Hi, Couple questions (like the breakdown but I'm confused by the overall analysis comparison): 1) Your baseline includes 40% EHR and 48% DoT Multi from S5 Sampo, which if you are going to include as a baseline inherently biases your calculations to favor the E1 because you are using shared stats in your comparison on the LC. Do you have the calcs of the baseline where there is no EHR (that's adding multi via EHR boost) and no DoT Multi as your baseline? 2) If the above is true shouldn't you be comparing a baseline with no LC equipped to what the LC equip adds versus no LC equipped to what the e1 adds? (Only asking because in your final damage calcs you are calculating the S1 as only 15% dmg increase (when you have the sampo LC as your baseline so you are losing the whole value of 40% EHR in the comparison) to an E1 increase of 31% (which includes the sampo LC stats but is not mentioned?) This wide of a difference in the percentages seems highly due to the fact that your S1 vs E1 bias is focused actually on an [S1] vs [E1,S5|4*LC] ? So in reality that huge percentage gap should be way less? Please correct me if I'm wrong and missing something somewhere in the math. Only asking because I'm a DoT enjoyer also :)
No you are correct but the reason I chose do it this way is for people to see the the upgrade from running s5 EOTP. But you are correct I shouldve at least mentioned this right here. Thanks You i will pin this comment
No worries. I figured. I played around with your spreadsheet myself and set a new baseline where I assumed 40% EHR inherent from LC either from s5EoTP or s1 Sig. I then re-calced and did the math and ended up with them being very similar in comparison (31.25% from the E1 still vs 32.61% from the S1; assuming 40% EHR inherent). Almost the same value. The only difference I could find is if you assume 3 stacks from DoT set vs 1 stack in which then the S1 starts to outweigh that e1 just due to sheer amount of def ignore/def reduc you achieve. Overall really good analysis though, I enjoyed it a lot and can't wait for BS to come (been waiting since I saw initial leaks). :)@@iSUMMONYT
@@iSUMMONYTdid you factor in relics in this calculation? Im asking because if you have her S1 you can run an ATK% body and get the extra EHR with substats but with her E1 you will probably need an EHR body.
@@elderman64 Yes s1 is theoretically cheaper than e1 since the pity for lc is 80 while character is 90. But when you consider that s1 is a 75 25 and e1 is 5050 chance, we can see that s1 is a lot cheaper than e1 on avg
I fully agree with everything you said in the video. I will list out my set of reasons of why I'll got for S1 anyways, but this is just to provide some devil's advocate to people with options like me: 1. I have 2 accs, the one where I'll get Black Swan is a full DoT focused acc with S8 EotP, this means if I get the LC I can trickle down my other 2 EoTPs to Sampo and Guinaifen which is more fun than having to swap things around. 2. I own no copies of Resolution and didn't get tutorial bc I made the acc later on around Blade's banner, thus getting a working LC for my Pela and SW is far more valuable and super impositions make it way less coinflip too, also D3 is worth any extra copies too to enable compositions and cool ideas. 3. E1 and S1 will perform within margin of error of each other, so I don't think you'll regret picking one over the other really. 4. LC odds are just a lot more favorable and less punishing. 5. I own E6 Ting and will adamantly ignore Misha and while Guin copies sound tempting, it's not enough by itself where the LC banner does appeal a lot to my account. 5. Her face on the LC section of the char screen will just brighten my day :') I don't think you can go wrong with either, just felt it was good providing my frame of thinking. Great video as usual man, really appreciated!
Very detailed exactly what i need. I'm at E1/ Ruan mei, thinking if i should go for the LC, but certainly did not expect almost 50% increase in dmg when you got to E1S1/ Ruan Mei. Now i'm 100% pulling the LC lol
Awesome calculations. I was wondering how much of a difference it would make if I ran guinafen instead of Ruan. Counting her fire dot and vulnerability and that extra fire damage procs from kafka?
@@iSUMMONYT thanks, I feel like triple dot is over looked but if the damage lost isn’t too bad it’s possible to save ruan on a second team. Plus with triple dot you’d have 3 elements covered in one team. Gunifen will be on the banner and we can get a free copy too
Good question man, im running her with kafka and blackswan later also. since when my guin is e2 with luka picture LC s2, why not? im new and doesnt have ruan mei 😅
yo bro, im new at the game 1 month TL51 i just got kafka E0S0, i have around 120pulls for blackswan. do you think should i go all in for blackswan banner and her LC or upgrade my kafka to e1? Btw good video dude
I managed to prepare a prisoner artifact set with 78 hitrate without an artifact. Now gotta see how much hit rate her traces provide, and hopefully, I can reach 120 hit (without artifact, mind you)
The Black Swan LC banner is going to have some really good value 4* LCs so I'd value S1 higher than E1 in that case. I currently have S1 DDD and S3 Resolution. Getting Resolution to S5 would be amazing and the extra DDD's are welcome as well. The Misha 4* LC is going to be really good for Xueyi and I love Xueyi (even though she's only E2 for me).
@@iSUMMONYT I'm a f2p so normally I only go for E0 but Jingliu was an exception. Got her E0S1 and got MotP S5 (gave that to my Ruan Mei) and EotP to S4 from Jingliu's LC banner. Black Swan LC banner gonna be the 2nd exception and I like Black Swan (more than Kafka tbh) and her LC art is amazing.
@@Goodblue77 yeah i usually analyze if going for the S1 is worth it andif I really like the character I usually go for it but since im a DHIL main, Sparkle was my E2S1 target but looking at these banners made me reconsider so I might just get E0S1 BS and E0S1 Sparkle.
Thank you so much, this is exactly what I was looking for, calculations in every situation with her E1, LC and Ruan Mei. Both her E1 and LC are tempting, but they're expensive and E0 with Ruan Mei looks fine. Also I just got my last Sampo LC copy to make it S5 while getting Black Swan so I think that's a sign lol
I'm just planning on getting BS E0 S0 because I was planning on saving for Sparkle if I have enough(I got ~40 pulls ready)... Although an E1 BS seems very tempting, but I really don't think I'll be able to get enough tickets for that...
Hi iSUMMON first of all great video. I really enjoyed your video. I have a question currently my Black swan has 120 ehr if i superimpose my s3 eop to s4. I plan to play Black swan mainly in two teams: e1s1 Kafka, Black swan, Asta e6 and huohuo e0s0. My second team will be the same team but ruan mei e0s0 instead of Asta. My goal is to also clear 36 star moc constistently with the first team since the fisrt team is weaker then the second team. Shoul i go for e0s1 Black swan und use my eop s4 for someone else or should i go for e1 black swan. Which would help me clear moc 36 star consistently with the first team ? My other nihility lc are pearls of sweat s2, Payn s1 and my mentioned eop s3 which I can bring to s4. Sorry for the long comment 😅
Thanks for the video, it was really valuable. I second some comments I saw, it would be interesting to see if you can, the same type of calculations of the dmg difference between Asta VS Guinafen, for those who doesn't have Ruan Mei Thanks again!
@@iSUMMONYT ohh man... i dont remember what banner it was.. but i kid u not... i got soo many EoP copy that i got soo salty.. i have 2 S5 not even lvled up... and 1 S2... thats like what... 12 dupes of this LC? just imagine how frustrated i got... i have not a single DOT char built... just got kafka this week... but now... im happy... "how the turn tables" !! lol
Hi there, quick question: BS e1 said it reduce element res of corresponding element. Does that also mean it reduce the effect res of that element dot? Or does it only reduce the element res multiplier? (aka only increase dmg but the effect res of dot will still be the same)
I dont have RM but i do have kafke to e1 and her LC so as for blacksawn should i go for e1 or s1 at that point by the way i did get black sawn in 10 rolls since failed my 50/50 for kafke e2 and few issues i dont have pela,luka and but i do have esampo and asta e0 and ting at e4 and guin at e0 i have none the 5 star heralers and only have e6 natasha and e0 lkynx so now that my question how would my team work and for black swan shuld get lc first then use money if i can for e1 because dont have much money but i will and should enough to for my 50/50 ifd i fail well i might have more for to get her atleast once so if i can should go for both or just 1 first any opinions im pretty much trap since i started bnit late during blade and rm area but had no money and no luck to get her as i failed 50/50 for rm...... but i d id get kafke in 10 rolls funny enough i failed as i stated earlier i failed kafake e2 since i spent 200$ but failed at the 50/50 pity but i did get black sawn in 10 rolls they give during patch so.. anyway any thoughts
@iSUMMONYT nah you didn't, its just that i usually never see it anywhere and it's what compells me to pull 5☆ LCs when I'm on the fence also i appreciate the fast reply holy
@@kyo_. ohh ok lol well yeah thats the only other base atk increase you can get so its extremely important. I try to respond to every comment when I see it if I have time then again ive never had this many comments lol so we'll see ill do my best
To me E1 is if you want to use Black Swan as a sub dps more than as the main dps (you have kafka). And you go for S1 if you want Black Swan to take the main dps role primarily.
If you want Black Swan as a main DPS, E1 is still better than S1 (assuming you have a good alternative LC like Eyes of the Prey or Tutorial Mission). Basically E1 is better either way.
I understand. I ask again: The damage from Black Swan that Kafka triggers, is it affected from the def ignore for black swan's source of damage during the triggering? @@iSUMMONYT
@@lokeras92 No. The only defense ignore Kafka takes advantage of is the defense down from BS skill even when she retriggers. The Def Ignore from having more than 7 stacks only applies to when the enemy takes a turn anf takes DoT damage. The defense ignore from the LC only applies to BS as well.
S1 is always better all of the time. Because when we are version 4.0 and your old characters are dusty and sub optimal. You can slide that lightcone over to someone else. That E1 is going to sit there as dead pulls until you feel nostalgic or the turbulence buff justifies it.
Except Black Swan's S1 is very tailored for her. Pretty much no other unit is gonna trigger that 28% DEF shred and 20% ATK, so it's basically just a lousy 40% EHR. If you don't find a way to magically apply 4 different elemental DoTs, it's literally worse than Eyes of the Prey and Tutorial Mission for other characters lol. And if you're worried about current characters being dusty and suboptimal in 2 years, you should know that the current lightcones are likely gonna suffer the same fate. Or maybe the reverse scenario happens. I mean who knows? Maybe in 4.0 a new LC releases that takes Black Swan to the next level, so there's no point in pulling for S1 now, right? It's kind of a pointless argument. At least Black Swan's E1 is a huge benefit for the entire team (basically Ruan Mei ult), so even if you get a newer and shinier DoT main DPS, Black Swan can still act as a support/subDPS.
If we're judging by Honkai's History, it would realistically be the opposite! The design team from HSR is heavily derivative of the Honkai Impact design team, in their design philosophies and passion for the game and characters, and historically, Honkai Impact 3rd would release new, crazy specific Weapons and Stigma (the equivalent of Lightcones and Relics, respectively) for fan favorite characters to buff them up to the current power level of the game, releasing those alongside a Rerun even YEARS after they've been fully powercrept, and rocket them to the top of the meta. These Weapons would usually be HYPER specific, sometimes even listing actual character abilities in the Weapon so that other characters really couldn't take advantage of the extreme amount of power they granted. If they end up doing this in Honkai Star Rail (which isn't guaranteed, of course), it would be like them releasing a Lightcone for Kafka that says "Whenever you Detonate a DoT, place a DoT on the enemy for 50% of the damage dealt by the Detonation", or something similarly bonkers, which would basically make any previous Lightcone look unusable in comparison. So, grabbing Lightcones to switch to future units really doesn't feel like the correct play, unless they're truly universal for the path, like Before Dawn, I suppose.
@@Himomo3I don’t think applying different types of DOT is going to be unique to black swan forever. Not to mention half of end game content is in the simulated universe which you can just slap the nihility path on. we have gotten DOT turbulences before, and pure fiction rotations are meant to highlight certain characters. A little birdy told me the next pure fiction is a DOT one, but you didn’t hear that from me.
@@evanprimeau3810that would be cool, but so far they seem to have strayed pretty far away from the impact 3rd formula and have adopted a Genshin impact approach to the game. Except more generous of course. This could become a thing though, some of the new 4 star lightcones that I definitely didn’t see yet might be buffing some existing characters. And the relic sets I have officially seen seem to be doing the same. Time will tell however. But I still think weapons will have more value in the long run over an eidolon.
@@ForTheViolence That still means the lightcone will find limited use. I'd go as far as to say severely limited, considering that DoT turbulences are few and far between while Simulated Universe is mainly decided by blessings, not lightcones (blessings and other SU buffs outweigh LCs by several orders of magnitude, so you can run basically any LC). At this point, I feel like a universally useful E1 which highly increases the entire team's damage (equivalent to Ruan Mei ultimate for DoT teams) is more valuable, don't you think?
Ruan Mei already has RES PEN at E0 (using ult), E1 is DEF shred. But yes, all sources of RES PEN stack with each other additively, the same goes for DEF shred. So having both Ruan Mei (using ult) and Black Swan (E1) on the team gives you a total 50% RES PEN.
Black Swan has resistance reduction not penetration. Ruan Mei has penetration which ends up working better becuase they independently work to reduce the overall resistance which is why the dmg is insanely high
@@iSUMMONYT My bad, it is reduction. But as far as I know, it should work exactly the same. Just like DEF shred/reduction and DEF ignore stack additively in the damage formula (i.e. 20% DEF shred and 20% DEF ignore give a total of 40% DEF reduction in practice), 25% RES PEN from Ruan Mei and 25% RES reduction from Black Swan E1 should give your enemies a total 50% reduced resistance in the damage formula. I'm pretty sure this is how it works, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
Ok the are additive in the sense that they result in the same multiplier (ie. 40% def red and 40% def ignore = .597 mult) but it doesnt mean that adding both would be 80% increase in the multiplier. so 80% res reduction doesnt take the multiplier from 100% to 180% if that makes sense. @@Himomo3
@@iSUMMONYT Hmm. I looked at the damage formula in the wiki (it might be incorrect, but I feel like it's probably thoroughly tested). For the DEF multiplier, one of the factors (in the denominator) is (1 - %DEF Reduction - %DEF Ignore), which is an additive stacking. It could be rephrased as 1 - (%DEF Red + %Def Ignore). So according to this, having 40% def red + 40% def ignore is exactly the same as having either 80% def red or 80% def ignore. However, the RES Multiplier has a formula of 1 - (RES_Target - RES PEN_Attacker). So either whoever wrote it didn't take into account RES reduction, or we can assume that RES reduction is already applied to RES_Target, which would give us 1 - (RES_Target_base - RES reduction - RES PEN_Attacker), which would once again result in an additive stacking. I haven't personally tested this out in practice, but I honestly can't think of any other sensible way it could stack. I mean, both RES PEN and RES reduction are a flat subtraction from the target's RES, so I don't see how it could be multiplicative. I might honestly do some in-game testing to figure this out. Sorry for the wall of text, and thanks for hearing me out. Oh, and I'm not sure if I understand that last example of yours. What is the multiplier you mentioned? Because if it's the RES multiplier for a 0%RES enemy, I feel like with an 80% RES reduction it would exactly go from 100% to 180%.
Lol shes really not. Idk where yall are getting this from. She still slaps for over 100k with Sampo amd Ruan Mei. If anything, now. Kafka is shit without Black Swan. Black Swan helps Kafka not the other way around.
@@iSUMMONYT that's the other problem, I don't have Sampo too 😅EDIT: from everywhere people who are making videos about Black Swan, they say BS is shit without Kafka.
@@aria.e im sorry, i dont mean to discredit other CC work but if they dont run the numbers themselves I dont trust them. If they dont show you receipts other than "trust me bro" i wouldnt take advice from anyone, including me. So if you like Black Swan, go for her dont let anyone discourage you from getting a character you like. Especially with un proven information
@@iSUMMONYT I meant the overall damage. Arcana deals 180% extra damage to adjacent enemies, so if there are 3 enemies, the middle target should take 360% extra DoT damage & gains 2 extra Arcana stacks. That's equivalent to 10 Arcana stacks damage.
Well I'm a fucking whale, because those characters are just that damn cool, got Kafka E2/S3, Ruan Mei E2/S1, once Black Swan comes out, I'll probably dish out the cash for a that TONS of damage. Since I really like the characters, plus I've saved a good amount of jades. So hope I get lucky.
Hi,
Couple questions (like the breakdown but I'm confused by the overall analysis comparison):
1) Your baseline includes 40% EHR and 48% DoT Multi from S5 Sampo, which if you are going to include as a baseline inherently biases your calculations to favor the E1 because you are using shared stats in your comparison on the LC. Do you have the calcs of the baseline where there is no EHR (that's adding multi via EHR boost) and no DoT Multi as your baseline?
2) If the above is true shouldn't you be comparing a baseline with no LC equipped to what the LC equip adds versus no LC equipped to what the e1 adds?
(Only asking because in your final damage calcs you are calculating the S1 as only 15% dmg increase (when you have the sampo LC as your baseline so you are losing the whole value of 40% EHR in the comparison) to an E1 increase of 31% (which includes the sampo LC stats but is not mentioned?)
This wide of a difference in the percentages seems highly due to the fact that your S1 vs E1 bias is focused actually on an [S1] vs [E1,S5|4*LC] ? So in reality that huge percentage gap should be way less?
Please correct me if I'm wrong and missing something somewhere in the math. Only asking because I'm a DoT enjoyer also :)
No you are correct but the reason I chose do it this way is for people to see the the upgrade from running s5 EOTP. But you are correct I shouldve at least mentioned this right here. Thanks You i will pin this comment
No worries. I figured.
I played around with your spreadsheet myself and set a new baseline where I assumed 40% EHR inherent from LC either from s5EoTP or s1 Sig. I then re-calced and did the math and ended up with them being very similar in comparison (31.25% from the E1 still vs 32.61% from the S1; assuming 40% EHR inherent). Almost the same value. The only difference I could find is if you assume 3 stacks from DoT set vs 1 stack in which then the S1 starts to outweigh that e1 just due to sheer amount of def ignore/def reduc you achieve.
Overall really good analysis though, I enjoyed it a lot and can't wait for BS to come (been waiting since I saw initial leaks). :)@@iSUMMONYT
Also. BS E1 also helps Kafka and her other teammates so E1 is def the best best option if u have 120% EHR in your Build.
Yes! I forfot to mention that. Im going to pin this! Good looking out! 🔥
@@iSUMMONYT 🗣️
@@iSUMMONYTdid you factor in relics in this calculation?
Im asking because if you have her S1 you can run an ATK% body and get the extra EHR with substats but with her E1 you will probably need an EHR body.
@@SoulChainXx I mean you can run S5 Sampo lightcone and still get 120 EHR without EHR chest
An advantage of the S1 vs E1 is that, on average you need less pulls to get it. But her E1 is very tempting.
Less pulls to get which one? S1?
@@elderman64the s1 yea, its because its a 75% instead of a 50/50 like a character
@@elderman64 Yes s1 is theoretically cheaper than e1 since the pity for lc is 80 while character is 90. But when you consider that s1 is a 75 25 and e1 is 5050 chance, we can see that s1 is a lot cheaper than e1 on avg
Based take.
@@pixelniceness5711 aight makes sense
Man now i want her e1 too, i am getting s1 since i like collecting LC for the characters i like, this will be perfect for my kafka (e1 s1)
Its a good Eidolon
I fully agree with everything you said in the video. I will list out my set of reasons of why I'll got for S1 anyways, but this is just to provide some devil's advocate to people with options like me:
1. I have 2 accs, the one where I'll get Black Swan is a full DoT focused acc with S8 EotP, this means if I get the LC I can trickle down my other 2 EoTPs to Sampo and Guinaifen which is more fun than having to swap things around.
2. I own no copies of Resolution and didn't get tutorial bc I made the acc later on around Blade's banner, thus getting a working LC for my Pela and SW is far more valuable and super impositions make it way less coinflip too, also D3 is worth any extra copies too to enable compositions and cool ideas.
3. E1 and S1 will perform within margin of error of each other, so I don't think you'll regret picking one over the other really.
4. LC odds are just a lot more favorable and less punishing.
5. I own E6 Ting and will adamantly ignore Misha and while Guin copies sound tempting, it's not enough by itself where the LC banner does appeal a lot to my account.
5. Her face on the LC section of the char screen will just brighten my day :')
I don't think you can go wrong with either, just felt it was good providing my frame of thinking. Great video as usual man, really appreciated!
I see nothing wrong with this 🔥🔥
Thx man. Vey underrated content here
I appreciate that!
The legend is back with another great video.
lol not a legend yet but im shooting for it... trust
Aww thank you so much! ❤ I already have S5 Eyes of the Prey so I will go now for E1
💪 your BS bout to slap!!
Very detailed exactly what i need. I'm at E1/ Ruan mei, thinking if i should go for the LC, but certainly did not expect almost 50% increase in dmg when you got to E1S1/ Ruan Mei. Now i'm 100% pulling the LC lol
Yeah I was not going to get the LC but given that banner is so good I have to toss a few multis in there
Your hard work on calculating paid off 🎉, nice video. Hope for more 👍
Aye thanks to you! appreciate the support!
I was gonna go for E1 S1, but then they announced Acheron so I’m going for her S1 simply because I like the art a lot.
Acheron messsed up some plans for me ngl
Gotta love the monster hunter music in the background!!
Love that game
Thank you for this video. Next rerun i will pull for lightcone
I picked her LC up right at the end and I dont regret it. I kind of wanted the e1 but it wasnt a must for me
Awesome calculations. I was wondering how much of a difference it would make if I ran guinafen instead of Ruan. Counting her fire dot and vulnerability and that extra fire damage procs from kafka?
When I get to the PC i can run a few numbers really quick, disvlaimer I may forget but i'll try to remember!
Saw on some calcs that e6 gui s5 resolution is 17% worse than e0 RM on kafka team w/ e6s5 eotp sampo.
@@iSUMMONYT thanks, I feel like triple dot is over looked but if the damage lost isn’t too bad it’s possible to save ruan on a second team. Plus with triple dot you’d have 3 elements covered in one team. Gunifen will be on the banner and we can get a free copy too
@@InfinityInfinite1 that’s not too bad! Thanks for the calcs
Good question man, im running her with kafka and blackswan later also. since when my guin is e2 with luka picture LC s2, why not? im new and doesnt have ruan mei 😅
Great video. Thanks from Brazil
Aye appreciate the support mano 💪
yo bro, im new at the game 1 month TL51 i just got kafka E0S0, i have around 120pulls for blackswan. do you think should i go all in for blackswan banner and her LC or upgrade my kafka to e1? Btw good video dude
and please can you make a video the best way to farm relics? thanks
Given that BS already gives you 25% Vulberability debuff already id say go in on BS
@@iSUMMONYT aight, thanks for the answer 🫡
I managed to prepare a prisoner artifact set with 78 hitrate without an artifact.
Now gotta see how much hit rate her traces provide, and hopefully, I can reach 120 hit (without artifact, mind you)
Thats nice! Its looking like a clean build! Traces you get 10% EHR
The Black Swan LC banner is going to have some really good value 4* LCs so I'd value S1 higher than E1 in that case. I currently have S1 DDD and S3 Resolution. Getting Resolution to S5 would be amazing and the extra DDD's are welcome as well. The Misha 4* LC is going to be really good for Xueyi and I love Xueyi (even though she's only E2 for me).
Yes! Its crazy how good thst banner is. I wasnt going for her S1 but my Xueyi wants that LC so I gotta do what I gotta do lol
@@iSUMMONYT I'm a f2p so normally I only go for E0 but Jingliu was an exception. Got her E0S1 and got MotP S5 (gave that to my Ruan Mei) and EotP to S4 from Jingliu's LC banner. Black Swan LC banner gonna be the 2nd exception and I like Black Swan (more than Kafka tbh) and her LC art is amazing.
@@Goodblue77 yeah i usually analyze if going for the S1 is worth it andif I really like the character I usually go for it but since im a DHIL main, Sparkle was my E2S1 target but looking at these banners made me reconsider so I might just get E0S1 BS and E0S1 Sparkle.
Thank you so much, this is exactly what I was looking for, calculations in every situation with her E1, LC and Ruan Mei.
Both her E1 and LC are tempting, but they're expensive and E0 with Ruan Mei looks fine. Also I just got my last Sampo LC copy to make it S5 while getting Black Swan so I think that's a sign lol
Nice! GGs! Im glad the video helped!
bro in title :"[E1 vs S1 Analysis] "
bro in vid : "Ruan Mei>>>>"
thankfully i got ruan mei lol
I was like naaa fuck both e1 and s1. Ruan Mei is where its at 😂
Thanks for the video. From Russia
No way! thats crazy!
Nice
💪💪
Thanks bud
No problem 👍
I'm just planning on getting BS E0 S0 because I was planning on saving for Sparkle if I have enough(I got ~40 pulls ready)... Although an E1 BS seems very tempting, but I really don't think I'll be able to get enough tickets for that...
unless youre super lucky.
id just get E0 of each
@@iSUMMONYT Yeah... I wish they would reset the oniric shard purchase bonus already
I have S0 EotP and sweaty man, so I might go S1.
Lol that was funny
Hi iSUMMON first of all great video. I really enjoyed your video. I have a question currently my Black swan has 120 ehr if i superimpose my s3 eop to s4. I plan to play Black swan mainly in two teams: e1s1 Kafka, Black swan, Asta e6 and huohuo e0s0. My second team will be the same team but ruan mei e0s0 instead of Asta. My goal is to also clear 36 star moc constistently with the first team since the fisrt team is weaker then the second team. Shoul i go for e0s1 Black swan und use my eop s4 for someone else or should i go for e1 black swan. Which would help me clear moc 36 star consistently with the first team ? My other nihility lc are pearls of sweat s2, Payn s1 and my mentioned eop s3 which I can bring to s4. Sorry for the long comment 😅
E1 would help more if you already can get 120 ehr. It would help Kafka do more dmg and asta dots would do more dmg as well with e1
okay so e1 will it be probably thank you
@@iSUMMONYT
i regret not pulling for ruan mei more and more every day
RIP
Thanks for the video, it was really valuable.
I second some comments I saw, it would be interesting to see if you can, the same type of calculations of the dmg difference between Asta VS Guinafen, for those who doesn't have Ruan Mei
Thanks again!
I have a few other videos planned but I'll try to get this one in!
Comparing unbuffed E1S1 to Buffed E0 is kinda unfair, you should do Asta vs Ruan Mei buff or some other f2p harmony
I wasnt going to do any but since most people were going to use Ruam Mei with BS i decided to throw that in for those that had asked.
I have only S2 EoP, so, probably gonna pull for S1. Idk it just feels like the character will be incomplete without her sig.
I suffer from that too ive had to learn to be ok with out the LC lol I know the struggles lol
@@iSUMMONYT ohh man... i dont remember what banner it was.. but i kid u not... i got soo many EoP copy that i got soo salty.. i have 2 S5 not even lvled up... and 1 S2... thats like what... 12 dupes of this LC? just imagine how frustrated i got... i have not a single DOT char built... just got kafka this week... but now... im happy... "how the turn tables" !! lol
Hi there, quick question: BS e1 said it reduce element res of corresponding element. Does that also mean it reduce the effect res of that element dot? Or does it only reduce the element res multiplier? (aka only increase dmg but the effect res of dot will still be the same)
Yes the effect res of the dot remains the same, it only increases the res multiplier
alright done .... already 120 with Eyes of The Prey S5 , going for E1
Just got both
Nice! Ggs
I've almost reached pity on lc banner and thinking whether I should get Kafka's lc or BS', what would you recommend?
If you have EOTP S5 then go for Kafka LC if not then go for BS LC
Me watching Black Swan vids but is saving for Fu Xuan..
Best unit in the game imo. Cant blame you
I dont have RM but i do have kafke to e1 and her LC so as for blacksawn should i go for e1 or s1 at that point by the way i did get black sawn in 10 rolls since failed my 50/50 for kafke e2 and few issues i dont have pela,luka and but i do have esampo and asta e0 and ting at e4 and guin at e0 i have none the 5 star heralers and only have e6 natasha and e0 lkynx so now that my question how would my team work and for black swan shuld get lc first then use money if i can for e1 because dont have much money but i will and should enough to for my 50/50 ifd i fail well i might have more for to get her atleast once so if i can should go for both or just 1 first any opinions im pretty much trap since i started bnit late during blade and rm area but had no money and no luck to get her as i failed 50/50 for rm...... but i d id get kafke in 10 rolls funny enough i failed as i stated earlier i failed kafake e2 since i spent 200$ but failed at the 50/50 pity but i did get black sawn in 10 rolls they give during patch so.. anyway any thoughts
run kafka, BS and Asta with a healer. That team should be really good!
@@iSUMMONYT alright thank you what should to e1 or Lc which one should I get first?
S1 is better. Def shred, ehr, and atk%.
Meaning you can stack a lot more spd, means more energy gain.
Even more now with that banner they put it on
Should i pull the lightcone banner? Not gonna pull for bs but i want misha’s lc
You run the risk of getting her LC and then what? Shes the only one that can use outside of sim universe
Is silverwolf's 4star lc good if you don't have s5 sampo lc?
Check out my LC video!
so i have LC eyes of prey S5 with EHR 40%, its better go for E1 or Sign LC?
Her Sig is very good but E1 has a lot of utility and its also a nice dmg bonus. Id say E1
How about s1 Kafka vs s1 Black Swan? I really don't know what to choose.
If you have EOTP S5 go Kafka if not go Black Swan
good stuff
If we're running her w/ Kafka, do we have a general idea of how many Arcana stacks we can expect on average before they expire?
with a fast kafka and fast bs around 17 no ult and 25 plus when she ults is what i theorize
@@iSUMMONYT cool so hopefully we can average 15-20 with more average builds. thanks!
How do you feel about the Genius set on Black Swan?
Video on that coming next. I had to re record it but its coming tomorrow
@@iSUMMONYT perfect. Thanks dude. Looking to it 👍
is the 582 atk on sig vs 476 on EOTP really that negligible even tho it counts as base atk and increases with multipliers?
I dont think the flat atk from LC is negligable at all. Idk if I alluded to that but no thst LC atk is very important
@iSUMMONYT nah you didn't, its just that i usually never see it anywhere and it's what compells me to pull 5☆ LCs when I'm on the fence
also i appreciate the fast reply holy
@@kyo_. ohh ok lol well yeah thats the only other base atk increase you can get so its extremely important.
I try to respond to every comment when I see it if I have time then again ive never had this many comments lol so we'll see ill do my best
To me E1 is if you want to use Black Swan as a sub dps more than as the main dps (you have kafka).
And you go for S1 if you want Black Swan to take the main dps role primarily.
Thats a good point and I agree
If you want Black Swan as a main DPS, E1 is still better than S1 (assuming you have a good alternative LC like Eyes of the Prey or Tutorial Mission). Basically E1 is better either way.
I'd be lucky to even win the 50/50 and get E0 lol 😂
you got this! we dont lose 50/50!
E0 cuz there no way in hell ima afford either the lightcone or eidolon and still have even a chance to get sparkle ;-;
Depends on how lucly ypu get! You gotta believe
Is EHR chest better than ATK? I’ve been farming for ATK all this time lol
If you can get 120 ehr without the chest then go atk. But its going to be very hard to do that so ehr is just better because of that
sorry i havent watched the video yet, but does black swan lightcone also give defense ignore when kafka retriggers the dots?
no its only for Black Swan
I think they asked if the def ignore is active for Black Swan when Kafka triggers Black Swan's DoTs
@@iSUMMONYT
@@lokeras92 the only def reduction that isnactive for Kafka is the Def Reduction from the skill nothing else
I understand. I ask again: The damage from Black Swan that Kafka triggers, is it affected from the def ignore for black swan's source of damage during the triggering? @@iSUMMONYT
@@lokeras92 No. The only defense ignore Kafka takes advantage of is the defense down from BS skill even when she retriggers. The Def Ignore from having more than 7 stacks only applies to when the enemy takes a turn anf takes DoT damage. The defense ignore from the LC only applies to BS as well.
I have e1 s1 ruan mei so im fine with e0s0 black swan?
I have her e1 s1 too but I don't have a Kafka :( was thinking of using black swan as a sub dps in a dr ratio team
@@kashmankipstaz i have kafka my main team is kafka dot team then at the other side its jingliu hyper carry
Yeah you can run S5 Eyes of Prey
@@Birdizzle98 thanks
Im have E1S1 Ruan Mei and im running my Black Swan hust like that. I think it will work just fine with Break Asta and HuoHuo
S1 is always better all of the time. Because when we are version 4.0 and your old characters are dusty and sub optimal. You can slide that lightcone over to someone else. That E1 is going to sit there as dead pulls until you feel nostalgic or the turbulence buff justifies it.
Except Black Swan's S1 is very tailored for her. Pretty much no other unit is gonna trigger that 28% DEF shred and 20% ATK, so it's basically just a lousy 40% EHR. If you don't find a way to magically apply 4 different elemental DoTs, it's literally worse than Eyes of the Prey and Tutorial Mission for other characters lol.
And if you're worried about current characters being dusty and suboptimal in 2 years, you should know that the current lightcones are likely gonna suffer the same fate.
Or maybe the reverse scenario happens. I mean who knows? Maybe in 4.0 a new LC releases that takes Black Swan to the next level, so there's no point in pulling for S1 now, right? It's kind of a pointless argument.
At least Black Swan's E1 is a huge benefit for the entire team (basically Ruan Mei ult), so even if you get a newer and shinier DoT main DPS, Black Swan can still act as a support/subDPS.
If we're judging by Honkai's History, it would realistically be the opposite! The design team from HSR is heavily derivative of the Honkai Impact design team, in their design philosophies and passion for the game and characters, and historically, Honkai Impact 3rd would release new, crazy specific Weapons and Stigma (the equivalent of Lightcones and Relics, respectively) for fan favorite characters to buff them up to the current power level of the game, releasing those alongside a Rerun even YEARS after they've been fully powercrept, and rocket them to the top of the meta. These Weapons would usually be HYPER specific, sometimes even listing actual character abilities in the Weapon so that other characters really couldn't take advantage of the extreme amount of power they granted. If they end up doing this in Honkai Star Rail (which isn't guaranteed, of course), it would be like them releasing a Lightcone for Kafka that says "Whenever you Detonate a DoT, place a DoT on the enemy for 50% of the damage dealt by the Detonation", or something similarly bonkers, which would basically make any previous Lightcone look unusable in comparison. So, grabbing Lightcones to switch to future units really doesn't feel like the correct play, unless they're truly universal for the path, like Before Dawn, I suppose.
@@Himomo3I don’t think applying different types of DOT is going to be unique to black swan forever. Not to mention half of end game content is in the simulated universe which you can just slap the nihility path on. we have gotten DOT turbulences before, and pure fiction rotations are meant to highlight certain characters. A little birdy told me the next pure fiction is a DOT one, but you didn’t hear that from me.
@@evanprimeau3810that would be cool, but so far they seem to have strayed pretty far away from the impact 3rd formula and have adopted a Genshin impact approach to the game. Except more generous of course. This could become a thing though, some of the new 4 star lightcones that I definitely didn’t see yet might be buffing some existing characters. And the relic sets I have officially seen seem to be doing the same. Time will tell however. But I still think weapons will have more value in the long run over an eidolon.
@@ForTheViolence That still means the lightcone will find limited use. I'd go as far as to say severely limited, considering that DoT turbulences are few and far between while Simulated Universe is mainly decided by blessings, not lightcones (blessings and other SU buffs outweigh LCs by several orders of magnitude, so you can run basically any LC).
At this point, I feel like a universally useful E1 which highly increases the entire team's damage (equivalent to Ruan Mei ultimate for DoT teams) is more valuable, don't you think?
Can i ask the same cuestion about Jingliu? S1 or E1?
S1 for Jingliu
Is an attack orb better than wind damage boost? Assuming u already have 3k attack
If you have Ruan Mei, Atk orb is better of not Wind orb is about 3% better.
Any idea if the resistance penetration from a E1 Black swan stacks with the resistance penetration of a E1 Ruan Mei?
Ruan Mei already has RES PEN at E0 (using ult), E1 is DEF shred. But yes, all sources of RES PEN stack with each other additively, the same goes for DEF shred. So having both Ruan Mei (using ult) and Black Swan (E1) on the team gives you a total 50% RES PEN.
Black Swan has resistance reduction not penetration. Ruan Mei has penetration which ends up working better becuase they independently work to reduce the overall resistance which is why the dmg is insanely high
@@iSUMMONYT My bad, it is reduction. But as far as I know, it should work exactly the same.
Just like DEF shred/reduction and DEF ignore stack additively in the damage formula (i.e. 20% DEF shred and 20% DEF ignore give a total of 40% DEF reduction in practice), 25% RES PEN from Ruan Mei and 25% RES reduction from Black Swan E1 should give your enemies a total 50% reduced resistance in the damage formula.
I'm pretty sure this is how it works, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
Ok the are additive in the sense that they result in the same multiplier (ie. 40% def red and 40% def ignore = .597 mult) but it doesnt mean that adding both would be 80% increase in the multiplier. so 80% res reduction doesnt take the multiplier from 100% to 180% if that makes sense. @@Himomo3
@@iSUMMONYT Hmm. I looked at the damage formula in the wiki (it might be incorrect, but I feel like it's probably thoroughly tested).
For the DEF multiplier, one of the factors (in the denominator) is (1 - %DEF Reduction - %DEF Ignore), which is an additive stacking. It could be rephrased as 1 - (%DEF Red + %Def Ignore). So according to this, having 40% def red + 40% def ignore is exactly the same as having either 80% def red or 80% def ignore.
However, the RES Multiplier has a formula of 1 - (RES_Target - RES PEN_Attacker). So either whoever wrote it didn't take into account RES reduction, or we can assume that RES reduction is already applied to RES_Target, which would give us 1 - (RES_Target_base - RES reduction - RES PEN_Attacker), which would once again result in an additive stacking.
I haven't personally tested this out in practice, but I honestly can't think of any other sensible way it could stack. I mean, both RES PEN and RES reduction are a flat subtraction from the target's RES, so I don't see how it could be multiplicative. I might honestly do some in-game testing to figure this out.
Sorry for the wall of text, and thanks for hearing me out. Oh, and I'm not sure if I understand that last example of yours. What is the multiplier you mentioned? Because if it's the RES multiplier for a 0%RES enemy, I feel like with an 80% RES reduction it would exactly go from 100% to 180%.
S1 for art alone
Cant argue with that
I don't have kafka so it's no reason for me to pull her because she's useless without kafka
Lol shes really not. Idk where yall are getting this from. She still slaps for over 100k with Sampo amd Ruan Mei.
If anything, now. Kafka is shit without Black Swan. Black Swan helps Kafka not the other way around.
@@iSUMMONYT that's the other problem, I don't have Sampo too 😅EDIT: from everywhere people who are making videos about Black Swan, they say BS is shit without Kafka.
@@aria.e im sorry, i dont mean to discredit other CC work but if they dont run the numbers themselves I dont trust them. If they dont show you receipts other than "trust me bro" i wouldnt take advice from anyone, including me. So if you like Black Swan, go for her dont let anyone discourage you from getting a character you like. Especially with un proven information
Is the bonus adjacent damage from 3+ stacks being considered as well?
Only 1 Dot since its only her and Ruan Mei. 6% Def ignore
@@iSUMMONYT I meant the overall damage. Arcana deals 180% extra damage to adjacent enemies, so if there are 3 enemies, the middle target should take 360% extra DoT damage & gains 2 extra Arcana stacks. That's equivalent to 10 Arcana stacks damage.
I wonder how much damage e1s1 BS + RM will be doing when you add in a e2s1 Kafka onto the team.
We can round down the damage to a FUCK TON OF DAMAGE! lol
Well I'm a fucking whale, because those characters are just that damn cool, got Kafka E2/S3, Ruan Mei E2/S1, once Black Swan comes out, I'll probably dish out the cash for a that TONS of damage. Since I really like the characters, plus I've saved a good amount of jades. So hope I get lucky.
@@quatixel hope you do get lucky! 💪💪
@@iSUMMONYT thank you, I hope so too. It's going to be really fun.
Hey dude if you do a summoning session, summon on my account i need one copy of her !
I got you! 💪 I will be streaming
Lc fo sure since it gives you 40ehr
E1 Kafka or E1 Black Swan?
Black Swan imo
@@iSUMMONYT Omg ok thank youuuuu
@@itsCreamy no problem!