Joseph Knew 2.0 Part 4 | Book Of Mormon Evidence
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 26 ม.ค. 2024
- Why is that in every account that attempts to defame Joseph Smith, there is evidences that don't support those claims. Such as the John Bernhisel manuscript, what is the Bernhisel manuscript? How did it emerge, and why did it emerge? In this episode we dive deep into this topic and so much more!
Our team has researched extensively and uncovered compelling evidence that supports this claim. But don't just take our word for it, visit our website at bookofmormonev... for even more proof!
Join us as we uncover how Joseph Smith knew, as he described through his divine role as prophet and translator of the Book of Mormon. Discover the historical context behind these publications in early Church history and how it aligns with Joseph's teachings. Don't miss out on this intriguing discussion filled with fascinating evidence. Hit play now! #BookofMormonEvidence #JosephSmithKnew #TimesAndSeasons
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Visit Jonathan Neville at www.mobom.org/ & nomorecontenti...
Great discussion Rod and Jonathan. As a descendant of Dr. Bernhisel, it has been fascinating to research his life and learn of the contributions he made to not only the early church, but also working in Washington D.C. as a delegate from the territory of "Deseret" (Utah) to push for recognition by the federal government and potential future statehood. Having said that I have no reason to believe that he had any concrete evidence of where the Book of Mormon lands were. What is amazing to me is that while I do believe that Joseph 100% knew exactly where the events of the Book of Mormon occurred (and despite the evidence to the affirmative), how many church "scholars" continue to insist that they are in fact correct about the Meso-America model.
I noticed that the Come Follow Me lesson for 1 Nephi 11-15 completely ignores the ch 13 prophecies of the United States which identify the land of the US as the promised land promised to Lehi.
That is very sad. Chapter 13 is such a verification of North America as the very Promised Land spoken of in the Book of Mormon
Ugh
The reason for it is because the interpretations of the Heartland group are false. There's a reason no apostle and prophet ever references the Heartland model.
It wasn't Joseph Smith who said that Lehi landed in Chile. He did in fact say that Lehi landed a little south of the Isthmus of Darien. Then later on Joseph F. Smith said they landed in Chile. Then Joseph Fielding Smith said that it would have been a shame that North America was the promised land, because Nephi and his group never made it there (all paraphrasing.) He then went on to say that for someone to believe in the Book of Mormon must also believe that both North and South America is the promised land.
What's really sad is that a fringe group was organized denouncing prophets because they think they know better than them. They selectively pick certain phrases from Joseph Smith that fit their context, so when they share their narrative people believe them. Joseph Smith wasn't the only prophet entitled to revelation pertaining to the descendants of Lehi and the Mulekites.
What a disservice we do to the Native Americans by denying their Lehite lineage. We, as a Church, are largely failing to restore them to a knowledge of their fathers.
Which native Americans are you referring to? North and South Americans? Or American Indians as most call themselves?
I don’t think anyone can claim they/we know for sure. But we are restoring the truth and covenants to all who will hear and accept the message of the restored gospel. That’s the service we provide. So I don’t think we are blowing it or doing anyone a disservice.
You know the BoM is made up right ? natives don’t need a racist make believe “white savior” complex thank you very much.
All people are children of a wonderful Good. Some are literal Children of Israel through Jacob. Those that are not, may become heirs of the same blessings through proper Baptism and Confirmation. Native Americans of Iroquois and Algonquian have a Hebrew lineage, called Haplogroup X other Native Americans such as Dine, Inuit, Sioux, and many others have an Asian background of Haplogroup A,B,C,D. @@alaskachad1
Thank you for your deep research and head on approach. I’m loving your further light and knowledge.
You are so welcome
I like the discussion around the 21 minute mark about the other sheep.
In the 2010 BYU production of “Messiah: Behold the Lamb of God,” Episode 6, “He is Not Here; He is Risen,” at the 27:15 mark in that video, S. Kent Brown gives the following: “if apocryphal literature is several steps removed from accepted scripture, one more step takes us into the world of legend. Here, one does not find truth in individual stories, but in trends or in themes. Oral tradition is persistent, and can give clues about events in veiled and unexpected ways. And in terms of local folklore, one of the most common claims from London to Tibet is: “Jesus was here.”
Further, he quotes John 10:16 about “other sheep” and then finishes with this statement as he introduces a segment on The Book of Mormon: “Although it is unclear how many other sheep Jesus intends to visit, one record stands apart as an independent witness of his literal resurrection.”
With all the legends around the world referencing visitation from a great bearded god, or some other description, I take the reference to “London to Tibet” as a metaphor referring to a wide range of geographical locations, such as the Marines “from the Halls of Montezuma to the shores of Tripoli.”
2 Nephi 29:11-12 says it pretty well, I think: “For I command all men, both in the east and in the west, and in the north, and in the south, and in the islands of the sea, that they shall write the words which I speak unto them … and I shall also speak unto all nations of the earth and they shall write it.”
I believe that the Marvelous Work and a Wonder has only begun to come forth. When all is said and done, we will know that Joseph knew, and that he never wavered.
Can someone please share the original Wilford Woodruff "most correct" quote in context. They danced all around this at the 19 and 20 minute mark but didn't really show us how to find it
The statement about Winchester being "rotten at heart" is on page 174 of "The Lost City of Zarahemla"
Love it
I have some questions about the possible Florida landing. I live here and would like to visit the place you believe Lehi might have landed. The question I have is why does the Florida State Parks say these mounds were built between 1000-1500 AD? That puts the dates at least 600 years past the destruction of the Nephites. Just looking for some clarification, because, as I said, my husband and I would like to visit the place. Thanks.
When on my mission in Finland , while under the delusion of the mesoamerican theory, I left a copy of the book He Walked the Americas in a Finnish library. It is unfortunate that this tendentious theory had become so strong in the Church that it misled so many of us down a bogus path.
I understand why the church leadership won't state which Book of Mormon model is correct due to the members needing to show more faith. But what I don't understand is why Joseph Smith's own words about the geography of the Book of Mormon aren't backed up by the brethren more? If there is hard evidence that Joseph Smith didnt write or state things about Central or South America being the lands of the BOM and only testified of North America, shouldn't the leadership be supporting those words and putting to rest the other models???
Personally, from my own research on Joseph Smith and seeing the evidences shown in North America, I believe it's the place!
I also believe for myself that by knowing where the Book of Mormon took place it would only reaffirm and strengthen my own belief in Jesus Christ more than hinder it! And maybe I wouldn't be so heartbroken, because it would help others (like my own son) not to disregard the faith so easily and fall away because their faith isn't strong enough to believe!
We have tried our level best to share the historical facts as they are known. We have addressed every known argument that has been offered in the attempt to show that Joseph changed his mind on his early revelatory statements indicative of his understanding of the setting of the Book of Mormon in America's Heartland. We have not knowingly left anything out because it would impune our geography model, as can be shone to have occurred among our Meso-America advocate friends.
We believe the brethren have relegated the responsibility to get the history correct and have relied on the historians in their understanding of what actually happened. If the historians provide inaccurate, misleading or falsified historical information to the brethren, they are highly likely to assume it's accuracy. They are busy administrators of a world-wide church organization and do not have the time and expertise to micromanage the historians. They should expect them to get it right and true, so its on the heads of the revisionist historians if the brethren get bad information. As Pres. Nelson has said... 'Good inspiration comes from good information.' We believe that is true and tantamount to this discussion.
@BookofMormonEvidence Thanks for what you do! Hopefully, someday, more people will realize the truth and believe the words of Joseph Smith and others who have stated where it took place.
I wish I was able to travel and come see all the sites for myself, where you all are describing to possibly be the Nephite ruins. It's exciting, and it really strengthens my testimony. 😀
It's evidence that your best efforts are not substantiated by the prophet. If yours is the wisdom of men the brethren may lean your direction if the Lord leads them to do so, or not lean towards your understanding if the Lord so leads them.
It makes real good politics to consider the United States above the rest of the Americas. It is perfectly reasonable, what you are saying. It makes good sense.
I wouldn't get ahead of the brethren on it, though.
The very idea that you expect that Joseph Smith didn't see letters written in his name is suspect. Just assume that Joseph dictated those letters in his name, and your speculations will be more credible.
However, we know that Joseph wasn't dictating those letters in the Times and Seasons because of historical accounts of what he WAS doing at the time. Read Jonathan's book, The Lost City of Zarahemla for all the details. Joseph had to submit articles he wrote to the editors whichever makes no sense if he was the editor.
It might be nice to use stylometry to prove your theory on "who" was the author of those letters. Joseph and the others had enough writings for a strong stylometric study. Thanks for your passionate presentation.
Jonathan Neville discovered the authors of the Times and Seasons articles when he found the Gospel Reflector newspaper that Benjamin Winchester was publishing in Philadelphia prior to coming to Nauvoo to work with William Smith on the Times and Seasons. He had published some of the articles previously in Gospel Reflector that were later published in the Times and Seasons under 'ED' and attributed falsely as from Joseph Smith. No stylometry is needed to know who the author(s) were. For more detailed information please read Jonathan's book, The Lost City of Zarahemla, which is fully referenced. It unfolds the entire historical background of the origins of the Mesoamerica theory as stemming from several people who ultimately became apostates against the teachings of the prophet Joseph Smith. Benjamin Winchester was the 'smoking gun' of how Mesoamerica was ever even considered as a possible setting for the Book of Mormon. Read and discover how it happened.
Still looking for Zarahemla
Can't find what isn't there
31:24 Andrew Ehat
No he did not.
But I do believe Jesus did visit people throughout central and South America
Believe any crazy thing you like...
I am sure the Lord loves all people all over the world. I'm sure it is likely the Savior visited many lands. The issue is, the Book of Mormon record is about North America as joseph Smith says, and other records have not come forth as of yet.
The fact that every single prophet and apostle who spoke on this topic said that Lehi and his group landed in South America. Then, when speaking of the Hill Cumorah they all say it's in North America. But somehow Heartlanders conflate that the Hill Cumorah is indicative of Lehi's landing, when there is no correlative relation between the two. Lehi landed about 592 BC, the final resting place of the plates was 421 AD, so about a thousand years between the two events. Then there's Joseph Fielding Smith declaring that if someone believes in the Book of Mormon must also believe that both North and South America is the promised land. Heartland only advocates that North America is the promised land. So now they're denouncing a prophet of God.
Through all of my personal studies and research, Lehi landed in South America and I have all the prophets and apostles in support of it. Then Mormon even states that Lehi landed in South America. Yes, I know America isn't said in the Book of Mormon. Hel. 6:10 is the reference. When you compare that verse to the latter day prophets and apostles it makes perfect sense what Mormon meant. I also have tons more to reinforce what I know.
Lehi's sailing voyage is documented in Herodotus Book 4, Ch 40-42.
Thank you, that is a very good reference.
Thanks for that reference!
About those "plates," that you playfully showed. It seems that people continue to show the plates as being a stack too deep to be authentic. Gold is heavy. The prophet's brother, William, said that the plates weighed about 60 lbs. The stack would not have been deep, as some seem to think. To me this a commentary on the "gift and power." Joseph was a prophet
The replica gold plates Rod was holding are actually fiberglass made by Mormon Art & Bronze in Provo, UT.
They were made after consultation with several historical accounts depicting the original set of plates that were retrieved from the stone box on the side of the one-and-only Hill Cumorah in New York. They were said to have been approximately 6" wide x 8" long x 6" tall.
The plates were said to have been primarily gold in color, but with a "greenish cast" which would indicate the presence of copper and that the plates may have been made of an alloy of gold, copper, and silver called Tumbaga. Interestingly, Tumbaga has a lower melting point than any of the pure metals. It is also somewhat lighter as it is less dense, yet has the main properties of gold in that it doesn't rust or corrode over time. Hope this is helpful.
Interesting podcast. Appreciate the info. Are you guys RLDS? or one of the splinter groups of the Restoration?
Pretty sure they are….not.
@@jordan-xe2yb thanks! You’re answering for them then?
@@pjones1403 yes, from reading their books and listening to different interviews and talks. LDS.
@@jordan-xe2yb got it! Thank You! So they are B.Y. LDS?
@@pjones1403I know for a fact that both gentlemen are B.Y. LDS
Stop and think about it! If the BYU "scholars" are some how proven to be right then the LDS faith is proven to be false. I believe JS and believe the with all the overwhelming evidence the BOM happened here in the USA. If I am worng then my religion is false and and I know its not. These people are unwittingly supporting the adversary!!!
The Latter-Day Saints are some of the nicest people I know, devoted people, whom many other Christians could do well to emulate in their zeal and spirit of sacrifice, in their concern to build loving Christian communities, and in their positive approach towards family values and the sanctity of life. Nevertheless, LDS “gospel” is a sad travesty of Christ’s true gospel as evidenced after ever Sunday service as Jesus is desecrated when the 'left over' blessed and sanctified bread and water is thrown into the trash.
A singular and speculative issue my friend. What should the Priesthood do with the sacred emblems of the Sacrament after it is passed to the Saints? Keep it in the freezer? Do a special ceremony to bury it? Save it for the next week? The bread and water REPRESENT the Lord's flesh and blood, these items are not the actual flesh and blood of the Saviors body. After a sacred baptism of a new convert to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, we don't save the water in the baptismal font, but it goes back to nature. The ordinance is over and the Sacrament is renewed fresh again each week.
@@riannelson67 To 'bless and sanctify' something means to set it apart for a sacred purpose or religious use and bread, water, or oil is no longer ordinary bread, water, or oil any more, symbolic or not. Mormons will respectfully remove the non-biblical freemasonic symbols from old garments before disposal.
Which is strange because Joseph Smith strongly opposed Freemasonry in early LDS history, due to its incompatibility with Christianity. Then, for whatever reason, Smith later become a Freemason himself in 1842, and soon after implemented the ‘secret’ temple ceremonies, handshakes, dress, symbols, and covenants, which are eerily similar to the ‘cult like’ Freemasonry secret ceremonies, handshakes, dress, symbols, and covenants.
So you see friend, mormons show more respect to old worn out underwear than the body of Jesus Christ, as LDS leadership smile and speak of the goodness of the church.
@@johns1834 whooooosssshhh
@@vendingdudes Is there a sentence or meaning in your 'whooooosssshhh'?
They will do and say anything to make this fairytale book seem true...
"They" is a broad stoke of insinuation sir. To you it may be a fairytale, which is fine if you believe that, to me and millions of others the Book of Mormon is a second witness to the Lord Jesus Christ. It is my special witness to truth.
Please expound! @johnrowley310 I am not a Mormon according to as you may define it! Aka one who resides in or believes in the Utah faith of Christianity. But I have read the Book of Mormon a few times! I absolutely believe it to be the ancient writings of the 1st peoples of the Americas and subsequent inhabitants & their relationships with The God of Creation, Jesus Christ! So please expound your point as it being a fairy tell? I would remind you that the very attitude and judgement that seems to come from you is the same attitude the Pharisee and Sadducees had with Jesus as they denied he was who he said he was! And yet you believe in a book of scripture that testify of him with far greater amazing and seemingly fairy tail experiences. Oh! And I absolutely believe in the truth and testimonies found in The Old and New Testaments! May I ask, have you ever read The Book of Mormon?