I found Professor Jason to be clear and excellent. (I am studying Portuguese on Duolingo. When, I saw what I now know is the personal infinitive, I immediately purchased a 501 Portuguese verbs book. I still did not have any idea why the personal infinitive would be used until I saw Jason's lesson. Thank you!)
Professor Jason, in the last few years a number of Portuguese language teachers on TH-cam have made videos about the Personal Infinitive - and while they are all very good and helpful - your video on the subject is the gold standard in my opinion. Nobody else for example explained how to transform between the Personal Infinitive and Subjunctive tenses. I have watched this video at least 10 times over the years and understood every example except one: English: We insisted until you accepted the invitation. Personal Infinitive: Nós insistimos até você aceitar o convite Preterit: Insistimos até que você aceitou o convite Imperfect Subjunctive: Insistimos até que você aceitasse o convite Why did you use transform from the Personal Infinitive to the Preterit - and not the Imperfect Subjunctive - in this example? Muito obrigado pelos vídeos e pela ajuda!
Thanks for watching and for the complement. In this example (and in the very next one on that slide), the meaning is that you did accept (and I did arrive). From the perspective of the speaker, what they are narrating are completed past events that did, in fact happen. So you could say "até que você aceitou" or "depois que (eu) cheguei" but these do not, and should not be expressed in the imperfect/past subjunctive because they are not in doubt or being expressed as yet-to-occur actions. That would be something like: we were going to insist until you accepted the invitation: a gente ia insistir até que você aceitasse... (because we didn't know if you would). Does this help?
Yes Sir this makes perfect sense, I had a feeling it was something along those lines but I wanted to hear it from the master! De novo, muito obrigadissimo Professor Jason!@@Professorjason
You are awesome, it's amazing how much you know about Spanish and Portuguese. I just started to learn Portuguese like a week ago but this lesson on personal infinitive was helpful even though I don't know much Portuguese yet but I could understand what you were talking about because I am a Spanish native speaker. THANK YOU!
Muito bom vídeo para apoio no ensino de PLE para falantes de língua inglesa. Creio que ajude muito, por ser um estrangeiro que passa pelas mesmas dificuldades que os alunos estrangeiros passam. Os alunos também podem ver que fala português bem. Espero que inspirem-se e procurem melhorar! Indicarei no materia alternativo do meu curso! Seria intressante se fizesse um vídeo abordando alguns usos do imperfeito e do presente do subjuntivo! #ficaadica Algumas pessoas comentam sobre o uso ou não de determinadas palavras, termos, formas verbais. É importante entender que para quem está apredendo português como língua estrangeira, antes de tudo, deve-se priorizar o ensino da norma culta, de maneira que o aluno possa navegar por qualquer variante. Ainda que eu seja bem carioca, não ensino os alunos a falarem "tu vai", primeiro porque é linguagem extramamente informal, segundo porque é inadequado para comunicação em situações que exigem o uso normativo da língua. O dialeto local é assimilado facilmente e naturalmente quando o aluno está imerso no idioma. É primordial que aprendam a variante formal para que depois se aventurem pelos mares revoltos dos dialetos locais, como o do RIo.
@juanmaargentina muchas gracias, Juanma. Aprecio mucho el positive feedback que me has dado! So, why England?... Si tenés tiempo, échale un vistazo a mi video sobre dialectos del castellano... abrazo!
And just so I don't sound completely negative, I liked finding out about this "personal infinitive". It makes me very happy. It seems like an adorable mix of english and spanish syntax. Not that it came from that.
Hola soy Fernando de Perú. Me gustó muchísimo su clase porque yo domino los tres idiomas que usas en el video: español (lengua madre), inglés y portugués jaja. Sus videos son una buena forma de comparar y practicar las tres lenguas al mismo tiempo y ayudan a comprender las diferencias entre ellas. Por favor, haga mas videos parecidos donde incluya inglés, portugués y español. ¡Felicitaciones!
Great explanation on a topic I have struggled with in the past! Do you have any Video Lessons on Brazilian Portuguese Indicative verbs in the "Mais-Que-Perfeito" and how, when and why its used?
@juliecranford you are not incorrect in your definitions, which I of course am very familiar with, but my purpose here is not to expound on grammatical terminology. I use the term "tense" in the general sense in which most learners would recognize it -- a distinct grouping of verb forms. I do refer to the subjunctive "mood" several times, but I hesitate to do so, because although that may be more precise, it's that level of detail most people find "icky." Aspect means nothing to most people...
I've studying Portuguese for a few months now and have already concluded that the Personal Infinitive is a differing trait between Spanish and Portuguese. The other conclusion I had already arrived at is that the native Portuguese speaker prefers the Personal Infinitive to the Subjunctive. And then I made it my goal to imitate the native speakers in order for me to get as far away from Portuñol as possible! I also found out than in Spanish we do say phrases containing an infinitive form beyond the regular use of this tense, e.g. "Para (yo, tú, él, etc.) (hacer, lograr, etc.) éso, tendría(- - -) que...", which is identical to Portuguese in the sense that the Infinitive follows the pronoun. Or, using another expression: "Después de (llegar, cantar, hablar, etc.), (yo, tú, él, etc.), el ambiente cambió. I hope I didn't mess things further!
@juliecranford but like I said, I don't disagree with your points. In fact, I expected someone to point out that the personal infinitive is not a "tense" at all.
Tense means time. Preterite also shows aspect and future subjunctive also shows mood. It's kind of icky to call them all just "tenses" and confuse people about what that term actually means.
So to double check - the personal infinitive can substitute for both the present subjunctive and imperfect subjunctive? Can it also substitute for the future subjunctive?
@BRDisney hmmmm nao sei... ta falando de qual parte?... em que momento? V ou verificar... o espanhol moderno nao tem infinitivo impessoal nem tampouco futuro do subjuntivo :) é isso.
@juliecranford what I'm saying is I get where you're coming from, but to most learners the distinctions you are making would only add to the confusion in terms of making sense of what is already a fairly difficult topic. There is a fine line between enough information and too much detail, and I typically know where that is (according to most people). To say that conjugation is basically adding endings that indicate "tense" and "subject" certainly strikes a balance that makes sense -- to most.
Muito bom o vídeo, bem claro e objetivo!! Mas pelo menos , aqui no Rio de janeiro não usamos palavras como 'Quereres, fizeres..."Que é usado mais frequentemente no sul do país. Por exemplo. Mas usamos o "Tu" informalmente (somente o pronome). Adorei o vídeo, já indiquei a alguns amigos. Parabéns!! =)
@juliecranford I get it, but the preterite is a tense, for example. What a lot of teachers or professors fixated on labels often don't understand is that they can get in the way of actual learning. I haven't met anyone who's learned the imperfect vs. preterite distinction effectively through an understanding of aspect. If a person does not undestand that the present subjunctive and the present indicative are a single tense (two moods) it makes absolutely no difference in terms of learning.
;-) nice to know! Spanish speakers sometimes will use a subject pronoun before an infinitive, but they stop short of adding personal endings to the infinitive. I am not really sure if this is a recent trend or if its been going on for generations.
Exactly as you say, we native speakers of Spanish DO place subject pronouns BEFORE an Infinitive but we stop there. If we added the Personal endings, then Portuguese and Spanish would be more than 89% identical. I can't stop being amazed at the fact that these two languages are so alike structurally and even in written form.
Jason, Spanish does have the future subjunctive. It is used in legal writing as well as in certain phrases (at least in Castellano Rioplatense). ej: Sea cual fuere. .....quien estuviere...etc. However, you are correct that it is not used in everyday speech. We should not say that Spanish does not have it however. Other than that, great video!
The way I see it is that the personal infinitive makes it clear who did the action Where is in Spanish the infinitve is used. Depois chegarmos Despues de llegar. for example.
My mom is a spanish linguistics teacher, so I hear a lot about how people mis-use the term "tense". She hates having to correct people on that. She wishes that textbooks and lower-level teachers would just teach it right, instead of "simplifying" and leaving a mess for upper-level teachers to clean up.
Ah I understand now In Spanish to eliminate the second clause that would require the subjunctive you would only use the infinitve in portuguese you would the personal infinitve. Me mandó ir Mandou que eu ir.
![[Part 1] ทารกน้อยถูกทิ้ง👶 หญิงชราเก็บขวดขายเลี้ยงดูเขาจนโต #โลกการละคร](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/nPTDvFCExks/mqdefault.jpg)
I found Professor Jason to be clear and excellent. (I am studying Portuguese on Duolingo. When, I saw what I now know is the personal infinitive, I immediately purchased a 501 Portuguese verbs book. I still did not have any idea why the personal infinitive would be used until I saw Jason's lesson. Thank you!)
Exactly the same for me, also in duolingo there is no "esteja" for example: Talvez voce esteja penssando
Thank you Professor Jason. You are amazing teacher 🌺🌺❤❤🤗🤗
Muito obrigado
Professor Jason, in the last few years a number of Portuguese language teachers on TH-cam have made videos about the Personal Infinitive - and while they are all very good and helpful - your video on the subject is the gold standard in my opinion. Nobody else for example explained how to transform between the Personal Infinitive and Subjunctive tenses.
I have watched this video at least 10 times over the years and understood every example except one:
English: We insisted until you accepted the invitation.
Personal Infinitive: Nós insistimos até você aceitar o convite
Preterit: Insistimos até que você aceitou o convite
Imperfect Subjunctive: Insistimos até que você aceitasse o convite
Why did you use transform from the Personal Infinitive to the Preterit - and not the Imperfect Subjunctive - in this example?
Muito obrigado pelos vídeos e pela ajuda!
Thanks for watching and for the complement. In this example (and in the very next one on that slide), the meaning is that you did accept (and I did arrive). From the perspective of the speaker, what they are narrating are completed past events that did, in fact happen. So you could say "até que você aceitou" or "depois que (eu) cheguei" but these do not, and should not be expressed in the imperfect/past subjunctive because they are not in doubt or being expressed as yet-to-occur actions. That would be something like: we were going to insist until you accepted the invitation: a gente ia insistir até que você aceitasse... (because we didn't know if you would). Does this help?
Yes Sir this makes perfect sense, I had a feeling it was something along those lines but I wanted to hear it from the master! De novo, muito obrigadissimo Professor Jason!@@Professorjason
You are awesome, it's amazing how much you know about Spanish and Portuguese. I just started to learn Portuguese like a week ago but this lesson on personal infinitive was helpful even though I don't know much Portuguese yet but I could understand what you were talking about because I am a Spanish native speaker. THANK YOU!
It is a very helpful lesson. Thanks a lot my teacher Mr. Jason.
Muito obrigado por todo sua ajuda nestes videos. You have a great talent to teach.
Your explanations are amazingly clear and extremely helpful. Thanks!
muito obrigada pela liçao professor!
De nada! Obrigado por assistir!
Muito bom vídeo para apoio no ensino de PLE para falantes de língua inglesa. Creio que ajude muito, por ser um estrangeiro que passa pelas mesmas dificuldades que os alunos estrangeiros passam. Os alunos também podem ver que fala português bem. Espero que inspirem-se e procurem melhorar! Indicarei no materia alternativo do meu curso! Seria intressante se fizesse um vídeo abordando alguns usos do imperfeito e do presente do subjuntivo! #ficaadica
Algumas pessoas comentam sobre o uso ou não de determinadas palavras, termos, formas verbais. É importante entender que para quem está apredendo português como língua estrangeira, antes de tudo, deve-se priorizar o ensino da norma culta, de maneira que o aluno possa navegar por qualquer variante. Ainda que eu seja bem carioca, não ensino os alunos a falarem "tu vai", primeiro porque é linguagem extramamente informal, segundo porque é inadequado para comunicação em situações que exigem o uso normativo da língua. O dialeto local é assimilado facilmente e naturalmente quando o aluno está imerso no idioma. É primordial que aprendam a variante formal para que depois se aventurem pelos mares revoltos dos dialetos locais, como o do RIo.
@juanmaargentina muchas gracias, Juanma. Aprecio mucho el positive feedback que me has dado! So, why England?... Si tenés tiempo, échale un vistazo a mi video sobre dialectos del castellano... abrazo!
11 years late to the party but hey! Thanks for making this. It has helped me understand personal infinitive a bit more.
Seja Bem-vinda!
And just so I don't sound completely negative, I liked finding out about this "personal infinitive". It makes me very happy. It seems like an adorable mix of english and spanish syntax. Not that it came from that.
Hola soy Fernando de Perú. Me gustó muchísimo su clase porque yo domino los tres idiomas que usas en el video: español (lengua madre), inglés y portugués jaja. Sus videos son una buena forma de comparar y practicar las tres lenguas al mismo tiempo y ayudan a comprender las diferencias entre ellas. Por favor, haga mas videos parecidos donde incluya inglés, portugués y español.
¡Felicitaciones!
Great explanation on a topic I have struggled with in the past! Do you have any Video Lessons on Brazilian Portuguese Indicative verbs in the "Mais-Que-Perfeito" and how, when and why its used?
@juliecranford you are not incorrect in your definitions, which I of course am very familiar with, but my purpose here is not to expound on grammatical terminology. I use the term "tense" in the general sense in which most learners would recognize it -- a distinct grouping of verb forms. I do refer to the subjunctive "mood" several times, but I hesitate to do so, because although that may be more precise, it's that level of detail most people find "icky." Aspect means nothing to most people...
Thank you! This was really useful!
I've studying Portuguese for a few months now and have already concluded that the Personal Infinitive is a differing trait between Spanish and Portuguese. The other conclusion I had already arrived at is that the native Portuguese speaker prefers the Personal Infinitive to the Subjunctive. And then I made it my goal to imitate the native speakers in order for me to get as far away from Portuñol as possible!
I also found out than in Spanish we do say phrases containing an infinitive form beyond the regular use of this tense, e.g. "Para (yo, tú, él, etc.) (hacer, lograr, etc.) éso, tendría(- - -) que...", which is identical to Portuguese in the sense that the Infinitive follows the pronoun.
Or, using another expression: "Después de (llegar, cantar, hablar, etc.), (yo, tú, él, etc.), el ambiente cambió.
I hope I didn't mess things further!
Love your explanation. Is there anyway i can get the slides?
Fantastic clear explanation thank you.
Otimo explicacao, muito obrigado
@BRDisney ah muito obrigado! sempre aprecio seus comentários! :)
@juliecranford but like I said, I don't disagree with your points. In fact, I expected someone to point out that the personal infinitive is not a "tense" at all.
Tense means time. Preterite also shows aspect and future subjunctive also shows mood. It's kind of icky to call them all just "tenses" and confuse people about what that term actually means.
Tambem, ha uma opcao mais "normal" entre o conjuntivo ou o infinitivo pessoal?
So to double check - the personal infinitive can substitute for both the present subjunctive and imperfect subjunctive? Can it also substitute for the future subjunctive?
@BRDisney hmmmm nao sei... ta falando de qual parte?... em que momento? V ou verificar... o espanhol moderno nao tem infinitivo impessoal nem tampouco futuro do subjuntivo :) é isso.
@juliecranford what I'm saying is I get where you're coming from, but to most learners the distinctions you are making would only add to the confusion in terms of making sense of what is already a fairly difficult topic. There is a fine line between enough information and too much detail, and I typically know where that is (according to most people). To say that conjugation is basically adding endings that indicate "tense" and "subject" certainly strikes a balance that makes sense -- to most.
Muito bom o vídeo, bem claro e objetivo!! Mas pelo menos , aqui no Rio de janeiro não usamos palavras como 'Quereres, fizeres..."Que é usado mais frequentemente no sul do país. Por exemplo. Mas usamos o "Tu" informalmente (somente o pronome). Adorei o vídeo, já indiquei a alguns amigos. Parabéns!! =)
@juliecranford I get it, but the preterite is a tense, for example. What a lot of teachers or professors fixated on labels often don't understand is that they can get in the way of actual learning. I haven't met anyone who's learned the imperfect vs. preterite distinction effectively through an understanding of aspect. If a person does not undestand that the present subjunctive and the present indicative are a single tense (two moods) it makes absolutely no difference in terms of learning.
Obrigada! You're great!
theBookDictator awwwww, obrigado! Você também é :)
thanks for the upload it was muitíssmo util.
;-) nice to know! Spanish speakers sometimes will use a subject pronoun before an infinitive, but they stop short of adding personal endings to the infinitive. I am not really sure if this is a recent trend or if its been going on for generations.
Exactly as you say, we native speakers of Spanish DO place subject pronouns BEFORE an Infinitive but we stop there. If we added the Personal endings, then Portuguese and Spanish would be more than 89% identical. I can't stop being amazed at the fact that these two languages are so alike structurally and even in written form.
thank you so much, this is super helpful!
thank you Jason
Jason, Spanish does have the future subjunctive. It is used in legal writing as well as in certain phrases (at least in Castellano Rioplatense). ej: Sea cual fuere. .....quien estuviere...etc. However, you are correct that it is not used in everyday speech. We should not say that Spanish does not have it however. Other than that, great video!
Right you are!
Yeah for me as a spanish speaker the future subjunctive and the personal infinitive are quite strange.
Great video!
How do you say:
'it's important to inform us' ---> é importante nos informarem ? is that correct??
+Detlef De Clercq That sounds a bit awkward to me, but I guess it would work. I think the subjunctive would be better.
+Professor Jason okay, how woule you say it?
+Detlef De Clercq É importante que nos informem. But your ways is also correct.
+Professor Jason muito obrigado !
Sometimes the personal infinitive can change:
trair, traírem, pôr, porem.
ótimo!
The way I see it is that the personal infinitive makes it clear who did the action Where is in Spanish the infinitve is used. Depois chegarmos Despues de llegar. for example.
Sou brasileiro e não sei como eu vim parar aqui.... Mas se alguem quiser treinar seu português, eu posso ajudar.
It is haber in Spanish, haver is not used in modern Portgues as an auxilary only as the impersonal there is are
My mom is a spanish linguistics teacher, so I hear a lot about how people mis-use the term "tense". She hates having to correct people on that. She wishes that textbooks and lower-level teachers would just teach it right, instead of "simplifying" and leaving a mess for upper-level teachers to clean up.
Ah I understand now In Spanish to eliminate the second clause that would require the subjunctive you would only use the infinitve in portuguese you would the personal infinitve. Me mandó ir Mandou que eu ir.
Un vídeo excelente, mas debía ser expuesto al revés.
Oml boring too technical makes learning a second language a nightmare. Yuk.