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Thank you Mr This Way Works, you are very good at making things! 👍👍

@@HighFell I try, try try try a few times, then i have something normally lol

It’s always a pleasure to share information Steven 😁👍

Great to have you along. You are where I was nearly 2 years ago! Getting into scenery has been brilliant fun having never got too far before. Hopefully if I have done this right there is a link here to take you to the Hornby forum and you will find some track plans and dimensions for a range of layouts including High Fell 😁 community.hornbyhobbies.com/forums/topic/35633-tt120-track-plan-book/#comments

TBH, there are not so many issues, the shafts are a rare issue, this just clears it up. The early 3pole motors are the same as most people have seen in N too. The TT:120 50 Is a fine damn fine machine and I’m happy to have a couple, same with 43. You can pretty much name any brand and I know of failings, except maybe Piko, they build exceptional mechanisms. ALL the British brands have a lot of catching up to do.

So, I still haven’t fitted my previous replacements and he changes it again….i need to work faster

@@47606odin we are at the cutting edge of development here! This development is more driven by the lack of supply of the previous option and also finding a solution for class 43 too. When you are engineering a fix you might as well go all in 😁👍

Richard isn’t on this channel. In terms of the coreless motor fitted to A4, she keeps on running with no issues. The other motor fixes are also running fine too, it will interesting to see how they also perform approaching 30-35 hours and see if they outlast the Hornby ones. I know Hornby are working on the issue but other than that I don’t have any information. 👍

I did wonder about that, but I have had the shafts out on a few of these now and only 1 other had the same moulding on the ball end. I can’t think of any reason why it would be done on purpose. It actually appears as the end has been cut, probably it’s mis manufactured and when the ends are trimmed, too much has been taken off. If it was intentional it would be applied more consistently. The test ones don’t have any ends cut flat and they are working a treat.

@@HighFell One possibility could be the shaft moulding was attached to the sprue at the end where the short occasionally appears. Maybe a lack of attention (or care) when cutting the shaft off the sprue.

@@NewModelRailway1 that is where I am with it. I have sent Hornby Technical some images with some other info. They should have the original engineering drawings for the part. Feed back gained in the field is so useful for them 😁👍

It’s not that scary 😁

As modellers, as long as we have options we can work with that👍

I use a Dynamis Ultima (ESU Navigator rebadged) for control. I did try a different newly announced system as a potential replacement but it’s absolutely terrible and gone back.

@@HighFell OH, so you control HM7000 using this one also?

@@GlibVideo no, I control whole layout on a traditional DCC system, a Dynamis Ultra. I tried a new system, that was a disaster.

So, now you have a spare class 50 sound chip…..?

@@47606odin the beauty of an HM 7000 TXS decoder is, it can be anything that a a profile exists for 😁

1/4 watt absolutely perfect for this application.

I am experimenting with track power lighting set up, it’s more involved and a bit more skill to put together but the components work out cheaper.

@@HighFell Funny you should say that. I've spent hours trying to find platform lamps. Even N scale at 65mm height (item description) seems too tall. I haven't even found info on the height of the real ones! BTW where did you find the telephone box at 1:120 or is it N scale? BTW I also have the Artitec tractor and trailer which are pricey but such quality.

I sourced quite a lot of lights from Evemodel and repainted them etc. a lot of N gauge stuff is oversize so ideal for TT:120. Researching is varied! Check photos to get an idea for relative sizes, the phone boxes are 3D printed items off eBay, loads of TT:120 modelling trinkets there, I added glazing and a lights and repainted. A lot depends on the era and area you are modelling to what works 😁

Hi, thanks. The scale doesn’t just have to mean small layouts. It’s genuinely the first layout I have managed to get to do the scenery on! 👍

Hi, this really could help for you guys overseas as I know it’s awkward returning stuff for warranty repair. If you buy via EBay then there should be an overseas delivery option?

Richard has added overseas shipping to his eBay listings. 👍

Well that all depends if you can find a suitable one. A top quality 3 pole motor is better than a rubbish 5 pole one. There is not much wrong with a good quality 3 pole motor, I wouldn’t say these are ‘good quality’ though. A 5 pole motor has the advantage that its usually skew wound, that and the extra 2 poles improve smooth low rpm running. It’s also fair to say that 5 pole motors and Coreless tend to be higher quality due to the increased cost to produce them and the applications they often find themselves in demand better quality. I have not found an N20 5 pole motor so far, or even a 12v carbon brush N20, hence having to scavenge the carbon brushes and end cap from a 6v N20 and do a little tweak.

@@HighFell Glad to know that ill think about it more then thanks for the advice!

Just Google ‘Metal film 1k Ohm resistor’ loads will come up and cheaper than chips! Just check they are 1000 Ohm or 1k Ohm to get the lighting effect. These are easy to work with and easy to solder. 👍

No worries, hopefully no one needs it, but a useful reference to what goes where and how to get stuff apart without breaking anything. The service manuals these days don’t go any further than fitting a decoder.

It’s a BR130, they were a Soviet loco, designed and built in Ukraine. This is actually the DDR state railways livery but they appeared all over Eastern Europe. Known as ‘Ludmilla’ they still run today, successful class. This is a Piko TT:120 model, they run extremely well.

What is better than a 50, two 50s 😁 Running these as a consist on HM 7000 sound decoders, sound amazing, especially when they go in and out of sync 😁

@HighFell I have over 30 Class 50s in OO with 3 sound decoders I've never installed as most have sound, but with the Accurascale Class 50s due, it seems pointless to install them.

No, I am taking on the task of doing the bulk of the test in this. He has loads on and I have time and layout down etc. about this stage on an OE motor it’s getting noisy and usually not so smooth in reverse so it’s looking good so far. I’m trying to make sure it’s getting ‘proper’ use too, not just continual loops round. Get the stop start and reverse in etc. that’s the thing that’s harder to simulate on a test circuit, some one would literally have to sit and ‘play’ trains for days on end!

I am very impressed with 50, one will be appearing on High Fell soon 😁

@@HighFell hi High, Yeah you did seem pretty impressed with the big blue beast, and I presumed one would be arriving soon. I’m currently sticking with steam but never say never huh? 🤔😉 Oh yeah, I eventually sorted my reverse loop with some DCC products. Thanks again for all your help. Cheers 🍻 Andy

@andywilliams4116 I am looking forward to early livery versions of things like the 50, 37 etc That change over period was always something I wanted to model as there is such a wide variety. Glad you have made progress with reverse loop. What was your soloution?

Hi High, 😂 I may follow suit with an early scheme diesel on my LiTTlewick layout one day?? 🤔😉 The loop was resolved with a Lenz LK200 from KMS which initially didn’t work. However KMS were Very helpful and they contacted DCC Concepts who suggested a DCC Alpha sniffer?? (I’ve no idea what that is, and it doesn’t even smell of anything I can detect? 🤔) This too did not work initially, so I contacted DCC concepts who were also very helpful and the said to try a DCC concepts power supply. I was using the Hornby one in the sets which gave 15V DC. So got the DCC concepts power supply and after much jiggering about it works fine now! 🎉👍😁 Track gets 12V DCC according to the little track testing gizmo I got. 🙄 I know, it’s witchcraft huh?😮 So everything is going well now……… Well, thats apart from my Willy Whitelaw sounding like the class 50 with a horrible grinding motor. Luckily you provided a fix so a coreless motor from TWW is on order. Night Hawk died completely on Saturday, contacted Hornby Monday who said send an email which I did, they now say they will reply in 7 days! 😳🙄 Think it’s the decoder as Bluetooth symbol now red instead of blue…….. Think that’s about it now, so just going to check what’s left in the piggy bank for any other issues that may crop up…. Still enjoying it though (I think??🤔😉)

@@andywilliams4116 quite a bit going on there, I use the DCC Concepts ‘snubbers’ they are a good idea to protect against surges and spikes which modern electronics do not like. I mentioned before that Hornby are planning a DC and DCC RLM (reverse loop module) but there is no release date yet. All the other RLM’s I have seen are DCC only, so they will never work with DCC track power which is a form of AC. 12v is too low for DCC really, the track power ideally should be 14-15v. A proper multimeter would be very useful, £15 from Screwfix etc will get a good one. Make sure it has AC and DC voltage measuring capability. Grinding motor is a sign the BE brushes are failing. The coreless one on test here is going strong, as are the ones with the swapped end caps and brushes. The decoder not linking could be the lack of voltage on the track feed. The first things to check are clean track, clean wheels and the pick wipers are touching the wheel backs. Then pop the tender body off, check videos on that, and make sure the decoder is properly seated. Best way is remove and re-insert, it should be a firm audible click. Close the app and power down your controlling device. Re boot it all. Have you installed the Bluetooth Update? Latest one is v7

No specific trouble other than I am fed up of people trying to trash the hobby. Some trolls need to be told 🤣 Nice to have you along. As you can see TT:120 brought me back to the hobby and loving it more than ever. Too many unfinished OO projects, now I have time and space. 👍

@@HighFell nice one mate, it's fun to mess with her a little bit isn't it?

Even if it was just for the slow and super smooth running, it’s compelling! Maybe I should have negotiated commission with Richard 🤣 but it’s not the way I work. 👍

I use a traditional DCC controller and a mix of HM 7000 and Zimo decoders in locos. The HM 7000 locos are set up using the HM DCC App, it is superb. I prefer tactile controls. I am looking to update the Dynamis Ultra controller but not blown away with what’s out there at the moment.

To get data on motor temps, ‘tell tale temperature strips’ were stuck on the tops of the motors. Service limit on Coreless motors is 100-125C. Higher on an iron core motor. ‘Internet Experts’ suggested both coreless and OE motors ran ‘hot’ and that caused failure, while exceeding service temp will cause failure I couldn’t see these motors were routinely running in excess of 125C! I got strips with a range of 70-116C and after all the running, zero. So I popped a lower range strip in. Peak temps are under 25C. In serviceable state these motors do NOT run hot. Although a failing motor will run hot. Cause and Effect is easy to misunderstand without data. The Temperature Strips are used in all sorts of applications. The strip reacts at different temperatures and a die leaks into an indicator panel marked with temperature graduations recording the highest temperature.

Thank you. At the manufacturing stage there would be a few options open to them to eliminate this issue. It will interesting to see which they choose

It isn’t essential but it would be better from an engineering aspect. The ‘clatter’ or catching will be on the bogie end because of the articulation, it’s reduced at the motor end. The ‘fuse’ function is better served near the drive source. Do come back with any observations in running 👍

Been speaking with Richard at TWW, he has shown and issue on the 43 shaft, in light of that I am recommending for a belt and braces approach, thick end into motor end. This more to counter any possible flex in the shafts.

​@HighFell the class 43 has problems too mines ok at the moment but I'll keep an eye on it. Thanks .

I have done an update video on the testing process and some speed step 1 running, it’s pretty impressive stuff! 😁

I’d loosen the cab floor and see if that frees it off. Not all 50’s pop shafts, a lot depends on layout and min radius and the shaft has to catch on the slots in the drive cup. If yours runs fine leave her be and save the pennies 😁

I din’t think it wouldn’t be a bad thing to have a pair of new shafts in the spares box. No issues with them so far, and my layout’s minimum curve is radius 3. And yes, I will take the body off Sir Edward and loosen the cab screws slightly. Thanks for the info!

Ladderman caused problems with barrels of stolen custard from Dylington….. Thunberg Petrochemicals are involved… 😳

@@HighFell need to get Red Buffers involved in the clean up. 🙂😃

I understand Red Buffers has lost the nameplate…..

Me too, special gift 😁

Absolutely no way the cardan shaft can come out from shaking, it is exactly the reason in video. Using established engineering techniques normally employed in high performance projects has confirmed it. 😁 I really want an early one … But….. 🤣

I dropped one of my 50s and the shafts stayed put!

@@mf303 I hope the 50 survived better than a loco I dropped. Hit a metal tool box draw on way down… a lot of pieces. It was a Tillig destined to be returned under warranty… non runner out of the box. It happens ☹️

@@mf303 it has to be poorly fitted then as one failed out the box and the repair just ran really slowly.

Did the shaft come out of the slow runner?

I need to speak with the Artist who created it. I can sell you an NFT for one….Crypto only

There is a link in description to supplier. At this point it is a TT:120 soloution for a problem motor. I might be wrong but I thought the older motors in other scales are pretty well covered. Let me know what you don’t understand 😁👍

@@HighFell amazing. Thanks 👍

Thanks for the kind words. TT:120 has really established itself as a scale with a strong positive and friendly community. Onwards and upwards 😁

d63oxfkn1m8sf.cloudfront.net/1217/0065/0861/HM7000_Series_Decoders_Reference_Manual_V1.3.0_-_201123.pdf

@@HighFell thank you awesome

@@ianhughes-zf1ll I’ll take that 🤣 no problem. I’ll still try and produce something that hopefully helps along with the manual 👍

Cheers Richard, likewise it’s great to see premium quality work being done. I was quite an effort to do the hours! I had to play trains for days! 🤣

@@HighFell 😂, "Im not playing"... Its research! 😂😂

@@ThisWayWorksTWW I’m going to get a lab coat and a clipboard then it can be proper research 🤣

@@HighFell don't forget the spotted dickie bow too - also save on hairdressing costs...

Thanks. Team effort 👍

This motor is a dual shaft one so could accommodate a flywheel although I haven’t found it necessary. The smaller motor I think is compromised as result of its smaller size. In other tests small coreless motors can’t manage the heat well and break up. Please come back with any developments trying your ideas 👍

Thanks Tim, I know there a few people at Hornby who subscribe and are following things so here is hoping they do some follow up work to f they are not already on the same page 😁👍

Richard has tried these with DC to buy bulk of testing was with me on DCC. It will be interesting to hear what you think Garry. They are super smooth and seem to have good motive power.

@HighFell Hopefully here soon Matt even though Ebay states next Wednesday. I am guessing he bought a few although Ebay only had 5 for sale. My hard part is which locos to fit them in. I think I will do various ones like the Jubilee, W/C etc to give a broad spectrum of my locos a chance and not just A4's.

I’ve fitted coreless motors to a few of my n gauge locomotives as has Richard from TWW. Completely transforms them imo.

@@michaelderozario5626 good to hear actual experience from others, thank you 👍

I didn’t realise he has sold out so soon! It’s a really nice kit and easiest to install which was important.

They are back in stock! rookie mistake by me 😶‍🌫😁

@@ThisWayWorksTWW and I’ve ordered 3 😊

Don’t worry Dave, we will keep your ‘wee’ trains moving 😁 I think between us we have clocked a few hours and actually put the OE motors to the limit of what they can do. I will interesting to see if the Varley controller helps the motors live longer on DC.

I haven’t as yet. One little issue is I film via my phone that I also use to do anything with the HM DCC App. What CVs are you thinking about or are you just finding a loco slow and don’t know? What loco is it?

@@HighFell hi again it’s the flying Scotsman

@@ianhughes-zf1ll ok, I’ll put something together on video. Have you read the manual for HM 7000/DCC? It’s really well written and not as scary to understand than any other literature I have seen on DCC. If you go to Hornby website, on menu select communities, Forum, HM 7000/DCC there is a stickie at top with links to all the guides and manuals . I’ll still see what Incan put together on some bits too. 👍

These MK1s seem to have only a small amount in most places but I repainted some Pullmans for a friend it was impossible to get the glazing strip out without shattering all the plain sections. Luckily a lot of time and patience I got it all back together but I used Humbrol Maskol on the other coaches. I didn’t fancy pushing my luck further!

@HighFell Pullmans repainted, to what? As far as I can remember I only ever saw Met Cams in Grey and Blue but not the slab sided brakes. By that time Mk1 full brakes were used.

@@garryhall5552It was a ‘special commission’ 😉

Great to hear, best compliment a modeller can get 😁👍

Thank you, it was either going to work or not! The lining took ages with phone in the way, I did the other side in no time without it. I was keen to show that although it’s a bit fiddly, it’s not actually that difficult. 😁

Excellent work as usual.

@@garryhall5552 Thanks Garry and thank you sharing the info about RailTec Transfers, used quite a few of their products and very impressed. 👍

@HighFell it is just a pity Railtec do not do any loco transfers for LNER/LMS etc but I guess these days most modellers are what I would call modern image. 70's onwards. I did ask Steve if he would do a sheet of coach roundels a while ago but so far nothing. The thing is he puts 3 on a sheet for a Warship diesel so should be easy to use the artwork on a plainsheet with about 30 on.

Ha ha, The McDonalds receipt! Was out walking brothers dogs yesterday and some scummy urchin threw their litter down the road. Not bright enough to realise they can be identified by the receipt. Logged it with the local council, someone won’t be loving that fine! I must have added the photo as I knitted the video clips together, it could have been 3 daft dogs too! Thanks 😁👍

I never thought about the receipt as a means to identify the person. Thanks for the info

It wasn’t meant to be here but a useful tip for those of us who hate littering. The order number on fast food receipts will tie up with ANPR/CCTV at the drive through or car park cameras.

@HighFell but in all honesty, the authorities sit back and do nothing. Still we live in hope

That’s not entirely correct, SK is a designation rather than a fixed specification. The specifications of the MK1 SK did vary and there were various modifications done by BR in service downgrading 1st to Standard classes etc so in that respect it’s on the money. You can be excited again 👍 Thanks for watching 😁

Thanks 😁

You are welcome to use any ideas 😁 The main loop backscenes are from ID, Dales and Moors in N. OO always looks oversize for TT:120. The quayside is a Gaugemaster Industrial one again in N but it would have been better if it was taller, like the ID one. Loads of choice but avoid the fancy glues, they don’t work. I prefer carpet tape now, some backscenes are ready self adhesive. Any wet glues will play havock with the printed backscene paper no mater how good it says they are. Wallpaper would be ideal! With RLM, the majority are configured to work with AC as per regular DCC track power. However it’s possible to make a DC RLM or if you can wait the new Hornby one will work both AC and DC but it’s still in development AFIK. Something to consider with RLM is if you are ‘double heading’ the current draw on the RLM may exceed what it can easily supply, I have just swapped out the Lenz unit for a Tam Valley ‘Frog Juicer’ that can be set up for both powering live point frogs or to act as a RLM, it has adjustable current settings. It will be a similar situation if you had an HST, both power cars having decoders, lights and sound, you will get a temporary stall and possibly drop in performance with the Lenz unit. If that’s not an issue, you could consider using a suitable AC power supply and the Lenz RLM will work with that fine.

As to motors, Hornby will look after any customer with motor repairs but they are currently only fitting the same spec as OE. You can check the videos I have done on DIY fixes. You can replace the end cap with the same BE brushes from a motor available on EBay, easiest, swap to an end cap with carbon brushes again from a motor available on EBay a little harder as the end cap needs preparation. There is no 12v N20 carbon brush motor currently available for a direct swap.

Hi High, 🤔😂 many thanks for your replies and info. I’ll look into the AC power supplies or maybe just wait for the Hornby RLM…… Still building at a leisurely pace. Benefits of retirement and “other” hobbies.😉🏍️ I’ll look to get some end caps for the motor issues when they become unbearable, but it’s a shame Hornby don’t currently offer any spare bits for us tinkerer’s to play with huh? Again, thank you much for your help and keep up the good work. TT120 is a lotta fun eh? Cheers Andy

Hi High Feller (again), Thanks again for all your help, you stated that I could use a “suitable” AC power supply that would work with the LENZ unit? Please forgive my ignorance, but would the TT120 locomotives work with an AC supply? (If so what type/ rating?) They are DC and after a little look on the interweb I see that some say they will work if they have ‘series’ motors. Really don’t want to fry the whole set up before I get to grips with it. Still building slowly, but would like to resolve the loop issue before adding the detail & scenics. Cheers Andy

Oh yeah, what height backscenes did you use? 9” or 15” The ID info states N scale are 9”. Just checking……… sorry again for all the questions.😢

Thank you, I found it a really great technique 👍