1:07 I really don't think that was the intention. Rather, Rom and Leeta were using this opportunity to send a message. Just because they're joining the Federation doesn't mean they're giving up their values or choosing to become "suckers."
Indeed. If the Federation stands by his mission statement to learn from and co-exist with other cultures rather than just trying to subsume other cultures into its own, they need to put their proverbial money where there mouth is. ESPECIALLY during something as defining as a member negotiation
Having Rom only act in a way the DS9 Rom would act would be a disservice to his character. Instead, we have seen some kind of character growth here. He gained self-awareness that he was seen was stupid and uninterested in business and many Ferengi probably also underestimated his Bajoran wife. By showing publicly that basically his wife was calling the shots, no one took them seriously in negotiations until it was too late. And that also meant that Rom could operate in the cover of the ignorance of others to reform his culture. But as a good leader, he doesn't just represent his own personal views, but has to represent his people - and many Ferengi still chase profits and personal enrichment at that time, so any alliance with the federation will have to take that into account, even if he personally doesn't like it. This is especially showing his compassion, that was featured in his character in DS9 as well - he's not in it for himself, but for his people. As for fusing the currency-based economy of Ferenginar with the currency-free of the Federation, I think there is a very simple way out: The Federation doesn't outlaw currency. It just is not using currency-based economics for their own "official" business. Meaning Federation-own Dilithium mines are not for-profit organizations and Starfleet is not getting paid. However, Starfleet is still able to accumulate some form of currency - for example, Quark paid rent for his bar on DS9, even though it was, officially, a Starfleet installation. And with this currency-income, they tend to provide their officers with the cash to - like in this episode of LD - experience the Ferengi culture on Ferenginar. Member worlds can probably adapt this kind of non-currency-based economy, but they are also free to maintain their currency-based one. As there probably is a freedom for anyone to move anywhere, planets like Earth guarantee every federation citizen a life without poverty on the planet. So the negative side-effects of capitalism don't come into play on the other planets. If someone is too poor to live on that planet, they can always just move to paradise where they don't need money.
Way I figure it, Rom went in with ideals, yes, and he has done a lot to reform Ferenginar, but even the most liberal head of state can't rule without being willing to compromise to a degree. Rom has passed a lot of reforms, but he probably still needs to deal with a lot of the more traditionalist members of his society and business sector. Don't forget that Zek nearly got himself deposed when he pushed reform too hard and most of the business leaders on Ferganinar refused to support him, so as Grand Nagus Rom needs to at least pay lip service to all the tycoons and heads of industry that help him stay in power. On top of that I imagine that in the six years he's been Grand Nagus Rom has had to redevelop a bit of a ruthless side, so that he can deal with the numerous political rivals gunning for his position and so he can strong arm some of the more stubborn members of his government into actually accepting the political reforms he knows will be good for the Ferengi as a species. And as such I think he's perhaps come to appreciate some of the more devious sides of Ferengi culture, as sometimes in their species you need to be a right manipulative and devious b****ard to get any progress done with a bunch of individuals who only look out for their own self interests like the modern day Ferengi. And by extension I could also see this as him warning the Federation "Hey, don't underestimate Ferengi or else they'll scam your collective pants off. Trust me. I work with them daily..."
@@startreknitpickers5838 Darkplace wasn’t big even in the UK - it was just six episodes. But it’s a cult show among people who people who are interested in comedy.
I think Rom wants to make reforms and still does. But I bet when he got to Ferenganar as the Grand Nagus, he discovered reform was a lot harder than he thought it would be. And there are also questions of how much does he want to reform? His own son, Nog, had to teach Jake how capitalism can work as a useful way of bartering for goods and storing time worked in the form of latinum to be spent later. Just because Ferengi are greedy doesn't mean there's nothing worthwhile in their culture or the rules of acquisition. So Rom had to learn how to use his power as Nagus to guide other Ferengi. The society won't change unless he makes them want to change. And he has to convince the other Ferengi that he's not an idiot. Notice that there are other people watching his interactions with the Federation now. Assume for a moment that his speech wasn't for the Federation reps, but for them. So that the spies report back to other Ferengi both that Rom is clever, the Federation is also clever, and after a brilliant move by the Federation, Ferenganr is going to enter a society of equals as an equal and with respect. You're looking too much at the surface. Probably because Rom seems like such a simple man. But some of the time, he's just playing simple in order to figure out his best move.
Hell his son said it best to Sisko: Rom is brilliant, but too passive and kind hearted. He's a great man but a terrible Ferengi. The same son who got into Star Fleet and probably is the best person Rom has to judge them by... but never mind we're making him sound like a dorky idiot.
@seiboldtadelbertsmiter3735, I love how many people agree with you in the comments that Rom is doing the moral thing to do. However, it occured to me while making this video that he may well have been a bit corrupted by the near-absolute power that goes along with bein Nagus... It's true that a fair amount of time has passed. This Rom works well for the cartoon world of the show though, so in the end I'm fine with it. Thanks for commenting, and believing in Rom.
This is why I despise modern Star Trek. It seems the writers and producers have not watched DS9, or in general Star Trek at all. (Just take a look at Star Trek - Picard) It is really sad :(
Normal for modern trek but abnormal for LD. Usually the writers seem like they have a solid understanding of the spirit and specifics of trek post TNG. But not in this episode.
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1:07 I really don't think that was the intention. Rather, Rom and Leeta were using this opportunity to send a message. Just because they're joining the Federation doesn't mean they're giving up their values or choosing to become "suckers."
Indeed. If the Federation stands by his mission statement to learn from and co-exist with other cultures rather than just trying to subsume other cultures into its own, they need to put their proverbial money where there mouth is. ESPECIALLY during something as defining as a member negotiation
1:52 Yeah, but this is Rom after six years on the throne. You don't think he could've managed that without adapting, do you?
Having Rom only act in a way the DS9 Rom would act would be a disservice to his character. Instead, we have seen some kind of character growth here. He gained self-awareness that he was seen was stupid and uninterested in business and many Ferengi probably also underestimated his Bajoran wife. By showing publicly that basically his wife was calling the shots, no one took them seriously in negotiations until it was too late.
And that also meant that Rom could operate in the cover of the ignorance of others to reform his culture. But as a good leader, he doesn't just represent his own personal views, but has to represent his people - and many Ferengi still chase profits and personal enrichment at that time, so any alliance with the federation will have to take that into account, even if he personally doesn't like it. This is especially showing his compassion, that was featured in his character in DS9 as well - he's not in it for himself, but for his people.
As for fusing the currency-based economy of Ferenginar with the currency-free of the Federation, I think there is a very simple way out: The Federation doesn't outlaw currency. It just is not using currency-based economics for their own "official" business. Meaning Federation-own Dilithium mines are not for-profit organizations and Starfleet is not getting paid.
However, Starfleet is still able to accumulate some form of currency - for example, Quark paid rent for his bar on DS9, even though it was, officially, a Starfleet installation. And with this currency-income, they tend to provide their officers with the cash to - like in this episode of LD - experience the Ferengi culture on Ferenginar. Member worlds can probably adapt this kind of non-currency-based economy, but they are also free to maintain their currency-based one. As there probably is a freedom for anyone to move anywhere, planets like Earth guarantee every federation citizen a life without poverty on the planet. So the negative side-effects of capitalism don't come into play on the other planets. If someone is too poor to live on that planet, they can always just move to paradise where they don't need money.
Way I figure it, Rom went in with ideals, yes, and he has done a lot to reform Ferenginar, but even the most liberal head of state can't rule without being willing to compromise to a degree. Rom has passed a lot of reforms, but he probably still needs to deal with a lot of the more traditionalist members of his society and business sector. Don't forget that Zek nearly got himself deposed when he pushed reform too hard and most of the business leaders on Ferganinar refused to support him, so as Grand Nagus Rom needs to at least pay lip service to all the tycoons and heads of industry that help him stay in power.
On top of that I imagine that in the six years he's been Grand Nagus Rom has had to redevelop a bit of a ruthless side, so that he can deal with the numerous political rivals gunning for his position and so he can strong arm some of the more stubborn members of his government into actually accepting the political reforms he knows will be good for the Ferengi as a species.
And as such I think he's perhaps come to appreciate some of the more devious sides of Ferengi culture, as sometimes in their species you need to be a right manipulative and devious b****ard to get any progress done with a bunch of individuals who only look out for their own self interests like the modern day Ferengi.
And by extension I could also see this as him warning the Federation "Hey, don't underestimate Ferengi or else they'll scam your collective pants off. Trust me. I work with them daily..."
They used two of the most detestable jobs for the Ferangi show. Landlord cops. Lol
This is a different episode, with four story lines going on. Boimler, Mariner, Rutherford & Tendi, and the Captain.
No one gets the joke in the title? It’s a reference to the UK comedy Garth Marenghi’s Darkplace, a parody of the horror films and 80s TV.
Thank you, @TheGreatAmphibian -yeah, being from the states, I had no idea what the heck the title was all about... LLAP!
@@startreknitpickers5838 Darkplace wasn’t big even in the UK - it was just six episodes. But it’s a cult show among people who people who are interested in comedy.
but i wonder who is attacking all those ships, Who in star trek has beef with all those worlds?
I think Rom wants to make reforms and still does. But I bet when he got to Ferenganar as the Grand Nagus, he discovered reform was a lot harder than he thought it would be. And there are also questions of how much does he want to reform? His own son, Nog, had to teach Jake how capitalism can work as a useful way of bartering for goods and storing time worked in the form of latinum to be spent later. Just because Ferengi are greedy doesn't mean there's nothing worthwhile in their culture or the rules of acquisition.
So Rom had to learn how to use his power as Nagus to guide other Ferengi. The society won't change unless he makes them want to change.
And he has to convince the other Ferengi that he's not an idiot. Notice that there are other people watching his interactions with the Federation now. Assume for a moment that his speech wasn't for the Federation reps, but for them. So that the spies report back to other Ferengi both that Rom is clever, the Federation is also clever, and after a brilliant move by the Federation, Ferenganr is going to enter a society of equals as an equal and with respect.
You're looking too much at the surface. Probably because Rom seems like such a simple man. But some of the time, he's just playing simple in order to figure out his best move.
I like you're interpretation, @jenniferhanses ! Thanks for commenting!
Hell his son said it best to Sisko: Rom is brilliant, but too passive and kind hearted. He's a great man but a terrible Ferengi. The same son who got into Star Fleet and probably is the best person Rom has to judge them by... but never mind we're making him sound like a dorky idiot.
Rom knows he can't change Fernginar over night it will take time to direct the culture in a different direction.
@seiboldtadelbertsmiter3735, I love how many people agree with you in the comments that Rom is doing the moral thing to do. However, it occured to me while making this video that he may well have been a bit corrupted by the near-absolute power that goes along with bein Nagus... It's true that a fair amount of time has passed. This Rom works well for the cartoon world of the show though, so in the end I'm fine with it. Thanks for commenting, and believing in Rom.
You mean the people who wrote the episode didn’t actually watch any of the original stuff so they knew what the character was about? I’m shocked.
Great insights! I feel like I might have been a little too harsh on this episode after the last couple lol
At least they didn't make Rom out to be a complete moron.
Subscribed, you earned it pal
Thanks a ton, @RobWheeze88 !
This is why I despise modern Star Trek. It seems the writers and producers have not watched DS9, or in general Star Trek at all. (Just take a look at Star Trek - Picard) It is really sad :(
Normal for modern trek but abnormal for LD. Usually the writers seem like they have a solid understanding of the spirit and specifics of trek post TNG. But not in this episode.
This was the weakest episode of the season so far. It almost made me feel okay about LD being canceled after season 5.
You never know…