I actually had the EXACT same thought!! He is a Mercedes guru!! Not that Chris isn't but it's always good to bounce ideas off other very knowledgable TH-camrs.
You are a really smart guy and as an automotive engineer, I enjoy watching your builds and troubleshooting as it is highly educational for all interested in auto tech. Two thoughts and one that wasn't clear. I would have done a lot of things you did only out of your sequence. Your MAF's. If you have two MAFs...you touched on this...but I would switch MAF position however keep them connected...not disconnect one or the other or both and see if your code reader reflects bad lambda on opposite bank. Your engine PCM would be a second thought but to me, more remote. A positive note. Thank your lucky stars it isnt compression related or your bottom end. Be encouraged by that very important fact. This is fueling related. I wouldn't have bought new injectors because you switched them and same issue on pass side bank. I though you may get joy with your intake gaskets. Switching coil packs won't matter. To me, your pass side bank is getting the wrong AF and its all the things in that stream that may contribute are candidates. Any sensor specific to pass side bank needs to be scrutinized because driver side bank is fine. Lastly, consider this a great learning opportunity. Watching your videos, there isn't anything you can't do. Pull the engine PCM and reseat the harness connector to the PCM. Check your grounds. Moisture and short jaunts to work is likely your root cause over time. You may have a connector or harness glitch aka moisture ingression...or rusty ground. All the best.
Can you plug a "noid light" into one of the bad cylinders to see if injector pulse looks different than a good cylinder at 1500 rpm when it craps out? @@ChrisSullivan69
@ritt6676 Presumably that would be a slam dunk that the injector signal goes bad for misfiring cylinders...but yes, a good way to differentiate whether its bad fueling or...ignition is cutting out at 1500 RPM. Spark & Fuel is all it could be because he has solid compression. Good suggestion. Seems like it has to be fueling...but maybe ignition is cutting out oddly at 1500 RPM on pass sd bank. Maybe check coil pack voltages on pass side.
Hi Chris. Mb tech here. I had something similar a while ago, same car e63 with m156 “my own car” I had bad fuel pressure, first thing I found was braided hose from supply to rail hole size had reduced by half at the rail end, That helped get better pressure but didn’t fix it, next I changed fuel filter “complete sender unit” again increased pressure more but did not fix, then I changed the fuel pump control unit! And like magic that was the end of my problems! Similar to you random missfire terrible performance coating and spluttering. Check for codes in fuel pump control. All the best buddy.
My first thought was crank sensor. They heat soak, cause misfires, can even cause it to not run. Once it cools off it will fire and run fine. Can be hit or miss too. The random cylinder to cylinder misfire is usually the biggest indicator of this.
Had this issue with my clk 320 although mine would just cut out , worth while changing though . Was wondering is it could be a wiring issue from the ecu to the injector or the banks of coils , I would check the ecu plugs to see there is not green or corrosion , good luck mate
The issue for a bad crank sensor is when it get's to hot it shuts the motor down (sputtering till it die) if you let it cool down you can fire up the motor back up and drive it in limp mode. The first time I experence this I had no CEL. The second time I experience it I got a CEL before the symptoms happen and by that time I was already at the shop. The crank sensor goes bad I would say 85k-120k miles. I would only stick with OEM replacement because I had an aftermarket one in there and only lasted 6 months not even.
m278/GL550 owner here... check your harness and sensors for oil. its a common problem in early MB sensors for them to have a leak which caused oil to wick up into the harness and cause all kinds of weird problems. theres an updated set of cam position sensors and a cam cover plate reseal that fixes it for the m278's... perhaps similar for yours.
Good suggestion! but on the M156 with oil on the injector plugs - its actually oil passing through the old injectors after 14 years due to the oil in the intake manifold.
This is likely correct. I found some oil in injector plugs likely from oil passing through injectors. Cam harness and everywhere else is clean though. I believe I've narrowed it down to a VVT issue.
those plugs look like you're running pretty lean with all that ashy white deposits on them maybe look into getting a more dialed tune on the car. also i would check the resistance/ ohms on all the plugs and see what they read and compare them to Mercedes spec. do the same with the coil packs. I'd also try to get in contact with Alex at Legit Street Cars, he was a head Mercedes Tech for a number of years when these car where out and has had multiple M156 cars in his life. he'll probably have about 5-10 different things you can try to help diagnose this issue.
Chris the ‘while you’re in there’ guy. You should try the coils. Mine went into limp mode bcuz of it at one point. Maybe this is the case with yours. Ur trying things out and ur trying things out bruv. Or even the sensor of the coils/plugs/injectors. I have a feeling it’s something so small that it’s the least you’d expect
You mentioned oil in one of the injector plugs. I just watched a video by Dave’s Auto where they discussed bad oil wicking in Mercedes cars. Check the cam position sensor for oil contamination in the plug/harness. Worth the look at least.
I had 2 M156 C63s and a weird fix that worked for the 15k miles I drove was replacing the gas pedal. It would go into limp mode at certain travel and throw random misfire codes. Got a cheap used pedal and it fixed my issue. Hope you figure it out! Hearing yours makes me want another.
Great vid. I have w204 c63 and had a similar issue. It turns out the problem was with a small but almost unnoticed vacuum leak from the catch can. You notice it limp only when you get off throttle. Do another vacuum test and smoke it out this time. Check the return on the back of the intake manifold. Mine wasn't connected properly, also on the catch can, had a small the vacuum leak at the can. Check it again man. As for the pcv, I customized mine to make a permanent fix for it. The one from Mercedes is a poor design. I used a better oil hose. Good luck
Hello, I had the same issue as you. Once I start the car, it's fine, and revving in neutral causes no problems, but under load, the misfire starts between 1500-2500 RPM on the driver’s side bank. When the car warms up, the misfire gets worse. Here's what I did: I checked several forums on Google and saw your post on MB TECH. I replaced the MAF sensor, fuel pressure sensor, and both the exhaust and intake cam solenoids. I also checked the ECU because the fuel injectors were continuously pushing fuel. When I opened the ECU, I found one circuit was dead, so I replaced it. I also cleaned the fuel system since it hadn't been cleaned, and the car hadn't driven for 7 months after the engine blew (I replaced it with a brand-new engine). After all that, the car ran great.
It prevents oil vapors from building up in the engine, which can pressurize the system and cause problems. It basically catches and condenses oil vapor, which is why it collects oil and needs to be emptied periodically.
@@ChrisSullivan69 Chris! I grew up a tomboy, and always worked on my own cars. Being a single mom, I wanted to make sure that my son was proficient in taking care of his own car. So I taught him at a young age. My son and I enjoy watching your channel when he comes over to visit (because he misses mom’s food) from time to time. I noticed when you were talking about how long you’ve been driving you said 15 or 16 years I was a bit surprised, don’t take offense to that because I thought you were older than my son. He will be 34 this year. Which freaks me out! I’ve been driving 39 years this year with my learners permit and next year will be 40 years with my license. Ouch! (I am old!) 😂
I had a fuel pump going bad that did the same thing. Random Misfire on the cylinders closest to the fuel source. Just wasnt putting the pressure out under load that it needed to.
Ya, my original thought was injectors or fuel pressure regulator. So if its not the pump or anything else he did or mentioned, I am wondering if there is perhaps an ECU issue. Sometimes the capacitors swell on them and it can wreak havoc.
@TheSwampDonkey mine was a problem for months before the pump fully gave out. I also spent a long time troubleshooting and swapping parts to try to get the problem to follow to different cylinders.
Commenting before finishing the video - I had a really similar problem on my mustang several years back. Car was shaky and ran like crap out of nowhere (also catless). Replaced O2's and several other items and the issue didnt go away. Found a random post somewhere about a fuse that had blown for a driver on a brand new car that was causing a very similar issue. Low and behold a $1 fuse was replaced, check engine light went away and the car ran fine from then on. I don't know how relevant this may be, but I thought it was interesting.
Chris you mentioned seeing oil in the fuel injector harness. That's a big red flag. Oil can wick into the craziest places and cause all sorts of issues with the ecm. I'm not sure if each bank has separate harnesses on that motor for coils/ injectors but that would be my first thing to inspect. Good luck
You mentioned oil in a harness. Not sure if this motor uses a similar harness as the M278 but in that motor the cam sensors let oil past the plug and into the harness causing all kinds if issues. It actually works it's way back to the ECU and fills the ECU with oil. I would check all harnesses. there should be no oil in any of them.
Hey Mr.Sullivan, great content. I love how you got a lot of amazing cars to show to your community. I love how you work on them, and I appreciate your motivation on always finding a way to fix them when they break. I also love how you take on different brands and mix it up a bit. It’s interesting and very cool. All in all be safe and continue to work hard and to live your dream. Again thank you for the amazing content and videos and live it up 💯💯💯🫡
Can't say I've ever worked on a Mercedes but, this definitely seems to be a wiring issue. You made mention that there was oil in the harness for some reason and that can cause connection issues. I'd go over the wiring harness for the injectors, ignition coils, and see if there's any loose ground cables that possibly connect to the cylinder head? Thats my 2 cents as a diesel mechanic that works on semis. Best of luck
Oil in injector harness connector is a flag. Oil can travel through out the harness and eventually fail that harness. Hopefully not but check each end of that injector branch for oil and fingers crossed it didn’t make it to the main harness.
I really enjoyed the video. Hopefully you get to the bottom of the issue. My '11 E63 is on 111k now and it just keeps putting a smile on my face. My water pump pulley seized and threw off the serpentine belt recently. I wish had more time and knowledge to try and repair these things myself but thankfully I've got a great Mercedes specialist nearby.
@ChrisSullivan69 From what I researched mine was one of the last engines made with the original headbolt design. It was so cheap and local to me though that I couldn't turn it down.
I agree with everybody, Funny the whole time I was watching your video I was thinking you need to talk to Alex. He worked at a Mercedes service center for quite a while. Oh, and don't forget to change your battery key. 🙂
This one is a real test of your diagnostic skills. I'm betting money on you to find and repair the problem. Looking for the fix on the next video. Great video Chris.
Hey Chris, Sounds super frustrating. You have permission to turn off the TCS and throw a sick burnout when you get it fixed. Couple of suggestions: 1. PCV Catch Can hoses. Did you flush these out? Could one be blocked, or split? 2. Fuel Rail Pressure. Actual vs sensor reading (Signal) to ECU? I'm not sure if there is separate LH / RH Fuel Sensors? Further to this, did you replace the Fuel Filter? 3. As others have mentioned, oil in the harness sounds like an issue. Can you remember, was this just on the LHS or evident on both sides? Hope this helps.
I had a moisture problem with my 5.4 f150, same issue just driving short distances, I ran sea foam (oil additive) through it just before oil change, and changed oil early for a couple changes. After wards started letting it get up to temp before driving as much as possible Also might be worth changing the cam solenoid it’s not getting proper oil pressure for the phasers
Hey Chris - My 2008 E63 is literally being worked on for a few different problems. The one thing I didn't see you check out closely was the manifold you removed. I may have missed it. Mine had cracks in it and causing all kinds of junk to get into my engine etc. You'll want to check where the bolts secure the manifold to the engine. They are also doing the lifters etc and a rear main seal which is also a problem with the car. Hope this helps. Raffi, San Jose, CA
I've seen in other videos with similar issues it was a tuning issue. I could be wrong, but I seem to remember you mentioning you did a tune when you put the long tube headers on. Not sure how to check for that, but just a thought.
Hey Chris, don’t be disheartened brother! If these cars weren’t worth it they sometimes would make us earn them, lol Seriously Bro, I have learned so much from watching your videos. I have a 2012 CLS550, and watching you have literally given me the courage/confidence to get into my ride! Thanks again and I have complete confidence that you’ll discover what lies in Your way brother!
I would do 3 things 1) install new battery, 2) replace fuel pump, fuel filter, fuel pressure sensor and 3) as your gas tank is empty put in 5 gallons of 93 octane fuel. If it isn’t the fuel pump/filter/pressure sensor then it’s probably bad throttle position sensor. Good luck with the fix! I had a similar issue with my E46 M3 a few years back, replaced the plugs, coils, throttle position sensor and it turned out to be a bad fuel pump.
How is the quality of the Crank Angle Sensor signal and the Cam Position Sensor signals? Its been a bit since I was an ASE Tech, but if i recall correctly, Crank signal will dictate coil firing, and Cam position will dictate injector firing. Admittedly, I am not familiar with the 6.3, but would be something I would take a look at. I imagine it has a hall-effect style sensor on the crank, verify integrity of the ring, and face/output of the sensor.
Mis-fire is usually spark plugs and/or coils. Dealt with that before (Subaru), not fun with a Boxer engine. I actually keep the same OBD Scanner in that car just for those occasions.
Hey Chris! a guy online with the 2010 E63 AMG had the same problem and the resolution for him was replacing the "Key Ignition"... Definately check that. Maybe something with that wigs out and thinks the key is turning off the car. Good luck brother!
Oil near your wiring sounded scary. Could an oil pressure sensor have failed and be leaking oil into your wiring harness? VW Tiguans had a recall for something similar with coolant, it would work its way all the way to the ECU. Good luck, keep us posted!
Chris, just found your channel! Our 21 yo son just bought the same car and has been following your videos. He also shared you got a C8, we have one too and the boys love it but I prefer my Porsche 356 replica. Love your show, glad our son shared it with us! Can't wait for your next video! We know you'll figure out whats up!
I don't even change the battery on my Cadillac these days. I'm starting to think these cars don't like running without cats. I'd go w/ a performance cat & see what happens.
😮Nice chris uploaded. Damn my break is only 15 minutes 😢..OK finally had time to watch the whole video. Good to see you have issues like all of us where you fix something thinking that was it and nope. I'm sure 100% of us have faith you will figure it out. I actually wanna see this more then the cobra videos now lol
"we will be 2500 into this thing and might be not running right" hit me hard... I have a 5.5BT E63.. was misfiring badly as yours.. bought coils, sparks, o2s... ended up being 1.. ONE spark plug had the inner ceramic loose.
Chris, don't let it whip ya! You'll get to the bottom of the problem. Like others have mentioned, this is being for a collab with Alex Palmeri, from Legit Street Cars!
You need to do a flywheel adaptation. That block of 1500 rpm to 2500 rpm where this misfire occurs proves that this is the problem. If you replace the motor mounts or a cranksaft position sensor then this adaptation is crucial. However, if there is a problem in the driveline with some weird vibration like a crack in the flex plate then this will cause this adaptation to go haywire. Get a scanner that can reset this adaptation.
You should swap the VVT Acuators or Solenoids. They are right in front of each side of engine. That controls the timing for each side of the engine. You swapped everything else. I’m pretty certain that should be your problem.
Please don’t waste your money on plugs your problem is the coil packs have failed please try to replace them first before the intake manifold so much work for something your over looking it’s your coils promise I’ll pay for them if I’m wrong
Giving me flashbacks of an old car. I’m sure you know this but o2’s take a minute to warm up and on start up your car is in open loop. Once the o2’s heat up it enters closed loop, wondering if you try just unplugging the front O2’s altogether if the car will revert to the map sensor/speed density rather than maf and O2’s then you’ll know if you have an o2 short or problem
Can’t wait to see what it was but I was betting on Camshaft position sensor. But then you opened your intake manifold and I seen your throttle body’s and you had 2 butterfly plates and one looks pretty cracked up . Not sure that would matter, but like others have said, call legit street cars Alex! I love that guy!
I had a similar issue in my Escalade. But the code was clear that it was a bad injector. I ended up doing all four on that bank because I destroyed them removing them! 😂 th-cam.com/video/yvbegd8w-EE/w-d-xo.htmlsi=yG-cN5ZxCVXcdb9s
Man I was hoping you'd look at the fuel pressure at wide open throttle, see if it dips. Also the long term fuel trims on both banks would be interesting to see. Watch short term at full throttle/when the misfires happen. To test the MAF, I'm sure you tried swapping them and checking to see if the codes moved to the other bank but another thing you can try is look at the live data from both MAFs while you rev the engine, they should be close in grams/second. You can also see if someone has known good MAF values for that engine at idle and at 100% load and compare them with your reading at idle and full throttle/100% load. O2 sensors rarely go bad, the pre cat sensors get hot very fast, some even have an internal heater so I doubt condensation can make it go bad in a year. Good luck 😅
Ill put a pressure gage on the fuel line check if the pressure don't go down the normal values on 1500-3000 rpm it probably the problem. could be the line pump or filter dirty. hopefully you will not need to change the fuel pump. but higher % of water in your fuel can do that especially if it parked outside in the cold weather. same you find in your catch can.... but to be honest to me it look like faulty Air flow mass sensor but it probably the fuel the causing miss fire.
You have any room to put the 02 sensor bungs 90* to the pipes instead of at 45* or so? That angle could be collecting water and shorting out the sensors.
I'm not sure you'll have them in the states but here in Europe we have GPF/DPF or particulate filters in the exhaust system these clog up & cause rough running putting the cars in "limp home" mode. Might be worth a check to see if you guys have them too.
Had the same issue with an old Chrysler mini van , checked the throttle position sensor and that was the fault . Just had a dead spot in that position. Replaced and all was good unti the trans went out a month later lol 😂 … you may have the same problem … but hey , I’m a diesel mechanic not a car pro
Damnnnn! I was really hoping the engine would behave.. lol.. I watched this whole video with my heart in my lap.. Sorry Buddy. Hope next time you’ll get it fixed
I'm thinking before you put those catch cans on there is what's causing a problem. I'm no mechanic but listening to everyone hypotheses it may warrant a further look. Those cans were a mess,I can't imagine it before you had them.
Jokes on them, don’t have cats part had me rollin🤣🤣🤣🤣 ( Milwaukee has a like 6 pcs kit that attaches to your shop vac and each piece has a different diameter hose on the end, for vacuuming up stuff in small hard to reach areas. I have since bought the kit ( love it ) and have retired my sheets milkshake straw from active duty )
Keep the catch can next to engine or exhaust, it needs proper heat to thaw and circulate properly. I got this info from a Bmw mechanic that was very smart, why you think factory cars pcv are in the engine or around it.
My head dropped the second that check engine light came on right at the end of the video! I want to know what it could be. What about new coilpacks. And or change out coilpacks one at a time and see if the missfire changes cylinders?
The computer is seeing lean on the downstream O2, so it’s figuring the motor really does need the fuel. If the downstream sensor was connected after the car it would read rich too and throw an O2 code.
This is the thing with 2000+ model year cars that start aging. Some just aren't dependable at 10-20 years of age. It's not how it was getting a 80s or 90s car and make it dependable 20 years later with ease.
That motor looks remarkably similar to the engine in your cobra both in construction and the way things are laid out, Spark plug location, timing chains all very similar in design.
When you swapped injectors from left to right banks and nothing changed, I immediately started thinking it was a bad sensor, relay or melted wire.. got to be something electrical on the first bank
Dang man, just watched the whole thing hoping for the happy ending. At this point, my brain says it's either a tune issue (unlikely as it's always bank one) or a wiring/ground issue. Grounds are a PITA and especially up where you are with all the corrosion, this reaks of electrical problems.
This wont fix your major problem but will fix your minor problem, if it was me I would defiantly remove the catch can and return it to stock. The issue I have had using catch can in cold conditions is the engine internal air cools down too much and creates water in the catch can which cools any oil vapour and then that is caught in the catch can. I moved back to stock set up and no water in the drained sump oil or creamy oil was in the engine sump from then on with years of drained engine oil checking.
If u still don’t know The filter is right their n the front so watch the video n go to 48:50 n where u hav your light it’s the black thing right in front of it n if u haven’t checked the fuses, maybe but I also thought it was a fueling issue hope u get her right soon
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Everybody wake up! Chris posted!
😂😂😂😂
💪🏿🔥
Facts!
@@bernardowens1648yes😂. Ooh😮 B I’m😢🎉
P
😂😂😂 exactly how i am!😂😂
Need to get Alex from Legit Street Cars in here! These are his forte...
Was thinking the same thing... and he can help Alex with the cobra win win.
@@nicholasfoley7105 Exactly!! It’s a win for both channels!! And I’m sure a lot of us follow both of them!!
I actually had the EXACT same thought!! He is a Mercedes guru!! Not that Chris isn't but it's always good to bounce ideas off other very knowledgable TH-camrs.
was thinking this same thing too! think of how Sic that content would be to watch too!!@asfoley7105
I was thinking of Alex too! 😂
You are a really smart guy and as an automotive engineer, I enjoy watching your builds and troubleshooting as it is highly educational for all interested in auto tech.
Two thoughts and one that wasn't clear. I would have done a lot of things you did only out of your sequence.
Your MAF's. If you have two MAFs...you touched on this...but I would switch MAF position however keep them connected...not disconnect one or the other or both and see if your code reader reflects bad lambda on opposite bank.
Your engine PCM would be a second thought but to me, more remote.
A positive note. Thank your lucky stars it isnt compression related or your bottom end. Be encouraged by that very important fact.
This is fueling related. I wouldn't have bought new injectors because you switched them and same issue on pass side bank. I though you may get joy with your intake gaskets. Switching coil packs won't matter.
To me, your pass side bank is getting the wrong AF and its all the things in that stream that may contribute are candidates. Any sensor specific to pass side bank needs to be scrutinized because driver side bank is fine.
Lastly, consider this a great learning opportunity. Watching your videos, there isn't anything you can't do. Pull the engine PCM and reseat the harness connector to the PCM. Check your grounds. Moisture and short jaunts to work is likely your root cause over time. You may have a connector or harness glitch aka moisture ingression...or rusty ground.
All the best.
All good info. I did switch MAFs and plug them both in, no change. Didn't film it though, video was getting too long lol
Can you plug a "noid light" into one of the bad cylinders to see if injector pulse looks different than a good cylinder at 1500 rpm when it craps out? @@ChrisSullivan69
@ritt6676 Presumably that would be a slam dunk that the injector signal goes bad for misfiring cylinders...but yes, a good way to differentiate whether its bad fueling or...ignition is cutting out at 1500 RPM. Spark & Fuel is all it could be because he has solid compression. Good suggestion. Seems like it has to be fueling...but maybe ignition is cutting out oddly at 1500 RPM on pass sd bank. Maybe check coil pack voltages on pass side.
@@ChrisSullivan69 could it be something electrical TO the MAFs? Is there a ground to check or a fuse or ECU issue?
Put a fuel Gadge on it and make sure when you give it throttle it gets higher pressure .
Hi Chris. Mb tech here.
I had something similar a while ago, same car e63 with m156 “my own car”
I had bad fuel pressure, first thing I found was braided hose from supply to rail hole size had reduced by half at the rail end, That helped get better pressure but didn’t fix it, next I changed fuel filter “complete sender unit” again increased pressure more but did not fix, then I changed the fuel pump control unit! And like magic that was the end of my problems!
Similar to you random missfire terrible performance coating and spluttering.
Check for codes in fuel pump control.
All the best buddy.
Good suggestion
Where is the fuel filter on this thing anyways lol
The fuel filter is under the rear seat on the drivers side, fuel pump is on the passenger side rear seat
Part of the fuel sending unit under the rear drivers seat. @@ChrisSullivan69
@@AMGmeister ur the goat man
I'm recently a former owner of C63 AMG with an M156, yes, this is definitely real life.
My first thought was crank sensor. They heat soak, cause misfires, can even cause it to not run. Once it cools off it will fire and run fine. Can be hit or miss too. The random cylinder to cylinder misfire is usually the biggest indicator of this.
I second this. Bad crank sensor for me caused multiple cylinder misfires
But wouldnt a bad crank sensor affect both banks?
where is the crank sensor located ?
Had this issue with my clk 320 although mine would just cut out , worth while changing though . Was wondering is it could be a wiring issue from the ecu to the injector or the banks of coils , I would check the ecu plugs to see there is not green or corrosion , good luck mate
The issue for a bad crank sensor is when it get's to hot it shuts the motor down (sputtering till it die) if you let it cool down you can fire up the motor back up and drive it in limp mode. The first time I experence this I had no CEL. The second time I experience it I got a CEL before the symptoms happen and by that time I was already at the shop. The crank sensor goes bad I would say 85k-120k miles. I would only stick with OEM replacement because I had an aftermarket one in there and only lasted 6 months not even.
Whelp gotta drop what im doing for an hour 😅
You need to get a hold of Alex at LSC in Chicago. Between the two of you, yall can figure this out
Apes knows his stuff
m278/GL550 owner here... check your harness and sensors for oil. its a common problem in early MB sensors for them to have a leak which caused oil to wick up into the harness and cause all kinds of weird problems. theres an updated set of cam position sensors and a cam cover plate reseal that fixes it for the m278's... perhaps similar for yours.
Good suggestion! but on the M156 with oil on the injector plugs - its actually oil passing through the old injectors after 14 years due to the oil in the intake manifold.
If you find oil in the wiring/sensors for bank 1 but not in bank 2 ,,that could be it.
It may have been triggered by having a blocked PCV system.
This is likely correct. I found some oil in injector plugs likely from oil passing through injectors. Cam harness and everywhere else is clean though. I believe I've narrowed it down to a VVT issue.
I want to believe it's a sensor issue. Check map sensor if the car has it. Make sure that and maf sensor readings ok?
You will make it run better. You always do. Love your knowledge of cars and patience to work on them properly.
those plugs look like you're running pretty lean with all that ashy white deposits on them maybe look into getting a more dialed tune on the car. also i would check the resistance/ ohms on all the plugs and see what they read and compare them to Mercedes spec. do the same with the coil packs. I'd also try to get in contact with Alex at Legit Street Cars, he was a head Mercedes Tech for a number of years when these car where out and has had multiple M156 cars in his life. he'll probably have about 5-10 different things you can try to help diagnose this issue.
I haven't watched the whole video yet, but I'm going with the low key battery as the source of your problems. 🤭
Chris the ‘while you’re in there’ guy.
You should try the coils. Mine went into limp mode bcuz of it at one point. Maybe this is the case with yours. Ur trying things out and ur trying things out bruv.
Or even the sensor of the coils/plugs/injectors. I have a feeling it’s something so small that it’s the least you’d expect
Haha..when I clicked play, i was wating for it: "IT JUST NEEDS A CLUTCH". I love it! This needs to live on and on!
You mentioned oil in one of the injector plugs. I just watched a video by Dave’s Auto where they discussed bad oil wicking in Mercedes cars. Check the cam position sensor for oil contamination in the plug/harness. Worth the look at least.
I had 2 M156 C63s and a weird fix that worked for the 15k miles I drove was replacing the gas pedal. It would go into limp mode at certain travel and throw random misfire codes. Got a cheap used pedal and it fixed my issue. Hope you figure it out! Hearing yours makes me want another.
Hmm strange
Great vid. I have w204 c63 and had a similar issue. It turns out the problem was with a small but almost unnoticed vacuum leak from the catch can. You notice it limp only when you get off throttle. Do another vacuum test and smoke it out this time. Check the return on the back of the intake manifold. Mine wasn't connected properly, also on the catch can, had a small the vacuum leak at the can. Check it again man. As for the pcv, I customized mine to make a permanent fix for it. The one from Mercedes is a poor design. I used a better oil hose.
Good luck
Hello, I had the same issue as you. Once I start the car, it's fine, and revving in neutral causes no problems, but under load, the misfire starts between 1500-2500 RPM on the driver’s side bank. When the car warms up, the misfire gets worse. Here's what I did: I checked several forums on Google and saw your post on MB TECH. I replaced the MAF sensor, fuel pressure sensor, and both the exhaust and intake cam solenoids. I also checked the ECU because the fuel injectors were continuously pushing fuel. When I opened the ECU, I found one circuit was dead, so I replaced it. I also cleaned the fuel system since it hadn't been cleaned, and the car hadn't driven for 7 months after the engine blew (I replaced it with a brand-new engine). After all that, the car ran great.
dude i have NO clue what a catch can even is - yet here i am watching an hour long video and fully invested
Glad you enjoyed it!
It prevents oil vapors from building up in the engine, which can pressurize the system and cause problems. It basically catches and condenses oil vapor, which is why it collects oil and needs to be emptied periodically.
@@ChrisSullivan69
Chris! I grew up a tomboy, and always worked on my own cars. Being a single mom, I wanted to make sure that my son was proficient in taking care of his own car. So I taught him at a young age.
My son and I enjoy watching your channel when he comes over to visit (because he misses mom’s food) from time to time. I noticed when you were talking about how long you’ve been driving you said 15 or 16 years I was a bit surprised, don’t take offense to that because I thought you were older than my son. He will be 34 this year. Which freaks me out! I’ve been driving 39 years this year with my learners permit and next year will be 40 years with my license. Ouch! (I am old!) 😂
Chris is attempting to keep that catch can from becoming "Kick the Can" 😂
You know your ocd is top tier when your straw vacuuming the valley. As always, another dope video Chris !
Dunkin donuts straw FTW
I wonder if Alex from legit street cars can help you out 🤔
I had a fuel pump going bad that did the same thing. Random Misfire on the cylinders closest to the fuel source. Just wasnt putting the pressure out under load that it needed to.
Ya, my original thought was injectors or fuel pressure regulator. So if its not the pump or anything else he did or mentioned, I am wondering if there is perhaps an ECU issue. Sometimes the capacitors swell on them and it can wreak havoc.
@TheSwampDonkey mine was a problem for months before the pump fully gave out. I also spent a long time troubleshooting and swapping parts to try to get the problem to follow to different cylinders.
Might be the pump. I noticed the dash said 37 miles to empty. Not good to run that low, especially in cold weather
Commenting before finishing the video - I had a really similar problem on my mustang several years back. Car was shaky and ran like crap out of nowhere (also catless). Replaced O2's and several other items and the issue didnt go away. Found a random post somewhere about a fuse that had blown for a driver on a brand new car that was causing a very similar issue. Low and behold a $1 fuse was replaced, check engine light went away and the car ran fine from then on. I don't know how relevant this may be, but I thought it was interesting.
Definitely worth checking the fuses. Could be an easy fix.
Chris you mentioned seeing oil in the fuel injector harness. That's a big red flag. Oil can wick into the craziest places and cause all sorts of issues with the ecm. I'm not sure if each bank has separate harnesses on that motor for coils/ injectors but that would be my first thing to inspect. Good luck
The wiring harness may have oil throughout
Was going to mention this I’ve had it happen on my semi
He pretty much said it himself
You mentioned oil in a harness. Not sure if this motor uses a similar harness as the M278 but in that motor the cam sensors let oil past the plug and into the harness causing all kinds if issues. It actually works it's way back to the ECU and fills the ECU with oil. I would check all harnesses. there should be no oil in any of them.
This is also an issue with the M156. Unplug your injectors and see if you oil in the connections
Yo my wife has a 2012 ml 350 and she had a oil cam issue. Cost 7k to fix. Had to pull the engine. Lucky she had a warrenty.
My brother was a tech at Mercedes. He did a few oil in the harness jobs. Engine has to come out 🤑🤑🤑
Hey Mr.Sullivan, great content. I love how you got a lot of amazing cars to show to your community. I love how you work on them, and I appreciate your motivation on always finding a way to fix them when they break. I also love how you take on different brands and mix it up a bit. It’s interesting and very cool. All in all be safe and continue to work hard and to live your dream. Again thank you for the amazing content and videos and live it up 💯💯💯🫡
This is like a suspense film. I hope the sequel brings good news.
M156 owner here! Awesome video, I hope you figure it out soon. Love watching your videos!
Can't say I've ever worked on a Mercedes but, this definitely seems to be a wiring issue. You made mention that there was oil in the harness for some reason and that can cause connection issues. I'd go over the wiring harness for the injectors, ignition coils, and see if there's any loose ground cables that possibly connect to the cylinder head? Thats my 2 cents as a diesel mechanic that works on semis. Best of luck
Oil in injector harness connector is a flag. Oil can travel through out the harness and eventually fail that harness. Hopefully not but check each end of that injector branch for oil and fingers crossed it didn’t make it to the main harness.
I really enjoyed the video. Hopefully you get to the bottom of the issue. My '11 E63 is on 111k now and it just keeps putting a smile on my face. My water pump pulley seized and threw off the serpentine belt recently. I wish had more time and knowledge to try and repair these things myself but thankfully I've got a great Mercedes specialist nearby.
Nice! The 2010-2011 E63 are quite rare!
@ChrisSullivan69 From what I researched mine was one of the last engines made with the original headbolt design. It was so cheap and local to me though that I couldn't turn it down.
I agree with everybody, Funny the whole time I was watching your video I was thinking you need to talk to Alex. He worked at a Mercedes service center for quite a while. Oh, and don't forget to change your battery key. 🙂
This one is a real test of your diagnostic skills. I'm betting money on you to find and repair the problem. Looking for the fix on the next video. Great video Chris.
Fingers crossed!
Get a fuel pressure gauge hooked up and get readings at WOT and the range where the light comes on.
Hey Chris,
Sounds super frustrating. You have permission to turn off the TCS and throw a sick burnout when you get it fixed.
Couple of suggestions:
1. PCV Catch Can hoses. Did you flush these out? Could one be blocked, or split?
2. Fuel Rail Pressure. Actual vs sensor reading (Signal) to ECU? I'm not sure if there is separate LH / RH Fuel Sensors? Further to this, did you replace the Fuel Filter?
3. As others have mentioned, oil in the harness sounds like an issue. Can you remember, was this just on the LHS or evident on both sides?
Hope this helps.
I think it's something electrical, possibly the ECU or some other computer or module. Great video ⚡⚡
I had a moisture problem with my 5.4 f150, same issue just driving short distances, I ran sea foam (oil additive) through it just before oil change, and changed oil early for a couple changes. After wards started letting it get up to temp before driving as much as possible
Also might be worth changing the cam solenoid it’s not getting proper oil pressure for the phasers
Hey Chris - My 2008 E63 is literally being worked on for a few different problems. The one thing I didn't see you check out closely was the manifold you removed. I may have missed it. Mine had cracks in it and causing all kinds of junk to get into my engine etc. You'll want to check where the bolts secure the manifold to the engine. They are also doing the lifters etc and a rear main seal which is also a problem with the car. Hope this helps. Raffi, San Jose, CA
Thanks! I checked the manifold for cracks when I had it off
@@ChrisSullivan69 This is incredibly frustrating. Bummer.
I've seen in other videos with similar issues it was a tuning issue. I could be wrong, but I seem to remember you mentioning you did a tune when you put the long tube headers on. Not sure how to check for that, but just a thought.
Hey Chris, don’t be disheartened brother! If these cars weren’t worth it they sometimes would make us earn them, lol
Seriously Bro, I have learned so much from watching your videos. I have a 2012 CLS550, and watching you have literally given me the courage/confidence to get into my ride! Thanks again and I have complete confidence that you’ll discover what lies in Your way brother!
Thanks 👍
I would do 3 things 1) install new battery, 2) replace fuel pump, fuel filter, fuel pressure sensor and 3) as your gas tank is empty put in 5 gallons of 93 octane fuel. If it isn’t the fuel pump/filter/pressure sensor then it’s probably bad throttle position sensor. Good luck with the fix! I had a similar issue with my E46 M3 a few years back, replaced the plugs, coils, throttle position sensor and it turned out to be a bad fuel pump.
Chris, you have the patience of Job! Hopefully others will have solid fix suggestions. Just think of how satisfying it will be when she is fixed!
Hopefully get it figured out soon!
How is the quality of the Crank Angle Sensor signal and the Cam Position Sensor signals? Its been a bit since I was an ASE Tech, but if i recall correctly, Crank signal will dictate coil firing, and Cam position will dictate injector firing. Admittedly, I am not familiar with the 6.3, but would be something I would take a look at. I imagine it has a hall-effect style sensor on the crank, verify integrity of the ring, and face/output of the sensor.
Great advice. Cam position sensors visually look ok, crank position sensor is on my list
Mis-fire is usually spark plugs and/or coils. Dealt with that before (Subaru), not fun with a Boxer engine. I actually keep the same OBD Scanner in that car just for those occasions.
Rerun the cam adjuster adaptations and check for timing chain stretch. The Autel can show the adaptations live as well.
Hey Chris! a guy online with the 2010 E63 AMG had the same problem and the resolution for him was replacing the "Key Ignition"... Definately check that. Maybe something with that wigs out and thinks the key is turning off the car. Good luck brother!
Oil near your wiring sounded scary. Could an oil pressure sensor have failed and be leaking oil into your wiring harness? VW Tiguans had a recall for something similar with coolant, it would work its way all the way to the ECU. Good luck, keep us posted!
Can you take it to the dealer and get them to run it through DAS ? See what they get , sometimes can show more than what’s on the small scanners .
That might be the next step lol
Chris, just found your channel! Our 21 yo son just bought the same car and has been following your videos. He also shared you got a C8, we have one too and the boys love it but I prefer my Porsche 356 replica. Love your show, glad our son shared it with us! Can't wait for your next video! We know you'll figure out whats up!
Damn man!! Wish I was as Mechanically inclined as you are.. Would save me so much money!!
I don't even change the battery on my Cadillac these days. I'm starting to think these cars don't like running without cats. I'd go w/ a performance cat & see what happens.
😮Nice chris uploaded. Damn my break is only 15 minutes 😢..OK finally had time to watch the whole video. Good to see you have issues like all of us where you fix something thinking that was it and nope. I'm sure 100% of us have faith you will figure it out. I actually wanna see this more then the cobra videos now lol
Thanks for the video Chris! Hope you get this baby figured out!
"we will be 2500 into this thing and might be not running right" hit me hard... I have a 5.5BT E63.. was misfiring badly as yours.. bought coils, sparks, o2s... ended up being 1.. ONE spark plug had the inner ceramic loose.
Lmao hindsight being 20/20
Chris, don't let it whip ya! You'll get to the bottom of the problem. Like others have mentioned, this is being for a collab with Alex Palmeri, from Legit Street Cars!
This is my second favorite four-door sports sedan. The E55 is my all-time greatest!
Yo bro what do you do for a living your doing pretty good for yourself I respect it
Counterfeit spark plugs? Contaminated fuel?
You need to do a flywheel adaptation. That block of 1500 rpm to 2500 rpm where this misfire occurs proves that this is the problem. If you replace the motor mounts or a cranksaft position sensor then this adaptation is crucial. However, if there is a problem in the driveline with some weird vibration like a crack in the flex plate then this will cause this adaptation to go haywire. Get a scanner that can reset this adaptation.
I think this may be an electrical issue maybe a burned harness or a short some place, bad connector?
You should swap the VVT Acuators or Solenoids. They are right in front of each side of engine. That controls the timing for each side of the engine. You swapped everything else. I’m pretty certain that should be your problem.
Hi bro, try Intake manifold gasket hope it will work
Please don’t waste your money on plugs your problem is the coil packs have failed please try to replace them first before the intake manifold so much work for something your over looking it’s your coils promise I’ll pay for them if I’m wrong
If it was the coils why wouldn't the problem follow the "bad" coils to the drivers side?
Giving me flashbacks of an old car. I’m sure you know this but o2’s take a minute to warm up and on start up your car is in open loop. Once the o2’s heat up it enters closed loop, wondering if you try just unplugging the front O2’s altogether if the car will revert to the map sensor/speed density rather than maf and O2’s then you’ll know if you have an o2 short or problem
Clean your Maf as well
Can’t wait to see what it was but I was betting on Camshaft position sensor. But then you opened your intake manifold and I seen your throttle body’s and you had 2 butterfly plates and one looks pretty cracked up . Not sure that would matter, but like others have said, call legit street cars Alex! I love that guy!
I had a similar issue in my Escalade. But the code was clear that it was a bad injector. I ended up doing all four on that bank because I destroyed them removing them! 😂 th-cam.com/video/yvbegd8w-EE/w-d-xo.htmlsi=yG-cN5ZxCVXcdb9s
Man I was hoping you'd look at the fuel pressure at wide open throttle, see if it dips. Also the long term fuel trims on both banks would be interesting to see. Watch short term at full throttle/when the misfires happen.
To test the MAF, I'm sure you tried swapping them and checking to see if the codes moved to the other bank but another thing you can try is look at the live data from both MAFs while you rev the engine, they should be close in grams/second. You can also see if someone has known good MAF values for that engine at idle and at 100% load and compare them with your reading at idle and full throttle/100% load.
O2 sensors rarely go bad, the pre cat sensors get hot very fast, some even have an internal heater so I doubt condensation can make it go bad in a year.
Good luck 😅
Ill put a pressure gage on the fuel line check if the pressure don't go down the normal values on 1500-3000 rpm it probably the problem. could be the line pump or filter dirty. hopefully you will not need to change the fuel pump. but higher % of water in your fuel can do that especially if it parked outside in the cold weather. same you find in your catch can.... but to be honest to me it look like faulty Air flow mass sensor but it probably the fuel the causing miss fire.
It’s the coils my guy promise I had the same problem on my c63 with the m156
You have any room to put the 02 sensor bungs 90* to the pipes instead of at 45* or so?
That angle could be collecting water and shorting out the sensors.
I'm not sure you'll have them in the states but here in Europe we have GPF/DPF or particulate filters in the exhaust system these clog up & cause rough running putting the cars in "limp home" mode. Might be worth a check to see if you guys have them too.
Had the same issue with an old Chrysler mini van , checked the throttle position sensor and that was the fault . Just had a dead spot in that position. Replaced and all was good unti the trans went out a month later lol 😂 … you may have the same problem … but hey , I’m a diesel mechanic not a car pro
Those plugs look very white like you’re running lean. Fuel delivery
Just a heads up, those O2 sensors heat up when you turn the vehicle on. It will melt those plastic caps. Love the content.
I know the front ones do, wasn't sure about the rears. We shall see lol
I was thinking the same.
Damnnnn! I was really hoping the engine would behave.. lol.. I watched this whole video with my heart in my lap.. Sorry Buddy. Hope next time you’ll get it fixed
You and me both!
Move to Florida. It's fun here. We don't like the northerners moving here but I think we can make an exception for you.
I'm thinking before you put those catch cans on there is what's causing a problem. I'm no mechanic but listening to everyone hypotheses it may warrant a further look. Those cans were a mess,I can't imagine it before you had them.
Jokes on them, don’t have cats part had me rollin🤣🤣🤣🤣 ( Milwaukee has a like 6 pcs kit that attaches to your shop vac and each piece has a different diameter hose on the end, for vacuuming up stuff in small hard to reach areas. I have since bought the kit ( love it ) and have retired my sheets milkshake straw from active duty )
Need to look into that lol
Keep the catch can next to engine or exhaust, it needs proper heat to thaw and circulate properly. I got this info from a Bmw mechanic that was very smart, why you think factory cars pcv are in the engine or around it.
My head dropped the second that check engine light came on right at the end of the video! I want to know what it could be. What about new coilpacks. And or change out coilpacks one at a time and see if the missfire changes cylinders?
Hey Chris it's Chris! I keep a set of primary o2s in my trunk of my w211 E63. Its tuned as well and known issue with them tuned!
THESE VEHICLES ARE KNOW FOR PUSHING ENGINE OIL THRU THE WIRING HARNESS
The computer is seeing lean on the downstream O2, so it’s figuring the motor really does need the fuel. If the downstream sensor was connected after the car it would read rich too and throw an O2 code.
This is the thing with 2000+ model year cars that start aging. Some just aren't dependable at 10-20 years of age. It's not how it was getting a 80s or 90s car and make it dependable 20 years later with ease.
My favorite channel!
That motor looks remarkably similar to the engine in your cobra both in construction and the way things are laid out, Spark plug location, timing chains all very similar in design.
Try crank position sensor or cam position sensor. When failing, they can both cause misfires. HTH
The only thing that makes sense is the camshaft adjuster. You also had noise on cold startup on the last video, which is a symptom.
Adjusters are recently rebuilt and don't make any noise at startup
@@ChrisSullivan69considering you changed o2 sensors before you got all that water out of the catch can it’s highly possible you fried one again
Check for ECU for oil contamination
This car with just headers and off road x pipe is soooooo good!
It's unreal. Absolutely love it lol
When you swapped injectors from left to right banks and nothing changed, I immediately started thinking it was a bad sensor, relay or melted wire.. got to be something electrical on the first bank
Hey Chris, I'd like to see your wall of RockAuto magnets like we all have.
Dang man, just watched the whole thing hoping for the happy ending. At this point, my brain says it's either a tune issue (unlikely as it's always bank one) or a wiring/ground issue. Grounds are a PITA and especially up where you are with all the corrosion, this reaks of electrical problems.
Pretty sure you have to take the plastic caps off the rear O2. Not sure but i think the O2 heats up.
This wont fix your major problem but will fix your minor problem, if it was me I would defiantly remove the catch can and return it to stock. The issue I have had using catch can in cold conditions is the engine internal air cools down too much and creates water in the catch can which cools any oil vapour and then that is caught in the catch can. I moved back to stock set up and no water in the drained sump oil or creamy oil was in the engine sump from then on with years of drained engine oil checking.
I was jonesing for a Chris video yesterday over a good Sunday AM coffee. Was watching a 99 cobra video when this popped up. Attaboy Chris!
If u still don’t know The filter is right their n the front so watch the video n go to 48:50 n where u hav your light it’s the black thing right in front of it n if u haven’t checked the fuses, maybe but I also thought it was a fueling issue hope u get her right soon
I've a m156 too. But always have a problem reading the EO level off the dip stick. A few tries and they always give different levels. Any advice guys?
I have somewhat noticed this as well
@@ChrisSullivan69any tips? Mine burns 1 quartz per 1k miles. So EO level reading is important for me. 😂
Damn, I thought you had it there for a minute. I can't imagine how much the stealership would have to diagnose this
Same, seemed like it took longer to go into limp mode lol
Check the lines of catch can and clean it🧐