Even if the black piece is from a Prusa machine, it is a very bad example what even a MK3 can do. A bit of Z banding is unavoidable, but this is nog acceptable when printing for a client. I am a hobby printer, but often print for others on my Prusa printers. Even if this print was from my MK3, it will end in the waste bin and I will do a thorough maintenance job on the printer. A MK3 is capable of much better results although it may take some more time. This looks to me the have cranked up the printing speed up (and over) its limits. As the bottom part shows some over extruding the nozzle may be a bit worn out. Xometry should improve their quality and quality control.
i would argue that in mass production like xometry you expect some quality drop vs hobby printing; This is purely because hobbyists can spend 20x the human time per print than mass producers can. It's production, and production is stupid hard. You can't spend time fine tuning constantly.
I was thinking the same thing. My Mk3s+ consistently prints as good as the brown part. The only thing I have done is set belt tension. The black part looks like what I've been getting off of my Bambu. I was excited to get it, now I feel like I'm back in my ender days of tuning and tuning and slowing everything down to get quality prints. After about 4 weeks now I feel like I'm getting pretty close to the equal quality of my old machine.
Our Stratasys 400mc at work is this bad too. And the Insight software gives you no control over extrusion settings. Some surface defects like yours can be caused by the soluble support structures. But this is what you get from a well maintained, and fully functional Stratasys machine, nothing more.
Why i am not surprised at all; All the super expensive high end industrial FDM machines have been very lacklustre print surface quality i've seen to date :(
We have similar quality control issues with xometry orders. Mostly on machined milled parts, that in stead of milled look like hand machined, drilled and tapped. With extremely uneven edge treatments. Although to be fair, ordered with only basic quality control option. However, in my opinion a dimensional part simply needs to conform to a minimum standard. So no surprise your part came looking like it did. Which is really sad! Because we like the concept of their business model.
No that used to be how they do, they now have their own production facilities and machines. i get ads from them bragging about it. thats why we wanted to see what their new big badass machines would do.
There is also Weerg and Fractory, check them out. I use Fractory myself constantly, had some QA issues but they went last time truly above and beyond to work the issues out; Large thin aluminium sheet with M3 threads tapped -> The aluminium itself was uneven quality causing that i couldn't even tap it by hand often, i eventually gave up and started tapping M4 instead where ever i could. When tapping by hand the material would sometimes chip, a flake would fly off. Forget "doing the wrong way" and just using a drill. On high quality stiff aluminium (angle brackets) with less material thickness i've done hundreds upon hundreds of M3 threads with just a power drill without a single failure; So definitively material issue -- I did ask for the cheapest one :D Next time i'll ask for T6 and perhaps 1x steel as sample to compare.
@@paytreonsuhks Those wavy patterns on the side aren't supposed to be part of the print. They're a product of a badly tuned or very cheap 3D printer. While it costs an arm and a leg to actually mitigate, it's not something you should expect to find from a professional printing service.
The Xometry was bad, but even the BambuLab, while immensely better, still has some quality issues there which were obvious when zoomed in. It looks like the extruder's gears on the BL are out of alignment, but for a functional print it's not likely to be that big of a deal. I would utterly reject the Xometry model though, or at least be inspecting them closely for issues that impact functionality.
Why ever pay for an FDM print these days when SLS prints from the likes of Shapeways are vastly superior in all mechanical characteristics and at least comparable in price? Looking at my recent pricing, a part that size should range around $60 or so in solid nylon. And for all other uses, my Bambu has been the best for sure.
Last I checked, I could only get small stuff printed with SLS without breaking the bank. Once the dimensions exceeded 100 mm, that's when the cost ballooned. FDM, you can run at home and with a bit of tuning you get a good-enough print with all sorts of properties depending on the material that you use.
Depends on what the part is for, different structural properties for different materials and methods. standard screen project SLA is x4 the cost in the terms of material (its also generally pretty fragile). If you get into objet hybrid prints using some pretty fancy resins types the prices can get astronomical. If your doing high resolution detailed stuff like models then SLA. But I know alot of the 501st guys still stick to FDM over SLA, just out of sheer cost that and they are just gonna glass (fiberglass/resin) the part anyways.
This customer requested ASA material here so could not be sls. I found some over seas companies that have newer better and bigger machines than shapeways and they are cheaper.
Tough comparison too because the brown fillament hides the defects a lot more than the black. The xeometry part is basically unacceptable. Even if you look past the obvious lack of input shaping, everything else about the part is bad too. I would request a refund if I paid for a part like that. The bambu part is much better but it's also not perfect, can see surface quality defects in it as well. The (raft?) bottom of the bambu print is unacceptable as well IMO. PA looks like it's not quite dialed in. Overhangs can be better too. I find my bambu struggles with overhangs. Top surface looks off, maybe overextruded but don't have that good of a view of it from the video. Always something that can be improved. If you do more tuning you can get better prints out of the bambu.
Looks like not enough part cooling fan was used, retracts I would normally ask client where they would like z line but even then it should barely be visible and the corners are a sign that the pressure advance is miscalibrated.
The first layer on the bambu print wasn't perfect, but other than that really good. Black parts should be the easiest to tune for though, especially in a filament like ASA
to me looks like an mk3 print too. the basket waving is very characteristic of the tmc2130's. and yeah i was as disapointed as you when i got it 4 years ago xD
Unbelievable. These garbage companies like stratasys and ultimaker and keeping 3d printing in the dark with their useless overpriced hardware and patent trolling.
looks like someone lying to xometry about what printers they are using. do you know if it was made by xometry themselves or a supplier working for them?
God, even my Ender V2 Neo prints better than the left. If my printer out our parts like that I'd factory reset my slicer settings and do a full review of every part in my printer that I understand fully cuz I obviously screwed something up somewhere.
@@3DPrintsEverythingAh. That explains the poor looking bottom surface of the brown print. I assume you grabbed some calipers and did a dimensional check of the two printed parts to the original 3D model?
There was a great disturbance in the force... as if a million Prusa fanboys REEE'ED out in impotent rage, and were furiously typing their arguments in the comments ^_^
Honestly, If my MK3 (retired to make space for a MK4) produced a part like that black one, I would be pissed. But I have the benefit of being a hobby 3D printer and print slower and calibrate filaments. I also spend extra time on the slicer fussing with settings to get the best gcode that I can. All are time sinks that I wouldn't expect a production farm to put in. What would be interesting would be to run a set of parts through each of the big 3D print farm companies to compare quality between them. Unfortunately, that would take a lot of money and would have to be run annually to really be of any value. (Kind of like how LTT has their annual Secret Shopper series.)
@@Sembazuru Yeah, but a production farm should have already figured out the filaments they have on offer precisely because they are selling what they produce and there are expectations of a finished product. For the ladies in my office, I routinely make fairly large productions of things they like, and while they are free/gifts, I have expectations of my finished result that I plan to give to someone else that it at least looks good enough to appear like it was well made and with a bit of effort put into the final product.
Prusas/Stratasys are so overhyped. That part doesn't even look like it's was printed using resonance compensation. My $400 Vyper running Klipper prints better.
"resonance compensation" Ill be honest I didnt know about this until the bambu and it makes so much since. I wish I had bought stock in them they have to be killing it right now.
What materials are those parts? same brand? obvioulsy not same colour..... Also, not same g-code. This is s a poor way to compare machine output. Yes, i agree the brown one is way better, but still not perfect.
ASA filament. One is from 3D print everything on a bambu the other is from xometry. The basic measurement being done is Xometry cost 45$ 3DPE cost 9$. which would you want for the price?
@@3DPrintsEverything I understand the cost issue, but I build printer professonally and work at AON3D... so I have more than enough printers available.
@@3DPrintsEverything obviously the one you printed is better, that is not the question or concern here. They should not have sent that part at all regardless but it would be interesting to see the results if you were given the same exact filament they were using while using the same G Code. So many variables to what could have happened, but yes, printing your own seems to be the better play.
![ฮักเทื่อสุดท้าย - บอย ศิริชัย [OFFICIAL MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/-1PoPoQ-B-k/mqdefault.jpg)
Even if the black piece is from a Prusa machine, it is a very bad example what even a MK3 can do. A bit of Z banding is unavoidable, but this is nog acceptable when printing for a client. I am a hobby printer, but often print for others on my Prusa printers. Even if this print was from my MK3, it will end in the waste bin and I will do a thorough maintenance job on the printer. A MK3 is capable of much better results although it may take some more time.
This looks to me the have cranked up the printing speed up (and over) its limits. As the bottom part shows some over extruding the nozzle may be a bit worn out.
Xometry should improve their quality and quality control.
i would argue that in mass production like xometry you expect some quality drop vs hobby printing; This is purely because hobbyists can spend 20x the human time per print than mass producers can.
It's production, and production is stupid hard. You can't spend time fine tuning constantly.
In most of the big 3d printing services the quality its trash.
I was thinking the same thing. My Mk3s+ consistently prints as good as the brown part. The only thing I have done is set belt tension. The black part looks like what I've been getting off of my Bambu. I was excited to get it, now I feel like I'm back in my ender days of tuning and tuning and slowing everything down to get quality prints. After about 4 weeks now I feel like I'm getting pretty close to the equal quality of my old machine.
Our Stratasys 400mc at work is this bad too. And the Insight software gives you no control over extrusion settings. Some surface defects like yours can be caused by the soluble support structures. But this is what you get from a well maintained, and fully functional Stratasys machine, nothing more.
Yeah i am just getting to mess with the j5 and there are no settings at all besides color
Oh hell, INSIGHT!!!! The bane of my existence. I hate that software!
Why i am not surprised at all; All the super expensive high end industrial FDM machines have been very lacklustre print surface quality i've seen to date :(
I've used Xometry with HP MJF for a custom 2-stroke pull-start and it came out very nice. Good to know their cheaper techniques may be sub par.
Would love your Bambu profile. Looks great
thanks for the video, i love your chanel, nice to see you come back
Glad you enjoy it! Thank you for watching!
shame the brown hides a lot, would've been nice to have been as close as possible identical materials, and especially color matched
We have similar quality control issues with xometry orders.
Mostly on machined milled parts, that in stead of milled look like hand machined, drilled and tapped. With extremely uneven edge treatments.
Although to be fair, ordered with only basic quality control option.
However, in my opinion a dimensional part simply needs to conform to a minimum standard.
So no surprise your part came looking like it did.
Which is really sad! Because we like the concept of their business model.
Sadly Xometry is just a marketplace, they outsource the work to different suppliers (cheapest), so quality would change from order to order
No that used to be how they do, they now have their own production facilities and machines. i get ads from them bragging about it. thats why we wanted to see what their new big badass machines would do.
There is also Weerg and Fractory, check them out. I use Fractory myself constantly, had some QA issues but they went last time truly above and beyond to work the issues out; Large thin aluminium sheet with M3 threads tapped -> The aluminium itself was uneven quality causing that i couldn't even tap it by hand often, i eventually gave up and started tapping M4 instead where ever i could.
When tapping by hand the material would sometimes chip, a flake would fly off. Forget "doing the wrong way" and just using a drill.
On high quality stiff aluminium (angle brackets) with less material thickness i've done hundreds upon hundreds of M3 threads with just a power drill without a single failure; So definitively material issue -- I did ask for the cheapest one :D
Next time i'll ask for T6 and perhaps 1x steel as sample to compare.
@@3DPrintsEverything perhaps they are running hybrid model? Do whatever they can in-house for juicier fatter profit margin; Outsource rest.
@@ernestomilanThis is correct when it comes to machining. I can’t speak for 3D printing though.
$45 for that crap?
If my printer would produce something like that, I would throw it away and print it once more after I service the machine.
Seriously wtf
@@paytreonsuhks Those wavy patterns on the side aren't supposed to be part of the print. They're a product of a badly tuned or very cheap 3D printer. While it costs an arm and a leg to actually mitigate, it's not something you should expect to find from a professional printing service.
For an apples to apples comparison you should use the exact same filament, otherwise you're introducing a whole bunch of confounding variables.
The Xometry was bad, but even the BambuLab, while immensely better, still has some quality issues there which were obvious when zoomed in. It looks like the extruder's gears on the BL are out of alignment, but for a functional print it's not likely to be that big of a deal. I would utterly reject the Xometry model though, or at least be inspecting them closely for issues that impact functionality.
I'm interested in printers that achieve even better results than this Bambu example. Can you point me to photos of samples?
Why ever pay for an FDM print these days when SLS prints from the likes of Shapeways are vastly superior in all mechanical characteristics and at least comparable in price? Looking at my recent pricing, a part that size should range around $60 or so in solid nylon. And for all other uses, my Bambu has been the best for sure.
Last I checked, I could only get small stuff printed with SLS without breaking the bank. Once the dimensions exceeded 100 mm, that's when the cost ballooned. FDM, you can run at home and with a bit of tuning you get a good-enough print with all sorts of properties depending on the material that you use.
Depends on what the part is for, different structural properties for different materials and methods. standard screen project SLA is x4 the cost in the terms of material (its also generally pretty fragile). If you get into objet hybrid prints using some pretty fancy resins types the prices can get astronomical. If your doing high resolution detailed stuff like models then SLA. But I know alot of the 501st guys still stick to FDM over SLA, just out of sheer cost that and they are just gonna glass (fiberglass/resin) the part anyways.
This customer requested ASA material here so could not be sls.
I found some over seas companies that have newer better and bigger machines than shapeways and they are cheaper.
Tough comparison too because the brown fillament hides the defects a lot more than the black.
The xeometry part is basically unacceptable. Even if you look past the obvious lack of input shaping, everything else about the part is bad too. I would request a refund if I paid for a part like that.
The bambu part is much better but it's also not perfect, can see surface quality defects in it as well. The (raft?) bottom of the bambu print is unacceptable as well IMO. PA looks like it's not quite dialed in. Overhangs can be better too. I find my bambu struggles with overhangs. Top surface looks off, maybe overextruded but don't have that good of a view of it from the video.
Always something that can be improved. If you do more tuning you can get better prints out of the bambu.
A lot of printers can print just like Bambo if you put the work in to tune them. So that quality coming from Xometry is unacceptable.
Looks like not enough part cooling fan was used, retracts I would normally ask client where they would like z line but even then it should barely be visible and the corners are a sign that the pressure advance is miscalibrated.
45$?!
I charge 5e for those small prints.
If my prusa produced that, I'd be horrified! Must be running all settings at 100mm/sec if it even is a prusa. That bambu print is sweeeeet.
The first layer on the bambu print wasn't perfect, but other than that really good. Black parts should be the easiest to tune for though, especially in a filament like ASA
3:25 I think you are looking for the word 'Resonance' maybe
to me looks like an mk3 print too. the basket waving is very characteristic of the tmc2130's. and yeah i was as disapointed as you when i got it 4 years ago xD
Unbelievable. These garbage companies like stratasys and ultimaker and keeping 3d printing in the dark with their useless overpriced hardware and patent trolling.
That is why my farm is 53 Bambu machines :)
Hey z-banding is a vertical artifact and not a horizontal. What you are showing isn't z-banding but the explanation is right.
looks like someone lying to xometry about what printers they are using. do you know if it was made by xometry themselves or a supplier working for them?
Left looks like an Ender 3 V2. Right looks like an Anet A8.
🤣
My Anet A8 running Klipper literally prints better than that Prusa on the left.
God, even my Ender V2 Neo prints better than the left. If my printer out our parts like that I'd factory reset my slicer settings and do a full review of every part in my printer that I understand fully cuz I obviously screwed something up somewhere.
Did you do a strength test?
Side by side looks like one of those are not respecting the dimensions, they are different, bamboo lab is taller at first look.
Ok to be fair i forgot to mention a slight bit of raft was left on the bottom for this video. so the heights are actually the same with raft removed
@@3DPrintsEverythingAh. That explains the poor looking bottom surface of the brown print. I assume you grabbed some calipers and did a dimensional check of the two printed parts to the original 3D model?
Looks like absolute @($% calibration, probably favoring print speeds over anything.
The amount of time ive saved not having to stuff around with enders is well worth the price of a p1p
me too
what material it is?
4:05
ASA
I wouldn't send something like that to clients. horrible at any price
There was a great disturbance in the force... as if a million Prusa fanboys REEE'ED out in impotent rage, and were furiously typing their arguments in the comments ^_^
Honestly, If my MK3 (retired to make space for a MK4) produced a part like that black one, I would be pissed. But I have the benefit of being a hobby 3D printer and print slower and calibrate filaments. I also spend extra time on the slicer fussing with settings to get the best gcode that I can. All are time sinks that I wouldn't expect a production farm to put in.
What would be interesting would be to run a set of parts through each of the big 3D print farm companies to compare quality between them. Unfortunately, that would take a lot of money and would have to be run annually to really be of any value. (Kind of like how LTT has their annual Secret Shopper series.)
@@Sembazuru Yeah, but a production farm should have already figured out the filaments they have on offer precisely because they are selling what they produce and there are expectations of a finished product.
For the ladies in my office, I routinely make fairly large productions of things they like, and while they are free/gifts, I have expectations of my finished result that I plan to give to someone else that it at least looks good enough to appear like it was well made and with a bit of effort put into the final product.
Looks like they are simply running the printer to fast .
Black print is Prusa quality.
Prusas/Stratasys are so overhyped. That part doesn't even look like it's was printed using resonance compensation. My $400 Vyper running Klipper prints better.
"resonance compensation" Ill be honest I didnt know about this until the bambu and it makes so much since.
I wish I had bought stock in them they have to be killing it right now.
Wow! That sucks.
Bambu printers just work!
You got that right!
What materials are those parts? same brand? obvioulsy not same colour..... Also, not same g-code. This is s a poor way to compare machine output. Yes, i agree the brown one is way better, but still not perfect.
ASA filament. One is from 3D print everything on a bambu the other is from xometry.
The basic measurement being done is Xometry cost 45$ 3DPE cost 9$. which would you want for the price?
@@3DPrintsEverything I understand the cost issue, but I build printer professonally and work at AON3D... so I have more than enough printers available.
@@3DPrintsEverything obviously the one you printed is better, that is not the question or concern here. They should not have sent that part at all regardless but it would be interesting to see the results if you were given the same exact filament they were using while using the same G Code. So many variables to what could have happened, but yes, printing your own seems to be the better play.
My ender v3 SE prints better than that xometry, and I'm an absolute newbie even my prints come out better than that😂
any untuned Bambu lab printer will make a shit print if you don't calibrate it well, so what is your point ? clearly it is not tuned ...