What did everyone think about todays episode? Also, Spotify Link! podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/classicplusshow/episodes/Sardaco---Hardcore-and-What-Classic-Means--The-Classic-Show-5-e2oomio
There’s no point in a fresh hardcore server , 90% of the hardcore players never get to raid let alone hit max level so there’s no reason for fresh , it’s hardcore.
The fact that retail lovers are talking about Classic Vanilla, is why we're having issues in the first place. If you enjoy retail game design, you have no business talking about or voicing your opinion about Classic sorry.
You guys honestly need to get someone on that does not start every answer with "I agree...". I'm 12 minutes in and every single time someone new starts talking it's exactly the same. So yeah, some diversity of thought or playing devils advocate every now and then to at least challenge some ideas would be nice.
@@EbonhardtTV Yeah, everyone is excited for C+, myself included. What I meant was not someone who hates the idea, but more of a back and forth on individual aspects of it. As what additions would be good, what is too much etc. Now that I re-red my initial comment, it sounded a bit harsh, so sorry about that. What I would suggest is: one of you takes a contrarian position and tries to defend it. For example "I really love the standardized loot of retail, because 95% of it can be relevant to me" and then try to defend it against the more Classic version of itemization. No need to exactly get someone who actually thinks it, but you know, trying to find some merit in "bad ideas" can actually help out to improve the established narrative. I think we want to not fall into confirmation bias too much, as changes in C+ are inevitable and outright needed. So yeah, that were my like 47 cents on the issue. Cheers for reading.
That makes sense. I will keep it in mind for the next episode. Constructive criticism or breaking an idea down to find the negative and positive in it could add extra flavor/value to the show. Thank you for the feedback!
@@EbonhardtTVbtw if it’s allowed to talk about turtle wow on these podcasts, their in game store is great. You can buy subrace skins (make your dwarf look like dark iron, red orcs, mechagnomes), you can buy 30 slot bags, and other cosmetic options that are harmless to the game but add flavor to you.
I think Classic+ should have Outland, whether it rethinks/redoes TBC or accepts most of it as it is, is up for debate, but Outland is a natural place where you can have more content! Same goes for Northrend and the different Isles that were already in Warcraft 1,2 and 3.
You cannot unite people who want microtransactions, wow token, free respect, aoe grind fest and random dungeon finder ; and those who don't. Surveys don't work, because it's mostly people playing retail that answers, when it should in fact be true classic players who do.
Hardcore diablo 2 and hardcore wow are completely different , I can die in diablo and be back at 80 the same day. You lose a level 60 hardcore wow toon and your down 2 weeks to a month ez 🎉
I couldn't disagree more with some of Sardaco's ideas. Items randomly proccing to be upgraded has already been a thing and was universally hated (see titanforging). I think there might be a place for items proccing in this manner from farms that are repeatable but certainly not from raids. Chances only once a week at this upgraded gear would just end up making most people feel frustrated. BoEs being only green would be extremely unenjoyable for the majority of players imo. I think a decent middleground would be a design philosophy change on BoEs. I would rather have all BiS crafted items be bop and good but not BiS, maybe even slightly worse than prebis gear, be BoEs. They could also only have a handful of prebis slots be available from BoEs and not allow big slots (helm, chest, legs, weapons) be bis from BoEs. I also hope people shift their criticisms of the new honor system slightly. The previous system also didn't reward people for being skilled or doing something impressive. It rewarded people with infinite free time and a poop sock. The current system also simply rewards time spent it just requires *less* time. I'm not really sure what a fix for this system would look like, possibly gear being tied to RBGs instead of mindless time spent afking AV. Yes btw I'm looking at all those classic R14 ppl, your afking AV or rushing down the pve boss in 5min in a coordinated discord group was not impressive, sorry. PvP gear being removed from hardcore but BGs being enabled sounds fine to me. Maybe even make PvP deaths not count at all in hardcore so WPvP could be a thing (although this would have a lot of asterisks since I'm sure there are many abuses and they'd all need to be fixed). Maybe this will come off a bit harsh but I hope it gives pause for thought. People tend to fixate on certain answers to perceived problems even if alternative answers are just as good or better, as for why this is idk ask psychologists I'm sure they'll give you some variety of answers. I think the WoW community suffers from this right now with this idea that somehow the modern internet has destroyed people's ability to play WoW as they used to. I will say this is a possibility but people engaging with their lives in a more efficiency-over-fun manner is sadly not restricted to just games. It's been a societal shift that has affected far more sectors than just gaming. To repeat, access to information also does not necessitate the use of it, it is a shift in culture that has caused people to engage differently with games. There are plenty of articles from academics discussing the issue of efficiency-mindedness and how it is adversely affecting our mental health today. psyche.co/ideas/why-efficiency-is-dangerous-and-slowing-down-makes-life-better Hm, this paragraph is a bit poorly written but w/e too lazy to improve.
I think hardcore servers are good for content creators making content, but in terms of what do the majority of player's want is hazard to guess a fresh hc server would not be high on their list
@@kellypease-j2y Easier to do HC fresh it is implied that it is only vanilla, where an actual fresh is a can of worms I'm not sure the devs are ready to open.
@@codywatson9627 Economy on HC is very good. People die with all their gear and epic mount. So the economy is still amazing, the prices are almost the same as 1 year ago
Oooooo, I'm super firsty. I'll let you comment first about this rumored Fresh HC, Sardaco, to get your spoiler-free take. More news at 11. Love the content boys. Watch stuff from all three of you all the time. Side note: do any of you three play horde? "Get Packed Up" ....Cold Blooded Tello, haha.
That long tangent about adding breakable weapons and gear I think is not at all a great idea for wow… BUT a survival Warcraft game?? That would be LEGIT
Warcraft logs shouldn't exist in Classic. It is completely unnecessary and just further divides the community. If you want to sweat, go play retail. No one uses it for the intended purpose, they just use it for the dopamine of whether they got a purple or orange number.
Retail Classic+ (Vanilla World only - could potentially add new continents or expand on Outland, but do not use the cataclysm world) Era server that progs thru WoTLK and restarts every 3 years or something. Set it up where the phases come faster so there is less content drought. Hell they could even do like they did in SoD and do level bands. Gives people plenty of time to work on professions and alts.
If they make a new HC server, it’s needs to be 100% solo self found!! No AH, no mail, no trading, and also remove petri flask and LIP potion.. should be no pot that can save your life
24:15 you guy do realize that a divided community of 100,000 players is ok? That a TBC new can peel off 15,000 people and still has a successful server without taking from anyone else? Not enough push back to ideas on this show. When someone says something; you should think “what did he say that was wrong”. Let’s go
What did everyone think about todays episode? Also,
Spotify Link!
podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/classicplusshow/episodes/Sardaco---Hardcore-and-What-Classic-Means--The-Classic-Show-5-e2oomio
Really Enjoyed talking with these 2 legends. Thanks for having me boys.
Had an amazing time much luv amigos! Enjoy 🔒
There’s no point in a fresh hardcore server , 90% of the hardcore players never get to raid let alone hit max level so there’s no reason for fresh , it’s hardcore.
This is what I look forward to most on Mondays ❤️. Makes work so much better
It makes allot of sense to release TBC fresh before classic+. Imo the greatest version of the game.
The fact that retail lovers are talking about Classic Vanilla, is why we're having issues in the first place. If you enjoy retail game design, you have no business talking about or voicing your opinion about Classic sorry.
You guys honestly need to get someone on that does not start every answer with "I agree...". I'm 12 minutes in and every single time someone new starts talking it's exactly the same. So yeah, some diversity of thought or playing devils advocate every now and then to at least challenge some ideas would be nice.
I'm honestly not against it. A bit hard to find a creator whose super negative on the idea of Classic+ imo. If you have any suggestions let me know.
@@EbonhardtTV Yeah, everyone is excited for C+, myself included. What I meant was not someone who hates the idea, but more of a back and forth on individual aspects of it. As what additions would be good, what is too much etc. Now that I re-red my initial comment, it sounded a bit harsh, so sorry about that. What I would suggest is: one of you takes a contrarian position and tries to defend it. For example "I really love the standardized loot of retail, because 95% of it can be relevant to me" and then try to defend it against the more Classic version of itemization. No need to exactly get someone who actually thinks it, but you know, trying to find some merit in "bad ideas" can actually help out to improve the established narrative. I think we want to not fall into confirmation bias too much, as changes in C+ are inevitable and outright needed.
So yeah, that were my like 47 cents on the issue. Cheers for reading.
That makes sense. I will keep it in mind for the next episode. Constructive criticism or breaking an idea down to find the negative and positive in it could add extra flavor/value to the show. Thank you for the feedback!
@@EbonhardtTV pretty sure meta goblin isn’t all up on blizzards lap, he’d prolly have some opposite takes
@@EbonhardtTVbtw if it’s allowed to talk about turtle wow on these podcasts, their in game store is great. You can buy subrace skins (make your dwarf look like dark iron, red orcs, mechagnomes), you can buy 30 slot bags, and other cosmetic options that are harmless to the game but add flavor to you.
I think Classic+ should have Outland, whether it rethinks/redoes TBC or accepts most of it as it is, is up for debate, but Outland is a natural place where you can have more content! Same goes for Northrend and the different Isles that were already in Warcraft 1,2 and 3.
You cannot unite people who want microtransactions, wow token, free respect, aoe grind fest and random dungeon finder ; and those who don't.
Surveys don't work, because it's mostly people playing retail that answers, when it should in fact be true classic players who do.
Hardcore diablo 2 and hardcore wow are completely different , I can die in diablo and be back at 80 the same day. You lose a level 60 hardcore wow toon and your down 2 weeks to a month ez 🎉
I couldn't disagree more with some of Sardaco's ideas.
Items randomly proccing to be upgraded has already been a thing and was universally hated (see titanforging). I think there might be a place for items proccing in this manner from farms that are repeatable but certainly not from raids. Chances only once a week at this upgraded gear would just end up making most people feel frustrated.
BoEs being only green would be extremely unenjoyable for the majority of players imo. I think a decent middleground would be a design philosophy change on BoEs. I would rather have all BiS crafted items be bop and good but not BiS, maybe even slightly worse than prebis gear, be BoEs. They could also only have a handful of prebis slots be available from BoEs and not allow big slots (helm, chest, legs, weapons) be bis from BoEs.
I also hope people shift their criticisms of the new honor system slightly. The previous system also didn't reward people for being skilled or doing something impressive. It rewarded people with infinite free time and a poop sock. The current system also simply rewards time spent it just requires *less* time. I'm not really sure what a fix for this system would look like, possibly gear being tied to RBGs instead of mindless time spent afking AV. Yes btw I'm looking at all those classic R14 ppl, your afking AV or rushing down the pve boss in 5min in a coordinated discord group was not impressive, sorry. PvP gear being removed from hardcore but BGs being enabled sounds fine to me. Maybe even make PvP deaths not count at all in hardcore so WPvP could be a thing (although this would have a lot of asterisks since I'm sure there are many abuses and they'd all need to be fixed).
Maybe this will come off a bit harsh but I hope it gives pause for thought. People tend to fixate on certain answers to perceived problems even if alternative answers are just as good or better, as for why this is idk ask psychologists I'm sure they'll give you some variety of answers. I think the WoW community suffers from this right now with this idea that somehow the modern internet has destroyed people's ability to play WoW as they used to. I will say this is a possibility but people engaging with their lives in a more efficiency-over-fun manner is sadly not restricted to just games. It's been a societal shift that has affected far more sectors than just gaming. To repeat, access to information also does not necessitate the use of it, it is a shift in culture that has caused people to engage differently with games. There are plenty of articles from academics discussing the issue of efficiency-mindedness and how it is adversely affecting our mental health today.
psyche.co/ideas/why-efficiency-is-dangerous-and-slowing-down-makes-life-better
Hm, this paragraph is a bit poorly written but w/e too lazy to improve.
They aren’t going to announce classic plus for Warcraft direct, they will save that for a actual hype blizzcon moment
I think hardcore servers are good for content creators making content, but in terms of what do the majority of player's want is hazard to guess a fresh hc server would not be high on their list
There wont be HC fresh. There is 0 reason to release a new HC server.
Economy
@@codywatson9627 if "economy" is the reason, then why wouldnt there be an era fresh?
@@kellypease-j2y Easier to do HC fresh it is implied that it is only vanilla, where an actual fresh is a can of worms I'm not sure the devs are ready to open.
@@codywatson9627 Economy on HC is very good. People die with all their gear and epic mount. So the economy is still amazing, the prices are almost the same as 1 year ago
@@codywatson9627 its been done for over a decade on repeat. what "can of worms"?
I think most people just want era realms for wrath and TBC.
Oooooo, I'm super firsty.
I'll let you comment first about this rumored Fresh HC, Sardaco, to get your spoiler-free take.
More news at 11.
Love the content boys. Watch stuff from all three of you all the time.
Side note: do any of you three play horde?
"Get Packed Up" ....Cold Blooded Tello, haha.
That long tangent about adding breakable weapons and gear I think is not at all a great idea for wow… BUT a survival Warcraft game?? That would be LEGIT
A fresh hc doesnt really seem to make sense imo. Would much rather prefer a fresh classic cycle from vanilla to wotlk atleast.
TWW feels nothing like Classic. Where do you people get this stuff from? Such a bizarre take
Warcraft logs shouldn't exist in Classic. It is completely unnecessary and just further divides the community. If you want to sweat, go play retail.
No one uses it for the intended purpose, they just use it for the dopamine of whether they got a purple or orange number.
Screw hc fresh , give me
Classic vanilla fresh 🎉
Retail
Classic+ (Vanilla World only - could potentially add new continents or expand on Outland, but do not use the cataclysm world)
Era server that progs thru WoTLK and restarts every 3 years or something. Set it up where the phases come faster so there is less content drought. Hell they could even do like they did in SoD and do level bands. Gives people plenty of time to work on professions and alts.
Actually I’m changing my answer
Retail
Classic+ (Vanilla thru Wrath zones with expanded story lines and new content/raids)
Era (vanilla only)
If they make a new HC server, it’s needs to be 100% solo self found!! No AH, no mail, no trading, and also remove petri flask and LIP potion.. should be no pot that can save your life
You lost me at removing random items, sorry
@@munkymash those are not random items! Those are cheat mode items in HC
@@moto684what level did you make it to in hardcore
Dunno why some people think that onlyfangs made HC popular :D they started to farm HC because it was already popular.
24:15 you guy do realize that a divided community of 100,000 players is ok? That a TBC new can peel off 15,000 people and still has a successful server without taking from anyone else?
Not enough push back to ideas on this show. When someone says something; you should think “what did he say that was wrong”.
Let’s go