Lost-Tite Screws - a Brilliant Alternative to Nails
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ส.ค. 2024
- In today's video I show you a screw with a head that's so tiny that it will drive into wood leaving barely any hole!
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I discovered these screws when I was installing some engineered oak floorboards in my bathroom goo.gl/Q7djAS and I was recommended Tongue-Tite screws geni.us/J9op2SQ (Amazon) by the floorboard supplier.
Since then I've bought a few different variations from the Tite-Fix brand that make these screws. I was installing a new section to the door lining in my spare room and suddenly remembered I had a box of Lost-Tite screws geni.us/pmmI4 (Amazon) - which would be brilliant for this job.
The great thing about Lost-Tite is that the head of the screw is so small that it replaces the need for nails, glues or panel pins - which also means minimum effort is required to fill the hole left by the screw, which is great because I normally drill a pilot hole, countersink and use standard PZ screws that leave a big hole that needs filling.
TODAY'S TOOL KIT
- Lost-Tite screws 3.5mm x 45mm bit.ly/3FmXPyI
- For those of you in the US who may not be able to get hold of screws from the Tite-Fix range, check out McFeelys where something like this goo.gl/pAX7yZ is similar, and costs $12.25 for a pack of 100
- The screws come with a T10 driver bit, but you will need a drill driver or other form of electric screwdriver
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Discovered these while rewiring my new house, I didn't want squeaky floorboards everywhere so opted for these, fantastic bit of kit, worth every penny.
The 2nd thread holds the floorboard itself not allowing it to shift on the shaft causing squeaks.
Thank's for the explanation of the need for threads right under the screw head.
hi Charlie --we used them-- different make call SPAX --we use them a flooring screws ---and anti jack --the middle disconnects --the material doesn't jack up off the substrate.. great screws--pre tiling --no movement on floor once a box of the spax type are put in...another great vid.. cheers
I too have used the Herbert screws to repair fractures in bone. The most important design feature is the difference in the pitch of the screw threads that actually causes a compressive force to be delivered between the two pieces. The distal threads pull at a more rapid pace than the proximal threads thus pulling the two pieces together. Great design. Herbert screws have no heads at all, relying on the threads alone to compress the fragments.
+Tom Miller That's fascinating - I hadn't appreciated that varying pitch in threads could achieve that. Thanks for the comment!
Hey don't you types have ur own sites?
Mark Miller Ha! We're a broad church here, Mark! The more the merrier 👍
I'm surprised he missed that point. But I suppose anyone can make a video.
Hi Charlie, thank you for making time to do this. I am finding the channel so informative . A real confidence builder.
Aw, thanks Justin. Really chuffed you're finding my vids useful 👍🏻
@@CharlieDIYte looking for one on how to perfect a mitre, something I'm particularly useless at! ...Jus
There's a bit on mitres in this one bit.ly/3cfJHvG
Excellent illustration and these shure are better than the old tech. I especially like the driver type that never slip off or strip~! I will look for these at my local Home Depot and Thanks!
Great tutorial as ever Charlie. I find it really useful to check your vids for guidance before I try stuff for first time.
Whoa, I shall be trying these out myself, these look excellent ! Thanks for bringing this to my attention
You're welcome.
I use to live in Canada for 25+ years work for a management company using similar screws 15 years ago already !
Lovely...very pretty screw
Thank you for all your super helpful content Charlie. I am insulating the floor cavity spaces of a flat and then re fitting the floorboards and wondered - would these screws be suitable for screwing down traditional floorboards - particularly for eliminating squeaks and creeks also?
Going to get these Bad Boys for Edwardian floorboards 1 inch thick !!
Solid video as always Charlie, great explanations throughout.
The T10 Torx head on these are the dogs doodas. I don't use pozi head screws at all anymore and i'm bemused at why the whole construction industry hasn't moved over to torx head woodscrews as it virtually eliminates the ability to cam out a screw head no matter how bad the install technique. Cost is a factor i'd imagine as the avg price of 200 screw box in say a 40mm 4 size screw is about 1.5-2 x expensive depending on brand. I personally use all of screwfix's Turbo II range, just waiting for silver versions to appear there as they only sell gold versions
Very good screw designs to allow the supporting material behind to pull the surface material flush.
Thanks for the vid, thumbs up.
Tip of the hat foe the engineered wood in the bathroom, a rarity these days! Quality looking stuff.
Thanks Ryan! Yep, two comments though. 1) the T10 Torx (thanks for correcting me, I think I called it a hex bit in the vid!) is so small that you do have to be a bit careful with it. The screws are so hard chances are the T10 will strip before the screw does, but I have knackered one or two in my time; and 2) annoyingly Screwfix don't stock the T10. I might invest in some Wera, then I don't have to worry.
REALLY interested that you use the Turbo II range. I might have to start getting some of those - thanks for the tip!!
I was really pleased with the engineered flooring. Bought it from these guys, goo.gl/BThZnU in case you're interested!
Charlie DIYte Yep the t10 head are good if you are doing plenty of jobs and want to fill only small amounts.
The 4mm and 5mm Turbo II screws are a t20 and t25 head respectively and come with the screwdriver bit included ready to put in an impact.
Most of the areas ive used them for my place (bed, desk, wardbrobe carcass, tv unit etc) for the most part being used in areas where you cant see the screws so the bigger head on these doesnt need to be filled. They are the best ive used tbh and wouldnt go back to normal screws unless it is for facework that wont be hidden - for example screws for hinges to replace the crap included ones have to be silver so no luck there..
The grab pack is about £15 i think for 750 screws in all different sizes.
Spax makes screws similar to those. I haven't tried that screw that you are demonstrating but I have used a few of their other screw types. I really like their brand of screws.
Yes, mate, Spax is an awesome brand. Great quality stuff 👍
In the US we use them for composite material with no mushrooming, now I see them all over
Great video, I use a similar screw ‘GRK trim screws’ I’ll look for that brand next
Charlie, just throwing out a slightly different opinion since I gave these a try after your recommendation: for my garage conversion, I put up 11mm OSB, and I wanted a fixing that would allow me to potentially remove the boards in the future with little fuss.
I tried the Lost-Tite in 3.5x32. However, they really struggled to bite into the OSB. I don't think it's a problem for softer wood, but it was a huge headache. Moreover, the T10 head was really prone to cam-out and the drill bits wear very quickly when this happens.
That said, the double screw pattern is really good, but the inability to bite was a huge headache. In the end, I resorted to pre-drilling, which sort of defeated the purpose.
Sorry to hear that. I suspect you need something a bit more substantial with a larger torx head. I'm using Spax 4x50mm mdf screws at the moment on my wardrobe build and they're superb. Problem is, you won't get that hidden head effect. I'll give this some thought but in the meantime thanks for getting in touch 🤔
I've been using the GRKs for about 5 years. They actually provide a certain amount of adjustment, which is great for alignment of mitered corners/joints. Occasionally the head will strip out and the T9 will no longer turn the screw. I've had to use pliers or even very small vice grips to remove those screws.
I never use a pin nailer anymore.
You and me both Jim. I used them in this job which sounds similar to what you're describing bit.ly/3cfJHvG 👍🏻
Going to use some of these on my Victorian pine floor refurb. Was tempted to use cut nails to keep in line with age but decided if I needed to lift the boards (the ones needing replaced were ones cut over the years to access electric and pipes) then these would be better.
Yes, I used the mail's in the past but would never go back after using these. So much better having them hidden.
@@CharlieDIYte , noticed you have insulated
Yeah... been using them in Canada for many, many years. Different brand name of course and with a superior "Robertson" drive.
Just like a $4 Canadian haircut a? $1 a side
The tri lock... Refers to the triangular shank.
Those screws are for decking and floor boards at a push. Not door linings and architraves 🙄 the whole idea of screwing the a door lining in is so that the large head of a no5 screw pulls the door frame or lining flat against your packers or shims so you get a nice margin. Not piloting counter boring and countersinking is rough. If you dont to see the head of a screw pellet it
Fair point. It was only an additional layer on the existing door lining though, on the mortice side so it doesn't need much strength.
Ill tell you what they are good for charlie fixing timber facia boards because more the dont split the rafter foot if its a small rafter
This is very similar to the Herbert screw we use in trauma and orthopaedics.
Filon Agathangelidis It's very similar, isn't it! Thanks for the comment!
Do you ever have issues from the heads sinking too deep, or the work piece being allowed to pull free, due to the small head?
I wondered this but with decking. The secondary thread near the head stops them pulling through, without this they would yeah
Great video! Some nice wood filling as well
I've used Tongue-tite screws for a couple of floors, secret screwing instead of secret nailing. Damn fine for the diyer without a portanailer.
Mickleblade Couldn't agree more mate! Thanks for the comment!
as a painter you should always undercoat then fill as filler binds better to the undercoat.
Spax makes a Stainless Steel Deck Screw (counter sink head), or Spax Flooring Screws like this and so does GRK RT Exterior Trim Screws (small head). These are brands available in the US and are both very high end screw manufacturers.
If you can get hold of these screws, try spax flooring screws from wicks, there about the same.
Cheers, John. I'll definitely take a look at those, and they have a large range of Spax at my builders merchants (Tippers) - great quality screws!
Wow, love it! So easy and half the work. Will try my Mitre10 store to see if they stick them. Many thanks! Auckland New Zealand
I do love the tite-fix range. Although the tri-lock feature is not to do with the threads but the shank. It has 3 sides which has more surface area against the timber so does not undo over time like circular shanks. Good review Charlie.
Good to hear from you mate, and thanks for clarifying that one! What are your views (if any) on Robertson screws? Never really used them bit I hear the occasional good thing about them.
Charlie DIYte can't say I've used them but looking at pictures are they just wedge type screws with s square drive?
Great video Charlie DIYte! How would you use these to fix squeaky floorboards? The boards are the large square panels you find in new build houses and not long individual boards? Thank you
An excellent American version is the SaberDrive screw ....they come in Standard head, Exterior head, and the one you’re using the Trim head.....sold every where in America
Thanks buddy. I'll update the description to include the SaberDrive.
Nice video and presented well. Thanks!
Bonjour, Brillant Indeed ! Thank you for sharing
been using tite screws for years....very useful if you own an old property with shall we say delicate lath and plaster walls and ceilings where smacking away with a big hammer is not a good idea.
I need to secure my chipboard floor boards upstairs to stop them creaking. Would you recommend the lost tite you used for the door frame, or the screws you used in your flooring video?
You are all Screwed up 😁
Great Video, Thanks.
Ha! Thanks!!
got a skirting job to do will these go through the mdf plaster board and into the block
You'd need to wall plug the block.
Could these be used in conjunction with wall plugs for fixing skirting boards to masonry walls?
Good shout that, don't see why not like as again saves on pilot holes and less filling
I find an impact driver does not always work, it just spins
Yes it would be too powerful for these screws.
Hi Charlie
I am a avid fan of your channel and watch every episode for ideas. I have old cinder block walls in my bungalow and am replacing the old skirting boards. my question is will the Lost-Tite screws hold into a rawl plug or will they hold in cinder blocks. so before I order the screws I would like your advice.
Kind regards
John
Hi John, good to hear from you! Thanks for your comment - I can't thank you enough for supporting my channel!
Hhmm this is a tricky one! By your reference to "cinder" I'm guessing you're talking about a concrete/cinder based block that can be drilled but isn't as soft as the thermalite block equivalent. If your walls were soft thermalite I'd say don't use these screws as there won't be enough compression in the wall from the screw and plug for the skirting to be firmly fixed. If on the other hand your walls are the harder concrete block (albeit with cinder in), these screws might work although you'll need an appropriate, narrow diameter wall plug.
These screws are excellent in terms of leaving a tiny hole to fill, but this also means that they won't have a great deal of "pull", should you need them to pull the skirting into the wall, although you could always push or clamp the skirting in position before screwing home, in this scenario. You probably want to drill pilot holes in the skirting with the skirting in position on the wall, going through the wood and a couple of mm into the plaster behind as this will give you the exact position that you need to drill the wall for your plugs. But if you do this, make sure obviously that the pilot hole is narrower than the screws as otherwise the screw head won't bite sufficiently in the skirting to fix the skirting tight against the wall.
I started this reply thinking I was going to be telling you not to use these screws, but have concluded that, provided your wall is reasonably hard concrete based block, and your walls are straight and skirting boards aren't warped, then if you choose the right wall plugs these screws might work well. Does this help at all?
Hi Charlie
Thanks for you prompt reply.
These are sold by Camo as Trimhead Deck Screw in the US. The extra thread just under the head is to compensate for the small head so the screw won't pull through - they're much more resistant to pulling through than you would think, even in softwood - it's like pulling a half inch screw out of the wood. Available in stainless or coated at Home depot and elsewhere
How easy are these to unscrew once they've been painted over? Any tips?
Painted or filled? Tricky but not impossible - maybe with a bradawl and worse case you just lever the wood off them.
@@CharlieDIYte painted- floorboard 🙄- might swap them out before it gets painted over too many time. Have ordered a dentist pick- but yes a bradawl would have been a better idea! Any tips on best way to cover screws when painting the floor in order to have easier future access? I had to dig the old ones out.
They need make stainless as well
they are nice screws but be weary of the much reduced pull out force of the fastened material. the small head provides reduced surface area for the fastened material to push against
Valid point - albeit probably not an issue for hard wood for example, where you're going to need a serious amount of force to pull the head through the wood. I hear what you say though. As with so many things, it's horses for courses!
yup! you hit the nail on the head
That's what the threads are for.
has virtually no effect on sheet/thin materials. its the head that creates the majority of pressure
Tree House Most contractors just use air nails for a job like that, even less holding power. Although i wouldn't want any heavy, overhead panels being held up with reduced head screws.
What would your technique be when u want to remove the trim? You have to find them then how do you remove the filler out of the head so u can back them out and replace the trim? Just pry bar them out. Like to see video on removal of anything joined by trim screws. Thanks for the video!
I'm hoping not to have to remove them but yes you'd have to pry the trim off like you would with one that had been nailed on.
Y could use a magnet to find hidden screw heads
about to fix skirting board will the lost tite go into the wall..??
Yes, take a look at this John th-cam.com/video/qhe3Waq6Ac4/w-d-xo.html. You'll need to plug the wall if it's brick
do they require rawl plugs?
Yes if fixing into brick
OK for people too lazy to pilot hole or for those with only one drill I suppose, I still think for situations where clamping two things together you need a screw with the largest head possible, also, not sure if they are any good close to the end of the board, it usually splits no matter what you use if it isn't pilot holed.
I'll have to give them a go on my next project, nice video though, thank you 👍
Allan Atwick Thanks Allan. Your not the first person to say that and you make a good point. I think a door lining isn't the best application for them - fine for me as it was the non hinge lining and the door is a poxy light moulded thing. In hindsight I should have shown them on a different application but I primarily wanted to just spread the message about them.
Will these work for attaching MDF?
NOOICE!
Hi Charlie
are you going to cover fitting the door lining in full?
Cheers & Happy New Year
Hi Mike. I don't think so as I was literally fitting a new piece on top of the existing lining, to bring the lining a bit further away from the wall so I have room to fit a skirting. The wall was a bit too close because I've dry lined the original wall, which has brought it a bit too close to the door frame. I'm mulling over showing how I dry lined the room though, in case you're interested, and I have the skirting boards to fit, which I may video. So difficult to know what people are going to want to see.
Hi Charlie, what were you screwing into behind the wood: plaster board or brickwork? Or doesn't it matter? Thanks.
Wood. These things wouldn't go into brickwork, without pre-drilling and plugging the brickwork.
Are these lost tite screws only suitable for screwing into wood? I need to screw my skirting board on and I'm thinking off using these, but I'm not sure if they will be any good screwing into the wall behind the skirting. If so would you recommend using a wall plug with these, even if they are available in this size
No you can use them in masonry, but with a wall plug. You're absolutely right to think of using these as they're perfect for what you're intending. Check out my recent video when I did just that! th-cam.com/video/qhe3Waq6Ac4/w-d-xo.html
Hallelujah, because I'm crap at hammering a nail in straight, 9 out 20 times, the nail bends. Plus with screws, you easily remove them if needed.
sounds like your holding the hammer in the wrong position..try holding it lower down the shaft to increase the arch of the swing so the face of the hammer head hits the face of the nail head flush
@@1olas I hold it at the end, full hand grip, and still the nails don't go in straight. Perhaps I am not hitting the nail head squarely, a little bit either way bends the nail??
@@markflajsner9944 yeah if you hit the head slighly off square more chance it will bend...could be the type of nails too or the way you hold the nail whilst hitting it???...i used to find the cut clasp nails for floorboards were a bit harder to keep straight as they are not cylindrical so tend to bend to the left or right..i changed the grip for holding them and it made it a lot easier
@@1olasJust recently I was using 4-5cm pin nails or longer flat headed nails. I know I should for rougher woodworking projects I should use nails, cheaper and all, I just get a bad feeling ahead and so opt for a screw solution. Perhaps I just to concentrate better, make sure I hit the nail head squarely. Thanks anyways
How do you think these will work on feather edge fencing ? I've used galvanised ring nails in the past but I find they tend to pull out after time .
peter fido Hmmm. I guess it's more typical to use 50mm galvanised nails, with only one per pail (the feather edged board) to allow the board to expand and contract with the weather. But as you're saying the nails are pulling out, you could try them. I suppose the only danger is that the board would crack as you're preventing it from moving. But that's arguably less annoying than the nails just coming out completely? They say you should never nail two boards together because of the whole expansion and contraction thing - just checking you haven't done that.
As a professional carpenter and joiner I wouldn’t use these screws for a door lining. The head is way too small and it’s not what they are designed for.
If you are going to hang a door with any weight to it, over time the weight of the door and action of the movement of the door will pull the screw head through the lining, especially if you drive it in that far. Much better to drill a clearance hole (which is like a pilot hole but it will allow the thread of the screw to pass through without catching) and then either countersink before fixing or use a self-countersinking screw if you are that bothered about shaving a coupled minutes off (most wood screws that aren’t super cheap now have ribs on the back of the counter sunk head designed to cut into the timber that is being fixed to self-countersink the head).
If you countersink accurately so the head of the screw lies just below the surface of the wood it really isn’t much more filling and you will end up with a much stronger fixing. The countersunk head of the screw will hold tight against the countersink in the timber, clamping the timber onto whatever it’s being fixed to, where as driving in a small headed screw like that forces the grain apart making it even more likely for the head to pull through.
These screws are great for fixing tongue and groove or other applications where pull through isn’t a worry but if you need a strong fixing that is load bearing or potentially subject to movement there really are much better options.
Best to stick to the uses that fixings are designed for in my opinion, it may take a few minutes longer but that’s time well spent to do a proper job and it’ll take much longer to repair a bodge further down the line when it fails.
Fair point, Tom. The tongue-tite are brilliant for engineered floorboards and I used lost-tite to mechanically fix skirtings recently, to minimise filling, and to hold in place whilst the glue was setting, but I can't disagree with what you say 👍
Screwfix have these under "drywall svrews" are these OK for plasterboard then? Anyone?
No for plasterboard you need the wider head otherwise it's a risk it will simply pull though.
@@CharlieDIYtecheers
Hy so can these be used straight into concrete walls with no need for ads drilling first? Sounds amazing if so
No, you'd need some sort of wall plug if using them with a concrete substrata. If you're talking about self tapping, they're really designed for screwing into woods, fibre boards and plastics, although the box says sheet steel as well.
I had 4 doors to trim out and found these screws. Wonderful right? No!! Continually strip out, normally when partly in. Totally a pain, used numerous new bits and finally threw the rest of the screws away. Worthless!!
You're doing something wrong there Lane. I used these recently (the Tongue Tite variation) in oak floor boards and got through 2 boxes of them with just one screwdriver bit. Laid an entire engineered oak floor, screwing down into 150 year old oak joists. Didn't strip out once.
Àh! So the thread at the top replaces the 'holding force' of the larger head on other screws?, Neat, very Zen.
Thanks Charlie ☺
Scary feet in background. 😱😱😂
😂 indeed!!
Going to be very painful to remove trim work held in by screws vs nail. Screws should hold much better against uneven walls though.
Agreed, although the head is so small on these, removing wouldn't be dissimilar to an old oval head nail that's nicely rusted in place.
Could this be used for skirting boards? Or is it wood only.
Mutton Man I just used adhesive like no nails for my skirting
Michael Grievson okay thanks. I was going to use a grab adhesive as well. So I guess I don't need screws.
i used grab adhesive and panel pins is your walls aren't totally straight to pull in skirting while it sets.
Mutton Man Yes, they can also be used for skirting boards. Thanks Robert and Michael for commenting. I hear what you say about using No Nails (Gripfill is another good one) for skirting. Makes sense particularly where you're using eg MDF skirting that's nice and flat. However I tend to use timber for my skirting and invariably the boards are a little bit warped, so I need to mechanically fix them in to pull them flat - which you can't do with the grab adhesive 🤔
So do you fix plus in your walls prior to fitting the skirting?
These screws are ridiculously expensive ... Regular every-day Deck Screws will do exactly this same job ... no need to pre-drill or countersink.
Hello are they available in africa and where as i have not really seen them but they will came in hamdy. Thanks for the recommendation.
Hi Leon. I'm not sure, to be honest with you. You could always try Tweeting them @TiteRange, and the website is www.tite-fix.co.uk
Home Depot carries them....under a different name . If you look in the nail / screw area.
Thanks Gerald. I wish I had a more in depth knowledge of tools and hardware in the States. That way I could recommend both in the Description.
Home Depot sells the same type from a brand called GRK. They have many sizes and variations,I use their screws almost exclusively. Great product!
you say you can remove the screw without damaging the wood unlike panel pins/nails etc..well yes but you can remove any screw without damage unlike 8 inch nails or 10 inch nails or any nails....what was the point except to big up a rather expensive product when there are plenty of cheap wood screws that do the same job.
Why not Use normal screws hidden by the door stop? These are too light duty for linings. Better suited for floors
I hear what you say. For me the screws are fine on the door lining as the lining in question isn't the hinge bearing one and the door is a very light moulded door. Personally I think they will be strong enough in any event, but you've got a point - I was simply trying to bring them to peoples' attention, rather than recommending them exclusively for door linings, per se.
They have been in the us for a long time .
average joe That's really good to hear. I had a couple of comments on my last video from people saying they couldn't get hold of them. Where's a good outlet for then in the US? Cheers mate!
i don't get it... screws with a blank part on the top are absolut standard as long as I can think of here in germany... I have never understood the meaning of drilling pilot holes, since there was never a need for that.
USA welcome to the 21. century. Congrats :D
charmaman They are here too as everywhere else for that matter. I should have made the point that I tend to use gold screws in the day job that have a thread all the way down as I tend to be screwing into wood or concrete with wall plugs - and with wall plugs you want the extra thread for bite. So I don't have a lot of the other screws in my kit and so tend to drill pilot holes. It was perhaps a point that I over emphasised!
B
Ok thanks jus looked like you was drilling straight into wall
No, sadly not. I'm drilling into the existing (wooden) door frame.
0:39 ... I have 4 nail guns :)
Very strange set of feet there at 45:50
Yes, that's our resident ghost 😱👍
Who's that 4:40
The wife - who's just commented that she looks like some sort of bag lady!
@@CharlieDIYte
Ah ok, I was thinking it was a mother/Norman Bates type scenario - no offence to ya wife.
Nice review, thanks for sharing. Please PLEASE clip those fingernails asap.
B Gil Thanks for the comment. Will do 🙄 Maybe I should wear gloves!
They don't have much sheer strength. These won't replace nails, ever.
3:50 bit close to a knot...
USE filler on your knots. Thank me later :)
Or Zinsser BIN 😉
To be fair I did use zinsszer bin on the knots. I then used filler to hide the knots. No doubt they will continue drying and eventually show through but at the moment they look perfecto.
What about Asians
Saiyed Murtaza Very good point but you're casting the net pretty wide. Where do you live my friend?
Charlie DIYte in U.A.E
Saiyed Murtaza Hi Saiyed, thanks for getting back to me. I'll see what I can do!!