The Rigid Core Max flooring from today’s video is simply-surfaces.com in European Grey Oak. I was an early product tester of Simply Surfaces LVP flooring (before they came up with their brand name). Since I installed it last year they have decided to launch a 9 inch plank version which is more consistent with the demand they see from customers. I am really happy with the final result, it's a Jeff approved product. Find it at simply-surfaces.com and watch the full install tutorial 👉🏼th-cam.com/video/waCiOUOaR_A/w-d-xo.html Cheers!
Trick for everyone! I find those love tap tools sometimes cause damage. Just use an off cut and set it in the joint and then tap that. Spread that energy across the entire joint without damaging the tongue and groove. And it works for both vinyl and laminate! 😊
You can also shave off one edge of a 2x4, so that it has a sharp, clean edge, and use that to tap the boards into place. I did that for my laminate flooring, and it worked great.
As a flooring installer for most my life I’m 59 today, installing pretty much everything over the course of my life even did hard floor sending,stain and varnish. I got to say those vinyl products to me are much better than laminate products because of moisture issues. But as you said they are not miraculous. Your video is very well explained and shows an important difference is the lasting of the product. Well done keep doing good work !!
@@amadolasala200 my understanding is that the 4 side locking system have more chance on holding together with some imperfections on the subfloor. As said in the video those products change a lot in time by the manufacturers, You need to go and see what they have at this time in store’s. Be wise try to make the best choice but there is always a gamble good luck!
You posted this with absolutely perfect timing. I’m redoing my mom’s basement with the Vinyl flooring and I specifically asked her to get tongue and groove flooring because I’ve had so many issues with the snap lock flooring in other basements. We live in Pennsylvania and a lot of floors are uneven so the snap lock tends to come apart. I’m only 21 so she doesn’t completely trust my judgement so this video will help back up my case! Thank you for posting these videos, they’re life savers!
The demo was good but the pep-talk at the end is what I needed to hear; "If you're a DIY'er everything you do makes money". I was gonna go with vinyl flooring but now I'm sold on tile.
I just refloored a room with LVP after watching one of your older videos ... Cheap, easy upgrade that made the room look 2000% better. Grateful as hell for your vids Jeff.
I love the value of videos like this. So specific. I'm embarrassed to say I put vinyl flooring into a basement reno where there was too much slope in part of the basement near the entrance. The contractor totally recommended against it. I decided to do it anyway and got what I asked for. It's now starting to separate and look terrible at the place with the uneven surface after just 2 years. No one to blame but myself. Lesson learned.
I enjoy most of these videos. They’ve helped me with a few projects around the house that I had no experience with. But as a professional flooring installer, this video was hard to watch. The message was great. I always try and talk the homeowner out of drop lock. “Angle lock” is a much better product. But you never use a pull bar to secure planks in the field. It’s meant for places a tapping block can’t reach (around walls) you will definitely damage most locking mechanisms by doing it that way. Theres actually a much easier way to install the angle lock.. try starting with the butt joint first. There is a reason it’s called “angle lock”. It’s set in on an angle. but it takes a little time getting comfortable doing it that way.
Yeah he's doing it totally wrong. And whenever I use a pull bar close to a wall on a factory edge I still put a small scrap piece on the edge so it doesn't get damaged
Had LifeProof installed in our house about 3 years ago. 90% of the house is slab-on-grade, the other 10% is old pier and beam with standard lumber. Just recently had to have the floor in the 10% fixed because a gap appeared. The rest of the house looks great but after watching this and realizing what the real problem is, I'll likely look at replacing that 10% with the mohawk material. I'm going to keep an eye on it, but if you're right about it coming undone easier the second time, that floor will end up having a 3 year life, not 20. Live and learn, thanks for the video. Before seeing this, I figured it was just a bad joint initially and I should just put down more LifeProof to fix it. You probably saved me some time, money and frustration!
Oh, thank goodness! I picked the right flooring. I'm going to be honest I had no idea about what you're pointing out in this video. We almost got the lifeproof, but we decided at the last minute to get the ridged core. Mainly because of the look and style of the ridged core. It actually had texture and looked more like real wood, in our opinion. Now I will say installing the ridged core wasn't fun at all! It was difficult and I cussed the whole time. However, it's been almost 3 years, and we haven't had any gap issues that I've seen others have. I was relieved to find out now that we made the better choice! Thanks 😊 this was a good video!
@@HomeRenoVisionDIY All fun and games until you're alone at the job site and the lenght is like 6 meters per row all at once, what a nightmare that was.
@@luilocolombia "tiles for less" carries it. If you don't have a local store than just Google "ridged core max 22" and you should have a local distributor. 😀
Thanks for the shout out, Jeff! Great explanation here of the different types of locking systems and awesome example of how they react to gaps. Really underscores the need for floor prep with drop lock.
So good to know. I couldn't believe how uneven my floors are. Between that and the fact that nothing seems to be actually square, doing the floor has been harder than I thought. But I'm doing it MYSELF! Yay, me!
I’m trying and it’s not working out for me. Actually, I’m trying to relay the pieces that my landlord laid and they’re not snapped in and there’s gaps everywhere. It’s driving me nuts and I can’t stand it. We have lots of new boxes of the flooring and I’m honestly debating just redoing it, but I’m afraid of the mess I might make :/
Speaking from experience. I currently have LVP. I would only recommend this for basement or if you have a really flat surface. Can you imagine placing these thin boards over your sub floor. The product work great if your floor is concrete.
I wish I had the information in the video three years ago. I had a vinyl floor installed three years ago. (my wife insisted that we have it professionally installed) They are now showing spots where they appear to be cupping, I think it is just the joint is expanding and failing. As you mentioned in the video, the issue is with the current floor. I am near Cleveland, Ohio. My house was built in 1954. The subfloor is 1x6 planking covered by tongue and grove hardwood flooring. The kitchen has two layers of tile flooring. We had the vinyl installed throughout the living room, hall and kitchen. It is the drop lock type floor. The installer used leveler on the transition between the rooms and two surfaces. We have had the flooring company out and they have filed a claim with the manufacturer. I did some research on the product, and per the manufacturing, it can be installed floating or glued. If I had known I would have requested the tongue and groove or insisted that it be glued
We've installed the Costco mohawk flooring in our rentals. Was a steep learning curve but your videos helped build confidence and tricks to handle tricky cuts (I still hate doing door jambs). Its a 1900s house and while we had the floors raised/leveled from underneath there was still some uneveness. We're using the steico underlayment and it's working great. The floors feel really good under your feet with it with the bonus of providing a little insulation from the crawlspace.
Great video. I bought about 1000sqft of Lifeproof on recommendation of a friend how has installed it in his newer home. Long story short, I hired a reputable flooring company to come install it and they said they would not in good conscience install it in my older home which has multiple subflooring types done over decades of remodels and additions. Even with a 1/4in plywood overlayment, they said it would fail from uneven surfaces and floor movement of the raised foundation. Wish I had seen your video sooner but at least I have the receipt to Home Depot for the material.
I put down LV plank in the basement. It was originally cheap vinyl tile 9x9s. Put down LV plank right over it. It has the padding under so it doesn’t feel like you’re walking on concrete. So far so good.
GIANT CAVEAT ABOUT T&G!! We moved into a patio home (slab-on-grade) 3 years ago. We had the carpeted floors replaced with T&G vinyl planks. It looked good. BUT, here comes the caveat.. I use a wheelchair and it’s two small wheels on the front are wider, softer, and spread the load out better. Had a problem with it, so i had to use a backup wheelchair that has the standard, thinner, harder wheels in front. In just about a months time of using that wheelchair, the places that i occupied the most throughout the day, the flooring started seperating and bowing up at the ends. It got so bad in the kitchen, we just pulled up severL of the planks. The change in loading by using the second chair caused an increase in the point load made by the two small front wheels. This caused the tongues to fracture and break. We had to have the ENTIRE floor replaced with NON -T&G glue-down vinyl planks at a cost of around $8000.. So anyone moving into similar circumstances, check to make sure you don’t have T&G flooring, or may be replacing your floors within a few months of wheelchair use…
I could really use a video on how to bring vinyl flooring through doorways without removing the casing. Showing how to lay it each way to continue into another room
😅Do read the warrenty on vinal floring , after a year and a half mine started to come apart. . called the manafacture and found out if you have a hospital bed, a wheelchair or a office rolling chair it voids the warrenty. And we have all three
I've been installing these laminate floors since they came out. On the tongue and groove it's easier to install the short side first, then click in the length side
@@HomeRenoVisionDIY In my last flooring attempt I tried to get explicit, written information on what the warranty covers and not as it was general conditions and lack of clarity about what a repair would be (whole carpet, part, etc). In this case it was medium-high end carpet but they wouldn't give me anything beyond the generic info from the manufacturer and suggested I go elsewhere if I didn't like it. My take away is that any flooring warranty is mostly a joke unless you are willing to take legal action (which will probably cost you more than just replacing the flooring yourself).
“It’s Saturday hunny, gonna go fix the floor” 🤣 I just about pissed myself cause it’s so F N true Love your channel brotha Always educational, great humor and packed full of tips. #1 big dog thank you 🙏
There are more options. My Mannington plank floor is glued to the subfloor. The adhesive is a special type that allows you to peel up a plank and stick a new one in it's place with no additional adhesive. I chose this over a floating install for several reasons, but this is the one I like the most. I've got a spare box of planks in the basement, and if a plank gets damaged I can easily replace it.
I've been installing floors for 5 decades and the only vinyl plank I would ever install, it is so much easier, faster, to install than click floor. The adhesive is called pressure sensitive, great stuff
I installed some super cheap vinal plank flooring over an uneven basement floor. Bought some super inexpensive flooring and a super cheap pad/moisture barrior. It wasn't perfect and places where I had problems because of the floor slopes like he showes I used expanding sprayfoam to fill in the voids and glue the floor in place. Over each problem spot I injected the foam and then just put a heavy weight to hold the planks down so it would dry flat with the joints locked. I doubt it held up but it gave the basement a clean enough look for my family to sell the place quickly. I dont recomend the inexpensive stuff, and deffinatly if you do use it you have to have a dead flat floor. The glue with some "Great Stuff" did work but I bet after a little while that stuff broke down and made the floor have crunchies underfoot. I woulden't have left it if it wasent just quick cosmetic refresh on a basement utility room. It was for sure lipstick on a pig but better looking than painting the floor or the peel and stick tiles you can get which would have been the only other as cheap/ quick options.
If you're skimping like I did on a project like this skimp all the way. The trash products that get returned a bunch by the big box stores are always getting rotated out of inventory. Get the clearance they practically give out the items they are discontinuing.
This was excellent I needed that information. We don't want to spend 15,000 on hard wood floors. I'm looking for the second best thing for our home. Definitely need the tongue and groove style. Thanks I'm a new fan of the channel.
Haha my mother bought a trailer house and the floor is like waves in the ocean. The previous owner installed some kind of vinyl flooring and it's all coming apart😂 This floor needs a lot of prep before we can get it to look any good
I've installed a lot of LifeProof floors and as long as it's installed properly and as Jeff says your floors aren't all wanky it'll hold up.. love the channel..
Thank you Professor Jeff.❤..One hundred plus house St Louis Missouri. I’ve been a member for two and a half years. You’ve been helping me ( post Covid with long hauler’s syndrome) systemic issues. I’m slowly getting better and more things done on my house working alone. I love your videos. Older homes are very difficult. You’re a life saver ❤.
I was so confused when you said a 20 mil wear layer! In Australia we call millimetres "mils" and 20 millimetres is just over 3/4in! After a quick google, 20 mil is approx 0.51 millimetres. Love from Australia 🦘
Just finishing with a product called Aqua Guard Premium over concrete. The floor was previously ground flat for laminate that was 3.5 mm thick which got destroyed by my gf’s unhousetrained dogs. The underlayment is 6 mil plastic moisture barrier + rubber backing on the planks. Finally figured out that I had to slightly lift the previous plank and get the ends lined and partially clicked in place, and there is a little notch in one corner of the drop locks. The planks are very stiff and 12 mm thick which are on the same plane as existing porcelain tile transition. I doubt they could be snapped, I put a 6.5 inch wood blade in a wet tile saw I had from glass backsplash install and ran it dry. I didn’t want to rent a table/miter saw cuz I’m very slow and would cost more than the material. Could have bought a saw and then sell it, I suppose. Got the planks on closeout for $1.98 sf, I don’t think it is sold anymore, just the 10 mm thick version now. Ripping the last row of planks on the tile saw was an adventure, I messed it up and had to use one short piece of scrap cut wider to patch up the wall gap that kept growing to 1” at the end. Getting the end joints to close was a bear, I used a tapping block and pro length puller hitting them hard with a 4 pound sledge. The puller I engaged over the plank lip, not on the locking ledge. Chipped the wear layer off on the end of one row, but next to wall so it won’t show. And I learned that 1/8 inch gap, the width of the locking ledge, is plenty next to the wall in my small house.
There should be an EP on whether to choose wpc (wood polymer/plastic composite) or spc (stone plastic composite). I notice SPC is cheaper but cold on concrete
"No one intends to give you a warranty" - truth Would love a video on large format porcelain tile in an apartment. Not because I am getting ready to do it...... for the people....that just happen to be in the exact situation that I am in.
I just installed laminate in my house last year, and thought I'd share a few more tips: - Score boards with a knife, and then snap them instead of using a saw, whenever possible. It's quick, and saves a ton of cleanup. - Use a 2x4 as a tapping block, to distribute the load across your boards, so you don't damage them when tapping them into place. - Vary your patterns because it's obvious when you see the exact same printed "knot" seven times in a row. - Don't buy laminate, and just get hardwood floors. Sure, it's cheaper and easier to install, but it scratches just as easily as wood, but you can't hide the scratches with a stain pen. Furniture legs also dent the PVC surface much easier than you'd expect.
Disagree. I have laminate from Pergo (outlast) and i TRY to scratch it and it doesnt AT ALL. The same engineered wood (4mm wear, wide plank, european/white oak) will be 3x the cost once installed. Wood/engineered wood doesn't work as well in homes with constant humidity level changes either
@@J_Money1I suppose some brands and types of laminate are better than others, so that's awesome that you got a good floor. The handful of people I know with laminate had bad luck with them. I installed bamboo floors in my last house, and they were terrific.
I used Stain master luxury Vinyl planks years ago and regret using it ,was expensive and scratched so easy.Even with thresholds it separated at some points.I learned my lesson,so doing it on the stairs I used nail gun to secure planks and caps. I definitely recommend if you're flipping house looks good and it's easy to install.
Not surprised it scratched easy, Stainmaster LVP has an abysmal 12mil wear layer. Jeff says don't consider anything lower than 20mil, personally, I'd up that to 30mil
Jeff, as a manufacturer who owns a factory that makes spc flooring, I would like to point out something. You can NOT hammer the short side on these drop lock systems. To learn about drop lock installation, I suggest people check out I4F, who is lincensor of drop lock technology. If the plank has not locked properly, hammering it from the other side will only damage that joint. "love tap" should only be done on the long sides. Uniclic locking system is the only locking system that can be "love tapped" on both sides short and long sides because all 4 sides of this locking system is angle type, not drop-down type. However in this video, you have not brought any to showcase. Also, the very top of spc flooring is coated with UV later. This is the layer that provides critical scratch and stain protection to your floor. There are many different types of UV oil, some have much better performance than others. This video's purpose was to show two different locking systems, but the two products you are comparing have the same drop lock system. Doesn't give your viewers much confidence if you can't tell which locking systems you are working with.
I don't know what you're looking at but those are definitely two different locking systems on the short joint, he just mistakenly calls the second one a drop lock when he starts to put it down. However, the way he does it is not how I do it. I start by angling in the end joint and then do the long joint. And I would never use that pull bar on a factory edge, get or make a proper tapping block.
This gives me some peace of mind. My buddy owns a bar and wants me to do LVP and I've been extremely worried about the 100 year old building and the amount of traffic.. he knows he will get 10 years max out of it. But I've put in cheap trash for friends that they purchased and I told myself never again will I do something like that for anyone.
in that environment take a look into the vinyl plank that glues in place with no locking joints. that way you can peel up a damaged board and replace it. many come with a 10 or 15 year commercial warranty as well.
Soo you're not a not a believer in loose lay or glue down vinyl planks? I just put loose lay vinyl in one of my apartments and have fallen in love with it. Interested to hear your thoughts
Hi Jeff, I'm a fan of your informative videos. I am a subscriber and shop at your Amazon store to support. I have engineered wood glued on slab. It has developed gaps that are 1/8th of an inch and larger. Could you please let me know how to fix it? Lots of videos are about just moving the pieces but that is not an option because my home floor is glued to the slab. Thanks for your help.❤
ohh, I was expecting to see loose-lay vinyl to be compared with the locking planks. Would be nice to see a follow-up with a 5mm vinyl plank that is most commonly glued down in commercial applications!
Now I wish I would’ve got the 20 mil wear layer instead of the 12 for my house 😂but it’s only 1k sq ft and just me with no pets, so I think it will hold up well. Thanks for the vid Jeff! You’re truly a Jack of all trades.
The locking systems you describe here are the '2G' (aka "droplock") and the 'quad lock' systems, respectively. However, there is another locking system known as '5G', which is essentially a '2G' system with a plastic clip incorporated into the tounge allowing it to lock, rather than only being seated - basically gives you the best of both worlds. With your 'quad lock', instead of putting the length tounge in first and holding down with your knee while giving it a love tap, i find its easier to put the end tounge in first, then sit the opposite end of that board into the previous row on the angle, then tap the length side in. Although, personally, I dont work with my knees on the already installed boards until im up to the last few rows and not longer can - this is because it makes installing this quad lock system easier by eliminating the need to use any tools because I can simply do the love tap with my left palm while maintaining the locking angle with my right hand. The only time i ever lock the length side in first is when im doing the last row where the board is going under a door jamb, where manipulating the board to get it on the angle cannot be met.
We had 5 mm vinyl flooring installed and the planks warp on the long end. They were installed with a professional contractor. The flooring company we purchased the material said it was our fault for not using plastic under the vinyl. We have seen the same vinyl installed on concrete without plastic and it is not warping.
I have a slab on grade... that was poured in the 60s... and is so uneven that before I used some leveler there were gaps approaching an inch over 8 foot spans. At one point along the wall I noticed a crack.. so I figured.. open the crack up a bit with a chisel to get a good surface to bond with and apply some patch, right? Apparently there was some sort of underlayment that they poured the concrete over.. probably a moisture barrier of some sort... and at that point where the crack had occurred it had bunched up really high so the concrete at that point was less than 1/2 inch thick... no wonder it cracked... sheesh. I literally don't know how they poured that slab so poorly, unless they were actively trying to. It certainly has made my vinyl floor journey... interesting.
Also make sure you clean the floor... our house's kitchen has some sort of vinyl flooring and it seems like 2 or 3 small pebbles were left under it and the joints are cracking apart on those spots. I think it's tongue and groove style like you mentioned. :( Not sure how to repair it. They also didn't do any underlayment, I think it's installed right on the concrete because it makes snap crackle noises all around when walking on it.
All I know is I've been in homes with vinyl flooring that look similar to the eye. In one home though I remember the sound of the floor slapping when i walked on it. Like I was walking on sheets of masonite. I assume it may have been warped but it didn't look like it. Other homes almost looked like wood engineered flooring. I think there may be a lot to the quality of vinyl flooring and choosing a good product over what just meets the eye.
Every box of flooring will have instructions which tells you what the tolerance of the subfloor must be. If the subfloor is within the tolerance set by the manufacturer, then droplock shouldnt be coming apart - if they do, then it would almost certainly be manufacturing defect and will likely eventually occur to many of the joins from that particular batch. As for the melting or heat damage aspect, it should also be stated on the instructions whether that product is suitable for use with underfloor heating. From what I've seen, warping damage from sunlight seems to be most prevalent with the thinner products of 4mm and 4.5mm. Ive also noticed that its frequently in homes that allow for prolonged sunlight exposure, or where the climate isnt well maintained, such as holiday homes. Personally, I haven't seen it as a problem that would make it only susceptible to vinyl and hybrid products, given that timber and laminate are also prone to expansion problems in these conditions.
I installed the Noble Oak vinyl plank flooring from the Home Decorators Collection in a older house bathroom with a new sub floor and it curled up like bacon with a week. It had too much give side to side and after i trying to level off the floor perfectly i gave up and installed linoleum instead.
There are two locking systems which you did clarify for both. One is the click and lock, and the other is drop and lock. You did cover 4iF technology drop and locking system which does not needs love taps and comes apart easily w/o damage.
Give me the minutes and seconds in your video, so that, I do not have to hunt for where you are talking about. All of 4iF will have this on the end of their cartons.@@luilocolombia
We have SPC flooring tnat was installed a few weeks before we bought our home. The previous owners had a toilet leak and ripped out the entire floor thatvwas engineered hard wood and replaced with SPC planks. Unfortunately the SPC only lasted 6 months before all of the locking mechanisms failed, planks coming up and cutting feet, chipping, separating, etc. Called the company who installed it and of course they were off the hook because the warranty did not transfer to new ownership. They admitted that they had needed to raise the floor off the concrete slab to make up for the height of fhe thick engineered wood. So they laid 3/4 inch plywood underneath a vapor lock barrier right on top of the slab. The floor is a hazard to walk on and it needs to be replaced but we are unsure of what type of floor to replace it with because the plywood underlay seems to be extremely uneven and warping in our clhot Arizona climate. I am considering just the glue down type floor but have a feeling everything needs to be ripped out and we need to start from scratch which we cant afftat the moment. Our planks are being ductaped down to prevent further injuries, it's awful. Does anyone have any suggestions? We will have to avoid any flooring that has any kind of locking mechanism due to how uneven the floor is. Or do we just try to nail it all down and peel n' stick vinyl over top of it?
I have Coretec LVP floors. That actually cost more than many hardwood planks. I have dropped stuff a bazillion times doing interior DIY projects (with no visible damage) that would have scratched or dented the hell out of a hardwood plank.
I have been watching this channel for quite some time now and enjoyed it tremendously. We are building a two story home and need to install the floors. Upstairs are a easy decision, they will be hard or engineered wood. Downstairs are more complicated. It has a open kitchen which transits to the big open family room area without any boundaries in between. We are very concerned about possible water damage from the kitchen and have a hard time to decide the floor material, wood, vinyl or tile, etc. Any opinion will be highly appreciated.
Please do that test with flooring plank on both sides of the end joint. That is much more of a real life test since only the first and last row of the floor will be like your test .
Went with engineered wood on my 1943 reno, because my subfloors weren't perfectly flat and I could staple them down. Soon learned that it is very sensitive to moisure, aka cat urine. It will cup on the edges. I have to set weights on it while it dries to flatten it out. Wood, tile or LVP next time.
As a GC and 10 year ex flooring contractor: 1: you definitely need a love tap, especially every other row if you kinda know what your doing and your joints are tight to begin with 2. while product 1 looks a lot easier to install, believe it or not, it’s a lot easier to mess up break the corners where it messes up. the thing is if your 1 mil off from being straight your could be denting every corner and won’t see it until the sun shines across the floor in the middle of the day. ** the reality with the locking point Jeff makes us unless your floor is really bad each system is good cause the next row will lock it all in and the weight of the whole floor will follow the “slopes” of your floor.
A couple more tips: if there is a flooring supply store like Prosol in your area, you can find plastic tapping blocks for your love taps that won’t damage the floor like metal ones do. It’s best practice on butt joints to start tapping from the joint out towards the open tongue to avoid a bit of buckling at the joint which can happen if you’re a bit too tight.
What's your views on loose lay vinyl flooring with no glue no tape just loose lay for an uneven plywood floor. Wavy from the floor Joyce but unable to fill to level.
Hmm 2nd floor kitchen, townhouse built 1989. 2 layers of sheer vinyl. The 2nd sheet vinyl they used some self leveler but they could not get it perfectly level, it more a long distance in non level not a whole bunch ups and downs. Looking at LVP overtop of existing sheet vinyl.
I LOVED your video!!!!!!! I have a 53 year old 2-story farm house (we live on a 15 acre farm) we are rough on floors! We currently have travertine 18X18 square tiles and I HATE THEM. They are COLD, they are HARD, they hurt my feet and the grout is always dirty. I really want to put new floors in...being that we are soooo rough on floors-kids, animals, even goats and alpacas sometimes in the house and that we are on a raised foundation, we have variance in the grade and level-can we put the tongue and groove vinyl plank over the tile? Do we have to remove the tile? should we put hardwood-thoughts ideas, suggestions are most WELCOME
Man, I put down vinyl upstairs in my 2x10 joist, 1/2 subfloor because It's all I could afford, and now we will need to redo everything : ( I wish I knew this a year ago!
if your joints are popping up try setting them in adhesive for vinyl plank and leave a weight on over night. this will help to extend the life of the floor.Cheers!
We have Lifeproof floors in the living and dining room. So happy I found SmartDrop floors for the rest of the house. Love this floor more. Amazing to work with, fully waterproof too. It is exactly what the name implies-SmartDrop. You literally drop the floor in place. Glue around the outer to stop it from moving.
An interesting thing that I figured out regarding lifeproof, some (not sure how much) is re-branded MSI. What I tracked down for sure is on the engineered hardwood version. This is useful as MSI has more matching transitions, stair noses, stair treads etc than what HD sells. Seems the best way to tell is that HD uses the same image on their site as MSI does (as in the exact same picture down to the knots in the wood etc).
@@HomeRenoVisionDIY While I'm sure it is coming out of the same factories as half the other similar products, Home Depot's questions section on the page actually had really old comments from MSI answering questions and also linking to the MSI products on the HD website (this is how I got started tracking down the MSI version).
Been looking to install new vinyl flooring in kitchen as previous owner used regular laminate which clearly not appropriate as it's lifting up. Will have to rewatch some ofvur previous videos as not familiar with the construction terms used. It's a 1970's home so floors aren't level.
We have had vinyl for 6 years and my floors are very uneven or sloping (130 year old house). I have a couple of spots where it cracked because not having enough plywood under it. We are pretty happy with it overall, especially if it lasts another 15 years, which it seems like it will. Cost me about $3k per 1000sq ft.
What product someone chooses to install (vinyl, timber, laminate) should be determined by the circumstances in which its most suitable to them. Yes, an engineered timber floor would add monetary value to the property from a valuation perspective, say with insurance or banks/mortgage companies, but in the long term, that sale value would be negligible after paying for its maintenance and refinishings, especially if there's children or pets involved, where sanding + polishing simply wont fix it.
If you have a slab on grade concrete subfloor in the basement, but the concrete is not perfectly flat, would you recommend going tongue and groove over snap lock? We're talking about maybe half an inch change over several feet, but you can see the hump standing back.
I have used both and had it professionally installed and the one that you use the tool to close the inner gap is pure garbage for spills. I wouldn't waste my money on that flooring ever again. Oh and the space you have to leave around the baseboards so it can expand also helps it become lose and leave gaps. If you have kids or pets I don't recommend either of these types of flooring. Spills cause buckling and like he mentioned the joints are easily damaged and they start peeling and it looks horrible. Also a quick fix is not an option you have to start from one side of the room and remove all the planks without damaging them which is almost impossible to fix the one that was damaged then reinstall which is a total pain. The tap joint ones also if they get wet over a few short times they are ruined.
FFFF thanks Jeff. I'm dealing with this exact problem (what flooring to use for sloped old home floor) ... most crap youtube channels are like "hey just use floor leveler" Ok yeah I have enough slope to where that's a ridiculous idea lol
Have you tried Select Surfaces 24 hr Spill defense? We installed it in 2 rooms so far. A fellow customer said they installed it 5 yrs ago with 2 labradors and grandkids and says it still looks great❤
We have a townhouse with self stick vinyl flooring. What a mess that's going to be to remove and then lay some new flooring. It's so soft a plank I lifted could almost be rolled like the rubber/vinyl wall trim one can see in the hospital.
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The Rigid Core Max flooring from today’s video is simply-surfaces.com in European Grey Oak. I was an early product tester of Simply Surfaces LVP flooring (before they came up with their brand name). Since I installed it last year they have decided to launch a 9 inch plank version which is more consistent with the demand they see from customers. I am really happy with the final result, it's a Jeff approved product. Find it at simply-surfaces.com and watch the full install tutorial 👉🏼th-cam.com/video/waCiOUOaR_A/w-d-xo.html Cheers!
What is the name of the tool you apply the love tap with?
Trick for everyone! I find those love tap tools sometimes cause damage. Just use an off cut and set it in the joint and then tap that. Spread that energy across the entire joint without damaging the tongue and groove. And it works for both vinyl and laminate! 😊
Great tip!
ABSOLUTELY...a must!
If you don’t have a tapping block, 💯
You can also shave off one edge of a 2x4, so that it has a sharp, clean edge, and use that to tap the boards into place. I did that for my laminate flooring, and it worked great.
I was gnna say exactly this good on you fam
As a flooring installer for most my life I’m 59 today, installing pretty much everything over the course of my life even did hard floor sending,stain and varnish.
I got to say those vinyl products to me are much better than laminate products because of moisture issues.
But as you said they are not miraculous.
Your video is very well explained and shows an important difference is the lasting of the product.
Well done keep doing good work !!
And you approve of using a pull bar on a factory edge? Speaking of pull bars he needs to lose that mamby pamby thing and get a real one.
Which one is better
Hi Sir, so which one is MUCH better for my Basement which is Uneven surface/Floor. It’s an old house.
Thanks
@@amadolasala200 my understanding is that the 4 side locking system have more chance on holding together with some imperfections on the subfloor.
As said in the video those products change a lot in time by the manufacturers,
You need to go and see what they have at this time in store’s.
Be wise try to make the best choice but there is always a gamble good luck!
You posted this with absolutely perfect timing. I’m redoing my mom’s basement with the Vinyl flooring and I specifically asked her to get tongue and groove flooring because I’ve had so many issues with the snap lock flooring in other basements. We live in Pennsylvania and a lot of floors are uneven so the snap lock tends to come apart. I’m only 21 so she doesn’t completely trust my judgement so this video will help back up my case! Thank you for posting these videos, they’re life savers!
Add roof shingles underneath to level gaps
Torly’s is the best luxury vinyl flooring on the market, period.
The demo was good but the pep-talk at the end is what I needed to hear; "If you're a DIY'er everything you do makes money". I was gonna go with vinyl flooring but now I'm sold on tile.
I just refloored a room with LVP after watching one of your older videos ... Cheap, easy upgrade that made the room look 2000% better. Grateful as hell for your vids Jeff.
That is awesome!
I love the value of videos like this. So specific. I'm embarrassed to say I put vinyl flooring into a basement reno where there was too much slope in part of the basement near the entrance. The contractor totally recommended against it. I decided to do it anyway and got what I asked for. It's now starting to separate and look terrible at the place with the uneven surface after just 2 years. No one to blame but myself. Lesson learned.
I enjoy most of these videos. They’ve helped me with a few projects around the house that I had no experience with. But as a professional flooring installer, this video was hard to watch. The message was great. I always try and talk the homeowner out of drop lock. “Angle lock” is a much better product. But you never use a pull bar to secure planks in the field. It’s meant for places a tapping block can’t reach (around walls) you will definitely damage most locking mechanisms by doing it that way. Theres actually a much easier way to install the angle lock.. try starting with the butt joint first. There is a reason it’s called “angle lock”. It’s set in on an angle. but it takes a little time getting comfortable doing it that way.
Exactly. With butt joint engaged the side long joint usually can be engaged by lifting and pulling together.
Yeah he's doing it totally wrong. And whenever I use a pull bar close to a wall on a factory edge I still put a small scrap piece on the edge so it doesn't get damaged
Had LifeProof installed in our house about 3 years ago. 90% of the house is slab-on-grade, the other 10% is old pier and beam with standard lumber. Just recently had to have the floor in the 10% fixed because a gap appeared. The rest of the house looks great but after watching this and realizing what the real problem is, I'll likely look at replacing that 10% with the mohawk material. I'm going to keep an eye on it, but if you're right about it coming undone easier the second time, that floor will end up having a 3 year life, not 20. Live and learn, thanks for the video. Before seeing this, I figured it was just a bad joint initially and I should just put down more LifeProof to fix it. You probably saved me some time, money and frustration!
Man this guy is a little intense but I can tell he has a lot to say about all his years of knowledge and he’s speaking truth! Great informative video!
cheers!
Oh, thank goodness! I picked the right flooring. I'm going to be honest I had no idea about what you're pointing out in this video. We almost got the lifeproof, but we decided at the last minute to get the ridged core. Mainly because of the look and style of the ridged core. It actually had texture and looked more like real wood, in our opinion. Now I will say installing the ridged core wasn't fun at all! It was difficult and I cussed the whole time. However, it's been almost 3 years, and we haven't had any gap issues that I've seen others have. I was relieved to find out now that we made the better choice! Thanks 😊 this was a good video!
the secret is to connect the whole length before slipping it into the groove. Cheers! video coming soon!
@@HomeRenoVisionDIY All fun and games until you're alone at the job site and the lenght is like 6 meters per row all at once, what a nightmare that was.
on this job i was doing a 50' run. Cheers!
Where were you able to buy the rigid core floor? I'm looking but I can't find it.
@@luilocolombia "tiles for less" carries it. If you don't have a local store than just Google "ridged core max 22" and you should have a local distributor. 😀
Thanks for the shout out, Jeff! Great explanation here of the different types of locking systems and awesome example of how they react to gaps. Really underscores the need for floor prep with drop lock.
Looking forward to the live show tomorrow, thanks for coming on. Cheers
Excellent explanation. Many new homes by me are installing Vinyl even expensive houses.
So good to know. I couldn't believe how uneven my floors are. Between that and the fact that nothing seems to be actually square, doing the floor has been harder than I thought. But I'm doing it MYSELF! Yay, me!
You rock Rayna!
How did it turn out?
I’m trying and it’s not working out for me. Actually, I’m trying to relay the pieces that my landlord laid and they’re not snapped in and there’s gaps everywhere. It’s driving me nuts and I can’t stand it. We have lots of new boxes of the flooring and I’m honestly debating just redoing it, but I’m afraid of the mess I might make :/
Speaking from experience. I currently have LVP. I would only recommend this for basement or if you have a really flat surface. Can you imagine placing these thin boards over your sub floor. The product work great if your floor is concrete.
I wish I had the information in the video three years ago. I had a vinyl floor installed three years ago. (my wife insisted that we have it professionally installed) They are now showing spots where they appear to be cupping, I think it is just the joint is expanding and failing. As you mentioned in the video, the issue is with the current floor. I am near Cleveland, Ohio. My house was built in 1954. The subfloor is 1x6 planking covered by tongue and grove hardwood flooring. The kitchen has two layers of tile flooring. We had the vinyl installed throughout the living room, hall and kitchen. It is the drop lock type floor. The installer used leveler on the transition between the rooms and two surfaces. We have had the flooring company out and they have filed a claim with the manufacturer. I did some research on the product, and per the manufacturing, it can be installed floating or glued. If I had known I would have requested the tongue and groove or insisted that it be glued
We've installed the Costco mohawk flooring in our rentals. Was a steep learning curve but your videos helped build confidence and tricks to handle tricky cuts (I still hate doing door jambs).
Its a 1900s house and while we had the floors raised/leveled from underneath there was still some uneveness. We're using the steico underlayment and it's working great. The floors feel really good under your feet with it with the bonus of providing a little insulation from the crawlspace.
The Mohawk flooring from Costco doesn’t come with underpayment?
how is your flooring holding up?
@@Weirdkid71 2 years in and hasn't been destroyed yet.
Great video. I bought about 1000sqft of Lifeproof on recommendation of a friend how has installed it in his newer home. Long story short, I hired a reputable flooring company to come install it and they said they would not in good conscience install it in my older home which has multiple subflooring types done over decades of remodels and additions. Even with a 1/4in plywood overlayment, they said it would fail from uneven surfaces and floor movement of the raised foundation. Wish I had seen your video sooner but at least I have the receipt to Home Depot for the material.
I put down LV plank in the basement. It was originally cheap vinyl tile 9x9s. Put down LV plank right over it. It has the padding under so it doesn’t feel like you’re walking on concrete. So far so good.
Great job Bill. no worries with that! Cheers!
Thanks for posting this video clip! I’m glad I bought LifeProof with rigid core 7mm layer thickness and 22 mils wear tear layer.
I love your honesty. And thank you for explaining the differences.
Glad it was helpful!
GIANT CAVEAT ABOUT T&G!! We moved into a patio home (slab-on-grade) 3 years ago. We had the carpeted floors replaced with T&G vinyl planks. It looked good. BUT, here comes the caveat.. I use a wheelchair and it’s two small wheels on the front are wider, softer, and spread the load out better. Had a problem with it, so i had to use a backup wheelchair that has the standard, thinner, harder wheels in front. In just about a months time of using that wheelchair, the places that i occupied the most throughout the day, the flooring started seperating and bowing up at the ends. It got so bad in the kitchen, we just pulled up severL of the planks. The change in loading by using the second chair caused an increase in the point load made by the two small front wheels. This caused the tongues to fracture and break. We had to have the ENTIRE floor replaced with NON -T&G glue-down vinyl planks at a cost of around $8000.. So anyone moving into similar circumstances, check to make sure you don’t have T&G flooring, or may be replacing your floors within a few months of wheelchair use…
I could really use a video on how to bring vinyl flooring through doorways without removing the casing. Showing how to lay it each way to continue into another room
working on that right now!
😅Do read the warrenty on vinal floring , after a year and a half mine started to come apart. . called the manafacture and found out if you have a hospital bed, a wheelchair or a office rolling chair it voids the warrenty. And we have all three
I've been installing these laminate floors since they came out. On the tongue and groove it's easier to install the short side first, then click in the length side
very true!
@@HomeRenoVisionDIYthen why didn't you do that?
"Now, no one really intends to give you a warranty..."
Wise words
right. warranty is fancy talk for the run around
@@HomeRenoVisionDIY In my last flooring attempt I tried to get explicit, written information on what the warranty covers and not as it was general conditions and lack of clarity about what a repair would be (whole carpet, part, etc). In this case it was medium-high end carpet but they wouldn't give me anything beyond the generic info from the manufacturer and suggested I go elsewhere if I didn't like it. My take away is that any flooring warranty is mostly a joke unless you are willing to take legal action (which will probably cost you more than just replacing the flooring yourself).
Glad you explained things truthfully. I'm going to stick with the hardwood floor.
“It’s Saturday hunny, gonna go fix the floor” 🤣
I just about pissed myself cause it’s so F N true
Love your channel brotha
Always educational, great humor and packed full of tips. #1 big dog thank you 🙏
There are more options. My Mannington plank floor is glued to the subfloor. The adhesive is a special type that allows you to peel up a plank and stick a new one in it's place with no additional adhesive. I chose this over a floating install for several reasons, but this is the one I like the most. I've got a spare box of planks in the basement, and if a plank gets damaged I can easily replace it.
I've been installing floors for 5 decades and the only vinyl plank I would ever install, it is so much easier, faster, to install than click floor. The adhesive is called pressure sensitive, great stuff
I installed some super cheap vinal plank flooring over an uneven basement floor. Bought some super inexpensive flooring and a super cheap pad/moisture barrior. It wasn't perfect and places where I had problems because of the floor slopes like he showes I used expanding sprayfoam to fill in the voids and glue the floor in place. Over each problem spot I injected the foam and then just put a heavy weight to hold the planks down so it would dry flat with the joints locked. I doubt it held up but it gave the basement a clean enough look for my family to sell the place quickly. I dont recomend the inexpensive stuff, and deffinatly if you do use it you have to have a dead flat floor. The glue with some "Great Stuff" did work but I bet after a little while that stuff broke down and made the floor have crunchies underfoot. I woulden't have left it if it wasent just quick cosmetic refresh on a basement utility room. It was for sure lipstick on a pig but better looking than painting the floor or the peel and stick tiles you can get which would have been the only other as cheap/ quick options.
If you're skimping like I did on a project like this skimp all the way. The trash products that get returned a bunch by the big box stores are always getting rotated out of inventory. Get the clearance they practically give out the items they are discontinuing.
This was excellent I needed that information. We don't want to spend 15,000 on hard wood floors. I'm looking for the second best thing for our home. Definitely need the tongue and groove style. Thanks I'm a new fan of the channel.
Haha my mother bought a trailer house and the floor is like waves in the ocean. The previous owner installed some kind of vinyl flooring and it's all coming apart😂 This floor needs a lot of prep before we can get it to look any good
I uploaded a video a couple weeks ago about how I solved the soft floor issue. it was actually quite easy to do. Cheers!
I've installed a lot of LifeProof floors and as long as it's installed properly and as Jeff says your floors aren't all wanky it'll hold up..
love the channel..
This was an amazing video. Thank you very much. I learned so much.
Thank you Professor Jeff.❤..One hundred plus house St Louis Missouri. I’ve been a member for two and a half years. You’ve been helping me ( post Covid with long hauler’s syndrome) systemic issues. I’m slowly getting better and more things done on my house working alone. I love your videos. Older homes are very difficult. You’re a life saver ❤.
Happy to help Gerge!
I use the 'love tap' to lock but I do it from a standing position so that I can stand on the other piece to keep it from moving.
I was so confused when you said a 20 mil wear layer! In Australia we call millimetres "mils" and 20 millimetres is just over 3/4in! After a quick google, 20 mil is approx 0.51 millimetres. Love from Australia 🦘
Just finishing with a product called Aqua Guard Premium over concrete. The floor was previously ground flat for laminate that was 3.5 mm thick which got destroyed by my gf’s unhousetrained dogs. The underlayment is 6 mil plastic moisture barrier + rubber backing on the planks. Finally figured out that I had to slightly lift the previous plank and get the ends lined and partially clicked in place, and there is a little notch in one corner of the drop locks. The planks are very stiff and 12 mm thick which are on the same plane as existing porcelain tile transition. I doubt they could be snapped, I put a 6.5 inch wood blade in a wet tile saw I had from glass backsplash install and ran it dry. I didn’t want to rent a table/miter saw cuz I’m very slow and would cost more than the material. Could have bought a saw and then sell it, I suppose. Got the planks on closeout for $1.98 sf, I don’t think it is sold anymore, just the 10 mm thick version now. Ripping the last row of planks on the tile saw was an adventure, I messed it up and had to use one short piece of scrap cut wider to patch up the wall gap that kept growing to 1” at the end. Getting the end joints to close was a bear, I used a tapping block and pro length puller hitting them hard with a 4 pound sledge. The puller I engaged over the plank lip, not on the locking ledge. Chipped the wear layer off on the end of one row, but next to wall so it won’t show. And I learned that 1/8 inch gap, the width of the locking ledge, is plenty next to the wall in my small house.
Torly's all the way, love their double locking system
Thanx SO GLAD I took the time to watch your video before it was too late. Was informative thanx a lot.
There should be an EP on whether to choose wpc (wood polymer/plastic composite) or spc (stone plastic composite). I notice SPC is cheaper but cold on concrete
"No one intends to give you a warranty" - truth
Would love a video on large format porcelain tile in an apartment. Not because I am getting ready to do it...... for the people....that just happen to be in the exact situation that I am in.
I have installed a lot of lifeproof floors and find them to be pretty good overall
only in certain situations
I just installed laminate in my house last year, and thought I'd share a few more tips:
- Score boards with a knife, and then snap them instead of using a saw, whenever possible. It's quick, and saves a ton of cleanup.
- Use a 2x4 as a tapping block, to distribute the load across your boards, so you don't damage them when tapping them into place.
- Vary your patterns because it's obvious when you see the exact same printed "knot" seven times in a row.
- Don't buy laminate, and just get hardwood floors. Sure, it's cheaper and easier to install, but it scratches just as easily as wood, but you can't hide the scratches with a stain pen. Furniture legs also dent the PVC surface much easier than you'd expect.
Disagree. I have laminate from Pergo (outlast) and i TRY to scratch it and it doesnt AT ALL. The same engineered wood (4mm wear, wide plank, european/white oak) will be 3x the cost once installed. Wood/engineered wood doesn't work as well in homes with constant humidity level changes either
@@J_Money1I suppose some brands and types of laminate are better than others, so that's awesome that you got a good floor. The handful of people I know with laminate had bad luck with them. I installed bamboo floors in my last house, and they were terrific.
@@GeoffCostanzaLaminate does not contain PVC. You have confused Laminate Flooring with Luxury Vinyl Plank, which is what this video is about.
I used Stain master luxury Vinyl planks years ago and regret using it ,was expensive and scratched so easy.Even with thresholds it separated at some points.I learned my lesson,so doing it on the stairs I used nail gun to secure planks and caps. I definitely recommend if you're flipping house looks good and it's easy to install.
Not surprised it scratched easy, Stainmaster LVP has an abysmal 12mil wear layer. Jeff says don't consider anything lower than 20mil, personally, I'd up that to 30mil
Jeff, as a manufacturer who owns a factory that makes spc flooring, I would like to point out something. You can NOT hammer the short side on these drop lock systems. To learn about drop lock installation, I suggest people check out I4F, who is lincensor of drop lock technology. If the plank has not locked properly, hammering it from the other side will only damage that joint. "love tap" should only be done on the long sides. Uniclic locking system is the only locking system that can be "love tapped" on both sides short and long sides because all 4 sides of this locking system is angle type, not drop-down type. However in this video, you have not brought any to showcase.
Also, the very top of spc flooring is coated with UV later. This is the layer that provides critical scratch and stain protection to your floor. There are many different types of UV oil, some have much better performance than others.
This video's purpose was to show two different locking systems, but the two products you are comparing have the same drop lock system. Doesn't give your viewers much confidence if you can't tell which locking systems you are working with.
I don't know what you're looking at but those are definitely two different locking systems on the short joint, he just mistakenly calls the second one a drop lock when he starts to put it down. However, the way he does it is not how I do it. I start by angling in the end joint and then do the long joint. And I would never use that pull bar on a factory edge, get or make a proper tapping block.
This gives me some peace of mind. My buddy owns a bar and wants me to do LVP and I've been extremely worried about the 100 year old building and the amount of traffic.. he knows he will get 10 years max out of it. But I've put in cheap trash for friends that they purchased and I told myself never again will I do something like that for anyone.
in that environment take a look into the vinyl plank that glues in place with no locking joints. that way you can peel up a damaged board and replace it. many come with a 10 or 15 year commercial warranty as well.
@HomeRenoVisionDIY that's what's currently in place. I was trying to avoid all the work tearing it out because I'm doing this as a favor lol
Watch How to Install Vinyl 👉🏼th-cam.com/video/OJqk2iS_jyQ/w-d-xo.html
Watch Brad's @fixthisbuildthat vinyl tutorial mentioned 👉🏼th-cam.com/video/6KEthELQfro/w-d-xo.html
Soo you're not a not a believer in loose lay or glue down vinyl planks? I just put loose lay vinyl in one of my apartments and have fallen in love with it. Interested to hear your thoughts
I love your honesty.
Hi Jeff, I'm a fan of your informative videos. I am a subscriber and shop at your Amazon store to support. I have engineered wood glued on slab. It has developed gaps that are 1/8th of an inch and larger. Could you please let me know how to fix it? Lots of videos are about just moving the pieces but that is not an option because my home floor is glued to the slab. Thanks for your help.❤
ohh, I was expecting to see loose-lay vinyl to be compared with the locking planks. Would be nice to see a follow-up with a 5mm vinyl plank that is most commonly glued down in commercial applications!
Now I wish I would’ve got the 20 mil wear layer instead of the 12 for my house 😂but it’s only 1k sq ft and just me with no pets, so I think it will hold up well. Thanks for the vid Jeff! You’re truly a Jack of all trades.
The locking systems you describe here are the '2G' (aka "droplock") and the 'quad lock' systems, respectively. However, there is another locking system known as '5G', which is essentially a '2G' system with a plastic clip incorporated into the tounge allowing it to lock, rather than only being seated - basically gives you the best of both worlds.
With your 'quad lock', instead of putting the length tounge in first and holding down with your knee while giving it a love tap, i find its easier to put the end tounge in first, then sit the opposite end of that board into the previous row on the angle, then tap the length side in.
Although, personally, I dont work with my knees on the already installed boards until im up to the last few rows and not longer can - this is because it makes installing this quad lock system easier by eliminating the need to use any tools because I can simply do the love tap with my left palm while maintaining the locking angle with my right hand.
The only time i ever lock the length side in first is when im doing the last row where the board is going under a door jamb, where manipulating the board to get it on the angle cannot be met.
We had 5 mm vinyl flooring installed and the planks warp on the long end. They were installed with a professional contractor. The flooring company we purchased the material said it was our fault for not using plastic under the vinyl. We have seen the same vinyl installed on concrete without plastic and it is not warping.
I have a slab on grade... that was poured in the 60s... and is so uneven that before I used some leveler there were gaps approaching an inch over 8 foot spans. At one point along the wall I noticed a crack.. so I figured.. open the crack up a bit with a chisel to get a good surface to bond with and apply some patch, right? Apparently there was some sort of underlayment that they poured the concrete over.. probably a moisture barrier of some sort... and at that point where the crack had occurred it had bunched up really high so the concrete at that point was less than 1/2 inch thick... no wonder it cracked... sheesh. I literally don't know how they poured that slab so poorly, unless they were actively trying to. It certainly has made my vinyl floor journey... interesting.
Also make sure you clean the floor... our house's kitchen has some sort of vinyl flooring and it seems like 2 or 3 small pebbles were left under it and the joints are cracking apart on those spots. I think it's tongue and groove style like you mentioned. :( Not sure how to repair it. They also didn't do any underlayment, I think it's installed right on the concrete because it makes snap crackle noises all around when walking on it.
Thanks for the information, this helps a lot & glad I used the ridged core style locking system for our flooring unknowingly. :)
All I know is I've been in homes with vinyl flooring that look similar to the eye. In one home though I remember the sound of the floor slapping when i walked on it. Like I was walking on sheets of masonite. I assume it may have been warped but it didn't look like it. Other homes almost looked like wood engineered flooring. I think there may be a lot to the quality of vinyl flooring and choosing a good product over what just meets the eye.
Every box of flooring will have instructions which tells you what the tolerance of the subfloor must be. If the subfloor is within the tolerance set by the manufacturer, then droplock shouldnt be coming apart - if they do, then it would almost certainly be manufacturing defect and will likely eventually occur to many of the joins from that particular batch.
As for the melting or heat damage aspect, it should also be stated on the instructions whether that product is suitable for use with underfloor heating.
From what I've seen, warping damage from sunlight seems to be most prevalent with the thinner products of 4mm and 4.5mm. Ive also noticed that its frequently in homes that allow for prolonged sunlight exposure, or where the climate isnt well maintained, such as holiday homes.
Personally, I haven't seen it as a problem that would make it only susceptible to vinyl and hybrid products, given that timber and laminate are also prone to expansion problems in these conditions.
I installed the Noble Oak vinyl plank flooring from the Home Decorators Collection in a older house bathroom with a new sub floor and it curled up like bacon with a week. It had too much give side to side and after i trying to level off the floor perfectly i gave up and installed linoleum instead.
There are two locking systems which you did clarify for both. One is the click and lock, and the other is drop and lock. You did cover 4iF technology drop and locking system which does not needs love taps and comes apart easily w/o damage.
Which one was the second floor that we showed? Click and lock or drop and lock?
Give me the minutes and seconds in your video, so that, I do not have to hunt for where you are talking about. All of 4iF will have this on the end of their cartons.@@luilocolombia
@@dreid4760 the one he is open at 4:45
We have SPC flooring tnat was installed a few weeks before we bought our home. The previous owners had a toilet leak and ripped out the entire floor thatvwas engineered hard wood and replaced with SPC planks.
Unfortunately the SPC only lasted 6 months before all of the locking mechanisms failed, planks coming up and cutting feet, chipping, separating, etc. Called the company who installed it and of course they were off the hook because the warranty did not transfer to new ownership. They admitted that they had needed to raise the floor off the concrete slab to make up for the height of fhe thick engineered wood. So they laid 3/4 inch plywood underneath a vapor lock barrier right on top of the slab. The floor is a hazard to walk on and it needs to be replaced but we are unsure of what type of floor to replace it with because the plywood underlay seems to be extremely uneven and warping in our clhot Arizona climate. I am considering just the glue down type floor but have a feeling everything needs to be ripped out and we need to start from scratch which we cant afftat the moment. Our planks are being ductaped down to prevent further injuries, it's awful.
Does anyone have any suggestions? We will have to avoid any flooring that has any kind of locking mechanism due to how uneven the floor is. Or do we just try to nail it all down and peel n' stick vinyl over top of it?
I have Coretec LVP floors. That actually cost more than many hardwood planks. I have dropped stuff a bazillion times doing interior DIY projects (with no visible damage) that would have scratched or dented the hell out of a hardwood plank.
Ok
Cortec SPC is tough. Got it in my basement home gym. It does resist dents.
@Jeff what’s the best flooring for a concrete slab? And underlayment? Thank you!!
I have been watching this channel for quite some time now and enjoyed it tremendously. We are building a two story home and need to install the floors. Upstairs are a easy decision, they will be hard or engineered wood. Downstairs are more complicated. It has a open kitchen which transits to the big open family room area without any boundaries in between. We are very concerned about possible water damage from the kitchen and have a hard time to decide the floor material, wood, vinyl or tile, etc. Any opinion will be highly appreciated.
Haha “Saturday hunny let me fix the floor”
Please do that test with flooring plank on both sides of the end joint. That is much more of a real life test since only the first and last row of the floor will be like your test .
I wish I knew this 4 years ago. Our snap lock vinyl flooring is shot. Warranty didn’t cover it exactly like you said.
Went with engineered wood on my 1943 reno, because my subfloors weren't perfectly flat and I could staple them down. Soon learned that it is very sensitive to moisure, aka cat urine. It will cup on the edges. I have to set weights on it while it dries to flatten it out. Wood, tile or LVP next time.
I bought 14mm laminate from Sam's club is great product and good price
Great video. With the drop lock, doesn’t the next plank help to stabilise the smaller joint though? So it doesn’t lift on uneven sub-floor.
Thanks brother you're video is to halpfull ❤❤❤❤❤
As a GC and 10 year ex flooring contractor:
1: you definitely need a love tap, especially every other row if you kinda know what your doing and your joints are tight to begin with
2. while product 1 looks a lot easier to install, believe it or not, it’s a lot easier to mess up break the corners where it messes up. the thing is if your 1 mil off from being straight your could be denting every corner and won’t see it until the sun shines across the floor in the middle of the day.
** the reality with the locking point Jeff makes us unless your floor is really bad each system is good cause the next row will lock it all in and the weight of the whole floor will follow the “slopes” of your floor.
Absolutely right brother. Sun will expose all imperfections. Great comment
A couple more tips: if there is a flooring supply store like Prosol in your area, you can find plastic tapping blocks for your love taps that won’t damage the floor like metal ones do. It’s best practice on butt joints to start tapping from the joint out towards the open tongue to avoid a bit of buckling at the joint which can happen if you’re a bit too tight.
Butt joint
Do you have a video on waterproof laminate
What's your views on loose lay vinyl flooring with no glue no tape just loose lay for an uneven plywood floor. Wavy from the floor Joyce but unable to fill to level.
I have one wave in my subfloor. Can you show us how to fix it ourselves without sanding the subfloor? Love your channel!
Hmm 2nd floor kitchen, townhouse built 1989. 2 layers of sheer vinyl. The 2nd sheet vinyl they used some self leveler but they could not get it perfectly level, it more a long distance in non level not a whole bunch ups and downs.
Looking at LVP overtop of existing sheet vinyl.
sounds fine to me. Cheers!
I LOVED your video!!!!!!! I have a 53 year old 2-story farm house (we live on a 15 acre farm) we are rough on floors! We currently have travertine 18X18 square tiles and I HATE THEM. They are COLD, they are HARD, they hurt my feet and the grout is always dirty. I really want to put new floors in...being that we are soooo rough on floors-kids, animals, even goats and alpacas sometimes in the house and that we are on a raised foundation, we have variance in the grade and level-can we put the tongue and groove vinyl plank over the tile? Do we have to remove the tile? should we put hardwood-thoughts ideas, suggestions are most WELCOME
Thank you! I was thinking about vinyl but changing direction hardwood
I just installed spc flooring and love it!
Good to hear!
Man, I put down vinyl upstairs in my 2x10 joist, 1/2 subfloor because It's all I could afford, and now we will need to redo everything : (
I wish I knew this a year ago!
if your joints are popping up try setting them in adhesive for vinyl plank and leave a weight on over night. this will help to extend the life of the floor.Cheers!
@HomeRenoVisionDIY I will try that. Thank you for the great videos!
two thumbs up for this one!
We have Lifeproof floors in the living and dining room. So happy I found SmartDrop floors for the rest of the house. Love this floor more. Amazing to work with, fully waterproof too. It is exactly what the name implies-SmartDrop. You literally drop the floor in place. Glue around the outer to stop it from moving.
An interesting thing that I figured out regarding lifeproof, some (not sure how much) is re-branded MSI. What I tracked down for sure is on the engineered hardwood version. This is useful as MSI has more matching transitions, stair noses, stair treads etc than what HD sells. Seems the best way to tell is that HD uses the same image on their site as MSI does (as in the exact same picture down to the knots in the wood etc).
LOL. they are both buying the vinyl from the same chinese supplier!
@@HomeRenoVisionDIY While I'm sure it is coming out of the same factories as half the other similar products, Home Depot's questions section on the page actually had really old comments from MSI answering questions and also linking to the MSI products on the HD website (this is how I got started tracking down the MSI version).
@@daviddeflyer8671home depot is listed as a supplier on the msi site
Thanks for your honesty
Been looking to install new vinyl flooring in kitchen as previous owner used regular laminate which clearly not appropriate as it's lifting up. Will have to rewatch some ofvur previous videos as not familiar with the construction terms used. It's a 1970's home so floors aren't level.
Hello, wanted to know if it’s best to put down a vapor barrier before installing LVP flooring if the foundation is concrete?
This guy is awesome.
We have had vinyl for 6 years and my floors are very uneven or sloping (130 year old house). I have a couple of spots where it cracked because not having enough plywood under it. We are pretty happy with it overall, especially if it lasts another 15 years, which it seems like it will. Cost me about $3k per 1000sq ft.
Is this cost include the sub flooring and any labor charges or did you install it yourself ?
What's the definition of "older house" ? Is a 1995/1996 home likely to have dimensional floor joists? How can I spot a dimensional vs. engineered?
What product someone chooses to install (vinyl, timber, laminate) should be determined by the circumstances in which its most suitable to them. Yes, an engineered timber floor would add monetary value to the property from a valuation perspective, say with insurance or banks/mortgage companies, but in the long term, that sale value would be negligible after paying for its maintenance and refinishings, especially if there's children or pets involved, where sanding + polishing simply wont fix it.
If you have a slab on grade concrete subfloor in the basement, but the concrete is not perfectly flat, would you recommend going tongue and groove over snap lock? We're talking about maybe half an inch change over several feet, but you can see the hump standing back.
Another video with great advice - thanks Jeff!
I have used both and had it professionally installed and the one that you use the tool to close the inner gap is pure garbage for spills. I wouldn't waste my money on that flooring ever again. Oh and the space you have to leave around the baseboards so it can expand also helps it become lose and leave gaps. If you have kids or pets I don't recommend either of these types of flooring. Spills cause buckling and like he mentioned the joints are easily damaged and they start peeling and it looks horrible. Also a quick fix is not an option you have to start from one side of the room and remove all the planks without damaging them which is almost impossible to fix the one that was damaged then reinstall which is a total pain. The tap joint ones also if they get wet over a few short times they are ruined.
THANKS FOR THIS INFORMATION
I needed this one! Thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
Can you do a video about linoleum flooring?
FFFF thanks Jeff. I'm dealing with this exact problem (what flooring to use for sloped old home floor) ... most crap youtube channels are like "hey just use floor leveler" Ok yeah I have enough slope to where that's a ridiculous idea lol
Have you tried Select Surfaces 24 hr Spill defense? We installed it in 2 rooms so far. A fellow customer said they installed it 5 yrs ago with 2 labradors and grandkids and says it still looks great❤
Excellent video
We have a townhouse with self stick vinyl flooring. What a mess that's going to be to remove and then lay some new flooring. It's so soft a plank I lifted could almost be rolled like the rubber/vinyl wall trim one can see in the hospital.