Between the testing I did in this video and some since then one additional, important conclusion I've made is, that while FSR may or may not have a significant effect on average FPS depending on the game, it has a significant effect on 1% low FPS in every title that supports it. The gameplay with FSR enabled is significantly smoother than without it.
I would presume it is “just” the upscaler you have used (now that it is only recently frame generation has been added). It is bit annoying both Nvidia and AMD has put new features into the upscaling name, making it very confusing what exactly has been used, lol.
I would love a quantified look into how Frameworks recommended linux disrtos preform with the battery saving tweaks and without. Also the mention of comparing the framework AMD to the MacBook M2 or M1.
Great comment. Have a 11th gen for my wife. Just ordered an amd for myself now that my laptop died... and it being an acer nothing is replacable. Even the battery is glued in.
The best I have gotten is to install the framework bundle first then upgrade just gpu and chipset drivers to latest. This has given me the best setup so far for everything.
9:09 Not me yelling at my screen to throw a nade and use overshield haha. All jokes aside nice vid CJ, was curious on this topic so was good to see. Bummer about the drivers hopefully AMD can fix those soon!
I have seen the problem with drivers shown on 14:07 before and from my experience it should be easily fixable without reinstall. Windows is trying to keep the drivers updated on its own and then there's a mismatch of versions between the Adrenalin and the drivers used. You can actually fix that without reinstalling the drivers by going to Device Manager, pick Update driver on the GPU and then pick the correct driver version from the drivers already on your computer.
Someone on the forums ran 3DMark, and found that Vulkan tests ran faster than DirectX tests. Maybe using DXVK/VKD3D would give better results? I also wonder how the Linux drivers fare…
Thanks so much for another extremely helpful report. For me I think it is not if but when to update my current 13th gen Intel Framework 13 to AMD. Not quite yet, maybe, but updates will help soon, we hope!
Baldur's Gate 3 uses FSR 1. Even on my 7700XT, you can see the same type of drop in image quality by turning it on at 1440p Ultra. I was hoping to see patch 4 at least update it to FSR 2 but it didn't, from looking at the the patch notes. I haven't installed the patch, yet, due to all the reports of people having issues with it. As it stands, it's not worth bothering with FSR in the game, if running on most of the more recent AMD GPUs. If I were playing on my 2in1, I may have to turn FSR on to get anywhere near a good experience.
I could see this internal graphics being almost enough for me since - VR aside - Cyberpunk is the most demanding game in my collection actually. Maybe by the time I actually need an upgrade for my desktop (my laptop is ThinkPad X250), I might go with a framework eGPU combo instead and things have been ironed out even more.
the driver issues is 100% windows’s fault, I’ve had the same issue on Intel laptops where windows constantly wants to update drivers with older/broken versions.
I wish I knew the Framework laptops just 1 year ago before getting my latest ultra portable laptop. I just really want to know what is the program that You use to show the numbers of the system during the game play in the top left.
Contemplating the Framework 16, but I use an Intel chip based TB3 external NVIDIA GPU as my work docking station, and I'm not sure how well it will work with AMD and USB4. I'm also apprehensive about using Radeon graphics again. My last laptop with it crashed all the time just trying to watch youtube. Same with my gaming desktop with a RX6800, and then a 7900 XTX. (both clean installs) I ended up selling the XTX for a big loss to get a 4080S, which has been much more stable.
I'm on the lookout for a work laptop that can also play Skyrim and Fallout 4. Your tests show okay framerates for Skyrim, but were the fans going full blast? Perhaps not really a good option except for very casual games?
Curious if you'd consider doing this for the framework 16? I know it has a built in GPU option, but I'd love to see how that compares to an eGPU setup on the 16 (and I cannot find anyone who's actually tested it). I've heard it's built in GPU option isn't the greatest (nor would I expect that much given its only $400) But to use it with a high end GPU basically requires an eGPU but I don't know if its worth going that route.
Wondering the same thing. I have a thunderbolt 3 eGPU docking station with a RTX 4060. Works great on my old intel laptop, even with light gaming, but I really want to upgrade to the FW 16. But if I can't use a nice 1 cable solution with AMD, that's a no go for me and limits my 16" laptop choices.
Since Occulink isn't a practical option on the Framework you're still going to have the USB4 bandwidth restrictions which will very likely reduce the performance of the 7600M to barely above the integrated 780M. However, I'd be very happy if someone proved me wrong.
I think egpu should be rhe future it will save hardware time and thermals in that they will make laptop more cheaper and build great and support for thunderbolt 5 or 6 in the future
I've got a 12th gen Intel Framework running Linux Mint and have been considering migrating entirely over to using it with an eGPU rather than having a dedicated gaming PC and a laptop. I was about to buy an eGPU enclosure but had some people mention that currently the technology really struggles with high refresh rate monitors. Have you experienced this at all? I have 3 144hz displays and would like to continue playing games at that refresh rate, at least on 1 of them at a time.
I would never do reviews in 1080p but instead 720p windowed or on Linux whatever setup with nearest neighbour upscaling. I dislike the lack of exclusive fullscreen in modern games.
Now I do wonder if Framework 16 screen is better for gaming. It could also be interesting if there was various screens for specific tasks like productivity and gaming.
Great testing! But I really hope your monitor didn't get "hurt" too much. The unit is called "Hertz" both in plural and singular, because that was the guy's last name. This triggers me sometimes😅. Never mind, currently waiting for batch 5 and quite hyped also thanks to your video. BG3 seems to run quite well for an iGPU.
The M.2 WiFi slot is only an x2 connection. You can connect it to the M.2 SSD slot but then you would have to run the OS via a USB drive, which comes with its own problems.
I honestly had a better egpu experience (7640U+razer core x+ gtx 1070) On windows 10 ltsc was getting a solid 81 fps 1080p max settings on farcry 5 with no stutters and really smooth. From my experience its a lot more stable to use a Nvidia card as the Egpu as it's drivers doesn't conflict with the igpu. However an AMD egpu is fine with a intel igpu. Will be getting the onedock soon do will be testing occulink and USB4 performance using it
If I remember correctly on the GTX 1070 Far Cry 5 ran at about 100 FPS at 1080P ultra when it came out over 5 years ago. What does it run at with the 1070 in a desktop with a current CPU today?
@@ElevatedSystems I was getting around 95 fps on my desktop same card. In this case the bottleneck doesn't really affect the gameplay. However witcher 3 next gen update struggled a lot but then again all systems do
I feel framework in general needs more spotlights and recognition. No other laptop company is coming close to offering something so repairable and so much upgradability
@LagiohX3 it's not 850 when I'm looking, and a laptop with a gpu will only run for an hour on battery 😂. They are basically pointless unplugged from the wall
Let’s face it.. the framework laptop could have been an amazing project but it failed in various aspects. It’s not mainstream - fine was to expected, it’s not a creator laptop - fair enough most would go with apple, but it aims to address nerds and tinkerer. However, despite the fact that all forums where full with the just one wish: ECC as the new amd chips fully support it framework went to the „fu-route“ to save 5cents for leaving out traces. 2nd wish was open source firmware - line tuxedo. „But it is fully repairable“ yea.. so is the steam deck for a fraction of the price. I still don’t understand how you can just treat the Audience like that. It just LTT recommending this box.
Between the testing I did in this video and some since then one additional, important conclusion I've made is, that while FSR may or may not have a significant effect on average FPS depending on the game, it has a significant effect on 1% low FPS in every title that supports it. The gameplay with FSR enabled is significantly smoother than without it.
Thanks, man. I love portable computing 🖥 .
I would presume it is “just” the upscaler you have used (now that it is only recently frame generation has been added).
It is bit annoying both Nvidia and AMD has put new features into the upscaling name, making it very confusing what exactly has been used, lol.
I would love a quantified look into how Frameworks recommended linux disrtos preform with the battery saving tweaks and without. Also the mention of comparing the framework AMD to the MacBook M2 or M1.
As an 11th gen i5 framework owner looking to upgrade, I can't tell you how much I appreciate this AMD mainboard video series you've been working on.
100% worth it. made the upgrade too
Put a preorder in yesterday - thank you so much for your coverage, we really need this company to succeed.
Out of curiosity, which batch is is in? Is It expected to be shipped in Q4 2023?
It's a win win if they do. If they're successful they will push other companies to allow for more customization and upgradability and repairability.
Great comment. Have a 11th gen for my wife. Just ordered an amd for myself now that my laptop died... and it being an acer nothing is replacable. Even the battery is glued in.
Can't wait to see the Framework 16 review and how a gaming-focused framework laptop handles AAA titles!
Same
Expansion Card plugged into iPhone at 12:02 😆
The best I have gotten is to install the framework bundle first then upgrade just gpu and chipset drivers to latest. This has given me the best setup so far for everything.
That's exactly what I did.
9:09 Not me yelling at my screen to throw a nade and use overshield haha. All jokes aside nice vid CJ, was curious on this topic so was good to see. Bummer about the drivers hopefully AMD can fix those soon!
Yooooo I've been waiting for this laptop!! Thanks for doing this vid!
I have seen the problem with drivers shown on 14:07 before and from my experience it should be easily fixable without reinstall. Windows is trying to keep the drivers updated on its own and then there's a mismatch of versions between the Adrenalin and the drivers used. You can actually fix that without reinstalling the drivers by going to Device Manager, pick Update driver on the GPU and then pick the correct driver version from the drivers already on your computer.
Thank you for this video and the effort you've put in
Someone on the forums ran 3DMark, and found that Vulkan tests ran faster than DirectX tests. Maybe using DXVK/VKD3D would give better results? I also wonder how the Linux drivers fare…
got my amd framework laptop today just waiting for my ram and storage to arrive to start programming on it
Thanks so much for another extremely helpful report. For me I think it is not if but when to update my current 13th gen Intel Framework 13 to AMD. Not quite yet, maybe, but updates will help soon, we hope!
Been waiting for a vid like this sub and liked!
Nice job on the video. 👍
Another well researched, unbiased video. Thanks!
I would love to see a comparison to the Ryzen 5, many folks are unsure if if the 300 bucks are worth it
Really enjoying this series, nice work 👏
Baldur's Gate 3 uses FSR 1. Even on my 7700XT, you can see the same type of drop in image quality by turning it on at 1440p Ultra. I was hoping to see patch 4 at least update it to FSR 2 but it didn't, from looking at the the patch notes. I haven't installed the patch, yet, due to all the reports of people having issues with it. As it stands, it's not worth bothering with FSR in the game, if running on most of the more recent AMD GPUs. If I were playing on my 2in1, I may have to turn FSR on to get anywhere near a good experience.
Patch 4 upgrades it to FSR 2.2 baldursgate3.game/news/patch-4-now-live_96
@@ElevatedSystems Okay. I must have overlooked it. Thanks for the correction.
Except the ram I have the same machine as you and its nice to see what it'll do as a gaming machine if I wanted to.
I could see this internal graphics being almost enough for me since - VR aside - Cyberpunk is the most demanding game in my collection actually.
Maybe by the time I actually need an upgrade for my desktop (my laptop is ThinkPad X250), I might go with a framework eGPU combo instead and things have been ironed out even more.
the driver issues is 100% windows’s fault, I’ve had the same issue on Intel laptops where windows constantly wants to update drivers with older/broken versions.
I wish I knew the Framework laptops just 1 year ago before getting my latest ultra portable laptop. I just really want to know what is the program that You use to show the numbers of the system during the game play in the top left.
Contemplating the Framework 16, but I use an Intel chip based TB3 external NVIDIA GPU as my work docking station, and I'm not sure how well it will work with AMD and USB4.
I'm also apprehensive about using Radeon graphics again. My last laptop with it crashed all the time just trying to watch youtube. Same with my gaming desktop with a RX6800, and then a 7900 XTX. (both clean installs) I ended up selling the XTX for a big loss to get a 4080S, which has been much more stable.
NICE handheld pc move over 👌
Subscribed just for the Linux related stuff on framework 😅
3x2 aspect is really good for retro games 🎮 👏
This is awesome to see. Thanks. Did you test whether the USB4 dock can output to a dual monitor setup using MST?
Not yet but I'll be using a dual 4k display setup for my content creation performance overview.
Aparantly with MST it can. Just can't without it.
I'm on the lookout for a work laptop that can also play Skyrim and Fallout 4. Your tests show okay framerates for Skyrim, but were the fans going full blast? Perhaps not really a good option except for very casual games?
Sounds like I can play some indies on here, which is all I would expect.
Curious if you'd consider doing this for the framework 16? I know it has a built in GPU option, but I'd love to see how that compares to an eGPU setup on the 16 (and I cannot find anyone who's actually tested it). I've heard it's built in GPU option isn't the greatest (nor would I expect that much given its only $400) But to use it with a high end GPU basically requires an eGPU but I don't know if its worth going that route.
Wondering the same thing. I have a thunderbolt 3 eGPU docking station with a RTX 4060. Works great on my old intel laptop, even with light gaming, but I really want to upgrade to the FW 16. But if I can't use a nice 1 cable solution with AMD, that's a no go for me and limits my 16" laptop choices.
How much VRAM be configured in these tests? It seems configurable in BIOS.
I have my amd on preorder. Batch 9.
I am wondering what the gpd g1 portable epgu would do.
Since Occulink isn't a practical option on the Framework you're still going to have the USB4 bandwidth restrictions which will very likely reduce the performance of the 7600M to barely above the integrated 780M. However, I'd be very happy if someone proved me wrong.
I think egpu should be rhe future it will save hardware time and thermals in that they will make laptop more cheaper and build great and support for thunderbolt 5 or 6 in the future
Do you prefer the glossy or matte display? I saw you have both
I think GW2 will run fine in most areas as long as there is not to many players using spells.
I've got a 12th gen Intel Framework running Linux Mint and have been considering migrating entirely over to using it with an eGPU rather than having a dedicated gaming PC and a laptop. I was about to buy an eGPU enclosure but had some people mention that currently the technology really struggles with high refresh rate monitors.
Have you experienced this at all? I have 3 144hz displays and would like to continue playing games at that refresh rate, at least on 1 of them at a time.
I ran my frame work with a 3050 and a 165hz monitor and no complaints
I would never do reviews in 1080p but instead 720p windowed or on Linux whatever setup with nearest neighbour upscaling. I dislike the lack of exclusive fullscreen in modern games.
I mostly wanna be able to plug into an external monitor at college so the screen is fine
Ready for the Framework 16? :)
Now I do wonder if Framework 16 screen is better for gaming.
It could also be interesting if there was various screens for specific tasks like productivity and gaming.
The 16 has a 1600P, 165Hz, 9ms display.
@@ElevatedSystems not the best but certainly better than the 13. Thanks for the info.
Great idea, but should have executed correctly. An AMD CPU with Nvidia GPU combo will be nice.
Great testing! But I really hope your monitor didn't get "hurt" too much. The unit is called "Hertz" both in plural and singular, because that was the guy's last name. This triggers me sometimes😅. Never mind, currently waiting for batch 5 and quite hyped also thanks to your video. BG3 seems to run quite well for an iGPU.
How about connecting the GPU to PCI express? For example, instead of a Wifi module
The M.2 WiFi slot is only an x2 connection. You can connect it to the M.2 SSD slot but then you would have to run the OS via a USB drive, which comes with its own problems.
doens't it have 2 ssd slots?
Would probably have been better if this video is at 60fps 😅
Playing the latest and greatest isn't an ideal task for most ultralights, but playing something nice from yesteryear chefskiss.jpg
12:22 DDR4-5600 😮
ddr4 can do 6000MT/s
but yeah, r5 7600x doesnt use ddr4
I honestly had a better egpu experience (7640U+razer core x+ gtx 1070) On windows 10 ltsc was getting a solid 81 fps 1080p max settings on farcry 5 with no stutters and really smooth. From my experience its a lot more stable to use a Nvidia card as the Egpu as it's drivers doesn't conflict with the igpu. However an AMD egpu is fine with a intel igpu. Will be getting the onedock soon do will be testing occulink and USB4 performance using it
If I remember correctly on the GTX 1070 Far Cry 5 ran at about 100 FPS at 1080P ultra when it came out over 5 years ago. What does it run at with the 1070 in a desktop with a current CPU today?
@@ElevatedSystems I was getting around 95 fps on my desktop same card. In this case the bottleneck doesn't really affect the gameplay. However witcher 3 next gen update struggled a lot but then again all systems do
If having Intel Core Ultra 7 equal to GPU?
If I want to edit videos with the Framework laptop do you recommend the 13th Gen Intel or AMD?
Different software favors different architecture. I would suggest looking up the specific video editor you want to use and going from there.
Intriguing
I like your back yard.
Please try Blender 4.1 por favor.
How can you have a Ryzen 5 7600X with DDR4 5600Mhz ram? :P You mean DDR5
You can view ghosting as a hardware motion blur implementation. 😂
Free TAA
Everytime you cover the AMD Framework 13 I feel one step closer of swapping out my i5 12th gen mainboard 😂
Great video as always!
I know nobody is covering framework 7040u 😢
I feel framework in general needs more spotlights and recognition. No other laptop company is coming close to offering something so repairable and so much upgradability
too expensive
how so ? @@LagiohX3
@@X862go it costs 850$ at that price you get a laptop with a dgpu
@LagiohX3 it's not 850 when I'm looking, and a laptop with a gpu will only run for an hour on battery 😂. They are basically pointless unplugged from the wall
Let’s face it.. the framework laptop could have been an amazing project but it failed in various aspects. It’s not mainstream - fine was to expected, it’s not a creator laptop - fair enough most would go with apple, but it aims to address nerds and tinkerer. However, despite the fact that all forums where full with the just one wish: ECC as the new amd chips fully support it framework went to the „fu-route“ to save 5cents for leaving out traces. 2nd wish was open source firmware - line tuxedo. „But it is fully repairable“ yea.. so is the steam deck for a fraction of the price.
I still don’t understand how you can just treat the Audience like that. It just LTT recommending this box.
how to tell you're an apple boy without telling you're apple bot
@@ChrisTian-sd5yq I am everything but an apple boy. But you clearly don’t have any clue about the stuff I was talking about.
The creators fully understood that it wasn't going to be a household name in 3 years. they wanted to disrupt the market and make a good laptop.
@@RainbowGin so why aren’t they doing so