ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ต.ค. 2023
- Comment down below if you have another unique way of using Cine EI Mode!!
Color graded with my S-Log 3 LUTs www.cammacky.com/store
🎥 Gear I Used In This Video (affiliate links)
1.Checkout All My LUTS & Presets ↠ www.cammacky.com/store
2. Sony A7CII ↠ geni.us/a7ciicam
3. Sony ZV-E1 ↠ geni.us/ZVE1Cam
4. Handheld Smoke Machine ↠ geni.us/smokegeniecam
5. Sony 40mm F2.5 ↠ geni.us/sony40mm
6. iPad Pro Cage ↠ amzn.to/3rzhSZB
7. FX3 OD Green Skin ↠ alphagvrd.com/collections/son...
🖍️ My LUTS and PRESETS
/*/*/*/*/*/*/*/*/\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\
🪶 Graded With My LUTS: www.cammacky.com/store/luts
🪶 Edited With My Presets: www.cammacky.com/store
🪶 Grain & Halation ↠ Use Code CAMHANCER for 10% Off www.dehancer.com/
🎵 Music:
/*/*/*/*/*/*/*/*/\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\
Get 70% off first year of Audiio Pro when you use my link: audiio.com/cammackey
Cactus Neon ↠ amzn.to/3LIZmo9
Alien Neon ↠ amzn.to/3LI98ae
🎥 Gear I Use to Make Videos:
/*/*/*/*/*/*/*/*/\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\
1. RED Komodo X ↠ geni.us/hvUD
2. Fav Anamorphics ↠ geni.us/TxY6LK
3. PL VND Adapter ↠ geni.us/dNVRi
4. Sony FX3 ↠ geni.us/Vy4kDB
5. Fav AF Zoom Lens ↠ geni.us/BKvLBdg
6. CF ExpressA 1TB ↠ geni.us/XVFZuT
7. DJI Ronin 4D ↠ geni.us/cp2bXWU
8. Fav Wireless Mic ↠ geni.us/PnizP
9. Complete Gear List ↠ kit.co/CamMackey
🎥 Gear I Use to Take Photos:
/*/*/*/*/*/*/*/*/\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\
1. Sony A7RV ↠ geni.us/TAOmIjD
2. Fav Lens ↠ geni.us/zQB3Qgn
3. Fav Photo Zoom Lens ↠ geni.us/zQB3Qgn
4. Fav Filter ↠ geni.us/b5zt
5. Complete Gear List ↠ kit.co/CamMackey
🤘 Follow Me:
/*/*/*/*/*/*/*/*/\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\
Instagram: / cammacky
⚡ Lights I Use to Make Videos:
/*/*/*/*/*/*/*/*/\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\*\
Fav COB Light ↠ geni.us/sIL0
Fav Compact Light ↠ geni.us/fxIiLU
My LED Tube Lights ↠ geni.us/OAux
Scrim Jim ↠ geni.us/gVxKQ - ภาพยนตร์และแอนิเมชัน
![[FULL EP.13] เซียนหรั่ง พา ไททศมิตร ลงเรือฝึกสกิลหว่านแห | เฮ็ดอย่างเซียนหรั่ง | One Playground](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/EWFuf2Av0K0/mqdefault.jpg)
Went to several 20min-long videos trying to explain CineEI and my brain was in pain. Saw this and understood everything, finally. Thank you so much!
I have to admit, I wasn’t using the EI settings properly and constantly underexposed my images in Slog3. Now that I’ve implemented this understanding into practice, my footage looks phenomenal. Thank you from the bottom of my soul good sir! 🤙
same here, I'm used to exposing for middle grey and using all your latitude up and down in post. Glad he made this video
Jeez someone finally explained this properly and in 7 concise minutes.
This is perfect! Our FX3 just came in and I’ve been researching the Cine EI tool. This method makes the most amount of sense to me and makes exposing your image so easy.
Seriously dude... this is the best video I've watched on CineEI. I finally feel like I get it!! Thank you for explaining and actually showing how this works.
Straight to the point with thorough visual examples! Thank you! x3
I've been struggling with the FX30. Exposure is way more tricky than with my Komodo.. Now I understand what I was doing wrong! Thank you. This was extremely helpful for me.
This was so nice to hear. I feel like everyone makes cine ei complicated but its really not with this explanation. Thank you!
Thank you! For the first time, I understood how to use it (despite watching so many other TH-camrs!)
Ffs finally it makes sense
Alister Chapman put out a video on it almost a decade ago.
Best video I've seen on it yet! Thank you
I've been using the FS7 for years and fully understand Cine EI. Just purchased the FX3 and you nailed this explanation! Come on Sony, easy firmware update to fix make everyones life a bit easier.
Thanks for this Cam! Just started using Cine EI a little more and this helps validate my usage of it.
I have not used it up until this point and now I will. THANK YOU!!!!
Thanks for this explanation. I use Cine EI all the time but usually just leave it at the base iso because the shifting thing didn't make sense to me. Now I'm gonna try it your way. Makes a lot more sense.
I had my FX30 then eventually move to FX3 as my main cam. Been using CineEI mode since FX30, but I've been using it wrong, just got aware of it when I got my FX3 and Atomos Ninja V for monitoring. I noticed that whenever I was changing the iso in the camera, nothing is changing with the exposure in my monitor. That's when I tried searching more about this topic. Kept studying until I understand it, but nothing helped. Eventually I bumped to your video and a lot makes sense now, like A LOT. I watched other videos regarding this topic and no one can explain it better as what you showed here. Really appreciate your time showing us how easy it is to use CineEI and make your footages better.
you truly understand, as you can explain in practicale language for even beginners! Thank you!
Love it! Finally an explaination that confirms me that, if you don't mind shooting with overexposed image on screen, you don't need cine EI ...
YUP!
Absolutely amazing, thank you so much!
As a photographer getting deeper into video, this makes complete sense now. Thanks! Other videos were describing cine ei like it was the bogeyman and to not use it. But this has helped me so much!
Thanks man!
As clear as day. Thank you man!
Thank you for the awesome video! Extremely helpful.
Amen. Love it brother 🎉
4:05 Cam, you are a genius! Amazing idea! Sony, please listen to this! Amazing video man
Thanks for explaining this I was totally confused before this video
Sweet video man! 🙌🏼
I have no idea what you meant by the second example of using CINE EI but the first way is how I’ve always used it.
this might only apply to the FX30 but I’ve tested the base ISO 800 and also just actually dropping ISO to where you want it and I’ve seen no difference in dynamic range. in fact the lower ISO’s are far cleaner - meaning, they say 800 has the most DR but if it does it’s nearly indistinguishable from 200, 400 etc.
Big fan bro! And yeah I remember people having this debate with RED all the time too. I think as long as your exposure looks good according to the ISO you’re good. I just prefer to use it how we use it tho for max control. Specify on jobs, im obsessive with making sure my highlights aren’t clipping whenever possible while boosting the exposure as much as possible. Before I used cine ei, there were multiple times I under exposed my image and didn’t have enough info in post to play with, which is why I started to use it this way.
But yeah my second example is basically using it how people use ISO on red cameras. So imagine you’re lighting a nighttime interior scene for ISO 800, you bring it into post and you’re kinda lacking some info to push the exposure around. Rewind. Set your RED camera to ISO (shooting in raw), you light your scene the same way but now you’re having to turn your lights up more to match the ISO400 exposure. Bring that into post, when uou set it to that middle ISO of 800 you all of a sudden has all this extra info to play with. So it’s more powerful for actual lighting setups for sure. But some people use it for natural light too. But you can use Cine EI mode in the same way cause the camera is still cooking in that ISO800 exposure but you’re just cheating the reference as if it’s RAW. The major different being on RED cameras we have the traffic lights and no matter what ISO you’re at you can see if any of your RGB channels are clipping, so it’s still a more useful trick on red raw vs Sony cine ei. Which is why I asked Sony in the video to give us an option to lock the exposure tools to the base cine ei iso
the dynamic range is the same, is just redistribute if the range is below or above middle gray, native iso just means the iso where as its same above and below
@@aleksanderhaugdal2060 well, no - a native ISO is a sweet spot for maximum dynamic range.
@@impatrickt didn’t you say in your original comment that you couldn’t see a difference in DR when dropping the ISO?
@@PhillipRPeck exactly, which is i find the whole cine EI think kind of weird
Wish sony would make it so changing the EI doesn't affect our exposure tools, would love to have the log signal the whole time.
Hey Cam,
Love the TH-cam channel and all the amazing content you create.
I would love to see two videos if you get the chance…
One on tips and tricks / settings / setup when working with a Red Komodo X and then also a proper workflow on the Komodo X.
I’m super curious how you conduct a run and gun shoot in daylight and how you then take that footage and mold it to your vision when the lighting isn’t always ‘fully’ controlled.
Thanks Cam!
;) stay tuned. But regarding strictly KX content, it doesn’t do the best on TH-cam so I ll have to how much time I can dedicate to covering it. I will try my best tho!!!
Nice, Cam...thanks for the great demo! And your setup makes it easy to follow. Which iPad app is that? Thanks!
This Def helps, was confusing for me but this helps clear it up. I recently picked up a Komodo so that helped me as well. Def gonna dedicate operating my fx3 in cine Ei moving forward.
Finally makes sense for me tks😊
I get it. I finally get it. Thank you sir!
Thanks a lot.. I jut got the FX6 and didnt know anything about CineEI and all my testfootage is noisy as hell. I loved it, because I kinda like the look, but friends were asking me what I was doing with the camera, because it is supposed to be good :D This video made me understand my mistakes and now I can use noise on purpose, not by accident. BTW the main reason I am commenting is, because I love the whole look (seems like Texas Chainsaw Massace 2) and that you even hazzed the background for a youtube tutorial. Very cool - love it and wish you a great weekend :)
I appreciate it!!! Thank you! And I like to try and have fun with my setups!
Hey Cam, sick video as always. Ive been trying to figure this out for the longest time. If you could could you go over what post production you do for audio that would be unreal cause you sound CRISPSYYY. I have the same DJI mics but always struggle with ambient noise. Thanks brother.
Sure thing!
I would love to see a video on this as well!
Hey Cam I usually expose right in the middle with my Phantom Lut. And have set my zebras differently for the rec709 image. Would the method be the same?
-Check zebras/exposure in 800 then check look in 400?
Also are you using any Lut or gamma assist to check your image on monitor? Thanks man love your channel 🥳
I'm so glad you said this. I made a similar video and people told me I was wrong. I tried the normal way and it was waaaay to noisy.
Great explanation! Wish you were using the C 70 again. Love your content and style!
The C70 was the only camera I like with canon, but the form factor I hated and felt like I was gonna break the thing haha
Lowering the EI will shift down the entirety of the DR available to the camera, favoring the shadows at the expense of the highlights. That was the biggest thing that helped me. At low base use EI 800, 400, or 200, in hi base use EI 12800 or 6400 if it's super dark or nighttime. Nice video Cam
Yes exactly! I try to not explain any of that tho cause that's what starts really confusing people. Again personally like keeping it as its base and being aware of the fact that sensors need as much light as possible to get a good image, without peaking your whites if possible. And then shitting the EI after
OP can you explain this in more detail? I don't quite understand. Why would you use 6400 in low light instead of going higher from EI 12,800?
@@bluenightskywhen in hi base, you are likely in a low light scenario, or nighttime scenario. If you switch from high base 12800 to 6400 what you are doing is shifting the DR to favor the shadows at the expense of losing highlight info. If it’s nighttime you have less highlight info and much more shadow info so basically you are allowing yourself more shadow detail in post to play with. The same idea applies in hi base or low base, if you want more shadow detail and dynamic range, shift the EI lower to get more shadow detail but just remember that you’ll lose a stop of detail in your highlights doing this so it’s not always the right thing to do. It depends on you scene. Hope that helps.
Great insight, thanks! What’s the monitor setup?? Looks nice 👌🏾
good video... what monitor is that? It allows you to control the camera settings?
amazing ! so how do you exposed for the windows in highlight with your method ?
Do you have a video on your fx3 settings and or what file format you shoot in?
Got hooked on Cine EI as soon as it came out and feel like a total idiot for not doing this sooner. Great idea.
On a side note, can tell that you used an AI denoiser for this video and it's making me a bit distracted as I'm listening. Something I've picked up while using AI denoisers is to add the original audio back in at a very low level just to fill in the small gaps that the AI creates between different vowels/consonants and sounds a little more human while keeping the strong pronunciations the AI creates.
Thanks for the vid!
As a a7s III user how I understand this is: set base cine EI iso 800 or 12800 in s-log3. Push the exposure as much as you can towards the highlights using aperture and/or ND’s. Then adjust monior exposure to taste by changing the iso. Which will only effect the monitor exposure and not the recorded one. Thats how you get the best exposure in post when you bring it down, avoiding noise, and correct exposure on the monitor when you record?
Correct! Just make sure you’re in the right Cine EI mode tho.
@@cammackeyThanks, first one to make sense when explaining it👍
@@cammackeyWould it be about the same if you record ProRes RAW on a ninjaV, start recording at base ISO and after you hit record lower the ISO?
Just want to add to this, base iso on A7s3 is 640... but otherwise thanks for the clarification
@@anhdo6859Yes that’s correct. My bad ☺️
I don't use a Sony, but I was curious. I shoot a z cam f6 and a ninja v. What I do is use a monitoring lut that appears a couple stops darker than it actually is. I use that lut most of the time for monitoring.
Also... what about using the atomos ninja that won't inheret the feed from the camera in regards to cine ei settings and then you can apply whatever luts you wanted that convert exposure. Also... I'm looking for good luts that do that. Can you recommend?
Would you have the same problem that you had with the aperture if you used a filter? Assuming Im outside with a Base ISO of 800, should I use the histogram to determine how high to set my filter?
Great tutorial! Thanks for it.
BTW, log was never meant for lifting shadows in post as this already happens during recording. Unfortunately, many people have this misconception and struggle with noise in the darks.
I disagree. Go talk to any pro colorist who work on big films.. they all say they do whatever it takes to get the image to look good. There’s no rules as long as it looks good. Don’t bog yourself with such silly things
@@cammackey Thanks for your response - I was just trying to provide a simple explanation to the many amateurs (like myself) who continue to struggle with Log-Footage and noise in the blacks when lifting those.
I fully agree with your comment re focusing on what makes things look good.
Keep on rocking - looking forward to you (re-)rise at YT.
@@joyoffilming9500 all good! I think the important thing here is that LOG is NOISY. We're getting the full potential of the sensor, that comes with noise. A lot of videos here on TH-cam dont go into the importance of using noise reduction. A lot of dynamic range tests actually aren't telling the full truth cause once the noise hits, they cut off the dynamic range readings.. but in post if you use even the most subtle noise reduction.. you get that extra dynamic range out of it. But yes, the trick to LOG on certain cameras is to push as much light as possible on to the sensor without clipping the highlights. That was you are giving the sensor as much info as possible to play with in post. They did the same thing in film but the difference was the way film rolls off in the highlight it keeps some color density and grain in the highlights. If you under expose film tho.. its the same thing, you get super grainy muddy results.
@@cammackey That's what I call personal engagement with a youtube's audience: response within a few minutes - awesome and I feel a great honor from this.
Btw, that's why I switched to HLG in recording on my S1H and my other tinyer cameras. The curve-bending is in the lights, with awesome leeway for overexposure, especially with the S1H. Yes, the color resolution in the highlights gets reduced by the log-compression - but, as an amateur I can live with it. And even better, all my grading trees continue working (I work fully color managed in DR with no LUTs)
Worth to mention: I watched a few of your YT videos more than a year ago, and the algorithm brought you up again to my attention in YT. And guess what - it was your very specific color grading that made my memories ring in less than a second. This time, I subscribed -:)
Great vid. Question : what kind of external monitor are you using that you can remotely control the FX6!? Didn't even know that was possible..
Monitor +
Thanks for sharing. Very clear. I know this might be a dumb question but what app are you using with your iPad Pro?
Not a dumb question! Monitor+ I prefer it over the Sony app
Hi there, How do you separate the exposure on the camera's display from ninja V? When I dial down the EI values on my FX3 the image on ninja V changes as well. I would really appreciate your help here!!!
It is absurd that the exposure tools aren’t locked to the base. This makes it hard to use cine EI when moving fast. I just looked at dailies from day one of a shoot I did with 2 fx6s and all of the footage is insanely dark, like.. too dark. Like.. I’m going to potentially get in trouble dark. Lol. On set I’m like damn these cameras are great, light, battery lasts forever, easy to move around, and now I’m up looking at black footage. 😡
Man I did the same thing on my first FX6 shoot. I used Neat Video plugin and the HDR wheels to bring it back. The blacks were clipped tho sadly.
What monitor do you use in this video? Is it used to directly control FX6's settings? :o
What app is that? does it work with the FX6?
Thouroughly confused. But thank you Cam for your efforts!
okay if you still have your FX6 PLEEEEEEEEEEEEASE do a update video review of the fact that Davinci (of all programs) allows resolve MXF cine EI files to be read as raw. You can change the iso, white balance etc in post now. You can even change the sharpness levels too. Even if it isn't a "true" Raw the program is doing a great job to give that feeling with some amazing results with the 4:2:2 color space. I just would love yours or Kofi's take on it since he can do it with the sony fx30 (Fx3 is the same situation) but he has to export the files from catalyst browse as an MXF file to get the feature. It would be a great video and I feel Davinci just helped give extra flexibility to a file format that definitely lacks in the "sexy name" department lol.
Isn’t over exposing 1 stop at 800 and then bringing it down to 400 the same as exposing correctly at 400 (1 stop over exposed). Also, is that an app you are using on your iPad? Thanks for the video!
If you’re in Cine EI, sure. But again, you’re not going to get an accurate exposure reading because Sony locks the tool to your ISO. So again, as I explained, if you have highlights that you want to save from clipping, and in 400EI it shows they’re not peaking.. in post they’ll be peaking. Which is why I set the exposure, using the tool, in 800, then shift the EI
So, to get it right: either outdoors or in a controlled environment, you set your Cine EI to "neutral" (meaning Base ISO 800), leaving your f-stop at the desired value, adjusting your lights or your ND and checking your exposure tools and then you dial down the Cine EI value, so that your monitor has a proper look? Thank you ❤
Bingo. I use it simply to reference what my image will look like in post.
@@cammackey you are the man 👏
fair enough
CineEI as a monitoring adjustment is the most reliable use of the tool. And when you use it to “trick” yourself into pushing the middle grey exposure either up or down, you’re asking for trouble at the extremes of the sensor. You can end up crushing more than you want or blowing out more than you want. You understand the limitations of EI far better than most.
Exactly. I always got a little bothered by how people generalize Cine EI. It can get a user into some trouble if they’re not made aware of what it’s actually doing.
Ots very encouraging to hear more people say a stop or 2. Csise hou go on youtube and all you hear is oh overexpose 1.7 to 2.0 but none of thst tskes into account differencea in skin tones or just in general what you may be exposing for in a scene. Its akso extremely tough to overexpose at night on the indie level. So to hear from a a sony rep, and a few other less well known youtubers thst clearly are professionals in their feild saying a stop of over exposure csn be enough depending on what your looking for in post os just very encouraging
YES! While there are general rules... you have to do whatever is best for your scene. Rules are just guidelines ;)
Quick one, is that an iPad, if so what app? Or is it an monitor, if so which one? Since you can can change ei easy
iPad Pro. App called Monitor +
@@cammackey I got that one, perfect..
I had the biggest issue trying to do this now before someone told me that resolve reads the footage as iso 400🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻 had to manually change in raw tab
I was wondering that the cine EI mode is not really shifting its dynamic range, which is not like what the RED raw actually is doing. CINe EI is pretending a proper exposure when adjusting the total amount of light into the sensor, but remaining six stops in high light and 9 in shadow relatively.
when I overexpose to 2 stops, it actually brings up the shadow in 2 stops that sensor can't see previously, but at the same time clipping 2 stops of highlights. In conclusion, if I use cine EI above or under the base IOS 800 in order to have my middle grey correct in the "monitor", I'm just about to decide whether to save more shadow or highlights. Am I misunderstanding?
You’re over complicating it. Changing the cine ei ISO doesn’t change how much dynamic range you’re getting on the sensor. It simply just shifts how you expose for middle gray.
So you only use Cine EI for overexposure and then bringing it down? What about in low light situations when you cannot add more light? How would you use Cine EI? I find that the second hase IOS for the FX3 at 12,800 introduces a lot of noise and even after bringing it down in post,it still looks kind of crumby. My natural instinct would he to use flexible ISO and raise the ISO from base 800 no higher than 3200 and then live with the results. Is that better than using Cine EI mode in hase 800 and just raising it in post to 3200? I think im confusing myseelf even more 😂
Higher ISO (on camera) = more info in high lights. Lower ISO (on camera) more detail on shadows. Don't forget that guys.
Here’s one… say I’m recording RAW at iso 400. In post I raise my iso to 800. I have conversion LUTS, RAW to Log for each iso. Which conversation LUT should I use? The iso400 LUT for what I recorded in camera or the iso800 LUT for what I changed it to? Also I think it’s important to understand and reference your cameras DR chart often which I don’t see many shooters doing.
Clarification… I’m recoding RAW cine EI at iso400
To me that’s over complicating the whole process. At iso 800 I have equal dynamic range of the low and high end, so I choose where to set my exposure. Then in post I know I have all the info I need cause I exposed accordingly. I test dynamic range by pushing the exposure to the edge of peaking and then see how much shadow details is left. Sony has some of the best in camera none raw dynamic range performance.
Also I’m raw it doesn’t matter as much, but the ISO just shifts how you expose. The hard part is the raw isn’t like traditional raw, at least from what I gathered. On red cameras, the sensor just sees light.. the iso 100% has no effect on how much light is gathered on the sensor.. it’s not the same story for these Sony cameras and external raw.
@@cammackey I just need to have my DR chart tatted on my forearm hahaha
Still learning how to best expose with RAW video.
Thank you for the response. 🙏🏼
Cam balances PYXIS 8 on two fingers, BlackMagic staff hit pucker factor 8.
Can you tell me if this is correct? You only have 2 Base ISOs that you can choose from in Cine EI. When changing the EI values in your camera you're not actually changing anything with the exposure of your real image file... it only changes how you see the image in your monitor. The reason to adjust your EI values are only for you to see how to adjust the exposure through lighting, ND, or Aperture, So if you want clean shadows you lower your EI value. This darkens the scene in your monitor and you realize you need to bring in more lights for your subject to be properly exposed because everything has gotten darker. Then when you bring this footage into your grading software all looks overexposed. But you'll just bring down the exposure to correctly expose your subject and your shadows will be clean! Is this correct?
can anyone tell me how to turn the histogram on in the fs7 monitor?
Maybe Cine EI makes sense on the cinema line but on A7S III ISOs 160 and 320 are cleaner than the base. I wouldn't use base for everything, it all depends on the situation.
Correct and incorrect. There’s a million ways to go about this.
What app are you using on the iPad to monitor?
Monitor +
This sounds like the good old "ETTR" but with extra steps haha
Sure, you can be a glass half empty type of guy and use ETTR and skip the rest and deal with a blown out screen 🤷🏽♂️
Thanks man, I have an off the wall question, is there anyway I can activate with a custom button click to quickly have the menus from my Sony A7IV on my external monitor and then back to not having it, sometimes in daylight I cannot see the little screen on the camera and need to check my ISO or settings quickly and then want my external monitor to show that and then back to normal. Kind of like you show in the first few seconds of this video, but I do not want it on all the time bc it eats up too much real estate on my external monitor?
Thanks, I would appreciate any help if that is possible...
Sorry brother but zero clue haha
@@cammackey what app were you using on that monitor?
How can i lock the internal exposure tools in Sony cameras so they are not affected by Cine EI?
can't
Hey Cam, how were you able to use Monitor+ with the FX6? I didn’t think it worked with the fx6.
Errrr idk. I looked it up and was able to connect. Couldn’t explain that even if I tried haha
@@cammackey hahaha damn!! I’ll have to give it another go!
@@waltdog177 yeah there’s a couple TH-cam videos on it. It’s confusing AF
Assuming I use it the way you use it, could i technically put the iso to 400 so the monitor shows what the image will look like after bringing the highlights down?
Another way to phrase my question i guess is… why not just keep your iso at 400 so your monitor always shows what you’ll see after bringing the highlights down?
Someone help me phrase my question cleaner haha! Thanks for the video!
So this is similar to the Red way of doing things, where the "traffic lights" are the key to getting your exposure as hot as possible without clipping any colour channels? Then treating the recording iso as a viewing level/guide look on set,, then going to town with the red raw files in post to really dial in the exact look? Kinda?
HAHA! I made this comment at 3:30, then you basically say something similar at 7:10. 😁
Hahaha yes. Tho, it’s not as powerful as reds actual system because we don’t any way of actually monitoring if the sensor is clipping on the FX3 besides with its exposure tools.. and the issue being that those tools are locked to the ISO changes
@cammackey thanks for clarifying Cam. I come from a red background, right back to the original red one. I shot some b cam on a rented fx3 a few months ago and didn't expose it high enough. Footage ended up a bit noisy. I'll definitely take on board the info in your video next time. Thanks for the awesome channel!
@cammackey I wonder of sony could add a sensor clipping gauge through firmware, while avoiding a lawsuit from Jarred and the boyz from red I guess!
Theoretically, if you shift down to 400 in EI for monitor sake and then expose normally by false color, shouldn't that be overexposed by the right amount once you get into post?
In theory yes, but again youre not getting accurate representation on whats really going on in the exposure.. I rather have 100% accuracy.
@@cammackey right so setting everything based on 800 then dropping EI to monitor
on the fx3 the iso is locked so you're saying just use the shutter and nd to compensate
There’s two cine EI modes. One locks it and the other lets you change the iso still but the the actual image isn’t being affected.
I understand this much better now, You have by far the best explanation and examples. Thanks, also what monitor is that, it looks awesome@@cammackey
And to think... i have been shooting weddings in CINE EI mode and had NO IDEA this is how it really works.... smh.... Thanks bruv.
First ✌🏾✌🏾
Second!
Whats the app you were using on that monitor by the way?
Monitor +
@@cammackey That is what I thought but how ere you projecting it to that Big monitor? and it looked wirelessly, or is that an iPad ? Thanks, looks cool And what iPad is that if it is, the iPad Pro? I tried Monitor plus last year on my iPhone but the disconnection problems was too much to even use it for more than 5 minutes...
@@ekphotography yeah that’s the iPad Pro haha
Okay that was super comprehensive and honestly made more sense than a lot of other cine EI videos. So. Just to summarize your usage
1.) set the base iso to 800 or 12800 (preferably keeping your scene over exposed)
2.) next change the exposure index to on your cameras monitor to a a stop or two under exposed so it can look properly exposed on the screen.
3.) do the same in post to get the look of what you recorded that’s not baked into your footage as cine ei shows you the options of what you can get look wise and allows flexibility to do what you need to in post.
But what’s most important and still rings true is that the footage should be over exposed by a stop or two for the best image to preserve your shadows. Now what I am still trying to understand is why would you ever try to over expose your screen at base 800 (moving your ei mode to 1200, 1600 etc.) instead of going to 12800 and bringing your EI exposure down a few stops to get a cleaner image? Are there any benefits? Like I could just experiment and do this myself but this is why TH-camrs like you kill the game.
For clarity I would add step 1.5) set your exposure.
And agreed. Some people swear by shooting at a higher iso for outdoors, so again in post none of your highlights will ever be clipped. I’ve tried that on my Komodo back in the day and it messed me up. My brain works better if I just have full control of the exposure and then just shift it in post. Thats just shifting it by a stop to the right tho. 12,800 is meant for a totally different thing. It’s a whole 4 stops brighter in exposure.
If you want to get the most DR in your highlights don’t shoot at base ISO which almost always favors stops below middle gray. Usually the last stop before the second noise floor offers the highest range above middle gray.
I disagree. Theres a dozen ways to skin a cat tho
@@cammackey Its true for every RAW and log format on the market. But if you're getting the results you're happy with and the client is happy, that's the most important thing.
so youre saying for the most dynamic range in the highlights, you should change your actual ISO, not EI, to 10,000?
@@WillJauregui changing the ISO on a sensor does not increase the dynamic range. At all. It simple shifts where your mid point is, which affects how you expose. Thats it. You won’t magically get extra stops of dynamic range.
@@cammackey yeah I didn’t mean total dynamic range, I meant allotment, like highlights get more of the range than shadows or vice versa if you deviate from the native isos
0:38 You're an amazing teacher but can you save the Motor Company?
lol huh?
Hi cam:-)
You the man.
I don't like Cine EI because I can't record 4k on my Ninja V while sending EI to it. I get the advantages of using it though.
so cine ei are just luts? Instead of confusing myself i just created a series of luts that are 0 exposure. +.5 over exposed. +1 stop over exposed. +2 stops over exposed. Then instead of changing the cine ei, i just use which ever monitoring LUT i know will be best in that situation.
I'm sorry I'm sure you tried to "dumb it down" as much as you can but the second example flew over my head.
Haha sorry about that. I skimmed over it cause i didn’t want to dig too deep on it. I like to jsut keep it simple personally
I don’t think you stuck the landing there bud. Kofi did a good job of explaining this a while back. He showed the redistribution charts and played back examples to show how the shifting dynamic range impacted the capture.
Hey bud, this was about how I use it with a short explanation on how others use it ;) Kofi's the GOAT.
Still confused
I over expose shooting on my Black magics.
Yeah it's good to practice that technique with all cameras. These sensors and even film NEED LIGHT to create an exposure. The more you give it the cleaner it gets.
@@cammackey over exposure just makes sense because once you color grade the image comes down anyways. Also, crushing the blacks gets rid of noise 😂
Yeah I'm not gonna fuck with Cine EI
This is a really complicated and unnecessary workflow from Sony. Really not well thought out AT ALL.
I highly disagree. I use it frequently. So much so I wish it was on my hybrid cameras too because of how handy it is when doing actual lighting
GAME CHANGER 🫡🫡