I love coming back to these older videos just to see how far you and your team have gone! Truly amazing! Thankyou for sharing your knowledge for FREE with the world! 🙏
Well yah its Aluminum . Also when you cut fast and hard you always put stress / pressure risers into the material . Try making super precision items like that OK for roughing , not for finishing . Also spindles hate high loads and so do ways and ball screws ! Every job requires a different approach. Coming from a collet maker .
Yeah, the faster you go the more flex you get. Spindles definitely hate high loads, ways can take it if it's properly lubed and free of contamination, but ballscrews can start flexing and cause even less accuracy.
Hello Gilroy , i wish when i was machining my bosses had such a positive and exciting attitude with there employees like you show in your video At 59 years of age my machining days are past , but i believe that your passion demonstrated can only elevate your work force towards a higher learning and a corporate passion for excellence that can only excel your company , all the best man .
@@Brad-lt6mr impossible... the East has moved into a dictatorship, they will once again explore killing their poor in mass through starvation. America (was) great because we didn't over regulate, now we are so over regulated people hardly understand a world without regulation that exists only to enrich the Government. The Government kills and pollutes more than anything that has ever been. Government is the Mafia, it seeks to keep their citizens impoverished and educated with old archaic ideas. But you are correct, we need to work smarter VS fall for the trap of Government welfare to oppress us all.
TITAN's now has became my idol for me to raise again and re-start a new cnc machining business and pioneer an advanced level in Advance Machining Facility in my country Malaysia.. He's totally a genius in CNC's machining world!! Thank's Mr. Titan.!
The man has a very valid point. Cannot begin to tell you how many times I've seen people running a half inch end mill taking a sixteenth of an inch axially and running sixteen inches per minute on twenty horsepower machines. If you are not going to use the twenty horses, save some money and buy something smaller. Also, no matter how much of a hotrod you think you are someone out there is doing it faster. I know of a LOT of Haas machines out in the world that are over ten years old than have been run at their peak most of their lives and still run well. If Haas machines were as bad as people say they would not be around anymore. How many Hyundai machines (Same people who make the cars) you see out in the world? None. They sucked.
Titan is correct about adapting to newer technologies. This video demonstrates the difference between newer waveform machining vs traditional profile machining. Waveform is far more superior but it comes with a price.
Thank you! I have this problem, and now that i have seen this video I understand the need for faster machining. I will whip out my feeds and speeds book and begin learning.
assuming the cnc machine can handle the increased workload. most companies don't want to overwork the machines... machines are depreciated over a set number of years/hours. if you are putting more work on the machine, you may be reducing it's effective lifespan... especially the tooling. so all this cuts into profit, which squeezes the competition. sure, you can sustain the business model, but can smaller shops that don't have that type of money for investment? food for thought.
All these pros down in the comments saying he’s going to fast and he won’t get good tolerance. You can easily just slow it down for the final passes, he’s showing how easily and fast he can make the big cuts and save large amounts of time. New cncs can just handle this now he’s still doin it in 2020.
Agreed. Finishing is where you hit your tolerances. Roughing is just that, roughing. Get all the extra material off the part so you can finish to print. If the machine can't do 800IPM with enough accuracy to leave a decent finish allowance then you might need to make some changes.
Every now and then I want to unsubscribe just so that I can have the pleasure of subscribing again! Titan, you are my hero! I have purchased my first VMC, a HAAS Sminimill that was delivered just yesterday and it is all thanks to the information that you are sharing and making it more approachable for an average person like me. Thank you!
lenard ggor No. The problem lies with the machine, crap CAM sofyware AND tooling. There are monstrously high dollar companies running 120IPM with tiny ball mills all day, every day 360 days a year and making money for that reason.
@@hamsteaks5541 Yeah 120IPM... NOT 800IPM. That's definitely going to wear the tooling fairly quickly and put tolerances at risk along with putting stresses in the work piece which will in turn compromise the tolerances on the back end. Notice how the Inconel was still only running at 70IPM... because Inco destroys the tooling and heat stresses (even with steady coolant flow) will distort. Anyone can run Aluminum at 800IPM but that isn't going to happen with harder metals.
When having slower IPM you get a finer finish and much better looking sides, running it hard and fast adds so much spindle load and wares the drill much faster and increses the chance of something going wrong and it being bigger than if it was running slower
I fucking love you. What did I just see. He is so right we as a country need to adopt that philosophy. I saw the craziest graph the year; stating that we as a country consume more than we produce, due to overproduction overseas.
Oh yeah?? Well I bet you can’t machine *INSERT OBSCURE MATERIAL* at those feeds!!! Folks, this video is promoting a MINDSET, not “run 800ipm on everything!” Titan has plenty of videos on machining hard metals quickly. Also, aluminum is ubiquitous in aerospace. There’s nothing “garage shop” or “small-time” in making money machining aluminum.
Clearly stated that it was a roughing pass... I know attention spans are short as fuck these days, but Jesus... Love when people talk shit and yet weren't even listening... Way to make yourself look like a fucktard... Lolol
Amen brother. Your doing good things. Yes your losing money up front but saving your customer money. That customer keeps coming back. Spending money at your shop. Short term lost long term gain.
SFM of 2000 is feasible for Aluminium 308 (5-8% Si) with a 0.5 inch dia tool, and this gives an RPM of 15280For Aluminium 308 (5-8% Si) roughing a max. IPT of 0.02 is possible. For a 0.5 inch dia Carbide tool with 2 flutes, it means that: IPM = RPM x IPT x number of flutesIPM = 15280 x 0.02 x 2 = 611.2 The only way to achieve 800 IPM is either by increasing the SFM or the number of flutes
We've an old Mori-Seiki that can do these speeds/feeds quite easily. Utterly reliable. It's nothing compared to a DST Ecospeed F though. 11 cubic litres of swarf removed per minute when roughing at full tilt
@@RaybanDude1 these guys are machinists and the products they put out are consistently more accurate and more diverse than manual machines can ever produce. You guys are skilled, yes. These guys are useless without computers, yes. But don't bash them because their trade is different. Let's keep it sensible guys. Different skill set.
cost is only dependent on runtime when you either produce a whole lot of the same part in mass production OR decide beforehand whether you want titanium or something else. I dont get why they can charge the customer less money by milling a part for 2 minutes instead of 4 or even 10. preparing the whole operation for these parts and doing the hand labor takes away most of the time and employees salary anyway. This show is hilarious though. they tried to make a cnc milling shack a cool thing like OCC or whatever. and all these people are standing there talking and watching the cnc. wtf is this. saluted for comedic effect because i cant help it
Yes sure you can do that or I’m saying you can go faster who care it’s good for a show but not when you have close tolerance and you need to change your Machine every couple years 😂😂
I was hating on you for a while then I realized that you're only manufacturing a small percentage of all that is being manufactured in United States I hope the best for you
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Good to hear the spirit of build it here include some "how". Good stuff!
I know this is old, but how does tooling cost come into the equation? I assume you use higher end and more expensive tooling, but also the tools might wear faster and need to be replaced more often, or just faster since they are removing more material faster too. I'd be curious how tooling costs figure into the cost stack. Thanks!
I LOVE ALL THE COMMENTS. running aluminum at these speeds is normal and if you invest in good tooling they have pretty good life as well . My problem with this is -i would like to see someone show me how they are high speed machining tool steels M2,D2 ,A2 O-1 ECT. I also get the whole saving time makes money but tolerance and finishing comes into play as well -this is a video that is only part of the information -NOT ALL the information.
Yeah, pressure and wear are directly related. Maybe a company running blinding travel speeds and deep feeds can save enough to offset the overhead increase from tool wear. I don't know those depths of cost of operations analysis
Ikr? I have nothing against going fast, but his point was skeewed when he changed the doc AND feed. Its like..."oh i took my foot off the gas on my muscle car, and now im going slow... Thats why you buy Maserati." Lol
its the same product, but the first program is his "aggressive" version. the second file is the "typical" version. i agree that he couldve exagerated how slow it is, but it does look pretty typical
I'm a hobby level machinist and also like to run as fast as possible. I never really noticed any wear on mine but it doesn't really run that much, I am wondering how much more you spend on maintaince or replacement parts.
Working for a big international company I am afraid the USA is quite a but behind Europe in terms of capabilities especially in machining for medical devices. It's very hard to.find high quality casting companies in the USA with vertical integration. Same for part cost. We have resourced most of our machines components to Europe for cost quality and delivery. USA is not what it was. Too many companies sold out to cheap Chinese manufacturing whereas in Europe they seem to have kept the core skills in house and outsourced the basic stuff to China. We do billions of spend each year in our products and it's very evident. Why make electronics in China vs. Design and make in America. In Europe cars were designed and made there, same for high end machine tools most supercars. In the US a lot of good products are designed but made in China
Anybody with a shop full of Haas machines talking about high speed machining and high material removal is just blowing smoke. Wouldn't mind putting that part up on one of my horizontals, maybe bump up to around 18 00 IPM. Now we talking boys!
Lots of factors here Workholding Cutter Holding Cutter Length and Diameter Older machines will struggle and maybe the cutters are not always sharp Everything has to be managed from the top to practise this type of machining Good when it all goes together though Good job
I think a few others have mentioned it but pushing your spindle load like that has to result in breakdowns and therefore, down time. From what I saw, it was almost always over 100% and sometimes 180%-200%. How do you deal with that? There's a gun stock manufacturer near me that uses Haas machines and pushes them like that. They replace them every 5 years because they're completely worn out by then. Is that your approach too?
Really depends on the industry you're working in. For me, 5 years is a decent ROI on a machine, because I can turn around, sell, and still get a fair price for it. Technology changes fast enough to warrant that in the industry 'we' work in. If I asked you, would you like a money machine that prints 100, $100 bills a minute or one that prints 200.. you'd probably be less concerned about replacing the faster machine twice as often.. especially if it's a lease, which 99% of machine tools typically are.
WTF those guys are talking, its just simple physics, where forces must be equale, that something doesnt break, and why are you hiding your likes/dislikes?
Am I missing something here? I didn't see anything "pushing machine speeds to the limit." I see decent programming WRT efficient tool paths but nothing that even remotely scares me WRT tool loading. My machines suck at tight tolerance when hauling ass but for material removal it ain't rocket science; Use your CAM for constant chip loading with a deep cut and whatever your spindle's torque can deal with on radial. What am I missing here? Are you guys hiring? I got me some CAD/CAM skills lol
I just have a hard time understanding why you would charge less, why not keep that $465000 and put it back in the company. You worked faster, better, harder, you should reap the rewards. I understand wanting to make manufacturing in the USA attractive, and as an inventor it resonates with me. But, I also understand that as a customer of job shops, if the shop figures out a way to make my product faster and to the same quality that's their win. I mean, to say that machining is only worth 2 bucks when it would be 20 anywhere else is a bit extreme. You're literally making genius moves, and giving them away. Then I think about the added wear and tear to the equipment, right now everything's fine, but what happens when your maintenence cost increase 10 fold. I'd imagine those "savings" for the customer are going to start looking like a "loss" or "money left on the table" to the shop.
He has what I call the "Walmart" approach. They boost efficiency and maximize the use of one employee to make the products cost less to sell (in the video's case; to produce) and drop the sale price to match the cost but have a slightly higher percentage of upcharge compared to the slower machined part. This method draws in more customers because of the cheap price and the company is able to turn a larger profit as a result, albeit a tighter profit margin if they dont have the volume. Also pocketing that difference would not sit easy with customers and probably does not align with the owner's moral compass.
It called economic efficiency, labor is not the worse cost is the time it takes to deliver to the end user. The same reason computers are so cheep better parts faster. Companies go over seas because they can get the same quality at a cheaper price. Why pay $20/hr here when I can get the same at the same pace for $.165/hr? If I can produce 100k units per month and I charge $2 per unit I make sound money, my customer spends less so they make money, the end user spends less they save money. Everybody wins. Versus the "trade secrets" method where I charge $20 per unit and have a margin of 200%. When hard times come my customer will leave to find some one else who can do it for less.
Brad Gefroh the speeds of the roughing passes don't matter much... Really not at all. The finishing pass would clean it up. And you'd need to run a finish path no matter what.
Brad Gefroh bruhh with a haas at those speeds and with that spindle load we 're in the 10 to 20 thousands plus or minus range. he's just showing a demo, he doesn't actually make money off of those. I haven't even seen haas run their machines like him lol. it's all for show.
We all know Haas machines are also sold in China and also Mazaks, Okuma, DMG Moris, etc... And yes cutting at the same speeds and feeds! Couple that with cheaper labor and no unions, China will most likely always win! Sad but true! We have to innovate! Great video though, watched it 2x!
Sir can you explain how to make a semicircle in G18 zx plain using G02 or G03, actually when I am working it is cutting v shape, not working with cutter compensation. So please ans if any possibility in hand programing.
There are a ton of fast machines.... my video is not about the specific machine but more about philosophy and how you approach jobs... so you can make money. I have a machine on the way that feeds at 1500 IPM... Can't wait
Well a Brother is a more expensive machine. Not exactly sure what your point is. What is your point exactly? That a Ferrari is faster than a Honda Civic?
Lol grade 2 Ti? You realize thats essentially pure titanium? In fact, "aerospace aluminum" a.k.a. 7075 has a higher tensile strength than pure titanium
Tool life is a thing. Also my vf6 maxes at 500ipm I believe with a 40 taper at 15hp. I get excited to run 125ipm at .1 doc 2/3 step over 5000rpm with a 3inch kennametal face mill with super sharp positive rake inserts at 90-100% spindle load...its also from the 80s I think.
The only reason you want to run FAST is for mass production. But your not gonna get anywhere changing burned up tools all the time. You need a balance. Not to mention that eventually somethings gonna break.
How can you push haas up to 800ipm i our company we heve 3 haas machine and the max thet program let us is (12000mm/min ) 470ipm... how do you push it pass thet, whit overrides ?
I remember a new 4 axis mazac machine installed I thought that machine was so quick . stepping it up to the next level hey just think how much better you could serve the customer buy cutting the electrical costs searl seg generator help them salve there problem and you can solve your cost in energy cutting overhead costs that's just the beginning.boom
High Speed machining has been in use for 30+ years. However, the types of material that it can be applied to has changed due to advanced technology in cutting tools. Reduced machining time has always been the competitive edge in the industry and companies that did stay current did not stay in business. The same was true when the industry transitioned from conventional machine tools to automated machine tools. Prior to that people could hack out a meager living with a Bridgeport milling machine in their home garage. Nothing new here.
I love coming back to these older videos just to see how far you and your team have gone! Truly amazing! Thankyou for sharing your knowledge for FREE with the world! 🙏
Well yah its Aluminum . Also when you cut fast and hard you always put stress / pressure risers into the material . Try making super precision items like that OK for roughing , not for finishing . Also spindles hate high loads and so do ways and ball screws ! Every job requires a different approach. Coming from a collet maker .
Yeah, the faster you go the more flex you get. Spindles definitely hate high loads, ways can take it if it's properly lubed and free of contamination, but ballscrews can start flexing and cause even less accuracy.
Hello Gilroy , i wish when i was machining my bosses had such a positive and exciting attitude with there employees like you show in your video
At 59 years of age my machining days are past , but i believe that your passion demonstrated can only elevate your work force towards a higher learning and a corporate passion for excellence that can only excel your company , all the best man .
Never thought I'd watch CNC propaganda hahaha
haha I thought the same... although I think anything that comes out of the USA is propaganda these days!
These guys got it going on! I wish I could pull off 1/2 this efficiency! Don't be intimidated/scared/offended by American Pride! 🇱🇷
Jealous much
USA movie you know 😅
@@Brad-lt6mr impossible... the East has moved into a dictatorship, they will once again explore killing their poor in mass through starvation. America (was) great because we didn't over regulate, now we are so over regulated people hardly understand a world without regulation that exists only to enrich the Government.
The Government kills and pollutes more than anything that has ever been. Government is the Mafia, it seeks to keep their citizens impoverished and educated with old archaic ideas.
But you are correct, we need to work smarter VS fall for the trap of Government welfare to oppress us all.
there is nothing I love more than seeing endmills fly that fast with a huge depth of cut.
He said in the video, this is the roughing program. I optimize all roughing programs at every shop I go to when I see how slow they’re running.
Welcome to how its done across the world. 1000in/m isn't unheard of in mild steel or aluminum machining.
User Name you'd never be able to use those parameters on high alloy steel
Nick Rockz: Impossible with a Haas machine. But not with a Real VMC (from Germany...)
Or Japan...
Yah. Im sure you milled mild steel at 1000 in/m. lol
Lol look at your load. It will also equate to down time for spindle repairs and axis drives.
This is definitely true.
TITAN's now has became my idol for me to raise again and re-start a new cnc machining business and pioneer an advanced level in Advance Machining Facility in my country Malaysia.. He's totally a genius in CNC's machining world!! Thank's Mr. Titan.!
The man has a very valid point. Cannot begin to tell you how many times I've seen people running a half inch end mill taking a sixteenth of an inch axially and running sixteen inches per minute on twenty horsepower machines. If you are not going to use the twenty horses, save some money and buy something smaller. Also, no matter how much of a hotrod you think you are someone out there is doing it faster. I know of a LOT of Haas machines out in the world that are over ten years old than have been run at their peak most of their lives and still run well. If Haas machines were as bad as people say they would not be around anymore. How many Hyundai machines (Same people who make the cars) you see out in the world? None. They sucked.
Finally someone who gets it
Though I'm a Brazilian who lives in Japan, I'm always inspired by the American Spirit!
Thank you TITANS!
Titan is correct about adapting to newer technologies. This video demonstrates the difference between newer waveform machining vs traditional profile machining. Waveform is far more superior but it comes with a price.
This channel and its content, is the perfect example of a decadence in machining industry ...
Its good for save time and can increase productivity but as well as it will increase tooling cost.
The second part did depth cuts which was completely unnecessarily especially at 100 ipm. You need to compare apples to apples.
Richard Hugo I agree, 800ipm vs 100ipm. Pretty easy to figure out how much time difference between the two without using a different program
Thank you! I have this problem, and now that i have seen this video I understand the need for faster machining. I will whip out my feeds and speeds book and begin learning.
He is just plugged the hell out of imco tools...and as an employee I appreciate it
assuming the cnc machine can handle the increased workload. most companies don't want to overwork the machines... machines are depreciated over a set number of years/hours. if you are putting more work on the machine, you may be reducing it's effective lifespan... especially the tooling. so all this cuts into profit, which squeezes the competition. sure, you can sustain the business model, but can smaller shops that don't have that type of money for investment? food for thought.
Titan has some of the best work ethic a man can have. I’d be proud to work at his company.
I love this guy's attitude
It’s been 30 years since I was a cnc machinist in the U.K. and we used to run high speeds where we could back then it’s nothing new
All these pros down in the comments saying he’s going to fast and he won’t get good tolerance. You can easily just slow it down for the final passes, he’s showing how easily and fast he can make the big cuts and save large amounts of time. New cncs can just handle this now he’s still doin it in 2020.
Agreed. Finishing is where you hit your tolerances. Roughing is just that, roughing. Get all the extra material off the part so you can finish to print. If the machine can't do 800IPM with enough accuracy to leave a decent finish allowance then you might need to make some changes.
Good demonstration of the speed/cost comparison. I've never seen it put this way side-by-side it makes perfect sense
Every now and then I want to unsubscribe just so that I can have the pleasure of subscribing again! Titan, you are my hero! I have purchased my first VMC, a HAAS Sminimill that was delivered just yesterday and it is all thanks to the information that you are sharing and making it more approachable for an average person like me. Thank you!
I have been playing with speeds and feeds this week . Got my machine to cut at 20metres a minute . Seriously fast
Your tools are gonna get dull very quick if you keep going those speeds.
Your not gonna have good toleranc after a few runs.
lenard ggor No. The problem lies with the machine, crap CAM sofyware AND tooling. There are monstrously high dollar companies running 120IPM with tiny ball mills all day, every day 360 days a year and making money for that reason.
@@hamsteaks5541 Yeah 120IPM... NOT 800IPM. That's definitely going to wear the tooling fairly quickly and put tolerances at risk along with putting stresses in the work piece which will in turn compromise the tolerances on the back end. Notice how the Inconel was still only running at 70IPM... because Inco destroys the tooling and heat stresses (even with steady coolant flow) will distort. Anyone can run Aluminum at 800IPM but that isn't going to happen with harder metals.
When having slower IPM you get a finer finish and much better looking sides, running it hard and fast adds so much spindle load and wares the drill much faster and increses the chance of something going wrong and it being bigger than if it was running slower
I fucking love you. What did I just see. He is so right we as a country need to adopt that philosophy. I saw the craziest graph the year; stating that we as a country consume more than we produce, due to overproduction overseas.
Titan's message is contained in my book "The Economics of Speed: Machine Speed as the Key Factor in Productivity," Springer 2020.
Oh yeah?? Well I bet you can’t machine *INSERT OBSCURE MATERIAL* at those feeds!!! Folks, this video is promoting a MINDSET, not “run 800ipm on everything!” Titan has plenty of videos on machining hard metals quickly.
Also, aluminum is ubiquitous in aerospace. There’s nothing “garage shop” or “small-time” in making money machining aluminum.
CHATTER IS NOW A FINISH. LOL 🤣
I think it was just a roughing pass
He did say that was a roughing pass.
Clearly stated that it was a roughing pass... I know attention spans are short as fuck these days, but Jesus... Love when people talk shit and yet weren't even listening... Way to make yourself look like a fucktard... Lolol
Amen brother. Your doing good things. Yes your losing money up front but saving your customer money. That customer keeps coming back. Spending money at your shop. Short term lost long term gain.
Super speed machining with a Haas, cutting aluminum. LOL.
Yeah, it was a joke...
I like your made in America message! If you can follow speed with quality & precision then you will have a winning formula!
SFM of 2000 is feasible for Aluminium 308 (5-8% Si) with a 0.5 inch dia tool, and this gives an RPM of 15280For Aluminium 308 (5-8% Si) roughing a max. IPT of 0.02 is possible. For a 0.5 inch dia Carbide tool with 2 flutes, it means that: IPM = RPM x IPT x number of flutesIPM = 15280 x 0.02 x 2 = 611.2 The only way to achieve 800 IPM is either by increasing the SFM or the number of flutes
Your team made me freedom,thanks you.
I love this guy! Respect!
I can imagine at higher speeds there would be more vibrations and increase wear on components, although these machines look well built
He is 1000% right don't deal with cheap labor, increase performance
every one of those dudes watching, watch parts get made at the same speed literally all day. this isnt new to them lol
We've an old Mori-Seiki that can do these speeds/feeds quite easily. Utterly reliable. It's nothing compared to a DST Ecospeed F though. 11 cubic litres of swarf removed per minute when roughing at full tilt
"Cubic litres" - WTF??!!
What about a Bridgeport? My hand can only turn so fast? Lol
Unfortunately pal you're talking a different language to these button pushers
Salty Steel now I finally found a real Machinist
@@RaybanDude1 these guys are machinists and the products they put out are consistently more accurate and more diverse than manual machines can ever produce. You guys are skilled, yes. These guys are useless without computers, yes. But don't bash them because their trade is different. Let's keep it sensible guys. Different skill set.
You need to hook two power drills to it, lol.
Nick taylor lmaoo
I try to teach this to my customers , machine to the limits of the machine, spindle, and tooling.
I like that winner attitude nice shop BTW! I am a professional welder and I love your videos
try 800 ipm on steel
cost is only dependent on runtime when you either produce a whole lot of the same part in mass production OR decide beforehand whether you want titanium or something else. I dont get why they can charge the customer less money by milling a part for 2 minutes instead of 4 or even 10. preparing the whole operation for these parts and doing the hand labor takes away most of the time and employees salary anyway. This show is hilarious though. they tried to make a cnc milling shack a cool thing like OCC or whatever. and all these people are standing there talking and watching the cnc. wtf is this. saluted for comedic effect because i cant help it
Must be the only guy in the world who makes a profit by charging his customers less LOL
Keep up the good work mate ;D
They’ve a great machine shop...perfect business
Hey Titan, thank you for putting out all of these videos. They have helped a ton even with my small CNC router.
Yes sure you can do that or I’m saying you can go faster who care it’s good for a show but not when you have close tolerance and you need to change your Machine every couple years 😂😂
rotciV Baboie If you have to change your machine every couple of years, you bought the wrong machine.
In Germany we say aluminum is not an enemy. Good chanel though
I was hating on you for a while then I realized that you're only manufacturing a small percentage of all that is being manufactured in United States I hope the best for you
Good to hear the spirit of build it here include some "how". Good stuff!
I know this is old, but how does tooling cost come into the equation? I assume you use higher end and more expensive tooling, but also the tools might wear faster and need to be replaced more often, or just faster since they are removing more material faster too. I'd be curious how tooling costs figure into the cost stack. Thanks!
Your way of teaching me is very unique. Ty to be a part of it. Keep up ur good work 😎
I LOVE ALL THE COMMENTS.
running aluminum at these speeds is normal and if you invest in good tooling they have pretty good life as well .
My problem with this is -i would like to see someone show me how they are high speed machining tool steels M2,D2 ,A2 O-1 ECT.
I also get the whole saving time makes money but tolerance and finishing comes into play as well -this is a video that is only part of the information -NOT ALL the information.
Tool wear, and spindle wear. You can push a machine to it's limits great, but look at the cost per tooling, and possibly a spindle failing.
Yeah, pressure and wear are directly related. Maybe a company running blinding travel speeds and deep feeds can save enough to offset the overhead increase from tool wear. I don't know those depths of cost of operations analysis
Lmao its not even the same program
Ikr? I have nothing against going fast, but his point was skeewed when he changed the doc AND feed. Its like..."oh i took my foot off the gas on my muscle car, and now im going slow... Thats why you buy Maserati." Lol
its the same product, but the first program is his "aggressive" version. the second file is the "typical" version. i agree that he couldve exagerated how slow it is, but it does look pretty typical
I think he just wanted to show how 100ipm looks like in person and say its not about machines Its about mentality.
I'm a hobby level machinist and also like to run as fast as possible. I never really noticed any wear on mine but it doesn't really run that much, I am wondering how much more you spend on maintaince or replacement parts.
TITAN way to go.
i was conventional mill operator at Boeing late 70s. they pushed for speed. BUT they NEVER complained if you broke a cutter.
Pushing the limits is great in a shop with no repercussions. But I'm real people. Tool life and part quality are number 1 and number 1.5
I run 40 ipm 1500rpm on my manual mill! I would run faster but I'm maxing my power feed out...
Working for a big international company I am afraid the USA is quite a but behind Europe in terms of capabilities especially in machining for medical devices. It's very hard to.find high quality casting companies in the USA with vertical integration. Same for part cost. We have resourced most of our machines components to Europe for cost quality and delivery. USA is not what it was. Too many companies sold out to cheap Chinese manufacturing whereas in Europe they seem to have kept the core skills in house and outsourced the basic stuff to China. We do billions of spend each year in our products and it's very evident. Why make electronics in China vs. Design and make in America. In Europe cars were designed and made there, same for high end machine tools most supercars. In the US a lot of good products are designed but made in China
Anybody with a shop full of Haas machines talking about high speed machining and high material removal is just blowing smoke. Wouldn't mind putting that part up on one of my horizontals, maybe bump up to around 18
00 IPM. Now we talking boys!
Don't need to improve feeds and speeds, It is and Horizontal, it will beat a VMC any time!
I'd like to see the the Mitsubishi machining center at work do that on chromoly steel.
In a few months we get a new machine .... Emco Hyperturn 110 or something a similar machine. I will have so much fun 😁😁
Lots of factors here Workholding Cutter Holding Cutter Length and Diameter Older machines will struggle and maybe the cutters are not always sharp Everything has to be managed from the top to practise this type of machining Good when it all goes together though
Good job
I think a few others have mentioned it but pushing your spindle load like that has to result in breakdowns and therefore, down time. From what I saw, it was almost always over 100% and sometimes 180%-200%. How do you deal with that? There's a gun stock manufacturer near me that uses Haas machines and pushes them like that. They replace them every 5 years because they're completely worn out by then. Is that your approach too?
Really depends on the industry you're working in. For me, 5 years is a decent ROI on a machine, because I can turn around, sell, and still get a fair price for it. Technology changes fast enough to warrant that in the industry 'we' work in.
If I asked you, would you like a money machine that prints 100, $100 bills a minute or one that prints 200.. you'd probably be less concerned about replacing the faster machine twice as often.. especially if it's a lease, which 99% of machine tools typically are.
WTF those guys are talking, its just simple physics, where forces must be equale, that something doesnt break, and why are you hiding your likes/dislikes?
Am I missing something here? I didn't see anything "pushing machine speeds to the limit." I see decent programming WRT efficient tool paths but nothing that even remotely scares me WRT tool loading. My machines suck at tight tolerance when hauling ass but for material removal it ain't rocket science; Use your CAM for constant chip loading with a deep cut and whatever your spindle's torque can deal with on radial. What am I missing here? Are you guys hiring? I got me some CAD/CAM skills lol
As a machinist my dream I will go America for proved my skill...its will be soon...
now my work place is Malaysia...
Love your passion Titan... you rock!!!
thankyou for your idea.
I just have a hard time understanding why you would charge less, why not keep that $465000 and put it back in the company. You worked faster, better, harder, you should reap the rewards. I understand wanting to make manufacturing in the USA attractive, and as an inventor it resonates with me. But, I also understand that as a customer of job shops, if the shop figures out a way to make my product faster and to the same quality that's their win. I mean, to say that machining is only worth 2 bucks when it would be 20 anywhere else is a bit extreme. You're literally making genius moves, and giving them away. Then I think about the added wear and tear to the equipment, right now everything's fine, but what happens when your maintenence cost increase 10 fold. I'd imagine those "savings" for the customer are going to start looking like a "loss" or "money left on the table" to the shop.
He has what I call the "Walmart" approach. They boost efficiency and maximize the use of one employee to make the products cost less to sell (in the video's case; to produce) and drop the sale price to match the cost but have a slightly higher percentage of upcharge compared to the slower machined part. This method draws in more customers because of the cheap price and the company is able to turn a larger profit as a result, albeit a tighter profit margin if they dont have the volume.
Also pocketing that difference would not sit easy with customers and probably does not align with the owner's moral compass.
It called economic efficiency, labor is not the worse cost is the time it takes to deliver to the end user. The same reason computers are so cheep better parts faster. Companies go over seas because they can get the same quality at a cheaper price. Why pay $20/hr here when I can get the same at the same pace for $.165/hr? If I can produce 100k units per month and I charge $2 per unit I make sound money, my customer spends less so they make money, the end user spends less they save money. Everybody wins. Versus the "trade secrets" method where I charge $20 per unit and have a margin of 200%. When hard times come my customer will leave to find some one else who can do it for less.
Brad Gefroh I doubt he even gets that close just by chance.
Brad Gefroh the speeds of the roughing passes don't matter much... Really not at all. The finishing pass would clean it up. And you'd need to run a finish path no matter what.
Brad Gefroh bruhh with a haas at those speeds and with that spindle load we 're in the 10 to 20 thousands plus or minus range. he's just showing a demo, he doesn't actually make money off of those. I haven't even seen haas run their machines like him lol. it's all for show.
We all know Haas machines are also sold in China and also Mazaks, Okuma, DMG Moris, etc... And yes cutting at the same speeds and feeds! Couple that with cheaper labor and no unions, China will most likely always win! Sad but true! We have to innovate! Great video though, watched it 2x!
Cnc is now a motor sport!
Sir can you explain how to make a semicircle in G18 zx plain using G02 or G03, actually when I am working it is cutting v shape, not working with cutter compensation. So please ans if any possibility in hand programing.
I'd like to see a Brother S700X1 Side by Side with this "Amazingly Fast" Haas. Then we can see what fast really is.
There are a ton of fast machines.... my video is not about the specific machine but more about philosophy and how you approach jobs... so you can make money. I have a machine on the way that feeds at 1500 IPM... Can't wait
TITANS of CNC: Academy -- thanks for the reply man. I can get on board with that way of thinking. Keep up the videos!
Well a Brother is a more expensive machine. Not exactly sure what your point is. What is your point exactly? That a Ferrari is faster than a Honda Civic?
Do you guys only run aerospace aluminum? Or do you run real metals like Hastaloy B, Alloy 20, and Titanium grade 2?
Check out some of tutorials on titanium, Inconel etc... on this page
Lol grade 2 Ti? You realize thats essentially pure titanium? In fact, "aerospace aluminum" a.k.a. 7075 has a higher tensile strength than pure titanium
Titan - in the academy of CNC videos, you're using Fusion. Here and in other videos, your shop uses Inventor. Can you talk about one vs. the other?
We have both and Inventor was from older videos... basically Fusion has Inventors vase but Autodesk is throwing way more into Fusion. It’s the Future!
Tool life is a thing. Also my vf6 maxes at 500ipm I believe with a 40 taper at 15hp. I get excited to run 125ipm at .1 doc 2/3 step over 5000rpm with a 3inch kennametal face mill with super sharp positive rake inserts at 90-100% spindle load...its also from the 80s I think.
I like to see such video with steel
VERY WELL SAID!!!
you can push ti way faster than 250 inchs a min. with the right tooling and machine. really cool video man keep up the great work
Haas...the aluminum machine!
That's a regular day in my shop man.. non stop rush orders. 400. Thou doc on stainless!! She can handle it
lot of arm chair referees commenting. Do yall have a shop? Ever done a million month?
Hav u try same speed on ti or superalloys?
No, because they are not ignorant. Different materials run different speed.
The only reason you want to run FAST is for mass production. But your not gonna get anywhere changing burned up tools all the time. You need a balance. Not to mention that eventually somethings gonna break.
Is that the same guy from boyd coddington American hotrod?
How can you push haas up to 800ipm i our company we heve 3 haas machine and the max thet program let us is (12000mm/min ) 470ipm... how do you push it pass thet, whit overrides ?
Machine operators are fine a dozen , programming and manual machining is where at.
Sweet surface finish...
I remember a new 4 axis mazac machine installed I thought that machine was so quick . stepping it up to the next level hey just think how much better you could serve the customer buy cutting the electrical costs searl seg generator help them salve there problem and you can solve your cost in energy cutting overhead costs that's just the beginning.boom
100ipm part looks alot cleaner..flutes have more time to cut..coolant helps with quality of your cut...and saves on tooling.
Cool, you are the only shop I know which uses Inventor!
??? Fusion 360 is coming up fast. as a solidworks / mastercam / sigmanest user im seeing more folks go to autodesk.
Yeah, at my job we use Solid Works and we are starting to switch to NX.
Did he wait a bit before grabbing that machined aluminum part? It must have been hot as hell? Did you say .200 inces radial cut? Nice video.
High Speed machining has been in use for 30+ years. However, the types of material that it can be applied to has changed due to advanced technology in cutting tools. Reduced machining time has always been the competitive edge in the industry and companies that did stay current did not stay in business. The same was true when the industry transitioned from conventional machine tools to automated machine tools. Prior to that people could hack out a meager living with a Bridgeport milling machine in their home garage. Nothing new here.
😂😂 put some stainless or titanium in there at 800 ipm
LOL I'd like to see that Too.