Are Keith Raniere & Allison Mack psychopaths? Watch new episodes of On the Edge with Andrew Gold podcast Mon & Thur: th-cam.com/play/PLwU7HOfuSL5KD5s9hGoPuyVzN_VwG4Yi_.html Get them 20 hours early on Spotify/Apple: podfollow.com/on-the-edge-with-andrew-gold
I watched HBO's "The Vow" about NXIVM. Fascinating. He tried to come across as humble, but was anything but. I'm not a doctor and can't diagnose him, and although I'm sure he has psychopathic tendencies, his need for adulation, subservience and ego supply seems to place him high on the narcissist spectrum. I personally found him repugnant. Not just physically but in all aspects, but I'm coming from a more objective "after the fact' perspective I suppose. We quite often assume that those who are susceptible to that sort of indoctrination are young, uneducated and needy, but after watching "The Vow" it became clear that no one is really immune. These were mostly very well educated, successful, thriving individuals who, for whatever reason fell victim to this vile creature and his manipulations.
@@Kreepyb5 *Edge Hodges* that’s so adorable 🥰 I’ve heard Andrew use it before and for a long time I’ve wanted to write a comment on how happy this *name of this lovely community is and that it always makes me smile* Have a lovely day 🌼
Excellent interview! When Vanessa was describing her first impressions of Keith Raniere, I was reminded of Hannah Arendt’s phrase, “the banality of evil.” When I first saw KR on The Vow, I couldn’t fathom how so many people could’ve been taken in by that conniving evil little man. I began to understand when I saw the clip of Alison Mack’s first meeting with KR. Typical narcissist he asked her a probing question and then twisted around her answer to make her feel vulnerable and exposed. You can see on her face the moment when self-doubt comes crashing in. Vanessa Grigoriadis is a brave woman. I wouldn’t want to sit across the table from KR. I imagine interviewing a manipulative character like him amounts to negotiating a psychological minefield.
I have been fascinated by all of the tiny interpersonal exchanges that follwed the exact same playbook. Find whats important to you then turn it on its head and nake tou feel like you dont get it Then offer the solution. So so obvious now but if you are vulnerable...different story. Add in Group think and the specific issues women deal with....Oye. 120 yrs was too kind.
Enjoyed this Andrew! I would love for your to interview a Norwegian lady called Catherine Mostue, a psychologist who was in a cult-lile environment when she was young. She's a well known psychologist here in Norway and just before Christmas she shared her story in newspapers here. It's so fascinating, how it only takes one person with the right characteristics to make up a cult! It's so interesting, that so many of the same traits are found in both religious and non-religious groups.
I've been a fan of Vanessa Grigoriadis since I was in college and read her Rolling Stone Britney Spears article. It was brilliant and multilayered and different than most other pop music coverage and I can't recommend it highly enough, even 15 years later!
@@AndrewGold1 Sorry i couldn't catch you this time either in the premier, live. I have a bit of a difficult HORARIO myself, and 4 kittens in the house. Have to wait til night time to be able to sit down in peace to concentrate on my fab subjects. Hope to catch you live soon, one day/evening/ night..day.. Ok ;) Thanks for this one. Excellent reporting!
Monday was such Spring weather where I'm at- but then it turned so freaking icy cold, again- I actually am really looking forward to that weather thaw around the corner!
This journalist seems to be brilliant. The way she scrutinises ethic from different points of view makes me believe her articles must be reliable. It's rare nowadays. Love it!
This is sad. And again, young females are involved for their youth and beauty. I am glad someone is speaking out against this happening to our youth. When watching Allison Mack on tv, you never realize that something like this could happen. How are these people escaping the law? What is wong with the parents and family members that they are not coming forward.
I saw a Dr Phil where parents have tried .it's kinda sad because at first they where like well they are there on they're own free will . Until the truth came out only then was something done
Right off the bat she mentioned est. I was in Landmark, which was the direct descendant of est. I was only in for a little over a year, but for me, it was a ghastly, soul-crushing experience. I didn't realize just HOW bad it was until i started removing myself from it. Things that just seemed like a pain in the @$$, at the time, were actually doing real harm, in my humble opinion. I would personally not recommend getting involved with ANY Large Group Awareness Training seminars to anyone, at any time. They promise empowerment, while sucking the life out of you, and altering you in ways to which you did NOT consent. They are also very sneaky about it, making it difficult to prove in court.
@@smooth_pursuit Yeah, I agree. I couldn't watch the entire video because of her intentional vocal fry. Most female Millennials in the States utilize this intentional vocal fry, which drives me nuts. It was a hallmark of "the cool kids" when my kids were in school. So glad my daughter wasn't one of the cool kids...
I’m certainly not a doctor, but I say that the diagnosis of a psychopath kind of takes away some responsibility for Keith’s crimes and I think Allison was also brainwashed but by no means should that absolve her of her involvement with this cult
I don't think the label of psychopath takes away his responsibility, but portrays just how dangerous he really is. A psychopath never stops being a psychopath and they're completely ruthless. They have no empathy, and that's how he's blithely able to brand women without a twinge of anxiety about the pain, the repercussions, none of that. He's able to use women as his toys and do whatever he wants because he sees them, and everyone else in the world, as things to do with as he pleases. Things, not fellow human beings. He's deadly dangerous and he'll never be anything else.
Not really. Psychopaths quite understand right from wrong, they just don't care. Unless they have other co-morbid mental illnesses that affect their ability to distinguish right from wrong or their perception of reality, they are completely culpable.
This argument absolves 99.9% rapists and murderers. Psychopathy is a personality disorder, not mental illness. Not all psychopaths choose to victimize others.
@@danijudy92 It's listed in the DSM-V under Cluster B personality disorders so I'm not sure why you want to argue semantics. I said that they are absolutely culpable because those who have psychopathy or sociopathy know right from wrong. No one said they're absolved or that all psychopaths will victimize others. Mental illness does not necessarily mean mental incapacitation. Two different things.
Andrew, I much admire your interviews, although when I first began to watch them I sometimes felt you seemed a little too even-handed. But since then, I've come to appreciate your style much more. Confession: I usually download videos I am interested in to my PC for later viewing - I hope that's OK. For that reason, and it's a selfish one, I would like to make one tiny suggestion, and it is this: during the long-form interviews, it would help old (73) viewers like me if you could show the name of your interviewee on the screen every now and then. Thank you, and keep up the good work.
She is so spot on about how creepy Keith is and how others bought his line of b.s. His kissing everyone on the lips should have been a dead giveaway that he was crossing lines.
Man, I would have loved for this to premier in the morning in the states as I am driving 6 hrs to Rhode Island. I’ll have to watch this in the evening. Love your content.
Ah shame! I just put out later because more people are online then. But hope you get to watch it later, and also you can listen to the audio version on Spotify or Apple during your drive. It comes out 20 hours or so before the TH-cam.
@@CarmencitaTiradoJayandme21 Drive safe, hun. I'm a New England girl. I was born at Manchester Memorial Hospital in Connecticut, and grew up in Glastonbury, Ct. I now live in California, and miss home so much. Cali sucks. People here are insane.
This was absolutely fascinating and I think I will continue to research NXIVM from this, after hearing about Eliza Bleu I do want to learn more of how rings like this coerce their followers
I can’t help but wonder if Tom Welling, Erica Durance, Michael Rosenbaum and others from Smallville will see this. I’ve seen interviews that stated Allison Mack tried to recruit the women who played Supergirl and Black Canary from Smallville. Thank goodness they didn’t fall for it.
Don't you just love professional people guys? Here is a prime example of two mega professionals. Such a pleasure to listen to you both, as hard as the subject is ,you bring out the facts with grace. Yes, professionalism. K.R would be sitting in an insane asylum for the rest of his natural life, where i come from. Criminal of highest degree. Insane Criminal. I keep finding it fascinating the HUGE difference in how cases like this are treated starting from legal procedures all the way to where they land their asses once judged. See, i used to work in an asylum for the criminally insane ( as Keith would be called under the criteria in my country, Finland) , So there's a definite line in the type of crime committed whether you land your ass in prison, and get out when your sentence is done with. The line goes at that if there is ANY or SOME (or both) indicators within the crime committed that there is a degree of pervertedness ( i know its not exactly a word, but..), if you like, or something very EXTREME (for example the branding would be considered as such) , then the criminal is referred to the State Psychiatric ward directly and any court proceedings are halted at that point, and what follows is examination ( can last up to 3 or more years depending on the case) by 3 psychiatrists, whom have to come to the same conclusion and diagnosis. MOST cases referred to the Psychiatric examination will never get out again, except for a walk around the enclosed court yard. So, i'm fascinated how someone like K.R in the U.S just gets like 120 yrs in normal prison cos in my "books" the creep is absolutely off his rocker insane. But i respect his 120 yrs. I hope he lives that long as to have to serve every single day. Well, one can always hope right..?
Interesting. I would hope he gets the most harsh punishment possible. Therefore if deeming him unfit for regular prison due to mental disorder would give him the ability to veg out on psychotropic drugs every day instead of be in agony and turmoil every single day for 120 years, I will hope he gets scenario B. Let him meet God, the only person who can ACTUALLY change his reprobate heart.
I'm about to watch this vid. I LOVE the way you titled it, Andrew: "A Scientology-like" cult". That title says I lotg, so I won't elaborate. Thank you.
Hey Andrew love the channel! Whenever I think of Keith Raniere, I think of him running around in those little volleyball shorts, and I wonder how could this guy possibly think he's God's gift to women! 🙄
….and how any woman would pay him any attention. He is so slimy, hairy and gross! The way that he breaths and flicks his tongue just lets you know he’s evil.
Andrew I’ve been watching your videos I just haven’t commented a long time I hope you’re doing really well I loved your video and interview with this lady in reference to Megan Markle and some of the comments that I commented on in reference to the dossier project Nikki Klein left and my comments are pulled off of the Darcy project and put on the frayed report April 11 of 2023 I was really proud of that❤
Hey Andrew, great interview 🙌 In regards to her comment in beginning of interview that she was surprised to finding this cult in upstate NY. I will share that there are other cults there, especially in the Hudson Valley. I'm aware of this thru a friend that lived in that area for many years.
@@AndrewGold1 I guess the only good thing one could find about K.R. is that he didn't use ACTUAL 13 year old children... EDIT: When might you look into the beginning of this cult? Look into "Sex Magick [sic] Rituals," Andrew. It's all connected. L. Ron Hubbard was a devotee of Aleister Crowley. Since this is a "Scientology-like Cult," I'd be willing to bet K.R. was a devotee of Crowley, as well. *This whole sex cult screams Sex Magick* [sic] *Ritual* to me. *Crowley was the inspiration for sex cult founder Colin Batley.*
"est" is an acronym for Erhard Seminars Training, (the founder was Werner Erhard), so probably is NOT related directly to Reniere's ESP. I don't know what Raniere's acronym was. Having said that, most of the LGATs sprung out of the Esalen Institute, Mind Dynamics, and Scientology.
Im from Guadalajara, live here, is so weird that you guys are aware of my City lol but yeah.. i knew some girls that were with me in high school that ended up in those "executive succes programs" ..so sad
It's worthwhile to note there are (and have been) plenty of other ethically managed Large Group Awareness programs which evolved from the EST model. Her description of these seminars leave a lot unsaid about their curriculum and content.
I am going to watch The Vow and check out the Scientology angle. I am quite familiar with 'est' and some of it's splinter groups. Werner Erhart had been in Scientology. LRH was very pissed off about that apparent thievery. LRH stole half his stuff from others as well. Sort of like the pirates of silicon valley. This was fun. Thanks Andrew.
I appreciate how these guests go deeply into their personal experiences. Andrew, I'm sorry I've not been commenting under your videos. I've been quite unwell as of late, and unable to sit up to type. *You are one of my favorite content producers.* I can spot a person who possesses talent, and I can easily tell you'll be an investigative reported who exposes a whole lot more than just these truly sick cults. *I am wondering why on Earth you've not gone to the very source of the cult, however.* L. Ron Hubbard was a devotee of Aleister Crowley. I'll bet Keith R. was, too. *Look into "Sex Magick* [sic] *Rituals,"* Andrew. It's all connected.
@@AndrewGold1 Thanks, sweetie. I see so many great exposes you will do in the future, Andrew. You are quite talented, and one does not need to be a talent scout to see this. Take care, and thank you for your kind thoughts & kind words. *Shalom* ❤
What is happening at minute 43-46? Can someone clarify that for me? I didn’t understand what VG was really talking about. What was her point? What does Aziz Ansari have to do with this example? What is she saying about the college women having accusations about jerks vs rapists? What is her opinion on the accused being thrown out of university? I appreciate an explanation. I have a hard time understanding right now. Thank you!
Meghan Markle has been connected with this cult through the Bronfams and isn't BetterUp with Prince Harry into some of this as well. Mental Health and Growth. Seminars???
I think Keith must've been a narcissist, also, because of his NEED for people to worship him and believe him to be ever so smart and good🤮 I feel bad for Allison Mack. I think she must've really hated herself when she met him and fell for him. And now gets to spend the rest of her life hating herself some more. I hope she gets healthy! Great guest, Andrew
A quick note just to say that this topic is just too off-putting for me to follow very much of it. But that’s just me! I see that others are having a lively discussion, and that’s great! Remember to point your friends to this channel! Many many interesting topics!
Hi and thanks for this interesting interview/dialogue 🙏 (I wonder, since English isn’t my first language, if this and similar videos are considered interviews, (like the definition of the word interview suggests) or are my thoughts regarding these kind of interaction’s, that they’ve the format of an interview, but they also have the intention to create a feeling of A) a more relaxed setting and B) create space for a more intimate, and deeper conversation, and both parties (the interviewer and interviewee) are on equal footing. ➡️ And this is where my ambivalence lays, I normally feel most interview’s have a different type of power balance. Take f.ex. Pier Morgan’s popular show “Uncensored with Piers Morgan”, that’s a interview setting that I consider to be a *traditional type of interview* the interviewer ask’s question and don’t necessarily ask questions they are personally interested in knowing, but instead prefer to stick with a predetermined set of questions, and that is in my experience why many interviewer’s aren’t foreign to keep asking the same questions over and over until they get one that suit the expectations. All answers outside the prepared script, would potentially have undesirable consequences, imagine f.ex you’re interviewing a semi-controversial person, I can see why someone prefer to have a more controlled format, to avoid being triggered/ provoked which can easily result the interviewer loses their “cool”. (for the sake of it, I’ll insert Wikipedia’s definition: [quote] “an interview is a structured conversation where one participant asks questions, and the other provides answers” [End quote] the “roles of an interviewee, and interviewer” is present in this video, yet I’ll argue that this format is one I personally favor, and to me it doesn’t feels like it’s a interview due to what I wrote above under ➡️ *B* Again, thank you so much for this awesome episode 🙏🌻 Love, Grace
Cults preying on young age children is not so new at all. I live in Australia and used to be approached by nice looking 'religous males, one in particular who would target me while I was at the bus stop to go home. It was around the late 70s and I do not remember why I knew it was weird. My mother would certainly not have told me nor would she come and wait for me. I never told her because I knew she would not care or pretend it was a fantasy of mine. Fortunately I was smart enough to question why they only approached people of my age at the bus stop and not just anyone. We know why. I was so fortunate that I have always smelled a rat ( although I actually love rats and all animals) Children of God was their name.
Yes! I had coworkers in “Landmark”. They were so annoying! Always trying to get me to join. They finally left after a few years in it and having lost a lot of money in their courses!
(I see that landmark like all cults do offer some stuff that is useful to some and generally can be found in many places, being kind of human common sense wisdom. Their jargong and belief that they got all we need def betrays them).
I think sometimes the good guy image/philanthropy/feminist leaning is a facade created to put you off that he's really a bad guy/narcissist/psychopath. iow, he's like hey, look at me doing all this good. How could I be bad?
EST was not a cult. It stood for Erhard seminar training and happen to mean in Latin, it is. You took the training at that was it. They offered some small seminars for 25 bucks. The training was 200$. There was no place to stay and work for them. If you wanted to be a seminar leader, you got trained and paid. There were processes as they said. They weren’t just telling their woes. There was controlled sharing. Spent all day on just the 50 rules about the seminar in which people bucked and griped which is what the seminar was about. What as they say now, triggers you. You were not allowed to take it if you were in therapy. What one experienced another did not or it was something diff. Each has their own crap. No sex involved. Sex was mentioned quickly”when your hot your hot, when your not your not.” That was it. Not even close to a cult. I couldn’t even say it was enlightening except for the fact that you sure looked at YOURSELF differently. And noticed all the shit you carry around needlessly.
yikes...I recently watched a documentary about werner erhard and found what he created to be fascinating and generally helpful for most people....I know his ideas continue today under different names after the press attacked him mainly after scientology deemed him FAIR GAME....and slandered him as a man and a father...most of which were lies
hey Andrew. i would suggest not to let this woman (who works fot the NYT) to instruct you orsway how you see things in any way most especially when we are talking about morals. dig the channel. appreciate you.
Andrew I Luv Vanessa and I just wanted to say that I am so well versed in the story in which she’s speaking of because when I was in that wheelchair for the year that was when the vowel was really hot and everybody was talking about it I just wanted to add that before you were born, I watched Keithon a commercial with the guy from Green Gables when he had buyer consumers guidelines or whatever it was and I thought what a creepy creepy character and why didn’t these people google him?
Intetesting interview. However, she was very difficult to listen to with all the "likes" & "you knows."it also seemed a bit of an informercial for her own podcast.
Please don’t give a platform to cult followers/ leaders to come spread their beliefs. Rather give your platform to those who studied them or interviewed them like you did in this interview.
Yeh can't deal with the vocal fry, scrolled through the comments to make sure I'm not alone! Why do people do this, doesn't it give them a sore throat as well as annoying people??
That was disappointing towards the end. Sounds like my dream of studying law, to draft and uphold flirting contracts, is dead in the water. Turns out people still want sex to be spontaneous and don't want everything defined in terms of legality. I am the disappointing. 😢
"Sex is supposed to be abstract and spontaneous": yes, but FIRST you need to know the person wants it, enthusiastically. Also, very sad to hear the notion of how 20 year old women have a "narrow definition of consent". What a yucky, patriarchal, colonial comment to come out of a person's mouth. Every person has the right to define what consent is to them, not anyone else. Let's try to support survivors, people who feel violated vs. providing explanation/excuse for a creep who touched someone or said something that made another human feel unsafe and used as an object. Ya, it's subjective, but YOU aren't the one to decide for someone else, or an entire demographic, what consent looks like or means to them. Maybe it needs to be narrow so people STOP TOUCHING!
If the idea of consent is an individual concept then how can the other person know? Presumably consent can also change from encounter to encounter and from person to person. How can anyone navigate that? How do they know you are fully on board and enthusiastic? Women especially young womrn go along with things they are unsure about because they don't have the self confidence to say no. I can not see how you can blame that on the other person. Speak up.
I hope she's open to personal development and does some training on how to talk without the vocal fry's and 'umms' etc it really made it difficult to listen to her. I didn't even get through half the video before i forgot what she was even trying to say at the end. There was a bit after a few minutes 9:18 where you hear her real voice which was way better! then she goes back down to the vocal fry... why girl why... she got better after 11 minutes. in and out of vocal frys but much less 🥰 much easier to follow along while im working 🙏
@@AndrewGold1 I know! She at least had to serve some time and 2 years out of 3 is a good chunk of time..........that being said, I still don't think long enough. I watched the documentary about this cult and was soooooooo saddened to see so many people sucked in to a "self help" group. Just as scary as COS imo. I may have missed it but have you done any reports/videos on the Branch Dividians? I have watched alot of documentaries/movies/series about that and it is fascinating. I am a proud Christian. I just recently watched your Exorcism video and was glued the entire time. Excellent work Andrew- absolutely excellent!!!!! much love from across the pond in North Carolina
A 'theory' is the graduation point of any scientific endeavor. A model or hypothesis aspires to the status of a falsifiable theory. Evolution is an established fact in this sense. I'm confused about the statement you made (I'll have to rewatch) along the lines of 'I know it's only a theory'. Maybe you said 'evolutionary psychology' which may not have achieved the desired standard of rigor it aspires to as a scientific discipline... Anyway, I feel like I know less about Nexium than when I started watching. It seems as though the target audience for this interview is expected to have the broad strokes already in place. Personally, I'm going to have to go to wiki or something so that the details provided here have some context I can use as scaffolding.
with her vocal fry, frequent pauses, stops, elooongated pronunciations...hemming & hawing a lot for the first t w e n t y m i n u t e s... wanted to perform the heimlich maneuver on this reporter, whereas it was refreshing to hear Andrew speak so straightforwardly.
It was like a Jenny Craig people would try that out Jenny Craig each other it was bizarre it was almost like or could be the better robot and deliver the dialogue in the most effective manner to get the CEOs attention and the whole thing was just gross I remember these Monica Lewinsky as a spokesperson and the terrible things that people used to say about her and not Bill Clinton I just and this was back in the 90s 9899 and I worked there from 1995 Until 2006 and so that was Survival because I worked my way up in the company but I always needed to come home and felt like I needed to take a shower it was a really gross anyways I can do a podcast about that or you could have me as a guest Andrew I’m struggling still trying to get on your show
If said I counted how many times I heard "you know"-sentence in this video. If I told you the exact number, but first you had to guess how many times it was. What would be your answer?🤔
Are Keith Raniere & Allison Mack psychopaths?
Watch new episodes of On the Edge with Andrew Gold podcast Mon & Thur: th-cam.com/play/PLwU7HOfuSL5KD5s9hGoPuyVzN_VwG4Yi_.html
Get them 20 hours early on Spotify/Apple: podfollow.com/on-the-edge-with-andrew-gold
Thanks to you and edge hogs! Making a difference always!❤🎉
I watched HBO's "The Vow" about NXIVM. Fascinating. He tried to come across as humble, but was anything but. I'm not a doctor and can't diagnose him, and although I'm sure he has psychopathic tendencies, his need for adulation, subservience and ego supply seems to place him high on the narcissist spectrum. I personally found him repugnant. Not just physically but in all aspects, but I'm coming from a more objective "after the fact' perspective I suppose. We quite often assume that those who are susceptible to that sort of indoctrination are young, uneducated and needy, but after watching "The Vow" it became clear that no one is really immune. These were mostly very well educated, successful, thriving individuals who, for whatever reason fell victim to this vile creature and his manipulations.
Yesss
@@cymbelinebritain6799 yup
@@Kreepyb5 *Edge Hodges* that’s so adorable 🥰 I’ve heard Andrew use it before and for a long time I’ve wanted to write a comment on how happy this *name of this lovely community is and that it always makes me smile*
Have a lovely day 🌼
Excellent interview! When Vanessa was describing her first impressions of Keith Raniere, I was reminded of Hannah Arendt’s phrase, “the banality of evil.”
When I first saw KR on The Vow, I couldn’t fathom how so many people could’ve been taken in by that conniving evil little man. I began to understand when I saw the clip of Alison Mack’s first meeting with KR. Typical narcissist he asked her a probing question and then twisted around her answer to make her feel vulnerable and exposed. You can see on her face the moment when self-doubt comes crashing in. Vanessa Grigoriadis is a brave woman. I wouldn’t want to sit across the table from KR. I imagine interviewing a manipulative character like him amounts to negotiating a psychological minefield.
What I saw on Alison's face was pure worship and adoration for this creepy man. Absolutely totally in love.
I have been fascinated by all of the tiny interpersonal exchanges that follwed the exact same playbook. Find whats important to you then turn it on its head and nake tou feel like you dont get it
Then offer the solution. So so obvious now but if you are vulnerable...different story. Add in Group think and the specific issues women deal with....Oye. 120 yrs was too kind.
2 narcissists
@@jamesrobbins1243 eww
Me neither 🫣
Enjoyed this Andrew! I would love for your to interview a Norwegian lady called Catherine Mostue, a psychologist who was in a cult-lile environment when she was young. She's a well known psychologist here in Norway and just before Christmas she shared her story in newspapers here. It's so fascinating, how it only takes one person with the right characteristics to make up a cult! It's so interesting, that so many of the same traits are found in both religious and non-religious groups.
I've been a fan of Vanessa Grigoriadis since I was in college and read her Rolling Stone Britney Spears article. It was brilliant and multilayered and different than most other pop music coverage and I can't recommend it highly enough, even 15 years later!
Hey, if your into reading about bands you should try Mark Devlin, it will blow your mind the stuff he has found out.
Oh, that sounds great!
I'll def look into that
@@erciliaflores cool, he has 3 books called Musicals Truths vol 1, vol 2, vol 3. First two are brilliant, not read the third yet👍
This woman is a great journalist!
That was brilliant 👏. The story is just fascinating, terrifying & just really sad. The similarities with scientology makes it extra creepy too 😳
Josci ❤thankyou
I remember watching a documentary on this cult awhile ago. Thank you for another great interview Andrew! 💗
Glad you enjoyed it!
Love to see your take on this Andrew. Cheers, Merry spring everyone!
Hope to see ya in the premiere!
😊 Thanks, and a Merry Spring to you, as well!💜
You too!!
@@AndrewGold1 Sorry i couldn't catch you this time either in the premier, live. I have a bit of a difficult HORARIO myself, and 4 kittens in the house. Have to wait til night time to be able to sit down in peace to concentrate on my fab subjects. Hope to catch you live soon, one day/evening/ night..day.. Ok ;) Thanks for this one. Excellent reporting!
Monday was such Spring weather where I'm at- but then it turned so freaking icy cold, again- I actually am really looking forward to that weather thaw around the corner!
Thankfully we are learning more about how cults work. This one is scary
Vanessa is a true journalist. She's riveting.
This journalist seems to be brilliant. The way she scrutinises ethic from different points of view makes me believe her articles must be reliable. It's rare nowadays. Love it!
This is sad. And again, young females are involved for their youth and beauty. I am glad someone is speaking out against this happening to our youth. When watching Allison Mack on tv, you never realize that something like this could happen. How are these people escaping the law? What is wong with the parents and family members that they are not coming forward.
Love your comment ❤
I saw a Dr Phil where parents have tried .it's kinda sad because at first they where like well they are there on they're own free will . Until the truth came out only then was something done
Right off the bat she mentioned est. I was in Landmark, which was the direct descendant of est. I was only in for a little over a year, but for me, it was a ghastly, soul-crushing experience.
I didn't realize just HOW bad it was until i started removing myself from it. Things that just seemed like a pain in the @$$, at the time, were actually doing real harm, in my humble opinion. I would personally not recommend getting involved with ANY Large Group Awareness Training seminars to anyone, at any time. They promise empowerment, while sucking the life out of you, and altering you in ways to which you did NOT consent. They are also very sneaky about it, making it difficult to prove in court.
Great conversation. Sounds like an intelligent person who understands nuance. Great voice too
I agree.
I think she’s great but the vocal fry hurts my ears.
@@smooth_pursuit Yeah, I agree. I couldn't watch the entire video because of her intentional vocal fry. Most female Millennials in the States utilize this intentional vocal fry, which drives me nuts. It was a hallmark of "the cool kids" when my kids were in school. So glad my daughter wasn't one of the cool kids...
Another amazing interview, Andrew! You are simply a fantastic interviewer. Thanks!
aw thank you karla!
I’m certainly not a doctor, but I say that the diagnosis of a psychopath kind of takes away some responsibility for Keith’s crimes and I think Allison was also brainwashed but by no means should that absolve her of her involvement with this cult
I concur ☮️❤️👋
I don't think the label of psychopath takes away his responsibility, but portrays just how dangerous he really is. A psychopath never stops being a psychopath and they're completely ruthless. They have no empathy, and that's how he's blithely able to brand women without a twinge of anxiety about the pain, the repercussions, none of that. He's able to use women as his toys and do whatever he wants because he sees them, and everyone else in the world, as things to do with as he pleases. Things, not fellow human beings. He's deadly dangerous and he'll never be anything else.
Not really. Psychopaths quite understand right from wrong, they just don't care. Unless they have other co-morbid mental illnesses that affect their ability to distinguish right from wrong or their perception of reality, they are completely culpable.
This argument absolves 99.9% rapists and murderers. Psychopathy is a personality disorder, not mental illness. Not all psychopaths choose to victimize others.
@@danijudy92 It's listed in the DSM-V under Cluster B personality disorders so I'm not sure why you want to argue semantics. I said that they are absolutely culpable because those who have psychopathy or sociopathy know right from wrong. No one said they're absolved or that all psychopaths will victimize others. Mental illness does not necessarily mean mental incapacitation. Two different things.
Andrew, I much admire your interviews, although when I first began to watch them I sometimes felt you seemed a little too even-handed. But since then, I've come to appreciate your style much more. Confession: I usually download videos I am interested in to my PC for later viewing - I hope that's OK. For that reason, and it's a selfish one, I would like to make one tiny suggestion, and it is this: during the long-form interviews, it would help old (73) viewers like me if you could show the name of your interviewee on the screen every now and then. Thank you, and keep up the good work.
Nice work! I'm a fan of Vanessa Grigoriadis' work, glad to see her on the channel.
Another fascinating interview Andrew!
She is so spot on about how creepy Keith is and how others bought his line of b.s. His kissing everyone on the lips should have been a dead giveaway that he was crossing lines.
Man, I would have loved for this to premier in the morning in the states as I am driving 6 hrs to Rhode Island. I’ll have to watch this in the evening. Love your content.
Ah shame! I just put out later because more people are online then. But hope you get to watch it later, and also you can listen to the audio version on Spotify or Apple during your drive. It comes out 20 hours or so before the TH-cam.
@@AndrewGold1 oh! Will do!!
Enjoy your trip carmencita
@@CarmencitaTiradoJayandme21 Drive safe, hun. I'm a New England girl. I was born at Manchester Memorial Hospital in Connecticut, and grew up in Glastonbury, Ct. I now live in California, and miss home so much. Cali sucks. People here are insane.
This was absolutely fascinating and I think I will continue to research NXIVM from this, after hearing about Eliza Bleu I do want to learn more of how rings like this coerce their followers
I can’t help but wonder if Tom Welling, Erica Durance, Michael Rosenbaum and others from Smallville will see this. I’ve seen interviews that stated Allison Mack tried to recruit the women who played Supergirl and Black Canary from Smallville. Thank goodness they didn’t fall for it.
Don't you just love professional people guys? Here is a prime example of two mega professionals. Such a pleasure to listen to you both, as hard as the subject is ,you bring out the facts with grace. Yes, professionalism.
K.R would be sitting in an insane asylum for the rest of his natural life, where i come from. Criminal of highest degree. Insane Criminal. I keep finding it fascinating the HUGE difference in how cases like this are treated starting from legal procedures all the way to where they land their asses once judged. See, i used to work in an asylum for the criminally insane ( as Keith would be called under the criteria in my country, Finland) , So there's a definite line in the type of crime committed whether you land your ass in prison, and get out when your sentence is done with. The line goes at that if there is ANY or SOME (or both) indicators within the crime committed that there is a degree of pervertedness ( i know its not exactly a word, but..), if you like, or something very EXTREME (for example the branding would be considered as such) , then the criminal is referred to the State Psychiatric ward directly and any court proceedings are halted at that point, and what follows is examination ( can last up to 3 or more years depending on the case) by 3 psychiatrists, whom have to come to the same conclusion and diagnosis. MOST cases referred to the Psychiatric examination will never get out again, except for a walk around the enclosed court yard.
So, i'm fascinated how someone like K.R in the U.S just gets like 120 yrs in normal prison cos in my "books" the creep is absolutely off his rocker insane. But i respect his 120 yrs. I hope he lives that long as to have to serve every single day. Well, one can always hope right..?
Interesting. I would hope he gets the most harsh punishment possible. Therefore if deeming him unfit for regular prison due to mental disorder would give him the ability to veg out on psychotropic drugs every day instead of be in agony and turmoil every single day for 120 years, I will hope he gets scenario B. Let him meet God, the only person who can ACTUALLY change his reprobate heart.
I know this is a year later, but I really enjoy Vanessa! Please keep having her on more!
Always interesting subjects…Eye opening to hear what kind of people are out there..thanks Andrew.
🙋♀️ Hello again, you two. I have this on my watch list for tomorrow. In the meantime, wishing you both a wonderful evening.
Hope you enjoy it!
I'm about to watch this vid. I LOVE the way you titled it, Andrew: "A Scientology-like" cult". That title says I lotg, so I won't elaborate. Thank you.
Hey Andrew love the channel! Whenever I think of Keith Raniere, I think of him running around in those little volleyball shorts, and I wonder how could this guy possibly think he's God's gift to women! 🙄
….and how any woman would pay him any attention. He is so slimy, hairy and gross! The way that he breaths and flicks his tongue just lets you know he’s evil.
Andrew I’ve been watching your videos I just haven’t commented a long time I hope you’re doing really well I loved your video and interview with this lady in reference to Megan Markle and some of the comments that I commented on in reference to the dossier project Nikki Klein left and my comments are pulled off of the Darcy project and put on the frayed report April 11 of 2023 I was really proud of that❤
Please do an episode on Teal Swan's cult
Hey Andrew, great interview 🙌
In regards to her comment in beginning of interview that she was surprised to finding this cult in upstate NY. I will share that there are other cults there, especially in the Hudson Valley. I'm aware of this thru a friend that lived in that area for many years.
Really interesting guest! I'm going to check out her podcast. :)
Hope you enjoy!
@@AndrewGold1 I guess the only good thing one could find about K.R. is that he didn't use ACTUAL 13 year old children... EDIT: When might you look into the beginning of this cult? Look into "Sex Magick [sic] Rituals," Andrew. It's all connected. L. Ron Hubbard was a devotee of Aleister Crowley. Since this is a "Scientology-like Cult," I'd be willing to bet K.R. was a devotee of Crowley, as well. *This whole sex cult screams Sex Magick* [sic] *Ritual* to me. *Crowley was the inspiration for sex cult founder Colin Batley.*
All this info...so distrubing! I'm glad to be informed but I can't stay.
Job well done Mr. Gold! I shall rtn!
"est" is an acronym for Erhard Seminars Training, (the founder was Werner Erhard), so probably is NOT related directly to Reniere's ESP. I don't know what Raniere's acronym was. Having said that, most of the LGATs sprung out of the Esalen Institute, Mind Dynamics, and Scientology.
Im from Guadalajara, live here, is so weird that you guys are aware of my City lol but yeah.. i knew some girls that were with me in high school that ended up in those "executive succes programs" ..so sad
It's worthwhile to note there are (and have been) plenty of other ethically managed Large Group Awareness programs which evolved from the EST model. Her description of these seminars leave a lot unsaid about their curriculum and content.
I am going to watch The Vow and check out the Scientology angle. I am quite familiar with 'est' and some of it's splinter groups. Werner Erhart had been in Scientology. LRH was very pissed off about that apparent thievery. LRH stole half his stuff from others as well. Sort of like the pirates of silicon valley.
This was fun.
Thanks Andrew.
I am so curious about EST!! And I know absolutely zero about it. Only heard about, about a month ago. Take care always ❤
Good interview. Running short on time, so will have to come back to finish watching.
I appreciate how these guests go deeply into their personal experiences. Andrew, I'm sorry I've not been commenting under your videos. I've been quite unwell as of late, and unable to sit up to type. *You are one of my favorite content producers.* I can spot a person who possesses talent, and I can easily tell you'll be an investigative reported who exposes a whole lot more than just these truly sick cults. *I am wondering why on Earth you've not gone to the very source of the cult, however.* L. Ron Hubbard was a devotee of Aleister Crowley. I'll bet Keith R. was, too. *Look into "Sex Magick* [sic] *Rituals,"* Andrew. It's all connected.
Aw hope you get better soon!! Much love
@@AndrewGold1 Thanks, sweetie. I see so many great exposes you will do in the future, Andrew. You are quite talented, and one does not need to be a talent scout to see this. Take care, and thank you for your kind thoughts & kind words. *Shalom* ❤
Great interview and discussion!
What is happening at minute 43-46?
Can someone clarify that for me?
I didn’t understand what VG was really talking about. What was her point? What does Aziz Ansari have to do with this example? What is she saying about the college women having accusations about jerks vs rapists?
What is her opinion on the accused being thrown out of university?
I appreciate an explanation. I have a hard time understanding right now. Thank you!
Would love to see you interview Nicki Clyne and/or Marc Elliott. Ideally you and Shaun and Nicki and Marc to cover the Tourette’s side
I love your Tom Cruise cosplay Andrew. Seriously though, great interview. Very interesting.
Glad you enjoyed it! Haha
Hi from ClearwaterFlorida
👋I'm just over the bridge lol Skyway
Hi👋☮️
Hi everyone!😀👍
@@clearwaterchad9037 👋☮️
@@Kreepyb5 hi! Hopefully I will see you in the comments tonight if Aaron does Mondays with Marc and mike!
I'm sorry... I've been super sick with covid but I promise I am now trying to catch up on your videos. 😊
Welcome back! And hope you feel better !
Meghan Markle has been connected with this cult through the Bronfams and isn't BetterUp with Prince Harry into some of this as well. Mental Health and Growth. Seminars???
Vanessa we need more people like you exploring abuse consent power dynamics etc ...more power to you
I think Keith must've been a narcissist, also, because of his NEED for people to worship him and believe him to be ever so smart and good🤮
I feel bad for Allison Mack. I think she must've really hated herself when she met him and fell for him. And now gets to spend the rest of her life hating herself some more. I hope she gets healthy!
Great guest, Andrew
I think she only got 3 years !!! Which I am very disappointed to hear.
@@wingedinfinity6715she was just recently released.
Louies situation was kind of gross, but it was consensual, and he didn’t deny it at all. I’m thrilled that he’s back.
Thanks Nos, just caught your comment about the lighthouse! Goiuto see if I can fi d it. Ty
I liked it !
Great interview.
So good!!
A quick note just to say that this topic is just too off-putting for me to follow very much of it. But that’s just me! I see that others are having a lively discussion, and that’s great!
Remember to point your friends to this channel! Many many interesting topics!
Hi and thanks for this interesting interview/dialogue 🙏
(I wonder, since English isn’t my first language, if this and similar videos are considered interviews, (like the definition of the word interview suggests) or are my thoughts regarding these kind of interaction’s, that they’ve the format of an interview, but they also have the intention to create a feeling of A) a more relaxed setting and B) create space for a more intimate, and deeper conversation, and both parties (the interviewer and interviewee) are on equal footing.
➡️ And this is where my ambivalence lays, I normally feel most interview’s have a different type of power balance. Take f.ex. Pier Morgan’s popular show “Uncensored with Piers Morgan”, that’s a interview setting that I consider to be a *traditional type of interview* the interviewer ask’s question and don’t necessarily ask questions they are personally interested in knowing, but instead prefer to stick with a predetermined set of questions, and that is in my experience why many interviewer’s aren’t foreign to keep asking the same questions over and over until they get one that suit the expectations. All answers outside the prepared script, would potentially have undesirable consequences, imagine f.ex you’re interviewing a semi-controversial person, I can see why someone prefer to have a more controlled format, to avoid being triggered/ provoked which can easily result the interviewer loses their “cool”.
(for the sake of it, I’ll insert Wikipedia’s definition:
[quote] “an interview is a structured conversation where one participant asks questions, and the other provides answers” [End quote]
the “roles of an interviewee, and interviewer” is present in this video, yet I’ll argue that this format is one I personally favor, and to me it doesn’t feels like it’s a interview due to what I wrote above under ➡️ *B*
Again, thank you so much for this awesome episode 🙏🌻
Love, Grace
Fascinating interview
Andrew, kudos for not falling asleep during this interview - not cos she's boring but cos her voice is pure ASMR..! 😆
This is funny because I thought the fry was very distracting.
Interesting live chat happening 😂 42:21
😂👍🏽👋☮️
Old fashioned garden variety psychopaths. 🌻
I can’t believe I missed this video
Excellent interview 👏
great pod cast
Awesome video, thank you.
I cant find her podcast. Could you link her youtube?
It's not 'evil'; it all comes down to psychological needs.
Cults preying on young age children is not so new at all. I live in Australia and used to be approached by nice looking 'religous males, one in particular who would target me while I was at the bus stop to go home. It was around the late 70s and I do not remember why I knew it was weird. My mother would certainly not have told me nor would she come and wait for me. I never told her because I knew she would not care or pretend it was a fantasy of mine. Fortunately I was smart enough to question why they only approached people of my age at the bus stop and not just anyone. We know why. I was so fortunate that I have always smelled a rat ( although I actually love rats and all animals) Children of God was their name.
I want to know more about EST?
”Landmark” currently.
@@ehyeh365 TY👍🏽☮️👋
Yes! I had coworkers in “Landmark”. They were so annoying! Always trying to get me to join. They finally left after a few years in it and having lost a lot of money in their courses!
(I see that landmark like all cults do offer some stuff that is useful to some and generally can be found in many places, being kind of human common sense wisdom. Their jargong and belief that they got all we need def betrays them).
@@ehyeh365 agree 👋☮️
Allison was my favorite on Smallville.
Guess if i was shocked?
Very interesting. Thank you. ❤
Welcome!
I think sometimes the good guy image/philanthropy/feminist leaning is a facade created to put you off that he's really a bad guy/narcissist/psychopath. iow, he's like hey, look at me doing all this good. How could I be bad?
New York state is not the same thing as New York City
EST was not a cult. It stood for Erhard seminar training and happen to mean in Latin, it is. You took the training at that was it. They offered some small seminars for 25 bucks. The training was 200$. There was no place to stay and work for them. If you wanted to be a seminar leader, you got trained and paid. There were processes as they said. They weren’t just telling their woes. There was controlled sharing. Spent all day on just the 50 rules about the seminar in which people bucked and griped which is what the seminar was about. What as they say now, triggers you. You were not allowed to take it if you were in therapy. What one experienced another did not or it was something diff. Each has their own crap. No sex involved. Sex was mentioned quickly”when your hot your hot, when your not your not.” That was it. Not even close to a cult. I couldn’t even say it was enlightening except for the fact that you sure looked at YOURSELF differently. And noticed all the shit you carry around needlessly.
yikes...I recently watched a documentary about werner erhard and found what he created to be fascinating and generally helpful for most people....I know his ideas continue today under different names after the press attacked him mainly after scientology deemed him FAIR GAME....and slandered him as a man and a father...most of which were lies
hey Andrew. i would suggest not to let this woman (who works fot the NYT) to instruct you orsway how you see things in any way most especially when we are talking about morals.
dig the channel. appreciate you.
Andrew I Luv Vanessa and I just wanted to say that I am so well versed in the story in which she’s speaking of because when I was in that wheelchair for the year that was when the vowel was really hot and everybody was talking about it I just wanted to add that before you were born, I watched Keithon a commercial with the guy from Green Gables when he had buyer consumers guidelines or whatever it was and I thought what a creepy creepy character and why didn’t these people google him?
Sadly there are always folks who are gullible or vulnerable to being love bombed.
Intetesting interview. However, she was very difficult to listen to with all the "likes" & "you knows."it also seemed a bit of an informercial for her own podcast.
Interesting podcast, as most have been.
But as a non US-listener: aaaaghhh, the vocal-fry on this good lady...
In Scientology there are collaterals as nxivm??
Please don’t give a platform to cult followers/ leaders to come spread their beliefs. Rather give your platform to those who studied them or interviewed them like you did in this interview.
They’re still active
Weird how she slips into extreme voice fry at certain points of her storytelling. Not sure what to make of that.
Yeh can't deal with the vocal fry, scrolled through the comments to make sure I'm not alone! Why do people do this, doesn't it give them a sore throat as well as annoying people??
It's not purposeful, it's just the way some people talk. They can't help it, and it's unkind to make fun of them for it.
I cannot cope with her vocal fry. It's awful. It's a shame but I literally cannot watch this 🙉
Fascinating.
That aziz ansari bit threw me off 🥴
That was disappointing towards the end. Sounds like my dream of studying law, to draft and uphold flirting contracts, is dead in the water. Turns out people still want sex to be spontaneous and don't want everything defined in terms of legality. I am the disappointing. 😢
Very interesting!!!
"Sex is supposed to be abstract and spontaneous": yes, but FIRST you need to know the person wants it, enthusiastically. Also, very sad to hear the notion of how 20 year old women have a "narrow definition of consent". What a yucky, patriarchal, colonial comment to come out of a person's mouth. Every person has the right to define what consent is to them, not anyone else. Let's try to support survivors, people who feel violated vs. providing explanation/excuse for a creep who touched someone or said something that made another human feel unsafe and used as an object. Ya, it's subjective, but YOU aren't the one to decide for someone else, or an entire demographic, what consent looks like or means to them. Maybe it needs to be narrow so people STOP TOUCHING!
If the idea of consent is an individual concept then how can the other person know? Presumably consent can also change from encounter to encounter and from person to person. How can anyone navigate that? How do they know you are fully on board and enthusiastic? Women especially young womrn go along with things they are unsure about because they don't have the self confidence to say no. I can not see how you can blame that on the other person. Speak up.
I hope she's open to personal development and does some training on how to talk without the vocal fry's and 'umms' etc it really made it difficult to listen to her. I didn't even get through half the video before i forgot what she was even trying to say at the end. There was a bit after a few minutes 9:18 where you hear her real voice which was way better! then she goes back down to the vocal fry... why girl why... she got better after 11 minutes. in and out of vocal frys but much less 🥰 much easier to follow along while im working 🙏
The remaining members have a TH-cam channel......
how are cult leaders treated in prison?
Allison Mack was just released early 😳.
Interesting!
@@AndrewGold1 I know! She at least had to serve some time and 2 years out of 3 is a good chunk of time..........that being said, I still don't think long enough. I watched the documentary about this cult and was soooooooo saddened to see so many people sucked in to a "self help" group. Just as scary as COS imo. I may have missed it but have you done any reports/videos on the Branch Dividians? I have watched alot of documentaries/movies/series about that and it is fascinating. I am a proud Christian. I just recently watched your Exorcism video and was glued the entire time. Excellent work Andrew- absolutely excellent!!!!! much love from across the pond in North Carolina
There’s still at least two unsolved disappearances around this creepy little punk KR. One of them was only 13.
A 'theory' is the graduation point of any scientific endeavor. A model or hypothesis aspires to the status of a falsifiable theory. Evolution is an established fact in this sense. I'm confused about the statement you made (I'll have to rewatch) along the lines of 'I know it's only a theory'. Maybe you said 'evolutionary psychology' which may not have achieved the desired standard of rigor it aspires to as a scientific discipline... Anyway, I feel like I know less about Nexium than when I started watching. It seems as though the target audience for this interview is expected to have the broad strokes already in place. Personally, I'm going to have to go to wiki or something so that the details provided here have some context I can use as scaffolding.
I started to listen but sadly had to switch off. Can't listen to that voice 😰
with her vocal fry, frequent pauses, stops, elooongated pronunciations...hemming & hawing a lot for the first
t w e n t y
m i n u t e s...
wanted to perform the heimlich maneuver on this reporter,
whereas it was refreshing to hear
Andrew speak so straightforwardly.
the vocal fry is profoundly irritating.
Vanessa looks SO-O-O world weary here. Been there, done that, doing it again tomorrow kind of thing.
It was like a Jenny Craig people would try that out Jenny Craig each other it was bizarre it was almost like or could be the better robot and deliver the dialogue in the most effective manner to get the CEOs attention and the whole thing was just gross I remember these Monica Lewinsky as a spokesperson and the terrible things that people used to say about her and not Bill Clinton I just and this was back in the 90s 9899 and I worked there from 1995 Until 2006 and so that was Survival because I worked my way up in the company but I always needed to come home and felt like I needed to take a shower it was a really gross anyways I can do a podcast about that or you could have me as a guest Andrew I’m struggling still trying to get on your show
If said I counted how many times I heard "you know"-sentence in this video.
If I told you the exact number, but first you had to guess how many times it was. What would be your answer?🤔
That woman’s vocal fry is driving me nuts!! I’m not sure I can make through this video. Why do women do this?
OK…. I’m out…interesting video, but that woman’s voice could strip paint off of furniture from 50 feet away.
What has become of Allison?
@Abe Froman
😪
She has two years to serve already done one year