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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ธ.ค. 2024
- Just two years after Superstar Saga, Alphadream released a sequel with some pretty significant changes to the formula. Was this change in direction a good thing, or did it miss the mark?
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In the North American version of Partners in Time, Elder Princess Shroob has 3500 HP in her 1st phase and 3000 HP in her 2nd phase, making a grand total of 6500 HP. However, in the European/Japanese version, she only has 3800 HP total across both phases. That’s roughly a 71% health reduction.
Wish I had known that before playing the game, I beat it yesterday and it took ages.
Someones got their math wrong. 6500 is a 71% increase from 3800 and 3800 is a 42% decrease from 6500.
3800 HP is only 300 more HP than her American first phase (3500 HP), which, by the way, is almost DOUBLE the HP of the non-American versions (1800 HP).
Me as a Shroob Myself I Quitted Fighting The Mario Bros. Because of my 2 leaders have been destroyed. And yes I survived the War Yes You can also call me a friendly shroob Despite me Wanting To destroyed things in my head.
@@Tailsthefox564shroob
I kinda do like the idea that characters in the past has a sort of classic or outdated style or humor. Like the Hammer bros L33T speak is totally buried in a certain era, but since they appear in the past, it kinda justifies it. I actually wish they leaned into this a little more qith NOC dialogue leaning more into older slang and comedy tropes. But alas its fine as is
When the game released, that was a modern form of speaking. It wasn't considered "the past" because people actively spoke like that online...
i found the leetspeak hammer hammer bros fucking hilarious because my friend group and i speak in leetspeak and lolcat very often
If they remade partners in time, they might make the hammer bros speak in gen alpha slang
@@goomyiscute777 that'd be fucking sick ngl
@@goomyiscute777no, I want this to be recontextualized as a time capsule like some things in the TTYD remake now feel like. Such as the gaming toad kid still talking about GBA Fire Emblem: The Blazing Blade instead of Three Houses.
I love this game, but one thing I feel was a seriously missed mark was the fact that other than Peach's Castle, you don't time travel THROUGH any of the areas in this game. You should have been able to go to all these areas in the present day, and then time travel to them from there. It would not only have made the world feel larger and more interconnected, it would have actually added to the menace factor of the Shroobs by showing you what all these areas are supposed to look like, then what they'll look like forever if the Shroobs win.
that sound awesome tbh
Then everything would have the same style. Purple mushrooms everywhere, that would not be interesting. Them conquering everything in the past on the other hand, is.
This is A+ long-form review content. I can't wait to get the *inside story* on the next game.
That’s what he said
I’m in that weird camp where this is my favorite Mario and Luigi game
Same.
me too
Same. This is my favorite. It's also my introduction to the series
same! love this one
I'm in a weirder camp where this is my favorite game of all time
I like that both Toadsworth and E.Gadd are in this game. They were both big in the 2000s and then largely disappeared. E.Gadd still pops up thanks to Luigi's Mansion, but he's seldom seen in other games. Toadworth has almost been forgotten, but maybe 3D All Stars and the TTYD remake will convince Nintendo to bring him back (the poor fools even cut him from the Mario Movie, which would've been a great place to see him return).
Something I always liked in this game aside from the darker theme were the credits! They were less of a happy conclusion and more a waltz of memories. The music was more somber and serenading while the imagery was a bunch of artistic recreations of key events within the whole game! It really made finishing the game truly worth the trouble when we get to revisit the best moments of the game through an artistic point of view.
Same i love that
I'm that guy whose favorite Mario & Luigi game is Partners in Time.
Mine too. Came out during the beginning of my 7th grade year. Good memories.
Same here.
AlphaDream would have been better off remaking this game as their last game on the 3DS because there is a lot of things that they could have changed to match the same standard that Bowser’s Inside Story set for the DS. When remaking Bowser’s Inside Story, there wasn’t much to change to fit the 3DS’ functionalities, hence why it didn’t sell well, here however, doing stuff like adding more touch control during the battles with stuff like Battle Cards or a Battle Spinner would’ve made a big difference.
Honestly, I'm glad they skipped to Inside Story. I don't like Partners in Time and I certainly would've skipped it if they remade it, given my experience with the game.
@@No-Ink boooo
I wish they had made this game as well. It's my favorite in the series.
@@No-InkAgreed. Partners in Time is one of the worst games I have ever played, and that game doesn't deserve a remake, especially considering how brutally difficult it is and how much I despise Elder Princess Shroob.
Note: I only despise this game because I was severely underleveled when I played it.
If they didn’t get bankrupted, Partners in Time would work well on the Switch. The only DS features it really used was the dual screen, which most of the time was a map. They can make the map smaller. The 1 stylus section they can either use motion control or touch screen
44:37 My headcanon is that Younger Princess Shroob is just a much better strategist than her elder sister and Peach actually did the shroobs a favour by trapping her in the Cobalt star.
You know what, I’ll adopt that headcanon too. Anything to give my waifu a one-up over her far inferior elder sssissster.
@@MyNaymIsSnek1526thats not headcanon. Thats just true.
Princess Shroob, a genocidal tyrant, is proven to be at least hightly intelligent (if not genius level)
@@HedgeHero0236 Probably my favourite bitsss about what you sssaid are 1. The OP of the comment we’re replying on sssaid it wasss their HC in the firssst placcce, and 2. You didn’t acknowledge me calling Younger Princccesssss Shroob my waifu.
@@MyNaymIsSnek1526 3. IDGAF
A psychopath that tortures and feeds people to beasts to kill them is your beloved.
One problem partners in time has is that the american/NTSC version is balanced... not balanced, actually. Enemies have way too much HP.
The european(PAL) and JP versions are actually very different. Bosses can have as little as half the HP of their NTSC counterparts, but they usually gain new gimmicks.
PAL is the better version overall.
This is one of my absolutely favourite childhood games. First game I got on my original DS
Partners in Time is literally if the Mario and Luigi series had the plot of Chrono trigger
M&L 2 was genuinly scary.... and I loved that!
And yes: the story only makes sense if it is an entirely different timeline/world. Otherwise, they would know about the Shroobs in the past obviously. Don't get why Nintendo did not realize that plothole xD
I love how Shroom-Bowser's stats are basically infinite, infinite DEF infinite HP infinite speed, except for his damage. Imagine he would one shot everyone^^
2:41 - I imagine the main reason was because BIS was their best selling game at that point.
So they probably figured it'd be the best chance to save themselves by remaking that instead.
without remembering that the game already works on a 3ds via backwards compatibility (Superstar Saga made sense because it was for the gameboy advance and couldn't be played on a 3ds, it could be played on an original ds and a ds with the gameboy slot but ds's without that gameboy slot it couldn't be played)
39:54 Mate, when something isn't consistent, it's called *_variety._*
Hey, just wanna say I've been binging your Mario RPG retrospectives and they're all excellent videos. That said, I feel the need to defend Partners In Time's honor a bit, as I personally enjoy it almost as much as Superstar Saga and feel it has a WAY better narrative structure than Bowser's Inside Story (which I'm about to watch your review on). I think Partners in Time gets a bad rep because people are overly fixated on its linearity, and formulaic McGuffin collecting structure, but I don't think people appreciate how free flowing and variety-filled the narrative manages to be within that structure. First of all, despite the interconnected world of Superstar Saga, it is still an incredibly linear game with essentially no reason whatsoever to backtrack anywhere, which makes the open world do very little to complement its actual design. Additionally, in addition to obvious points of narrative interest (such as each area having a unique and compelling scenario), the plot is surprisingly twisty. Early on, the Bros are forced to join forces with Bowser because both sides are being overwhelmed by the Shroobs. Then Bowser decides to make a competition out of the Cobalt Star shard hunt, even going so far as to steal the first 2 pieces from you. Then you rescue Peach weirdly early, only for a clueless Bowser to kidnap her back, and then it's revealed that wasn't even the real Peach. Then the BROS are essentially kidnapped by the Shroobs, and then it turns out that the Cobalt Star was purposely shattered by the real Peach because it was sealing away the Elder Princess Shroob. The "spirit" inside the Cobalt Star was actually this Elder all along, and has been tricking you into freeing her throughout the entire adventure.
This should go without saying, but Mario RPGs haven't had narratives half this complex and involved in like 10 years, arguably more if, like me, you think that Bowser's Inside Story isn't really as well-written. BiS is a fantastic game, and it's still leagues above any of the modern Paper Mario games both narratively and mechanically, but I've always felt that its premise was much stronger than its actual plot structure. I think that just as people get negatively distracted by the Timeholes and undisguised linearity of PiT, they get positively distracted by the fact that you get to play as Bowser and Fawful is the main villain of BiS. BiS makes better use of the open world than SS does since both Bowser and the Bros explore it, but that world itself is so bland that it borders on Sticker Star levels of aesthetic design. Additionally, there essentially are no unique and interesting scenarios outside of Bowser and Peach's castles. Bowser just passes through each area - encounters like Monsieur Broque and the Wiggler aren't a fraction as interesting or compelling as the scenarios in SS or PiT in my opinion. Overall, the narrative has a couple of small surprises here and there (the shift to a quest for Star Cures, actually fighting Bowser after the Bros escape his body, the Dark Star copying Bowser's DNA), but is way less involved and interesting than the one in PiT.
TLDR, PiT is almost as well written as SS and WAY better-written than BiS in my opinion, but this is a perfectly fair review. BiS has slightly more fun moment to moment gameplay imo, but the difference in narrative quality is so great that I honestly prefer PiT in a few areas despite being a gargantuan Bowser fan. Superstar Saga is still the king though
I think the problem with Partners in Time is the time travel itself. It feels like the game doesn't follow the rules of time travel, as the actions and events in the past don't seem to alter the present or future in any meaningful way. In fact, the game implies the Shroobs attacked the Mushroom Kingdom in the past when Mario and Luigi were still babies, so shouldn't this mean the Shroobs have taken over the present as well? That right just kinda doesn't make a lot of sense from a narrative perspective, and what is often called a plot hole.
So, what I would do is have the Shroobs attack in the *present,* where Mario and Luigi try to fight them off, but are easily overwhelmed and then tossed into the time machine E. Gadd made. The time machine would then take them into the past, partially breaking as well due to various circumstances, where Mario and Luigi would then meet their younger selves and join forces to find a way to secure the Mushroom Kingdom's future. I know this would require an *intensive* amount of rewriting, but I think this is a better premise from a logistical standpoint, in my opinion.
I feel the reason people like BiS so much is because of Bowser’s character. He’s always been the funniest character next to Luigi, and he adds a unique flavor to the game, even if the things around him are rather bland.
I don’t know if you knew this but when you use the fire and ice flowers you can use the x and y buttons to throw the balls at airborne enemies with the babies. I figured it out during the Petey Piranha boss fight. Personally I wish more of the items did that, had extra effects when all 4 brothers were in battle together.
But all of the items DO have extra effects when the 4 characters are in a battle together... Usually in the form of being able to press the Baby buttons on top of the Adult buttons for extra damage.
I do think all items have an extra effect if 4 bros are in battle. Except for Cannonballer, Trampoline, Copy Flower and Mix Flower because they require all Bros:
- Green/Red Shell: Baby button to deal more damage.
- Fire/Ice Flower: Deal Damage to Flying enemies
- Smash Egg: They change the timing to deal more damage with next hit (Baby -> Adult -> Baby -> Adult...)
- Pocket Chomp: Deal extra damage. If incorrect button is pressed, Chomp goes faster.
I've played this game many times ever since I was like 5 and I never knew about this honestly
The fact you bought the Mario outfit just for the gag is some dedication to the bit. Love it!
I really wish this game got remade....
same
I really liked your review! One thing I feel compelled to note is that enemy HP in this game is different between the NA and PAL/JP versions of the game. Glaringly, most of the Boss HP is inflated in the NA release. For example, none of the phases in the final boss went *above* 2000 HP overseas, while none of the phases went *below* 3000 in the US. I have no idea why they did this.
The NA version was released first, while the other regions got the game second and at that point the game had seen a few revisions, including rebalancing the HP values to be more sensible.
11:46
Having been born in 1997, I was more of a 2000’s kid, but even I think the “LEET” speech is, while not terrible, is whatever.
Great video! I wanted to comment briefly on my theory for why there were lot of changes with Superstar Saga stuff, like the area dungeon structure, hub area, bros items vs moves, even things like villain group vs specific villains, etc etc. I think, since this game was made relatively close in time (ha!) to Superstar Saga, I think that Alphadream was experimenting with what worked better overall for the series. In BiS you can see what they took from that, and it was larger Superstar Saga stuff, like Bros Attacks, more minigames, more connected worlds, specific villain etc. I think Partners in Time was an experiment, and while a lot of stuff didn't pan out, it still is a very unique game in the series worth playing. Also just saying, if you didn't like the tutorials in this game... you are NOT gonna like how Dream Team handles it, I just hope you'll be able to see past that very big flaw when you cover that game, it's probably my favorite personally.
One bad experience I did have with the game near the end tho was with Elder Princess Shroob one time. When I was first playing through the game I was having a TON of trouble beating her last phase. So on one run, I beat Young princess shroob, and elder phase 1, was doing well on phase 2, then I dropped my DS. The ds was fine. However, the game itself? Frozen. I had to redo the younger and elder phase 1 again cuz of th
23:39 the fact that thwomps are built into this area makes me feel uneasy... Makes me realize Thowmp King from 64 was right. We DO step all over them :O
I’m not sure if they were built rather they were just part of the volcano and the king in 64 is a whomp not a thwomp.
For some reason the algorithm doesn’t like to recommend your videos, so I had no idea this video and the bowser’s inside story video were out yet. So excited to binge these
This was the first game in the series I played and while I have a lot of nostalgia for it, I still admit it's one of the weaker entries. The biggest issue I have and one that is very rarely brought up is that it doesn't actually feel like a time travel story. Take away the younger versions of the characters you meet and you really just visit the invaded areas, do stuff there and leave. None of them look like they take place in the past since we don't know how different they look in the present. Shroob castle could easily be just on the other side of Toad Town and you could even avoid Peach's castle having to have the same size and layout.
I ran through all of your retrospectives so quickly. I appreciate the hard work you put into all of these!
Nice! Dude, I just subscribed to you after binging all of your Paper Mario reviews! Your content is top-notch, keep it up.
50:06 Why is that an issue though? In other M&L games, you can totally run out of special points for attacks as well and have no items to replenish them in order to use special moves… Having them as items just makes it less complicated than managing attack points for 4 different playable characters. You can always go to the shop in Peach’s Castle to get more items! The same way you’d get syrups to replenish your Bros. Points in other games…
I jokingly like to imagine that AlphaDream skipping this game for getting the remake treatment was the karma that resulted in their bankruptcy.
Funny enough, they actually did get Karma. Not for skipping partners in time, but the workplace abuse
To be fair, isn't the player always running the risk of running out of moves in the previous game by making the bros movies consumable in BP and only making them restorable through syrup?
In the context of a single fight, sure. But with mana systems, after a big fight I can go to an Inn or etc. to heal up and have all my mana back, doing that doesn't restore consumable items you spent and it's likely to take a lot more money to buy them back.
True but the primary distinction is that because you can use syrup for every move one syrup is roughly equivalent to buying one or more of every item. It's just more resource friendly in principle but I think partners in times item system works fine due to how plentiful they are.
this is my favorite ds game
yeesh, if you think those tutorials are annoying, wait till dream team, its weird cus otherwise the game is just as good as bis, but MAN they treat you like youre stupid.
I am stupid tho
A fun fact about this game: When AlphaDream was developing it, they had no idea what the console they were making it for would actually be like, except that it had four face buttons and two screens. Their "development kit" for a while was literally just a GBA, a GBA SP, and a Super Famicom controller all linked together. This past can be seen all over the game, with how it focuses on using the face buttons and the screens, while only using the touch screen for one minor moment near the end of the game.
This one is the best entry in the series, i really can’t understand why ppl don’t like it.
Ngl, the L33T speak gets more and more funny as the years go by lmao
Damn you deserve more views. The quality is wild and great voice
Was listening to this while making lunch for work, and was enjoying it greatly. Then I looked down and saw the Player Pin mark in the background. As a TWEWY fan who uses that design for so much stuff in other games.. you have my respect. XD
Seriously though, great video. I'm hitting subscribe.
I never ran out of Attack Items when I played this game as a kid, since I bought a ton of them in the shop. From what I remember, the game throws a TON of coins at you.
I love partners in time, most underrated in the series in my opinion. Such a good game
Despite its flaws, this will always be my favorite Mario and Luigi game, mostly due to nostalgia I'll admit. I loved it as a kid and was devastated when one day, I lost my copy. I was at the final boss and had yet to beat her. I don't know how I didn't find it, but I would search my room all the time and I never found. It was only a few years later when my mother was helping me clean my room that she found it and I was able to finally finish the game. Very happy memory for me.
The leetspeak bit was very different in japanese. They used katakanas instead of hiro/kanji, which usually is done to denote foreigness or "something different/robotic" we deff got tbe better joke
2:02 boy do I have news for you
After playing through partners in time, I realised why it wasn't remade. It would've been a bitch to not just remake the game but also retrofit it with the mechanics that were introduced in bowser's inside story and used in following games, including the superstar saga remake.
The worst thing this game did was give me a crush on the younger Princess Shroob, who still has so little fanart due to the game's relative obscurity.
Alright i am here because Nintendo announced super Mario rpg aka the rumored beloved snes remake. How do you feel?
I actually thounght the hammer Bros we're talking like robots
Here I was going to say that I didnt run in the "running out of bro items" issue and the stalemate in the final battle when I beat the game when I was, like 13-14?
But, as many other people pointed out, the final bass has almost double the hp in the us than in europe/japan (european here). So... If I recall a long and hard battle, I cannot imagine what it must have been for you.
The reas9n alohadream skipped it is because bowsers inside story sold the most copies by a kanslide so theyd assume something similar would happen
Watched this whole video and man this felt like classic TH-cam Nintendo videos, can’t wait to see more
I’m actually let’s playing this game right now I love your videos
30:33 I've grinded my way to level 47 in Superstar Saga, 55 in Bowser's Inside Story, 50 in Dream Team, and 60 in Paper Jam. I've also grinded in this game, and I have to say that at least from my experience I had the most fun grinding here. The battle system sure isn't perfect, but the snappy and consistent action commands combined with a wide variety of enemies in Shroob Castle provide the best grinding experience out of the series.
I enjoy this game for its unique and original ideas. I think my biggest issue is the linear stages being accessed via a hub world. I preferred having an open world to explore in the first game
I think this might be my favourite Story in the series, potentially overtaking BiS
My headcanon is that this takes place not long after the end of the first Yoshi's Island. After being rescued the babies are taken to the castle for a playdate...
We need more of this
09:24 That walcc cccycle tho…
this game is my favorite one
2:06 Guess we’ll be finding that out soon now, lol.
Honestly my favorite Mario & Luigi
While I do not share a lot of the criticism that you have with the game (but I might be blinded with a lot of nostalgia here), I really appreciate you talking about this game and the entire Mario & Luigi franchise a lot. This series doesn't get enough love and I'm so happy everytime a video about this (maybe forgotten) series comes out. Thank you!
This was my first Mario RPG I ever played. I had no idea about RPG mechanics so always struggled with this game. Especially that final boss
Personally, some of the things here I don't fully agree with and stuff I feel was glossed over. You can read the first big paragraph regarding the battling system, specifically the Bros Items and Grinding. Second paragraph is about story stuff I just felt like talking about. You can skip either paragraph or read both. No hard feelings, just my opinions.
So, to start off I wanna say that the implementation of Bros Items is definitely not the same as say Stickers and Cards from the Paper Mario series because in those games that is the only way to attack. While in this game you can still attack with your basic jumps and hammers. I understand where you're coming from, and I can see the similarities, but I feel like that small difference can make all the difference. But let's say that they did have Bros Attacks with BP in this game instead, you'd have to keep track of all 4 of the BP stats from the Big Bros and the Baby Bros. Not to mention some of the attacks get stronger when all Bros are together, so would those attacks cost more BP? Since the Babies generally have lower stats than the Big Bros does that mean their BP would suffer as well? Or how about which attacks belong to which Bros or PAIR of Bros? Having the Babies use BP stats would make their solo fights less bearable since you wouldn't be able to use as many of your Bros Attacks to get through the fight a little faster. Overall, I definitely prefer the idea of Superstar Saga Bros Attacks in general compared to what the rest of the games end up doing. But in this game, I think this was probably the best thing they could do for simplicity's sake. As for the consumable part of the items and grinding, I personally never found any problem with it. Even at the final boss I had like 25-40 of each item, and that was with me not spending as much as I would've liked to and also using those Bros Items in normal battles. I also feel like with how common Bros Items are and how easy they are able to be obtained, that I found myself having more fun with this game because I actually got to use the Bros Attacks that make battles more engaging more often than the other games. Speaking of normal battles, I am one who will often battle every enemy I see in an area just because battling is so fun. But I never actually had to grind my level up, matter of fact I was a bit over-leveled heading into the Final Boss. The games are designed that if you take everything that they give you, you should be fine. But if you skip a lot of the enemies in favor of moving along the story, then I could see why you'd have to grind a lot near the end. After all the game rewards you for exploring and for not skipping the enemies early on. Of course, a lot of that is my experience and opinion, but I have only ever played Partners in Time once and so what I have said is regarding my first experience of the game.
As for the story, I feel like some things were talking about briefly but not in its entirety. Like I know you talk about the music giving some of the best tones for the area you're in, and that you can see the devastation of the world around you that the Shroobs have caused sticks with you throughout the game. But I feel like the biggest thing about the story, particularly at the end isn't really talked about all that much. For one the music that plays over Elder Princess Shroob's second phase is called "Another's Requiem". In laymen's terms (how I understand the meaning) a Requiem is a song played at a funeral. The meaning behind the song's name and the game as a whole is two races fighting for their lives for the right to survive. Yea we see the Shroobs do some evil stuff and take pleasure in doing so but imagine seeing your beloved leader defeated by one of the residents of the Mushroom Kingdom, of course it makes sense that these twisted creatures would take pleasure in seeing the Mushroom Kingdom fall. They love their leader so much that in the final battle THEY WILL LITERALLY KAMIKAZE just to try and stop you from beating Elder Princess Shroob. They are sacrificing their lives for any chance to have their whole race live on. Probably the deepest part is that Elder Princess Shroob is with you on your entire journey, we see the devastation that the Shroobs caused but she is also forced to see us eliminating her people one by one, see a future where they canonically failed and their race is dead, WATCH AS WE KILL HER SISTER while she can't do ANYTHING about it. While Elder Princess Shroob is definitely not in the right, her feelings are kind of warranted and you can really almost understand the kind of pain she's going through. Well, as we defeat the Final Boss with "Another's Requiem" playing, the game's ultimate meaning is about a climactic battle that decides of fate of two races. One will survive, and the other will fall. This game sure is dark, but I feel like this video doesn't really go into HOW dark it actually is. And there's so much more to talk about like the fate of the Toads that had their Vim absorbed fully, you can literally see the souls of toads in the Vim Factory itself. Were they dead? I mean the end of the game seems happy and all, but that only really cleaned up the Shroob Shrooms around the place, they didn't really say if they managed to take the Vim out of the ships (that we helped destroy by the way) and revive all the Toads. It seems ironic as we literally traverse the present-day Peach's castle, but the fate of these individual people isn't really clear. Well at the moment I can't think of anything, so I'll stop before I remember something to not make this comment EVEN bigger than it already is.
But yea, those are some of my thoughts regarding this game. Some things I agree with, other things I don't, and some others are a little complicated than just "agree" and "disagree".
That game is one of my favorite DS games, it's the darkest Mario game, very underrated.
It was my first Mario and Luigi game
I have SO many great memories about this game
although the health pools of the bosses ARE quite large in partners in time, like in any m&l game, if you just focus nearly all of your bonus stat points into POW and if you know what your doing during specific boss battles/can perform the theoretically infinite bros. attacks well enough, those health pools will look a LOT smaller
the fights can be made even EASIER to beat with either of the two badges that VASTLY increases the damage of bros. attacks at the cost of using multiple of the bros. item for every single use
also No Stuffwell Slander, To Shroob Castle With You
Don't have to wait long to figure out how a Mario and Luigi game would play/designed for switch LOL
I actually recently beat the game and elder shroob took so long to beat, but only two full attempts. Luckily did around 400 damage with the copy flower and once I realized I had to attack her legs followed by her crown, I was golden. I used the mix flower to break her defenses (arms and legs) before going for the crown and doing massive damage to her. It was about an hour and a half long battle but I beat her in just two attempts around lvl 26~28 I cannot remember exactly. Oh yeah and I didn't have either special badges equipped
Now I don’t know if I’m the only one that thinks this, but I think that the Bros Items were going to be for both the Adult and Baby Mario Bros. For Mario and Baby Mario, they would get the Red Shell, Bro Flower, Pocket Chomp, Cannonballer and Mix Flower, while Luigi and Baby Luigi would’ve gotten the Green Shell, Ice Flower, Smash Egg, Trampoline and Copy Flower. I think that Alphadream were going to make those individual Bros Attacks for the Mario Bros and their Baby selves but it could’ve gotten scrapped and they just turned the Bros Attacks into Bros Items.
For the first half of the game, I didn’t even realize that you could choose other stats to level with that spinning wheel thing. So it leveled exclusively health until I realized the error of my ways once I accidentally pressed down on the d pad… this explained why it felt like my damage output was horrific lol
But after I realized I set about grinding this game senselessly. Add on the fact that it took about two hours of straight grinding to try and get that top-tier overall equipment form the last dungeon, and I was completely overpowered for the end unintentionally.
And for the record, this was my first M+L game lol. It was in my backlog and I used a roulette spinner and it gave me this one, so I played it. Fine enough game. But at least I know that there’s greater titles ahead in this series!
Holy shit i just realized something:
The Mario and luigi games are just brighter turn based soulslites
We never get to see Toadsworth worry at 11, but then again, he spends most of the game worrying
I never got the chance to play this myself, so I can't be 100% sure on this, but I actually think I would have preferred itemized bros moves. With the BP system I have to do some attacks, waste a turn restoring BP, repeat. This way at least I don't need to essentially skip a turn every now and then. After all, what's the difference between needing to collect syrup, and needing to collect bros items?
Great video!
This is still my favorite in the original 3.
The darker tone, the music, worlds, etc.
Love it.
Remember, you quite literally committed genocide in the end
Also, i would never have noticed the HP difference for enemies in the NA release if people weren't complaining.
Unless you just dont know how to play thr game, it really isnt ther big of a deal lol. Especially since you should have at least one member with the badge thst gave you infinite items.
i personally love this game. it was the first game i played on my first console ever when i was 6 years old. i could sadly never finish it becase my ds broke and when i sent it in they lost the game and gave me bowsers inside story instead.
This one is the best of the series.
Not really agree but i can see the points in this. To be truthful i much prefer this story even if the gameplay ended up being a little repetitive compared to sleeping through 3/4 of the game like i did in Superstar Saga. I don’t really understand the final boss thing…. I mean, i played this like 10 times and arrived at the end with more than needed items without buying any, though you said you had problems using some to their full potential so it might have been that.
Overall this was a nice review, good job!
31:58 this is a *positive* feedback loop, not a negative one :)
negative loops serve to rebalance the current situation, positive ones are snowball effects (both in a negative and positive way)
This one’s my favorite
Time travel stories CAN make sense, but there aren't many that do. One of the only (and best) examples I can think of is Steins;Gate
I don't think the rant about the game's linearity is good at all, PiT is the most weakest on that aspect but both Bowser's Inside Story and Dream Team are lineal and people love those games
Reasons I, at least at the time (I haven't played it in years) considered it inferior to Superstar Saga:
The Bosses -
Superstar Saga are almost all completely unique (Tolstar, Ho-oh Dragon, Queenbean, Chukolamater, Cackletta, Fawful, Piranha Egg thing, Trunk, Hermie (The Christmas Tree Hermit Crab), Poppel & 'Rookie', etc etc)
Meanwhile, though PiT has some unique bosses, due to focusing on an alien race, they fall into the trap where at least 3 of the bosses are basically recolours with minor differences (Shrooboid, Junior Shrooboid, Elder Shrooboid), there's some unique moments, such as the Bowser + Jr tag battle. Yoob is pretty memorable, but most of the bosses are there as an excuse to be 'another alien enemy' with an excuse to use the flying saucers for the dual screen DS capabilities.
Abilities -
I know they had to split the abilities to Mario & Luigi, AND, Baby Mario & Baby Luigi
I just wish they gave the babies NEW moves, and let the brothers hold the old moves
Removal of the Firebrand/Thunderhand style abilities is also an unfortunate miss and feels bad to anyone coming to this sequel from Superstar Saga.
The Bros Abilities in Superstar Saga are therefore incredibly well executed, having both the customisable BP cost (based on the difficulty of execution, altering the number of frames you get to push the correct button, as well as removing the prompts) on TOP of the fact that if you perfect the Bros Move, you unlock an alternate version of the attack if you use a different button combination, that has different effects.
PiT just replaces this genius with... items... just repetitive items... that you have to buy... or find... yay... fun!
Everything else is pretty much the same but it just feels more repetitive compared to Saga.
I disagree with the bros attacks being genius. I think they’re actually pretty unintuitive.imo, Having the practice mode cost more bp actually discourages new players to try using bros attacks and having a slow version isn’t good because players would get too used to that speed and mess up the faster versions.
That was a great review! I forgot to comment in the last video but in my opinion the gap between Superstar Saga to Partners in Time for me is very big. Superstar Saga is my 2nd favorite Mario Rpg and Partners in Time was my 2nd least favorite. This is mainly because I never played any games or remakes that released on the 3ds and Wii U since I don't own those consoles. But Partners in Time flaws for me really outweighs the positives like you said; the battles as a whole are a massive downgrade, the bros items leave a lot to be desired and they can be very monotonous, since almost all of them are infinite plus they are so basic, I liked to master all the button combinations for the Bros Attacks in Superstar Saga and another thing that Partners in Time that feel so monotonous are the items, they nerfed so much of the items and its healing properties just for no reason, there is like no Max Nut substitute.
Also did you noticed how rushed the game feel in its story? When you are at Star Hill, the third to last area of the game you only have 3 shards but when you finish Star Shrine the second to last area, you have *5 shards* ! Like, this has to be the worst mac-guffin in any Mario Rpg, the first shard is not even guarded by a boss, everything involving this stupid star is a mess.
Also the worlds feel dull, with almost no characters in it, what happened to the fun, loveable cast of the previous game? Its almost like the game is like the the latter Paper Mario games with only generic Toads for the Npcs. Yeah there is Kylie Koopa, the 3 Unique Toads (Iko, Bert and Toadsworth), E. Gadd and Fawful but thats about it. The game tone sure is dark, but dark doesn't mean restricting the amount of npcs and having no sidequests at all.
I don't hate this game, but I can't shake off this feeling that this game is very shallow and I would want to play Superstar Saga again any day over this game.
This game needed the remake. Not Inside Story.
I beat the 3 Princess Shroob fights in a row easily. Lucky Badge A, Rough Badge, Red Pepper, Mix Flower.
I beat each form in 4-5 hits, and took me about 20 minutes total. I don't know how some people spent over an hour on the final battle lol.
It makes sense why the HP pools were expanded because Princess Shroob would have easily gone down in 2-3 hits.
Depends on a lot of things
Princess Shroob, like many other fights in Partners in Time is super harsh if you can't do damage fast enough since the forcefield/tentacles will keep regenerating.
Elder Princess Shroob in particular is a huge difficulty spike in attack timings and general power. Besides having challenging attacks, she can get multiple attacking turns in the same turn since the arms, feet, and head all get their own turns. If you mess up and waste time reviving the bros, or you can't kill the tentacles quickly, you're in big trouble. Making matters worse is that these two problems can compound since reviving the bros means you're spending turns not dealing with the body parts and losing your Red Pepper buffs. If you can kill the tentacles fast, the fight is OK. If you can't, the boss becomes immensely difficult.
The Rough Badge increases damage done by 1.5x, which is quite a lot, so combining those with mix flowers is a winning strategy, especially if you're well leveled. There are only a few badges in the game that increase your attack power, so if you don't have one you'd be at a big disadvantage.
I can't stress enough just how good damage badges are though. The Dire Pow Badge increases damage by 2.5x if you're at 25% or lower HP, the highest multiplier in the game except for the Risk Badge with 0 mushrooms in your inventory (which is 3x). I've played low level runs where I can wipe out bosses in the blink of an eye because this badge is so good, although it's very hard to use against Elder Princess Shroob since you get fully healed before her fight and it's not easy to lower your hp safely to 25% against her second form if you die. The Dynamic Badge/Dynamic Badge A, which increase attack power by 1.5x/2x at the cost of using 2 or 4 items in a turn, actually end up paying themselves off quite well because having a higher attack power means using less items on not only the boss itself, but having to deal with less shield phases too. Considering how plentiful items are, the Ulti Free Badge is actually a huge scam since you get free items but no damage boost.
PiT is my FAV.
great video man
I love this game despite it being considered the 'meh' title in the franchise. The story was dark, the music was amazing, the dialogue was stop drawer.
I personally actually really loved Stuffwell and always thought he was a funny and had a cute design. The gameplay was amazingly refined. It's just that some of the puzzles are serious bs.
All that aside, I'd still say that this is one of the best DS games out there and definitely my 2nd favorite Mario RPG - bested only by Superstar Saga
If I had to hazard a guess as to why PiT didn't sell so well, it might be the inclusion of the Baby characters. I can't emphasize enough that Baby Mario was one of the least liked, most despised things that Nintendo ever created, being one of the few things people didn't like about Yoshi's Island and how irritating his crying was in that game. Now imagine an RPG with not just him, but also Baby Luigi and Baby Peach in it. Throw in a grossly incompetent dickhead like Toadsworth + E Gadd and you have a game that is painfully dated to its time. There's a reason why they stopped putting those characters in games aside from E Gadd in the Luigi's Mansion sequels. Not even including things like the Hammer Bros' L33T speak or anything like that. And I say this as someone who loved Partners in Time, liked it more than either Superstar Saga or Inside Story.
For anyone willing to play this game, I recomment the European version because they owered the bosses HP significantly because they realised they fucked it up
due to dreamteam being a retread of the prvious game and how souless paper jam is i feel people now look at partners in time more fondly.
Great video!!!
49:05 same
still my favorite Nintendo game
About time travel since your actively changing what’s going n in the past here it is technically possible the Shroobs could succeed since Adult Mario and Luigi got involved and start altering the events. There is a chance that ripples forward into the present
I think the problem with Partners in Time's story is the time travel itself. It feels like the game doesn't follow the rules of time travel, as the actions and events in the past don't seem to alter the present or future in any meaningful way. In fact, the game implies the Shroobs attacked the Mushroom Kingdom in the past when Mario and Luigi were still babies, so shouldn't this mean the Shroobs have taken over the present as well? That right just kinda doesn't make a lot of sense from a narrative perspective, and what is often called a plot hole.
So, what I would do is have the Shroobs attack in the *present,* where Mario and Luigi try to fight them off, but are easily overwhelmed and then tossed into the time machine E. Gadd made. The time machine would then take them into the past, partially breaking as well due to various circumstances, where Mario and Luigi would then meet their younger selves and join forces to find a way to secure the Mushroom Kingdom's future. I know this would require an *intensive* amount of rewriting, but I think this is a better premise from a logistical standpoint, in my opinion.
We could assume that if Peach and extension the Bros. Never went back in time, then prince bowser wouldnt have had to stop his airship to rescue the adult Bros, run out of ammo and be shot down. It could have been very possible the Shroob invasion would have been stopped by Prince bowser and Co. Before the Shroobs made a successful assault. Which would explain why The future was not originally affected.
I never understood the criticism about Bros Attacks being items in this game. If it was for the fact that Bros Items overall have less personality or creativity, then sure fair enough. I agree on that point. But the mechanic of them being items instead of a BP/SP system and in my experience as someone who has played both countless times, I never really found much of a difference. Sure you technically run out of items, but that's no different to running out of BP/SP and to me at least running out of Green Shells makes more sense than suddenly not being able to do Bounce Bros. I don't think either or are better, as they're doing things so differently that I wouldn't want to compare them.
Having said that, Bowser's Inside Story's decision to kinda combine both just makes no sense whatsoever. Acrobatic Bros Attacks being BP/SP? Yeah, that works. Bros Items being consumable items? Regardless of your opinion on whether they're better than SS Bros Attacks, items being... items works. But then Bowser's Inside Story has Bros Attacks which utilize items but is also on an SP system which makes no sense. Where are the items coming from? What's SP in this context? If we always have access to this item, what in lore is stopping the Bros and Bowser from using their respective attacks?
Lore of Growing Pains | Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time Retrospective - ScionVyse momentum 100
Unlike Superstar Saga which I've replayed countless times, I only played through Partners in Time once in 2006 and never again, but don't really know why. Something about it just made me uninterested, but I feel like many of the flaws you pointed out are the same things I noticed about it. At some point I may give it another go all these years later.
Partners in Time is the only game I haven’t played and it annoys me because I played the others
The eshop are down, finding the game are pricey and I don’t know how to emulate games nor have a computer or the right equipment to mod my 3DS/DS
honestly the only reason i didn’t enjoy this game as much as other entries was the final boss (never could beat it due to the insane amount of hp and time it takes) and also some of the puzzles being needlessly stupid
7:12 wtf? Very irresponsible, hmm!