SEGA Should Stop Delisting Sonic Games
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 พ.ย. 2024
- In this video, I'll be talking of a phenomenon SEGA has unleashed with the release of Sonic Origins, at the detriment of fan remaster Sonic 3: Angel Island Revisited, it being the delisting of legacy releases. I'll also be describing how such a phenomenon could impact Sonic Generations, should the release of SONIC X SHADOW GENERATIONS result in the delisting of its legacy version.
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The most screwed up part of these delistings is that they delisted the games on 360 and PS3, platforms where Sonic Origins isn't even available. It's really terrible.
That makes no fucking sense💀
Tbf the 360 versions of the classic games do work on modern Xbox consoles, but PS3 literally has no excuse.
That’s because they’re encouraging you to go Next Gen and play on the consoles that actually do have it.
Regardless, Sonic 1, 2, and 3&K are all in the Ultimate Genesis Collection, and CD is still available on the store, so you can still play them on the PS3.
AINT EVEN NO SONIC 1 2 OR 3 ON PS4
Or 5
This has to be a kick in the teeth for the publisher. This basically encourages piracy, if you can even call it that, since there's no official source to buy the original versions.
The saddest part of SEGA delisting Sonics 1, 2, 3K, and CD is that they actually responded to fans begging them not to do it, basically saying "too bad, so sad."
Hopefully, they won't repeat such a response with the Generations fans.
@@giovannidotgenwell, they didn’t delist colors when colors ultimate came out
As far as I know, The mainline version of Sonic Colours was never distributed outside of the Nintendo Wii. The Wii Shop Channel was discontinued long before the release of Sonic Colours Ultimate.
...I guess technically SEGA didn't :P
@@giovannidotgen
The Wii Shop Channel never hosted full Wii games on it's service. It only featured Virtual Console titles as well as WiiWare
Get origins dude
So basically if you wanna play the og version you either gotta own it on console me or emulate… delisting games should be a crime honestly.
Yeah, the gaming industry has become too trigger-happy with delisting games.
I mean you could play the original inside origins
You just cant modify it and mess with it like before
50€ for one 30 year old game is wild tho@@GAMM_SAGE
@@GAMM_SAGE You can't. The "Classic" mode in Origins is still the remakes but with the lives counter enabled and the aspect ratio changed to 4:3. Any gameplay differences in the whitehead versions still apply to Classic mode including the Spin Dash still being enabled in Sonic 1.
Is this basically Sega trying to disappoint everyone?
Kind of seems that way.
They have been disappointing people since the Saturn era on its launch outside of Japan.
Solution: every new copy of sonic x shadow generations on steam comes with and original copy of the game
That would be the ideal solution, especially if SEGA felt pressured to delist the original release
@@giovannidotgen they could even do the same with orgins for those who already own the game and those who buy it
Like how the steam release of Doom and Doom 2 had an option to play the original dos exe?
@lego174 yeah but also the file of the original game
I agree. Those who don't have the legacy version, include it for those who buy Sonic x Shadow Generation.
1-2 years ago I wanted to renew my PS plus account to play SA2 again and when I got it, I found Sega took most old sonic games off PS now. I was so mad I streamed Crash 4 for a year
I made sure to buy SA1 and SA2 on my PS3 the moment rumors of rereleases started up last year. I was not going to miss them like I did Sonic 1 and Sonic 2 on PS3. I'll never own those and never be able to get the achievements on my account.
This is more like just Sony not paying for licenses.
Why couldn’t Sega just include the roms in the Sonic origins of port as a bonus, just like what nightdive does with most of their remasters?
exactly! you'd think "Classic" mode to be an emulated version of each game featured
but nope! we get fake classic mode
@@giovannidotgen Which is literally just the Retro Engine aka the Widescreen versions....in 4:3 instead.
I find it annoying when SEGA makes a reference then they delist the original, so then you can't get it legally. Like sonic origins they delisted the original like wtf? (BTW get sonic 1 forever, sonic 2 absolute and sonic cd miracle edition and sonic 3 air instead cuz I think they are better and better, free.)
They are far better in every way
I might prefer Sonic Origins just a bit more over Sonic 3 A.I.R. Theres a bunch of weird quirks that are in A.I.R. that aren't in Origins. I hate how I have to wait for my cooldown to go down until I can turn super again, I hate how the bubbles don't have an active hitbox and just have invincivility when their spikes are open, or how op the springs are when pressed. I also prefer the physics in Origins a lot better because they feel wayyyy more fluid. that said.
I still Play Sonic 3 A.I.R. Because it allows mod support, I can play it on my phone, has a remastered soundtrack, All of Sonics abilities are available without cheatcodes. Sonic 3 A.I.R. is a FANTASIC Fan Remaster
@@nintony2994 I agree with your opinion
Idk how to get sonic cd miracle edition
@@Therealestfisttalker you need the decomplation scripts for it to work (the 1.3.2) verson :).
I remember when Dark souls remastered came out, I had my digital copy of the 360 version in my xbox account, I bought it for 5$, then when the remaster came to xbox one I kid you not I booted the game and it told me "Do you own this game?" then it deleted it from my hardware and it was removed from store, they stole it from me an many others, they wanted us to buy the remaster for full price once again, I just went to my pc and pirated it, installed mods and had a much better time with it than with the original and the remaster.
Its happening all over again.
"Piracy is almost always a service problem and not a pricing problem" - Gabe Newell
4:37 Flashkit programmer md is pretty cheap, depends on which you buy like i got a cheaper one for 20 euros and dumping and writing roms works fine.
And on this topic, it's unfortunate but Sega probably doesn't care about projects like air. Even if they are pretty supportive about fans (or they just completely forgot about it lmao) but it seems they just want people to buy origins cause thats more profit for them. Incase of shadow generations it's the same, they just want consumers to buy the newest and more expensive version.
The thing is, these games were the only way to play the series on multiple platforms such as Mac and PS3 where Sonic Origins isn't even available even if I payed $40 for it on steam. It's like they're encouraging piracy at this point. Screw you SEGA.
Grave? Its FATAL
Great video! Your voice sounds amazing. Can’t wait to see more from you in the future!
They should also stop censoring
For clarification, it isn't just origins and generations with Sega being involved when it comes delisting their sonic games starting from Shadow the Hedgehog to Sonic and the Black Knight and Sonic 4, if you were to talk about Sega delisting sonic games in general, I feel like your video could've gone on to a topic about Sega's history in general with delisting Sonic games. Sega's habit of delisting of sonic games general was sparked from the release of Sonic 06, which I feel should be fact or a thing that most Sonic fans should understand.
To be fair, at least that was done with a good purpose, delisting bad and mediocre Sonic games in order to improve brand value, and decrease exposure of bad Sonic games. Now they are delisting good, even their best games.
I own Sonic's Ultimate Genesis Collection, Dreamcast Collection (includes Sonic Adventure, Crazy Taxi, SEGA Bass Fishing, and Space Channel 5 Part 2), and Sonic Generations on Xbox 360. If they delisted these games, then I can say SEGA should offer the fanbase legal ROMs for the original version of the games on their website for free or at $20.
What baffles me is that the legacy Steam versions of the games doubled as legal ROMs, for the affordable price of 5$ each.
And they took that away because of Origins, offering no equivalent alternative.
@@giovannidotgenEven though SEGA really should have. Especially since on the Xbox 360, they released collections of SEGA games like Dreamcast Collection that features Sonic Adventure, Crazy Taxi, SEGA Bass Fishing, and Space Channel 5 Part 2. Sonic's Ultimate Genesis Collection includes 40 SEGA Genesis games, 5 SEGA Arcade games, and 5 SEGA Master System games and if you ask Sonic 1, Sonic 2, Sonic 3, Sonic & Knuckles, Sonic Spinball, Dr. Robotnik's Mean Bean Machine, and Sonic 3D Blast are on this collection too along with other Genesis classics. Sonic Generations is a really good game and SEGA should keep both versions up for fans to choose like how Bethesda did for DOOM 3 as you can get the 2004 version of DOOM 3 or you can get DOOM 3: BFG Edition from 2012.
I think whats funny is that though Sonic CD is delisted on pretty much everything, the PS3 still has it up for purchase (In the US at least)
YARR MATEY YOU KNOW WHAT WE'VE GOTTA DO NOW.
IT'S TIME FOR SOME PLUNDERING, SOME SWASHBUCKLING AND SOME SCURVY.
THATS RIGHT MATEY 🗣️🗣️🗣️🗣️🗣️🗣️
Vanilla sonic generations modding is dying 😭😭😭...
Frontiers has a larger modding scene than Generations. Guaranteed free the mods will get ported
Honestly, while yes I would like to say that it's bad in the sake of preservation, I understand why they are doing this. They are doing this because they would consider the newer ports to be the definitive ones, since they have added content and probably less hardware problems on newer machines, which Generations particularly seems to struggle with.
Generations will 100% be recompiled, as there is no way they're going to keep the version of Direct3D that Generations uses (due to it causing performance issues on modern systems, Generations requires a mod that replaces it to run at 60FPS on Steam Deck and doesn't support any aspect ratios other than 4:3 and 16:9. While I haven't tested it on my main PC, I have a console PC with a R7 3800X boost clocks disabled + RX 480 8GB, basically PS5 CPU with PS4 Pro GPU, and even that couldn't do locked 60fps)
Also apparently the textures shown in the trailers are actually lower res than the textures in the original game
There's also glitches in some of the modern stages I found. The main one is chemical plant act 2 when you try go for the second crane, it will throw you backwards and kill you for some reason... Honestly the only reason I'm giving the remaster a chance
I believe that Sonic Generations X Shadow will be good due to it being the same with a new side story
Start a hashtag or something and drill it into the fanbase so something is done.
Honestly all SEGA has to do to fix this issue is include legacy games with their re-releases. For example: If you buy Sonic Origins, you should be able to get the legacy roms as a bonus in the game files. If you buy Sonic X Shadow Generations, you should also get the original Generations bundled with it as a free bonus tied to your Steam account. This might not be particularly convenient for customers since the price barrier to entry would be rising, but at least there'd still be a legal way to obtain these older games without having to go through shady resellers.
that still doesn't solve the sonic 3 issues since sonic 3 hasn't been re-released since 2011 because of legal issues surrounding the music, unfortunately.
After "Sonic Origins (Plus*)" was released in physical form, I became a former OG "Sonic" fan. Overall, the 2D collection is fine, but ultimately a disappointment for longtime classic hardcore fans. That was the beginning of the complete downfall of Sega and Sonic Team on trust from (former) OG "Sonic" fans in terms of doing things right with real passion. "Sonic Superstars" cemented the complete downfall of Sega and Sonic Team on trust from (former) OG "Sonic" fans overall. Their reputation on being untrustworthy from (former) hardcore "Sonic" fans (classic and modern) is well deserved.
I currently have no faith or hope in Sega and Sonic Team doing anything right nowadays. It's going to take a heck of a lot more than a simple remaster of the supposed high quality that is "Sonic Generations" to get them back in my good grace again, especially after they failed to accurately represent the mainline 2D sprite "Sonic" games (including "Sonic Mania (Plus)"). Yeah, I'm not in a forgiving mood after the absolute mess (otherwise, mediocrity; quantity over quality) that was "Sonic Superstars" (critically speaking, Arzest's weakest work by far, excluding the absolute train wreck that was "Balan Wonderworld").
"Sonic Origins (Ultrafix)" is available. If a cracked version of "Sonic Origins (Plus*)" (via "Sonic Origins (Ultrafix)") becomes available one day, I'll download that 2D collection. For now, I'll settle for the alternative definitive mainline 2D sprite "Sonic" games with "Sonic Forever", "Sonic CD Restored", "Sonic 2 Absolute", and "Sonic 3 A.I.R.".
you at least gonna see the sonic movies?
@@DamnZtar I had a fine time watching the 2020 film. I was considering seeing the rest afterwards. But after what they did, no way. I would much rather watch "The Super Mario Bros. Movie" and its sequel(s) and forget that anything modern along with "Sonic Superstars" in their original forms (outside of the mainline 2D pixel "Sonic" games) ever existed. Hardcore and passionate fans (classic and modern) understand the point of the blue blur and make improvement mods that are better than the companies themselves anyway.
@@William5000000 wait, you didn’t watch the sequel to the 2020 film?
@@DamnZtar Nope. And I don't plan on it either. This is what happens when they become greedy and stop caring about quality in general.
@@William5000000 but wasn't the sequel more like a sonic movie since the first one focused on humans more?
Physical media cannot get delisted. Availability is THE key part of preservation, and physical is the way to get it.
I know three games came with no data on the disc, but over 10,000 have been delisted from several consoles stores, and more will follow.
My shiny new copy of Daytona USA for Dreamcast is great, but the only reason I didn't get the Xbox 360 version is because digital versions of Daytona are gone for good.
Those who bring up disc rot as a means of shunning physical media as a whole are falling for the corporations "own nothing" future they complain about.
@@The_Prizessin_der_Verurteilung you can still pick up the digital versions on PS3, most of the Sega games that aren't Sonic were not delisted at all. I need to get Jet Set Radio before that's gone on PS3 as well, picked it up on 360 right before it got delisted.
Not to mention that Xbox 360 market store is gonna be shut down at July 29 this year including Sonic Generations digital version and Sonic unleashed digital version with all dlc and Sonic adventure games as well oh and sonic 4 btw this is why physical always better
those games will still be available for purchase since they're backwards compatible. that is, if sega doesn't delist them themselves.
@@blankfacesodaboi8629 Not only are they on the modern xbox stores because they are backward compatible, but sonic adventure 1 also got a physical release with the dreamcast collection, which included it with crazy taxi, sega bass fishing, and (the non-backwards compatible) space channel 5 part 2
I still have my hopes up that all the delisted Sonic Games from the PS store will come back one day.
I’m pretty sure generations is already delisted. I checked steam and it’s not there. You can only get the original generations within some sonic generations collection for 20 dollars. Which is cheaper than sonic X shadow generations. It’s just you cannot get the game without the casino night dlc anymore.
if you want to play without the casino night DLC, just uninstall it. it's still a DLC like normal.
You can find it under the DLC section below NOTES and ACHIEVEMENTS and above SCREENSHOTS
Click on "Manage my 1 DLC"
Uncheck the INSTALL checkbox and close the window, that'll uninstall the DLC
I don't know where i got my sonic & knuckles steam rom from but i have all secrets in sonic 3 air
And i now have 0 achievements so i deleted the gane
If SEGA was nice, they would Delist the original Sonic Generation, HOWEVER those who don't have Sonic Generation on their Steam Library and purchase Sonic x Shadow Generation will Also be given the Legacy Sonic Generation for free to download and play.
That way the legacy of the original Sonic Generation can live on and continue to enjoy the modding community, and Sega will still get people to buy their new game. Its a win I feel.
They legit just want you to buy sonic origins which is fine by me but due to the fact sega delisted their old sonic games, literally is dumb
They are selling you a remaster of sonic 3 and 1 and 2 and knuckles and it is supposedly the definitive version if so... why remove the old games? On steam? Like bro its the definitive version so fuck it. Sega shouldn't have delisted their old games because literally they are destroying the best way to get sonic roms legally.
Next thing I know they will delete sonic adventure 1 and 2 for their supposed definitive version of those 2 games..
"SEGA Should Stop Delisting Sonic Games." I agree. I don't Trust SEGA much like I used to.
Im not that concern because the generations part doesnt look any different, so probably only the modloader thing will need an update, and most mod will work without a problem, dont forget that both lost world forces and frontiers has mod working loaders!
That's why certain websites that preserve those type of lost media are necessary, because if it wasn't for that, basically nobody else would be able to play Sonic 3 AIR besides the ones who bought S3&K on steam. And to be honest, Sonic origins remaster of S3&K fucking sucks.
actualy sonic 3 air doesnt need the sonic 3 steam copy it just claims it needs it when in reality you can just download the sonic 3 and knuckles rom and put it on the sonic 3 air folder
I mean, yeah. Me saying otherwise was an error, for I had written and recorded the script before even viewing the error. But yes, you can use any unmodified Sonic 3 & Knuckles ROM
the main reason why they did it is specifically BECAUSE of sonic 3 most likely. they haven't delisted sonic generations yet, meanwhile they delisted sonic 1 2 3 and cd long before the game came out. They want a version of sonic 3 that won't get them sued to re-release.
SEGA is gonna to follow in Nintendo footsteps
Yea this choice they made is bull shit
NOTICE
While I have been relatively lax on pro-piracy comments from the audience (they do pose an interesting case study, I have to admit), please do not explicitly reference websites or methods to pirate games in the comments sections of my channel. Comments referencing such will be removed.
It's important to note that this channel does not condone piracy. At the time of writing, I am one of the folks running the Sonic Hacking Contest, and SEGA has been generous enough to allow its operations for over two decades. Although not likely, I do not wish to pose a threat to the SHC over me openly encouraging piracy. I hope you understand my position.
I was wondering if you heard someone is attempting to crack denuvo on sonic origins. The modding scene will explode if sega is forced to remove denuvo from the actual release with this development.
There is no guarantee SEGA will remove Denuvo in direct response to a crack release. Save for Sonic Mania, all titles in the franchise retain some form of 3rd party DRM regardless of crack status.
@@timbo303official9impossible due to the new laws in Japan, which are the same reason Street Fighter's newest release has DRM, I'm sure even Sega doesn't like this
I just hope one day the legal issues regarding the Jackson music in Sonic 3 get resolved so we can get a 1:1 rerelease of Sonic 3 again!
I wanna see a remaster of Secret Rings and Black Knight
:5:30 there is also the mega collection pc port and iirc it’s cheaper than that
The particular problem with Sonic Mega Collection is the extraction process, for dumping the Sonic Mega Collection disc is actually insufficient, as the ROMs are compressed. One would need to extract them from the game's RAM as it is running.
Furthermore, even if you did extract the ROMs from the Mega Collection's RAM, the uncompressed ROMs are byte-swapped, which makes retrieval slightly extra complicated, and will require specialized tools to convert into something that can be run within a conventional Mega Drive emulator.
It is certainly possible, and probably cheaper than even the Steam CD keys, but the setup process is exceedingly complicated for the average end user.
The alternative to all this would be a utility that, given a Sonic Mega Collection disc, would somehow find and decompress the ROMs, while also byte-swapping them. And, as far as I know, no such tool exists.
A thread on the Sonic Retro forums goes further in detail on the subject:
forums.sonicretro.org/index.php?threads/extracting-roms-from-mega-collection-plus-pc.13514/
If SEGA would have made the original classic games unavailable for purchase on their own but you could obtain them by buying Sonic Origin than I would still be angry that they require you to pay so much more even if you want to play the original games, that they sold for much cheaper, but I would have accepted that. They want the remake to sell and having the originals as an alternative option would be an obstacle.
Even if you had to play them through Sonic Origin (with the ROMs included) it would at least give us that.
But no. They decided to delist the original games entirely, I can't play them through their emulator and I can't obtain the original ROMs in a legitimate way.
I used to love how they handled their Sega Mega Drive Collection, the emulator was cool (at least in concept, although it is OK in practice, nothing terrible) and the prices were cheap. You could even gain the original ROMs completely legally and use them however you see fit. This was a heaven for retrogaming.
I still can't handle how terrible this decision is. I shall never buy Origin, not only it has its fair share of problems, but I don't want to play a remake, even with a fake "classic" mode. I want to play the original games and now there is no legal way to do it unless you were fortunate enough to buy them before hand.
Good thing i got mega collection hurhuhrur
Sadly is the industry standard, look at Beyond good and evil. the old versions of Metro 2033 Hitman 1 and 2 reboot. all pre GTA 4 games. the list goes on and on.
The FlashKit Programmer MD from Krikzz is even cheaper. Very handy gadget.
Look at this point 🦆 this crap i am pirating this shit I ain't doing all that crap to play a 90s game
Sega is stupid for delisting the classic games. I got the retrode2 from over 10 years ago to play my Sega Genesis legally and thankfully I've bought Sonic The Hedgehog 1,2,3 and CD on Steam 😊
I don't think Sega was stupid for the delisting the classic games I think the real stupid part was not letting you play the original games on classic mode in Sonic Origins. I'm not a game designer but wouldn't it be easier to let you play the original roms on classic mode?🤷♀
Well, Sonic games were pulled from PS Now/ PS Plus for a while now, so it’s even more likely to happen on pc.
You know, you don’t really need the steam port of Sonic 3 and Knuckles to play Sonic 3 air. Since it’s just an emulated rom, you can just use a rom, whatever you were getting the rom from the original cartridge or downloading it from the internet.
You are correct, that was a script error, which was written before I had even read the S3AIR error message for when the ROM is missing, which reinforces your very point. I apologize.
@@giovannidotgen I’m just saying, no need to apologize
So now Nintendo and devs are a problem, Nintendo is copyright striking and sending cease and desist letters to TH-camrs, music yt channels and fan made game developers that use their ip which is Mario in any of their content, plus they also get rid of their old games and consoles to force you to buy a switch and their shitty online subscription just for you to play like 5 old games of theirs that nobody asked for. Now dega is delisting old sonic games now?! What’s next they start banning sonic fan games, God forbid because that’s the last thing we’d want considering sonic’s game lineup in recent years has been dog shit including frontiers
yeah man like i could have gotten s3 for a few bucks and sonic 3 air but now i gotta pirate the old rom to get sonic 3 air? oh nah
Downloading roms aren’t exactly illegal, they’re actually a grey area
Either way SEGA won't receive your money when buying old games from second hand market then it's kinda pointless to buy the game. At least if you have mindset to support devs or something like that.
However, even if the original game was available for purchase from SEGA then most likely in one way or another way those devs who actually made the game doesn't work under SEGA anymore.
Good thing I bought sonic generations before it was delisted on steam
its not delisted yet though
@@CaptoadI know
I mean, they've only delisted the classic titles as of today (1, CD and 2). Sonic Generations' original / legacy port is still available on Steam for purchase, as well as SxSG. And the SEGA MD&G Classics ports aren't even that good. Yeah, accesibility is appreciated, but I believe this "stop delisting games"-thing is not as people claim it to be. Sonic 1 Forever, Sonic 2 Absolute, Sonic CD Miracle and Sonic 3 A.I.R. are still available for those not willing to pay for the Origins collection, it's not like SEGA or Sonic Team had DMCA'd them. Also, Sonic 1, CD and 2 made with RetroEngine are still available on the Play Store :P
Here's the thing
If the segment about it did not imply it, the SEGA MD&G Classics are not ports.
They are ROMs you can collect from the game's folder, and run on any Mega Drive emulator/real hardware as you please. All SEGA MD&G is, in reality, is a (questionable) Mega Drive emulator.
I also do go on to mention the availability of the mobile remakes, through which you can obtain S1 Forever, S2 Absolute, and SCD Miracle Edition, yes.
However, I spent a whole segment explaining how legally playing S3AIR is made significantly harder, because of SEGA delisting the ROM you actually need to play the very game. Which doesn't sit right with me, or those dedicated to the community's fan projects.
@@giovannidotgen Oh, I get that, I didn't mean my comment about your whole video, but I meant it for the whole take about delistings in generals. I find people to be really catastrophistic about it when it's not that bad for me tbh
And of course, piriting is still an option. If companies doesn't let you get their games legally, then piracy should do
@@IconPNG I represent the Sonic Hacking Contest. My ass can't be caught encouraging or endorsing piracy. But I'm sure folks can read along the lines my disappointment in knowing that the legal options suck so bad, and that's because SEGA took away the best one there was available.
Comments from the pro-piracy folks watching this video make for an interesting case study: the fact that they say this stuff is a problem SEGA genuinely worsened by making getting the S3K ROM harder.
Also, to some extent, people really do over-dramatize the extent of delistings, even going as far as saying that "modding will be gone", which, objectively, is wrong. Modding doesn't vanish. It just makes it harder to get into for those new.
Which is still a problem worth talking about, to me, else I wouldn't have made this video.
@@giovannidotgen You have a great point. Also, didn't know you represented SHC, sorry for putting you indirectly on this position. As for me, I rather buy any game the legal way and own a copy of a game I want, than pirate it. But yeah, SEGA (and companies which have really old games buried like Nintendo) should step up with this kind of things, availablity and preservation of games and ports are a must. I just got tired of reading the delisting take in a catastrophistic manner from users all around the world.
Let’s not forget that Michael Jackson owns 90% of segas sonic 3 and knuckles sound tracks and the whole of Sonys music library, Sony didn’t like that so they had MJ killed
Another reason why piracy is good and very much legal
True!
It's a 30 year game, why should Sega care at this point?
I think Sega should relist the Steam versions since Sonic Origins is no longer new.
OG Sonic Generations, 06 and Unleashed will disappear from XBox very soon.
OG generations and unleashed are on the modern xbox storefront while 06 is not. 06 actually used to be delisted for a while and quite ironically, it got relisted when sega delisted the classic games on the 360 storefront
Honestly… it’s so annoying and frustrating to me that Sega is delisting all of the games.
I just realised Sonic Generations got delisted, and I’m NOT gonna buy Sonic X Shadow Generations, cuz I know DAMN well that it’s gonna suck so much, if Origins somehow failed, even though this was SOOOO easy to not ruin, then Sonic X Shadow will too.
Mind you, as of the time of me writing, Sonic Generations was not yet delisted, and can still be bought.
However, if precedent is to be listened... chances that the game gets delisted are quite high.
@@giovannidotgen The original Sonic Generations is "technically" delisted on Steam already, since it's now bundled with the Casino Night DLC as "Sonic Generations Collection", but that's pretty much it. Still cheaper than the upcoming rerelease though.
Sonic Generations has NOT been delisted on PS3 as of today. If you have a PS3, GRAB IT. Accessing the PS3 store is a little harder these days as Sony requires some extra steps, but it is still available on that platform. Just look up guides on how to get your PS3 online in 2024, (it is 100 percent official, Sony is still operating the PS3 store at this time) and remember to get at least 25 dollars in gift cards so you can add funds to your console to purchase the game (Adding funds via credit or debit is no longer supported, and adding them via Sony's website is a nightmare if you dont have a payment method already set up)
360 version of Sonic generations just got nuked off the Xbox storefront
I'm aware. I hope I don't have to make a part 2 to this video!
@giovannidotgen looks like it's not getting permanently removed after all, though it seems like Segas gonna stick the old version in a legacy collection bundle for $60
@@waspennator beats not having it available!
#SEGASTOPDELISTINGGAMES
SPREAD THE HASHTAG
8:12
i'm pretty sure pirated copies do work with mod loaders though, just pirate the steam version, very easy task
i could use mods on pirated Mania, SA2 (i just did that btw) and Gens, so i'm not sure if you pulled that claim outta your ass
While I'm aware that some mod loaders do not take pirated versions of games into account, some Hedgehog engine-based mod loaders have protections that require the user to own a legitimate copy of the game being modded.
I'm lead to believe that HedgeModManager, the current standard for Hedgehog Engine-based games, followed suit in implementing these protections, though, as I've never felt the need to pirate Sonic Generations, I can not verify that claim; rather, I can only assume such based on previous mod loaders and the community's opposing view on piracy.
As for non-Hedgehog Engine games, I can not confirm or deny anything on that regard.
@@giovannidotgenFrontiers also had Denuvo and it has an active modding scene. You're confusing Denuvo DRM and Denuvo Anti-Cheat. Sega only uses the basic DRM which just checks legitimacy of the copy once per 3 months. Do some research next time
@@RandomAnimeGamer While I can recognize Sonic Frontiers' Steam page specifically as only listing "Denuvo" as its 3rd-party DRM, as said in another comment of mine, SXSG very explicitly mentions "Denuvo Anti-tamper" being included with its release.
After reviewing previous games' listings, the listing of one or the other appears to be inconsistent across the franchise.
If they are, as you say, using the standard version of Denuvo, then SEGA (or Steam, not sure who's in the wrong for these matters) should absolutely correct the listing for SXSG, as to not mislead readers.
@@giovannidotgen This has been the case for all of the Steam Persona games, Sonic Mania / Origins / Frontiers, and probably more I'm forgetting. It's all basic online checks prior to launching. When away from home, if it complains, I just turn on my hotspot for like 3 minutes and launch the game, and done. The fact you haven't gone ahead to verify this information leads me to believe there's insufficient research put into this video.
omg giovanni from rhs server
I just don't get it. SEGA is like... the only ones that do this...
If you buy DOOM 3, it comes with the original Doom 1 and 2 files. Doom Eternal does too. Why? Why not???
Why can't Sega just do this too?
its because of sonic 3. they finally have a version of sonic 3 that they can re-release without getting the ire of the michael jackson estate, since the issues arose in 2011... after they last re-released sonic 3. They want to wash michael jackson off the game so that they, well, can re-release it again and again like sonic 1 and 2.
Sonic 3 AIR's physics aren't as on the money as Origins. It's too bad there's not a mod to add all the extra customization options found in AIR in the Origins version.
I have no idea why they didn't make the classic version in Origins just play the ROM. It makes no sense whatsoever.
Oh well, I bought the ROMs back when they were first put on Steam so meh. Plus I'd rather play the Origins version anyway. The coins to retry special stages and lack of lives just makes it far less frustrating.
De-listing things turns it into abandonware. If everything was right in the world then abandonware would effectively be copyright free. It would be considered fair use to do whatever you want with it because clearly the copyright owner doesn't care or they wouldn't have abandoned it.
there's unlimited lives in S3air and a mod that retrys special stages
The reason you liked Sonic Origins physics more is because Sonic is actually faster in Origins Sonic 3 air uses the code and physics from the original rom.
Sonic is dead beyond revival
Well at least it wasn't as bad as the 2010s 😭😭😭
Yeah no i don't think sega is stupid to pull this off twice, _especially_ considering how _heavy_ the modding community is for generations, it would not matter the quality of sonic x shadow generations, amazing or shite, {most likely the ladder considering it's blind squirrel again working on actual generations and you _know_ what happened with colors ultimate} you take away the old version NONE of the mods will work anymore.
Honestly i would have just the episode shadow a separate dlc and just upgraded all three versions... except the ps3 version, that can stay ps5.
That way all mod compatibility remains intact _and_ you get actual new content for a 20 year old game.
Not to mention, right before the launch window of these games is the SAGE EXPO and SHC 2024, where the rumor is the encouragement is generations mods this year, using it as base to either create new or something creative. could you even _imagine_ the backlash from both groups should they do something scummy like this a MONTH LATER
wait hold on
i thought the generations remaster was in house, where is it known that blind squirrel is behind it?
otherwise, hard agree with you: were they to delist the game, it would cause quite the reaction
@@giovannidotgensega in house specifically working on the _shadow campaign_
Someone a while back leaked the print codes of the physical case and on one of the lines, is blind squirrel
@@tsyumamatsuthehavenofguard32 It's already been confirmed that the only studio making this remaster is Sonic Team
@@ContextuallyDeContextualized
STILL.
THESE DAMN FOOLS PULLED THE PLUG
ADACHI
Piracy is a party!😁
Well there's only one thing we can do now and that's to sell the Seven Seas with me brother. 🗿
Average emulation W
You're confusing Denuvo DRM and Denuvo Anti-Cheat. They're not adding Anti-Cheat, they're adding DRM. Mods will be fine, they did the same thing for frontiers.
There's a lot wrong with your claim:
1) I never mentioned any "Denuvo Anti-Cheat": I was referring to Denuvo Anti-Tamper within the video.
2) The Steam page for SXSG straight up lists the so called "Denuvo DRM" as "Denuvo Anti-Tamper".
3) Denuvo Anti-Tamper is specifically designed to combat reverse engineering, among other things, as claimed by the folks at Irdeto themselves in the web page for Denuvo Anti-Tamper
4) Not once have I stated in the video that modding will be impossible on the newer release. Rather, the same modding methodologies employed by the 2011 release of Sonic Generations will be harder to carry over, and the same degree of support can not be guaranteed. Sure, Sonic Frontiers and other games that started off with Denuvo built-in may still have a thriving modding scene, but with Anti-Tamper very explicitly getting in the way of reverse engineering, it's bound to make things harder and more limited.
@@giovannidotgen Hedgehog Mod Manager supports Sonic Frontiers, which has had Denuvo for a long time. You did state that the modding scene is in danger due to Denuvo Anti-Tamper, which is objectively false. If you're referring to the Denuvo DRM, it's not made to prevent reverse-engineering, it's made to prevent piracy. If you're referring to the Denuvo Anti-Cheat (which IS specifically designed to prevent reverse engineering and cheating), that's another story. Frontiers modding is a lot more developed than Generations modding in less time, and they were able to access the new playable characters during DLC2 times, which means it is both not "more difficult" nor "more limited".
So yes, you are confusing Denuvo DRM and Denuvo Anti-Cheat. And yes, mods will be fine with it involved. And yes, your video does claim it's a problem for modding, which it isn't.
@@RandomAnimeGamer I will concede that, within the video, I have implied that the "Denuvo" DRM and the "Denuvo Anti-Tamper" DRM were the same thing, which are not. On those grounds, I will accept being told that I was confused about Denuvo, and recognize my error.
However, do consider that Sonic Frontiers is not listed to feature "Denuvo Anti-tamper", rather, "Denuvo", and that the modding scene for Sonic Frontiers started out with Denuvo included at launch in some form.
Sonic Generations' modding scene, however, never had to deal with either Denuvo, nor Denuvo Anti-tamper, at least until now. Which means that some modding practices employed may not have been developed in mind with neither DRM solution, leaving an incognito as to whether compatibility, especially for the code-altering mods, will be guaranteed. And if the listing of Denuvo Anti-tamper is accurate, then it significantly raises the likelihood of such, making my statement, in regards to Sonic Generations modding becoming more difficult and more limited, accurate, when compared to modding of the 2011 release.
Furthermore, I have never once given blame to Denuvo in any way for the endangerment of modding as it stands now. The inclusion of Denuvo Anti-tamper will only complicate modding on the 2024 release. What I do claim to be a danger to Sonic Generations' modding scene as it stands now will be the potential delisting of the 2011 release of Sonic Generations, which will make legal access to the game's mods significantly harder, on a similar degree of those willing to access Sonic 3: Angel Island Revisited legally.
A point you haven't addressed with clarity is whether or not there is difference in functionality between games listed as "Denuvo" powered, and games listed as "Denuvo Anti-tamper" powered. If you yourself can confirm, without the shadow of a doubt, that functionality matches the former, regardless of listing, then I will gladly commend your level of research on the subject, and recognize my mistake, considering, however, the fact that the mistake was a fault not of my own, but of an improper listing on the publishers' end.
I do not believe I should analyze the game's functionality to tell whether the claims made by SEGA, when listing the games on Steam, are legitimate. Rather, I believe SEGA should not mislead their customers by making improper statements that only go on to damage their games' perception beyond what's necessary, to those viewing their listings.
@@giovannidotgen The problem with that mindset is that people can easily "port" the games. Denuvo is not an issue with this, but the game moving to HE2 poses additional work. It's not impossible, not even hard, but it will take a little bit to learn the difference.
I know this because I took part in the modding discourse in Naruto Ultimate Ninja Storm (which has absolutely no mod manager, mind you), and people were able to create scripts that convert the structure of compiled hex code from the old games' formats to Storm 4's format easily. So even data from Storm 1's OG files, or mods of Storm 3, can be converted to a Storm 4 format 1:1 with accuracy.
On the topic of the Steam Store page listing, trusting that is like trusting a politician. Some games don't even list Denuvo to start, and then list it on launch-day. Some games list Denuvo, and before launch remove it. That's why it's important to notice patterns first. Capcom has an absolute reputation of removing Denuvo within 6 months of release, so you know it will be removed by that time in all their future games. Recently they started replacing Denuvo with Enigma, so now we know 6 months will have Denuvo removed and Enigma added. Similarly, we can look at SEGA's patterns to know that they'll always keep Denuvo (with Mania being a notable exception) and keep it uninstrusive. Fun fact, when Mania had a patch, people claimed that it was fixed because Denuvo was removed. That very patch didn't remove Denuvo, but made it more strict actually, requiring more often activations online. The game later had Denuvo removed, but I find it interesting that people attributed Denuvo to the various PC porting issues so much, that when Denuvo was made stricter yet they patched bugs, people thought Denuvo was removed.
Lastly, on the topic of "legal access to the old games' mods", that's also not correct. Mods can be downloaded independent of the game. Someone can easily download an OG Generations mod just fine, whether or not they own the OG game. When Generations gets de-listed, it won't be de-listed from other websites like Gamebanana or Nexus. This is absolutely overblown, and once people figure out how to convert OG Generations mods to HE2's format, those mods will easily re-appear.
@@RandomAnimeGamer On the topic of HE2, according to some experienced Sonic Generations modders, there is a chance the Sonic Generations portion of SxSG may still be running under HE1 wrapped within HE2. I am not certain if that will actually simplify modding, but a lot of tools and code-based mods will require rewriting, and Sonic Generations running HE2 would only make it harder. The chance rewrites will happen, as far as the legacy mods go, is unlikely. Then again, if the Sonic Generations modding scene does pull off a compatibility layer that will ensure functionality for the 2024 version of Sonic Generations, I'll absolutely be impressed!
On the topic of legal access of old games' mods, while I do recognize that obtaining the mods is bound to remain possible to all, running them will be made harder for those who have never owned the 2011 version of Sonic Generations after a delisting.
Assuming someone does not wish to pirate Sonic Generations past its potential delisting, they will not be able to purchase the game required to properly execute the mods, which does impede access. Assuming someone does pirate the 2011 version of Sonic Generations, the latest mod loaders will give you a hard time actually running stuff on it, and the community will most likely not aid you in trying.
I can recognize your arguments on DRM listings. If anything, I'm quite disappointed that accuracy on these matters is not pressured as much as it should be, and I will compliment you on the degree of intel you have on the matter.
Thanks for pointing out the obvious.
Nah, I'd pirate
Well if you wanna play 3 air just get a rom online
I just pirated the rom
so ur saying sega should just give up?
SEGA RUINED SONIC
Sega is following Nintendo too hard and trying to disappoint everyone
Sega's been disappointing everyone long before it became a repeated trend with Nintendo.
@@SunkythePootis well ya got a point there😂. I’m not going to be the one to say everything past Sonic 06 has been bad, but let’s just say that Sonic and Sega as whole isn’t the same force as it was in the 90s
And nothing of value was lost. If most of these games weren't shitty, they wouldn't get delisted in the first place.
Just buy the superior versions dude. Who cares
Nintendo does it all the time and Sega should take down every single fan game since they count as pirated software and they make money out it the follow the Nintendo way Sega
gi-goat-vannidotgen