“I wrote the Dune series because I had this idea that charismatic leaders ought to come with a warning label on their forehead: "May be dangerous to your health." ― Frank Herbert, author of Dune.
This is one of the reasons after decades of reading the novels Dune has always stuck with me, ideas about messiah figures, destiny, choice, philosophy, culture, tradition etc all wrapped up into a mix that continues to be inspiring and frightening.
The spitting scene is not a joke. In Arrakis the water is so valuable that sharing your "body moisture" is actually a great sign of respect. Cultural differences.
The first movie really short-changed the explanations of the ecology of Arrakis and how important it is to the people and the culture. I'm hoping the second movie covers it a lot better, and does so early in the film. What spice is to the Imperium, water is Arrakis.
@@fakecubedWatching the first film, I didn't think I needed explanation about the importance of water and spitting in the desert. So during this scene, everything was immediately clear, just like the scene with Jamis. The film did a good job of showing the universe through visuals and sound.
The reason for the odd "low-tech futurism" is that in the backstory of the books, all advanced computers were banned following a human uprising against oppressive AI.
Also, there is an advanced laser weapon called a lasgun. Problem is, when it's beam strikes a shield, it sets off an atomic explosion generally big enough to kill both the target and the shooter. So folks generally fight hand-to-hand.
@@Wired4Life2Although from the book I always read it differently to how the post-Herbert spin-offs put it. I read from it that AI was a tool that enabled humans to control other humans, not that AI was on top itself. So at some point there was a totalitarian state that used AI as a tool, which I find somehow more chilling an idea, and in the world of deep-fakes and drones more worrying now than it even was back then. I think it's fine if it's read as a Cylon style uprising as it still works, but I think the intent is otherwise.
Few things: 1. Paul does not see the absolute future. He sees *possible* futures. So when he saw Jamis as his friend that was a possile future. But he didn't' know how to make that happen, and instead they fought to the death. In some futures that didn't happen. He sees it like seeing a thousand different worlds through the blinds of a window, and between each blind is a possible future, but he doesn't know how to make them happen. His goal, as he will articulate in the second movie, is to try and steer to the best possible world. 2. Shai-Hulud is the fremen word for the Sandworms. When Dr. Kines says she only worships Sha Hulud, she means the worm. 3. The blue in blue eyes is from intense spice exposure. You don't need to be born fremen, just essentially breathing in spice 24/7.
More than possible futures, Paul sees 'interpretations' of events. Even though he kills him, Jamis WAS his friend (if they skip the funeral in Part 2 I'll be sad). He teaches Paul one of his most important lessons (that ultimately carries him to victory). And when Paul sees his death, he is seeing the death of his innocence, killed by his own hands with Jamis's help. Paul makes all his visions come true, from a certain point of view 😉 I love the layers in Dune so much 🤩
@@LordVolkov Yes, all the visions come true if you interpret them like you are. It's the same with Chani killing off his boyhood/innocence when she gives him the knife.
Paul's sight is just beginning and he is learning. It's like waves and troughs, he can see the peaks but the troughs that lead there he can't see yet. He sees that his choices will lead to terrible galactic war and he is trying to steer the best course but, right now, doesn't fully know how to get there. His sight will improve.
I think there was a great explanation in the book about it. It's like you go round a corner of the street you know well, you know what buildings and shops there are, but you still don't know what people you will meet or if the shops are open or not.
The book literally has a dictionary at the end for every word, character and thing that Frank Herbert created in the story. Dune is one of the most indepth fictional universes.
Inkvine (n) - The inkvine was a creeping plant native to Giedi Prime and frequently used as a whip in the slave pens of House Harkonnen. Victims were marked by beet-colored tattoos that cause residual pain for many years. Gurney Halleck bore an inkvine scar on his cheek as a consequence of his attack on Glossu Rabban Harkonnen while a slave on Giedi Prime.
What I've always liked about Paul is, that instead of the old trope of a "hero" trying to find his potential, he already knows his potential, he's terrified of it and his choices. Also, as a big fan of the books, I truly believe that we finally have the movie it deserves and I can't wait for the sequel to come out this year.
So am I! Even though, I've never read the books, I definitely ship Paul and Chani together. They make a *perfect* couple! 🥰 Plus, I'm even more anxious to see how a showdown for both Chani and Irulan because of their feelings for Paul, too!
I agree, this movie is the best version of Dune we have seen in live action. The best decision they made was not to try to fit ALL of the first book into just 2 hours. That book is WAY too dense to get right in 2 hours.
@@EpimethiusPSN I'm torn on that. The syfy miniseries included more of the books, the acting was fantastic, as were sets. The only negative I have for it was the special effects, and that desert scenes were shot on sound stages (which was't that bad). I would have preferred them to do this as an HBO series to include more.
Well, the thing is.... Paul is not, and never was, the hero of this story. There is no hero. Paul, in fact, is a villain... he is somewhere between a supervillain and Hitler and Scar. He is on a vengeance quest. And he'd let a global jihad cause trillions of deaths for it. He is NOT a hero. This isnt a hero arc, this is a warning to beware who you call a hero, beware charismatic leaders.
Lady Jessica's main error within the sisterhood of the Bene Gesserit was her failure to bear a daughter as instructed by the sisterhood's breeding program. Instead, she bore a son, Paul Atreides, with Duke Leto Atreides. This deviation from the Bene Gesserit's breeding plans led to unforeseen consequences and complicated the sisterhood's carefully laid-out schemes for generations to come. But here's the WHY Lady Jessica's decision to bear a son instead of a daughter was driven by her love for Duke Leto Atreides and her desire to provide him with a male heir, despite the Bene Gesserit's directives. Additionally, her deep attachment to Leto and her own sense of agency likely influenced her decision to deviate from the sisterhood's breeding program. Furthermore, her training in the Bene Gesserit arts of manipulation and self-awareness may have led her to believe that she could navigate the consequences of her actions, even if they went against the sisterhood's plans.
Jessica condemns the galaxy to war to please a man and dooms Leto in the process. It's Shakespeare level irony. An Atreidies daughter would have been wed to Feyd Harkonnen and united the houses, creating a galactic dynasty to command the Landsraad and rival the Emperor.
@@LordVolkov How would that have avoided war, though? They would still need to go to war against the Emperor, right? And Leto having a son wouldn't have prevented the Emperor from setting him up for betrayal on Arrakis. I mean, I guess they could have entered marriage negotiations with the Harkonnen when their hypothetical daughter was still a child. But for some reason, I can't see Leto going for that fate for a daughter either.
@@melanie62954 They wouldn't need to go to war with the Emperor. With H & A united, they lead the Landsraad unequivocally (Leto is already the most politically popular and it's why he's targeted) and the Emperor becomes little more than a figurehead. Even his Sardukaar are no match for the combined armies of the Landsraad. Secondly, CHOAM is never mentioned in the movies, but they are the financial power of the empire and are another weight on the scales. Their financials are tied into the spacing guild (they are usually lumped together) and Landsraad, but the Emperor's only control over them is that he appoints their contracts. Everything below is spoilers for Part 2 (at least based on the book) In conclusion, if Jessica had had a daughter, she would have been wed to Feyd while Harkonnen still had the CHOAM contract on Arrakis. A united A & H then control all spice production in the empire with the military might of the Landsraad backing them. He who controls the spice controls the universe. The Emperor can do as he pleases, but is essentially a figurehead when his power is stripped. This is the exact same outcome as the book, with no annihilation of the Atreidies or a years long jihad by Paul & the Fremen.
@@melanie62954it would have avoided bloodshed because a unification of the two great houses would have created the most powerful house in the imperium their unified power would have allowed them to take control without bloodshed the sisterhood literally created this plan for 10,000 years, they made sure that the emperor only had daughters so that when the child born of harkonnen and atreides blood would then marry one of the princesses and gain the throne
The emperor sent House Atreides to Arrakis to die, so it's only fitting that their arrival should be announced with the sound of bagpipes. It's essentially an epic funeral procession.
@@GooMoo-Yippee It's a Celtic/Irish thing. For racism/classism issues the immigrants from Ireland in the USA were forced into dangerous jobs like the firefighters/police. Over the years It just spread to be a USA tradition due to this for police/firefighters/soldiers.
A detail about Paul's fight with Jamis. Paul is used to fighting with shields, so he slows down his attack to penetrate the non-existent shields. The Fremen think Paul is fucking with Jamis and consider it bad form.
Exactly it's an interesting note to take because if he knew beforehand if he had adjusted his fighting to non-existent Shields he would have handedly defeated him pretty quick
Also, if you pay close attention, you'll see Jamis switch his blade to his other hand when he does his last charge, just like Chani warned Paul of in the book. She doesn't in the movie, but the fact that he does that is so incredibly cool.
Also, the idea that Paul had to die to become Lisan al-Gaib, it wasn't a physical death. By killing Jamis, that version of him, the innocent child died in that moment. In the book is a very important and dramatic scene
The Padishah Emperor feared the power of both House Atreides and House Harkonnnen. Duke Leto Atreides was very popular with the other nobles, a cousin to the Emperor, and he had created a small army as elite as the Emperor's own Sardaukar. Baron Vladimir Harkonnnen had been in control of Arrakis for 80 years and amassed vast stockpiles of spice, making him insanely wealthy, perhaps wealthy enough to one day challenge the Emperor. So, the Emperor had the Harkonnnen use up most of their wealth to destroy the Atreides, killing two birds with one stone.
Correction the emperor did not fear the harkonnen he was only jealous of their wealth the harkonnen military is extremely weak the emperor had no reason to fear them, he only feared that the atreides growing power because of Leto's growing popularity and rising military might. He knew that the laansraad what eventually depose him of his position as emperor and replace him with leto
@@houseofaction Baron Harkonnen was literally planning to overthrow the Emperor. Yes, the Emperor feared House Harkonnen. Maybe a reread is due for you?
Interesting to note its year 10191 AG. That's 'After Guild'. The Spacing Guild is so important the entire calendar system is based on the date of its founding. Also spice does not allow space travel. It allows a limited prescience in the Guild Navigators. This means they can see future paths to chart for their ships, the Heighliners. The engines which fold space are called Holtzman Engines.
@@7RendarI think the bigger issue is time rather than safety. Space has so much "space" you can blindly go in a straight line and never come close to running into anything.
@@7Rendar There ARE FTL ships that don't use Holtzman engines and are safe to use, but are considered painfully slow in comparison. Like a Holtzman ship, you instantly jump thousands of lightyears, a Non-Holtzman ship takes months to reach the next system over.
You did remarkably well in understanding the film. I just have a few comments to enhance your experience. Paul's visions are possible futures. He's been seeing the Chani a lot because she's apparently in a lot of those possible futures, but they are different each time because the way she's in his life could be different in those different outcomes. When he got into the desert, his visions became stronger and more frequent. It's the spice causing this. Some part of his genetics make him particularly susceptible to it. But he's also been in training to be a mentat, like Thufir Hawat (the living computer). In the book Paul has been getting this training without realizing it, and was only just informed at the start of the book. He's able to calculate probabilities from any data he takes in. Combined with the spice, and his heightened senses trained in him by his Bene Gesserit mom, makes him uniquely suited to seeing these possible futures. It's not some mystic supernatural thing, but a sort of science with a biological realism. The book is really grounded in science. Speaking of, ecology plays a major part in the story. Arrakis has almost no water at all. It's treated as a resource just as precious as spice is to the wider Imperium. On Arrakis, water is wealth. The Fremen culture is entirely wrapped around water, gathering it, preserving it, and losing as little of it as possible. That's why the spitting scene is a big deal. When Stilgar spits on the floor inside Duke Leto's palace, he is giving Leto some of his water. The palace, like everywhere else on Arrakis, has moisture seals so that water will not be lost, it'll evaporate, and be collected by systems inside the house from the air. Imagine a high tech, highly efficient dehumidier in every home, which people use as a reservoir. There's a great scene, sadly cut from the movie, that goes into great length about how the various life on the planet has adapted to this water scarcity. Plants have evolved to act as natural water collectors for the morning dew, channeling it down into their root systems which go extremely deep. The little mouse you saw does something similar with its big ears. Another aspect of the Fremen culture is their religious beliefs, including their belief in the lisan-al-gaib, which was planted by the Bene Gesserit's missionaries over many centuries so that Bene Gesserit in Jessica's position might someday be able to exploit it for survival. They do this everywhere and the most dangerous planets get the more extreme religions. Shadout Mapes went to get a job in the Atreides household in order to test if Jessica and her son are the ones prophesied. Jessica, with her finely-tuned Bene Gesserit senses saw the slightest signs that Mapes was carrying a concealed weapon. So she confronted her, not knowing what Mapes' intentions were. Jessica then bluffs her way through the conversation, drawing upon her knowledge of Bene Gesserit myth-making and her training in many languages. When asked if she knows what the knife is, Jessica actually is about to say "a maker of death". You can see her lips continue to move to form the next words but Mapes in a sudden burst of religious ecstasy interrupts. Mapes only heard "a Maker", which is a word the Fremen use sometimes for their creator-deity Shai-Hulud, which they believe physically manifests in the universe as the great sandworms. The Maker, aka the Creator. The knives the Fremen use are carved from the teeth of sandworms, so their blades are literally part of their god. This has tremendous religious implications. Jessica's educated guesses accidentally got it right, thus proving to Mapes that their messiah has come. This of course is a messiah the Bene Gesserit cynically planted into the Fremen culture in order to manipulate them. Shai-Hulud translates roughly to "the old man in the desert". So later, when Paul is out in the desert for the first time and starts inhaling a bunch of spice near the sand crawler, he starts having much more intense visions. In at least some of those possible futures, he becomes a Fremen, and comes to know the sandworms as Shai-Hulud, aka "the old man". Paul, still in a bit of a trance, hears Gurney (another old man) walking up behind him to pull him back to the thopter. In a call-back to their training scene, Paul says he can tell it's Gurney by the sounds of his footsteps. That's Bene Gesserit training to heighten Paul's senses. Paul actually can tell, just as he can tell immediately that Duncan is the one flying that thopter later that picks them up. He recognizes the patterns of motion. So we get a fun little double meaning as Paul's words while he's having visions of the future. Paul recognizes Gurney's footsteps, but he also recognizes the footsteps of Shai-Hulud, the giant sandworm coming to eat the crawler. So now, at the end of this film, Paul is faced with a choice. He's had visions about a terrible war burning across the universe in his name. He wants to avoid this future. But he's also a scared kid who doesn't want to die, and is surrounded by enemies. He only sees glimpses of the possible futures, and he can try to steer his course through space and time with the decisions he makes. The visions in the book are described like being in the desert with the sand dunes all around. When Paul is in a valley, he can't see very far. When he's at the top of a sand dune, he can see farther, but other sand dunes are blocking his view of the path ahead. The sands are constantly shifting, so going back down into another valley and climbing to the top of another dune, the path beyond there may have changed again. Paul is fighting for survival and fighting to avoid a terrible war, and trying to make the best choices he can with an imperfect prescience. We see he decides not to let himself be killed, but to kill Jamis and then go with the Fremen deeper into the desert. Was this the right choice? What will the consequences be? Dune Part Two will begin to answer those questions, but the saga of Dune is far from over.
10:28: just to let ppl know, the reason why Jessica is standing outside the room alone, and the Reverend Mother is so confident that no one would get past Jessica… is because, Jessica is guarding the room with her life, and, due to through centuries of conditioning, technological argumentation, genetic manipulation and evolution, the Bene Gesserit Training makes the female sister/mother into near superhuman beings, with strength and speed that rival any elite soldier, in that universe… Jessica alone could fend off well over 12 or so highly trained and armed warriors…in the books, members of the sisterhood are so conditioned and disciplined that they can use their brain power to the fullest, control their bodies nearly 100%, which also includes controlling their periods, bodily illness, fertility and even the very genetic sex of their children.
I tried reading "Dune" back in the mid '70's, when I was in High School, but it was too much to digest. I attempted it a few years later and devoured it like it was an exquisite feast. Dune, and its first sequels are some of the best SciFi ever written.
Yes! I read the trilogy in the early 80s. Still my favorite all time book series. I am very interested to see how Part 2 is handled, especially Paul's sister. And also how they divide up the story into.(hopefully) future parts. Finally, to all who haven't read the books, don't worry about waiting for the movies to release. The books are amazing at all levels. Economics, politics, religion, technology. Top notch!
i read Dune my freshman year of HS as an assignment for English class. The teacher recognized that different students liked different books so she gave the class a choice of 6 different books rather than simply assigning one that most would hate. Dune was on the list, so since i'm a big sci-fi nerd, of course I chose it. I don't recall much of the assignments and small-group discussions she had with those of us that chose Dune, just her harping on the idea of "Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely." Still and all, I read all 6 of that series (checked out from the local public library, no less... yeah, I'm old....) so I must have liked it :D
I struggle to read for long periods of time as I get too sleepy. But I listened to the 15 hour long audiobook whilst working. It was fantastic and the voice acting worked well
Bizarrely in my case, my first book in the series is not the first one but the fourth book, God Emperor of Dune which veers far off from the story of the first three and like you, found it incredibly dense and hard to digest at first but Frank Herbert's graceful (if somewhat wordy) prose and incredible worldbuilding immediately hooked me in.
Agreed. Dark City, directed by Alex Proyas, who had previously directed The Crow, is a lost masterpiece. Another movie that the marketing department didn't know what to do with so it flopped and has drifted mostly into obscurity. To be fair, I don't know how you could have marketed it properly without ruining the experience.
Yeah, I hope you'll do Dark City as well. But please, make sure it's the director's cut as the theatrical version opening utterly spoils the whole film!
I've seen both the theatrical release and director's cut, and I actually prefer the theatrical release. I felt the voiceover at the beginning was helpful, even necessary, but to each their own. I didn't feel like it spoiled anything.
Back when I was in the 9th grade my History teacher gave me his copy of Dune. It changed how I saw the world and had a huge impact on my life. This has to be one of the most intelligent reactions I've seen to this movie. You guys picked up on a lot of important details others missed. I read that part two will be even better. Can't wait.
This book was written in the 1950s, think about that you guys. Before Star Wars, or Trek, or really any of the huge pop culture sci fi stuff we take for granted today. Frank Herbert was a visionary, who's work influenced all of the sci fi we love today. Warhammer 40k has a ton of stuff in its lore that was straight up ripped off from Dune. Herbert was a genius, and his book was so complex and deep, that it was though unfilmable until now. And the director had to shuffle a lot of stuff around and make a 3 part movie to get through everything in it. I like to say that Dune is "The Lord of the Rings" of Science Fiction.
Dune can be considered a pioneer of the Sci-Fi genre, in its own right. Frank Herbert , like Tolkien, was a scholar first and a writer second, whose work drew partly from his own views, and experience as a journalist; there's some veiled social commentary underneath most of the Dune lore referencing real-life issues, such as the meddling of religion in politics, the evils of colonialism, the over-exploitation of natural resources, among others.
Very curious to see how she's handled - I'm sure it was very challenging for them to find a 6-month old actor familiar enough w Herbert's work to play the role of Alia lol
@@zmani4379yeah hope they do her justice it's such a hard character to show. Hope it's good n can't wait for dune part 3 dune Messiah she's an integral part of part 3 so excited but nervous for both films lol
The all blue eyes indicates the Fremen, but it's not genetic, it's a result of taking too much spice. That's why you see visions of Paul and his sister with those eyes.
@@donaldb1 yes exactly addiction to spice gives the blue eyes so anyone can have blue eyes just gotta be a junkie with the spice or taking huge doses for a long time.
In the books, the shields do make it impossible to shoot another person with an energy gun... and not die yourself. Instead of the shield stopping energy, it causes a very explosive reaction.
the shields stop fast moving projectiles. Lasers hitting a shield cause a nuclear explosion so you can't risk that. Nuclear weapons are prohibited, but every House keeps a supply of them just in case.
The "atomics" is one part where I feel the book shows it's age s little. Maybe nukes in the Dune universe is more powerful than real world nukes I dunno (have only read the two first books) but you could "easily" drop a small asteroid from orbit to get the same results as a nuke.
I loved this adaptation. Denis not compromising the story and insisting on two movies to cover the story was so important. It gives this movie a bit of a lower climax, certainly,. but sets things up very well for the next film. Can't wait for March! RE: The blue eyes, that's just due to spice exposure, not genetic.
Sucks that they are doing it in two parts, though. Sucks even worse that they didn't even know if they were going to make part 2. It all depended on how part 1 performed.
@@miller-joel It was a roll of the dice, certainly, but it seems worth it to capture this dense book more fully - and by this time next year it's likely we'll all be thinking of Dune 1 and 2 as 2 parts of a single work, like w Godfather 1-2, or LOTR - and we may even see a version released that weaves them into 1 film - but it was a big risk - I spent my childhood waiting for the sequel to Bakshi's LOTR, which never came - and that could easily have happened again here w part 1
A point about Paul's visions, he sees the future, but the future isn't fixed, that's why his visions keep changing. Each vision is true at the time, but the choices of everyone involved twist and change the path that events will take. So in some futures that he saw, Jamis became his friend and taught him about the desert, and in some futures Jamis or Chani kills him, but in the end he kills Jamis.
In the books that's correct but not in this reimagining. His visions are more metaphorical, based on feelings until his skill with them grows. Jamis is a friend (of sorts, such that Paul should listen to what's being conveyed for his benefit..."let go") and does in fact teach him about the ways of the desert. Chani, is the attraction of Paul to the Fremen, and his innocence must die in order to become Muad'Dib. Paul even says so in a round about way. "I thought I saw my death but it wasn't...I do know someone hands be a blade..."
In one path he saw him teaching the ways of the desert through his life, here because he knocked past him and earned his ire (chosing to do so only because he recognized him as a friend from his vision) he instead earned his ire and Jamis thought him the ways of the desert through his death.
“I recognize your footsteps, old man..” is one of my favourite lines. Because while Paul can obviously be talking about Gurney, I feel he’s talking directly to the massive sandworm, esp considering he can see multiple futures.
Paul’s line ‘I recognise your footsteps old man’ are him alluding to Shai Hulud. The worms have many names; many given to them by the Fremen. These including Old Man of The Desert, Old Man Eternity & Grandfather of The Desert. In Arabic Shayʾ-Khulud translates as "Thing of Eternity" or "Thing of Immortality", consisting of Shayʾ "thing of" (in construct state) and Khulud "eternity" or "immortality".
About your comment on how things seem a little old fashioned, with swords...that's because of the personal shields. Projectiles from things like guns cannot penetrate them, so guns are essentially useless. With a blade, if you're good enough, you can get in close, slowly penetrate the shield, and kill its wearer. If you're wondering about laser weapons, they do exist, but if you hit a shield with one it causes a significant nuclear explosion, so combatants tend to avoid their use unless they are absolutely sure there are no shields in use. Kind of evens the playing field. And in case you're wondering about some of the themes you see in this movie seeming a little familiar, Dune is essentially the granddaddy of modern Sci-Fi. George Lucas admitted he borrowed heavily from Dune for the creation of Star Wars. If either of you enjoy reading, I highly recommend the books...well the first 4 books anyway. I think there are something like 13 now, but the first 4 are pretty much all you need. So glad you reacted to this one. As a longtime Dune fan, this is the film I've been waiting my whole life to see. They did an excellent job with it.
"Lisan al-Gaib" is a term in the Dune universe that translates to "Voice from the Outer World." It refers to a prophesied figure who will come from outside the Fremen culture and lead them to victory. Paul Atreides fulfills this prophecy when he arrives on the desert planet of Arrakis. He gains the trust and admiration of the Fremen, who see him as the fulfillment of their long-awaited prophecy. This title reflects Paul's role as a messianic figure among the Fremen and his eventual rise to leadership among them. Within the Bene Gesserit sisterhood, the title "Lisan al-Gaib" holds significance as it refers to the prophesied figure who will emerge as a messiah-like leader among the Fremen on the desert planet of Arrakis. The Bene Gesserit, a secretive and powerful organization, manipulate various cultures and religions across the universe to advance their own agenda. By orchestrating the emergence of the Lisan al-Gaib, the Bene Gesserit seek to influence and control the political and social dynamics on Arrakis and beyond to further their long-term plans and goals.
@@wackyvorlon Yeah that's also why Stilgar refers to Jessica as a "weirding woman"; The bene gesserit had been to Arrakis long before the Dune story is set and spread both religion and fighting styles. Space ninja nuns lol.
My favorite fictional universe by far, 20:36 "Is it propaganda if its real?", "The sisterhood that has done this for thousands of years to lay the foundation" You guys have hit upon one of the fundamental ideas behind the novels, The truth/propaganda of the messiah story... A fundamental truth? or simply prudent planning?
Kinda like in our reality how the moneyed interests that rule us have contingency plans for just about every catastrophe, war, or crisis that comes along so that they financially benefit off it to the point it can feel engineered.
@@fs127 well put, I am sure that there are many elites who have been born into wealth and privilege who feel they have been destined for their role. As if they are put there by God himself only for the truth to come out that their families wealth came about through criminality or by pure chance.
Moreso self fulfilling prophecy I'd say. That's exactly what Paul does himself, and that's what the sisterhood did when they created his myth. This itself is a commentary on the human condition, both the power we give ourselves through imagination and yet the limitations of that very same imagination that we place upon ourselves.
@@pseudonymousbeing987 Yes and no… hear it from Paul’s own perspective: “He felt suddenly fearful, that by reaching for any new thing he might fall what is most precious. That even the slightest noise might send the universe crashing back. Receding until he can never capture any piece of it.” “How did I set this in motion? He asked himself.. it had of course set itself in motion. It was in the genes that might labor for centuries to achieve this brief spasm”. -Dune Messiah
@@Maya_Ruinz Nearly a quarter of important Dune quotes are related to this topic. I could bring up the one about the narrow fault line. Or about what is a prophet. Or themes about bullfighting. Etc etc. And yeah most of Dune is "yes and no". Everything is nuanced. But conclusively speaking I'd say that while Paul is subject to a force that is largely inevitable. He also forges his own doom. Especially in Messiah. He definitely has a choice like when he can escape Arrakis and become a spice navigator. One of his flaws is he's too unwilling to fight back and resist. Though that may be a product of knowing the future. But again, this knowledge is imperfect. And at the same time the very fact he tries at all is due to his Atreides stubbornness and willingness to fight the unwinnable.
NICE! One of the best adaptations of the epic Sci Fi novel by Frank Herbert Nominated for 10 Oscars including Best Picture but won for Best Sound (Editing, Mixing) Best Visual Effects Best Original Score Best Cinematography Best Film Editing Best Production Design. DUNE, PART TWO will be in theaters March 1st.
House Atreides In the "Dune" universe, traces its lineage back to ancient Greek mythology, specifically to the House of Atreus, a legendary royal family in Greek literature. The name "Atreides" itself is derived from Atreus, a king of Mycenae in Greek mythology. The House of Atreus is famous for its tragic history, including stories such as the curse of the House, the sacrifice of Iphigenia, and the Trojan War. While there are parallels between the fictional House Atreides and the historical figures from ancient Greece, the specific details of their lineage and history in the "Dune" series are unique to Frank Herbert's creation and are not directly tied to real-world historical events such as Roman or early Scottish history.
@@wackyvorlon In later Dune novels, Leto II literally says he has seen his most distant ancestors in visions, all the way back to the House of Atreus. Btw, "Old Earth" or "Ancient Terra" are mentioned numerous times in the novels, so it's absolutely meant to be a "real future", one where so much time and distance has basically made Earth an ancient forgotten place. Paul and Stilgar discuss his revolution's body count vs famous conquerors of ancient earth- Ghengis Khan, Hitler, etc. Paul and the Fremen Jihad kills over 60 billion people on hundreds of planets in their total takeover of Shaddam Corrino's Empire. The Fremen are descendants of the "Zensunni Wanderers" (some references to Zen Bhuddism and Sunni Islam from our world. There are numerous other examples of connections to our current Earth, cultures, religions, flora and fauna, etc.
The Gom Jabbar scene, or "hand in the box" scene always stuck with me. It sells the idea of a human (especially one with so much power like Paul) literally suppressing their impulse of wanting to avoid pain, by enduring the worst pain just to not die. To be able to decide long term and withstand suffering in the current. After all if he only cares about the pain his hand is feeling, and removes his hand, then he doesn't deserve his power, he is no different than an animal (at least in the ruthless standards of the superhuman Bene Gesserits) and therefore should just be put down. He must be better than just an impulsive animal, withstand pain, survive, as the heir to the Atreides throne, as the superhuman offspring of a Bene Gesserit, to be there for the people he cares for, etc.
You have to remember what Paul told the Reverend Mother about his dreams; they don't always come true. His visions are only possabilties and not a set destiny. They can be changed and he is not stuck in one path.
That's because they are metaphorical not literal while his skill with them is still growing. In the books you are correct but source and reimagining often don't or even can't match 1 to 1 given the differences in the medium.
But while they might change, they will follow more or less the same purpose or essence. He still thought him the ways of the desert, but with his death instead. The real screwed up thing is that the only reason he chose to go in his direction in because he had seen he was a friend in his vision and thought it was the surest direction. Thus averting the future he had seen completely by earning his ire and resentment when he knocked him down.
By the way, the year 10191 is based on their updated calendar. It is approximately 20,000 years in the future from our time, which makes more sense to me than it just being 8,000 years in the future. Their year 0 is based on the year the Spacing Guild essentially established a monopoly on space trade.
To be honest, you guys did an amazing job interpreting the story. Almost everything other people have fumbled on when watching these reactions, you got right or very close to it. Without giving too much away, most of the stuff you predicted and theorized about is exactly what will happen.
"Reminded me of Apocalypse Now".... Stellan Skarsgard (I'm sure I'm spelling that wrong) actually said in an interview that he was inspired by Brando's role in Apocalypse Now. Also.... you hoped Paul would do something to the Reverend Mother Gaius??? Thats like hoping 9 year old Anakin would defeat Yoda. The bit about Shadout Mapes and the Crysknife at the interview for housekeeper... Mapes completely misunderstood and cut Jessica off... she did NOT know about cyrsknives and she was NOT saying "the Maker" as in the worms being the Maker of the Desert (of water, of spice..) the sandworms, whom the Fremen practically worship as an avatar of god. But Jessica totally played along with Mapes misunderstanding that Jessica understood... Also, they did both Mentats (Thufir Hawat and Piter de Vries) a bit dirty in this telling, practically cutting their roles out... Thufir had a bigger role... and also the Atreides KNEW they had a traitor in their midst, just not who, and many suspected Jessica because she was a Bene Gesserit (in the book).
@@LordVolkov Yep. However, when Paul becomes Muad'Dib and is done overthrowing the Emperor with the Fremen in the books, he is definitely a match for that Reverend Mother.
Its an amazing plot device to introduce close combat. If an energy weapon crosses a shield you get a nuclear explosion. Projectile weapons are useless against shields. So here we are in the far future brought back to sword fighting.
Bagpipes are at the very least thousands of years old, same as horns, drums and even string instruments. Flutes are tens of thousands of years old. We still use all of them, despite having more modern instruments available. Personally, I would have found it weirder if they had used a synth, theremin or some unidentifiable scifi instrument.
I personally really enjoyed 5 and 6, and I thought they had good pacing and plotting. 4 was the the tough slog to get through for me. I also felt two felt slow. My favorite books in order would be something like 1-3-5-6-2-4. @@laraq07
One of the best sci-fi films of all time, and perhaps the best sci-fi novel of all time. The second half of that novel is some of the most intense and wild shit I've ever read.
Yeah, by the time I got to God Emperor of Dune, I was blown away and read that book about a dozen times or so. I still have the copy I read from 2006..it's definitely worn but that gives it even more character lol.
The Bene Gesserit have seeded many planets with myths and legends so that their agents can use them under duress and so that these cultures will be ready to accept the Kwizatz Haderach as their messiah. Religion as a method of control is a huge theme in the books.
I just saw this in theaters for a second time last night and it was just as good or better than the first time, can't wait to see your reaction to a fantastic movie. And can't wait for Dune 2 on February 25th
When I was a kid, my friend's mom had these books. Nerd that I am, I was hooked right away. I saw the original movies and think they did a great job telling the story. I'm so glad you're reacting to it.
38:54 Yes, it was. The dreams are metaphors. Jamis (the guy he just defeated in the duel) DID teach him: he taught him that the desert is a brutal, unforgiving place if you’re not prepared to do whatever it takes to survive. (Remember when the Baron said "The desert takes the weak"?) Also, the girl, Shani, stabbing him with the knife was another metaphor, the point being that in order for the Muad-Dib, the Fremen Messiah, the leader he was destined to be, to rise, then Paul, the naive, starry-eyed kid he currently is at this point, has to die.
That's the movie that got me hooked on these books - it's got a lot of issues, but it's really fascinating as a hybrid between the visions of Herbert and Lynch - and I love the way that film handled the book's gravitas, its trippy spiritual aspects, and Paul's tragic loss of innocence
See part 2 in IMAX multiple times, then come back to the channel and give a re-watch reaction/analysis because you can't deprive yourself the experience. This is how I imagine audiences at the time saw Lawrence of Arabia in the theater. It must be seen on a big screen. Shot completely with IMAX cameras. Denis is a genius on par with, well, I won't say his name, but if you know you know.
As someone who was once a huge Star Wars fan, once you "get" into Dune and its mind-blowing lore and aesthetic, Star Wars' hollow, juvenile sci-fantasy no longer cuts it. I've become a huge fan of Herbert's work due to this film. It's the real deal.
I agree in that I find it sad how so many things that were influenced/simply stole from Dune only ever steal the surface level. The aesthetics or most basic ideas. But the actual depths of philosophy and complex themes are never built on. Yes everyone that came after Dune took from Dune, but Dune is still adored today not just because it's the OG but because nobody has been able to match it. I still love my Star Wars too tho. The original trilogy, Andor and the last jedi.
Jeezus.. I just got back from the IMAX rerun of Dune with the Dune 2 preview and you guys post this!!?? The Dolby Atmos rattled the fillings in my fkn teeth.. its MADE to be seen in IMAX with the earth shattering sound/score.. go see Dune 2 March 1st Team Schmidt 👍🏻 Respect from 🏴 And its Den-ee Veel-nerve
Glad to see you both enjoying this recent modern classic! I'm even glad you both are seeing it for the first time, getting a fresh perspective and trying to out together inferences, clues and details for yourself without any help from the books which is interesting to see.
What Frank Herbert did with Dune is create a multi-layered canvas to explore ecology, economics, politics, religion, spirituality, and other themes. In many ways, Dune is to science fiction literature what The Lord of the Rings is to fantasy. The film ends at the midway of the novel...and the second half is filled with action. Part 2 adds four characters not in the first part...Margot, Lady Fenring (Lea Seydoux), Feyd-Rautha Harkonnen (Austin Butler), Princess Irulan (Florence Pugh) and Shaddam IV, Padashah Emperor of the Known Universe (Christopher Walken). Irulan is important especially in the novel, as she is an historian, and her writings start each chapter of the novel. When the novel was written, it was actually the first three books (Dune, Dune Messiah, and Children of Dune) combined and it took Herbert six years of research and writing. He was forced to break it up. Herbert wrote 6 novels in the series, and his son, Brian has written an additional 14 novels. The films will most likely end with Dune Messiah being directed by Denis Villeneuve. After that, it will depend on a lot of factors as each novel is different...Messiah takes place 12 years after Dune, Children is another 9 years after that, then the time jump is 3,500 years (God Emperor of Dune), and then 1,500 years (Heretics of Dune) and finally 8 years later (Chapterhouse: Dune) which was Frank's last novel. Then there are the Brian Herbert novels that are both prequels and sequels to what his father wrote. Fun fact: Starting with Dune Messiah, one character returns over and over due to certain circumstances...I won't say who, how, or why....but, he is in the first movie, and it is not Paul. If the Dune series has a real main character...this one is it. Take a guess, and one else spoil it!
No spoilers 🤐 Which is your favorite book of the series by Frank Herbert? Mine is easily God Emperor of Dune. It's just the most compelling and complex and Leto II becomes something that, alone, required me to read the book multiple times just for that to better understand it lol. Still loved the others all the way to Chapterhouse. Then, I finally brought myself to read Brian Herbert's sequels to them and as I pretty much expected, I personally was not fond of them but he should not be blamed. It would've been damn near an impossible task for any writer.
Dune is definitely one of the best sci-fi movies to date, Dune: Part 2 comes out in theaters (cinema) on March 1st, and I think you guys should definitely watch Oppenheimer, Interstellar, Inception, Breaking Bad, and Stranger Things at some point
You mentioned how strange it was not to have communication, which is a good catch & part of the technology of the universe. With the help of spice they can travel between stars nearly instantly, but the thing is communications like radio is still limited by the speed of light. So it's faster for a messenger to travel between worlds to hand-deliver a message than to try to send a signal the same distance.
It is very much worth it to read the books as for a very long time it was believed that this series was un-filmable because of the depth and nuance. Also worth it to watch the David Lynch film.
Paul is a biblical name. There are many transformed religious traditions still alive in dune. The benne gesserits religious text is literally called "the orange catholic bible". So picking a biblical name for a highborn firstborn makes a lot of sense.
You might be the first blind reactors who actually guessed majority of why things are the way they are correctly. The mouse is a species called Muad'Dib. If Denis had total freedom, it would have been a 6-7 hour movie, and I would of struggled to retain my body's moisture through every second of it. As you might have noticed, the Dune fanbase is very helpful. ***removed my spoiler about Chani and Ghola those who know.. know***
"i thought Zendaya would be important, like maybe the daughter of the leader of the Fremen" The irony of you making that comment right at that moment is incredible.. The Character Dr Liet-Kynes (who is onscreen right at that moment saying the prayer as Shai Hulud devours the harvester) is a man in the book, He is Chani (Zendayas) Father, and is known by different names to different people, as 'Dr Kynes Imperial planetologist' to the imperium, and as 'Liet' to the Fremen, who is refered to in a reverent, almost godly sense for much of the Narrative until the reveal that he is one and the same, and is the defacto leader of all of the Fremen peoples on Arrakis. I hope this isn't a spoiler, I realise the narrative technically doesn't reveal that Chani is Liets Daughter until immediately after this first film leaves off. But with the deviation of the Kynes character in the first film Vs the novel I feel like they will either omit that connection completely, or the film will play out differently anyway.
Paul's "death" was a symbolic one; the boy he was needed to die for him to become the Muad'Dib and truly be able to lead the Fremen. Killing Jamis was Paul's first kill, and by so doing was also the death of his former life.
The desert mouse is called Muad'Dib. It becomes Paul's usename/battlename with the Fremen especially in their fight against the Harkonnen and the Emperor's Sardukar army.
In the books yes, but in this interpretation they are more metaphorical based on feelings until his skill with them grows and they can become more clear.
this story is monsterously HUGE. it is a 6 book series that took me months to get through. it gets better the more you get into it. I think the director is going to make this a three movie series roughly covering the first 3 books.
He's talking about 3 movies covering the first 2 books, because the second book is shorter - I'm hoping they cover at least the first 4 books, with another film for the 3rd and another 2 films for the weightier 4th book - IMO it's the 4th book that ties the series together - I feel like it's the conclusion to the social experiment started by Paul
@@zmani4379 So far, it's never been worth hoping for more than a trilogy by one director. They've always gotten sick of their big projects at 3 (Nolan, for example) and ready to move on, or the quality has suffered (LOTR, Star Wars, etc)
I think perhaps the most interesting detail about the Dune novels is that in this future, computer technology has been outlawed, because of a catastrophe caused by AI. Meaning that these worlds are futuristic and high tech in every way except computer tech. Instead they have these human computers, like that guy with the rolling eyes. That is quite clever for a novel written in the 60s. No wonder Dune is the mother of all sci-fi.
The Baron has suspensor belts to "float". They are the only way he can support his massive weight. You also see Duncan using one in the fight scene during the invasion as do the Sadukar when they drop in to fight
I case you missed it, the box that Paul put his hand in was a direct neural pain inducer, to him it was gradually increasing heat that got to the point he thought his hand had been burnt away to bone before Reverend Mother Superior Mohiam stopped it.
Denis basically shoots independent European movies with Hollywood budget. I'm so glad he got the money to shoot Dune, I was worried when Blader runner 2049, one of my favorites movies of all time, failed at box offices. And I'm glad you are reacting to it!
35:40 "Drum sand" is described in the books as compacted sand that resonates when you step on it. As far as we know, it is not a real thing. But we've never had a chance to study a real-life desert planet.
It was like the vision and he had to die. The Fremen was his teacher in the way of the Fremen with his actions. And Paul left his old life behind and had to accept his role in the Fremen Framework. That was the death. Visions, eh ^^
"I was a friend of Jamis. He taught me that when you kill, you pay for it..." It's not just leaving that part of him behind. Paul kills his innocence when he kills Jamis. I really hope they don't skip the funeral in Part 2. It's a really powerful scene and very informative of Fremen culture.
Oh heck yeah. I wasn't expecting this reaction today. A surprise to be sure but a welcomed one. Hope you guys enjoy it. Its currently one of my favorite modern films in the 2020's. Dune has such a huge and rich amount of lore with interesting and cool things about it. The characters, the visuals, set designs, costumes, ships, weapons, planets, subtle humor, action/fight scenes and the musical score are all fantastic along with such a big cast that it got. Hans Zimmer did about 3 soundtracks for the film and each one just sucks you in and makes you wanna hear more. Looking forward to hear what he'll bring to the table for part 2 this year! And yes, as many of the commentors have pointed it out, Dune was Star Wars before Star Wars and other sci-fi things were even cool. Glad that Dune is getting the love and attention that it deserves!
In my humble opinion, you guys should watch this on the biggest screen you can. Movies like this are rare and should be viewed in the cinema. You can always do a second viewing when Dune Part 2 relases on video or streaming. Not only will it be an experience, but you will be supporting Denis Villenueve and the whole cast and crew....and hopefully guarantee us Dune Messiah...
The blue eyes was from prolongued consumption of the Spice, which the Fremen use even in their food almost nutritionally, some some spoces in Indian cooking. Blue eyes dont mean Fremen. Its coincidental. Also, regarding the doctor... one thing this telling left out was that the doctor was specially trained for loyalty.... the diamond on his head is symbolic of that... he was supposed to be incorruptible. For him to betray the Atreides was unthinkable. And yet Vladimir Harkonnen found his weak point.
Great observation about why combat reverted. That's exactly the reason why they reverted back to fighting with swords and other close range weapons. The invention of personal shields made ranged combat go out of style. Projectile weapons ate deflected, and even worse, laser weapons cause a nuclear reaction when they hit a shield, resulting in an explosion that can level an entire city, killing both shooter and target.
While early in the movie, you see the year, but as with time keeping in our own history, events have caused humans to "change calendars." The time we see in the Dune universe is actually about 23,000 years in the future, which explains how different people living on ecosystems on different planets would have changed so radically.
I wish they had included the dinner scene where they have to describe drowning to the Fremen because the idea of being submerged in so much water until death is so alien to them.
45:50 Dune's "spice" is used as a spice. It tastes like cinnamon, and has a bitter cinnamon smell. There aren't many details about spice's "geriatric properties", but I suspect it only helps prevent geriatric diseases. The book says it can lengthen a person's lifespan to 4 times normal. So, figure 300 years as a senior citizen. Also, the spice doesn't power space travel. Spice only allows Guild Navigators to use a limited form of prescience to see the safest path to take. It's like the nav-computer from Star Wars; if you don't know the safe route, you could slam right into a star/planet/etc.
I read recently that he got so into the Dune music that he kept creating more even after the release of the movie! 😄A lot of that might have been used in part 2 though. Can't wait, tickets booked already!
23:34 Funny you say that, in this film, Zendaya's character Chani is the Niece of Liet Kynes, Although this isn't expressly mentioned in the film. In the original novel, Liet Kynes is a man, and Chani is his daughter.
great reaction! Such an epic adaption. the move throws a LOT of information at you very quickly, and key facts can be mentioned once in easily-missed single lines of quiet dialogue. you guys did a lot better than so many other reactors I've seen watching this, by listening to all the dialogue and thus picking up on all the worldbuilding. Many people flat-out miss the fact that the messiah myths have been *made* by the Bene Gesserit. The book focuses a lot about propaganda and schemes. People have abilities yes, but it's all explained within a scientific system.
Jamis WAS the guy in Paul’s vision (The guy Paul killed, was the guy who was helping him in his visions). It’s just that that possible path wasn’t taken. Instead he killed him which prevented that path (sadly).
The blending of technology comes from something they don't mention called 'The Butlerian Jihad" Thinking Machnes (computer AI) was overthrown and banned. This is why you have people like Hawat called "Mentats". People trained to be human computers. You correctly identified another aspect. Projectile weapons are rendered ineffective by shields but so are laser weapons. When a laser weapon hits a shield it can cause an explosion that kills both the target and the shooter. This is why they've gone back to hand to hand combat for much of the fighting.
IS SHE FREMEN? lmao, you clearly missed the part where they explained, anyone who has prolonged exposure to Spice - their eyes turn blue. So if you live out in the desert with the Fremen long enough, your eyes will turn unnaturally blue, no matter what home culture youre from 😂 good reaction tho! I cant wait for Dune 2 🥳
You are not the only reactors to be surprised that Paul has an apparently normal name in amongst all the otherwise strange futuristic names. But actually there are resonances with ancient human culture throughout the story. There is not only Paul and Jessica, but their family name, Atreides, also comes from earth, from ancient Greece. I think they claim descent from the Greek Atreides, which is the family of Agamemnon and Menelaus, who fought the Trojan war, hence all the bull imagery you see in their buildings.
One of the best parts about the cinematography of this movie is you always have a sense of scale to show the size of things in the frame. A really nice touch more films need to do.
Villeneuve did a great work but so many of Herbert's work is impossible to put in a movie and get people to understand it. But this is the best adaptation you can get, at least for this generation. About the dates... it's the standard year of 10.191 since House Corrino took the Golden throne of the Padisha emperors, that's like 20.000 years since Earth. The shields rendered the firearms obsolete, but not completely, however if you use a laser against a shield you unleash s nuclear explosion, so they turned to martial arts again. It's a complicated series of overlapping technologies. The Bene Geserit... you could write books about them. Technology... restricted because of the Butlerian jihad.... so much to explain. Enjoy.
“I wrote the Dune series because I had this idea that charismatic leaders ought to come with a warning label on their forehead: "May be dangerous to your health." ― Frank Herbert, author of Dune.
This is one of the reasons after decades of reading the novels Dune has always stuck with me, ideas about messiah figures, destiny, choice, philosophy, culture, tradition etc all wrapped up into a mix that continues to be inspiring and frightening.
@@Maya_Ruinz Indeed.
Those worthy of worship would never demand and those that demand are not worthy.
Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Furthermore, power attracts the corruptible.
Even knowing what Paul is we can still empathize with him and his struggle with his visions. That's a testament to Herbert's amazing writing skills.
The spitting scene is not a joke. In Arrakis the water is so valuable that sharing your "body moisture" is actually a great sign of respect. Cultural differences.
Yes, that moisture is now gone for good, not reclaimable by the suit. Stilgar has given up something very valuable.
It's a desert planet with not a drop of water. Allegedly.
The first movie really short-changed the explanations of the ecology of Arrakis and how important it is to the people and the culture. I'm hoping the second movie covers it a lot better, and does so early in the film. What spice is to the Imperium, water is Arrakis.
@@fakecubedWatching the first film, I didn't think I needed explanation about the importance of water and spitting in the desert. So during this scene, everything was immediately clear, just like the scene with Jamis. The film did a good job of showing the universe through visuals and sound.
so precious that when you die they draw every last drop of water from your dead body
The reason for the odd "low-tech futurism" is that in the backstory of the books, all advanced computers were banned following a human uprising against oppressive AI.
And oppressive AI, well...see: _The Terminator_ and _The Matrix._
Yes! It was the war long ago "the butlerian jihad" infact about 10,000 years prior to dune
@@Wired4Life2AND it came before both those properties
Also, there is an advanced laser weapon called a lasgun. Problem is, when it's beam strikes a shield, it sets off an atomic explosion generally big enough to kill both the target and the shooter. So folks generally fight hand-to-hand.
@@Wired4Life2Although from the book I always read it differently to how the post-Herbert spin-offs put it. I read from it that AI was a tool that enabled humans to control other humans, not that AI was on top itself. So at some point there was a totalitarian state that used AI as a tool, which I find somehow more chilling an idea, and in the world of deep-fakes and drones more worrying now than it even was back then. I think it's fine if it's read as a Cylon style uprising as it still works, but I think the intent is otherwise.
Few things:
1. Paul does not see the absolute future. He sees *possible* futures. So when he saw Jamis as his friend that was a possile future. But he didn't' know how to make that happen, and instead they fought to the death. In some futures that didn't happen. He sees it like seeing a thousand different worlds through the blinds of a window, and between each blind is a possible future, but he doesn't know how to make them happen. His goal, as he will articulate in the second movie, is to try and steer to the best possible world.
2. Shai-Hulud is the fremen word for the Sandworms. When Dr. Kines says she only worships Sha Hulud, she means the worm.
3. The blue in blue eyes is from intense spice exposure. You don't need to be born fremen, just essentially breathing in spice 24/7.
More than possible futures, Paul sees 'interpretations' of events.
Even though he kills him, Jamis WAS his friend (if they skip the funeral in Part 2 I'll be sad). He teaches Paul one of his most important lessons (that ultimately carries him to victory).
And when Paul sees his death, he is seeing the death of his innocence, killed by his own hands with Jamis's help.
Paul makes all his visions come true, from a certain point of view 😉
I love the layers in Dune so much 🤩
@@LordVolkov Yes, all the visions come true if you interpret them like you are. It's the same with Chani killing off his boyhood/innocence when she gives him the knife.
"I was a friend of Jamis. Jamis taught me that when you kill, you pay for it. I wish I'd known him better."
Paul's sight is just beginning and he is learning. It's like waves and troughs, he can see the peaks but the troughs that lead there he can't see yet. He sees that his choices will lead to terrible galactic war and he is trying to steer the best course but, right now, doesn't fully know how to get there. His sight will improve.
I think there was a great explanation in the book about it. It's like you go round a corner of the street you know well, you know what buildings and shops there are, but you still don't know what people you will meet or if the shops are open or not.
The book literally has a dictionary at the end for every word, character and thing that Frank Herbert created in the story. Dune is one of the most indepth fictional universes.
JIHAD
I’ll always love Robert Jordan and Frank Herbert for their insane levels of world building
Frank Herbert is the Tolkien of science fiction.
Yep and so much so, that the Dune books inspired much of Star Wars.
Inkvine (n) - The inkvine was a creeping plant native to Giedi Prime and frequently used as a whip in the slave pens of House Harkonnen. Victims were marked by beet-colored tattoos that cause residual pain for many years. Gurney Halleck bore an inkvine scar on his cheek as a consequence of his attack on Glossu Rabban Harkonnen while a slave on Giedi Prime.
What I've always liked about Paul is, that instead of the old trope of a "hero" trying to find his potential, he already knows his potential, he's terrified of it and his choices.
Also, as a big fan of the books, I truly believe that we finally have the movie it deserves and I can't wait for the sequel to come out this year.
So am I! Even though, I've never read the books, I definitely ship Paul and Chani together. They make a *perfect* couple! 🥰
Plus, I'm even more anxious to see how a showdown for both Chani and Irulan because of their feelings for Paul, too!
I agree, this movie is the best version of Dune we have seen in live action.
The best decision they made was not to try to fit ALL of the first book into just 2 hours.
That book is WAY too dense to get right in 2 hours.
@@EpimethiusPSN I'm torn on that. The syfy miniseries included more of the books, the acting was fantastic, as were sets. The only negative I have for it was the special effects, and that desert scenes were shot on sound stages (which was't that bad).
I would have preferred them to do this as an HBO series to include more.
Well, the thing is.... Paul is not, and never was, the hero of this story. There is no hero.
Paul, in fact, is a villain... he is somewhere between a supervillain and Hitler and Scar.
He is on a vengeance quest. And he'd let a global jihad cause trillions of deaths for it.
He is NOT a hero.
This isnt a hero arc, this is a warning to beware who you call a hero, beware charismatic leaders.
@@cliveklg7739They SyFy miniseries was great, it should get more love.
Lady Jessica's main error within the sisterhood of the Bene Gesserit was her failure to bear a daughter as instructed by the sisterhood's breeding program. Instead, she bore a son, Paul Atreides, with Duke Leto Atreides. This deviation from the Bene Gesserit's breeding plans led to unforeseen consequences and complicated the sisterhood's carefully laid-out schemes for generations to come.
But here's the WHY
Lady Jessica's decision to bear a son instead of a daughter was driven by her love for Duke Leto Atreides and her desire to provide him with a male heir, despite the Bene Gesserit's directives. Additionally, her deep attachment to Leto and her own sense of agency likely influenced her decision to deviate from the sisterhood's breeding program. Furthermore, her training in the Bene Gesserit arts of manipulation and self-awareness may have led her to believe that she could navigate the consequences of her actions, even if they went against the sisterhood's plans.
Jessica condemns the galaxy to war to please a man and dooms Leto in the process. It's Shakespeare level irony.
An Atreidies daughter would have been wed to Feyd Harkonnen and united the houses, creating a galactic dynasty to command the Landsraad and rival the Emperor.
@@LordVolkov How would that have avoided war, though? They would still need to go to war against the Emperor, right? And Leto having a son wouldn't have prevented the Emperor from setting him up for betrayal on Arrakis. I mean, I guess they could have entered marriage negotiations with the Harkonnen when their hypothetical daughter was still a child. But for some reason, I can't see Leto going for that fate for a daughter either.
That's not what the word "failure" means. She intended to have a son. And she did. That's called a success.
@@melanie62954 They wouldn't need to go to war with the Emperor. With H & A united, they lead the Landsraad unequivocally (Leto is already the most politically popular and it's why he's targeted) and the Emperor becomes little more than a figurehead. Even his Sardukaar are no match for the combined armies of the Landsraad.
Secondly, CHOAM is never mentioned in the movies, but they are the financial power of the empire and are another weight on the scales. Their financials are tied into the spacing guild (they are usually lumped together) and Landsraad, but the Emperor's only control over them is that he appoints their contracts.
Everything below is spoilers for Part 2 (at least based on the book)
In conclusion, if Jessica had had a daughter, she would have been wed to Feyd while Harkonnen still had the CHOAM contract on Arrakis. A united A & H then control all spice production in the empire with the military might of the Landsraad backing them. He who controls the spice controls the universe. The Emperor can do as he pleases, but is essentially a figurehead when his power is stripped. This is the exact same outcome as the book, with no annihilation of the Atreidies or a years long jihad by Paul & the Fremen.
@@melanie62954it would have avoided bloodshed because a unification of the two great houses would have created the most powerful house in the imperium their unified power would have allowed them to take control without bloodshed the sisterhood literally created this plan for 10,000 years, they made sure that the emperor only had daughters so that when the child born of harkonnen and atreides blood would then marry one of the princesses and gain the throne
The emperor sent House Atreides to Arrakis to die, so it's only fitting that their arrival should be announced with the sound of bagpipes. It's essentially an epic funeral procession.
very good observation. the sacred and the propane.
Also, small thing. The Bag Piper leading them off the ship, is Hans Zimmer making a cameo on screen
What's bagpipes got to do with funerals?
Is that an American thing or something?
@@GooMoo-Yippee It's a Celtic/Irish thing. For racism/classism issues the immigrants from Ireland in the USA were forced into dangerous jobs like the firefighters/police. Over the years It just spread to be a USA tradition due to this for police/firefighters/soldiers.
@@moonbrooke27 wym "racism", irish and american aren't races tho
A detail about Paul's fight with Jamis. Paul is used to fighting with shields, so he slows down his attack to penetrate the non-existent shields. The Fremen think Paul is fucking with Jamis and consider it bad form.
I#
I've watched this film many times but never picked up on this, good catch.
Exactly it's an interesting note to take because if he knew beforehand if he had adjusted his fighting to non-existent Shields he would have handedly defeated him pretty quick
Also, if you pay close attention, you'll see Jamis switch his blade to his other hand when he does his last charge, just like Chani warned Paul of in the book. She doesn't in the movie, but the fact that he does that is so incredibly cool.
Also, the idea that Paul had to die to become Lisan al-Gaib, it wasn't a physical death. By killing Jamis, that version of him, the innocent child died in that moment. In the book is a very important and dramatic scene
It's in the book, Paul is fighting like a shield fighter and Stillgar asks Jessica if Paul is playing with Jamis.@@2old4gamez
The Padishah Emperor feared the power of both House Atreides and House Harkonnnen. Duke Leto Atreides was very popular with the other nobles, a cousin to the Emperor, and he had created a small army as elite as the Emperor's own Sardaukar. Baron Vladimir Harkonnnen had been in control of Arrakis for 80 years and amassed vast stockpiles of spice, making him insanely wealthy, perhaps wealthy enough to one day challenge the Emperor. So, the Emperor had the Harkonnnen use up most of their wealth to destroy the Atreides, killing two birds with one stone.
Correction the emperor did not fear the harkonnen he was only jealous of their wealth the harkonnen military is extremely weak the emperor had no reason to fear them, he only feared that the atreides growing power because of Leto's growing popularity and rising military might. He knew that the laansraad what eventually depose him of his position as emperor and replace him with leto
@@houseofaction Baron Harkonnen was literally planning to overthrow the Emperor. Yes, the Emperor feared House Harkonnen. Maybe a reread is due for you?
Interesting to note its year 10191 AG. That's 'After Guild'. The Spacing Guild is so important the entire calendar system is based on the date of its founding. Also spice does not allow space travel. It allows a limited prescience in the Guild Navigators. This means they can see future paths to chart for their ships, the Heighliners. The engines which fold space are called Holtzman Engines.
Yeah space travel is possible without spice, it's just incredibly hard to do safely/efficiently without those drugged out navigators.
@@7RendarI think the bigger issue is time rather than safety. Space has so much "space" you can blindly go in a straight line and never come close to running into anything.
@@7Rendar There ARE FTL ships that don't use Holtzman engines and are safe to use, but are considered painfully slow in comparison. Like a Holtzman ship, you instantly jump thousands of lightyears, a Non-Holtzman ship takes months to reach the next system over.
Around 22,000 years from now.
Question, if space interstallar travel is imposible without spice, how did they find the spice in the first place?
You did remarkably well in understanding the film. I just have a few comments to enhance your experience.
Paul's visions are possible futures. He's been seeing the Chani a lot because she's apparently in a lot of those possible futures, but they are different each time because the way she's in his life could be different in those different outcomes. When he got into the desert, his visions became stronger and more frequent. It's the spice causing this. Some part of his genetics make him particularly susceptible to it. But he's also been in training to be a mentat, like Thufir Hawat (the living computer). In the book Paul has been getting this training without realizing it, and was only just informed at the start of the book. He's able to calculate probabilities from any data he takes in. Combined with the spice, and his heightened senses trained in him by his Bene Gesserit mom, makes him uniquely suited to seeing these possible futures. It's not some mystic supernatural thing, but a sort of science with a biological realism. The book is really grounded in science.
Speaking of, ecology plays a major part in the story. Arrakis has almost no water at all. It's treated as a resource just as precious as spice is to the wider Imperium. On Arrakis, water is wealth. The Fremen culture is entirely wrapped around water, gathering it, preserving it, and losing as little of it as possible. That's why the spitting scene is a big deal. When Stilgar spits on the floor inside Duke Leto's palace, he is giving Leto some of his water. The palace, like everywhere else on Arrakis, has moisture seals so that water will not be lost, it'll evaporate, and be collected by systems inside the house from the air. Imagine a high tech, highly efficient dehumidier in every home, which people use as a reservoir. There's a great scene, sadly cut from the movie, that goes into great length about how the various life on the planet has adapted to this water scarcity. Plants have evolved to act as natural water collectors for the morning dew, channeling it down into their root systems which go extremely deep. The little mouse you saw does something similar with its big ears.
Another aspect of the Fremen culture is their religious beliefs, including their belief in the lisan-al-gaib, which was planted by the Bene Gesserit's missionaries over many centuries so that Bene Gesserit in Jessica's position might someday be able to exploit it for survival. They do this everywhere and the most dangerous planets get the more extreme religions. Shadout Mapes went to get a job in the Atreides household in order to test if Jessica and her son are the ones prophesied. Jessica, with her finely-tuned Bene Gesserit senses saw the slightest signs that Mapes was carrying a concealed weapon. So she confronted her, not knowing what Mapes' intentions were. Jessica then bluffs her way through the conversation, drawing upon her knowledge of Bene Gesserit myth-making and her training in many languages. When asked if she knows what the knife is, Jessica actually is about to say "a maker of death". You can see her lips continue to move to form the next words but Mapes in a sudden burst of religious ecstasy interrupts. Mapes only heard "a Maker", which is a word the Fremen use sometimes for their creator-deity Shai-Hulud, which they believe physically manifests in the universe as the great sandworms. The Maker, aka the Creator. The knives the Fremen use are carved from the teeth of sandworms, so their blades are literally part of their god. This has tremendous religious implications. Jessica's educated guesses accidentally got it right, thus proving to Mapes that their messiah has come. This of course is a messiah the Bene Gesserit cynically planted into the Fremen culture in order to manipulate them.
Shai-Hulud translates roughly to "the old man in the desert". So later, when Paul is out in the desert for the first time and starts inhaling a bunch of spice near the sand crawler, he starts having much more intense visions. In at least some of those possible futures, he becomes a Fremen, and comes to know the sandworms as Shai-Hulud, aka "the old man". Paul, still in a bit of a trance, hears Gurney (another old man) walking up behind him to pull him back to the thopter. In a call-back to their training scene, Paul says he can tell it's Gurney by the sounds of his footsteps. That's Bene Gesserit training to heighten Paul's senses. Paul actually can tell, just as he can tell immediately that Duncan is the one flying that thopter later that picks them up. He recognizes the patterns of motion. So we get a fun little double meaning as Paul's words while he's having visions of the future. Paul recognizes Gurney's footsteps, but he also recognizes the footsteps of Shai-Hulud, the giant sandworm coming to eat the crawler.
So now, at the end of this film, Paul is faced with a choice. He's had visions about a terrible war burning across the universe in his name. He wants to avoid this future. But he's also a scared kid who doesn't want to die, and is surrounded by enemies. He only sees glimpses of the possible futures, and he can try to steer his course through space and time with the decisions he makes. The visions in the book are described like being in the desert with the sand dunes all around. When Paul is in a valley, he can't see very far. When he's at the top of a sand dune, he can see farther, but other sand dunes are blocking his view of the path ahead. The sands are constantly shifting, so going back down into another valley and climbing to the top of another dune, the path beyond there may have changed again. Paul is fighting for survival and fighting to avoid a terrible war, and trying to make the best choices he can with an imperfect prescience. We see he decides not to let himself be killed, but to kill Jamis and then go with the Fremen deeper into the desert. Was this the right choice? What will the consequences be? Dune Part Two will begin to answer those questions, but the saga of Dune is far from over.
Great post! Excellent background information that doesn't spoil anything. Well done.
10:28: just to let ppl know, the reason why Jessica is standing outside the room alone, and the Reverend Mother is so confident that no one would get past Jessica… is because, Jessica is guarding the room with her life, and, due to through centuries of conditioning, technological argumentation, genetic manipulation and evolution, the Bene Gesserit Training makes the female sister/mother into near superhuman beings, with strength and speed that rival any elite soldier, in that universe… Jessica alone could fend off well over 12 or so highly trained and armed warriors…in the books, members of the sisterhood are so conditioned and disciplined that they can use their brain power to the fullest, control their bodies nearly 100%, which also includes controlling their periods, bodily illness, fertility and even the very genetic sex of their children.
I tried reading "Dune" back in the mid '70's, when I was in High School, but it was too much to digest. I attempted it a few years later and devoured it like it was an exquisite feast. Dune, and its first sequels are some of the best SciFi ever written.
Yes! I read the trilogy in the early 80s. Still my favorite all time book series. I am very interested to see how Part 2 is handled, especially Paul's sister. And also how they divide up the story into.(hopefully) future parts.
Finally, to all who haven't read the books, don't worry about waiting for the movies to release. The books are amazing at all levels. Economics, politics, religion, technology. Top notch!
i read Dune my freshman year of HS as an assignment for English class. The teacher recognized that different students liked different books so she gave the class a choice of 6 different books rather than simply assigning one that most would hate. Dune was on the list, so since i'm a big sci-fi nerd, of course I chose it. I don't recall much of the assignments and small-group discussions she had with those of us that chose Dune, just her harping on the idea of "Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely." Still and all, I read all 6 of that series (checked out from the local public library, no less... yeah, I'm old....) so I must have liked it :D
I struggle to read for long periods of time as I get too sleepy. But I listened to the 15 hour long audiobook whilst working. It was fantastic and the voice acting worked well
Bizarrely in my case, my first book in the series is not the first one but the fourth book, God Emperor of Dune which veers far off from the story of the first three and like you, found it incredibly dense and hard to digest at first but Frank Herbert's graceful (if somewhat wordy) prose and incredible worldbuilding immediately hooked me in.
Very happy to see “Dark City” come in second on that poll!! Criminally under-seen and oh so cool.
Make sure to watch the directors cut on that one. The theatrical release has a voiceover at the start that basically spoils everything.
Agreed.
Dark City, directed by Alex Proyas, who had previously directed The Crow, is a lost masterpiece. Another movie that the marketing department didn't know what to do with so it flopped and has drifted mostly into obscurity. To be fair, I don't know how you could have marketed it properly without ruining the experience.
Yeah, I hope you'll do Dark City as well. But please, make sure it's the director's cut as the theatrical version opening utterly spoils the whole film!
I've seen both the theatrical release and director's cut, and I actually prefer the theatrical release. I felt the voiceover at the beginning was helpful, even necessary, but to each their own. I didn't feel like it spoiled anything.
Second this!! Please watch the Director's Cut, it's such a better and more satisfying experience!!!
Back when I was in the 9th grade my History teacher gave me his copy of Dune. It changed how I saw the world and had a huge impact on my life. This has to be one of the most intelligent reactions I've seen to this movie. You guys picked up on a lot of important details others missed. I read that part two will be even better. Can't wait.
This book was written in the 1950s, think about that you guys. Before Star Wars, or Trek, or really any of the huge pop culture sci fi stuff we take for granted today. Frank Herbert was a visionary, who's work influenced all of the sci fi we love today. Warhammer 40k has a ton of stuff in its lore that was straight up ripped off from Dune. Herbert was a genius, and his book was so complex and deep, that it was though unfilmable until now. And the director had to shuffle a lot of stuff around and make a 3 part movie to get through everything in it.
I like to say that Dune is "The Lord of the Rings" of Science Fiction.
Dune can be considered a pioneer of the Sci-Fi genre, in its own right.
Frank Herbert , like Tolkien, was a scholar first and a writer second, whose work drew partly from his own views, and experience as a journalist; there's some veiled social commentary underneath most of the Dune lore referencing real-life issues, such as the meddling of religion in politics, the evils of colonialism, the over-exploitation of natural resources, among others.
The baby is not Fremen its The Duke Leto's child and Lady Jessica's child. Pauls parents. The baby is Paul's younger sibling.
Very curious to see how she's handled - I'm sure it was very challenging for them to find a 6-month old actor familiar enough w Herbert's work to play the role of Alia lol
@@zmani4379yeah hope they do her justice it's such a hard character to show. Hope it's good n can't wait for dune part 3 dune Messiah she's an integral part of part 3 so excited but nervous for both films lol
The all blue eyes indicates the Fremen, but it's not genetic, it's a result of taking too much spice. That's why you see visions of Paul and his sister with those eyes.
@@donaldb1 yes exactly addiction to spice gives the blue eyes so anyone can have blue eyes just gotta be a junkie with the spice or taking huge doses for a long time.
@@travisgray8376dont need to be a spice junkie. Just by living there for years and inhaling spice in the air naturally will result in the blue eyes.
He who controls the spice, controls the universe!
The spice must flow..🖐
He who controls the pumpkin spice, controls the basic white chicks!
The Spice Extends Life, The Spice Expands Consciousness, The Spice Is Vital To Space Travel...
In the books, the shields do make it impossible to shoot another person with an energy gun... and not die yourself. Instead of the shield stopping energy, it causes a very explosive reaction.
the shields stop fast moving projectiles. Lasers hitting a shield cause a nuclear explosion so you can't risk that. Nuclear weapons are prohibited, but every House keeps a supply of them just in case.
The "atomics" is one part where I feel the book shows it's age s little. Maybe nukes in the Dune universe is more powerful than real world nukes I dunno (have only read the two first books) but you could "easily" drop a small asteroid from orbit to get the same results as a nuke.
@@generic_account2138 Eye see what you did there 👀
I loved this adaptation. Denis not compromising the story and insisting on two movies to cover the story was so important. It gives this movie a bit of a lower climax, certainly,. but sets things up very well for the next film. Can't wait for March!
RE: The blue eyes, that's just due to spice exposure, not genetic.
Sucks that they are doing it in two parts, though. Sucks even worse that they didn't even know if they were going to make part 2. It all depended on how part 1 performed.
@@miller-joel It was a roll of the dice, certainly, but it seems worth it to capture this dense book more fully - and by this time next year it's likely we'll all be thinking of Dune 1 and 2 as 2 parts of a single work, like w Godfather 1-2, or LOTR - and we may even see a version released that weaves them into 1 film - but it was a big risk - I spent my childhood waiting for the sequel to Bakshi's LOTR, which never came - and that could easily have happened again here w part 1
@@zmani4379 If they made the two parts at the same time, fine, but making one without making the other would have sucked so bad.
I believe the ending still makes sense. The beginning sets up Leto's goal is to ally with the Fremen and by the end Paul has done it.
@@ninjabluefyre3815 It's only half the story. Imagine if there was never a Kill Bill vol 2, and we never saw Bill.
A point about Paul's visions, he sees the future, but the future isn't fixed, that's why his visions keep changing. Each vision is true at the time, but the choices of everyone involved twist and change the path that events will take. So in some futures that he saw, Jamis became his friend and taught him about the desert, and in some futures Jamis or Chani kills him, but in the end he kills Jamis.
In the books that's correct but not in this reimagining. His visions are more metaphorical, based on feelings until his skill with them grows. Jamis is a friend (of sorts, such that Paul should listen to what's being conveyed for his benefit..."let go") and does in fact teach him about the ways of the desert. Chani, is the attraction of Paul to the Fremen, and his innocence must die in order to become Muad'Dib. Paul even says so in a round about way. "I thought I saw my death but it wasn't...I do know someone hands be a blade..."
In one path he saw him teaching the ways of the desert through his life, here because he knocked past him and earned his ire (chosing to do so only because he recognized him as a friend from his vision) he instead earned his ire and Jamis thought him the ways of the desert through his death.
“I recognize your footsteps, old man..” is one of my favourite lines. Because while Paul can obviously be talking about Gurney, I feel he’s talking directly to the massive sandworm, esp considering he can see multiple futures.
Paul’s line ‘I recognise your footsteps old man’ are him alluding to Shai Hulud. The worms have many names; many given to them by the Fremen. These including Old Man of The Desert, Old Man Eternity & Grandfather of The Desert.
In Arabic Shayʾ-Khulud translates as "Thing of Eternity" or "Thing of Immortality", consisting of Shayʾ "thing of" (in construct state) and Khulud "eternity" or "immortality".
About your comment on how things seem a little old fashioned, with swords...that's because of the personal shields. Projectiles from things like guns cannot penetrate them, so guns are essentially useless. With a blade, if you're good enough, you can get in close, slowly penetrate the shield, and kill its wearer. If you're wondering about laser weapons, they do exist, but if you hit a shield with one it causes a significant nuclear explosion, so combatants tend to avoid their use unless they are absolutely sure there are no shields in use. Kind of evens the playing field.
And in case you're wondering about some of the themes you see in this movie seeming a little familiar, Dune is essentially the granddaddy of modern Sci-Fi. George Lucas admitted he borrowed heavily from Dune for the creation of Star Wars. If either of you enjoy reading, I highly recommend the books...well the first 4 books anyway. I think there are something like 13 now, but the first 4 are pretty much all you need.
So glad you reacted to this one. As a longtime Dune fan, this is the film I've been waiting my whole life to see. They did an excellent job with it.
"Lisan al-Gaib" is a term in the Dune universe that translates to "Voice from the Outer World." It refers to a prophesied figure who will come from outside the Fremen culture and lead them to victory. Paul Atreides fulfills this prophecy when he arrives on the desert planet of Arrakis. He gains the trust and admiration of the Fremen, who see him as the fulfillment of their long-awaited prophecy. This title reflects Paul's role as a messianic figure among the Fremen and his eventual rise to leadership among them.
Within the Bene Gesserit sisterhood, the title "Lisan al-Gaib" holds significance as it refers to the prophesied figure who will emerge as a messiah-like leader among the Fremen on the desert planet of Arrakis. The Bene Gesserit, a secretive and powerful organization, manipulate various cultures and religions across the universe to advance their own agenda. By orchestrating the emergence of the Lisan al-Gaib, the Bene Gesserit seek to influence and control the political and social dynamics on Arrakis and beyond to further their long-term plans and goals.
Specifically it was planted by the Missionaria Protectiva on many worlds with the goal of protecting any Bene Gesserit who found herself in trouble.
@@wackyvorlon Yeah that's also why Stilgar refers to Jessica as a "weirding woman"; The bene gesserit had been to Arrakis long before the Dune story is set and spread both religion and fighting styles. Space ninja nuns lol.
My favorite fictional universe by far, 20:36 "Is it propaganda if its real?", "The sisterhood that has done this for thousands of years to lay the foundation" You guys have hit upon one of the fundamental ideas behind the novels, The truth/propaganda of the messiah story... A fundamental truth? or simply prudent planning?
Kinda like in our reality how the moneyed interests that rule us have contingency plans for just about every catastrophe, war, or crisis that comes along so that they financially benefit off it to the point it can feel engineered.
@@fs127 well put, I am sure that there are many elites who have been born into wealth and privilege who feel they have been destined for their role. As if they are put there by God himself only for the truth to come out that their families wealth came about through criminality or by pure chance.
Moreso self fulfilling prophecy I'd say. That's exactly what Paul does himself, and that's what the sisterhood did when they created his myth.
This itself is a commentary on the human condition, both the power we give ourselves through imagination and yet the limitations of that very same imagination that we place upon ourselves.
@@pseudonymousbeing987 Yes and no… hear it from Paul’s own perspective:
“He felt suddenly fearful, that by reaching for any new thing he might fall what is most precious. That even the slightest noise
might send the universe crashing back. Receding until he can never capture any piece of it.”
“How did I set this in motion? He asked himself.. it had of course set itself in motion. It was in the genes that might labor for centuries to achieve this brief spasm”.
-Dune Messiah
@@Maya_Ruinz
Nearly a quarter of important Dune quotes are related to this topic. I could bring up the one about the narrow fault line. Or about what is a prophet. Or themes about bullfighting. Etc etc.
And yeah most of Dune is "yes and no". Everything is nuanced.
But conclusively speaking I'd say that while Paul is subject to a force that is largely inevitable. He also forges his own doom. Especially in Messiah. He definitely has a choice like when he can escape Arrakis and become a spice navigator. One of his flaws is he's too unwilling to fight back and resist. Though that may be a product of knowing the future. But again, this knowledge is imperfect. And at the same time the very fact he tries at all is due to his Atreides stubbornness and willingness to fight the unwinnable.
NICE!
One of the best adaptations of the epic Sci Fi novel by Frank Herbert
Nominated for 10 Oscars including Best Picture but won for
Best Sound (Editing, Mixing)
Best Visual Effects
Best Original Score
Best Cinematography
Best Film Editing
Best Production Design.
DUNE, PART TWO will be in theaters March 1st.
House Atreides In the "Dune" universe, traces its lineage back to ancient Greek mythology, specifically to the House of Atreus, a legendary royal family in Greek literature. The name "Atreides" itself is derived from Atreus, a king of Mycenae in Greek mythology. The House of Atreus is famous for its tragic history, including stories such as the curse of the House, the sacrifice of Iphigenia, and the Trojan War.
While there are parallels between the fictional House Atreides and the historical figures from ancient Greece, the specific details of their lineage and history in the "Dune" series are unique to Frank Herbert's creation and are not directly tied to real-world historical events such as Roman or early Scottish history.
Also the events depicted in Dune are happening about 20,000 years into the future, so it would be impossible to make any connection.
@@wackyvorlon actually 21,226 years after 1965
@@wackyvorlon In later Dune novels, Leto II literally says he has seen his most distant ancestors in visions, all the way back to the House of Atreus. Btw, "Old Earth" or "Ancient Terra" are mentioned numerous times in the novels, so it's absolutely meant to be a "real future", one where so much time and distance has basically made Earth an ancient forgotten place. Paul and Stilgar discuss his revolution's body count vs famous conquerors of ancient earth- Ghengis Khan, Hitler, etc. Paul and the Fremen Jihad kills over 60 billion people on hundreds of planets in their total takeover of Shaddam Corrino's Empire. The Fremen are descendants of the "Zensunni Wanderers" (some references to Zen Bhuddism and Sunni Islam from our world. There are numerous other examples of connections to our current Earth, cultures, religions, flora and fauna, etc.
@@halcyo woah big spoilers there
The Gom Jabbar scene, or "hand in the box" scene always stuck with me. It sells the idea of a human (especially one with so much power like Paul) literally suppressing their impulse of wanting to avoid pain, by enduring the worst pain just to not die. To be able to decide long term and withstand suffering in the current. After all if he only cares about the pain his hand is feeling, and removes his hand, then he doesn't deserve his power, he is no different than an animal (at least in the ruthless standards of the superhuman Bene Gesserits) and therefore should just be put down. He must be better than just an impulsive animal, withstand pain, survive, as the heir to the Atreides throne, as the superhuman offspring of a Bene Gesserit, to be there for the people he cares for, etc.
You have to remember what Paul told the Reverend Mother about his dreams; they don't always come true. His visions are only possabilties and not a set destiny. They can be changed and he is not stuck in one path.
That's because they are metaphorical not literal while his skill with them is still growing. In the books you are correct but source and reimagining often don't or even can't match 1 to 1 given the differences in the medium.
But while they might change, they will follow more or less the same purpose or essence. He still thought him the ways of the desert, but with his death instead. The real screwed up thing is that the only reason he chose to go in his direction in because he had seen he was a friend in his vision and thought it was the surest direction. Thus averting the future he had seen completely by earning his ire and resentment when he knocked him down.
You are the only reactor we seen so far that caught the whole Apocalypse Now easter egg with the Baron! Bravo yo!
By the way, the year 10191 is based on their updated calendar. It is approximately 20,000 years in the future from our time, which makes more sense to me than it just being 8,000 years in the future. Their year 0 is based on the year the Spacing Guild essentially established a monopoly on space trade.
“Jesus. All he did was put his hand in a box and I’m stressed the fuck out” 🤣
Genius!
NEVER change, TBR. NEVER.
To be honest, you guys did an amazing job interpreting the story. Almost everything other people have fumbled on when watching these reactions, you got right or very close to it. Without giving too much away, most of the stuff you predicted and theorized about is exactly what will happen.
"Reminded me of Apocalypse Now"....
Stellan Skarsgard (I'm sure I'm spelling that wrong) actually said in an interview that he was inspired by Brando's role in Apocalypse Now.
Also.... you hoped Paul would do something to the Reverend Mother Gaius??? Thats like hoping 9 year old Anakin would defeat Yoda.
The bit about Shadout Mapes and the Crysknife at the interview for housekeeper... Mapes completely misunderstood and cut Jessica off... she did NOT know about cyrsknives and she was NOT saying "the Maker" as in the worms being the Maker of the Desert (of water, of spice..) the sandworms, whom the Fremen practically worship as an avatar of god. But Jessica totally played along with Mapes misunderstanding that Jessica understood...
Also, they did both Mentats (Thufir Hawat and Piter de Vries) a bit dirty in this telling, practically cutting their roles out... Thufir had a bigger role... and also the Atreides KNEW they had a traitor in their midst, just not who, and many suspected Jessica because she was a Bene Gesserit (in the book).
Right? The movie really undersold how powerful the Rev Mother is. Even without the Gom Jabar she could have killed Paul easily.
@@LordVolkov Yep. However, when Paul becomes Muad'Dib and is done overthrowing the Emperor with the Fremen in the books, he is definitely a match for that Reverend Mother.
@@Tman001100 Absolutely! The moment when he shuts her down is chilling - when you understand just how powerful Paul has become.
@@Tman001100bruh even a reverend mother is a rounding error compared to the Kwisatz Haderach.
Skarsgård.
Its an amazing plot device to introduce close combat. If an energy weapon crosses a shield you get a nuclear explosion. Projectile weapons are useless against shields. So here we are in the far future brought back to sword fighting.
Yep and I'm all for it. Frankly, I find gun/projectile fights less interesting than with swords/knives. It takes more refined skill and finesse.
Bagpipes are at the very least thousands of years old, same as horns, drums and even string instruments. Flutes are tens of thousands of years old. We still use all of them, despite having more modern instruments available. Personally, I would have found it weirder if they had used a synth, theremin or some unidentifiable scifi instrument.
The sleeper has Awaken! I read all of the dune books and it is a great series.
Honestly, I think only the first 3 are worth reading.
@@laraq07I agree
I personally really enjoyed 5 and 6, and I thought they had good pacing and plotting. 4 was the the tough slog to get through for me. I also felt two felt slow. My favorite books in order would be something like 1-3-5-6-2-4. @@laraq07
One of the best sci-fi films of all time, and perhaps the best sci-fi novel of all time. The second half of that novel is some of the most intense and wild shit I've ever read.
Part Two is going to be incredible.
Yeah, by the time I got to God Emperor of Dune, I was blown away and read that book about a dozen times or so. I still have the copy I read from 2006..it's definitely worn but that gives it even more character lol.
Hell yeah, me and my two boys have tickets for the 29th first showing of part 2, wooooo hoooooo!!
The Bene Gesserit have seeded many planets with myths and legends so that their agents can use them under duress and so that these cultures will be ready to accept the Kwizatz Haderach as their messiah. Religion as a method of control is a huge theme in the books.
I love his sister: His sister is such a bad ass, my favorite part is when she puts the whammy on the Head of the Sister hood, and makes her shut up.
Great reaction!
One thing they omitted about stillsuits - they also process urine and feces. The goal is no loss of moisture to the atmosphere. ;-)
I just saw this in theaters for a second time last night and it was just as good or better than the first time, can't wait to see your reaction to a fantastic movie. And can't wait for Dune 2 on February 25th
When I was a kid, my friend's mom had these books. Nerd that I am, I was hooked right away. I saw the original movies and think they did a great job telling the story. I'm so glad you're reacting to it.
38:54 Yes, it was. The dreams are metaphors. Jamis (the guy he just defeated in the duel) DID teach him: he taught him that the desert is a brutal, unforgiving place if you’re not prepared to do whatever it takes to survive. (Remember when the Baron said "The desert takes the weak"?)
Also, the girl, Shani, stabbing him with the knife was another metaphor, the point being that in order for the Muad-Dib, the Fremen Messiah, the leader he was destined to be, to rise, then Paul, the naive, starry-eyed kid he currently is at this point, has to die.
You should see the original 1984 David Lynch version, the no-CGI era. Sting and Patrick Stewart are in it.
That's the movie that got me hooked on these books - it's got a lot of issues, but it's really fascinating as a hybrid between the visions of Herbert and Lynch - and I love the way that film handled the book's gravitas, its trippy spiritual aspects, and Paul's tragic loss of innocence
Yeah I suggested the original also but reactors seldom if ever take TH-camr suggestions. LOL.
Gotta love the David Lynch weirdness!
The costumes and sets were beautiful.
No. No they shouldn’t. LOL!
Don't worry they won't. Reactors almost never take TH-camrs suggestions. It is some kind of members only club. LOL@@rev.chuckshingledecker
One of the best sci-fi films of this decade. Denis is a genius. Gimme all the sandworms in dune 2!!!!!
Frank Hewbert is the genius. Denis is a phenomenal director
Facts
See part 2 in IMAX multiple times, then come back to the channel and give a re-watch reaction/analysis because you can't deprive yourself the experience. This is how I imagine audiences at the time saw Lawrence of Arabia in the theater. It must be seen on a big screen. Shot completely with IMAX cameras. Denis is a genius on par with, well, I won't say his name, but if you know you know.
Good catch. The baron rubbing his scalp was a direct homage to Marlon Brando in Apocalypse Now
As someone who was once a huge Star Wars fan, once you "get" into Dune and its mind-blowing lore and aesthetic, Star Wars' hollow, juvenile sci-fantasy no longer cuts it. I've become a huge fan of Herbert's work due to this film. It's the real deal.
I agree in that I find it sad how so many things that were influenced/simply stole from Dune only ever steal the surface level. The aesthetics or most basic ideas. But the actual depths of philosophy and complex themes are never built on. Yes everyone that came after Dune took from Dune, but Dune is still adored today not just because it's the OG but because nobody has been able to match it.
I still love my Star Wars too tho. The original trilogy, Andor and the last jedi.
Star wars actually did not borrow from dune George Lucas borrowed mostly from Isaac asimov's the foundation@@pseudonymousbeing987
Jeezus.. I just got back from the IMAX rerun of Dune with the Dune 2 preview and you guys post this!!?? The Dolby Atmos rattled the fillings in my fkn teeth.. its MADE to be seen in IMAX with the earth shattering sound/score.. go see Dune 2 March 1st Team Schmidt 👍🏻 Respect from 🏴
And its Den-ee Veel-nerve
Glad to see you both enjoying this recent modern classic! I'm even glad you both are seeing it for the first time, getting a fresh perspective and trying to out together inferences, clues and details for yourself without any help from the books which is interesting to see.
What Frank Herbert did with Dune is create a multi-layered canvas to explore ecology, economics, politics, religion, spirituality, and other themes. In many ways, Dune is to science fiction literature what The Lord of the Rings is to fantasy.
The film ends at the midway of the novel...and the second half is filled with action.
Part 2 adds four characters not in the first part...Margot, Lady Fenring (Lea Seydoux), Feyd-Rautha Harkonnen (Austin Butler), Princess Irulan (Florence Pugh) and Shaddam IV, Padashah Emperor of the Known Universe (Christopher Walken). Irulan is important especially in the novel, as she is an historian, and her writings start each chapter of the novel.
When the novel was written, it was actually the first three books (Dune, Dune Messiah, and Children of Dune) combined and it took Herbert six years of research and writing. He was forced to break it up. Herbert wrote 6 novels in the series, and his son, Brian has written an additional 14 novels.
The films will most likely end with Dune Messiah being directed by Denis Villeneuve. After that, it will depend on a lot of factors as each novel is different...Messiah takes place 12 years after Dune, Children is another 9 years after that, then the time jump is 3,500 years (God Emperor of Dune), and then 1,500 years (Heretics of Dune) and finally 8 years later (Chapterhouse: Dune) which was Frank's last novel. Then there are the Brian Herbert novels that are both prequels and sequels to what his father wrote.
Fun fact: Starting with Dune Messiah, one character returns over and over due to certain circumstances...I won't say who, how, or why....but, he is in the first movie, and it is not Paul. If the Dune series has a real main character...this one is it. Take a guess, and one else spoil it!
No spoilers 🤐 Which is your favorite book of the series by Frank Herbert? Mine is easily God Emperor of Dune. It's just the most compelling and complex and Leto II becomes something that, alone, required me to read the book multiple times just for that to better understand it lol. Still loved the others all the way to Chapterhouse. Then, I finally brought myself to read Brian Herbert's sequels to them and as I pretty much expected, I personally was not fond of them but he should not be blamed. It would've been damn near an impossible task for any writer.
Dune is definitely one of the best sci-fi movies to date, Dune: Part 2 comes out in theaters (cinema) on March 1st, and I think you guys should definitely watch Oppenheimer, Interstellar, Inception, Breaking Bad, and Stranger Things at some point
You mentioned how strange it was not to have communication, which is a good catch & part of the technology of the universe. With the help of spice they can travel between stars nearly instantly, but the thing is communications like radio is still limited by the speed of light. So it's faster for a messenger to travel between worlds to hand-deliver a message than to try to send a signal the same distance.
It is very much worth it to read the books as for a very long time it was believed that this series was un-filmable because of the depth and nuance. Also worth it to watch the David Lynch film.
Note: The books and the Lynch film will both spoil events in the forthcoming Part 2.
Paul is a biblical name. There are many transformed religious traditions still alive in dune. The benne gesserits religious text is literally called "the orange catholic bible". So picking a biblical name for a highborn firstborn makes a lot of sense.
You might be the first blind reactors who actually guessed majority of why things are the way they are correctly. The mouse is a species called Muad'Dib. If Denis had total freedom, it would have been a 6-7 hour movie, and I would of struggled to retain my body's moisture through every second of it. As you might have noticed, the Dune fanbase is very helpful. ***removed my spoiler about Chani and Ghola those who know.. know***
"i thought Zendaya would be important, like maybe the daughter of the leader of the Fremen"
The irony of you making that comment right at that moment is incredible..
The Character Dr Liet-Kynes (who is onscreen right at that moment saying the prayer as Shai Hulud devours the harvester) is a man in the book, He is Chani (Zendayas) Father, and is known by different names to different people, as 'Dr Kynes Imperial planetologist' to the imperium, and as 'Liet' to the Fremen, who is refered to in a reverent, almost godly sense for much of the Narrative until the reveal that he is one and the same, and is the defacto leader of all of the Fremen peoples on Arrakis.
I hope this isn't a spoiler, I realise the narrative technically doesn't reveal that Chani is Liets Daughter until immediately after this first film leaves off. But with the deviation of the Kynes character in the first film Vs the novel I feel like they will either omit that connection completely, or the film will play out differently anyway.
Paul's "death" was a symbolic one; the boy he was needed to die for him to become the Muad'Dib and truly be able to lead the Fremen. Killing Jamis was Paul's first kill, and by so doing was also the death of his former life.
The desert mouse is called Muad'Dib. It becomes Paul's usename/battlename with the Fremen especially in their fight against the Harkonnen and the Emperor's Sardukar army.
Visions are subject to change. They show what CAN be.
In the books yes, but in this interpretation they are more metaphorical based on feelings until his skill with them grows and they can become more clear.
"I have no idea what's happening, but I have chills" could be the tagline of the movie.
this story is monsterously HUGE. it is a 6 book series that took me months to get through. it gets better the more you get into it. I think the director is going to make this a three movie series roughly covering the first 3 books.
He's talking about 3 movies covering the first 2 books, because the second book is shorter - I'm hoping they cover at least the first 4 books, with another film for the 3rd and another 2 films for the weightier 4th book - IMO it's the 4th book that ties the series together - I feel like it's the conclusion to the social experiment started by Paul
@@zmani4379 So far, it's never been worth hoping for more than a trilogy by one director. They've always gotten sick of their big projects at 3 (Nolan, for example) and ready to move on, or the quality has suffered (LOTR, Star Wars, etc)
I think perhaps the most interesting detail about the Dune novels is that in this future, computer technology has been outlawed, because of a catastrophe caused by AI. Meaning that these worlds are futuristic and high tech in every way except computer tech. Instead they have these human computers, like that guy with the rolling eyes. That is quite clever for a novel written in the 60s. No wonder Dune is the mother of all sci-fi.
The Baron has suspensor belts to "float". They are the only way he can support his massive weight. You also see Duncan using one in the fight scene during the invasion as do the Sadukar when they drop in to fight
I case you missed it, the box that Paul put his hand in was a direct neural pain inducer, to him it was gradually increasing heat that got to the point he thought his hand had been burnt away to bone before Reverend Mother Superior Mohiam stopped it.
You guys were great, probably the only reactors I’ve seen that were able to figure it why they’re not using guns.
The test with the box was to see if Paul is human or not. He passed that's why she called him human before leaving.
Denis basically shoots independent European movies with Hollywood budget. I'm so glad he got the money to shoot Dune, I was worried when Blader runner 2049, one of my favorites movies of all time, failed at box offices.
And I'm glad you are reacting to it!
35:40 "Drum sand" is described in the books as compacted sand that resonates when you step on it. As far as we know, it is not a real thing. But we've never had a chance to study a real-life desert planet.
The Weirding Way is a MARTIAL ARTS Defense of the Bene Gesserit
And the most advanced form of hand-to-hand combat in the known universe
Let's gooo...awesome reaction y'all. Can't wait for part 2.
It was like the vision and he had to die. The Fremen was his teacher in the way of the Fremen with his actions. And Paul left his old life behind and had to accept his role in the Fremen Framework. That was the death. Visions, eh ^^
"I was a friend of Jamis. He taught me that when you kill, you pay for it..."
It's not just leaving that part of him behind. Paul kills his innocence when he kills Jamis. I really hope they don't skip the funeral in Part 2. It's a really powerful scene and very informative of Fremen culture.
Exactly!
Change and Death are often interchangeable
Oh heck yeah. I wasn't expecting this reaction today. A surprise to be sure but a welcomed one. Hope you guys enjoy it. Its currently one of my favorite modern films in the 2020's.
Dune has such a huge and rich amount of lore with interesting and cool things about it.
The characters, the visuals, set designs, costumes, ships, weapons, planets, subtle humor, action/fight scenes and the musical score are all fantastic along with such a big cast that it got. Hans Zimmer did about 3 soundtracks for the film and each one just sucks you in and makes you wanna hear more. Looking forward to hear what he'll bring to the table for part 2 this year! And yes, as many of the commentors have pointed it out, Dune was Star Wars before Star Wars and other sci-fi things were even cool. Glad that Dune is getting the love and attention that it deserves!
Den-knee Vill-nuv - There you go! You'll get it, this time! Its possible! 🤣
In my humble opinion, you guys should watch this on the biggest screen you can. Movies like this are rare and should be viewed in the cinema. You can always do a second viewing when Dune Part 2 relases on video or streaming. Not only will it be an experience, but you will be supporting Denis Villenueve and the whole cast and crew....and hopefully guarantee us Dune Messiah...
The blue eyes was from prolongued consumption of the Spice, which the Fremen use even in their food almost nutritionally, some some spoces in Indian cooking.
Blue eyes dont mean Fremen. Its coincidental.
Also, regarding the doctor... one thing this telling left out was that the doctor was specially trained for loyalty.... the diamond on his head is symbolic of that... he was supposed to be incorruptible. For him to betray the Atreides was unthinkable.
And yet Vladimir Harkonnen found his weak point.
'sealed their fate,' said by those living after the use of literal 'seals' before the metaphor took hold.
Great observation about why combat reverted. That's exactly the reason why they reverted back to fighting with swords and other close range weapons. The invention of personal shields made ranged combat go out of style. Projectile weapons ate deflected, and even worse, laser weapons cause a nuclear reaction when they hit a shield, resulting in an explosion that can level an entire city, killing both shooter and target.
While early in the movie, you see the year, but as with time keeping in our own history, events have caused humans to "change calendars." The time we see in the Dune universe is actually about 23,000 years in the future, which explains how different people living on ecosystems on different planets would have changed so radically.
Dune Part 2 MUST BE WATCHED IN IMAX or Dolby. If you loved this one, your minds will be blown by the second part
Dolby for the win
You guys did so freaking good with this. Good job.
Get well soon TBR!
I wish they had included the dinner scene where they have to describe drowning to the Fremen because the idea of being submerged in so much water until death is so alien to them.
Ah, yes, the Alaskan Bull Worm clearly was the inspiration for Dune's sand worms.
45:50 Dune's "spice" is used as a spice. It tastes like cinnamon, and has a bitter cinnamon smell.
There aren't many details about spice's "geriatric properties", but I suspect it only helps prevent geriatric diseases. The book says it can lengthen a person's lifespan to 4 times normal. So, figure 300 years as a senior citizen.
Also, the spice doesn't power space travel. Spice only allows Guild Navigators to use a limited form of prescience to see the safest path to take. It's like the nav-computer from Star Wars; if you don't know the safe route, you could slam right into a star/planet/etc.
The hero of this movie is the score. Hans Zimmer rules every scene in this film,
I read recently that he got so into the Dune music that he kept creating more even after the release of the movie! 😄A lot of that might have been used in part 2 though. Can't wait, tickets booked already!
23:34 Funny you say that, in this film, Zendaya's character Chani is the Niece of Liet Kynes, Although this isn't expressly mentioned in the film. In the original novel, Liet Kynes is a man, and Chani is his daughter.
The eyes turn blue due to exposure to the spice. It does not mean they are Freman ;)
great reaction! Such an epic adaption.
the move throws a LOT of information at you very quickly, and key facts can be mentioned once in easily-missed single lines of quiet dialogue.
you guys did a lot better than so many other reactors I've seen watching this, by listening to all the dialogue and thus picking up on all the worldbuilding. Many people flat-out miss the fact that the messiah myths have been *made* by the Bene Gesserit. The book focuses a lot about propaganda and schemes. People have abilities yes, but it's all explained within a scientific system.
Jamis WAS the guy in Paul’s vision (The guy Paul killed, was the guy who was helping him in his visions). It’s just that that possible path wasn’t taken. Instead he killed him which prevented that path (sadly).
The blending of technology comes from something they don't mention called 'The Butlerian Jihad" Thinking Machnes (computer AI) was overthrown and banned. This is why you have people like Hawat called "Mentats". People trained to be human computers. You correctly identified another aspect. Projectile weapons are rendered ineffective by shields but so are laser weapons. When a laser weapon hits a shield it can cause an explosion that kills both the target and the shooter. This is why they've gone back to hand to hand combat for much of the fighting.
I’m glad you mentioned the little mouse, it actually has some importance. I’m just going to leave it at that.
Muad'Dib!
IS SHE FREMEN? lmao, you clearly missed the part where they explained, anyone who has prolonged exposure to Spice - their eyes turn blue. So if you live out in the desert with the Fremen long enough, your eyes will turn unnaturally blue, no matter what home culture youre from 😂 good reaction tho! I cant wait for Dune 2 🥳
You are not the only reactors to be surprised that Paul has an apparently normal name in amongst all the otherwise strange futuristic names. But actually there are resonances with ancient human culture throughout the story. There is not only Paul and Jessica, but their family name, Atreides, also comes from earth, from ancient Greece. I think they claim descent from the Greek Atreides, which is the family of Agamemnon and Menelaus, who fought the Trojan war, hence all the bull imagery you see in their buildings.
Wow missed the announcement that you were doing this one - great video. Also, hope you feel better 🙂
One of the best parts about the cinematography of this movie is you always have a sense of scale to show the size of things in the frame. A really nice touch more films need to do.
Villeneuve did a great work but so many of Herbert's work is impossible to put in a movie and get people to understand it. But this is the best adaptation you can get, at least for this generation. About the dates... it's the standard year of 10.191 since House Corrino took the Golden throne of the Padisha emperors, that's like 20.000 years since Earth. The shields rendered the firearms obsolete, but not completely, however if you use a laser against a shield you unleash s nuclear explosion, so they turned to martial arts again. It's a complicated series of overlapping technologies. The Bene Geserit... you could write books about them. Technology... restricted because of the Butlerian jihad.... so much to explain. Enjoy.
Frank Herbert put a *lot* of thought into all of this.
@@wackyvorlon Yed, basically created a new universe and his son continued expanding it and reviewing it 👍