Upgrading from my Behringer XR 16
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ก.ค. 2024
- Hey everyone, so...I did a thing.
Yep, I spent money (I don't have) upgrading from my Behringer XR16 to TWO Soundcraft UI24R mixers.
If you are interested in picking up one of these mixers yourself, here's the link:
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If you're interested in picking up a really robust network cable, here's the one I'm testing in this video.
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My patreon page:
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00:00 - Chapters
00:00 - Intro
00:04 - What did I do
00:13 - Why did I do this
02:02 - Logo Roll
02:11 - Lets look at the devices
02:37 - My CASCADE network cable
03:15 - The hardware interface
04:18 - The Web interface
06:40 - Wrap up
07:32 - Outro
07:43 - Subscribe
07:48 - Patreon - ภาพยนตร์และแอนิเมชัน
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Here is the HTML code to copy/paste.
Make sure you change the IP addresses in the code to match the IP addresses of your two mixers.
Put this into a notepad (windows) or textedit (mac) and save it with the .html extension. Make sure you select "all file types" when you are saving it otherwise your computer will append the .txt file type to the end of the name and it won't work.
Then, just open the new html file you made and it will open the double interface.
I have been using my UI24 for about a year now without any major problems, having joined a few Facebook groups I soon realised that the internal hotspot is not at all reliable especially when running on 2.4 gHz - 5.0gHz mode is better but an external router is the way to go to eliminate connection problems between your UI and your Ipad. I installed a 60mm Noctua NF-A6x25 FLX fan into the unit and this certainly improves airflow to keep it cooler.
I was toying with the idea of the fan install but I haven’t had any heat issues with mine.
I ALWAYS use external routers. Even if a company put in the most robust internal router they could possible find…I still wouldn’t trust it ;)
Glad you’re having a good experience with your mixer.
I’m happy I switched.
Thanks for watching and happy mixing!!
The form factor is still one of my favourite things about my XR18 (no rack to find space for when playing in small places), but I did really like the idea with the Soundcraft that you could multitrack record a live event with no other device , straight to the USB stick! That's a great facility.
I love the size of the XR series too. They are hella-portable.
Even these Soundcraft are a bit bigger than I’d hoped for. They’re still absolutely portable but I don’t feel as confident leaving them out of a portable case as I do with the XR’s and they’re great rubber bumpers.
Oh Dude the HDMI and Mouse feature totally blew me away. Im keeping my X32r but Im watching... Im watching
It’s a great perk for sure.
I still use my XR for things. But having a couple of mixers with their own interface and controls is pretty neat. Knowing I don’t have to be reliant on another piece of software in a pinch is pretty satisfying.
Thanks for watching. And happy mixing!
A coworker has one of these. It does seem to be more sensitive to heat than he would like (yes he has a butt load of fans in the rack). A couple times it has reset during a show. It's not catastrophic, but scary. He uses the hell out of it. Often they will play three or four shows a week.
That aside, he likes it, and I've messed around with it a few times. The modeling is fun.
There is a well known issue with heat that seems to be resolved by removing and reapplying the thermal paste on the mixers processor.
I haven’t had the heat issues and therefore have not attempted this thermal paste redo. But it’s worth mentioning to your coworker.
If I ever do have this issue this is the first thing I’ll be doing.
@@QuickEZ Thanks, I 'll mention it to him. We have the stuff at the shop. I mentioned to him yesterday about this video, and he said it did it again about a week ago. He is worried about this weekend as it is to be toward 100 degrees on the next gig.
I literally returned my XR18 yesterday thinking of getting the MR18, instead I got the Soundcraft!! Amazing features
what made you switch to soundcraft?
@@AAngel411 Well, more outputs. A working app/browser. And above all, the ability to record and playback from an usb stick. You can also connect a touchscreen to it! Was really charmed by the Midas. But all the options of the Soundcraft got me stoked!
I just bought the 16 chann version for my dad, he’s retired and plays music for hobby. He’s an old man that doesn’t understand technology very well, and yet was able to use his iPad. Absolutely loves it!
Ive thought about moving from xr/mr18 to this soundcraft offering, especially since you could cascade 2 together for more inputs but monitoring via ultranet is still the win for me. Lol. Monitoring multiple ways has been a bigger issue than more inputs in a few of my setups.
I do like the approach soundcraft has taken on this mixer. The browser based mixing interface is priceless.
There are definite advantages to each manufacturers device. I’m keeping my XR 16 and will still probably pick up an 18 or even an x32 rack and an sd8 stage box at some point down the road.
Clearly I have a problem with buying too many toys!! Lol
The Soundcraft seemed like a good idea for what I’ve got going on right now.
The cascade function is great and having the full gui interface and control of the remote/stage box through the local box is great.
Not to mention being able to open both interfaces in a single browser window with a little HTML knowledge. That one feature really knocked its out of the park for me when I stumbled on it.
That interface is kind of cool though!
This, I completely agree with.
Great video! Thanks. I do recommend using a powered usb hub for your usb stick. The port only provides 40ma
Thanks for the tip!
Even better, use an ssd with the powered hub. Once I did that, I haven’t had any buffering issues with multitrack recording. The usb stick tended to skip or get buffer overruns once I was recording more than about 10 tracks.
Also, mixing station pro works with the ui24r now. I use it sometimes, and one cool thing is you can attach one or more mackie control capable fader units to your tablet or computer and have physical control that is wireless. It’s handy on gigs when you need to ride faders.
I use a strong outdoor wifi ap that reaches about 300ft. if I have it high enough in the air, the crowds don't fully eat my signal. I use an MS Surface Pro (an i7 model with fans) and can use the "Big Display" mode, which gives you a second layer of faders and control. Less flipping around on the screen. The blue section on the left gives you more controls there, too. Likewise, instead of running the HDMI straight out (which I still keep available in case of any wifi failure), I have a small chrome stick connected to my touch screen, so I can use big display mode on the display by the ui24r. Note for those purchasing: the built-in hdmi won't run higher than 720p, so you can't use the Big Display mode on the built-in port. Made me sad. Must be on 1080p for the option to work.
Also take careful note when rack-mounting: there are vents above and below the ui24r. Make sure you keep an air gap between the mixer and other rack items. This drove me nuts. I was planning to have a storage drawer or network switch rack mounted in my existing rack, but had to give up some U's to give the mixer some space.
thanks for all your insights here!
The more conversation we have about this and other pro-sumer products makes the landscape eaiser to navigate for the new users!!
You know what I found really annoying? The inaccessible power switch when the units are rack mounted!
Soundcraft aren't the only ones this applies to, my XR16 is the same. I feel like there's a better solution for placement instead of requiring me to install a surge-strip with individual power toggles in my rack.
But that's small potatoes I guess...just a silly nuisance that I wanted to rant about somewhere ;)
@@QuickEZ I agree about the power switch. It's just out of range if you try to switch it by reaching through one of the slots in the rack ears. But, ideally, it's plugged into a Furman so switching in the Furman takes care of that.
Generally it's a liveable situation and more a dumb oversight than anything else...HOWEVER, the annoying part for me is that when it's in my home rack, it's not the only thing on the power conditioner...and sometimes, I want the mixer off but the other items on. You can see why I might be grumpy about that... ;)
Have an M32C/DL16 combo showing up tomorrow.. with an addtl DL16 planned in the future.
Sure wish I'd stumbled on this sooner, you offer good food for thought.
I’m sure you’ll still be happy with your choices. Each system certainly has its advantages and disadvantages.
Just remember, you’re never locked in. You can always sell the gear if it doesn’t make you happy or satisfy its purpose for you. And there’s such a shortage of X and M equipment right now you’d probably have no trouble getting your full money back with a sale.
But check back in and let me know if the new toys make you happy. I love hearing from satisfied gear junkies 😉.
Happy Mixing!!
Is the one in the control room just going to be running the monitors and a talkback microphone because you can also connect to the same router and use that without having to buy another mixer
Hi Toby,
no, that was just an example. I use these for all different types of events/gigs with all types of different requirements.
I specifically wanted the ability to cascade the two units to have full audio control back and forth between two points.
Thanks for watching.
James, Great video, bit more than what I will be doing. Could have done without the music though. Your instruction and review is enough "background". :-)
Hi Chris,
Thanks for watching the video.
The music was a calculated decision.
Not only did I want to have a constant signal I could use to show that my routing was function as expected, at the time of shooting this video there was a lot of chatter in various forums about the instability of the cascade feature. I kept the music running to show that my cascade didn’t drop connection, and so that I could point to this video when further discussions on the topic came up.
That being said, I personally dislike music in the background of my videos so I’m basically in agreement with you. 😂
Hello, thank you for the review. I am not sure, maybe you have mentioned ... but how many tracks - inputs ..you can mix at the same time? It is 24+24 = 48 ? Because there is information from Soundcraft that cascade means 32x32 ??. Also.. how many track you can record directly on USB stick if you have 2 units? Probably 2 x 22 on 2 USB stick? Or on 1 USB stick you can record 32 track? This simple informations are often very hidden in the manual, or demonstration. The sound of UI24R is better than Behringer? Thank you very much!
Hi, thanks for watching!
Unfortunately, cascading does not give you double the amount of inputs.
The network connection can handle 32 send and 32 receive but you’re limited to the inputs of one single unit.
When you send inputs from one unit to the other, you have to apply those sends to the available inputs of the receiving unit.
So if you wanted to send all the inputs from one unit to the other, that would eat up all the inputs of the receiving unit.
On a USB you can record the amount of available inputs.
In my opinion, the converters in the Soundcraft are better than the Behringer units. But it’s not enough that the average person would notice.
I think choosing the unit that fits your purpose better is the way to go, while keeping in mind that Behringer is currently suffering from bugs/issues with their iOS apps.
Happy mixing!!
@@QuickEZ .. Thank you! So as I understand well, cascade means using 2 units inputs, but mixing one ONE tablet just 24 inputs?? I am talking just about the inputs, because my goal is recording and not mixing...Just my primitive way of thinking... 24 inputs with UNIT 1 --> Out master to 2 Inputs UNIT 2 + 22 Inputs UNIT 2 = All together 46 inputs. Of course..no cascade = 2 tablets and... of course probably some latency (possible to handle with dealy on 22 Inputs UNIT 2) .. It is correct what I am thinking? Not perfect, but possible. Or?
If I understand what you’re trying to do. You want the most inputs possible but be able to mix on one device.
You could use two UI24’s without using the cascade function.
You could mix together 24 channels in one device and send either a full stereo mix out to the other device, or use your 8 Aux outputs to send 8 sub mixes (drums, guitars, vocals, etcetera) out to 8 inputs on the other device.
Then use the remaining 16 inputs on the second device to mix even more instruments.
To be able to control both mixers from one device you can create a custom webpage that shows both mixers. That is VERY easy to do and I reference it in my video.
Yes there will be latency added both by the analog-to-digital conversion on the inputs and then the digital-to-analog conversion on the outputs.
But it may not be very much.
You would have to test the latency of a signal after its round-trip through the ADC>DAC. MAYBE 2048 samples??
I haven’t tested that myself, I’m just guessing at the amount of latency.
@@QuickEZ Thank you very much!
Hey! How are the machines going? I see a lot of problems with them, interested to know have you had anything go wrong with yours since you got them? Thanks!
Hi Pat,
I haven't had a single issue with either of my two devices.
My main device runs 24/7 here at home and I use it as my main computer audio interface. It hasn't ever dropped connection, it hasn't ever had heat related issues. It's been solid as a rock despite being in a rack with limited air-flow.
I know there is a issues out there, but I think in the grand scheme of things, it's fewer people with problems than without them. But if you're part of a group on FB or other social platforms, you're going to hear about the problems more than you normally would out in the real world because people actively seek out the groups for assistance and to complain.
Just my two cents, of course, but the fact that I have a device running all day long every single day without issue says a lot.
Thanks for watching!
I've seen you also have an ATEM switcher... I wonder what audio the Ui24R is putting out on HDMI, if I fed it into the ATEM ISO? This would be a great way to time-sync & record multi-cam ATEM ISOrecordings with a Ui24R multichannel recording, syncing them in post via the eg. HDMI/stereoMaster output channel also recorded in the ATEM ISO... you see where I'm going? :) do you hear anything via HDMI on a monitor with speakers?
Hey DR.,
This was some very clever thinking on your part.
Unfortunately, the HDMI output on the UI doesn't have any embedded sound and there is no facility in the mixer to turn that on.
I'm very curious now if it's something that Soundcraft could "turn on" or if there simply isn't a circuit that passes audio from the mixer to the HDMI. I suspect it can't be done, but I'm going to fire off a few emails and see whats possible.
Maybe someone smarter than I will see this and chime in.
It's actually too bad this isn't already a thing, it would be incredibly convenient as an additional audio output, even if it was just locked to the main mix and not adjustable.
Thanks for watching (and for the cool though experiement), happy mixing!
@@QuickEZ*dang* that's what I feared :( well, you do have the ATEM extreme, so you could re-route the headphone out of the ATEM into the Ui24R to get the sync the other way round... or use a HDMI-splliter that gives you Audio-Cinch from ATEM second HDMI, to feed audio back into Ui24R... I would just prefer the other way round, since you can "re-use" a field monitor for both devices.... you would see the Ui24R as one of your ATEM sources... if you "full-screen" the Ui24R there, even touchscreen would work!
yeah, it's a bummer for sure. I wasn't even so concerned with syncing, I always have ways to make that happen, I was just interested in what other possibilities it might have opened up as I hadn't even considered if the HDMI might have audio on it before you mentioned it. Just off the top, another way to get fully-mixed audio into a live stream with the ATEM without having to eat up physical audio outputs on the mixer. Which would be great if I was doing a full band and wanted to stream their show at the same time.
But alas, it was not meant to be...at least not yet :D
I do appreciate you getting my brain working in a direction that it hadn't gone before. Now I'm just going to sit and stare at all my hardware today until I think of something outside the box like you did.
cool ..let me know then!
Hii
A router without a modem is capable with it?
Yes, you can use a router without internet to control your mixer.
It also has its own wireless router built in
Interesting regarding the HDMI port cos I rang soundcraft tech support and they said it had been disabled because of resource limitations. All the units I have the HDMI doesn't work. How does yours?
Hi Wil, my devices are Soundcraft not Allen & Heath.
What device do you have?
@@QuickEZ ohh apologies friend... I ment to say soundcraft. My bad. 🙂
Do you have a ui24 Wil?
I haven’t heard anything anywhere about the HDMI ports being disabled.
@@QuickEZ I have the ui 16
Thanks for letting me know...maybe they've disabled the HDMI on the 16, as I don't see it mentioned in the FEATURES section of the website now, despite showing it in the photos.
The UI24 absolutely has a functioning HDMI as you can see from my video. Not to mention, there is a UI group on Facebook and everyone in there with a UI24 has a functioning HDMI output.
It's disappointing that they would shut that feature off as it's a pretty great one. However, if it was affecting functionality due to resource limits, then I guess a functioning mixer is more important that a video output.
I'll be sure to mention this fact any time I make a Soundcraft video moving forward.
Does cascading allow you to double the number of AUX outputs?
Sorry for the delayed response, I've been away.
The answer is yes.
1. The mixer has 8 physical auxes, but it also has 2 virtual auxes, (9/10)
You could patch those 2 auxes into the cascade inputs of your second mixer and then route them to whatever outputs on the second mixer that you want.
2. You can also set any of your channel inputs on mixer 1, to cascade to any of the inputs on mixer 2. Then you would have a duplicate of all your inputs from mixer 1 showing up on the inputs of mixer 2. This would allow you to create an additional 8 aux mixes as well as utilize your main outs on the second mixer.
@@QuickEZ So you're saying you could potentially have 16 aux outs?
Correct!
I just did a quick test of this to make sure I wasn't lying to you :)
I cascaded input 1 on my first mixer to input 1 on my second mixer.
I then sent that microphone to each of my 8 auxes on the first mixer, and to each of my 8 auxes on the second mixer.
Success! 16 separate aux outputs.
You could even use the main L/R out on the second mixer as two additional mixes....so 18 total
Or assign virtual auxes 9 & 10 to the headphone L / R outputs for a total of 20 mixes. BOOM!
What this does not do, is give you double the amount of inputs as you have to send the signal somewhere for it to work.
For instance:
You can duplicate all of you inputs from mixer 1, to mixer 2 using the method I've described above. But once you've done that, you no longer have use of the XLR inputs on the second mixer. You've overwritten the channels of that mixer with the inputs of Mixer 1.
Hope that makes sense. Let me know if you need any further clarification.
I should also mention just for clarity sake, you don't have to send all of your channels. The mixer doesn't do it in blocks of channels like some other mixers.
You can send one channel, 2 channels, all channels...it's up to you.
So if you wanted 16 aux outputs but also wanted to use physical XLR inputs on both mixers, you could do a mix and match and send stuff back and forth.
Or you could use the virtual Aux 9 & 10 I mentioned previously to send submixes from mixer 1 to mixer 2, and only use up 2 channels on mixer 2, which would then let you use the remaining channels for additional physical inputs.
This would work well if you wanted to do some serious cable management on stage...have one mixer on stage left, and one on stage right.
Patch some instruments into the first mixer (maybe all your drums) and some into the second mixer (all your other instruments). Then send signal back and forth between both boxes as required (as long as you have the required amount of channels free to receive signal)
@@QuickEZ thanks for the detailed description of the setup! One question - does the patching have to be via XLR? Isn't there like a network cable to simply send whatever channels from mixer1 to mixer2?
Well... If you wanted a stagebox, why not Presonus Studiolive rack versions? You can also extend them with matching stageboxes.
I chose Soundcraft for a couple of reasons;
1) I have experience with Soundcraft.
2) The HDMI port and the keyboard/mouse support right on each box.
I'm sure the Presonus are great, but the two reasons above made it the right choice for me.
But who knows, maybe there's a Presonus in my near future, too ?!?!
Sound craft is best
Questions on monitor. May I ask what monitor you are using because I'm looking to buy but most I read about says the touch doesn't work on hdmi? Thanks Scott
@@scottconard4643 Thats what i want to know . I would drop the ball today and already have an invoice from PAS but im trying to figure out how to find a compatible touchscreen 20-24". Even the techs at Soundcraft couldn't help there. They suggest a mini pc or a tv box . By the time i purchase these and a wireless mouse and keyboard (if needed) it will cost me another 4-5 hundred bucks minimum. Any help here would be great .
So i will need 2 ethernet cables?
Hi DJJASON,
that all depends on what you want to do. If you're asking about cascading the two units, then yes, unless you want to use a router or a switch, in which case you'd need 3
one cable has to go directly from one UI24 to the other using both ETHERNET # 2 ports.
Then if you're using a router or switch, one cable from each ETHERNET #1 port to the router/switch.
If you are going to use static addresses on each device, then you could go directly from ETHERNET #1 TO ETHERNET #1 on each unit, but you'd only be able to access the interface using the wireless network.
If you want to be able to access the interface from another hardwired machine on the network, like a desktop computer, then you'd have to go the router/switch method.
If you're asking about something else specifically, let me know.
@@QuickEZ Thanks for the reply so what i want todo is run 2 ui24s one in front of stage being the master and one in back next to the drum set being the slave i have a 50ft cat6 cable runing from port 2 to por 2 on each other and the master has a wifi router. I haven’t test it but thats the plan on pay per. My next question is i cant load a different scene on the remote so the master can have a front scene and the slave a back scene is there a way around this?
Not much of an upgrade though really.
Sorry XIIMonkeys, I have to disagree.
From an XR 16…not an 18…it’s a massive upgrade.
The XR has 8 xlr inputs. The ui24 has 20.
The XR has 6 xlr outputs. The ui24 has 10.
The XR had no usb daw integration. The ui24 does.
That’s a huge step up.