Did Sonic Lost World SUCK?! Well...
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Well folks, it's finally time, isn't it? It's been almost an entire year since I covered Sonic Generations on PS3 and 360. After that long gap, it's finally time to continue where we left off with Sonic Team's first entry on the Nintendo Wii U, Sonic Lost World, which released in 2013. Today, we shall examine why I fundamentally don't enjoy Sonic Lost World, and what the impact of that was. Setting up for the rest of the year's video roster where we will cover the Sonic games that have released since.
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Chapters:
00:00 Intro
01:19 The Recap
03:40 Sonic Lost World
07:33 The Least Appealing 3D Sonic Play Style
13:42 The Most Gimmicky 3D Sonic Game
17:47 Tedium
22:31 The Story
28:15 I Don't Enjoy Sonic Lost World
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#sonic #sonicthehedgehog #soniclostworld - เกม
I've S-ranked every stage in Lost World's time attack mode, and it really exposes the best and worst of the game. Clearing the levels quickly makes them surprisingly more fun; having to beat them without dying makes them...not more fun.
Dying more......
Let me guess… now when you’d said that getting the S-Ranks without dying isn’t fun, are you specifically talking about Lava Mountain Act 3 Time Attack? If so, then yes, screw that level’s Time Attack
@@isaiahthechristiangamer8716 That one was an endurance test if I've ever seen one, but there are some other frustrating moments throughout the game. The snowball and owl light levels come to mind first; good luck trying to beat those quickly without dying once!
That doesn't make sense bc in the console version you don't get ranking.
@@Ibalistic_hedge He was mostly mentioning Time Attack mode, since you only get rankings there.
I always loved the parkours idea of Sonic Lost world, parkours and Sonic is a match made in heaven. It's just that Lost world never seems interested in the parkours and just treats it like a side activity like the Wips, rather then the main attraction. The levels rarely make use of Sonic's parkours. Often I feel the level design was never made with Sonic's moveset in mind to begin with, and that's why the game is so stuffed to the brim with gimmicks to distract from the unstable core gameplay. It's one of the reasons I kinda prefer the 3ds version, way more tailored toward the Parkours moves. Altough the 3ds version has it's own issues and is not very good either. Oh well. At least I hear Sonic Frontiers is bringing the Parkours back, so maybe that will finally be it's chance in the sun. We'll see...
Ah yes, that Interview. At the time, I didn't put much thought into Mr. Pontac's statement about not having played the games, i was more curious about whether a Sonic writing bible existed and what it said. I kinda assumed on default that Pontac and Graff were coming in blind. I mean, they were obviously hired to bring in a fresh new take on the character to begin with. My partner Alex immediatly ran with it to the news sites tough, while I was still editing the interview. The interview was meant to be a wacky joke video, a sort of epilogue to me exploring Pontac's writing history before. But with all the drama that broke out from the reveal, the more zany nature of the interview suddenly became unapproperiate and made it feel like it was more of a deliberate attack on Mr. Pontac. Very awkward moment that kinda haunts me to this day. Oh well, Pontac and Graff kept on writing for 5 more years after, so I'm glad I didn't get them into serious trouble.
Even if I wasn't particularly happy with 5 more years of Pontaffian writing, but that's my problem.
It's so frustrating that Sonic Team always borrows the wrong thing when they start stealing ideas from other IP's.
Stealing from GTA? Great, plenty of valuable lessons to learn about freedom, creativity in world buiilding and mission design, effort and eye for deta...Or guns. Yeah, just put guns in there and make the atmosphere miserable and gray.
Borrowing from Mario? Great. Go steal the physics system and agility of Mario from Mario Odyssee, love to see that in a Sonic game.
But nooo. Instead, they just copy Mario's weakest parts, bland story, bland levels, bland everything. Meh.
And now they're taking ideas from open world games. In particular, that most of them have very generic and bland locations and toned down dull background music.
Great, thanks Sonic Team, that was indeed my biggest issue with your latest games, the locations and music were too interesting, glad you make them more boring. Thanks.
One interesting note about the Lost Hex, I don't recall where it was mentioned, the Japanese version or earlier in development.
Either way, Sonic Team referred to Lost Hex as the world of illusions, with the implication that the Zeti can change the nature of the land trough illusions.
That probably explains why there's random candy levels and casino levels in the middle of nowhere, it's the Zeti tapping into Sonic and Tails subconsious or something.
Regardless of intent, this concept was never brought up in the finished game so it's probably not canon anymore.
Probably took it out because it was too complex for a Mario style game. And then they repurposed the concept of illusions with Infinite and the Phantom Ruby in Forces, of course.
To this day, I wonder if the Metropolis level from Sonic Forces was actually meant for Sonic Lost world. Considering it doesn't look like an Eggman run city at all, and also has that Hexigon theme going for it. Then again, it doesn't really fit the simplicity of Sonic Lost World's artstyle, so I'm probably wrong.
To me, the most frustrating part of the story is that it has 7 good stories in one.
I LIKE the story beats in the game. Eggman struggling with creatures beyond his control, a mysterious never seen before continent, Tails and Eggman being rivals, Tails turning into a robot.
All great story beats I love to see, in a vacuum. Problem is, none of these plotbeats have a full Setup- complications- Pay off story structure.
All the story beats are either established and then peeter out with no resolution, or come out of nowhere for a dramatic reveal that isn't earned.
See, I don't mind at all that Tails is having trouble with working with Eggman despite cooperating before. It's an interesting story dynamic.
And the writers could have easily written a scenerio where the circumstances in which they work with Eggman, Eggman's behaviour and Sonic's attitude could have been different enough that Tails was fully justified in being concerned. They just didn't. They didn't set the scenerio up, nor did they pay it off with a proper conclusion. We just get the half-way point conflict of the scenerio out of nowhere and then it goes nowhere.
The Zeti being enslaved and forced to do Eggman's will without their consent is an interesting story setup, but then it goes nowhere, the Zeti just continue being villains and they aren't even particularly focused on Eggman for their revenge, still continuing to go after Sonic.
You'd think Zavok the master manipulator would have played up the fact he was enslaved against his will to try and get Sonic on his side, and then betray him later.
But nope.
Eggman is now angry and veangence focused on the Zeti. Instead of Eggman going "LOL, I'M THE BAD GUY ANYWAY, LOL" and just being a generic final boss, what if Eggman never betrayed Sonic, but is just so consumed by anger at the Zeti that he goes too far in trying to destroy them, and the final boss is Sonic fighting Eggman to save the Zeti? Or something like that. Would utilized the plotbeats established way more. Probably too dark tough. But hey, the game ESTABLISHED the whole "Eggman is a complicated guy" concept earlier on, so this would have been a neat if dark reprise of that idea.
As it is now, the story just doesn't have any rhytm to it. Conflicts are established, then never elobarotated on. We see the dramatic highpoint of a storybeat that was never established, then immediatly fades away. Then we see a resolution where Sonic learns his lesson of a story concept that was never elaborated on. All the plotbeats are vaguely connected so it almost feels like they are connected if you don't really pay attention, but it just never feels satisfying in any way.
3DS Version is good if you get good at it. Even the levels that people complain about (Sky Road and that Aquatic level with the drill) are tolerable and actually fun if you get good at the - admittedly twitchy controls.
i aint reading all that jesus christ
Sonic can run up buildings in super speed, why would he need to climb of jump then?
Spark the electric jester 3 bought back the running on wall feature
@@jlev1028 same
I'm not against Sonic having a slower speed option but he should have a walk button instead of a run button
He's not exactly slow, just can't go faster.
Werehog Sonic had a run button
@@xscythe67 For the wherehog it kinda made sense since it was combat focused
@@xscythe67
When people mention things they want carried over from Unleashed, anything related to Werehog doesn't usually come up.
I had the exact same idea..! 😊
Sonic team is taking the wrong route because of fans always talking about speed !
Sonic should have different paces . Different way to play the game and freedom. Not just speed speed poeed and automation 😥
_Precise platforming
_Exploration
_Hidden secret
_Physics pinball tricks
_And finally the possibility to speed run the game when you're skilled enough!
No baby mode for casual (that will say the level design is trash ANYWAY )
So don't try to not frustrate them , it's their fault. They have to learn how to play the game.
_A walk button would have been cool for more precision in slower paced platforming.
Unleashed had a crouch/crouch walk/crawl button. There are a lot of ideas to explore , but Sonic Team is giving him a skll tree for combat in frontiers 🤦♂
(Sorry for my English)
Collecting the RED Rings in this game was a pain in the ass. That snowball level and that casino pinball level gives me PTSD to this day😅
Swear and then if you played the DS version those special stages were by far the worst of the series
I agree with both of you, but I don't hate lost world 3DS, but I don't like it ether.
I collected the rings in the snowball level first to get it out of the way
I was still burned out from the Red Rings in Sonic Colors (Super Sonic was such a pain to unlock there) when I played this game. Can we admit that this was literally Sonic Colors 2? I hated 2010s Sonic so much!
@@WaterKirby1994 What about Sonic Generations, All Stars Racing Transform, and Maina? Those are good games.
the biggest praise i can give Lost World is the soundtrack. it’s massively underrated and a joy to listen to, i love it a lot. lots of jazzy and moody pieces, it’s wonderful
To be fair just about every sonic game has a good soundtrack
*Never played this game but I will check out the soundtrack.*
The thing that bugs me the most about the story is that WHY IS KNUCKLES NOT HELPING SONIC AND TAILS!? It was fine in Colours because it was assumed that he was guarding the master emerald but here, Knuckles isn’t even doing that. He’s just goofing around with Amy protecting the dumb animals.
It really bugs me, especially since Knuckles and Amy were around since the 16-bit era. It went to show how SEGA took the "focus on Sonic and Tails" criticism too literally. On the inverse, that criticism could've been fixed by not having Knuckles in this at all, since the Master Emerald is not imperative to the story. I'm not saying every single character needs to appear all the time, but at least leave room for acknowledgement.
My headcannon is Knuckles had yet to get the Master Emerald back from Rouge after she swiped it in Sonic Rivals 2 and he’s too embarrassed to say anything
@@skibot9974 People hated the Emerald hunting in Adventure 2, so Sega doesn't know what too with Knuckles now??
Why he was in the game in first place?
@@misterboogcn1288 Fanservice??????
One thing I find kinda funny about Lost World is it's implementation of "alternate paths." I remember hearing back in the day how "no no guys it's great this game has alternate paths like the classic games!" And then it's just 3 ten second straight lines on a tube. Not to mention, why would anyone want to take multiple paths when none of them are fun?
May as well ask why people would play the game at all
Sending hate or death threats is not okay,but it's also clear that Pontaff were a poor choice for the English localization of the 2010's Sonic games. And while someone doesn't have to be a mega fan of something,if it's an established IP with a long history, the least they can do is properly research the characters/world/lore justice to respect what came before. You can make a new spin on an IP, while still maintaining the spirit of why people liked it. Pontaff,didn't do that. Whether that's down to Sega interference or Pontaff not caring to put in the effort is something we won't know,but it's most likely a little of both.
I lowkey still believe on some level P&G were hired by Sega to be a "loose investment", at best if their stories are loved by many then Sega can take credit for hiring them and at worst if their stories are hated by many well Sega have a scapegoat.
The bottom line is a company thought it was a good idea to hire employees that had little knowledge of the actual franchise they'll be working on and that makes zero business sense (ofc Sega making questionable business decisions is nothing new tho, it's the main reason why they no longer make consoles afterall).
And with all the toxicity P&G got (e.g death threats) I doubt it encouraged them to truly immerse themselves into the Sonic franchise (outside work). The whole debacle is pretty much another black spot on Sonic's past.
@@lynxfresh5214 It's crazy to me that they're making and still making the same kind of mistakes with Sonic that made them leave the console market. Just goes to show how much Sega cares about the Sonic franchise game-wise when they hired Pontaff.Also,how mismanaged it's been forever. They haven't learned a damn thing. Tbf, I can't know what restrictions Pontaff had,but I don't buy it was to the extent where they had to write the characters in inconsistent ways. That part is on them for not caring enough to do the research whatever reasons they had.
@@lynxfresh5214 They were hired because of nepotism. Pontac's cousin landed him a job at Sega. He admitted it in interview with Roger van der Weide. It wasn't some grand plan.
On paper they looked fine, after all, they were experienced writers. However Sonic is so specific, that experienced writers are not enough.
I agree. I don't like their writings at all and I am happy to see them replaced by someone who I feel will do good in the upcoming game (PLEASE don't let me be proven wrong) But either way death threats are not okay. I dislike they're writing for what they did in terms of story and characters especially to a series I love but I have nothing against them as people and I wish more people could do that even if I get it's hard to divorce people from their work.
Yep
Something that also kills the game for me is the total lack of transitions between 2D and 3D. In unleashed, colors, and generations, you get a full camera shift as you go between 2D and 3D sections. But in Lost world the screen just fades to black and then when it fades back in you're just in a different area.
OK, this game... I bought this back in 2014 (3DS Version). My first experience of this was actually the free Demo. Those Windy Hill Acts were honestly fun. I say the 3DS would be better if the pure 2D level design wasn't messy. As for the 3D design, just make Wisp Color Powers optional and definetely less enemy hunting. Avoid Frozen Factory 3 like it is Covid. I also have no idea how to get the last Chaos Emerald The boy that posted this comment actually beat the first 6 Special Stages.
It's in frozen factory act 1, I think you need to get the B rank or higher
Agreed
Getting all the chaos emeralds would only end up breaking your spine or somehow not end up like a circus act in public. :(
The 3DS version has objectively superior controls, but after 1-4 the level design just nosedives in quality. And by nosedives, I mean "protect and roll around a snowball for 30 minutes" being a less frustrating example.
@@mythosinfinite6736 I thought that level couldn't get any worse, but then I got to the hard mode. That might be the worst Sonic level I've ever played
Regardless on what people think of Lost World I'm just glad to finally see your modern opinion on this game which pretty much kicked off your channel to where it is today, it may of been 10 months but the wait was definitely worth it.
I'm sorry but I can't read all of that
@@chilidogs2985 bro has the attention span of a tiktoker toddler ☠️
@@chilidogs2985sorry can't read all that
Sonic Lost World is like that one cousin in your family that you love unconditionally, but they really missed the mark on the family photo/
So scrappy doo?
It's like Sonic Xtreme finally came out. In one form or another.
Finally someone that gets it, it's not a Galaxy clone, it's like saying Galaxy copied Ratchet and Clank moon levels
Ehhh sonic xtreme has a fish eyed lens in a grid tiled game, this game isn’t. Its more like floating cylinders.
@@HyperComet369 Conceptually it's similar, there can be differences, that's what similar means. In one from or another, then there's all the other iterations of Xtreme, they all different but called Xtreme. Lost World is a similar thing.
@@Xegethra that's exactly what I was going to say Sonic Lost World is like Sonic Xtreme
Sonic Xtreme is different LMAO!!!
Do you ever thought about doing a review of Sonic fan games? I know you said eventually you will do review of Sonic P-06 once silver stages are done, But there are more Sonic fangames out there than Sonic P-06. Like Sonic GT, infamous Sonic omens, and Sonic triple trouble 16 bit game? All these fan-games released not too long ago.
Also Sonic Holograph, if/when that becomes a game.
...I love that too damn much.
Sonic Omens is weird. It's a game that starts up suprisingly good with it's first couple of levels but then just gets more and more god-awful the more you play. The voice acting is atrociously bad too, especially with Shadow who's somehow worse than generations-forces shadow. Plus the story is an overly-edgy joke that puts Shadow the Hedgehog to shame and tries to incorporate lore from Sonic X? Which isn't even canon? Not to mention all the contraversy like one of the 3D modelers sexualizing Maria, (who is 12) trying desperately to make the game paid in one way or another, (despite being a fan game they don't own the IP to) the main dev generally being a prick with an extreme superiority complex, and other random nonsense.
I'd love to see him tackle the Triple Trouble remake, that could be passed as a sequel to 3, 4, or Mania if it was official
Omens already has too much attention for what it's worth and there's nothing else to talk about it, mostly everyone's criticisms are the same:
Starts promising but decreases in quality as it goes on, the voice acting is bad, the story feels like a fever dream, the adventure and boost formulas aren't well mixed, the new abilities don't add much to the gameplay, etc.
I don't think J's perspective on it would bring something new to the table besides all the same issues and controversies over and over again
@@thomasthecoolkid7228
As someone who became a _hololive_ fan because of _Sonic,_ I also would love to see someone out there adapt CyclonicCircuit's _Sonic Holograph_ into a video game. Both the _Sonic_ and _hololive_ communities are very talented, as they are able to develop fan games like _Sonic Robo Blast 2,_ _Sonic Triple Trouble 16-Bit,_ _Sonic and the Fallen Star,_ and _HoloCure._ Even the documents for _Sonic Holograph_ present the story as more of a concept for a game!
The only thing that I see that stands in the way of a game adaptation for _Sonic Holograph_ is the community. I don't know if the _Sonic_ community can tolerate the idea of the _Sonic_ cast teaming up with the _hololive_ cast.
The thing about Wisps coming back after Colors was explained in Sonic Runners, where they mentioned that they really liked Sonic's world at the end of Colors and that they'd like to help him. Kinda weird to put such an important detail on a mobile game... but it's something
(Great video btw)
What happened to the chaos emeralds then?
@@erikbihari3625 Sonic remembered he had them the whole time after he collected every Red Star Ring
Guess it’s still weird they are in capsules, but I supposed that’s a gameplay necessity.
@@DrakesCove ok, but what about forces?
@@JsReviews Yeah, that only makes sense in gameplay... it also saves them time by reusing the games assets from Colors/Generations
It's so sad how Sonic really has lost his way. He was never supposed to copy Mario, he's supposed to be the anti mario. Sonic was the cool action hero for kids, while Mario was the silly, happy, and laid back game series.
Sega: "No one likes Zavok...let's put him in every game!"
Unlike Zavok, Bowser is actually a cool and competent villain and also a good father. Zavok is just worse Bowser, there is literally no rebuttal. Whereas Bowser has a funny personality as seen in the RPGs of a powerful tyrant as well as a lovable goof with a superiority complex and being a loving supportive father of 8.
At least in IDW, Zavok is actually a competent and somewhat charismatic villain, too bad he'll forever be labelled as "discount Bowser" regardless whose writing him.
Either way the Zeti will always be ugly AF imo (and not in an ironic way) so I won't miss them if they never appear in another mainline Sonic game.
@Jaretco
Actually, starting with Mario&Luigi Paper Jam, the Koopalings have been talking and expressing personality in official Mario games. This peaked in the Bowser Jr’s Journey storyline which stars them and Bowser Jr as well as Kamek and happens parallel to the events of Bowser’s Inside Story. It was a surprisingly heartwarming story with a great sense of humor.
So yeah, the Deadly Six are inferior in literally every conceivable way, even writing.
I just think that inherently Sonic was always going to struggle with the transition to 3D. While Mario has some speed, his focus has always been more on jumping. Sonic is the inverse of that. And moving fast in 3D is fucking hard. Think about how people still hold F-Zero GX in high regard even though that game is hard as balls. Sonic is supposed to be for people of all skills levels. Sonic Adventure was like 50/50 in good game design and shit. The fact that Sega keeps having these on-rail portions kinda proves that Sonic is a difficult thing to do in 3D. Hell, even in 2D, levels in Sonic can suuuuuuuuuck (just look at the 1st game).
Having said all that, I think Sonic world kinda fails at being a good Sonic game but it’s an okay platformer.
@@leeartlee915 going fast in video games in general is hard but 2d sonic is even harder to go fast in without dying tbh. Also the difficulty in sonic should not be in how hard it is to beat the level but how hard it is to master. That's why sa2 is my favorite game IMO is because it's fun to learn how to master it. (Yes even the knuckles levels). Just saying if you want an easy platformer play mario.
Koopalings aren’t his kids
I love your rant on the game’s story on the video “Why stories in Modern Sonic don’t work.” It’s still funny to me to this day.
Also, I’ve played Sonic and All-Stars Racing: Transformed and it’s such a fun game. Try it.
Sonic lost world didn’t have any promise to it so it’s the second worst
Sonic forces is the worst sonic story ever
I thought that video was kind of bad. J used to sort of have this 'Mr. Enter' style of reviewing, which was very informal mixed with a lack of self awareness, and the level of emotion made it quite the cringe-inducing watch.
I'm not fond of Lost World's story either, but agreeing with someone isn't me saying their point of view is polished.
Transformed is one of the best arcade racing games out there no 🧢
@@ShockwaveFPSStudios yes. And also arcade.
it's way better than mario kart imo
27:33 still doesn't change the fact that hiring ppl who know NOTHING about Sonic to write for sonic was a bad idea. Now that we have Ian Flynn, Sonic is already acting more like himself again in Frontiers
So basically Sonic will become more generic than ever, from a man with a pedigree of throwing in every basic action cliche in the book and popularizing a Sonic recolor with an even worse fanbase than Shadow's? I'm sorry, but as someone who wants to see Sonic attempt a more serious narrative at some point, Ian Flynn ain't it chief.
Actually a lot of people have turned on Flynn for how he’s written Sonic in the IDW continuity. I feel soem of the complaints are overblown but in IDW they gave Sonic an explicit no kill rule he never had in the games and makes no effort to even imprison his enemies after they’re beaten just letting them go
@@skibot9974 What's so wrong with Sonic having a no killing rule? Do people honestly want to see Sonic murdering his enemies? That doesn't do sound right to me!
@@thatitalianlameguy2235 I think it's safe to say that the Biolizard and Solaris are both very different to Surge. If Sonic were to straight up kill her then that would definitely be out of character!
@@bowmaj8666 for me the issue isn’t so much the fact he doenst kill them but the fact he doenst detain them. Surge was fine given she got away and Sonic wasn’t in a position to pursue her but letting Metal Sonic, Eggman, and the Deadly Six go at various points…
Also Sonic has killed or shown a willingness to kill more than the ones previously listed. He killed Erazor Jinn by tossing the lamp into Lava, was willing to kill King Arthur well before finding out it was an illusion. Finally his interactions Infinite make it clear he was willing to kill him if he got the chance. In Forces Sonic retorted Infinite’s claim of making Sonic an epitaph with “you should make it out to the person who will need it”
I think Lost World is the purest definition of confused. I think it has interesting, new ideas like the parkour, the tubular level design, and the addition of a run button. However, they are also have a bunch of other play styles that changed the gameplay so frequently that none of them really get fleshed out all that much. I mean, this game has pipe levels, 2D sections, mach-speed sections, stealth sections, auto scroll levels, labyrinth puzzle's, the wisps, and the God forbidden snowball and there is no thematic cohesion between them.
It's because LW doesn't feel like a Sonic game, but instead a game with Sonic in it.
@@lks19 The Wii U is too under powered for a Generations style game.
@@orangeslash1667 Um... It isn't. The Wii U is less powerful than the Xbox One and PS4, sure, but it's comparable to the 360 and PS3, which Generations was on. Plus, the Wii (which is definitely less powerful than the Wii U) ran Colors and the Wii version of Unleashed just fine, which were both boost style games like Generations. Sure, scaled back a bit and with weaker graphics, but there is no reason that they couldn't have made a boost-style game exclusively for the Wii U. They just decided not to.
@@kylejones8289 You know how people wanted Super Sonic to be playable in 3d levels????? Lost World was made for that reason. Sonic Team felt that Super Sonic was too fast in Sonic Adventure, making it kinda difficult to platform. That's not an issue with Lost World because the game has a run button. The problem is you have collect the red rings. I know Takashi Iizuka loves Pin Ball, but why did you place a red ring at the TOP OF A PIN BALL CABNET😤😤😤😤😤?????????
@@orangeslash1667 no it almost certainly could have run Generations. Wii U was about ps3 power
As a big Mario fan, I can very confidently say this game tried to appeal to a very, VERY shallow version of Mario. The “Mario Mold” as I like to call it.
Basic world presentation that barely goes beyond what the first NSMB game set.
Enemies from the first couple games and nothing else.
Koopalings as bosses because we can’t be bothered or don’t have time to think of new and unique bosses.
Barely any story besides “Stop bad guy, save day.”
SEGA wanted a Mario-Like game but didn’t want to put in the effort to dig deeper and figure out why the Mario series is so beloved, and why the Mario Mold monotony of around 2011-2016 is… not necessarily hated but not looked back upon fondly(aside from 3D World, Mario Kart 8, and the M&L games from this time).
They wanted something quick and easy, so they just glanced at Mario and saw all the bland shit it was doing in this era and thought to themselves “Y’know we should make our mascot that was literally made to rival Mario into Mario that’ll work out just fine!”
Instead of adopting Mario’s much more consistent, excellent game design of the best of his 3D games, they looked at how well the NSMB games were selling and just wanted that instead of anything with actual substance.
It’s kinda sad honestly.
Edit: I wanna clarify that the NSMB series, while pretty samey across all the games and bland in their presentation, are all good 2D Mario games. I kinda sounded like I didn’t like them much at all, but rest-assured NSMBDS is one of my favorite Mario games.
But that also kinda proves my point. SEGA wanted something that LOOKED like a Mario game, but didn’t put in the effort to make it DESIGNED like one. If it was designed like one, Lost World could have been a fun and unique one-off take on Sonic to hold fans over until the next true Sonic game.
What it is now is just a poor man’s Galaxy without any of the nuance that made that game as beloved as it is.
Agreed. The Mario series has a lot of charm to it, contrary to what many people say. It's a shame that Sonic tried imitating the blander aspects of Mario.
Even with some of the Mario games that have some pushback now (mainly the New Super Mario Bros. series) those had generally excellent level design and tight controls, even if the games were basically identical to each other and had really generic world themes. Lost World just took the really formulaic trappings (generic world themes, repetitive bosses) and didn't port over the quality controls or level design, which was why anyone liked the NSMB games in the first place. Without those, you just have a really generic platforming game, which is all Lost World really feels like.
@@jaretco6423 wait what
Uh… I don’t recall much or any Mario inspiration in 06, but now I’m curious. Please elaborate if you can
@@jaretco6423 I’m sorry but there’s no way that the idea of a hero rescuing a princess from her kidnappers started with Super Mario Brothers.
nah this is just sonic x treme if released in 2013
I'm replaying it right now, and... it's actually a lot more fun than I thought. It's nowhere near as bad as people make it out to be. Zavok and Zazz are all pretty cool too, and I think we should see more of them. I also think the game has a pretty underrated soundtrack. I have my own problems with it, but in my opinion, it's quite alright. I agree with a lot of your criticisms, though.
You should check out the IDW comics. The Deadly Six are at their peak in the comics.
@@marchedgie6838 OH yeah, I have checked them out. The Zeti were awesome there. Really wish they were like that in the games.
We already see too much of zavok and zazz, despite there being better characters to explore - characters that didn't get proper focus in more than a decade. zavok is a generic bowser rip-off with badly defined motive that's more boring than black doom and zazz is just "crazy" nothing more nothing less.
@@sezunemizuhana3870 Zavok has only been in two Sonic games and one spin-off. And Zazz has literally been in one spin-off. Zavok's looks pretty cool that fits within the Sonic universe. I want them brought back as well written villains with cool abilities.
@@sezunemizuhana3870 Christ you weren't joking when you said Zavok looked like a bootleg Bowser, like seriously wtf, how I have I not noticed before?
Lost World is weird for me. I don't really hate it now and I do find myself coming back to it every now and then but, this is just a weird experimental game that's like an awkward fusion of Mario and Sonic in so many ways. There are highlights with some stages like Honey Comb Highway, Sea Bottom Segue, most of the Tropical Coast acts and hell I even like the first acts of Silent Forest and Frozen Factory (unpopular opinion I know). The game is super unfocused, the Wisps are shoe-horned in, stage gimmicks can feel like they have no rhyme or reason to them (snowball), Boss fights are painfully underwhelming (and also feel just random visually), and the writing is hands down the worst in the series but...I can't fully hate the game? I don't know...game's a weird mess.
That's pretty much how I feel. Fun can be had with this game, but overall, I just don't have an interest in at overall. I'd give it a D if I were grading. It doesn't lose points because it's terrible, but because it's just not a great package. But it's okay enough to get a passing grade.
@@JsReviews Yeah, it's kind of an ultimate 6/10 to me.
Tails not wanting to work with Eggman makes total sense and Sonic is an idiot for wanting to team up with him.
Eggman in this scenario has absolutely nothing to offer them. He has no insider information that'll make turning off the energy extractor easier, he does not possess some mighty weapon to use against the Zeti, he is dead weight. The one use for him the story comes up with is that he can shut off the energy extractor, something Tails says he'd be capable of doing himself. While it might seem wise to keep Eggman around as a backup, in case Tails in indisposed, this falls apart on further reflection. Eggman is not some neutral party they can fall back on in a pinch, he's a lunatic who once attempted to blow up a city, who DID blow up the moon, and who has lied to advance his goals numerous times. Teaming up with Eggman is not only pointless, it's counterproductive. And Tails recognizes this, asking why Sonic is trusting Eggman when he could turn off the energy extractor himself. But we don't even get an answer as to why Sonic has shut off his brain and become a Robotnik simp.
And what ends up happening? Tails is, as he said he would be, totally capable of shutting off the energy extractor on his own. And he does. Eggman, meanwhile, betrays them and potentially could have made all their work for nothing. Good going Sonic, you fucking idiot.
@sonic 1995 They have certainly not worked together 'plenty' of times. There is exactly one example of Sonic and Tails working together with Eggman, at the Space Colony ARK, when they were on a time crunch and NOT working with him could spell planetary destruction. Eggman also had his own task to perform, he didn't just say he could do something Tails was going to do anyway. Tails and Sonic have, on occasion, let Eggman stand around in their general vicinity while the day is saved (Heroes, 06, Shadow the Hedgehog), all situations where there was an immediate threat and separating themselves from Eggman would be a waste of time. This is the full and complete history of them working with Eggman, a frankly short and dismal list. As it should be, Robotnik makes Bin Laden look like Ghandi.
Tails accusing Sonic of trusting Eggman is something I've always attributed to Sonic's actions rather than words. He brings Eggman along for seemingly no benefit and refuses to reconsider. Something that backfires when the Eggster turns on them. Come on, Sonic, even Knuckles has learned this lesson by now.
As for it being Eggman's machine, yeah it is, but why should they take the guy to deactivate it? Tails is confident he can do it, something that checks out, since he apparently reprogrammed a supercomputer with detergent once or something.
Your last line is 'Why shouldn't they let him help?' I would say because he's obviously going to betray him, like he did with Knuckles in S&K, or Unleashed's opening cutscene when he pretended he'd 'turned over a new leaf.' Or, you know, in Lost World. Additionally, Robotnik is a lunatic terrorist with no morals. His list of crimes include: attempting to blow up a city in Tails' story in Sonic Adventure, trying to murder Sonic numerous times, including one case where he actually thought he had successfully killed him and reacted the way I do when I squish a spider. He holds Amy hostage, he blows up the moon, in the very game we're talking about he's been sucking the earth dry of energy. WHY would you work with this guy unless you absolutely have to? (The answer is Pontac and Graff don't give a shit about my precious blue hedgehog games.)
TL;DR: Eggman has a history of trickery and evil, Tails can perform the only function he would be useful for in this scenario, and when they worked with him before the situation was very different.
@sonic 1995 First off: “Sonic never trusted Eggman from the start.” SOURCE???? He certainly seemed to trust the guy when he brought him along on a mission that would decide the fate of the world. You can judge the bonds of someone’s trust by more than if they literally say, out loud, ‘I trust this person.’ I would say Sonic puts great trust in Tails not to do a barrel roll while he’s balancing on one of the Tornado’s wings, for example. Trust exercises exist for a reason, falling backwards into someone’s arms is a good way to build trust and familiarity; do you think these exercises now don’t work because nobody is saying they trust someone else? Tails is inferring based on Sonic’s actions, something that PEOPLE DO. Even if you headcanon Sonic as expecting betrayal all along, it was still a reasonable assumption on Tails’ part
As for them working together before, are you allergic to nuance or something? Yeah they worked together to stop the Ark from desolating the earth, but this is obviously a different situation. It’s not out of character for Tails to be against working with Eggman in this scenario because in the other scenario the planet might’ve ended without his help, and in this scenario he’s just a tag-along who does nothing and is almost definitely going to stab them in the back! Yeah, of course he’s going to react differently. (I can’t believe I’m actually defending Pontac and Graff’s writing, this took a TURN)
@sonic 1995 I never said Sonic trusted Eggman, the closest I ever said to that was that I understood why Tails said it. The only thing I’ve accused Sonic of is being an idiot, never have I accused him of trusting Eggman.
As for Tails not complaining in one cutscene and then suddenly caring in the next, if you want to make the argument that Lost World has inconsistencies I’m totally with you, I think the game’s writing is frankly awful. It’s the only Sonic game I genuinely dislike. I’m definitely not going to argue that the cutscenes are *well written*. Go off, king, queen, or general monarch, tear the writing of this trash heap apart.
While I personally still love this game, I can respect where you're coming from with your critiques here. Also THANK YOU! The amount of hate Pontaff and Graff were getting was so stupid because SEGA is the ultimate authority on the story of the games, and this was around the time those stupid writing mandates for Sonic started being put into place by SEGA as a result of Ken Penders from the Archie Comics being a huge jackass and suing SEGA and BIOWARE over Sonic Chronicles using ideas he claimed to be his. Pontaff and Graff are great comedy writers as evidenced by their work on MadWorld, and I hate seeing them get so much hate over one thing Pontaff said in an interview that probably wasn't responsible for how his writing in the Sonic games turned out. Criticism is fine in it of itself, but as you said, full blown harassment is just not okay.
From what I seen their comedic chops are on par with joss wheadon. It's very situational humor that needs to be executed well or heroes come off like they don't care what happens!
They still suck at writing even with mandates, end of story.
I’m not a fan of Pontaff and Graff’s writing, but harassment is never ok. It’s another example of why the Sonic fanbase is pathetic.
Not to mention the tone of the stories changed BECAUSE people complained about the stories that came before.
People always like to blame Sega for everything, but at the end of the day all they are really doing is trying to give the fans what they think they want!
Let's not forget that this is fan base where people whine with crap like....
"Urgh, I hate playing as Sonic's stinky friends, get rid of 'em!" So now only Sonic is allowed to be playable!
"Urgh, the stories suck cos they're all edgy and emo! It's just a silly cartoon about talking animals; you can't take that seriously!" So now the stories are light hearted and goofy.
"Urgh, nobody plays Sonic games for the story! It should all be about the gameplay!" And because of that, Sega thinks that they don't have to try as hard in that department.
This is why Sega need to try listening to some constructive criticism for a change. It just feels like overly critical critics, haters and detractors have been dictating what can and can't be in the Sonic series for too damn long, and it just isn't doing the series any favours!
@@bowmaj8666 all those complains i hear mostly from critics
I remember playing this and literally returning this next day for a copy of all stars racing transformed. Best decision I've made.
It's sad to see that the sonic games haven't really improved since then, seeing as some other Sega franchises got the attention and quality they deserved.
Apparently early reviews are saying that Frontiers is actually really good but we'll see.
@@krimsonkatt yeah, it looks like it's gonna suck. Or at least that it isnt real open world. I mean, it's boost gameplay, boost gameplay doesn't work in open world environments.
Ironically if you're talking about Yakuza, Persona, Phantasy Star and Bayonetta those are all franchises where Sega has significantly less creative involvement in compared to Sonic.
I said this before. But Generations should've been the last Sonic game chronically. Not just because it was super good, but it felt like it was Sonic's last adventure and wanting to thank the fans for following the series and ended off the series in an positive way.
@@TheRealBlazingDiamond it's open zone, not open world, Iizuka made this very clear
I know I’ve said it before, but this game and Bowser’s Fury revealed to me that every time Sonic tries to shallowly copy Mario surface level stuff, he flops, but when Mario takes Sonic staples, he comes out looking cool and innovative for stepping out of his comfort zone, on top of a new well designed game like always, it just shows how out of touch Sonic is with himself, and why the 2010s in general were a drag to sit through for my favorite franchises, but it seems this decade has brought a new frontier that might set things right...
So basically.
Safer series takes risks: 👍
Risky series steps back: 👎
Understandable.
“It seems this decade has brought a new frontier that might set things right…” was that pun intentional?
@@IamaPERSON yes
What Sonic stables has Mario ever taken? Bowser's Fury was a Kaiju type thing, which mostly comes from Godzilla.
Rolling into a ball in Odyssey? Samus rolls into a ball, so it could just be from that for all we know.
Mario has never really taken anything from Sonic, but if he did, it probably won't go so well either.
The difference is that Sonic in Lost World wasn't really trying to hide the fact that everything is Mario-theme.
If Mario tried to to do something like that but entirely Sonic-theme without hiding it, it would be the same for him as well.
@@jlev1028 for god’s sake Mario Sunshine is literally Sonic Adventure 2
"but you don't trust Me to do it"
and immediately in the next game, Kate Tails was no more
If Sonic Lost World focused purely and only on the tubular level design and parkour mechanics, this game would be a lot more enjoyable with it not adding in random, stupid gameplay gimmicks that only appear for one level.
Like adventure 1?
Finally a video were explain why they dislike it instead of just saying "it's a mario game"
Also I disagree with the artstyle claim but I can see where you're coming from
(Also its about time someone ecnolaged the amazing soundtrack)
(And I can't wait for the lost world 3ds video)
Calling this a Mario game is an insult to Mario games.
I remember playing this game so much back in 2014, it was such a fun game so with the parkour, the combat. And I remember my friend helping me get all the red rings to get Super Sonic. I have so much nostalgia for this game, and for that reason it’s in my top 5 Sonic games.
Ok
most underrated good sonic game 9/10
It’s such a shame this game didn’t do great. As someone who has never played it, the concept and aesthetics look so cool. The Mario Galaxy-esque level design and parkour mechanics look so intriguing and perfect for Sonic, but it sounds like this needed more polishing. I hope they revisit these mechanics again, but implement physics and controls that make sense.
Man, this is one of the most mixed games I've played imo. I actually really love the concept of a slowed down 3d Sonic more focused on platforming and what not, and there are pieces of Lost World that I really liked. But the bad stuff I remember is reeeeeeeeallly bad. I still think this format has potential, though.
Hey man I've been watching some of your videos for a week or two now, I just wanted to say I really like what you have going on here and decided to subscribe today : )
Fun Fact: Lost World technically created the drop dash
No, Sonic 3 did in a beta build
yeah and people still forget about it
I know you talked about them a small amount in the recap but since you have gone over basically every single sonic game and spin-off, I feel that the full retrospective would be a little incomplete without reviews of Sonic and Sega Allstars Racing, Transformed and Team Sonic Racing.
I just really enjoy your content and would love to see similar reviews to the Sonic Riders trilogy you did for those games.
If you don't wish to do them I respect that and hope you have a nice day :)
8:38 this picture is AMAZING!!!
I got this game for the Nights into Dreams content, a game which I one day hope to see you review!
I was actually very satisfied by the controls of Lost World. Beside the snowball garbage, they're very responsive, at least compared to Forces.
Agreed. I really liked the controls.
They are usually at least consistent, so you can adjust to it. I feel like the lack of momentum really makes that hard though. I've played so many Sonic games, so I expect him to have momentum, so he doesn't respond how I think he should. Though this is somewhat subjective, because some people can probably adjust to the differences quicker than others.
@@thatitalianlameguy2235 i got more colors vibes from forces controls honestly
Looking forward to these Sonic vids. Great way to pass the time while waiting for Frontiers :))
You could check out Sonic older cartoons too. Knuckles is really well depicted in underground for example, he even used a spindash! Also do you think the animation shortcutting inspired knuckles'red electric powers in the movies?
Fun fact, the sound used when dashing as a Crimson Eagle is very similar, if not identical, to the Shadow Rifle from Shadow the Hedgehog.
At the very least, the fanbase is pretty united on one thing:
Sega, PLEASE stop trying to make Zavok/The Deadly Six a recurring thing.
If they were utilized to their full potential, then they would be great.
I really wanted to love Sonic Lost World. But sadly I just wasn't a huge fan. I love the cutscenes, the graphics are pretty, and the voice acting is pretty cool, but I wish they would have handled the parkour gimmicks more better. Maybe someday they can remake it on the switch with a better control scheme I'd be all for that.
Damn! Your videos changed so much! I have been watching you for like 3 years!
The one and only thing I truly love is how Eggman threatens the Zeti. It’s the one memorable cutscenes.
Good luck on the 3DS version, where you have to fight the final boss 4 times with the only thing unique being the increased health pool if you want to 100% the game
More worried about his time with the special stages on LW 3DS.
This personally is my least favorite Sonic game out of all the ones I've played, I'm sure Free Riders or Rise of Lyric would change that. Nothing against you if you like it, but to me at least 06 was interesting. Lost world has dull and poorly put together levels, a garbage story, and in general is just forgettable
Also while I liked Roger's Sonic performance in Color's and Generations, here he has weird inflection in his voice probably to make him sound younger, poor voice direction I know but it makes Sonic sound way more whiny
The sounding younger part reminds me of a little spat about knuckles'voice not too long ago.
@@erikbihari3625 Knuckles's voice in the games or in the movie?
Roger is improving
@@HordikaNate3821 in general. Basically:-"if knuckles had a younger sounding voice like everyone else, he wouldn't come to be treated like such an idiot"!
@@erikbihari3625 IDK what those people are on, aside from the OVA he's always had a deep'ish voice. Just because he doesn't sound like an angry Scott McNeil in SA2 and Heroes, doesn't mean his voice wasn't deep in those games
Sonic Lost World may be a copy of Super Mario Galaxy but it also remind me of the Sonic Xtreme, the unreleased Saturn game. It looks similar with just a camera angle change. Small levels, no boost, more emphasis on slower walking.
yeah you just debunked mario galaxy copy by sonic x treme and lets not forget sa2
I remember being so excited for this game coming right off the heels of Generations as a kid. After playing the demo on my new Wii U I left not really wanting to play more of it unlike every other Sonic game I had played before.
I like Sonic Lost World a lot but it doesn't feel like a Sonic game. I actually tried playing this game without using the run button and it was more fun! (which i was surprised by since this is a SONIC game) it feels like the game should belong to a different franchise entirely. honestly I think this game could have worked as a Silver title, with the slower pace it makes sense. also throw enemies into each other with psychokinesis would be fun in this game
honestly yeah
I only played this version of Lost World after the 3ds version, and I ended up enjoying the 3ds version way better for its mechanics and utilization of the same concepts, so in my mind it's just "Sonic Lost World" to me and I think of this version as the weird younger bother, like Unleashed where Dimps' version was what I played first but I still think of the 360 version first.
12:52 Oh yes, press triangle on the Wii U game, what a concept :0
Had been a minute since I'd seen IRL J. Seems you've lost some weight. Which, as long as it was not the result of being sick or very stressed, I'm glad you are 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
Great review. I like how even though you contributed heavily to the "2000s Sonic good, 2010's Sonic bad" discourse with that Sonic stories video you have some self awareness unlike some other fans who are just obnoxious.
It'd be nice if Star Wars fans had that quality. Especially considering how tatooine become the green hill zone of it!
@@erikbihari3625 Star Wars is easily on the list of top 10 most toxic fanbases along with Pokemon, (post 2017) Minecraft, (specificly the dream SMP fanbase) Steven Universe, (at its peak) K-Pop, My Hero Academia, Comics, and Gacha Life. The fanbase is so bad and so full of loser anti-SJW neckbeards who relentlessly hate on anything that's not the OT, the prequels, or Clone Wars for stupid reasons and overly glorify the non-canon EU stuff post Ep6. It's insane. Even the Sonic fanbase isn't that bad as most of the cringe people are either isolated or literally in jail (Chris Chan) and pretty much the entire fanbase is united in saying what games are bad and what games are good. Especially the idea that everything post-2011 is absolutely garbage. Games like Unleashed and Black Knight are also much more liked then they were back in the day where they were the most hated Sonic games and there is a lot more hate now towards Colors, but overall the fanbase is pretty united especially in their hatred of Ken Penders and what he did to the Sonic series.
@@krimsonkatt okay lucasfilm
@@krimsonkatt every fandom has toxicity, there's just no chance to tell when or where always. And I was referring to reactionary and overzellous crowd mentality where people are reads to grab pitchforks and torches! Heard of the stories about Jake Loyd being bullied at school and developing unease around cameras or achmed best being almost driven to suicide? Also Star Wars fans as I observed(mostly prequel lovers)hate the wokeness being inserted to the detriment of everything else! For example in the obiwan kenobi show reva the third sister of the inquisitors turns out to be a jedi padawan who survived order 66(by that I mean being impaled by anakin skywalker's lightsaber by the Man himself no less) and joined the inquisitors to get close to and kill him for massacering her friends!(I pointed out in the comment section of anomaly Inc:one of the most vocal prequel defenders that her backstory and actions are exactly like the g.u.n. commander from Shadow the hedgehog:-"hypocritical"!)
@@erikbihari3625 a thing that always ticked me off when people criticize fandoms is that they take a few example of some fans being pricks and then treats it as if that's good portrayal of every single person in the fanbase.
why can't they just talk about the individual toxic fans themselves why do entire fandoms always gotta thrown under the bus.
like you said every fandom gonna have toxic people in it.
As a Mario fan whose first Sonic game was Lost World 3DS… Yeah, this one sucks. Coming out in the same year as Mario&Luigi: Dreamteam Bros which
feels bigger, has more energy and actually establishes the world it takes place in certainly didn’t help its case for me.
And 3D World. Which is also an more enjoyable game.
@Jaretco
Yeah, but 3D World was on WiiU. Comparing Lost World to that one technically makes more sense, but since I only owned the 3DS version I compared it to other 3DS games I had at the time.
@@rainpooper7088 OK. Fair enough. I'm not the biggest fan of Dream Team ( personally I think it's the weakest Mario & Luigi series ). But even I can agree that at least it's more establishment & better world themes than Lost World has.
Love your RE2 shirt! It reminds me of my first profile picture :)
J's real face kinda reminds me of one of the guys from the movie West Side Story the 1960s version. And that was one of my favorite movies growing up!
I always hated Lost World, but I revisited it after playing Origins and actually learning about the exploration aspects of the classic games. I made my goal in this run to properly understand the parkour and collect all of the red rings. Through the combination of both I really really enjoyed it this time.
On the subject of frustration with the rings, I would say that 2nd pool ball table in the snowball level due to the checkpoint you can't avoid, the pinball table, and lava mountain....2 I think? The one with the harder Zavok fight
As someone who only has experience with the 3DS version, I can safely say that is a HORRIBLE version of a game that people are already pretty divided on. The worst part is that it actually started on a pretty high note, but lost that momentum VERY quickly after the first world. The level design went from fun and interesting, to tediously unfair or boring. The worst worlds being the Snow World, because certain levels had an Invincible snowball that is constantly following you, freezing you in place, and growing in size. The Ocean World, because it brings back the Drill Wisp in 3D, and it controlls like shit. And the Cloud World because the levels take FOREVER and I specifically remember this world giving me the most hand cramps, and keep in mind Kid Icarus Uprising is my favorite game for the 3DS, and that game never gave me even the slightest hand pain. And yes the special stages suck too. I think that they're fine in isolation, as in: you're alone in your house, and you don't have the system strapped down with recording equipment or something. And even then that's assuming you don't get dizzy or motion sickness. I didn't have that issue, but I'm not susceptible to that stuff and I know other people have had those problems. The 3DS version is such an awful game that I don't recommend. I'm sorry to anyone else who got it and played it as much as I did.
What annoys me even more is that from beginning to end, the levels in the 3DS version have a real habit of making long bad level design, but then you realize its cause what they did was lock shortcuts behind wisps in most of them. So in some twisted way its an evolution of Colors.
But most if not all the wisps needed for said shortcuts aren't even unlocked until post Silent Forest at most. Take Frozen Factory Act 3 for example, it would take 30 or 40 minutes on your own. But it can take 10 minutes or less with the Quake Wisp thanks to a shortcut. And no this isn't a praise, i'm mad they went so overboard with the wisps. Its like they were also an afterthought but for the complete opposite reason. And the after all the horrible and awful level design, you get a final boss that is actually competent but makes you question even more what the heck they were trying to imply since the wisps are in that fight too and help you out???
(Oh and funny enough the moment i beat the game and decided to check out hard mode, my 3DS freaked out and now has a broken circle pad, so thanks Lost World 3DS, not even the system had patience for you)
The thing that's frustrating about the 3ds version is that if it kept the same quality of the first zone all the way through it would have 100% beat the Wii U version in terms of quality.
The controls and physics are better and the levels in the first world feel more like an actual Sonic game
I got that game for Christmas when I wanted the Wii U version and a Wii U 😭
its so goddamn unfortunate that the 3ds version was so bad after the first world.
the first world did everything that the wii u did bad and turned it into good.
the levels werent one minute long and instead were two minutes or more, the levels had nice set pieces like the chase sequence, the levels were more focused on platforming and the parkour gimmick, and they also didnt hold your hand by having hidden springs everywhere doing the platforming for you, and the levels generally kept consistency (for example you wont be seeing a candy land in the grass world, or a volcano level in the grass world).
then after the first world it just goes downhill, levels get TOO long, they become focused on switch pressing and puzzle solving, and the wisps are much more apparent, with some not even being fun to control, like the asteroid or the drill in 3D.
its crazy how a game can go from being really good to being really bad in just a few levels.
@@gggsh7 yeah, I’ll take Mario 3D Land over Sonic Lost World at any time of the year.
17:32 it's funny how he says automation started in adventure, while showing a returning mechanic from sonic 2.
always been there bud.
I definitely have a very different opinion on the gameplay of Sonic Lost World, but I do respect yours. Also thanks for the DLC Restoration shoutout, glad to see it used for the review.
What doesnit specifically improve from the original?
@@erikbihari3625 By default you get the same experience out of the DLCs as on the Wii U but there are some Quality of Life improvements (like fixing the leather texture being assigned to Link Sonic's mouth) or some new things, like being able to take Link Sonic or even the Heart System from the Zelda DLC into any level. All of these are toggleable options in the mod manager.
This game is also kinda similar to Sonic Heroes. A game that changed the gameplay style right after 2 similar games that many people loved. A change that was ultimately not needed. And both were also met with less positive reviews scores than their predecessors.
Though obviously Heroes is the better game.
I’m interested on hearing your thoughts on Lost World 3DS because I really enjoyed that version of the game
I love that one
You want to know the crazy thing? Gameplay stuff from Gamescom shows a tutorial of using boost in the air straight into a wall to cause Sonic to wallrun up it. Frontiers is, to some limited degree, bringing back a portion of the Parkour system, but segued into the overall movement options more fitting of a combination with base Boost design.
Oh god, he has to play the 3DS version next.
I’m so sorry, J…
I do like the parkour concept. How's about finetuning it for a future game?
Hi CID, I do think it could have been one of the best mechanics if it was focused more.
After seeing your Top 10 Worst Colors Era Moments, I can't help but feel bad about the what could have been for the upcoming games of 2010, but sadly is released how it is.
I'm curious, what's your take on J's take on the story?
@@LeonardoGarcia-xi4gs The meat of J's take on the plot was in that 2018 video about the 2010s stories. The plot is confused, not sure of what direction it wanted, and has some of the most cringe of dialogue. At least we got Eggman telling Sonic he was an idiot.
I’m really interested to see your take on the 3DS version of lost world, the gameplay is a lot better on it but the level design is a lot worse. Also I REALLY want to see your takes on the Spark the electric Jester trilogy if you wanna see the parkour system (or atleast a part of it) in a much better game
If you want better parkour Prince of Persia. I'd like to see him cover Sonic stuff that isn't games or comics!
Have you ever considered a video on the IDW comics? I know that kinda goes outside your typical video, but I’m curious what you think of Ian Flynn’s writing and characterization of the characters.
You just summoned a deeply buried childhood memory with that sega superstars reference
My thoughts on lost world and forces are pretty much the same
'Objectively probably a "decent enough" platformer on it's own gameplay merits and isnt as offensive as some folks make it out to be but it has next to nothing I like about a sonic game outside of the soundtrack. I feel nothing towards both of them and I personally think I have very strong opinions on things and me feeling nothing towards a sonic game is probably one of the biggest insults I could throw towards it'
Any hopes for frontiers then?
@@erikbihari3625 I have plenty of hope from what I have seen from hands on impressions and the gamescom footage and the controls look to be the tightest in the franchise as I dont even think SA1 sonic turns as tightly as frontiers sonic. The open zone looks like bowsers fury for sonic and if you want to make an open ended game that's the best approach as elden rings and botws open worlds are both boring as sin
@@Osohe I specifically meant on the writing department or who will voice sonic and all. I checked out Sonic boom episodes wich Ian flynn wrote, wich gotta say, their not bad!
@@erikbihari3625 writing wise I feel it will be great as it isnt being as tryhard as forces teasers and seems much more honest and truly like the 2000s titles
@@Osohe the 2000's games problem wasn't mutch about earnestness, but plot holes, for example j's Pal retropolic zone or golden bolt detailed some of the adventure games ones like Rouge being a government spy who let two dangerous terrorist obtain power source for their weapon of mass destruction and let a military facility be destroyed with countless people in it, you know that sort of thing!
I feel like Zavok, or for that matter the entire Deadly Six, could’ve fit better in a Ristar Reboot/Sequel.
Think about it,
“A Strange Planet nobody heard of full of strange environments, and is terrorized by Six Deadly Creatures nobody heard of, but have incredible power.”
It could’ve been a good Kid Icarus Uprising esque Ristar Return. Not to mention aesthetically they look like they belong with Ristar more than Sonic, and couple that with refined Werehog Gameplay since Ristar also has stretchy arms and you got yourself a Superstar!💫⭐️🌟
Hopefully Frontiers would do Lost World's Concepts more Justice
J I been watching a lot of fan casting videos for Sonic characters and one name that keeps Poppins up for the blue blurr himself is Josh Keaton, any thoughts? Also last jedi is bad!
Zazz has such a cool character design and I hate that it was wasted on such a lame character.
I thought he was Going to be a least top 3 of the D.S
He looks ridiculous, they all do
I actually don't mind the Zeti's designs. It's just that practically nothing about them screams "Sonic character!"
Sonic characters have a unique style to them and I have no idea why Sega seem so reluctant to utilize that!
Idw comic will fix that for you
Funny how Zazz and Infinite the Jackal are voiced by the same guy
I've always found the 3DS version of this game to be a lot more enjoyable of an experience honestly. It has its issues too which can put you off of it depending on who you are but overall I just feel like it executed on the core ideas of the game better and arguably one of the best final levels in the series in the form of Sky Road 3. Plus, I really like how ranks are in the levels, you get special stages (which are pretty fun once you get past how stupid the controls are) and there's a hard mode that unlocks after beating the game for every stage along with unlockable ones for each zone.
This game in general really should've been scrapped and re-thought though. They already had a great idea with the parkour and for some reason they absolutely ruin it by making levels that run counter to it and then making half the game play to these gimmicky side ideas. It was a game that designed itself yet they chose to dive off the side of a cliff despite almost reaching the peak.
I would compare the parkour to Cat Mario's climbing ability in Super Mario 3D World.
Both were released in 2013.
Ayyyee great to finally see your face been watchin your vids for months now, def more face cam 🤝🏽😎
There's something kinda sad about this game not being that good. I kinda hoped it would be good, but it just never fleshed out it's ideas, relying on gimmicks.
I know a lot of people hate this game but for me, it will always have a special place in my heart for not only being my first Sonic, but being the game that made me realize that I even like video games. When I was a kid growing up I loved watching videos of other people playing video games but I could never find enjoyment when I played video games, for whatever reason. That was the same case when I got Sonic Lost World for my Wii U when I was little. I maybe got past the first world, but that was about it. Then, a couple years later I watched a video of someone playing Lost World and they briefly brought up the infinite spindash trick and I thought it was pretty cool, so I wanted to try it. You see I didn’t really own a lot of video games at the time. Some Wii U bundle games, Skylanders, Sonic Lost World, and Super Mario 3D World. I always thought Sonic was cooling then Mario, thanks to all the Sonic LP’s that I watched, so I wanted Lost World to be the game that I would actually complete for the first time. I started a new save and had a lot of fun learning the parkour mechanics along with the spindash trick. After I few days I had finally beaten a Sonic game. When that happened, I finally realized that yes, I do love Sonic games, but I also really loved video games. And with that, I began playing all the games that I owned, even convincing my older brother to get me some games on his Xbox so that I could play them, including the Adventure series. So yeah, I could never really bring myself to hate this game. I know it has its issues but without it I wouldn’t have discovered my love for other Sonic games, Mega Man, Mario, fighting games, etc. The only thing I found bad was collecting the Red Rings but I thought Super Sonic was really cool so I didn’t mind it. I wanted to put this comment out there since I know this video and comment section is gonna be pretty negative, which I totally understand why this game isn’t everyone cup of tea. I still wanted to have beacon of light for the weirdos like me who do enjoy this oddity of a Sonic Game.
I love the story. When it started off it was weak, but when eggman joined from that point on I loved it. It was actually pretty dark for a sonic game.
It was edgy than dark.
Out of all the games that Ken Pontac and Warren Graff worked on, this was the first (and currently only) instance where the two of them were given the opportunity to write the story and cutscenes of the game from the ground up, rather than being supplied the material by Sonic Team to translate like with Colors, Generations and Forces.
You been working out bro? (Or playing sonic free riders) you look great!!
Isn't playing Free Riders a workout itself just more painful? XD
This is literally the only game you have ever covered that I've never even heard of... I somehow feel thats not a good sign. Here we go--
I didn't hear anything beforehand, I was pretty sheltered in an internet sense.
Probably because it's mediocre and forgettable. People tend to talk about huge disasters (06, Boom, Forces), beloved classics (the Genesis games, Generations), or games that are very divisive (the Adventure games, Heroes, Unleashed), but not things that are so bland and uninteresting that nobody feels strongly about it either way. That's this game.
Also, initially being a Wii U exclusive didn't help. And I say this as someone who owned one.
"The Zeti turn on Eggman"
Lol.
I need a life man, lol.
16:10 We were told that they were going Home but they said nothing about Never Returning, you just assumed that which is why when I played Lost World when it came out for the First Time I thought, "oh, The Wisps are here, I guess some stayed behind on Sonic's World to Explore and got captured. Makes Sense".
What's wild is that I can point to a Sonic game I own and list one thing interesting about it. With Lost World, it just exists. Also, the bonus levels are not really that interesting, so you saved yourself some more boredom.
The worst part is it rips off games like mario galaxy and new super mario wii two better games u could play instead of lost world which feels like the worst of both worlds
@@nyhtfall1969 Still better than Galaxy 2. Galaxy2 was way too easy, the ranking's in Lost World are not easy to get.
I played the demo of the game from Best Buy, and I didn’t enjoy it. I thought the controls were awkward and the tubular level design made me nauseous. So I skipped this game and picked up Super Mario 3D World which was a much better game imo.
Some things of note:
-Roger van de Wiede did mention he regrets how he interviewed Pontac when looking back.
-Pontac does indeed dislike the community as seen in his RebelTaxi interview.
-Apparently there is a bible of sorts, if the localization of the game's script into Japanese is to be trusted. The localizers tried their best to make the script feel like Sonic. Perhaps Pontaff simply didn't look into it, opting for "original research". dunno about that.
Sega had an excuse to use the wisps though, because the lost hex was well lost, no-one had been there which means they could live there
26:57 Thank you! It’s about freaking time somebody said that. I don’t understand why people are that worked up over a Sonic The Hedgehog story of all things
Fan entitlement
@@thatitalianlameguy2235 doesn’t mean it should be treated like it’s the end of the world if it’s not specifically what you want
@sonic 1995 somebody’s greedy👀
I remember when I first bought a Wii U, three games that I knew I simply had to own were Super Mario 3D World, Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze, and Sonic Lost World. And yet, Lost World was the one that I was the least excited about. 3D World and Tropical Freeze were both taking what worked with their previous games (3D Land and DKC Returns) and were expanding on them, adding in new playable characters, expanding their world and what they could do with their already established formula.
Lost World on the other hand just felt like Sega were once again trying to redefine Sonic and appealing to haters, detractors, overly critical critics who have no idea what they're talking about, and for some reason, non-Sonic fans.
There just seemed to be this very mixed feel to it, the same with Forces a few years later, like Sega are just always between a rock and a hard place when it comes to their ideas.
This is what it feels like, to me at least.
"Well if it's a Nintendo exclusive game then clearly it has to be less Sonic, more Mario!"
No, who has ever thought that before? One of the reasons that the Sonic series is so popular is because it is unique from the Mario series!
"We better put in some Classic imagery to keep the Modern Hating Classic Fans happy! Remember how they threatened us to boycott Sonic 4 when we put the wrong character design in it!"
Seriously, this attitude really needs to stop! Classic imagery is just getting old and repetitive, and people are sick of it! And yet, even in the upcoming Frontiers game we've got Green Hill, Chemical Plant, Sky Sanctuary. It's like these Classic Fan Boys have caused irreparable damage to the Sonic series. Why is it that these kinds of people are ultimately dictating what can and can't be in a Sonic game? If these whiners keep getting their way, then it's only a matter of time until the next big Sonic game is just Sonic 2 again, but with maybe one or two unique levels thrown in, and the title "Sonic Mania 2 slapped on it to convince people to buy it. Oh, and Tails has been removed, "COS SONIC'S LAME-O FRIENDS, AM I RIGHT?" Speaking of which....
"Yeah, we'd better put Amy and Knuckles in this game to remind people that they exist, but we can't give them too much screen time since so many people find them annoying. Besides, what could they do to progress the story, they're just Sonic's useless friends! And we'd better make Knuckles look really dumb to make Sonic look cooler, since that's all he's good for!"
Again, I find it amazing that Super Mario 3D World gave us playable Luigi, Peach, Toad and an unlockable Rosalina, and DKC: Tropical Freeze brought back Dixie Kong and gave us a playable Cranky Kong for the first time, each with their own unique abilities to change up the gameplay and add some variety in their respective games. But will Sega do the same? Will they bring back fan favourite characters, improve on their abilities and allow for some variety in the Sonic series? Seriously, why is this such a taboo to them? They do know that there are people out there who actually LIKE these characters, so there's clearly a demand for it. Are they STILL listening to the "Sonic's stinky friends" crowd who have bitched, whined and moaned about practically every single Sonic character ever since Tails came along? Again, why does negative feedback ultimately trump positive feedback?
"The plot can have some stakes and serious moments, but we'd better throw in some wacky, goofy moments too so people can't accuse us of being edgy and emo and appealing to loser Weeaboos who think that Sonic should be an anime!"
In fairness, I think that a mixture of light-hearted humorous moments and serious and character driven moments is actually what the Sonic series needs, and I will always give the plots of games such as Colours, Lost World and Forces some credit for at least trying that. There are some ideas that I do think are interesting, like Sonic feeling guilty about acting too brashly, and Sonic and Tails having trust issues. These ideas could work, but just weren't written very well. And yes, it does annoy me that people seem to think that because a story comes from the so called "meta era" that means that there is absolutely nothing good about it, and now there is magically nothing bad about the stories that came before it. Give me a break!
10:12 yes this is the beauty of the boost formula classic and adventure is about achieving speed, boost is about maintaining speed
25:44 LMAO
A1 Roger Impression.
Congrats on the weight loss, J. It's really inspiring, and just great as a fan, to see you achieving your goals!
@@thatitalianlameguy2235 Roflmfao
I feel like lost world would have made a perfect spin off game
Having wanted to try it myself for over ten years now, I recently bought a copy of Lost World and today I sat down to play it. And after 2 hours of it, I found myself not wanting to play it further but struggling against 10 years of anticipation (and $25 spent on eBay). So hearing you share my disappointment has been very soothing.
Whoa J! You are lookin good man! Seems like you have lost a lot of weight since the first video where you were on camera that I saw a few years ago.
Wouldn't Sonic's speed negate the need for parkour? Being so fast he doesn't need to jump on them and all.
When is the time we have to talk about the 3Ds version, aka the only version I've played aka the best one imo. (Ok, I have played like, 5 seconds of the PC ver. but my PC crashed every time in the same section, because my PC is very bad, well, it WAS. If it was working now.) Obviously the soundtrack is awesome, is one of the best in the series, like yeah it's Sonic, what were you expecting? (IGNORE SONIC CHRONICLES PLEASE.) *Also the parkour is one of the best mechanics in the Sonic series, change my mind.* 💀
As a huge Mario fan, I immediately noticed the Galaxy-like gameplay, as well as the Deadly Six just being discount Koopalings. They completely forgot what made Mario Galaxy a great game: it's unique gameplay. Copying from another company and calling it a main feature isn't unique, and can ruin the whole game if done poorly. I know some stuff about Sonic characters, but I've never played a single game in my life, so thank you for your honest reviews.
Be quiet. They didn't copy Mario Galaxy. They were copying sonic Xtreme. See Kiddy, 90s kids like me remember sonic Xtreme being a thing and even having a release date. Sonic lost world was what I always wanted, a sonic game that played like the 2d games with different routes and ways to beat a level. Not just boosting around
@@mania4270 Shut the fuck up. Since when do you have the authority to tell someone to not speak their opinion, bitch? Also, if they weren't copying Mario Galaxy and instead copying Xtreme, then that's even worse, as Xtreme looked so bland and boring to play (just like Lost World).
3:10 WHAAA?!?!? It's honestly one of if not my favorite sonic games.