Brake rotors don't warp!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 ก.ค. 2024
- If you think you have “warped” your brake rotors then you need to watch this video.I explain what has really happened, what to do about it and how you can prevent it.
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For those wanting a recommendation on what pads to use that can take track abuse. I currently use are Endless MX72. The Endless part number For the MK7 GTI PP and R calipers is EIP250. They are good for up to 700deg C.
I have also used Forza FR6 which can also take the abuse.
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Man im glad this only got 4k views. They 100% do warp! Im a Master Mercedes Technician, ive physically measured rotors with a "dial gauge," this is a "measurement tool,." this is science. Just wow.
It's obvious you measured the pad deposits, which apparently only deposit in the same one spot on each revolution of the rotor, on the rotor that spins... You can't make up his kind of stupidity. lol
That's another reason never to take your Mercedes to the Dealer, "Master" lol !
I'm a mechanical engineer and I can guarantee you they DO warp
My dial indicator also proves they do warp. I measure them every time I install a rotor. I have the tool to do it with so, why not? I checked mine and they were perfect. I checked them when I got a pulsating in the brakes and the rotor warped, confirmed by my dial indicator. The wheel hub was also tested which came out to be perfect.
I agree with you 100% Yes, sometimes a driver may notice a brake pulsation upon brake application that many NOT be 'brake' related. That's when checking out the suspension, hub bearings, etc. need to be done.
@@drevil5546 quick question what do you mean by pulsating? Cause I think my rotor is warped, when I brake it kinda feels like it tugs right
@@shaneebahera8566 It's very easy to tell whether brake pad material has gotten stuck to the rotor or the rotor has warped. A rotor that just experiences normal wear is not going to wear unevenly unless there's a problem with the pads, and even then, it's going to affect the wear radially, not axially.
Anyone who truly thinks that brake rotors do not warp has obviously never operated a brake lathe.
@@greenman5391 If your brakes pull the car in one direction under braking, that is an indication of a stuck caliper. One side is braking harder than the other, which causes the car to veer to the direction of the working caliper.
Thanks so much. I never comment but I'm going to make an exception. I've been working on cars since the late 60s and have replaced a lot of "warped " rotors. Two or three years ago I changed the rotors on my toyota sienna and even bought expensive Bosch rotors because I didn't want them to "warp" again. About a month ago my front end started shaking when I put on the brakes. Needless to say I was really pissed (pissed has a different meaning in the US). I went on line and the first thing that came up was your youtube. In the past I always bought cheap pads because they're easy to change and wouldn't wear out the rotors. This time I bought Akabono ceramic pads, lightly cleaned up the rotors with a 120 grit flap disk, and rinsed the rotors with brake cleaner. It's been a week now and the brakes are sweet and smooth with no vibration. Thanks again. I can't believe that all these years I never measured run out.
Glad a saved you from throwing out a set of “warped” rotors :)
Metals do warp with heat, so yea rotors does warp with enough heat. Your point with pad deposits is true as well.
If the engine head and block can warp then best believe rotors can warp.
Yeah because Discs are made of the same alloy as an engine head. SMH.
Trying to tell people they don’t warp gets them very upset. There cast at very high temperatures and it’s not possible to achieve these temps while driving.
You're wrong rotors are made to cool quickly so when they get hot and cool quickly they warp. Anybody who knows basic metalurgy should know that rotors CAN and DO warp when heated up and cooled quickly. Same with cracks they form from expanding and contracting so that means the metal if not held at a constant temperature is always moving if you will and will be froze to that position if cooled too quickly.
A lot of confusion arises because most people don't know the definition of the word "Warp". The first time Americans are exposed to this word is on Star Trek. You are 100% correct, Discs cannot warp. Measuring Runout with the Disc on the hub as if it proves warping is ridiculous. I'm 67, I've never once seen a warped Disc because ..... it's not possible, even on the cheapest of Discs. They are made of Cast Steel, they fracture and crack like glass under enough pressure, EVEN WHEN GLOWING RED HOT. They cannot bend.
Though they sometimes do come wrongly machined new. Like mine.
They used to turn rotors at the parts store, but they won't do it anymore. So should I just go at them with sandpaper?
If they wrap, then how come when i put on new brake pads and hardware, its goes away at first?
i changed mine and the pulsating goes on.. so its the rotors..
If they were physically warped the turning them would be almost impossible or it would remove way to much material.
Very true
Fact, they can warp by increments of thousands of an inch. My rear rotor on a Pan European 1300 was out of true by 30 thou after a run where the calliper pistons were sticking and overheated the disc casing warpage. Very evident with a pointer next to the rotating disc. Happens in cars regularly too. Pads issues also contributory by rotors can defrost out of true enough to affect braking (causing pulsing etc and damage to mounting pins of calliper)
Brake heat isn’t hot enough to warp a rotor, when cast they subjected to heat 3 times or more than driving.
The fact is rotors can and do warp but its not often the problem with rotors warping is that some shops use it every time they want to sell a new set of rotors to increase the profit margins even when the rotors are not warped.
Hi. I'm running CSS pads on oem rotor (gti PP 340mm) and they are much smoother and progressive than originals. I'm due for rotors now. What would be your recommendation?
Thats some good feedback on the CSS pads. The perfect choice IMO would be to match them with the CSS rotors, though they are a touch pricey. Though cheap when compared to legit 2-piece options. DBA have good quality rotors, T3 4000 are a popular choice. The OEM rotors are good quality as well.
I'd also highly recommend titanium shims to complement the pads. track-hack-parts.myshopify.com/collections/braking/products/0-6mm-titanium-shim-for-mk7-gti-pp-and-r-front-brakes-340mm
that's funny. I've had a 2012 and now 2013 gmc terrain and I had to replace rotors on both because when applying the brake it would damn near start hopping. if they don't warp wht did I have to replace both vehicles?
Then why when I take my rotors to get turned and I get them back you can see where material had been cut out on like half the rotor and other half untouched by the lathe? That sounds like warped rotors to me. Also why would they make crazy expensive rotor turning machines if they were pointless?
Because that is called run out and does require turning. It’s wearing un-evenly. The metal is not changing shape (warping) which people incorrectly believe is a thing.
He is actually right.
My mechanic can confirm that rotors ONLY warp if there is SEVERE damage to them.
Like you are going 158mph and slamming on the breaks 4 hours a day.
Tracking the car basically.
But for everyday average people your rotors either don't warp or the warping is so small it is not noticeable.
90% of the time, squeaking and noises while driving is your break pads are low, break pads deposits, or maybe a bad wheel bearing.
But "warped" rotors is just another way for the industry to give you and excuse to sell you things.
Getting perfectly new rotors are kind of like getting the top notch anti freeze.....
........its nice to have but unless you are really BEATING on the car you won't need the top notch version.....
.....same idea applies with rotors.
Remember the industry just wants to make money off of you....
... and they will give you any excuse to do so.
Yeah... no. You've clearly never worked a brake lathe before. Regular people ride the shit out of their brakes, and it DOES warp the rotors. So much so that sometimes a lathe can't even fix them.
I had so much noise from the rotors i thought my pad were done, instead they're still new with tons of tread left and i think my aggressive driving just cook the rotor..but according to you i should just switch the pad ? They only have 25k on them with lots of tread left..
Noise or vibration? What kind of noise? Could be lots of things.
Rotors dont warp
Rotors don’t warp. What you’re measuring is material from the pad that glazes itself in random spots on the rotor’s faces. Rotors do not warp. In fact when turning rotors. You’re supposed to just shave down the pad material that’s stuck on there. That’s it. Rotors don’t warp
Raybestos is a manufacturer of brake components of all types. They have a professional brake Tech School where they teach professional mechanics the facts about brakes, their specs, troubleshooting, and repair. Here is an article in which they discuss the misunderstood topic of "rotor warpage": www.hendonpub.com/resources/article_archive/results/details?id=1787
By the way, these guys, whose entire business is brakes, state unequivocally, that "Rotors Don't Warp". If someone wants to argue with them, be my guest but they have invested a lot of money into their business so I would be willing to say they know this subject VERY well.
Thank you!
Finally, someone who knows what they are talking about. In a nutshell, it's important to control rotor run out, less than .002inch/.05mm. If you don't do this, the rotors will wobble against the pads creating scalloped areas in the rotors. Some people think the resulting vibration is caused by the rotor being overheated and thus warping when in reality, they just have scalloped out areas.
The link no longer works. It returns a 404 error (not found). Can you provided an updated link?
I'm experiencing what I believe is best described as "brake torque variation". At highway speed when I brake there is bit of unpleasant steering wheel vibration, a bit of body vibration, but *no* brake pedal pulsation at all. At low speed there is some the same feeling but much milder, unnoticeable unless you're paying careful attention. I measured the run out (I have a dial indicator) and all rotors are less than or equal to 0.001 in. It's a Honda vehicle and Honda's spec is 0.0016 in, so run out is not the problem. If the problem is uneven brake pad material deposition is there any value in removing the rotors and simply sanding the surface to "deglaze" them, or is that hopeless and the only solution is new pads and rotors?
p.s. I landed here because I searched for "rotors warp when hot". I've pretty much concluded my rotors are not "warped" and do not get hot and then warp. The car is driven gently, the rotors never get hot. I measured rotor temperature (with a IR gun) after a test driver and they were only 60 C. I'm pretty much sold on the conclusion that the measured run out is okay and that warping is simply not the issue.
Pad deposits could be the issue. I've had them from even low speed driving. I've sanded mine down before when it was really bad. It's worth a shot before spending money on new parts.
Hey mate what do you think of carbon ceramic pads on OEM discs??
I think they are fine. The Endless pads I use a carbon ceramic. They can be difficult to bed in but once done they perform very well. My advice is to first get the disc skimmed before switching to carbon ceramic to ensure a good initial bed in.
@@trackhackau awesome thanks mate. Super helpful!
You know nothing about what you are talking about! Rotors DO warp! Check ANY service manual and they have the process of checking runout (warping). Rotors will even warp if not stored correctly before installation! Do some research and get your facts right before posting an instructional video! I have been a professional mechanic for over 30 years and I have replaced many warped rotors!
@riikerman I am 58 years old and not a kid. Like I said above, do some research!
@riikerman Motors don't bent or twist from braking but only when there are uneven cooling. Try spraying with cool water the moment you reached home. You will be amazed
riikerman well if it is hot enough to become pliable, apply water to one side or part of the steel and see if it doesn’t contract more where the water hit it and cooled more quickly than the other part. Witnessed in person, plenty of times.
I recently got told that because I sprayed room temperature water on my slightly hot rotor (barely hot) that I had warped them.
Okay
Yeah, that is one way to warp the rotors. This guy is half full of shit. Warping is caused by uneven cooling. One way this happens is hard braking, then keeping the brake pressed. The pads keep the rotors warmer at the contact point (uneven cooling). Another way is spraying water on them, maybe braking and the going for a car wash. Only the outside of the rotor and the part not coverd by the caliper gets sprayed
Rotors do warp. But he is also right at the same time. You can get deposits on the rotor as well and it has the same effect. And his statement on OEM r better really depends on the manufacturer
I have had warped rotors on most of my Honda vehicles in the past with OEM rotors. I find that they are not as good as the aftermarkets I put on afterwards. However, one thing I have been doing to try to combat this is to make sure the lug nuts are torqued equally. This way as the metal cools when contacting water while they are hot, they don't warp as bad as if the lug nuts were torqued unevenly by a lazy mechanic. Different pressures at different parts of the rotor may cause warping?!?! Not sure, but just throwing it out there. Just my experience. I mean I think there is a lug nut torque spec for some reason right? Otherwise tight is tight which would make an engineer cringe.
I'm going through this with a 2017 Mazda 6 GT. I was heading down the path of warped front rotors until I saw that Mazda uses ventilated discs. Ventilated discs are much harder to warp than solid core discs. Long story short, I think you're correct that the pads could well be the issue. Thanks for posting.
Rotors do warp. They just do. Despite not being made of cheese or cardboard. Just like a frying pan would. The fact that in your case they didn't (though it's still unclear since your solution is both to skim the disks and change the pads) doesn't mean that they don't warp at all. What the hell?
Actually they don't. They are too think to actually warp. But they can wear unevenly which gives the sensation of warping. Splitting hairs but it's true.
Iv seen warped hub assemblys from excessive heat !!! So they do warp heat will warp most metals
this is what happens when you drive a vw lmao
I came across another reason that can warp rotors.... If the rotors are hot and you are driving on wet roads or even though puddles they get cool down too fast and it warps them.
100% impossible
That's 7 and a half minutes of my life I won't get back!
Yes they do warps. I replace mine and they work perfectly now.
So you replaced the rotors and the new ones feel better. So do they feel better because they aren't warped or because they don't have pad deposits?
Try driving a heavy car not a tin can. They warp
I got them to warp on my Accord, thing weights under 3,200lbs. This dude just has no idea what he’s saying.
wrong the oem cost more because of the name. you pay for the brand not for the quality
Have to agree to disagree on that one.
They do warp actually, not as much as your brain has warped, but they can get pretty fucked up.
they do warp,
you can listen to this guy or to people and experts that know what their talking about
Tell this to my '07 GTO.
Indeed , rotors do 'warp'. Not from being squeezed by brake pads while hot of course, where did you get that idea from, are you trolling?
Honest question: Are you a flat-earther? You have that look on your face.
the squeezing issue is real when rotors are old, the metal becomes porous and weak... and you end up with a thickness variation.
@@daves2433 I hope you are joking.
@@NotAnonymousNo80014 I'm serious, I've had old rotors (3-5yrs) which have spots are not shiny but dark & spotted. That's where they are corroded through and are softer than other areas of the rotor... causing a pulsation in the brakes. Is happened on solid and vented rotors, and does not machine out... rust is what steel & iron do when they get old.
He probably thinks the earth is flat too smh
ofcourse it is flat! in fact its shaped like a rotor!
There are some reputable engineers that deny warpage, but it's all theory unless someone does an actual experiment and collects suspect rotors and measures thickness and runout with a dial gauge. I've been in cars that actually shake from side to side durring hard braking.
Run out is real for sure. But they don’t warp from overheating is the common misconception.
Rotors do warp. Not because of the heat though. It’s because of the pad transfer that you mentioned. Transferred pad will mask the surface and the covered area will not wear as even as exposed parts. At the end you have DTV or something very similar to a warped disc. So if your rotor just started to judder, bed them in again or use some sand paper to take the transferred pad off. Otherwise you are going need to replace rotors anytime soon. Alternatively you could used a pad that is ready for high temperature.
Exactly my point. It's pad transfer or runout, not the metal changing shape (warping) which is the common misconception from people who track their cars and feel a juddering after.
What do U mean by DTV?
@@selwyn13 Disk Thickness Variation
Guess you’ve never turned rotors and heard the warp in them when cutting….
They do warp. Wonder why they measure runout???? Lol. Cheap new rotors seem to warp a lot. Getting good parts is hard anymore. Yes, I have experience. 26+ years ASE master tech.
This is actually one of the distinctions I was trying to make. That the metal itself doesn't bend (warp) due to overheating, but wears unevenly hence runout issues experienced.
Yes brake rotors do warp. Please be careful, as you cant mill or grind the uneven parts. Most now days rotors are not serviceable, and are only good for the use, what ever that length of time is. Rotor manufactures do not specify.
😂😂
Clearly this guy has never seen a warped rotor.
Excellent advice. But why do these guys make videos while driving?
It’s either that or sit in front of my computer with a blank wall behind me. At least shooting from the car keeps the environment “car relevant”. It is quite a challenge to shoot somewhere interesting.
what a load of bull crap!
Rotors warp. You have a lot more to learn.
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
🤦🏼♂️ clearly no idea, after several years of amateur rallying I’ve warped and melted many sets of rotors. Stock are not good enough for heavy track use
"they're not made of cheese" no but your brain must be! 🤣
When your video has more thumbs down then thumbs up...... you’re doing wrong
😂
My cars front discs just warped hence why I’m here.
if it's shakes it's warped lol
70k miles of hard driving with me purposely cooling when they've got hot. THEY WARP!
So wait, you have thousands of mechanics saying it can, and then you, a single youtuber saying it doesn't?
this guy has no idea whats he talking about..
i got new pads on mine and the breaks r still pulsating as they where with the old ones..
In 90% of cases it’s true
😂😂