Trying to fix the BA Falcon's Driveline Vibration For Good!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 ก.ย. 2022
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MotoringBox is an Australian based TH-cam channel run independently by Sean McKellar since 2019. It focuses on quality content about Australian car culture and some of the incredibly unique vehicles we manufactured here. I work a day job and publish videos in my spare time, so thank you for your patience and I hope you enjoy my videos.
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Please note: I enjoy working on cars but I can't promise that what I do will work for your particular car, or that you won't harm yourself, someone else, your car, or your warranty doing it. Please be safe, be responsible and if you're not sure what you're doing, get a qualified mechanic to help you out. - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
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Jackstand Jimmy shirt 😎
The nuances of the BA-FG/Terri are driving me up the wall. Its one thing after another.
I am so glad I'm not the only one that has gone through this. Glad you're on the right track Sean, this issue drove me nuts for years.
@@michwas7270 🤣🤣🤣 Stupid bots
My Ford territory only vibrates when it's in drive gear and stationery. what causes this?
@@magyaradam Engine mounts mate. Two on the engine, one under the gearbox.
@magyaradam it's usually only 1 that needs changing. lift your bonnet up and try putting it in drive with your foot on the brake if you rev it a little and your engine lifts up definatley engine mounts only about 80 bucks and takes 15 min to change
Chased similar vibration in my old ba around that 80kmh mark. After having all the "pros" mess with it I brought some of those clip on tailshaft weights and put it up on axle stands and run it up to 80 or so. I used one of those vibration measurement apps and just messed with the weights until it improved. I got it a lot better but never fully gone. Best thing I did to fix all my ba xr6 turbo issues was sell it :)
Great video Sean!
Yep it's a pain in the ass. I would have said centre bearing myself going from the video footage. Holdens too have their disadvantages but you also have to remember that our vehicles are getting closer to 20 years old. Holdens have centre bearing issues with the drive train.
You might beat yourself up Sean saying that there's Ford Falcon content but you have to remember that these cars although they were built here in Australia & it's unfortunate that the rest of the world didn't get them. At least you're showing issues that happen with ownership.
A very well balanced report
Being a mechanic, I have gone through this issue multiple times on multiple different Falcons. The CV on the end of the tailshaft is a common cause of vibration, the CV loses the oil from the grease over time past the cork gasket that is under the dome-shaped sheet metal cover. No matter how closely the CV components are inspected, abnormal wear will not be found. The only solution is to replace the CV joint, they are available from Hardy Spicer.
New CV certainly helped, and tomorrow's video will show you what finally fixed it!
@@MotoringBoxTV probably on car balancing using trial and error with clip on weights to get the remaining out of balance vibration down to an acceptable level, am I right?
@@2secondslater I got to the bottom of mine with the use of a hose clamp. Just use it to offset weight till you find the sweet spot. Once I found it though, I went in to my local Ford dealer and bought the clip on weights, removed the hose clamp installing the weights behind the shaft in it's place. Car is as quiet as a mouse now. All of this when Ford, and even 2 driveline companies couldn't fix the issue. Oh and it also helps to have a hoist at home... 😛
My dome cover has dents. Can you make a comment about the probability of how come?@motobox
Sean your video editing skills just keep getting better and better. That intro was wicked while also bringing up oh so many painful truths. Keep up the great work.
i work on these every day and also get alot of vibrations from the rear axle's, its not always the tailshaft, people just go straight to the shaft as its common
Good luck with it mate, it looks like you've broken the back of it. I wish I could say the same for my 2005 BA Ghia MKII. She's done now 288k kms, she was driving like I was in a spin cycle of a washing machine which led to the diff bushes, rear lunch pins, front wheel bearings, fh right control arm and she still makes jingle bell sounds. I've also changed the water pump, oil sensor, and the power steering hose and other control arm are next to change. I keep remembering back to watching an engineer say on the TV news that they build cars to last around 9 years. That guy clearly knew what he was talking about. I feel these cars start falling apart when they reach around 200k+ ! I've spent so much on her now that I've got to keep going I guess and sort out the rest of the crap with the suspension:(
The weights that clip on near the cv joint are used at Ford dealerships they dynamically balance the shaft on the car and normally have some reflective tape on the shaft as well.
They used their diagnostic tool (VCMM) along with with a vibration sensor (MTS 4000) to locate the imbalance. It might be worth contacting a dealership and have chat to them about it.
If you can't find any weights some hose clamps can be used for balancing. Easy to put on and move around to help improve the balance.
Awesome quality of production as always
I own 2 ba Falcons, one of them has the same vibration issue.
Love the work and I always jump onto your videos as soon as it pops up on my subscriptions.
I'm pretty sure that if you have universal joints on a tailshaft you are supposed to run them in pairs, so they cancel each others vibration out. These 2 piece tailshafts only use one universal joint.
Great video. I can tell from the footage under the car the centre baring is toast & should have been replaced. Splitting the shaft & having it properly weighted & balanced will make a big difference. I would also have replaced all the bushes & mounts that hold the shaft in place too.
Keep up the good work 😊
Sufferred for years on my BF XR6turbo with this problem. First occurred on a change of 4 tyres, so suspected that it was a tyre balancing issue. Not the case. Tyre shop said my alloy wheels were out of round! I did not believe this as I hardly ever curb my tyres, leave alone the wheels. Anyway took the car to an alloy wheel repair who said the wheels were out of round. The alloy wheels were machined but you gussed it, the vibration was still there.
Finally took it to the leading Ford dealer who changed some bushes on the rear suspension and as you are aware there are a 1,000 bushes on the control blade. You gussed it again- no difference. Decided to live with it, as the car is still an absolute delight to drive at speed.
Finally found a good mechanic who did mostly Fords & Holdens. He resolved the issue by changing all the rubber bushes to Super Pro bushes (made in Queensland). A change of tyres from Bridgestone RE003 to Michelin Pilot sport and the car is now a dream as good as new!
I reckon the Bridgesone's asymetical pattern COULD have set up an out of sync frequency with the suspension.
All this cost me more than $3,000 to fix over the years. Love the car!
Sam
My bf has the plastic weights on the tailshaft. I took em off, redid the centre bearing as it tore, didn’t bother with the weights and it’s still silky smooth.
this is one of most greatest fix ever and chickens will be happy
Calling out to Jesus stuck on railway lines will definitely help. (From very old Falcon owner, Perth). my Son has AU GHIA also, same colour as yours . Thanks for video's Sean
Hi - I have a few questions
vibration - through the floor and you feel it with your feet or through the steering wheel
Steering wheel vibration, is it a shudder or steering wheel shaking left / right or up / down
There are many things to consider
1. Front sway bar bushing can cause this
2. Steering rack mounting
3. Out of balance driveshaft gives a "cork screw" vibration
4. centre carrier bearing worn / ripped / soft
5. Road wheels - check first all weights are on, re balance as it is cheap , also unless tyres are fairly new even though they have plenty of tread they can be out of balance, some difficult tyre balancing or if they use excessive weights, have the shop un mount the tyre of the rim in spins it about 20-30 degrees from where it was and re-balance - often you will get away with not having to much weights on the wheels
5. Buckled or warped rims
6. gummed up brake calipers and to undo master cylinder and back of push rod
I noticed you mentioned each 1/2 of the shaft was balanced, well that is sort of fine, but they need to install a new centre bearing then re-balance the complete tailshaft as a unit - the bearing and the bushing will not be 100% neutral - so even if each 1/2 shaft is 100% perfectly individually balanced , bolted together with another items may not have it remain 100% perfect
The parts cannon is that last resort - but try swaping easy stuff with a friends car that does not have the issue - you will still do the same process of elimination - do the easy ones first , first the wheels, then the complete tailshaft
Once those 2 are Ok, then you look at transmission of diff as a possible fault - in the old days ( 60-80) the 3 speed and 4 speed manuals were simple to take of, place on bench or floor and turn the input shaft by hand and see how smooth it was - todays its a real drama
Also - finally, go check your engine mounts,they are fluid filled and they will leak and sag, one side is more easy to change than another and many shops just do the 1, but if you have both done, the steering actually feels much more stable and the ride is better - i had one side changed at @ 100k' and recently had both changed a few months ago at @ 150k's - i noticed straight away the car in reversing and low speed driving felt much more glued to the road and no vibration and also the drivers side mirror no longer vibrates at idle in gear when stopped
Regards
George
And if you in do the shaft the first time… mark the location so you can put it back in the same spot.
Most times you don’t want a balanced shaft, as you will need to add weights to it, try it and rotate.
But centres got out all the time
Glad your finally getting there with it Sean! These things can be so annoying I know.
Good luck with the tail shaft. Must be a killer. I might be in the minority, but I loved seeing the cinematic editing back.
At 6:32 you can see an absolute predator in the background
Ahaaa.....Snap On Van 😲
You a perfectionist!?? Noooo I had no idea 😆 That last road you drove on just before signing off is such a shit road. Everything vibrates! Great intro as usual too mate.
True blue Ford BA channel!
Love my car but it drives me crazy sometimes.
that little last bit of vibration you can feel could also be a wheel balance issue.
Binding brakes together with warped discs also.
Maybe Sean needs to do a video comparing his AU to his BA & show us which car has had more crap break & which car is the KING of FALCONS 🔥😈
It's not a vibration, it's a massage function 😀I had a steel skip bin out front many years ago, cost me something like $300 for a weeks hire - the first night I had it some bugger came and filled it half up with their crap. Recon I knew who it was too but no way to prove it. Glad they got it mostly sorted for you - worn CV joints can definitely allow the shaft to move off centre a bit and thus vibrate - I've had it happen with a FWD driveshaft with badly worn CV joints - felt like a wheel bearing but was actually just the shaft slopping around in the joint (you could tell it was the joint because it would clack like a mofo whenever you turned a corner though)
Wow. That’s a win.
I had a vibration and the mechanic at work said it’s my rear brake rotors he changed them out and guess what!! It went 😮he also did my centre bearing
Glad it's fixed
It's not yet. Still doing it.
I got an on car tail shaft balance done by Ford on my old BA after doing getting the centre bearing done. I was told at the time that it could take several attempts to get it right ( tried to shake itself to bits at 60kph ) Luckily it got fixed first go. Loved the car when it was right but it was rarely right and compared to the previous AU I had which was the most reliable car I ever owned the BA was a nightmare. Glad to sell it in the end.
It seems incredibly difficult to find dealers who still do it. I guess most of their current lineup are FWD.
Love the jackstand jimmy shirt 👕 quick question, what made you decide against the single piece tailshaft, i was very curious to see how that went
I came to the same conclusion with my BA Fairmont Ghia, that 90-95% done was good enough. The vibration was there, but not so bad. I guess we just need to live with that. I know your frustration and sympathise with you.
Even new cars off the lot can have niggling issues. Sometimes the best best fix is the put up with it fix, as long as it's not detrimental over time. You end up becoming accustomed to them and it can sometimes take getting used to if a noise gets eliminated!
Often, noises disappear all by themselves.
@@jamesfrench7299 Damn those Gremlins, they are the bane of my existence!
Just remember that the white plastics on the rear bolt threads are 5gram weights, so don't just snap them off like most people do and mark where you've taken them from and how many where there, also 3 or so centre bearings available so identify and measure the exact bearing required for application.
If fit a 1 piece shaft you'll probably void insurance as the split shift was fitted to supply part of a crumple zone. Ask insurance company before completing this modification
Binned mine, put a single piece shaft in, 5 years later no dramas
My territory seems to have the same issue. 85 km/h seems to be where the vibration is most noticeable. I tried taking the weight off the rear CV bolts and the vibration is 90-95% gone. Probably worth messing around with various weights and seeing what makes a difference.
Exactly right - check out the video tomorrow!
G'day Sean ...I had the 2003 BA Fairmont Ghia ...That tailshaft vibration drove me insane to the point that I got rid of the car with that as the primary reason . Other issues too including the sat nav and ICC , Great engine though .. My old AU ll is as smooth as butter in that regard as is my 2008 FG XR6 ... Neither have diff bush issues either like BA/BF seem too .. Beats the band but I still love the BA's generally ..just won't own one again any time soon .
The next video tomorrow might be interesting for you to check out... it could potentially be the way your old car could have been fixed!
Trying to do the same with my mk2 ba turbo, im now getting a swaying in the rear like im towing a caravan, can drive u nuts trying to iron it all out
Hi Shaun you didn't mention whether they tried to correct the centre support bearing bush issue you found with your cameras.
It seemed like you were on your way to solving the vibration all yourself.
Were the staff courteous and sympathetic or one of those workshops where the staff look like they're judging you every second like many are like?
5:30 Wacol Station Rd level crossing. I wouldn't be too concerned about the second set of tracks on the southern side of the crossing. The tracks are not used by regular suburban EMUs. It's a ballast/works siding. Most likely used at night, and slow speed shunting of works trains into the ballast yard. The crossing has caught me out a few times. You are waiting for the traffic to clear the roundabout, to either on to the east bound on-ramp for the Ipswich Motorway. Or, wanting to get onto the bridge to go southbound on Progress Rd.
Figured one of them must have been not in regular use - still scared me for a brief second there!
Love how your voice over sounds like dr suess
Hahaha, nobody has ever said that.
Just recently got my NA BF XR6 and had to spend a grand on deferred maintenance (brakes, coils, plugs, filters, oils, etc) and there's still some sort of noise from the rear, not the bushings or suspensions according to my mechanic and not dangerous. So I've decided to accept 95% and live with it unless something goes wrong.
And tell me that 24.3 litres per 100K is off, thats well off the charts, you'd be living at the servo :)
My xr8 only does 16-19 ltrs per 100 around town
Well, the weights are gone now...
"Hi Shannon,
Unfortunately all the weights are obsolete and no longer available from Ford.
I would suggest looking aftermarket.
Kind regards,
Jefferson Ford Parts"
Hey Mate, love the video. Where abouts in Brisbane did you take the car to for the Driveshaft repair?
Driveline Services Australia in Acacia Ridge 👍
@@MotoringBoxTV thanks very much, I didn't expect you to reply so soon. Take care.
What a epic intro, Hans zimmer spec
Cheers mate, had a bit of fun with that one.
Steve Jones.......I am currently chasing a rumble in my BA ..like others here ive had a new tailshaft ,checked twice by supplier even watched as they checked it for out of balance..My list in 12 months is New Centre bearing..New bushes through out diff cradle..New Suspension Blades and bushes,New tyres ,New discs and Shocks...And the rumble still persists after 102klm mark..nightmare to drive on 110klm freeways...Am so over this car lol...
my ba station wagon has the problem bad. but it's still getting me to work every day. And i bought it dirt cheap.had a few fords. My favourites were my dads old au11 xr8 and au11 Fairmont ghia. I think AUs are better. my advice for a cheap car that will make you smile every day= buy an alfa romeo 159. comfortable, beautiful, premium sound, almost enough power, great for Aussie roads, less than 10grand. I miss my old one.
I have heard good things about Alfas - funnily enough there was a 159 wagon I saw a few weeks back going cheap that looked great.
Ah the BA vibration... They need to be balanced ON the vehicle. It's the only way. Sad but true, and very few people have the gear to do it... Look around..
i agree needs to be balanced under load
I think Shaun's trial and error proposal with the weights is the go then.
If the stereo is on, and you're not holding the gearknob, do you feel it? Like this still seems like a very minor thing on a 20y.o car that was always known to do it.
them little clip on weights will fix it.
i had one of my cars done, an them weights were left off, an theres a vibration in the rear end, but it doesnt bother me
What garage fixed it for you?
dumping rubbish on someone else's hard waste collection is illegal! I have notified the police and they are on the way! Just kidding I do it all the time😂 Hope you get the old girl fixed mate!
It's like Minority Report except they focus on mundane crimes which happened 15 years ago.
Would converting to a one piece tail shaft help? Seems the centre bearing leads to a lot of issues.
Reason Ford didnt go single piece was the IRS would wreck havoc on the driveline lacking support to the gearbox. Ive heard of dudes trying singles on falcon irs cars and when pushed hard, they've smashed the tail of the gearbox / auto off and the whole lot has fallin on the road.
Ah yes. Now to wait for the next thing to break. The joys of cars.
I think one of the yolks isnt square in the shaft
If they've fully balanced the shaft and the centre bearing and rear joint are fine, then it's not the shaft. Diff bushes, rear axles, something else is causing your problem.
Great video and glad it's finally fixed... I have a friend looking to buy an N/A BA/BF Falcon, what do you think of the purchase?
Also, when is your new car coming around?
M8 just get an AU
@@lancecooper4646 Haha, might have to steer him towards an AU lol
@@victorpeirce4753 Yep, he bought it very cheap too and it's great value for money
find an FG instead, anything that's not 5 speed. mk2
@@TheJacobAnwyl Yeah, he's thinking FG now...
My 2007 territory TX vibrates like he'll when I break and stop at traffic lights, my side mirrors quiver as does the steering wheel, if I turn the wheel 3/4 left or right the shuddering quitens down a bit, but within moments the heavy rapid shuddering returns, so I put it in neutral and the vibrations stop but once I'm back into drive it returns, so as I excellerate away from a standing position the resonation noise goes away, can anyone advise me as to what this shuddering noise is when the cars stationary but in drive with my foot on the breaks untill the traffic lights change to go!
Wow, seems the bots are having a field day in the comment section Mate 🤣 Glad the car was sorted.
Put polyurethane round center bearing even territories have a vibration at 80 to 100?should fix it.
Seems Ford never fixed it. My BF has a hard vibration in the drivetrain too...at 200km/h. I didn't have the nerve to push through it to see if it went away.
😂😂
In mexico of course aye bro
hey sean your tailshaft is not in the right spot you should have maked your diff to your weights so you know where it does
The price you pay for RWD, no such issues in my FWD, but I understeer off the road just going to the supermarket. Lol.
They're certainly a lot more simple thats for sure.
I don't know who your taking it to but they sound dodgy asf
what is it like at 70kph and take it out of gear? does it still hav the whip?
Definitely isn't rev dependent - clutch in and drop the engine to idle and the vibration didn't change
@@MotoringBoxTV i like the video you took of the tail shaft... hav you tried to x2 or x5 the speed of the footage . that can reveal alot .. as police use those tactic to see ppl behaviour . just a thought
@@keithsmith8250 That sounds counter intuitive. Interesting idea. So is police speeding up footage to notice a pattern.
Who is the specialist you seen I need to see them for mine
I wouldn't be taking it to them. Seems they still haven't really sorted it
My next job (WTF)
This was not the video I was expecting but congratulations nonetheless. I thought you would be wrenching and fixing it yourself. But I guess you dont have the machines
single piece and be done with it imo
your rego expires soon mate
Bro's stalking lol
Where did you get your Triple dash gauge holder from?? .. had my ba xr6t 22 years now & No vibration with mine so far :) & no major issues what so ever .
It's one from 2007-ish unfortunately that's been unavailable for over a decade.
@@MotoringBoxTV Oh' ok.. a guy I was talking to today pointed me towards a company that makes some, but there $299.00 is way overpriced for what it is.. you'd think it was 24 carrot gold plated instead of plastic. must be somewhere i can find some cheaper, I'll keep looking. i have a twin set but want oil pressure gauge as well, not just boost & voltage
Thanks for the reply, tho.