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What Created KYLO REN? Star Wars Analysis (Part One)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 ส.ค. 2024
- The creation of Kylo Ren took multiple situations and circumstances that eventually pushed Ben Solo into his dark side alter ego. This videos goal is to outline the main reasons Ben Solo chose the dark side. This is also a part one of two where part two will focus on Ben Solo's return to the light and what led him to make that choice. Star Wars has always been about how our past can shape who we are for the better or worse and in Ben Solo's case it happened to be both. And of course the manipulation of Ben Solo at the hands of Snoke and Palpatine played a heavy role.
#BenSolo, #KyloRen, #StarWars,
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Hey all! Enjoy my dive into what I believe are the main reasons Ben Solo took the dark path. There are plenty of ways to explore his descent into darkness but for now consider this an aggregation of what I learned about his history up until he joined the First Order. Please Like, Share, and Subscribe!
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AT-AT Chat yessir
Do you think you can do an analysis on Kylo's and Rey's relationship through the sequel trilogy (and any outside sources)
@@emilysanchez4584 I plan on it!
@@ATATChat Awesome! I really love your analysis videos
@@ATATChat Yay! I hope your thoughts on Reylo haven't soured even if you've had some trouble with some of the more extreme members of the Reylo community.
Its kinda funny how Kylo/Ben has this duo-self fufilling prophecy within his narrative, where everyone raised him to be "the next chosen one" and to stop him from becoming "the next Vader" and yet he kinda becomes the next Vader, but also aids in saveing the galaxy just as the chosen one did (Redemption death and stopping a loved one from turning to the dark and all)
There's something about everything in the ST being a sort of radical tug-of-war with each storyline that's really interesting to me, both a narrative and meta-narrative level - sometimes it works and sometimes it doesnt, but I think its particularly great with Kylo
The fact that Palpatine wanted to become a Force Dyad with Anakin makes his grooming of Ben through Snoke all the more creepier..
Hadn't even thought of that!
That was never expressively mentioned at the time of the prequels or the OT, there was never any mention of the word "Force Dyad" by Lucas at that time. He may have intended that but it was not explained. This all just feels like you're adding things together later after TROS and even they have just rehashed and pasted stuff together, like even Palpy and his return.
Ben Solo, manipulated since birth and living with Schizophrenia for his entire life, his personality twisted by the world that viewed him as a monster, abandoned by everyone who was closest to him, and eventually, the only emotion he could feel naturally is sadness and anger, which results in destruction. That's a depressing life. Ben Solo's whole life was doomed to fail from the very start, and he never really got to live. In a way, he is arguably the most tragic character in fiction, even more so than Anakin.
"I've been every voice you've ever heard inside your head." If that's not coding for mental illness, I don't know what is. Anyone in the audience who had mental illness and saw themselves in Ben really got the middle finger with TROS.
I always read Kylo has a guy who suffers with BPD
AT-AT Chat I agree, and with really bad upbringing that only makes it more and more diabolical. A very good character for psychology study 😂
@@Penelope1730 Well said, mate. The ST has such great ideas that were executed poorly. The child soldier part is a huge missed opportunity. At least with Kylo, Adam Driver gave a very layered and complex performance, yet his moments are so limited I am ultimately left craving for more, to know more about Ben Solo as a person. This more in-depth, emotionally complex part of SW can actually be a great area to explore.
@@ATATChat The trouble is you're trying to project real life issues onto these fantasy characters, its all just like Rian's approach to Luke in TLJ, as thinking of how we change when we get old and have a different view of life.
This kind of thought approach to me, goes against the whole escapism of "Star Wars". Its projecting "real life issues", like say drugs, mental illness, drinking problems, etc, etc, erm Bills? Rent? Fuel for your ships to travel through space? Its a fantasy those things should not be the issue.
This has been the approach with Disney Star Wars all the long, and there is a danger that later on they could even re-work the OT, making out certain characters were LGBT, and all this SJW politic.
This is the concern with this new Project Luminous and the "High Republic", that the characters are expressitly created purely through the mind set of "gender politics", and all this PC, SJW culture we have going on in this current time.
The difference with you TLJ and Disney Trilogy lovers, is you view Star Wars and it's characters through your current "real world" era that you are living in right now!
Those of us "hardcore fans", passionate fans, even "The Fandom Menace" as many of you call us, we all view Star Wars simply through the context of the Galaxy itself, that particular fantasy world, we relate to the characters through that existence, we dont try to relate them to our current world-view.
E.g. We dont try to analyze Anakin Skywalker and eventually Darth Vader from the point of view of seeing him having somekind of mental illness, he became psychotic. Although a psychologist could argue the character of Vader especially would amount to that if we looked at him from the view point of our "real world" here today.
We just look at him as this troubled damaged man, who became "twisted and evil" and a tragic figure.
You even say "I always read Kylo as a GUY WHO SUFFERS WITH BPD", there in yourself relating him to our "REAL WORLD". I myself have Bipolar but i dont look at these characters and try to relate the issues with them with anything from my own real world.
I look at these characters as being in their own world existence and it is a form of sheer escapism to me, i want to look at Kylo and his reasons for turning out the way he was as feeling hes struggling to live up to all this legacy, etc and thats it. I dont want to bring in mental illness to that character also.
I dont want to look at Luke's failure as all this political correctness, that hes just a guy in his 50s reaching old age just like a "REAL MAN" in our world, reaching somekind of mid-life crisis, this is frickin LUKE SKYWALKER to me! I wanted him to be brought properly out of that exile not struggle with self doubt or face any of the real problems we face because of our real world.
I relate to such characters by them doing things in the sense that is of the fantasy, which helps inspire me, not have them written from the view-point of my own REAL WORLD. Thats boring and horrible to me, this is about escapism.
Its like Obi Wan is supposed to be in his 70s by the point of episode 4. Is he doing his gardening, sitting by his fire? Pops down to the local cantina for a few games of like space-darts, does his laundry, plays the space equivalent of dominoes and collects his pension from the mos esiley post-office each week!?
No! Because this is meant to be the Star Wars Galaxy! It only very subltey reflects things in our real world, like the "Cantina" is equivalent of a pub or bar in our world okay. Jabba is equivalent of a slimey, no good Gangster in our real world, etc. But these things how Lucas approached them was NEVER right on the nose, they still had their own unique space, fantasym space opera (how ever you want to put it) feel to them.
Another e.g. The Jawas from Endor, Lucas had them inspired from the Vietcong and the Vietnam, a small, technologically inferior group of natives, who organize themselves into a force and manage (with help) to defeat a superior one. Its subtle and theirs a social commentary evident there but its not on the nose.
I love Kylo, he is genuinely one of the best characters in Star Wars in my opinion.
Aaron Jude I thinks so too.
Easily the best character of the sequel trilogy. I really wish there was more time developing him in the films, though.
this makes his death even more tragic, gosh he should have lived.... loved your video as usual
Hes alive in the force!
His so far 30 years of life has only been abandonment, suffering and destruction that fundamentally was not his fault. After his redemption he really deserves a second chance, not only to right his wrongs but also to really just, live...
You can’t keep a genocidal maniac that killed MILLIONS of people alive. I love Kylo. He’s my favorite Star Wars character. But it’s like keeping Bin Laden alive after he helped the US defeat a bigger enemy for one day.
@@Shortyd17 If you are making that analogy then in this version Bin Laden is a tragic schizophrenia patient who's been groomed and manipulated by someone else for the entire life. He wasn't born that way, he was groomed to be one.
Like I’ve Said in other videos, Kylo Ren is the best character in SW in my opinion. Just so interesting.
The fact that Ben Solo feels the weight of FOUR Rebellion heroes’ legacies makes “let the past die; kill it if you have to” make a lot more sense
I feel like all his life story is so tragic and sad I love when in the comics he said:” the dark and the light claimed me when I was born” I don’t remember it perfectly but it was something like that.
And tie was the only real Jedi of the group he never gave up on Ben well until Ren came in..... but Ren is Ren I’m still wondering who he was. He mentioned he was no one in the last comic.
Kylo/Ben I love both of them so different but so similar, differently form Vader and Anakin that think and act like different people. That’s how I see it.
Love the video as always good job AT-AT
It’s so sad that he had to die....... I’m not crying right now
I’ll go get some ice cream
I need ice cream too
Same here
This was so well done AT-AT! A very thorough analysis of Ben's fall. The comics gave us such a good story. I wish we could have seen it in the films (or as its own film). His life was just so tragically sad, it makes what happened to him all the more painful to think about...but at least JJ thought it was pretty fun! I think his chosen name of Kylo, proves Lor San Tekka right- he may try, but he cannot deny the truth that is his family. Although he strips away most of Skywalker and Solo (who he is) at the same time he doesn't allow himself to let go of those legacies completely. Ben could never sever that bond he has with his family _completely_ which was why he was affected so much by killing his father and by the death of his mother, and why there is still a remnant of the Skywalker and Solo names in his own. The name is a perfect representation of himself though, a true Skywalker and Solo who is trying to *literally* make a name for himself in the shadows of greatness. I'd be overwhelmed too if I had the lineage he has! Ben Solo is such a great character and indeed relatable to a lot of people. I hope we get more Ben content from DLF in the near future. Looking forward to part two of your analysis! :)
Sounds like a family with a lot of communication problems.
Funny you should say that. Movies with Mikey brings up that point!
Legacy's pressure.
That was the main reason.
100%
@@ATATChat Which it is kinda interesting. Rey wants desperately wants to be part of a bloodline and Kylo is like:
"Girl, don't."
At least in The Last Jedi.
In TROS he is more like: "Rey, you are a Palpatine. Now embrace your evil, girl."
Yup. Even the studio failed.
Why are you not huge on TH-cam yet. Best Star Wars channel by far on here
0:54 Wait, so I'm the only one who wants to murder someone with a lightsaber if someone pisses me off? Well, that sucks. All jokes aside, Kylo's feeling of pressure and living up to expectations is something I can relate to. Since I've always expected to live up to anyone's expectations, needing to have good grades to succeed in life has always been too much for me. It is one of the reasons why Ben Solo is my favorite character in the entire sequel trilogy, hell maybe the entire Star Wars franchise as a whole.
Hahahaha
"Wait, so I'm the only one who wants to murder someone with a lightsaber if someone pisses me off?"
Well no. Me too. Key word 'want' and not actually doing it.
Without doubt, Kylo Ren/Ben Solo is my favorite Star Wars character.
A person of taste 🤟
He's my favorite character period it used to be Jon Snow...
Very well said. It refreshing to hear someone understand that Luke thought about killing Ben, but stopped himself before he tried to. That terrible misunderstanding born from a moment of pure instinct is so important to get right
Man, I love these videos! Thanks, Nick!
*What created Kylo Ren?*
Me: Well when a Han and a Leia love each other very much....
IG11: acceptable!
Kylo should have been the main focus of the sequel trilogy. from his point of view
Agreed heavily
@@ATATChat Would've made it more clear to fans that he was antihero, rather than the villain they were expecting.
Perfectly wrapped up.
This channel has surpassed Star Wars Explained as my favorite Star Wars channel on the YouHoloTube. With the stay at home/social distancing orders I’m hoping to get more content soon
Hah! I dunno. Alex is the man! I can't compete with daily. At least not for now.
And what a fine aggregator you are ...biggest common denominator with Ren and Vader was being taken from parents at early age...AND neither were absolutely committed to the light as Ben Kenobi and Luke were, cultivating a hatred for the dark side would have helped them resist the temptation to fall to the dark but then hatred was a big no-no with Jedi (one of many misconceptions)
Darth Traya yes more misconceptions please
Alright I got something to do but I’ll check back in later and explain
Misconception Grande - taking younglings from parents at early age to train BAD IDEA, when a child is raised by strangers it struggles to learn love or trust, which leaves them vulnerable to those who would mislead them for personal gain...how often do Jedi go full on rogue/dark side? Then of course the big pacifist thing...left evil unchecked until Palpatine...well you know how that story turned out...
And I guess my biggest beef with the Jedi- attachment being forbidden- this ranks up there with priests not being allowed to marry- WHY? Makes no sense, the wise man King Solomon said “a threefold cord cannot quickly be torn apart” , he was referring to a marriage that included a spiritual element, if Jedi were allowed to marry I wonder what two people united in serving the will of the force could have accomplished?..prevented? Just a few issues I could probably go on but maybe I’ll save some of these pearls for my own TH-cam channel 😝...Darth Traya, the Wise ...
Darth Traya you make a good case maybe the empire really were the good guys....😂
I was just thinking, man atat hasn't uploaded in a few days, then boom I see this video!
If I was in ben's shoes, I would absolutely feel pressured to live up to my name and heritage. His turn to the dark makes a lot of sense. He's not just after power or trying to save his wife from death (IMO a kinda silly reason to kill children; looking at you ROTS). I also love how Ben created his name of kylo. Its weird but cool. Keep up the deep dives, I can watch them all day!
I could sense your power
I love it. I love it. I LOVE it. I so agree with you about everything. Thank you so much for voicing my opinion so perfectly
He had a lot to make him feel pressured. The grandson of Vader, son of rebellion legends, nephew of a Jedi and his family probably made him feel like he had to live up to them. Such things plus the secrets would be enough to make anyone snap
I really appreciate this video. It's a nice thing for me to send to my friends who are still confused but wont read the comics and such. A great summary and analysis of his tragic beginnings.
Poor Ben Q.Q Such a sad story.
I wanted to name this THE TRAGEDY OF BEN SOLO but I didnt want the internet to collectively weep with me.
@@ATATChat DEW IT
good video lots of detail one one of the best youtubers\
Ben's fall to the dark side took place in 28 ABY, meaning he was 23 years old at the time. That's one year older than Anakin was when he became Darth Vader in 19 BBY.
It wasnt when he was 24? Hmm, ill take the L on that one then.
I thought Anakin WAS 23?
@@NoahS4226 Anakin was 9 in TPM, 19 in AOTC, 22 in ROTS, 41 in ANH, 44 in TESB, and 45 in ROTJ.
I'm convinced that it's impossible to write a bad story for any Skywalker.
I think it's really interesting how Ben Solo is redeemed. You can see he now has a feeling of hope and purpose. He finally knows who he truly is. I can remember when Palpatine told Anakin about Darth plagueis the Wise. How he could save others from dying but not himself. What's really interesting is Ben saved Rey from dying but couldn't save himself, which adds another lie from palpatine.
Great video! You have such a good grasp of Ben's character!
I do think it's possible that Ben unintentionally caused the destruction of Luke's temple, as we know he has a hard time controlling his strong Force abilities when he's upset, and he definitely would be after what happened with Luke, so I feel like he may have accidentally unleashed the Force storm, but it also could've been Snoke or Palps. I honestly don't know why they're still being so mysterious about what happened that night considering that Ben is now redeemed and, y'know... dead.
But anyway, always love hearing your thoughts about my boy! Looking forward to part two!
Absolutely possible! And thank you 😊
I don’t know if this is the right place to post this... But if I was the one making the new Sequel trilogy I would have made the big bad Darth Plaguis. - Then when it came time to reveal who he was I would have done a flashback showing Palpatine killing him in his sleep and then showing how Plaguis came back. Showing how he managed to bring himself back. AND NO HE CANT COME BACK AS A CLONE. - That’s just stupid and lazy writing. - Still have him tempt Ben Solo and then showing how Ben fell to the Dark and his transformation into Kylo Wren. - I distinctly recall that it was impossible to clone a Force Sensitive.
I think at this point most people would have been into anything beyond the bloodline connection
I really love this channel, why? Because everyone is so mature and respectful in the comments and you really go in depth with the characters. I understand much more with this trilogy and began to love these characters even more.
I really wish they would balance the responsibility of Ben's choices with the fact that he was also a victim. It feels like they are playing up the victim thing too much. The part that really bothers me is the events of the destruction of Luke's Jedi temple. It was clearly written in TLJ that Ben had already turned and that he destroyed his temple. Both Luke and Kylo himself state that. He is still the villain. He is the villain, AND he is a victim that you can sympathize with. Some people can't hold those two truths in their head but that's what makes Kylo such a compelling villain. Seems like Charles Soule had a bit of trouble with that. Reylos have a very difficult time accepting that as well. It's as if so many fans are trying to erase accountability for his horrible decisions and actions. For example, so many Reylos think that in the TLJ throne room scene, Ben being empathetic and tender with Rey, when Rian Johnson himself has stated that he is using the "Rey Nobody" to manipulate her. AND he actually does believe what he is saying and that he IS the only one who can save her. It's again, the viewer needing to be able to hold two contradictory truths in their head. That Kylo was being honest with Rey but he was wrong and manipulative. Abuser's in relationships aren't just evil people. They have a very legitimate perspective that they think is right. Just because Kylo/Ben has a legitimate and understandable perspective that you can sympathize with, does not make it right. The two truths can exist. Just because you understand and sympathize with a character's perspective doesn't mean you have to agree with it. People are conflating being an understandable villain with not actually being the villain. It seems like Charles Soule is trying to erase all accountability for Kylo Ren and making his turn entirely a victim of his circumstances that were out of his control, which is an irresponsible stance and not great story telling. Nuance in SW is dead.
That is pretty much my exact problem with people's perception of the character, he is a villian, understandable how got to be a villian, but he still made choices that he isn't exempted from.
Great video with lots of awesome information. I'm looking forward to part 2.
Cool video! I’m excited for the next, choice vs destiny is such a big tug of war in Star Wars, but Kylo and Rey were cool for fans like me who had the original trilogy feeling like common knowledge before we saw them and the prequels we already knew the end result, Kylo’s story was so hazy and his destiny/choices were hard to predict at times. The comics have done a great job of building on that, that he never felt he was more than a pawn and that fight. I really feel his story resonates with how all people feel the pressure of expectations of others and their own, and how that can mess with your head and your sense of self, and you feel like your a monster when you ignore those expectations.
Your channel has become one of my favourite on TH-cam, keep it up!!👍
LOVE THIS❤️ Really good analysis👌 This also put some salt in my wound again, because you know, at the end, they just killed him, but hey!😅
Great video! Can't wait for Part 2.
The thing is that although Ben wanted to be his own man and master, the legacy of the light and dark family tie he had proceeded him no matter which way he went. He would always be in the shadows of either expectation. Now it would have been interesting to see him be the first to try and walk the fine line between the light and dark.
I’m not sure I take this comic to be canon. The problem is that you say it was Snoke/Palpatine that may have destroyed Luke’s Jedi Temple after the initial conflict between Luke and Ben, but in TLJ Kylo said to Rey, “Did he tell you what happened? The night I destroyed his temple, did he tell you why?”
Isn’t that Kylo admitting that he did it? The point being that this man Luke. who had trained him and partly brought him up, would turn around and try to kill him is not all that he seems? Maybe Rey shouldn’t trust Luke either? And in telling her that, did he take it too far and admitted that he destroyed his Uncle’s temple? It wouldn’t surprise me in the slightest that he would want to completely obliterate everything to do with his Uncle after such a betrayal.
The way I look at Kylos perspective is that he believes he is the cause of that destruction via Snoke telling him so. I think because of how he thinks about himself it might as well believe it was him that caused that damage. For me its always about how Ben thinks about it verse what literally happened. Thats why TLJ gave us three versions of the event. While its easy to say that the third version is true, each version has a bit of truth in it IMO. It all comes down to horrible communication on all acounts.
0:11 "Ben"efitial
😉
Thank you for this. Some people just dont understand he was as much a victim as a perpetrator.
Exactly! People are so quick to judge Kylo Ren way too harshly instead of understanding his character and they ignore the fact that Darth Vader did 100 time's worse than Kylo Ren did in terms of turning to the dark side.
So much more I need to read now. Thank you for opening the door to my curiosity.
Love the vids - keep ‘em coming!
"Ben-ificial" Hah! So good! 🤣
Teehee
Just got a subscriber! You do great work man, looking forward to part 2!
Love the video, but I still wanna know from Disney where Luke had his temple.
My head canon is lothol
@@ATATChat that's pretty interesting, would be a great callback to Rebels. For now, I just think it's a slightly less forested part of Yavin 4. Mainly because his temple was there in legends so I'm just sticking with it :p
I’m still mad at how they had a perfect nice new story to build with fin and did nothing with him
Yeah Finn felt like a prop to me.
Great video!!
Thank you 😊
"I've been waiting a long time for this..."
Hey! I’m waiting for your edit on Kylo Ren/Ben Solo...Now that most the scenes are out. I would love to see your edits. It’s always so good😍
I like how they kinda go into the psychological consequences and heavy burden that comes with being a legacy character. He was born with expectations put upon him that someone like Rey, who was a nobody for the longest time, would never have to deal with.
Brilliant!
Tw. Being an INFP Type 4 that has been average to very low and then to very high functioning at different times in my life (essentially describing Ben/Kylo/Ben)... Ben's arc was cathartic. I especially appreciated how quickly his entire personality spontaneously reintegrated the moment he had his Wizard of Oz "Had it in me all along" moment, that many of us Type 4's experience the millisecond before we start to living our best lives. People I know have this happen around their 30's but I think some of the suicides and drug OD's I know of are people who just can't take American society anymore and can't keep waiting for an answer ... so they kill themselves in an act of twisted self-"mercy". What an incredible character, representing him on-screen must have been so daunting. Respect for Adam Driver as an actor and a person.
Thank you. Your analysis really informs my #Fanfiction.
You wouldn't believe how much easier it is to choose a side - Dark or Light - than it is to balance the Force within. Ben almost has it. Rey is pretty much out of control at this point, as any passionate 20 year-old with too much power will be. It's a tempest.
One of the problems I have with the _Rise of Kylo Ren_ comic series is that it paints Kylo in an almost completely innocent light. That none of what happened was his fault, that it was everyone else's fault. That he never had a choice in the matter.
It honestly feels like listening to a teenager having a tantrum and claiming everyone is out to get them.
I don't think it made the claim he was without fault. He murdered people. I think what it does is paint a clear picture as to why he did what he did now. Vader originally was "just evil" with some minor character development in ROTJ/ ESB.
Then the PT we finally understand why he became Vader. Both could be looked at as two immature force users at the will of their emotional state, but for me, I think it's too simple a way to look at the story.
But you also aren't wrong that the story is painting a picture that he was forced into all of this.
Well, children and teenagers aren't mature enough developmentally to properly perceive and process their emotions to begin with and that's why certain situations that a mature, emotionally stable/healthy adult might be able to handle are traumatizing for kids. Ben was an (unstable) adult when he turned, but all the issues that played into his fall were brewing from the time he was a child when he didn't/couldn't know better. So in that sense he is innocent. His trauma and emotional instability were neither his fault nor his choice. Dismissing a kid's (teenager's) pain/issues ,or anyone's for that matter, because it doesn't make sense to us and we don't think "they have it that bad" is callous and ironically, it's the exact response that drives people into the same corner Ben was in - feeling no one cares or understands or sees them, hopeless and desperate; that if they're not always getting it right they are worth nothing and expendable. And really, the ending of TROS proved exactly that. No one is saying Ben/Kylo isn't responsible for all the horrible things he did later in life. Just saying that a little compassion and understanding of people's emotional struggles instead of outright dismissal would go a long way in giving a lot of the good for nothing "problem children" a chance to get it right.
Kylo's dark path could have easily been avoided if this happened:
Luke above Ben with an ignited lightsaber: Uh, surprise training!
Ben with a smile: Oh boy!
you should do a video about how anakin and ben are reverses of each other
Good idea!
@@ATATChat thank you
Ooh I'm gonna enjoy this!😏
I'm curious if he ever learned why Anakin became Darth Vader in the first place, especially of Padme's role.
Unclear for now. I was hoping the movies would get into it more. But 😐
The story of Ben solo could be really interesting in future stories, either explored in an animated clone wars style show or in live-action, with Sebastian Stan or another recast Luke, and this would really mend how people see Luke and Ben in the sequels, it wouldnt fix the trilogy but they could at least try to fix how people see the characters in those films
Thanks, Nick! 🌌
Thank you!
You're quite welcome, as always! 😻
Did Bloodlines occur before the destruction of the temple? In bloodlines Luke and Ben have been “out of contact” for about six months and Leia receives a handwritten message from, she assumes, Ben, telling her to run. This would indicate that Ben was with the First Order at this point? Where does the date for the fall of the temple come from? How long did Luke wait to tell Han and Leia what he had done?
Also we only have Ben’s point of view to say he overheard Han and Leia calling him a monster while arguing about him. Did they ever really, or was this another voice impersonation by the Emperor?
Snoke and Palpatine disliked this.
I need part 2
All these things are very true and understandable, the trouble is none of them were addressed in the Disney Sequel Trilogy and they really should have been. He just appears as Kylo slaughtering and killing, is all lost, you can see he is lost and very conflicted even in TFA but we are never given any insight into how he got to that point.
Yes the comics fill all that in now later on, but at the time we never had that and this is one big flaw of the Disney Trilogy especially on the part of Kylo Ren. I know they wanted to keep mystery and intrigue throughout, but these things should have been subtly revealed and explored at some point in TLJ, with clever writing i think.
If I was in Ben Solo’s position, and if my parents neglected or abandoned me, I don’t think I’d be so forgiving at first. Like Ben, I’m probably gonna have a lot of anger and mistrust before I eventually forgive them.
I think the main issue is he realizes they never truly did anything of the sort. Sure, they weren't perfect but Ben had snoke in his mind making sure Ben took everything personally and negatively.
That's why the book doubles down so hard on being sent away to become a Jedi as him feeling rejected // then it leads to Luke. So Ben also focuses his anger on Luke at the entire family/ Galaxy.
It's a little silly to explain in that way I guess but it's what I think was going on in his mind concerning his parents.
He believed what that voice was telling him until Leia died etc.
AT-AT Chat I know that, but Ben has a right to feel angry.
In TFA when Han confronts him, Kylo does back away from him a little. So yeah, there's clearly a bit of tension there.
Fun fact: Ren also means "lotus" in Japanese.
I know a lot of people didn't get why he idolised Vader so much, especially considering that he was redeemed. The way I saw it he felt expected to live up to his name as "Vader's Heir", not just by Snoke but probably by his subordinates as well. Another idea is that he sees Vader as a somewhat father figure, similar to how he used to look up to Luke and Snoke. It's funny how he calls Rey out for looking for her parents in Han and Luke when Kylo/Ben's does the exact same thing.
What created Kylo Ren?
Bad parenting, overpowered Siths, and dead people talking (In your head, dreams and helmets.)
Boy, I wish this was what the movies were about...
What do you mean? Ive been talking about this stuff since TFA. Its all there. Its just without context. I knew the second Kylo Ren met Tekka that he was either Luke or Hans kid. Turned out to be Han. TFA, TLJ, TROS function very well with Kylo. Other characters not so much.
@@ATATChat I mean that actually exploring that part of Ben Solo's story would've been way more interesting to see onscreen instead of the shoddily mishandled focus on Rey being the main character and none of the other characters being developed AT ALL. EVERY character in this trilogy -- legacy or otherwise -- was just a human (or droid) mystery box.
@@ATATChat Also, NOTHING in the sequel trilogy expands on anything from the previous six movies AT ALL. What a waste...
I'll say it. Kylo ren has a better story than Darth Vader
F I T E M E
I think Snoke or Palpatine split the ground open two separate Kylo and Rey to prevent her from finishing him off in "The Force Awakens "
Interesting thought! I havent thought of that before.
you can completely understand how he fell, from his point of view he was attacked betrayed and lied to made vulnerable to manipulation, this is a brilliant video!... I'm currently doing a Star Wars poster and I'm currently asking other big star wars fans what there favourite Star Wars characters are so I can include it, is there any character that you would like to see? :)
Hey thanks for the kind words! I'd love to see Ben Solo! Hah
@@ATATChat anytime I really enjoyed it! and consider it done! :)
🤟
Yessir
Who ever reported u didn’t know go content
Ben Solo is named after two fake names. His initials are literally B.S. Shit, I'd turn to the dark side too if that was the case.
LMFAOOO
@@ATATChat glad you appreciated the joke lol. All kidding aside, your channel is one of my favorites on TH-cam, and your fight scene analysis videos are my personal favorites. Thanks for the awesome Star Wars content, keep it up!
How is he being himself taking advice from Snoke telling him who he is supposed to be? Lol
...that's the point
Rey raised as nobody,was more lucky than Ben.She had to deal with abandonment, loneliness and survival but she didn't have to carry on her shoulders the most evil name in the galaxy plus the poisonous heritage of that name. Ben on the other hand wished to be no one because his heritage was to heavy to let him breath. Leia and Luke failed to inform the right time Ben about his grandfather .Maybe Sidious was manipulating their minds all along, shadowing their judgement, the same way he did with the Jedi council.
Question is what were Han and Leia doing with Ben all this time. Were they going around giving Ben this idea that he wasn’t good enough? Rey was abandoned, but partly she was sustained was the idea that her parents were going to come back for her and they did love her (which we saw in TRoS). I think that Ben suffered from binary thinking. He had this notion that he must be good and heroic like his parents or else he was worthless. That’s what led to bade behaviour and the rebellions and acting out.
I think it's about his perception vs reality. Palpatine absolutely used his influence on Ben's feelings. It's mentioned a bit in the Tros novel that he hoped palpatine wasn't back and that he worried that was that quiet voice always in the back of his head. So creepy 😨
@@vittoriacolona Han and Leia, especially Leia,couldn't handle this combination that Ben was, the all mighty Skywalker blood and genes with the golden but also scoundrel's Solo heart. Plus the fact that Ben was their only child facing all along loneliness. It's the very first thing that he sences in Rey in the interrogation scene and makes his compassion for her to grow and grow.He sences things in her that he is facing all the time and make him understand that she is his soulmate equal not only in the Force.That's the reason that his feelings for her grow faster than hers, plus the fact that he is 10 years older than her ,a man ,when Rey is still a teenager.
@@ATATChat Very creepy. We see and feel that in the excellent beginning of TROS, where the lighting and the camera changes angles showing Emperor's horrible face, his twisted,diabolic nature.
BEN-efficial
This is what happened when parents are not always around their child. The child either mature early or grew up to be a brat
Ben is sounding a bit like Anakin
I had no idea thats how the name Kylo came about
Super strange/ sad/ creepy right??
@@ATATChat its like he wanted to keep his identity yet break it apart and make it his own. Its always a conflict with Kylo and thats why i think he had the most potential to really stand out as a character & it just wasnt shown properly in the films..i think you do an amazing job in explaining his character bc i never really understood him till i watched your videos :)
Always thaught that kylo was a refference to swolo but thats just me...
He's actually 13 years old in bloodline
Wrong. The story takes place one year before his turn. He's roughly 23/24 at the time of Leia's outing to the Galaxy.
@@ATATChat bruh he legit looks like a teen in the comics, how tf is he 23/24?
@@splashnskillz37 Some people just look very younger then they are.
Kathleen Kennedy Did she had them fuck up the story so he got mad and turned to the darkside he only came back to the light because the rise of Skywalker was the final movie nd he said fuck this shit
Why is the comments section at the very top. This change was not needed.
Disney did
Ha, BENificial lol
Ruin Johnson ruined Luke Luke would never try to kill Ben in his sleep that’s not the Luke I know because Luke saved Vader who killed billions of not trillions of people but tried to kill Ben who barely had conflict in him
Plus ruin Johnson said he never cares about the canon here’s your sweet video to prove it m.th-cam.com/video/eHWwQlA59Aw/w-d-xo.html
Kylo ren was created from a lack of reading the on going popular novel settings, allowed to use the star wars logo before the reign of Nazi Disney, of the star wars universe in which Han and Layla have multi children not just one and ANAKIN ii ends up being the powerful one not Ben~albeit maybe he might have had his moment in the light later.
disney soo power but to cheap to pay good writers to make a good movie
instead lets a nerd make up his own BS and then a non Star wars fan to make the 2nd disaster and then to rehire the nerd to make up watchable nonsense at least.
Terrible writing man.
It's all preference I guess. Some folks believe Anakins portrayal was masterful some still fight about it. If you don't like the sequels it's all good ,🤟
@@ATATChat saul goodman