickly, you have just seconds to get you and your family Out. .. Practice, practice a safe exit with your Family
Correction: BAN, BAN, BAN.
@@richardweyland116 If we had this attitude about every technology we take for granted that poses some kind of threat, we'd all still be living in mud huts.
@@richardweyland116 Yes! The Townhomes where I live have the bedrooms above the garage and I have 3 neighbors on my street that always park their Tesla in their garage to charge overnight. I'm glad none of these morons live in my building. It's a risk that I would never take!
Practice a safe exit from the dealership selling EV deathtraps
I know of 3 cargo ships that have caught fire with EVs on board. You never hear a cargo ship catching fire because of an ice car.
A car carrier catches fire almost every year but you never hear about it cos they don't make good clickbait. Google 'A Brief Look Back at Recent Car Carrier Fires' for an article covering ones from the last few years.
@@spankeyfish Yeah this one doesn't pass the smell test. You'd need to ask about all cases of cargo ship fires and start looking at causes to make any kind of fair comparison here.
Never, ever? Are you sure about that?? How many ICE cars versus EV cars are shipped in a time frame? Asking for a friend.
An ICE car catching fire on a csrgo ship is put out and contained, it does not take the ship down. EVs is however an internal fire that you cannot get to stop, it burns lika a torch and is a perfevt igniter for a chain reaction. A damaged battery pack can re-ignite after days... It is not safe until completely destroyed. I have actually seen an ICE car catch fire and burn, and extuingished by a hand held... An EV can burn underwater...
EV fires on car ferries are definitely A LOT worse but there’ve been some pretty horrific ICE fires on large car ferries, too.
Yes, and if you are in a tunnel under a city and an EV goes rogue, all the cars are banked up and people will be trying to flee, it's not a case of "IF" , you know the rest.
So how many times has that happened?
@@steveinoz8188 BurnleyTunnel fire in 2007 killed 3 people. It wasn't caused by EV, but when that eventually happens, the death toll will be a lot higher.
@@steveinoz8188 It hasn’t happened yet, but it will. It has to unfortunately- law of averages, and when it does it will be horrific. Do you lack the imagination to think what could happen in, for example, the Sydney Harbour Tunnel if an EV does the Runaway Flamethrower halfway thru?
read between the lines Sherlock @@steveinoz8188
@@davidshanahan5134 The Eurotunnel is particularly vulnerable - 120 cars and their passengers in a metal tube inside a tunnel. They will likely all die...
This is a Tesla model Y battery. It takes up all of the space under the passenger compartment of the car. To manufacture it you need:
o 12 tons of rock for Lithium (can also be extracted from sea water)
o 5 tons of Cobalt minerals (most Cobalt is made as a byproduct of processing Copper and Nickel ores and it is the most difficult and expensive material to obtain for a battery)
o 3 tons of Nickel ore
o 12 tons of Copper ore
You must move 250 tons of soil to obtain:
o 26.5 pounds of Lithium
o 30 pounds of Nickel
o 48.5 pounds of Manganese
o 15 pounds of Cobalt
To manufacture the battery also requires:
o 441 pounds of Aluminum, Steel and/or Plastic
o 112 pounds of Graphite
The Caterpillar 994A is used to move the earth to obtain the minerals needed for this battery. The Caterpillar consumes 264 gallons of diesel in 12 hours.
The bulk of necessary minerals for manufacturing the batteries come from China or Africa. Much of the labor in Africa is done by children. When you buy an electric car, China profits most.
The 2021 Tesla Model Y OEM battery (the cheapest Tesla battery) is currently for sale on the internet for $4,999 not including shipping or installation. The battery weighs 1,000 pounds (you can imagine the shipping cost). The cost of Tesla batteries are:
o Model 3 $14,000+ (Car MSRP $38,990)
o Model Y $5,000-$5,500 (Car MSRP $47,740)
o Model S $13,000-$20,000 (Car MSRP $74,990)
o Model X $13,000+ (Car MSRP $79,990)
It takes 7 years for an electric car to reach net-zero CO2. The life expectancy of the battery is 10 years (average). Only in the last 3 years do you start to reduce your carbon footprint, but then the batteries must be replaced and you lose all gains made.
And finally, some excellent points: I forgot to mention the amount of energy required to process the raw materials, for example in blast furnaces to process iron ore and others metals. And the amount of energy used to haul these batteries to around the globe, sometimes back and forth a couple of times.
But by all means, get an electric car. Just don't sell me on how awesome you are for the environment. Or for human rights.
You forgot that battery life shortens over time, so at that 7 years you may only have half of your original battery life available. Then there's the issue with temperature/discharge/life as well as load (weight carried or towed).
You're right, one could write books on it
Thanks for the info ! You don't come across such detail easily !
When I was a kid, my family and I went to town in our 80-something Ford Station Wagon. One of the errands was to swing by Pep Boys for some part.
Well, my dad and a tech came out, popped the hood, and next thing I know, dad's telling us to get out of the car. What happened was the sound-dampening material on the underside of the hood caught fire. The tech grabbed an ABC-rated fire extinguisher and was able to fully extinguish the fire!
Our day was not ruined, we did not lose the car, and most importantly we all went home safe and together.
All that to say, I'd rather take my chance with a fire in a vehicle with an ICE.
These batteries always scared me!
You should be scared, they're flat out dangerous. ... that's the reason we sold ours. I was afraid for my Family
@@Wendy-nm9zw *they are or they're flat out dangerous. Probably it's part of the population control system. Darwin awards incoming.
If it's Lithium batteries . beware, you could loose your life in seconds. They have a very unstable chemistry
I know of a guy that has them in his bedroom. btw. check out aubrey de grey
Then you better stop using your cell phone, or holding it up to your ear, or letting a tablet go on unattended, or placing a laptop on your lap.
Each and every one of these devices contains a lithium ion battery susceptible to swelling, explosion or fires.
i can't comment on South Korean Safety standards, but currently in Aus the management would release a statement saying they take safety seriously and are currently asisting authorities with their investigations. Meanwhile behind the scenes they would frantically be looking for scape goats.
👍👍
Blame lithium.
South Korea is pretty corrupt.
Over 2/3's of South Korea's major businesses are owned by a handful of families.
Deliberately setup by the US in the first 30 years of South Korea's existence as a state, where it was a brutal and murderous US backed autocracy...
G’day John. Silly question of the night. Do you know if there have been any official regulations been put in place for underground and multi-storey carparks ,both for office parking and residential parking? Charging station requirements?. (Definitely not in enclosed car parks.) . There is a terrible dearth of safety informations provided by the manufacturers of LiI products. Should be part of an upfront warning on any handbook of this sort of equipment. . I have known a faulty laptop battery raze a portable office, laptop was no good either. Cheers
lessons will be learnt BS evertime
Just for a bit of fun, I entered a post on Facebook attached to some EV safety article, and then sat back and read all the deniability of the risks of EV batteries, their more salient points being, smoke is not toxic, fires are easily extinguishable, less likely to occur (statistics are wonderful at bending results to one's will if taken with skewed context), and the aforementioned fires are not as hot as hydrocarbon fuel fires. And the most amusing was, that no EVs were involved or damaged by the recent-ish ship fire just off the Dutch coast.
I was labelled a "scare-monger" spouting unsubstantiated nonsense, even though I did point to a few articles in response until I got tired of reading their rants.
Amusing exercise, and ample proof that EV evangelists have a very blinkered view of the situation. I'm sure they'll look at this industrial incident as "false-news".
I'm not sure many of these EVangelist keyboard warriors are even real people. They're probably AI bots.
Many comments supporting the EV industry accuse everyone who dare to question their madness as "Luddites", At least the Luddites didn't burn the mills down.
They are also all vaccinated vax lovers
disconnect them from gas/electric grid
@@soulsacrify I agree with you about the nutty EV evangelicals, but what are we going to use when the oil runs out? We can not keep burning hydrocarbons like there is no tomorrow. In 30 years, oil reserves will be nearly depleted.
John.
Most apartment buildings have plumbing running from the units above to the garage underneath.
A tower in Neutral Bay Sydney way back in the early 2000’s had a simple garbage fire in the garage.
The heat went up, as heat does. Melted all the plastic plumbing right up the building. It was uninhabitable for a year while remediation occurred.
If an EV burned for 4 days in the same way….! ??? Noxious fumes trapped in the garage, no Fire Service access…!?
Think about that damage.
Councils and government have no guidelines for any of this, our Strata has discovered.
I am a voluntary firefighter. We train electric car scenarios with cars from different manufacturers, we have specialized tools to work on electric cars and we have iPads with a database containing information about all electric cars and instructions how to work on them.
Apart from that, when a car battery has reached the point of therman runaway, you probably can't extinguish it because of the "batteryfire makes its own oxygen"-problem.
So, in most cases, we are not only bystanders in uniform.
Back in about 1974 an old mate turned up in his EH wagon. All the paint on the bonnet was burnt black. Fuel line had come off the carb. Luckily he had a fire extinguisher. He put the fire out, fixed up the fuel line and continued around to my place.
I think I ended up buying that car!
also in 1974 are the MANY FORD pintos / cHJEVY vEGAS that got simple rear end collisions and blew up sky high.. Chevy and Ford used to put the fuel tanks in the Passenger cabins.. OF PICKUP TRUCKS..
@@southernyankeecustomuphols5480 Interceptors (Crown Vics) are notorious for cooking cops post rear-ending.
@southernyankeecustomuphols5480 yup, lesson there is cost cutting and corpo greed over saftey.
So very sorry for those poor people
There just sheep mate
@@gregchapman6056and so are you baaa
@GadgetMart I am steal laughing
@@gregchapman6056 steal?
You might be laughing but you ain’t spelling
@@GadgetMart
Maybe not, but he's smarter than you😂😂
Meanwhile, the Electric Viking is most likely ignoring this issue.
that guy is such a tool, from his thoughts to his fake hair.
That bloke is a clown, He's the type that are so Ignorant there Dangerous
Useful Idiots they call em 😮
@@orthopraxis235insulting people because you disagree is evidence of low intelligence
I think more of my species then that
You are better then that
If anyone tries to park an EV in my apartment building there are plenty of people in this building who would happily take baseball bats to the car. How dare anyone risk the lives of everyone who lives in an 18 story building? It makes people angry. Sprinklers can contain a petrol car fire, but no amount of sprinklers can contain an EV fire, and EV'S burn so hot they can bring down an entire 18 story building. No one has the right to endanger 18 floors of apartments. Once an apartment building goes up there will be significant opposition to EV's anywhere near housing and workplaces.
Most apartments can't get insurance to cover them if they allow ev parking. Now apartments are banning them, and rightfully so.
Once the technology exists to quenc a ev fire in seconds.. I will change my stance
And I am sure the Insurance companies are aware of this. when the Twin Towers went down, it was said that extreme heat caused the steel to lose its tensile strength and collapse the building. Goodbye your apartment block.
@@hillaryclinton1314 it does exist, it involves drowning the battery entirely underwater for several days.😂 In a carpark, well, that might be a logistics disaster.
That's a pretty insane stance to take; would you have the same position for any ICE car that set your apartment on fire?
Add this to two events in UK in the past few days. An E scooter partially destroyed 7 properties after catching fire charging overnight and a battery storage facility caught fire in Scotland resulting in local residents being told to stay indoors and keep windows shut tight!
It was 1 property in Gosport that set fire to another 7 so it’s 8 in total.
@@keegan773 I saw that. Terrible situation. Luckily no fatalities
Here, in California, May 14, there was a fire in a battery storage facility, it lasted for days, and the site was monitored by fire crews even longer, upto 17 days, because of reignition concerns. Your comment makes no mention of this fire. I don't fault you for not mentioning it because seeing that the battery storage facility was part of California's dream of carbon free energy there wasn't much in the way of news coverage. Sure, the population in the San Diego area should know, but the rest of the nation or the world? Your comment, again, supports my belief that California's ,one party, hacks squelched the story.
@@markthomas207 it was reported back in May but our 🇬🇧 Main Stream Media don’t like reporting on the failures of attaining the Holy Grail of Net Zero. We have to rely on independent media.
@@markthomas207 dude what the hell? When and where? I'm in san jose and didn't hear a peep about that.
This is just the beginning, the more of these huge lithium ion batteries we have around us , the bigger the disasters are going to get.
Batteries are getting safer. eg LFP chemistry batteries are hard to get to ignite.
No, better storage solutions and stricter demands towards manufacturing will ouwigh the potential harm, and manufacturers want to make money.
Compared to other industries, battery production and use has done pretty well.
Companies making cleaning products and fuel have had far more accidents.
@@steveinoz8188 you EV fanatics always have an excuse .. that isn't going to help with all the current Lithium Batteries already out there and they aren't stopping production anytime soon Steve
@steveinoz8188 Yep. That'll fix the countless existing lithium ion batteries in vehicles, already out there.
Perhaps a mass recall. Bah ha ha.
@@steveinoz8188 but LFP isn't as energy dense as lithium iron.
plus LEP still can enter thermal run away just as easy if theres a internal short or a cell gets damaged.
LEP is just less likely to have issues with charging
I'm still amazed that a lot of people think that EVs are maintenance free.
i am amazed that some people think that running the petrol pipes alongside the exhaust and storing the petrol tank under the back seat is a good idea. Good job petrol isn't flammable. 😂
@ItsAllJustBollox it won't self ignite. Much safer than sitting on top of a battery that can self ignite!!!
@@ItsAllJustBollox Also, seems that with petrol, if you take away the oxygen, it stops burning, but not so for lithium. Probably better to run a nuclear reactor inside your car than a lithium battery. Radiation from nuclear has never killed anybody, and here we have 22 dead from lithium? Clearly one is safer than another. Probably better to setup electrical trams for people to use and create more walking opportunities for people and jus use nuclear. Cars are such a pain and not necessary with good city design.
I drive one.. 51000 miles.. New tires and alignment.fill up washer fluid.. . thats it.. AND it shows battery life level at 97 % of what it was new. Cold hard facts..
@@southernyankeecustomuphols5480 Everybody I know that drives them only does so because the government helped them buy one. Nuclear had some deaths in the beginning also, but now it seems to be the safest energy we have available. Perhaps lithium will follow the same curve. Perhaps not. Seems relatively safe since there was the guy that drove his family off a cliff and destroyed his tesla but everybody is still alive.
Local Transport company just spent over 7 million dollars on 4 busses .. they cannot park them indoors because of the fire hazard could wipe out the rest of the fleet.
Big fire in Scottish battery recycling facility.
Very ugly pictures.
It was a junkyard. Apparently run by morons.
Add to that 2 fires at grid storage facilities here in Australia. Get used to it!
yes, and that’s dangerously close to a built-up area. Best wishes to all in Linwood/Paisley!
@@paulwatson6013 But no one talks about the toxic waste that would spew into the air in all directions when one of those go up... but we will draw conclusions from literal first wave nuclear reactor technology of the cold war to show how bad nuclear power is eh?
There was a battery fire at a grid storage facility in the USA this month. 15 days to finally put it out.
Its not just the fire. The inhalation of toxic fumes from those chemicals is also dangerous.
Geese you think ?
In America, 88% of all electricity produced is from a non-renewable source. These EV owners are so high on their horse.
Here is the breakdown from the DOE:
Electricity creation by source:
Fossil Fuels 60%
Nuclear @19%
'renewable' 21%
Care to check again?
In the EU they're burning biomass and calling it 'green', hahaha.
They’re high on
“Jenchems”
Look it up,
Just not before eating
@@Al-Stormbiomass burning is actually green
Seems you don’t know how this works
Biomass burning is green because that biomass took co2 from the air and is gonna be replanted
So it’s green
Near net zero
Often net negative overall
You really need to learn to step back and learn before letting the obvious but wrong answer mislead you
Imagine being in the Sydney harbour tunnel and a number of EVs spontaneously combust, at 2200° C, they'll weaken the concrete tunnel real quickly and.... thousands dead.
@@smcyfs9477 So true! And so scary! I never thought of that!
@@smcyfs9477 The tunnel would never, & could never be repaired. It only needs 1 EV car accident, & we have ourselves a CATASTROPHE!
Or the Channel Tunnel, Holland Tunnel (NYC), Lincoln Tunnel (NYC) etc...
Remember the Samsung mobile phones suddenly going up in flames?
I won’t leave ‘anything’ charging in my house unattended anymore. All my battery power tools are stored in a shed a long way from the house
Kind of funny, when charging my drone batterys I. Advised from manufactor to charge them in a fire proof jag which Ibdo. But car batteries are safe for some reason 😂
That was a manufacturing error, where the batteries were squeezed/pinched, making them unsafe to charge or rapidly discharge.
But you are right to keep your batteries in a safe place, anyone who can do that should.
@@afrog2666 still lipo batteries for drones should be charged in fire proof bags. No manufactor error on those
Everyone is charging half a dozen devices and you don't hear much about that causing fires. Car EV batteries are travelling at 100kmh in close proximity to all that unpredictable environment.
Perhaps they could start by designing the chargers and/or vehicle software to prevent over and undercharging I.e 20/80 rule. I've noticed that most power tool battery and charger combos do this or similar but ebike and e scooter chargers are just basic transformers with no electronics to prevent overcharging and no electrics in the device to stop discharging below 20%.
I had a little lithium 5B power pack I used to charge my phone when away from home. I had not used it for months and assumed it had very little charge. It developed a swelling and split open. I foolishly picked it up and it literally exploded into flames and clouds of gas in my hand. Fortunately I immediately dropped it so I did not get burned but it burned a hole in the carpet and wood floor beneath. If this had happened when I was not present it would have burned the house down. Be warned.
They are more unstable if not charged, funnily enough.
@@nilsingvar7319 How can that be? If they are not charged they have little chemical energy, surely?
As I have been advising people for decades
Charge your Li devices in the laundry tub or on the kitchen sink or if they are tools on a concrete floor or on a metal bench .
Li should never be used on any device bigger than a e-scooter .
@@I-have-a-brain_and-use-it I mean there are millions of lithium powered tools that have been used for over a decade, and all the stories I hear of building site fires are hot-works, heater knocked over, or some vacuum left on over the weekend. I'm sure one could burn your home down but the chances are is it'll be the tumble dryer or fridge.
@@edc1569 The critical time for fires is during charging and of course when idiots toss them into the garbage .
We are having over 100 Lithium battery fires in garbage trucks and sorting depots a week in Sydney .
Because these batteries are relatively small & do not cause a massive amount of damage they do not get the publicity they should . And of course if you like conspiracy theories, the manufacturers are probably asking the mass media not to give them much publicity because it might affect sales .
There is an almost zero chance of your house being struck by lightening but I am sure you have an insurance policy that includes lightening strikes .
It often comes dow to education & I spent 5 years as an analytical chemist so I had to lear about the toxicity of chemical fires.
I mean it is not hard to make a space were phones , computers, cameras etc can be charged without any chance of them starting a major fire should the very unlikely actually happen.
Ev is the big lie.
Solar and wind is a lie also
Anything of the future is a lie?
@@SpaceCadet4Jesus If somebody controls technologies and withold it for decades thats not natural evolution.
At least you don’t end up with myocarditis, blood clots, or cancer from buying an EV shitbox
Same liars different scams
@SpaceCadet4Jesus just because it's "of the future",doesn't mean it's good...
Talking to an EV person about cars is like talking to a bowl of Corn Flakes
😂😂😂
Well frankly what is an EV person? I drive an EV.. and a 1 ton Ford f-150 4x4.. They both do what I need them to do very well. The ev costs literally nothing for me to drive.. SOLAR POWER.. And i've personally built many v8 motors, and hot rods.. Been faster in both types than most As I am an amateur road racer.. AND my granddad could tell you many stories of entire OIL refinery's going up in smoke, huge gas fires at local gas stations,, ANd the CHEVY VEGA FORD PINTOs that used to blow up from a slow bump in the rear.. Back when we switched from STEAM to PETROL many old folks couldnt get a grip on it. Swore off the new technology, just like the people on horses did with Steam.. NEW tech takes awhile to perfect.. But burying your head and the sand and ignoring it, will only mean it passes YOU by.. and you can continue talking top your corn flakes ...
It looks like we've got ONE of those PEOPLE. That is so self absorbed the need to SAY things in block capitals because THEY think what they say IS important. Probably a TOOL.
@@pippip8744 amazing contribution. lol. Maybe. You should try out block capitals. It got your attention. Lmao. So you got nothing to contribute to conversation and go attack the messenger. Impressive.
@@pippip8744 ps. Bet ya wouldn’t call me a tool face to face. That’s the problem with trolls. They have no positive message. And say things they never would say if their name and face was involved.
A battery fire here in the UK has just shown how dangerous and toxic these fires are.
Now this one as well, how many more will lose their lives before stricter controls are introduced.
i can't imagine why anyone would want to be near let alone drive a vehicle with a lithium-ion battery pack.
Hey, I never understood why electrified trains not rule transportation ;-)
Gasoline or lithium-ion battery packs are both killers when you put them in a car. You want a safe and cheap vehicle, you want a tram or train! ;-)
who is the mental rtrd, that got all this green bs passed. non of it helps the earth. the earth doesnt need any help. it goes thru cycles, hot, cold, ice ages. we are spinning thru space, you cant stop that..
@@Traumglanz gasoline not really. we've been using it in cars for over 100 years and ICE cars catching fire is not an issue. either the fire is small and can be put out quickly with a bit of water or extinguisher, and there is ample time from seeing smoke to getting out of the car, or the much more common reason, a crash.
but yeah trains are the best method if you've got tracks to run them on.
Sadly, none of this will register about the danger of these things until such a tragedy actually happens in an underground car park or someplace similar.
Tesla started making EVs in 2008. How many carpark fires have been started by EVs since then?
Yeah but even Then it will be stated
" We will form a Committee to discuss this which will report in 6-12 Months time "
Inhale 2 deep breaths and you are gone
Doesn't matter nothing if it is an EV burning in the underground car park or an ICE car or a dumpster
This smoke is deadly no matter what
I work as a fire fighter and have been to around 50 or so car fires so far and none of them was an EV.
One was a hybrid catching on fire because the field it was parked on was burning. Bigger problem was the burning harvester thou
@@steveinoz8188The 'Luton' car park total-loss fire may not have been started by an EV, but the small number of EVs parked there made it impossible to extinguish. In 2008, there would be next to zero EVs parked in any carpark, but as their number rises, the danger from them is increasing, plus several people have already had their house destroyed by the EV parked outside. Considering the billions of ICE cars out there, that all carparks are not already raging infernos is surely a miracle, given that, but the small number of EVs are already causing problems.
@@Fluxkompressor
You don't mention which country you are in?
Please tell us all so that we can avoid visiting the worst educated fire fighting force ever.
John.. it is staggering ! . Several days ago I had 1 soda-can sized LTO battery explode and catch fire in my home. Within 15 seconds I was unloading 2 BCF fire extinguishers at it, then I had to get out . I was fortunate that just 1 cell blew. After getting the glowing mass out of the house in a bucket of (now boiling) water, I used water to save the house .
It was very FAST and violent.
Car parks, Tunnels, Airports, should immediately Ban EV's.....There should be a Big "F**K OFF" sign at them....
@@Yes-Gi-Man 100% correct
They should also ban cell phones and laptops from elevators and airplanes.
its because a lithium cell fully charged when damaged can go up like much like thermite, now imagine 25000-80000 of them in a row of electric vehicles parked at charge stations going up.
we have had electric cars go up in scrap yards here, sometimes weeks after an accident wrote it off
EV`S that have been in accidents hould have their batteries removed and stored safely imo.
imagine a whole street of EV going up ...the intense flame will set all houses on fire due to the plane effect which means that the intensity does not diminish with distance then if it was a point source. this is radiators are large flat surfaces
@@afrog2666
Should have, but like every safety rule ever written, they won't be adhered to by some!!
Once a Tesla did burn down when supercharging no other car was affected.
@@ReinhardSchuster good. park it in your garge then
Forcing Teslas to charge outside the shopping centre? I can hear the cries of discrimination already
Enter Lithium, the fire breathing Dragon.😮
You better not use a laptop or a cell phone or even a tablet. Those are lithium ion batteries in there.
Made in Ch...a
Made in C...
Dragon 🐉🐲
EV manufacturers and dealers are targeting women, young and old, because their an easy sell. They don't realize the true dangers of Lithium batteries to them and their families plus the long run cost of operation is outrageous.
What is that cost? Got a number ?
@@theairstig9164 The battery change cost as much as a cheap ICE car.
LOL Steam car guys said the same thing about ICE cars back in the day.. Ever drive an 1972 Chevy Pickup? Or maybe an Ford Pinto Chevy VEGA same era.. Used to blow up from simple rear end collisions the pintos and vegas.. and the TRUCK.. had the fuel tank.. IN THE TRUCKS passenger compartment.. I drive an F250,, 4x4 and an FULL EV and love them both ..
Elon said the batteries were good for 400k miles, yet in German court documents he stated 150k miles.....he can lie in advertising, but not in court documents. People are going to be freaking when their batteries are trash after 150k miles. Not fit for purpose for most people. Retired people that drive very little, possibly, but why risk it? Many homeowners insurance companies now either raise rate by a lot, or refuse coverage if toy garage park an ev. Rightfully so, they don't want to lose money. Happening to apartment buildings as well now that more accurate fire incident numbers are out.
I guess all those cock and balls behind the EV wheel identify as a woman. 👍
I didn't hear anything of this in the MSM. Only red maps of heat waves anyplace in the world.
MSM can't say anything bad about their sponsors. The sponsors will pull those shiny car adverts from the network. MSM knows how their bread gets buttered.
Thats called Summer!
It's not in the top stories, but if you go to any of the web sites and search for Battery Fire, you'll find the articles. Most people won't know to search because it's simply not listed as one of the most popular stories.
@@N1withaskillet Stop the victimhood already:
th-cam.com/video/_X3kYy7UgZ8/w-d-xo.htmlfeature=shared
“MSM” even “liberal” “MSM” can be just as anti-EV as all the other outlets. Actually they hide it better.
we need to get the news to stop talking about environmental problems and focus more on the threat of lithium ion batteries
There's just no way I'd live in a high rise building allowing car charging underneath. Same goes for a house with an adjoining garage. Its like a ticket in deathlotto with a really bad prize if you win.
My brother who is a fire Marshall said people who fight fires without proper training and equipment we call toast 🔥
A man suffers from poisonous fumes in a EV fire every day....& he's bloody well sick of it 😯
I wonder whether our politicians will listen to the warning. I have my doubts. It'll take a local disaster.
What makes you think they will? after 100 years of much greater deaths from petroleum fuel fires
A local disaster in a right neighborhood. If you or I die nobody's going to give a fuck.
I don't know if we make batteries for communication devices and sensors here.
@@nicholaskeur Have you got any figures to support your claim, or are you just another EVangelist pretending the problem doesn't exist? Surely the most important thing is that EVs are made safe, for all our sakes.
@@matthewgodwin3050
Banging your head against a brick wall there mate!!
I am a locomotive mechanic and I would much rather deal with an empty fuel tank than a dead Loco battery. I love battery operted tech, but dead batteries are a scourge and far more dangerous than lots of people realize.
We don’t have lithium batteries on our locomotives nor do I know of any that do. Diesel has a high ignition point and I also have never know in 46 years of driving trains ever known or heard a report of one exploding. Our loco maintainers thought this was amusing.
Can a dead battery even have a thermal runaway? My understanding is thermal runaway scales with how much charge is in the battery. No charge, no charge to result in heat.
@@brianm6965 no, it can’t
@ToyBJ the company I work for, just made a battery powered locomotive for an Australian company. And batteries of any type can have issues while charging
@brianm6965 "dead" often means it doesn't have enough energy to do the work you want, not "zero charge." If something goes wrong while working on a "dead" battery, like accidentally shorting one out (it can happen), they can overheat and explode.
A flashlight with Lithium battery 🔋 🔋 OH the irony.
Whats even more heated, These manufacturers are trying to push EV's for the off-road segment. Imagine being in a Tesla truck or Jeep EV following your buddies up that trail, occasionally dragging your bottom skidplate on the rocks. Compressing battery concern? Arcing concern? You can't make this crap up. It's no wonder insurance is going thru the roof on this garbage.
Thanks for another good video John. One thing I don't think people are wrapping their brains around is the "makes it's own oxygen".. An acetylene torch burning the oxygen in our air won't even heat metal to red, add pure oxygen and suddenly you can melt steel. Perhaps a video demonstrating how a fire that generates oxygen is rather significant, not only in trying to put it out but the incredible heat generated.
Burning magnesium strips are crazy hot enough
I remember when I was still working, driving trucks. The fire extinguisher in the truck needed to be checked by a licensed professional. I said why do you need to check the fire extinguisher? He said to make sure it will work in case the truck catches on fire. I laughed and said, if the truck catches on fire I am getting TF away from it as quick as I can.
If the owners of trucks were serious there would be an fire suppression system installed at the factory on every new truck.
Safety is talked about...right up until the bill has to be paid to implement a decent safety "system".....
not a shit 1kg $20 powder fire extinguisher...or even a 5kg one.
The truck only has 2x 400 litre diesel tanks to fuel any fire (if the fire isn't knocked out before that.)
Truck safety:
there also should be a 360 degree camera setup (that is available on many cars now) giving the driver all round vision from the cab.....
You are quite right. The fire extinguisher is only for very minor fires, or something electrical that has started smoking. Any safety professional will tell you to always raise the alarm first before you do anything. And that unless the fire is a minor one that you can put out without risk to yourself or others, you should simply leave and go to a fire drill muster point or safe place.
@@JohnSmith-pl2bk
Re the camera system, you are 100% correct, my Mercedes was sideswiped at the rear wheel by a artic tractor.... even though I was twelve & a half feet IN FRONT OF HIM!!!
Out of interest, was the truck an EV?
@@aaronsinspirationdaily4896 no
Aricell, the company catching fire, makes Lithium Thionyl Chloride cells. They're typically single cell batteries used in PLC and medical equipment backup systems, for keeping memory and such. Those type of cells have been in use basically forever, and are not used in consumer or general products.
Ask Chevy why they needed to warn people to NOT park their EVs inside of garages.....
@@TisiphonesShadow what's that got to do with that fire? It is in no way or form a related battery technology.
It's just mind blowing that people will still try and say EVS are safer then ICE cars.
Their virtue signaling demeanor of moral superiority will shield them from actual facts
ICE cars used to catch on fire all the time. Remember the VW rabbit? That caught on fire if you crashed it slightly? ICE vehicles have a 120 year history. We will eventually figure out EVs.
This is how explosives manufacturing facilities work, separate parts of the process and storage to limit the impact of any accident.
Good point. Lithium battery storage should be treated as equally dangerous.
You don’t see them putting petrol Bowsers in underground car parks or in apartment basements….. I wonder why that would be……….
The tanks are underground der brain.
Because they wouldn’t fit! 🤔😏
@@steveinoz8188
yes we know Einstein
but if you’re refuelling in a basement, how do you control the confined space vapours?…..
When you fill up your car, you go to a place called a petrol station and guess what the Bowsers are located……
OUTSIDE……….!!!!
@@steveinoz8188 tanks were placed underground to conserve space and the keep the fuel at 15 digress all year round.
you cant blow a tank up when it contains fuel but if you are dispensing gasoline in a confined area a single spark would blow the area up if the air fuel ratio is in the danger zone
@@malcolmyoung7866
wouldn’t be that hard
petrol storage tank could be located outside…. plumbed into the basement
You just don’t see it because…….
Given the confined space things may well go bang…….
So why would EV’s be any different….
Buy your deathtrap
BYD...? 😱😂
( Tongue in cheek): But wait, They promised that this e.v. tech would be cleaner, and SAFER than conventional vehicles... Uhhm, wha' happened?
Just watched bangers and cash auctioneer and owner Derek in Q & A video asked if he would buy an E.V,he said never ever and like in the 1900's electric cars were rubbish then and they still are,he said it will be a 20 year fad and will disappear up it's own arse
How could i forget when ' incandescent lightbulbs ' were the Danger ! and needed to urgently be replaced with ' compact fluoro globes/bulbs' for-our-future ' so we Did. It only took 2-3 Years and those compact fluoros were recognised as ' unreliable and much worse for our Planet '... Cannot buy them anymore...Nowadays we have L.E.D. globes that cost $10 each, whereas the incandescents used to cost Less than a dollar each. yes Yes I understand 75 Watt incandescants use more electrickery than the replacement 8 Watt L.E.Ds, meanwhile those bluddy compact fluoros were the worst polluters by-far - and They are currently in our landfill....
And those LEDs that do NOT 'last 10x longer' are in landfill too ???
Come-in-spinner..................................
That’s the silliest thing I’ve heard in years! EVs have already been popular for 10 years and they are increasing in popularity year-by-year! In fact the number 4 vehicle sold in the world is an EV that out sales Civics, Accords, Camrys and all the other traditional ICE mainstays!
@@Bacnow once the rich and green nutters have bought them ,the only sales are subsidized government sales,nobody wants them once the freebies are taken away.
@@Bacnow sales of EVs have dropped sharply in the last 6 months, and its funny we are at 10 years because that about the point those first EVs will become useless bricks because the battery is out of life. many who bought EVs are now going back to ICE.
@@Born_Stellar - I think you are mistaken! Very few people would go back to ICE after driving an EV for 10 years. Yes, EV sales are down AND ICE car sales are down! This is more a result of inflationary forces and car manufacturer’s pricing based on greed than anything else! To be sure, EV sales (as a percentage of total car sales) has not decreased! Also, EV batteries decrease in capacity over time but that doesn’t mean they are dead or can’t be replaced! There are many EVs with over 400k (with no maintenance costs) miles still rocking over 70% battery capacity!
Bro, you are either horribly misinformed or have fallen for anti-EV propaganda!
No one should be surprised. The layer between anode and cathode is so slim that any failure of this barrier will end in disaster.
I recently headed up a safety meeting featuring basic fire extinguisher use.
One of the items covered was how ineffective standard extinguishers are on lithium battery fires, especially on electric vehicle fires.
And to evacuate upwind. I like your delivery of the information, too.
Well done.
This was not a Li-on battery plant but a
Lithium Thionyl Chloride primary (non-rechargable) battery plant.
People mistake fire extinguishers as fire fighting devices, they in reality are time buying devices to get those few extra seconds for escape. Same as people staying in stores when an alarm goes off... use those big red doors at first sound, thats what they are for, you havent paid for the groceries in your cart..leave them.
What a stupid statement. Have had years of training in fire fighting and I used to machine magnesium and always had a extinguisher to put out fires and you know they do it really well.
What this emphasises to me is what I already knew. Lithium Ion batteries can burn. And can be deadly. The fumes, run off, everything about them is scary above a certain scale. You mention being close to such a threat. Imagine having 800MW of them at the bottom of your garden. That is what is facing me. They are trying to build a BESS facility in Somerset region Qld right next to Somerset Dam. The main water source for the whole of SE Qld, including Brisbane. Should this facility catch fire, and a majority do, the pollution could be of an epic scale. And literally this would be in the paddocks adjoining mine. Affording me a grandstand view of Brisbane's water being shut down. And this is deemed as green regenerative energy thus skipping a lot of planning requirements. The world has gone mad.
Wishing you luck and hope common sense wins!
@@TwoBassedThanks. Shame common sense is in such short supply these days.
Would be kind of worried, too. I mean you're so derulgated they can't even build a dam that is reliable. The problem is less the tech, rather, that this tech is handled by people which only know the words "profit" "cheapest" "fastest to implement" and certainly not the words "responsibility" and "redundancy" and "safety".
@@beyondEV Deregulated isn't how I would describe Australia. You need a licence to go for a crap. The biggest problem is we are run by Muppets who behave like sheep. But then that sums up most world politicians. Our latest is particularly bad though he has no knees left in his trousers from grovelling. It doesn't matter where you put this technology, from USA to Europe to Australia, it doesn't work. The whole set up is flawed as is proven by them burning wherever they are installed.
Thanks for posting
Asbestos was safe.
Asbestos is conditionally safe. The problem is that expecting companies to factor in health into manual labor denies the fact that corporations see humans as a resource to be exploited.
@@kdawson020279 so if it was just labour why did they stop using it in buildings?
radium was safe as well. well its 'conditionally safe' as long as you don't go too close to it.
a bomb is 'conditionally safe' as well, provided the condition is 'not currently exploding'
your argument is poor.
I hope that these batteries are made safer and people recognize the danger of these batteries.
They are making them more dangerous.
The higher the energy density and discharge rate, the more incendiary they become.
Electrical and chemical engineers have been warning people for over 10 years about it .
My buddies garage caught fire thanks to a brilliant neighbor smoking near dry brush. It caught his ice vehicle in the driveway on fire. Firefighters were horrified when they discovered one of the electric Jesus mobiles in the garage. Luckily they got the car out before it caught fire because the firefighters said the house would have burned completely down had it caught fire. Insert insurance rate increases here…
Guess those firefighter needed some training. Oh, wait training and equipping them needs money, never mind, let the house burn, rebuilding it will push the gdp, and if they can increase the rate, it even more gdp and profit...
@@beyondEV when an EV catches on fire - standard procedure is to submerge it in a special pool. How do you do that with an EV in a garage beneath a house?
@@beyondEVjust say no to EVs
@@ionbarari7202
DO NOT SUBMERGE LITHIUM FIRES UNDER WATER
The proper procedure is to use sand. Plain old silicon dioxide sand.
Additives to the sand like Ammonium Pentaborate and Ammonium Oxalate can be used to absorb heat from the battery reaction.
@@cezarcatalin1406 just look it up how they proceed with electric car fires
If only the Lithium batteries would "identify" as a Duracell, this wouldn't happen.
Combustionally fluid while cross charging..
Duracell is shit.
If they identified as 'diesel' then they would be much safer.
Lol i identify as a toaster...
Never use Duracell. Leaky leaky leaky.
These lithium fires spread that fast it's horrendous what these people went through RIP to those who lost their lives 😢
No fire escape, just like the number of times kids have died in fires in basement music venues ... "smoke on the water".
These EV'S should be banned if you ask me, not fit for purpose and dangerous/deadly.
My son in law is a fire fighter, daughter a paramedic. Terrified for them.
Time to find safe jobs that society appreciates with monetary payment instead of the occasional tongue bath.
I would be concerned too but not for being involved in any fire or injuries concerning batteries. Statistically even if every car on the road were an EV (which they will be within 20 years) and every home had an LFP backup battery the chances of them being called to a fire caused by one would be extremely small...far less so than fires involving a petrol/diesel car or a house using gas or oil for heating.
Talk to your son in law. Unless someone has seriously f*** up, he should be trained to handle hydrogen and battery fires for about two decades. Really surprises me, that people think all those other batteries somehow teleported from the factory directly into the smartphone and not be transported in bulk somewhere along the way.
@@kiae-nirodiariesencore4270 Nope. I've had to work a number of incidents involving EV collisions, some caught fire from damaged batteries (and we became spectators), some were handled by the FD before they went up (chemicals). Statistically, there are far fewer fires involving ICE vehicles than EVs.
@@TisiphonesShadow You are wrong. Look to the data collected by the NTSB (USA) and CCA (Sweden) where fire incidents are recorded. Look at the fires per 100,000 vehicles for hybrid, petrol, diesel and EVs. You will find that hybrids have the most number of fires per 100,000 vehicles followed by petrol (about 1/3rd of hybrid fire incidents) and EVs being 1/20th of petrol and 1/50th of hybrids. Too many people base their opinions on 'things they've seen or heard' rather than looking at the big picture and you can only get that by collecting data and analysing it.
Very topical video for me...this very day, I have just returned from a trip (with my elderly mother) to a rather large underground carpark below the Peter Mac cancer hospital, and had cause to bring to mind your numerous previous warnings about electric vehicle fires and enclosed spaces, upon noticing a goodly number of said vehicles (doctors cars?) already in "residence", whilst looking for a parking space myself. Now, in such a place, where many of the "visitors" are elderly, ill, and otherwise physically compromised, one can't help wondering how many of them can get to safety/exit in the 15 seconds they may only have - not many I'd suggest. A major EV fire in such a situation doesn't dear thinking about, and you are right, safety legislation is needed urgently - at the very least, EV charging should not be allowed in enclosed public spaces IMHO. Thanks John. Cheers!
Excellent monologue. Thank you.
The fire in South Korea was in an Aricell building. Aricell don't make "lithium-ion" batteries.
They make lithium-thionyl chloride batteries, which are not a lithium-ion chemistry.
Lithium-thionyl chloride is more reactive than lithium-nickel manganese cobalt oxide, which in-turn is far more reactive than lithium-iron phosphate.
It is idiotic and pointless to discuss "lithium" batteries without also discussing the specific chemistries, if we're interested in safety.
In the same way that it would be idiotic to lump gasoline and diesel into the same bucket, when discussing safety and storage.
i love that you caution people about lithium ion batteries but recommend people carry a lithium ion battery in their pocket every day. #olight
I do that most days but have chosen to store the lawn mower batteries in the shed.
Li-ion is decent for handheld things where the batteries aren't that large. I still prefer NiMH but that's because I don't care about the extra weight and like the AA ecosystem with easily swappable and replaceable batteries.
But yeah, in those sizes the risk is a lot more manageable. Let's be honest, people just don't die from cell phones lighting up, and it's pretty rare in the first place. Charge those "a bit bigger than a cell phone battery" things in a battery bag or on a concrete slab far enough from walls in your garage and, while you could have smoke emission, it's not gonna take your house down.
In short, the risk there can be managed with physics. An EV in your garage, at best you can manage the risk with insurance, and the risk is scaled up due to the high amount of cells. And insurance costs a ton more.
There are few certainties in life and a great skill is being able to get past preconceptions and gauge risk based on real factors.
And yet you're still probably more than happy to stick your phone in your pocket...It's a difference of scale here, the batteries those use are tiny when compared to an EV and the most it could do is give you some burns while an EV takes itself out, the 7 cars on either side and and the shop it's parked next to.
Recently one of California's battery backup facilities, part of their new green energy infrastructure, caught on fire. It burned for three day and reignited again for another two days. I confess that my details of this fire are vague because this state is committed to this madness and press coverage was minimal, but this should have been recognized as a major environmental catastrophe. This was a massive facility and if there is any good news only one of five huge buildings was engulfed. Imagine days of toxic smoke, tainted water from fire hoses, spreading across the landscape. There were residential habitations nearby. Someone remind me why this country stopped building nuclear power plants.
Actually there were quite detailed reports outside MSM. LI-Ions are not more toxic that simply plastic or rubber burning. So no that is not the issue. It rather was, that they made the subunits to big and therefore it was a unnecessary financial loss. If they split it into 25 or 50 seperate firecompartment instead of only 5, they would have lost 20% of it.
Personally, think the better go for more pumped hydro, but that needs time and planning. Lithium is far too valuable to be used for stationary mass storage.
We stopped building nuclear power plants because for-profit corporations lack the level of responsibility necessary to manage one.
Hopped on your channel and I'm grateful indeed. It's a mess unraveling throughout the world.
I would like to say that Tesla drivers are as obnoxious as BMW drivers. There is something about the EV drivers mindset the should be accounted for. Perhaps Tesla can notify the police when one of its cars decides to travel at 100 mph in a 30 mph zone.
At least Tesla has that capability which is more than the rest of the automotive industry can manage.
Many forget about time degradation inside the Cells is a big issue with BEVs. Not a surprise BEVs over ten years will start to be denied to be supercharger or even insured.
Talks dangers on lithium ion batteries, goes on to advertise tactical torches with rechargeable lithium ion batteries and tells us to keep a few in the car at all times. . .
As funny as that is, I do that now I think about it, hmm. 🤔
Money Talks..💲
Just wonderful how so many seem to have two mouths.
I would rather have a tiny fire from a torch battery than be caught in a fiery chemical deathtrap. Besides, nobody is saying that batteries are evil altogether. If that were the case, we would all have to get rid of our phones and other essentials. If you use some discernment, you will be fine 🙂
What if the battery is held in a steel can? Sealed can
The sad tale of the woman drowning in her EV is an example of just knowing that you can mechanically unlatch the doors is not enough. You must actually practice mechanically unlatching the doors, or you will never be able to do it in a stressful situation
It might be worse than just the latch. The water pressure would likely make it impossible to open the door, so rolling down the window would be the best bet. However, when a car is in the water, the electric window motor might not work. In fact, it's likely even worse on the Tesla. The brilliant Tesla genius who thought the glove box shouldn't have a normal latch, but instead, be controlled by an LCD touch screen, likely also over complicated the electric window. Bet that system didn't work.
One thing worries me even more. I read the cyber truck doesn't have a manual latch for the back seat. A kid trapped in a car wreck in the back seat while the parents are knocked out (or worse) will not be rescued easily. Since the glass is "unbreakable" (shatter resistant at least), a by-stander will have trouble rescuing the kid too. All that while the batteries ignite. Makes me wonder how these things can be allowed on the road.
@@MichellesVett It's the US. The Cyber Truck is not allowed in the EU to my knowledge. Likely never will be, as it fails the minimum safety requirements. In most ICE-Vehicles you face the same problem with the doors and windows. You have to shatter the window. Or wait (shallow water) until the car is sufficiently full.
@@beyondEV Yes, I know that is a common problem that is not EV related, but the point I'm making is that Musk is especially foolish. A simple thing like a latch for a glove box is absent, and it must be accessed by the LCD touch screen. He tries to impress people with the useless electronics, and in doing so, he adds unnecessary additional points of failure. A fully electric/automated car in the water will not do as well as a low tech car with actual handles. Additional, he made a big deal over the difficulty a person has when it comes to breaking a window in the cyber truck. That is fully insane. When there's a car wreck, or when a car/truck goes into the water, you need the windows to be easily broken. Even after the cyber truck is fully submerged, I'd bet the person will down as they vainly attempt to break the glass and crawl out.
It's sad because while I don't object to people removing themselves from the gene pool (it is their right to buy a Tesla), I don't like making victims out of innocent passengers or kids.
I've had an ICE catch fire on me. It started with a another panicked motorist pointing at my car while I was sitting at the red light. I had time to pop the hood and confirm that my engine bay was indeed on fire, get my girlfriend out of the car, pull the vehicle out of traffic, roll it down a hill, and park it an empty cul-de-sac at a contstruction site. Even after that, it still took several minutes more before it became engulfed.
I own an ebike. I fully know fully well what could happen if the pack ever went into thermal runaway. For that reason, the pack sits inside the oven everytime I recharge it. I also babysit it the entire time to make sure nothing happens to it.
Surely it is time to completely 're-think' the so called 'transition to EV's'.
Nope!...EVs are simply better to drive and cheaper to own...no oil changes to worry about, no exhaust, no fuel pump, no water pump, no starter motor, fuel tank etc etc. I only put my EV in for servicing because I don't want to void the 7 year warranty (8 years and 100,000 miles on the battery)...My GP has a Tesla Model 3...one of the early ones built in California, the build quality isn't great he says but in 80,000 miles it has been perfectly reliable and has never been serviced. ICE cars are just a hassle I would never go back to.
Once you realise that it was never about everyone still being able to drive it opens up wonderful new concepts to consider. They want you chained to a location(ULEZ/15m cities anyone?) that they always know(that's the real 5G conspiracy), using their digital currency, controlling what you are allowed to do via social credit scores, eating bugs, and generally keeping you with your hands wrapped around your ankles. If you don't believe what I'm saying start paying more attention. Maybe start with asking yourself what the geofencing and vehicle use timer downloads going into older cars and already installed in the newer ones are all about. Unfortunately, it seems that the latest generations have no concept of liberty or freedom and a lot would trade it without thought for a shiny new Starbuck's card. I've been preaching this shit for at least forty years and every year I watch something else I said would happen come to fruition with my naysayers accepting it without a second thought after originally saying that it would never happen. Sorry if I'm a bit disjointed here I have a migraine and I'm about to go to bed. Here's a prediction: Did you know before fluoride was introduced to the water supplies it was considered a heinous toxin and was considered Industrial waste? A lot of people have been asking what the hell we do with the Lithium from old batteries and studies have been and are being done on whether or not it should be introduced to drinking water because it's a socially responsible thing to want to reduce the suicide rate and you don't want to be antisocial do you?
@@kiae-nirodiariesencore4270makes me wonder how good the friction brakes are if he had to perform an emergency stop with zero inspection & servicing for 8 years.
@@stephensalt6787 Do you have any experience of owning an EV? If you did you would know that the friction brakes are hardly ever used. Most slowing down is done with by lifting the right foot to induce regenerative braking. One of the things I love about driving my EV is that the car does exactly what you tell it with the right foot, none of this lifting off while a flywheel spins in an effort to get a little more efficiency out of a fundamentally inefficient ICE. Check out James and Kate on EVs TH-cam channel where he goes to service a 200,000 mile EV taxi (Tesla Model 3) brakes and pads are still original and in good shape even with taxi stop/start work.. What I do with mine every so often is blip
the brake pedal at speed on an empty stretch of road (easy to do here in rural France), this knocks the corrosion film off the discs and makes the pads do some work.
It really isn't
You have to destroy the planet in order to save it.
We can just keep destroying it with coal I guess?
One day every one will realise that the burning of coal and climate change was a very big hoax.
Yep, like EV's were going to solve man accelerated climate change anyway, complete joke.
@@Low760 No, lithium is far more efficient. About them 1,000 active volcanoes, any ideas?
That is correct
Interesting that here in Canada where our ruling Dauphin has invested heavily in two battery factories.....there is not one mention of this in the Canadian press.
I talked to firefighter here in Poland, and he confirmed that while ICE fires are more numerous than BEV fires, they are small and easy to put down. Sometimes one or few small 1kg extinguishers that are mandatory to have in every car are all it takes.
Net zero is short for zero humans.
Yes Tucker Carlson
Talk about a net zero comment.
Holy shit! How the f@*k did you survive beyond childbirth?
If you trust the media, and I don't, we are about to be flooded with cheap Chinese EV's. Oh, the possibilities.
First the fetanyl. Then, the highly flammable lithium batteries. Sounds like a plan.
If the battery is punctured the contents will burn on contact with air or water.
A fire procedure for a tyre fire is 1 if possible park the vehicle so the burning tyre is facing away from the centre of the toad, 2 if possible radio to close the road 3 put your running boots into action.
Hope toads OK 😅
Just saw a statistic that in the USA 12,000 fires in landfills are caused by lithium batteries that are disposed of in the trash. However, most places don't provide an alternative for disposing of "old" lithium batteries so people just throw them away.
Well, we burn trash (filters of course) and make power and district heating out of it. still, you are supposed to sort out any batteries.
I remember when there was a big deal in the news about Lion batteries catching fire and exploding. Then about the same time the EV push started, the news stopped covering the fires and explosions.
Aricell, the company that had the acident only makes primary batteries with ion metal cathode. Those are non rechargeable and have nothing to do with lithium ion ev batteries. While li-ions explode too and you're right on that, this accident was with pure lithium metal primary batteries.
The spectacular toxic plume seen rising from the doomed Linwood battery plant fire makes Mount Versuvius eruptions look like Roman Candles in comparison.
These EV batteries are the Boeings of the roads..
Boeing can't even get the astronauts it delivered, back from the ISS.
They were not making EV batteries.
Last time I checked their main competitor in aerospace is someone I will not name. Wink wink. Yeah don't they fit lithium ion batteries to their evs.
@GDM22 I'm pretty sure @JackOfski was using Boeing as an analogy,
of big companies, cutting corners in development of new technology, prioritising profit, over customer safety. As was I.
There was no suggestion of Boeing battery production. Just an analogy.
@@stuartwood7252 I was indeed but it went over a lot of people's heads..whoooooosh
I don't want to be within 1 mile radius of that size of that power pack, when even the one in your phone can kill you.
I once had a smoke accident in my apartment, some appliance was lying on my oven plate, I accidentally switched it on, didn´t catch it.
There just as a smell, like hot electronics. The smell went nuclear in a few seconds, massive smoke developed. I have two cats, cought them and switched the plate off, opened windows and doors, smacked the appliance off the oven and poured water on it.
That took maybe 20 seconds, I had to breathe the smoke. That nearly knocked me out. I was with a fire brigade as a kid and they tried to tell us about the dangers of smoke- now I know. Now I experienced it and You are so right about breathing smoke. And it was just plasic with me...
Surely insurance companies are going to want to know if the building owners have any intention of providing basement charging.
When I renewed my home insurance recently, they asked if I, or any of my immediate neighbours charged an EV at the property. That alone proves that the problem is widespread.
or if there are large lithium batteries as part of a home solar system
Over here they don't care. IF you have installed a system actually designed for it. But they very clearly state not to do it yourself or to use the "normal" wiring for the house, as it's unsuitable to run at max. cap. all the time.my guess is, most people don't want to spend the money, so they charge from a unsuitable source, which can prove fatal.
About 20 years ago, I was working at Ingham poultry in dispatch. Got back from a break earlier than everyone and noticed that the line of electric forklifts (about a baker's dozen) all on the charger along one wall. One was on on fire, so I turned off mains, yelled for people to run and closed all doors.
I got the sack.
The sack for getting people out of harm's way?
@terencehawkes3933 After the completion of an entire review, new electrical wiring, new forklifts ect that took 2 months, I got a notice to say they were "restructuring the workforce and was no longer needed".
@@mini_steve That sounds really suspicious. You will never know if they voted you off the island for rocking the boat or if the company was downsizing and you just happened to be in the crosshairs. I detest corporate weasel wording like that. Lord knows I had a belly of it when Nortel collapsed.
Pretty sure most electric forklifts 20 years ago had big lead-acid batteries, not lithium.
@rastus666 Not sure if that really matters. Still could kill dozens of people.
4:05 In the context of an industrial/commercial site, a piece of advice I got from a firefighter/trainer many moons ago, the extinguishers are there to clear a path to the exit, not to fight fires, let someone else deal with that (the fire) and he was referencing similar situations to the one in Korea. Although with the toxic smoke as in this situation, they may have been cooked anyway.
It will always get pushed under the carpet and hidden until something really bad happens
The thousands of Kia and Hyundai fires that contributed to the "Ice cars burn more often" meme were caused by a design flaw in the ELECTRICAL side of the ABS module, brake fluid would leak into the electrical side and (due to too large a fuse) which I still don't understand the PIP being putting in a smaller fuse, so, the "ICE" fires are very often caused by electrical failures.
Out of interest, what alternatives to “electrical” systems are available in ICE cars?
Hydraulic? Vacuum tube?
@@aaronsinspirationdaily4896 My first car had a push button radio and an 8 track. There are no alternatives to an electrical system, other than block and tackle, bars and levers, torque multipliers, slip clutches, mechanical governors, points and condenser. 🤡
The data they used also didn't exclude arson, which is very common after a car is stolen. Neither did it control for serious crashes, or anything else that's not the fault of the technology itself. Propaganda masquerading as research.
I think they should narrow it down to just incidents where cars unexpectedly catch fire, and then look at relative severity. What is the relative cost of the emergency response, the clean-up, and damage to property? What's the relative impact on life and limb?
Well, we don't need to do this, because insurance companies have no choice but to deal with the real world data in that regard, and also first responders have no choice either.
Ultimately the truth will prevail, but unfortunately society likes to learn everything the hard way and then promptly throw those lessons out because they get in the way of "innovation" or whatever. Rinse and repeat.
@@aaronsinspirationdaily4896 His point is that EVs have the exact same systems.
@@Patrick-857same systems and ICE cars catch fire at a rate 80x more than EV’s?
What is it about ICE electrical systems that make them 80x more likely to catch on fire?