Here’s the list of products reviewed. More details in the video description. Thank you! SPAX: amzn.to/35ENWjr GRK: amzn.to/3IO64W5 WoodPro: amzn.to/3KX2CKy FastenMaster: amzn.to/3AFAwPv PowerPro: amzn.to/3u8qrJt Grip Rite: amzn.to/32NFBsA Deck Plus: amzn.to/3GezkUa Velocity: amzn.to/3ufQy1d Eagle Claw: amzn.to/3rapApJ DeckMate: Available at Home Depot Deck-Drive: Available at Lowes
Man, I remember when this guy first came up on TH-cam, I thought he did a lot of work for little reward. Now he is a force of nature. Me and others coming here before buying anything. Goes to show if you put the drive and heart into something you believe in, people will follow
AND he still replies to most comments! THAT is passion, not just doing the work. thank you for being an incredible part of this community. i’ve been watching for years :)
There are a few TH-cam channels I watch where people attempt to "test" things or claims. Project Farm, by a long shot, is the best. You do your damndest every single time to fairly and scientifically test products (and even torture test) and I definitely appreciate your hard work. I've made several purchases based on your testing and have never been disappointed.
There's actually a very interesting story about the grk screws. The original owner made sure they were manufactured in either the US or Germany, and eventually brought the majority of manufacturing here to the US. Eventually one of the evil Omni mega corps bought him out, but the terms of the buy out stated the US manufacturing had to remain open. The new owner violated that, shipped manufacturing to Taiwan, and the quality took a massive crap. However, due to them violating the terms of the agreement, the original owner, with hundreds of millions of dollars, opened u2 fasteners built to the same original standards with a few new improvements to design and production. Ran grk out of town in the northwest. And brought American manufacturing back. This all took place around 2016
You know, PF gets a lot of compliments about the resource and information that his videos provide and I appreciate that as well, but I don’t think he gets enough praise for how entertaining these videos are as well. Every time I start watching the channel, I end up watching all his videos again, I’ve seen them all a few times, that’s how entertaining they are. It’s kind of like mythbusters and I loved that show. Project farm is like a mythbusters that saves you money at the same time, as PF would say, very impressive.
I'm not so sure that I would call it entertaining so much as it is satisfying or even cathartic, there's just something supremely relaxing about watching his videos. I usually end up binging 3-5 videos in a go and every once in awhile I watch one of his older videos where he's seeing how quickly he can blow up a harbor freight motor with cruddy oil substitutes. And even those videos allow me to appreciate how his dry humor and video editing have transformed and polished through the years. Because I'm the same as you, I've been subscribed for years now and his changes have been subtle and yet transformative. I didn't subscribe to a dude who compares all that crap in your garage, instead I subscribed to a relaxing, informative and yet entertaining guy and he ended up doing comparison videos.
Agreed, though I do not know about watching some of the more technical ones more then once. Half the time I cannot hear fast enough and have to review the charts. Though Farm Baego is plenty of laughs. I respect the objective focus. Spare the opinion until results are in.
@@curtisbme I've seen them all. But there are so many that I lost track. Thanks for reminding me. These were screws with some sort of covering on them. That was the difference, right?
So far Project Farm helped me choose my electric chainsaw, leaf blower, cordless drill, string trimmer and generator. Now it's screws! This channel has never steered me wrong.
Todd -- This video made me tear up since I suggested it to you on my dad's behalf. He was always interested in your fastener videos. Sadly, my dad died a week ago of a heart attack. He and I are big fans of your channel. Thank you so much for improving the lives of little people like us with your authentic reviews ❤ 🤯🤯🤯 Video Ideas 🤯🤯🤯 • Best food vacuum-sealer • Best work socks for work boots • Best latex gloves for auto work • Best emergency poncho for roadside repairs or the football game • Best safety wire tool (careful: too much safety-wiring by hand can cause carpal tunnel syndrome or other wrist injury) • Strongest safety wire • Best portable oxy acetylene torch kit • Best economy welder (TIG, MIG, stick) • Best welding apron • Best denim overalls for work • Best work jeans • Best full face shield • Best heavy duty ratchet straps (such as the classic yellow cargo straps used by truckers)
IN-Line Torque Adapter? What?! Of course, you have one of those on hand. It doesn't seem to matter what piece of equipment I go to research, Project Farm pops up with the most thorough review partnered with fantastic demonstrations. Why do I bother watching any other channel when it comes to tools I "need". Simply the best, well-deserved priority in all searches.
@@ProleDaddy While I am all for things which arre _actually_ environmentally-friendly, building a house _by itself_ isn't one of those things unless you use nothing but hand tools. Even still you still destroy a little bit of forest using wood construction. And concrete? That emits greenhouse gases while building. Regardless, house construction is _very_ environmentally _unfriendly_ unless it's a mud hut.
Personally I use Spax after using a few different brands. I found that over time the Spax stayed tight better than others. Having a screw stay in place, for me anyway, is more important than a little extra effort to install. I have only used SS one time and that was on a dock. They did excellent during the build but after a season I had to go back and tighten most of them down. Of course alot of it is from wood shrinking especially with pressure treated. I did use Spax on a redwood one time from customer request. I told him that I would not guarantee that it wouldn't discolor at every screw point. Two years later it still had not discolored hardly any at all. Only a couple areas had a very slight discolor. Of course I pre drill everything with a counter sinking bit so that helped I guess. All structural gets galvanized ring shank by hand, never cared for a nail gun for build decks. But over all Spax has proven to be a extremely good deck screw. The cost is only slightly more than deck mate but the over all performance is well worth it. Thanks again another great video, I honestly look forward to getting that notification from you. Keep up the great work, it truly does help us make a informed decision.
I know it has been said time and time again but I’ll add my voice. You have provided an invaluable service to those of us without the means or technical knowledge to discern which products to spend our hard earned money on. Thank you from the bottom of my heart and godspeed in all your future endeavors.
Perfect timing for me on this video. :-) I have an old wood deck that needs replacing. Thanks for all the work you put into making these fantastic testing videos!
@@ProjectFarm Thanks Todd.. I'm building a wood/metal cover for my 27ft Travel trailer.. This is valuable information, so I now know which screws I'll be buying to put it together.
The video we all wanted, but didn't realize we needed! Can we test concrete fasteners next? I want to see how they hold up head to head Thanks for your hard work!
@Project Farm Would you use the same type of concrete fasteners just different brands or different types of concrete fasteners. I would like to see the difference between concrete screws, hammer-set anchors, lag shields, lead screw anchors, plastic wall plugs, anchor bolts
Awesome! While the SS screws had poor shear strength, I still prefer to use them in most applications since the heads never rust or "run/streak" on vertical boards. Great video!
I built my mom's back porch with 1/4 inch lag bolts and SPAX deck screws. Thanks for letting me know that my arbitrary decision in fasteners wasn't a poor one. I've only recently discovered this channel but I have been watching a lot of your videos and am becoming increasingly grateful for what you do and look forward to learning more from your testing and experimentation.
In my experience, those coatings are simply for the color to match whatever your final finish is. It may also provide a little bit of lubrication on the way in. the corrosion resistance comes in the type of metal used in the screw.
I use the GRK screws for absolutely everything interior and exterior. I used to keep interior and exterior screws but that turns out to be way too many different boxes of fasteners. It's worth the extra price price to have the convenience and higher quality. I only buy the other colored screws if I'm trying to match a deck finish
Not just this video, but every video I've watched of yours are just absolutely awesome... You leave no stone unturned when it comes to testing products... I personally think you should have way more subscribers... I've made plenty of purchases based off your testing and have not been disappointed... Please keep the vids coming.
I've been using GRK and Spax as my primary screws for years now. The primary reason being the fit of the bit out of the box and the fact that I don't believe I've ever had a bit shear before I finished a box. Generally Spax is my go to all rounder for 2"-4" with GRK being my choice for their smaller and lag bolts. Sometimes it is worth that bit of extra money for consistent performance.
I used 6" long SPAX to anchor my ledger boards. A combination of screw design and the coating made it easy to drive with a 1/4" impact. NO Pre-drill, NO Splitting.. No way would that work with an old-school lag bolt even with a pre-drill.. AND Building code allows a smaller diameter SPAX than a Lag-bolt for the same application..
I switched from Grip Rite to Spax and GRK several years ago for several reasons, mostly structural rating and wider variety available. This fall, I removed some of the Grip Rite screws I installed in some cedar 11 years ago, and they still looked nearly new, but all the GRK screws outside also still are reusable. Like you said, I don't thing I've ever broken one of either GRK or Spax, and maybe one has come out of thousands driven with a defective drive hole. I like the extra drive nub that stabilizes the Spax screws, but the GRK are a little easier to find, and maybe start just a little easier. So I mostly use GRK for "construction" screws where the head will get sunk into the surface, but Spax for washer-face cabinet screws and lags. The lags from both companies are also great - soooo much easier to drive than traditional lag bolts, *and* no need to pre-drill.
I love how thorough your test matrix is, and the spreadsheet at the end is so helpful. It would be great to have a link to an Excel spreadsheet version, especially for people comparing products based on which criteria are most relevant to our applications (for example, I always use a corded Milwaukee driver and I don't build anything professionally, so I don't care if a screw takes a little longer to install...but corrosion and pull-out force are critical, when I build something I want it to last!)
Speaking as an engineer, I'm impressed that the variances are as small as they are. This tells me, you can't go wrong with deck screws -- plan for loads a modest fraction of the failure point and any will handle it. That just leaves individual variation in stuff like coating quality, and, the elephant in the room, consistency of the wood being driven into (which from other data I've seen, looks to be much worse!). Nice to see a stainless screw on here, I'd think those are fairly specialty (coastal salt spray, industrial environments?), shame they apparently aren't as strong but to me that's just a compromise for using something exceptional otherwise.
I wouldn't say they are weak though. I am quite shocked at the sheer strength of a single screw. I was worried about pulling myself up onto a walk way overhead beam I fitted in the garden using 2 screws just in case my weight broke the screws holding it in. I am not 600kg so now I know that I don't need to worry, the wood may break though hehe.
100% no on stainless. Bought a home with composite decking, ribs under neath rotted out. We could not get stainless screws out they all stripped out. Had to pry board up and remove the screws with channel locks from the bottom. Turned that several hours job into 2 days!
@@brianx2640 Rough! Yeah, that's a huge pain, just from the material being a little bit softer probably. Normal screws I think are heat treated 1050 or so steel, not so hard like tool steel but much stronger than mild (have rounded off many a wood screw, the traditional tapered kind, man those things suck!). That's why they bend a little, then snap. 305 stainless can only be work hardened, not heat treated, so it would figure the screws aren't as hard. Next best thing would be a PH stainless, probably? Might be too expensive for deck screws though.
Great video! I randomly grabbed Spax a few weeks ago and it was daunting to look at all the different screw options at Menards. As a newer Home Owner, I enjoy watching your content as it helps me feel more confident in what tools I buy for fixing my home. I think a great video would be for clamps, like bar clamps for wood. There are so many out there and I would imagine some brands will have a much more resilent and stronger design than others. Thank you as always!
I've stopped buying any screws or hardware that are branded as Menards (Spax are not Menards). Look at a Phillips screw wrong when the moon's out on Tuesday or not, it strips immediately. An employee at Lowe's said it's because I breathed on them. Anything works better, even no-name screws from Amazon.
Great job as always. As the winter season ultimately falls upon us, I suggest testing sidewalk salts. The price varies wildly amongst the brands. Even more curious is how something like water softener salt stacks up being it's roughly 1/4 the cost. It's price blows my mind because it's washed and cleaned, certified for human consumption, while what is available to throw on your sidewalk is far more expensive...
Sidewalk salt is an interesting subject. If my father were still alive, he could give anecdotes on what all he saw as a concrete and salt (during the winter) salesman. Basically the suppliers of the salt can vary widely even though the branding on the outside of the bag will be the same year after year. He had stories of calcium and other ice melts, and the nuances of such (like damage to surfaces, etc.). Wish I could recall them now. My guess is that the only ones that could be tests would be the processed / manufactured ones, as salt quality varies from place to place.
I use water softener salt. 40lbs for less than 1lb of "sidewalk" salt. Salt is salt, and while we do get extreme cold of -30f or colder that's not when you get ice. We get ice when it's 15-20* or warmer and it makes zero difference what salt I use. Grass doesn't seem to care either.
Thanks again, I really apreciate all of your time, effort, and expense. You have saved me much money, and made my life better. I watched this vid again because I'm building a shed and remembered your work. A few months ago I built a cargo trailer with wood, and used a lot of drywall screws as it was for one trip. As I dismantled it to start the shed, I found most of the screws with rust. It had not even rained on it. Again, thank you very much.
Fantastic video as always! I use Spax for nearly everything around the shop, so it’s good to see that they’re a top performer. Would love to see concrete fasteners next!
2nd vote for concrete fastener testing -- there's a lot of different designs out there and some are much more suited for certain applications than others (different types work best in brick, concrete, and mortar/masonry).
We love watching your videos, no BS, straight to the point, informative! As someone who isn't mechanically inclined I'm learning a lot AND what brands to buy when I need it. Your videos are much appreciated and very entertaining. Please never stop. Subbed, liked every video, doing what we can for you 👍 God Bless.
Unfortunately, it's not actually that informative. This is highly anecdotal testing: at best this is entertainment disguised as "science". Maybe PF found three good or three crap screws from each brand: maybe you can see the random "black swan", but you probably won't A minimum of 29 samples per brand would be genuine scientific testing. That way you can determine a minimum confidence level for average statistics, deviations, variance, and derived statistics. It tells you nothing about the average screws from each brand or the brand overall. Funny enough when a tool test channel torture tests a drill or impact driver and drives hundreds of screws, they are inadvertantly doing a proper level for sample size on the quality of screws, but they aren't usually thinking of testing for torque specs for the screws, etc.
@@Jujoji ... Who peed in your cereal dude ... Wow. I'm not looking for what you described, I'm looking for general use and things I'll be happy buying. Let it go.
@@flannelbeard4621 my point is that it's just entertainment, not informative. It isn't science. The video doesn't in any way show you or demonstrate which is the best screw brand. I'm sorry, but nobody should base their purchasing decisions on anecdotal evidence and a sample size of three screws per brand. At that level of statistical confidence, all screw brands are functionality equal, even the absolute garbage no-name brands you buy by the pound in bulk out of a bin at. PF may have had the absolute worst garbage screws of one brand and the supreme examples of another brand, you can't determine for yourself, his tests don't tell you if the average screws in that brand are that good or that bad, just those three, which you will never possess because he just destroyed them in his tests. By testing at least, if not more than, 29 screws per brand, you start having a valid idea of the properties of the average screw from that brand as opposed to the properties of individual screws
@@Jujoji _"By testing at least, if not more than, 29 screws per brand, ..."_ Where did you get that number from? Why not at least 17 screws per brand? Why not 56? Where's the magic of 29?
I've personally seen sharkbites get pushed off of copper pipe if the lines freeze, they don't give up without a fight though, the teeth will dig into the copper and literally shave slivers of copper off of the pipe as the ice expands inside it.
Amazing testing as always. Love me some power pro screws and glad they did well here. Will have to check out a few of these other brands to see which ones I like best.
I've come to appreciate how this guy gets right down to business without a lot of fanfare and hoopla. Thanks for performing great comparisons of products that are full of detail and information to help us decide on whats best to use.
The delivery of the information is at the right speed for my ADHD-hampered attention span. No need to bump up the vidoe playback speed. The depth of analysis satisfies my curiosity and I feel confident that the information I am given is thoughtful and well vetted. I am thankful for your content. Please keep up the great work!
This is an excellent analysis! I've often gone back & forth with myself about which screws are "best." I use a lot of GRK & Simpson because they are code approved replacements for certain nails. For times where I don't necessarily need a code approval, but still want a good screw, this will be a great guide!
I always make sure to have some Fastap and Fastap Plus screws on hand. They have a unique tip that cuts a somewhat bigger hole, and they are good for going into harder woods, or where you need to screw farther into wood to the point where the torque required would be enough to snap other screws. Their coated screws were developed for salt water docks. They are more expensive than other screws, but their unique tips allow them to do the job where other screws won't, or require pre-drilling. They're hard to find in stores, so I get them online.
There's no substitute for stainless steel. We have a deck next to a swimming pool that is outdoor-carpet-over-wood decking. No metal screws have held up like the stainless. We typically get about 5 years out of the carpet before I need to replace it, and I will replace some deck boards as well. The s/s screws are always easily removed and I can reuse them; the same never applied to metal screws regardless of their "ultra-tough ceramic coating". Even hot-dip galvanized screws didn't last. They may cost 3x as much but def worth the investment.
I'd love to see these shear strength and pullout force tests on various diameter lag screws (1/4"; 5/16"; 3/8"; 1/2"). Maybe zinc-plated vs galvanized as well?
@@ProjectFarm I noticed the triple coated screws weren't referenced . I wonder how well they actually do hold up against corrosion like they claim. Have you done a Vid on them?
Great video, this confirms my field use of several of these screws for fence work. It's rather amazing how much a simple screw has improved in the last twenty years!
@fire304 - I'm an extremely unskilled and unknowledgeable DIY homeowner (not kidding!), who is hoping to replace my fence this year myself (have been watching tons of TH-cam videos to learn). Aside from cost, what is your preferred screw? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm guessing that sheer and holding strength for all of the tested screws are more than adequate for single family residential fencing, and that durability/longevity to rust would be the most important.
@@PW98372 glad to help! Any "deck" screw from the local hardware store that is rated for pressure treated wood works great. I would recommend staying away from Phillips screws and going with square drive or star/torks drive (6 point star). These screws usually come with the correct bit in the box. Phillips bits tend to spin out and wreck the head of the screw when you drive them hard and that will come back to haunt you if you ever have to pull the screw later.
I've always swore by GRK (havent seen grip rite around my area)now I have science to back it up! Appreciate all the work you do to make sure everyone is getting the best bang for their buck.
My front deck I built over 35yrs ago. I used spiral nails which wer pretty impressive. Unfortunately I live within the snow belt and nails are fairly rotted since I use salt on deck. Wood is still in good shape and will use stainless screws on it.
some people tell me i over think things, like whats the best screw for the job. then i watch one of your videos. excellent work. not all screws are created equal.
Great testing! One thing that has always driven me crazy was for different sized deck screws sometimes need a different sized torx bit. This varies by manufacturer.
When I rehabbed my garage a few years back I bought a few boxes of (I think) 1 3/4" treated screws. Bought them a month apart, same manufacturer and "model" screw. One box used T-25, the other T-30. WTF?
All charts!! 9:16 avg. Torque required to drive in screws 9:29 subjective coating wear rating 11:24 avg. Speed of driving 13:13 shear load 16:08 average pull out force 16:55 weight to start screw into board 18:08 overall chart with results
Wow. This is perhaps the most thorough, efficient, comprehensive, and useful comparative review I've ever seen on any product at any time on any forum.
Yeahhhhhhhhhhh. This made me think maybe you could do an Electric Cordless Brushless Drywall Screw Gun comparison. Two brands I know of right away are Milwaukee waukee and Kobalt.
Testing screws, never thought of that. Great job. Something that would help me is testing masonry drill bits. Have a place in Florida & it’s all cement & cinder block. Haven’t found a good bit yet.
I've always been curious if those torque sticks (or as Amazon calls them: Torque limiting extensions) that impact wrenches are even remotely accurate. It might not make a good comparison video, but it'd be interesting. Thanks as always for the great videos!
As a mechanic, I use torque sticks all the time. No, they are not very accurate but I still prefer them to torque wrenches. I’ve never lost a wheel with torque sticks but have lost one using a torque wrench. Also when customers come in with loose wheels, it’s often due to tire shops using torque wrenches. I have no problem with techs using torque wrenches, but it’s crucial to retorque them after 100kms or less. With torque sticks I haven’t ever had to retorque a wheel. A torque stick typically torques more than what it’s rated for. But this also is effected by the torque output of the impact. Air and cordless make a difference and the blows per minute of the impact makes a difference. A wheel I’d say seats better to the hub using torque sticks than it would with a torque wrench. It also saves a lot of time.
@@ThatGuy-sd3zl No way I'd trust final torque to a torque stick. Too dependent on air line pressure and gun settings. They are fine for limiting the gun's torque, but final torque needs to set with a torque wrench. Question: Would you final torque the engine head bolts with a torque stick?
Yeah,this exactly. They aren't very accurate but they have a time and place and they depend on being matched to the right impact set up. They're great for things like rims and frame mount hradware but are a disastrous or at best poor choice for actual torque specific critical things like engine ead bolts. Actaully anything on the actual engine torque sticks are bad choice.
Ya, I don't use them for the final torque -- always use a torque wrench for that. What I find them useful for it to prevent over-torqueing wheel nuts when reinstalling a wheel. If torque spec is say, 100 ft-lbs, I put a 90 ft-lb torque limiting extension on the impact driver and install all the nuts, then go back with a torque wrench for the final 100 ft-lb spec. This makes sure that I don't over-torque the nuts using the impact driver.
Hey! Love the content! You are one of the best on TH-cam! Idea: best multi bit screwdriver (maybe ratcheting?) nice to have in a car or something in case you don’t want a full set
Interesting results! It will definitely have me looking closer at my normal deck screws when I remove them from temporary projects. I already had the unpleasant experience of removing SPAX deck screws that were maybe 10 years old: they held up much worse than whatever other brand the previous owner used (it was a less distinctive design) - nearly all the SPAX corroded and either stripped out the head, or the head snapped off. For those I could remove, they were far more eaten away than the other brand. I definitely won't be buying any. I've had some of the larger GRK structural screws, and they hold up well so far, including in reuse.
Hey, one of my suggestions got tested! Really appreciate it! Especially the starting test on the drill press! When you have to install 1000+ of them, that makes all the difference. The Grip Fast brand from Menards seems to be particularly poor at that and are such a pain that they're almost not worth using
Using engineered lumber would better eliminate the wood from being a possible variable factor of the results I recommend PSL Parallams. They are the OSB version of common lumber.
I am just a weekend hobbyist, but I absolutely loathe Philips screw heads. Torx may not be the best screw head around, but it's the best of those that are reasonably easy to find, and for small projects around the garage, paying a few extra bucks for coated deck screws with Torx heads instead of drywall screws is well worth the money in my opinion, if just for ease of installation.
@@jayschafer1760 The PH screw heads have their use, drywall and automatic screw guns are some of them. Deck screws like this, is not. Also, I always recommend Stainless Steel, Acid Proof fasteners for decks... It holds up better in the long run.
I actually didn't know there was a difference in deck screws, I've always used deck mate in the past but I'll start looking at them a little closer now. As always another great video, thanks.
Definitely one of the best channels on youtube! Suggestion: It would be nice to see comparison charts on which screw would be best for which application ex: for low-corrosion environments this is the strongest bang for your buck, for reduced drilling time & effort this screw is great for lightweight projects. Sometimes it's not only about best-of-the-best. I guess what I'm trying to say is it could be helpful to compare related charts before the final conclusion.
I would also appreciate a test of various liquids that could be sprayed or dipped onto the screws as or just before being used. Dripped or squirted into pre-drilled holes as well. I have found beeswax to work for several decades with plain or galvanized hardware.
SPAX are awesome, you can pull anything together, close a gap or drive them darn near all the way through the board and out the other side if you want I just wish they used the more common t25 size torx bit and the are pretty expensive. The grip right from Lowes are my basic go to unless I need something special.
@Ross Radford he did that too. I made two comments. This one and I suggested testing razor knife blades to see which ones actually last the longest without dulling, rusting or breaking. He responded to that comment also
After building dozens of decks, installing cabinets, building raised beds and installing various structural and non-structural elements over the years I by chance settled on GRK and Spax and the go to's with Grip RIte as the third alternate. Fortunately most people won't pay extra for the GRK or Spax screws so they always seem to be available. A bonus by default. The only issue I ever had with Grip Rite was the higher rate of unusuable screws due to excess coating application clogging the drive slots. And the rare shearing of the head when driven into harder, old wood. Maybe that's not a factor now but I can't remember a GRK or Spax screw shearing off. I'm sure it happened but not often enough to stick with me.
I can't tell you how much I love this channel. I will not buy anything without checking with you first, and I almost always buy the product that you recommend. What an invaluable resource! After watching the deck screw reviews I have to ask: have you considered testing composite deck boards? I currently have a bunch of people asking me which one to buy, all because of a brief comment on the Nextdoor app. Around here (Houston) we have intense heat and tons of rain and wood just doesn't cut it. Pretty much everyone with a wooden deck, dock, or walkway wants to or needs to replace it with composite. Along with composite we're all looking at aluminum, plastic, and the Weardeck fiberglass (a leading contender). Man would we love to see you do your thing on all of these options!
I'd say the most important aspect is corrosion resistance. In reality if you use any of these in a building project, you're going to have sufficient strength. But whether or not the project lasts for 30 years is pretty much solely reliant on if your screws rust out and give up or not.
My assumption was that GRK and Spax would be at the top of the list. The Grip-Rite was a surprise to me. Generally I've avoided the brand for one of the poorer performing screws. Why? Because the Grip-Rite boxes always fall apart before they're half empty.
Great information & timely for me as I've got two decks to build this spring. I do wish you had tested torque to twist off a screw and torque to camout the drive - those were the problems I've had with stainless Phillips and square drive. Frustrating to run a screw in and then have the head twist off while countersinking itself.
Absolutely loved this! Now I would really really like to see this done again, except with multi material construction screws. In particular Spax, mostly because according to the box they are meant to go into concrete. I want to see a video just like this testing out that multi material claim. In particular going in to sheet metal, concrete and drywall (no anchor). Is there a savings (and safety!) In using a multi material construction screw or are you better off with focus fired screws such as tapcon, expansion anchors, sheet metal screws or drywall anchors?
FWIW as a result of wood rot, I replaced all the decking on my deck in 2009 with treated wood. The old screws were horribly corroded (I don't think they even used coated screws), so I wanted to make sure the same thing didn't happen. So I bit the bullet and bought stainless steel screws. The deck is in a shady location, so dampness is an issue, plus the winters here are harsh. 11 years later I had to disassemble part of the steps to route some gutter drains underneath them. The screws had no visible corrosion. Same story on some other boards I removed and replaced from rot from carpenter ants. I'd say sulfuric acid is a shade too aggressive of a corrosion agent against stainless.
@@TheDaniel85 It depends on the concentration of the acid, and of course the type of acid. It looks like these screws were soaked in concentrated sulfuric acid, which is a very powerful reducing agent. Stainless varies from resisting 3% sulfuric, 20% sulfuric, and some even higher.
I'd like the thoughts of others about pre-drilling with these screws. Many say they don't need it, but I have found that taking the time to make pilot holes really makes for a cleaner result that seems to stay tightened for longer. Is this just chance (or a myth), and is there a science with how the wood fibers work with the fastener with and without pilot holes?
100% agree. I wonder this every time I have to drill more than a handful of pilot holes. Assuming no splitting, is no pilot hole the strongest fastening strength and longevity? If not, is it better to drill a pilot hole just smaller than the shaft excluding the thread diameter? And how big is the difference?
I replaced al the decking on my deck in 2009 with 2 x 6 inch treated wood. 13 years later and there's no splitting, and they haven't loosened. And this is on treated wood, which of course will shrink a little. I couldn't tell you with other types of wood if you need pilot holes or not. There's been a small number of pieces that have rotted due to carpenter ants, but that's the only maintenance issue I've had.
When timing how long it takes to screw in, wouldn't it make more sense to use the drill press for consistency? Put the bit in the chuck and use your weight to drive the press down into wood. Would remove the human part of it. Just a thought, unless I'm overlooking something.
Downward pressure doesn't matter with screws as they self feed, and a drill press doesn't have enough starting torque to drive a screw without a running start
I'm with the other guy, downward pressure only matters in getting the screw started. Once the threads grab it's irrelevant, instead you're just chasing the screw as it pulls itself into the wood. Which is why torx or square drive screws are so much easier to work with vs Phillips. Can't really comment on the torque aspect of using a drill press, however it makes sense. Especially since most drill presses change speed via adjusting a v belt (which slips easily) and they are usually just on/off vs a variable speed trigger.
One test I would like to see with something like this is end insertions and see which did the least amount of damage to the wood itself, such as splitting. To me, when I'm doing builds or installations, the ability to predrill better than another is important.
@@ProjectFarm you're welcome. That would be a tough one, because of the variability of the end grain of the wood but I'm sure you'd be the one to figure it out :)
Yes, I wonder if the self drilling tips actually make a difference. From my experience they do. I went through a box of guard dog and won't use them again due to how many splits I was having. Separately pre drilling is a waste of time.
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I have always used GRK. They have been exposed to freezing snow driven weather with no rusting and were easy to drive. They don’t try to walk when driving. Great video. Thanks again.
Not screwing around in this video. We all LOVE these videos...kind of use them as a reference library for buying, tire inflators, drill press cutting oil, masking tape, automotive ceramic coating, grease, glue and the list keeps going...just hope this channel helps pay the bills...off to buy some merch!
I recently installed deckmate screws on my deck and was kicking myself for not finding this video first. In the beginning of this video I was worried the corrosion resistance wasn't going to be good enough but after watching until the end I am happy to see that they didn't have corrosion even after visible damage to the coating 😃 Thanks for another helpful video!
Great tests! When I bought my house it came with 10,031 projects. I randomly picked Grip Rite construction screws after seeing an entire aisle filled with options, and they have been great. I did find a couple, randomly, where the bit wouldn't work because the hole was packed with something.
I really appreciate all the work, this man does for us. His attention to detail and the extreme testing procedures, I say this hard working, resourceful man deserves a hand and praise.
Firstly, the testing done on this channel is among the best I have ever seen! Not just on TH-cam, but that I have EVER seen!!! So it's not without irony and humor that I point this out: "Power pro looks very good, with no visible chipping..." Rolls it over and shows a relatively GIANT chip... 🤣
I'm so glad I found this channel. I would love to see a video on the best engine parts cleaning solution. I just dismantled my 67' VW Beetle engine and it has stubborn grease deposits on nearly every part and surface. There are so many solvents and solutions on the market; I would love to see them go head-to-head.
Excellent testing methodology. I've given up using phillips head deck screws for obvious reasons. The last deck I replaced had rusted out phillips head screws and every one of the screw heads broke off when trying to remove them.
I'M SO GLAD YOU MENTIONED NAILS HAVING MORE SHEAR STRENGTH 💪 SO MANY PEOPLE IN THE INDUSTRY USE SCREWS WHERE NAILS ARE NEEDED AND NAILS WHERE SCREWS ARE NEEDED. SCREWS SQUEEZE TWO THINGS TOGETHER (TENSILE STRENGTH) , NAILS STOP TWO THINGS FROM SLIDING APART (SHEAR STRENGTH) . WANT TORNADO 🌪 RESISTANT? USE BOTH!
Before even watching this I have been buying GRK and Grip rite (tip from a home builder I know) glade to here my last 10 years of projects are held together well. great vid very well done!
Excellent set of tests. Comprehensive. I’ve been using SPAX stainless screws for exterior treated wood and redwood - I know they are “softer” and I was (pleasantly) surprised at how well the stainless screw performed. Especially since I had little choice according to the various manufacturers’ instructions. Thanks for the review.
You are right about the Deck Pro, I had a wooden walkway built three years ago, we live in Michigan, and a lot of the screws have come loose. They were purchased at Home Depot.
Here’s the list of products reviewed. More details in the video description. Thank you!
SPAX: amzn.to/35ENWjr
GRK: amzn.to/3IO64W5
WoodPro: amzn.to/3KX2CKy
FastenMaster: amzn.to/3AFAwPv
PowerPro: amzn.to/3u8qrJt
Grip Rite: amzn.to/32NFBsA
Deck Plus: amzn.to/3GezkUa
Velocity: amzn.to/3ufQy1d
Eagle Claw: amzn.to/3rapApJ
DeckMate: Available at Home Depot
Deck-Drive: Available at Lowes
Man, I remember when this guy first came up on TH-cam, I thought he did a lot of work for little reward. Now he is a force of nature. Me and others coming here before buying anything. Goes to show if you put the drive and heart into something you believe in, people will follow
Thank you!
AND he still replies to most comments! THAT is passion, not just doing the work. thank you for being an incredible part of this community. i’ve been watching for years :)
Well said. Couldn't agree more.
That’s no joke. I went to buy the Wiha screw drivers 48 hours after his screwdriver video and they were sold out EVERYWHERE.
@@turbotension 😂😂😂😂 wow. Amazing!!!!
There are a few TH-cam channels I watch where people attempt to "test" things or claims. Project Farm, by a long shot, is the best. You do your damndest every single time to fairly and scientifically test products (and even torture test) and I definitely appreciate your hard work. I've made several purchases based on your testing and have never been disappointed.
Thanks so much!
@Ross Radford disagree
@Ross Radford nah, I love getting a reply, no matter how short.
@Ross Radford disagree. Project farm is the real OG no matter what.
I really only buy based on his review haha. Long time fan
There's actually a very interesting story about the grk screws.
The original owner made sure they were manufactured in either the US or Germany, and eventually brought the majority of manufacturing here to the US. Eventually one of the evil Omni mega corps bought him out, but the terms of the buy out stated the US manufacturing had to remain open. The new owner violated that, shipped manufacturing to Taiwan, and the quality took a massive crap.
However, due to them violating the terms of the agreement, the original owner, with hundreds of millions of dollars, opened u2 fasteners built to the same original standards with a few new improvements to design and production. Ran grk out of town in the northwest. And brought American manufacturing back.
This all took place around 2016
The irony is that they would end up buying most of the tools and machines that were sold to ITW for a fraction of the price LMAO.
Great information. Thank you
Good information! Thanks.
Nice fun fact
Are you the original owner of GRK? 😏
You know, PF gets a lot of compliments about the resource and information that his videos provide and I appreciate that as well, but I don’t think he gets enough praise for how entertaining these videos are as well. Every time I start watching the channel, I end up watching all his videos again, I’ve seen them all a few times, that’s how entertaining they are. It’s kind of like mythbusters and I loved that show. Project farm is like a mythbusters that saves you money at the same time, as PF would say, very impressive.
Thanks so much!
I'm not so sure that I would call it entertaining so much as it is satisfying or even cathartic, there's just something supremely relaxing about watching his videos.
I usually end up binging 3-5 videos in a go and every once in awhile I watch one of his older videos where he's seeing how quickly he can blow up a harbor freight motor with cruddy oil substitutes.
And even those videos allow me to appreciate how his dry humor and video editing have transformed and polished through the years.
Because I'm the same as you, I've been subscribed for years now and his changes have been subtle and yet transformative.
I didn't subscribe to a dude who compares all that crap in your garage, instead I subscribed to a relaxing, informative and yet entertaining guy and he ended up doing comparison videos.
Agreed, though I do not know about watching some of the more technical ones more then once. Half the time I cannot hear fast enough and have to review the charts. Though Farm Baego is plenty of laughs. I respect the objective focus. Spare the opinion until results are in.
We're gonna test that!
His enthusiasm is infectious
I never thought of testing screws. That's why you're the BEST tester ever! I def look forward to my Sunday with Project Farm!
Thank you very much!!
@@ProjectFarm You are very welcome!
Didn’t think I’d be so interested in this, cool stuff!
He has tested other screws in the past so search his channel for other good content on screws.
@@curtisbme I've seen them all. But there are so many that I lost track. Thanks for reminding me. These were screws with some sort of covering on them. That was the difference, right?
So far Project Farm helped me choose my electric chainsaw, leaf blower, cordless drill, string trimmer and generator. Now it's screws! This channel has never steered me wrong.
Thanks!
Todd -- This video made me tear up since I suggested it to you on my dad's behalf. He was always interested in your fastener videos. Sadly, my dad died a week ago of a heart attack. He and I are big fans of your channel. Thank you so much for improving the lives of little people like us with your authentic reviews ❤
🤯🤯🤯 Video Ideas 🤯🤯🤯
• Best food vacuum-sealer
• Best work socks for work boots
• Best latex gloves for auto work
• Best emergency poncho for roadside repairs or the football game
• Best safety wire tool (careful: too much safety-wiring by hand can cause carpal tunnel syndrome or other wrist injury)
• Strongest safety wire
• Best portable oxy acetylene torch kit
• Best economy welder (TIG, MIG, stick)
• Best welding apron
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• Best work jeans
• Best full face shield
• Best heavy duty ratchet straps (such as the classic yellow cargo straps used by truckers)
My deepest sympathy in the loss of your dad! Thanks for sharing your camaraderie for the channel! Thanks for the video ideas.
Sorry about your Dad. The Lord's Peace be with you and your family.
Sincerely, I'm very sorry for you and your families loss! God bless you bro.🙏🙏🙏
IN-Line Torque Adapter? What?! Of course, you have one of those on hand. It doesn't seem to matter what piece of equipment I go to research, Project Farm pops up with the most thorough review partnered with fantastic demonstrations. Why do I bother watching any other channel when it comes to tools I "need". Simply the best, well-deserved priority in all searches.
Thanks!
The GRK and Spax both did well, but the GRK comes in a nice, sturdy, stackable plastic box, which is not to be underestimated.
Thanks for the feedback.
I currently store MANY of various things in various GRK boxes.
So much for environmentally friendly being part of the purchase decision.
@@ProleDaddy While I am all for things which arre _actually_ environmentally-friendly, building a house _by itself_ isn't one of those things unless you use nothing but hand tools. Even still you still destroy a little bit of forest using wood construction. And concrete? That emits greenhouse gases while building. Regardless, house construction is _very_ environmentally _unfriendly_ unless it's a mud hut.
Yeah half my extra screws and stuff are in the same lol
Personally I use Spax after using a few different brands. I found that over time the Spax stayed tight better than others. Having a screw stay in place, for me anyway, is more important than a little extra effort to install. I have only used SS one time and that was on a dock. They did excellent during the build but after a season I had to go back and tighten most of them down.
Of course alot of it is from wood shrinking especially with pressure treated. I did use Spax on a redwood one time from customer request. I told him that I would not guarantee that it wouldn't discolor at every screw point. Two years later it still had not discolored hardly any at all. Only a couple areas had a very slight discolor.
Of course I pre drill everything with a counter sinking bit so that helped I guess. All structural gets galvanized ring shank by hand, never cared for a nail gun for build decks. But over all Spax has proven to be a extremely good deck screw. The cost is only slightly more than deck mate but the over all performance is well worth it.
Thanks again another great video, I honestly look forward to getting that notification from you. Keep up the great work, it truly does help us make a informed decision.
Spax has disappeared from HDepot shelves. I assumed they went out of business, due to the pandemic.
@@bclamore nah they don't ,maybe just in the u.s.,but i doubt that
You are welcome! Glad to hear!
@@bclamore We still have Spax at Home Depot in Alaska.
I’m also fond of Spax’s T-Star Plus head. It just seems more stable than other screw-to-bit interfaces.
I know it has been said time and time again but I’ll add my voice. You have provided an invaluable service to those of us without the means or technical knowledge to discern which products to spend our hard earned money on. Thank you from the bottom of my heart and godspeed in all your future endeavors.
Thanks so much!
Perfect timing for me on this video. :-) I have an old wood deck that needs replacing. Thanks for all the work you put into making these fantastic testing videos!
Awesome!! Glad to help!!
@@ProjectFarm Thanks Todd.. I'm building a wood/metal cover for my 27ft Travel trailer.. This is valuable information, so I now know which screws I'll be buying to put it together.
And I'm watching this from a highrise lol. Good luck with the deck!
@@sorsorsor11 It just means that your deck has to be REALLY tall.
@@ProjectFarm love the videos! Please test redline shockproof gear oil!
The video we all wanted, but didn't realize we needed! Can we test concrete fasteners next? I want to see how they hold up head to head
Thanks for your hard work!
Thank you for the video idea!
@Project Farm Would you use the same type of concrete fasteners just different brands or different types of concrete fasteners. I would like to see the difference between concrete screws, hammer-set anchors, lag shields, lead screw anchors, plastic wall plugs, anchor bolts
Well I guess we can expect tapcons...
Agree, why haven’t I thought of suggesting this already. So simple, right in front of my eyes.
Awesome! While the SS screws had poor shear strength, I still prefer to use them in most applications since the heads never rust or "run/streak" on vertical boards. Great video!
Thanks! Thanks for the feedback.
I think for most deck applications the corrosion resistance is the most important of these traits tested.
@@whirving being a professional deck builder and having demoed hundreds of old decks, I would agree with you.
I agree I work near salt water and with alot of red cedar woods and only trust stainless they strip easy and bend but will never rust or bleed
I used stainless Robertson to put together a child's bed frame. Shear strength wasn't the issue - and it shouldn't be for a deck.
I built my mom's back porch with 1/4 inch lag bolts and SPAX deck screws. Thanks for letting me know that my arbitrary decision in fasteners wasn't a poor one. I've only recently discovered this channel but I have been watching a lot of your videos and am becoming increasingly grateful for what you do and look forward to learning more from your testing and experimentation.
Thanks! Thanks for sharing.
In my experience, those coatings are simply for the color to match whatever your final finish is. It may also provide a little bit of lubrication on the way in. the corrosion resistance comes in the type of metal used in the screw.
Great point! Thank you
I use the GRK screws for absolutely everything interior and exterior. I used to keep interior and exterior screws but that turns out to be way too many different boxes of fasteners. It's worth the extra price price to have the convenience and higher quality. I only buy the other colored screws if I'm trying to match a deck finish
It’s also a anti corrosive coating for green treated wood. The chemicals used to treat the wood deteriorates non coated screws twice as fast.
Yes. I agree
Or go big and run stainless 💪
Not just this video, but every video I've watched of yours are just absolutely awesome... You leave no stone unturned when it comes to testing products... I personally think you should have way more subscribers... I've made plenty of purchases based off your testing and have not been disappointed... Please keep the vids coming.
Thanks, will do!
OMG he replied...😌😊😃
I've been using GRK and Spax as my primary screws for years now. The primary reason being the fit of the bit out of the box and the fact that I don't believe I've ever had a bit shear before I finished a box. Generally Spax is my go to all rounder for 2"-4" with GRK being my choice for their smaller and lag bolts. Sometimes it is worth that bit of extra money for consistent performance.
Thanks for the feedback.
I used 6" long SPAX to anchor my ledger boards. A combination of screw design and the coating made it easy to drive with a 1/4" impact. NO Pre-drill, NO Splitting.. No way would that work with an old-school lag bolt even with a pre-drill.. AND Building code allows a smaller diameter SPAX than a Lag-bolt for the same application..
I switched from Grip Rite to Spax and GRK several years ago for several reasons, mostly structural rating and wider variety available. This fall, I removed some of the Grip Rite screws I installed in some cedar 11 years ago, and they still looked nearly new, but all the GRK screws outside also still are reusable. Like you said, I don't thing I've ever broken one of either GRK or Spax, and maybe one has come out of thousands driven with a defective drive hole.
I like the extra drive nub that stabilizes the Spax screws, but the GRK are a little easier to find, and maybe start just a little easier. So I mostly use GRK for "construction" screws where the head will get sunk into the surface, but Spax for washer-face cabinet screws and lags.
The lags from both companies are also great - soooo much easier to drive than traditional lag bolts, *and* no need to pre-drill.
I love how thorough your test matrix is, and the spreadsheet at the end is so helpful. It would be great to have a link to an Excel spreadsheet version, especially for people comparing products based on which criteria are most relevant to our applications (for example, I always use a corded Milwaukee driver and I don't build anything professionally, so I don't care if a screw takes a little longer to install...but corrosion and pull-out force are critical, when I build something I want it to last!)
Thanks!
Speaking as an engineer, I'm impressed that the variances are as small as they are. This tells me, you can't go wrong with deck screws -- plan for loads a modest fraction of the failure point and any will handle it. That just leaves individual variation in stuff like coating quality, and, the elephant in the room, consistency of the wood being driven into (which from other data I've seen, looks to be much worse!). Nice to see a stainless screw on here, I'd think those are fairly specialty (coastal salt spray, industrial environments?), shame they apparently aren't as strong but to me that's just a compromise for using something exceptional otherwise.
Thanks for sharing.
I wouldn't say they are weak though. I am quite shocked at the sheer strength of a single screw. I was worried about pulling myself up onto a walk way overhead beam I fitted in the garden using 2 screws just in case my weight broke the screws holding it in. I am not 600kg so now I know that I don't need to worry, the wood may break though hehe.
100% no on stainless. Bought a home with composite decking, ribs under neath rotted out. We could not get stainless screws out they all stripped out. Had to pry board up and remove the screws with channel locks from the bottom. Turned that several hours job into 2 days!
@@brianx2640 Rough! Yeah, that's a huge pain, just from the material being a little bit softer probably.
Normal screws I think are heat treated 1050 or so steel, not so hard like tool steel but much stronger than mild (have rounded off many a wood screw, the traditional tapered kind, man those things suck!). That's why they bend a little, then snap. 305 stainless can only be work hardened, not heat treated, so it would figure the screws aren't as hard. Next best thing would be a PH stainless, probably? Might be too expensive for deck screws though.
SS only for industrial environment? Come on! I use only 304 stainless screws in my home, cost negligible compared to the items they're fastened on
Great video! I randomly grabbed Spax a few weeks ago and it was daunting to look at all the different screw options at Menards. As a newer Home Owner, I enjoy watching your content as it helps me feel more confident in what tools I buy for fixing my home.
I think a great video would be for clamps, like bar clamps for wood. There are so many out there and I would imagine some brands will have a much more resilent and stronger design than others. Thank you as always!
Thanks! Thanks for the video idea.
Been using Spax screws since 5 years ago. Love them.
I've stopped buying any screws or hardware that are branded as Menards (Spax are not Menards). Look at a Phillips screw wrong when the moon's out on Tuesday or not, it strips immediately. An employee at Lowe's said it's because I breathed on them. Anything works better, even no-name screws from Amazon.
Great job as always. As the winter season ultimately falls upon us, I suggest testing sidewalk salts. The price varies wildly amongst the brands. Even more curious is how something like water softener salt stacks up being it's roughly 1/4 the cost. It's price blows my mind because it's washed and cleaned, certified for human consumption, while what is available to throw on your sidewalk is far more expensive...
Thanks! Thanks for the video idea.
Sidewalk salt is an interesting subject. If my father were still alive, he could give anecdotes on what all he saw as a concrete and salt (during the winter) salesman. Basically the suppliers of the salt can vary widely even though the branding on the outside of the bag will be the same year after year. He had stories of calcium and other ice melts, and the nuances of such (like damage to surfaces, etc.). Wish I could recall them now.
My guess is that the only ones that could be tests would be the processed / manufactured ones, as salt quality varies from place to place.
huge +1 to this idea. definitely think it's a good one and I hope he gets around to it.
Great idea, I hope this catches on project farms agenda
I use water softener salt. 40lbs for less than 1lb of "sidewalk" salt. Salt is salt, and while we do get extreme cold of -30f or colder that's not when you get ice. We get ice when it's 15-20* or warmer and it makes zero difference what salt I use. Grass doesn't seem to care either.
Thanks again, I really apreciate all of your time, effort, and expense. You have saved me much money, and made my life better. I watched this vid again because I'm building a shed and remembered your work. A few months ago I built a cargo trailer with wood, and used a lot of drywall screws as it was for one trip. As I dismantled it to start the shed, I found most of the screws with rust. It had not even rained on it. Again, thank you very much.
Thanks and you are welcome!
Fantastic video as always! I use Spax for nearly everything around the shop, so it’s good to see that they’re a top performer. Would love to see concrete fasteners next!
2nd vote for concrete fastener testing -- there's a lot of different designs out there and some are much more suited for certain applications than others (different types work best in brick, concrete, and mortar/masonry).
Thanks! Thanks for the suggestion.
We love watching your videos, no BS, straight to the point, informative! As someone who isn't mechanically inclined I'm learning a lot AND what brands to buy when I need it. Your videos are much appreciated and very entertaining. Please never stop. Subbed, liked every video, doing what we can for you 👍 God Bless.
Thanks! Thanks for watching and subscribing!
Unfortunately, it's not actually that informative. This is highly anecdotal testing: at best this is entertainment disguised as "science". Maybe PF found three good or three crap screws from each brand: maybe you can see the random "black swan", but you probably won't
A minimum of 29 samples per brand would be genuine scientific testing. That way you can determine a minimum confidence level for average statistics, deviations, variance, and derived statistics. It tells you nothing about the average screws from each brand or the brand overall.
Funny enough when a tool test channel torture tests a drill or impact driver and drives hundreds of screws, they are inadvertantly doing a proper level for sample size on the quality of screws, but they aren't usually thinking of testing for torque specs for the screws, etc.
@@Jujoji ... Who peed in your cereal dude ... Wow. I'm not looking for what you described, I'm looking for general use and things I'll be happy buying. Let it go.
@@flannelbeard4621 my point is that it's just entertainment, not informative. It isn't science.
The video doesn't in any way show you or demonstrate which is the best screw brand. I'm sorry, but nobody should base their purchasing decisions on anecdotal evidence and a sample size of three screws per brand. At that level of statistical confidence, all screw brands are functionality equal, even the absolute garbage no-name brands you buy by the pound in bulk out of a bin at. PF may have had the absolute worst garbage screws of one brand and the supreme examples of another brand, you can't determine for yourself, his tests don't tell you if the average screws in that brand are that good or that bad, just those three, which you will never possess because he just destroyed them in his tests.
By testing at least, if not more than, 29 screws per brand, you start having a valid idea of the properties of the average screw from that brand as opposed to the properties of individual screws
@@Jujoji _"By testing at least, if not more than, 29 screws per brand, ..."_
Where did you get that number from? Why not at least 17 screws per brand? Why not 56? Where's the magic of 29?
Once again, great informative video! Would be interested in a sharkbite vs pex crimp vs pex expansion vs copper solder strength test!
Great video idea! Thank you
👍🏼 Copper wins (unless frozen) is my bet! Probably a good test candidate if you can rent or borrow a PEX expansion tool!
I've personally seen sharkbites get pushed off of copper pipe if the lines freeze, they don't give up without a fight though, the teeth will dig into the copper and literally shave slivers of copper off of the pipe as the ice expands inside it.
pex copper ring crimp vs the thin stainless ring crimp
The pipe material bursts before the connections on everything but the sharkbite.
I honestly cannot imagine all the time and work tgat was put into making a video like this!!..I appluad you sir.Thanks a lot!!!
Thanks and you are welcome!
Great to see that most screws tested are very common in most suppliers.
Always enjoy your informative tests and reviews.
Thanks
Thanks and you are welcome!
Amazing testing as always. Love me some power pro screws and glad they did well here. Will have to check out a few of these other brands to see which ones I like best.
Thank you!
Didn't you already build out your deck though?
Just cant say enough about how good your tests are, and the thoroughness of each. Great job, great channel!
Thanks so much!
I've come to appreciate how this guy gets right down to business without a lot of fanfare and hoopla. Thanks for performing great comparisons of products that are full of detail and information to help us decide on whats best to use.
I appreciate that! Thanks!
You gotta come up with some T-Shirts "We're Gonna Test That"
As always this man never ceases to amaze me with the amount of effort he puts into his videos
Thanks!
Imagine how long all of this testing took ! Also the editing ! Thank you, Project Farm !
You are welcome!
Dude are you for real he does this for a job.
@@designstudio8013 Jealousy much? Responding to a comment that’s two years old?
The delivery of the information is at the right speed for my ADHD-hampered attention span. No need to bump up the vidoe playback speed. The depth of analysis satisfies my curiosity and I feel confident that the information I am given is thoughtful and well vetted. I am thankful for your content. Please keep up the great work!
Thanks, will do!
This is an excellent analysis! I've often gone back & forth with myself about which screws are "best." I use a lot of GRK & Simpson because they are code approved replacements for certain nails. For times where I don't necessarily need a code approval, but still want a good screw, this will be a great guide!
Thanks and you are welcome!
I always make sure to have some Fastap and Fastap Plus screws on hand. They have a unique tip that cuts a somewhat bigger hole, and they are good for going into harder woods, or where you need to screw farther into wood to the point where the torque required would be enough to snap other screws. Their coated screws were developed for salt water docks. They are more expensive than other screws, but their unique tips allow them to do the job where other screws won't, or require pre-drilling. They're hard to find in stores, so I get them online.
There's no substitute for stainless steel. We have a deck next to a swimming pool that is outdoor-carpet-over-wood decking. No metal screws have held up like the stainless. We typically get about 5 years out of the carpet before I need to replace it, and I will replace some deck boards as well. The s/s screws are always easily removed and I can reuse them; the same never applied to metal screws regardless of their "ultra-tough ceramic coating". Even hot-dip galvanized screws didn't last. They may cost 3x as much but def worth the investment.
Keep up the great work project farm, always appreciate the effort you put into these.
Thank you very much!
I'd love to see these shear strength and pullout force tests on various diameter lag screws (1/4"; 5/16"; 3/8"; 1/2"). Maybe zinc-plated vs galvanized as well?
Thanks for the video idea.
That would be interesting cause they are used quite a bit in deck building.
Right, with some adds for the items like Headlok and similar along with mixing in Simpson for head to head comparison.
@@ProjectFarm I noticed the triple coated screws weren't referenced . I wonder how well they actually do hold up against corrosion like they claim. Have you done a Vid on them?
Dish Soap! I would love to see your testing of the best dish soap for washing by hand. I think everyone would appreciate your thorough testing!
Thanks for the video idea.
Great video, this confirms my field use of several of these screws for fence work. It's rather amazing how much a simple screw has improved in the last twenty years!
Thanks! Thanks for the feedback.
@fire304 - I'm an extremely unskilled and unknowledgeable DIY homeowner (not kidding!), who is hoping to replace my fence this year myself (have been watching tons of TH-cam videos to learn). Aside from cost, what is your preferred screw? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm guessing that sheer and holding strength for all of the tested screws are more than adequate for single family residential fencing, and that durability/longevity to rust would be the most important.
@@PW98372 glad to help! Any "deck" screw from the local hardware store that is rated for pressure treated wood works great. I would recommend staying away from Phillips screws and going with square drive or star/torks drive (6 point star). These screws usually come with the correct bit in the box. Phillips bits tend to spin out and wreck the head of the screw when you drive them hard and that will come back to haunt you if you ever have to pull the screw later.
@@fire304 Thank you!!!
I've always swore by GRK (havent seen grip rite around my area)now I have science to back it up! Appreciate all the work you do to make sure everyone is getting the best bang for their buck.
Thanks! Thanks for sharing.
My front deck I built over 35yrs ago. I used spiral nails which wer pretty impressive. Unfortunately I live within the snow belt and nails are fairly rotted since I use salt on deck. Wood is still in good shape and will use stainless screws on it.
Thanks for sharing.
some people tell me i over think things, like whats the best screw for the job. then i watch one of your videos. excellent work. not all screws are created equal.
Good Point!
Great testing! One thing that has always driven me crazy was for different sized deck screws sometimes need a different sized torx bit. This varies by manufacturer.
Thanks! Thanks for the feedback.
When I rehabbed my garage a few years back I bought a few boxes of (I think) 1 3/4" treated screws. Bought them a month apart, same manufacturer and "model" screw. One box used T-25, the other T-30. WTF?
Great video, and just in time! We're rebuilding the deck at our house this summer.
Perfect timing! Thank you
All charts!!
9:16 avg. Torque required to drive in screws
9:29 subjective coating wear rating
11:24 avg. Speed of driving
13:13 shear load
16:08 average pull out force
16:55 weight to start screw into board
18:08 overall chart with results
I've used GRK (from Home Depot) for a few projects, though the big structural screws not the deck stuff, and was always impressed by them. Good test.
Thanks! Thanks for sharing.
Wow. This is perhaps the most thorough, efficient, comprehensive, and useful comparative review I've ever seen on any product at any time on any forum.
Wow, thanks!
Yeahhhhhhhhhhh. This made me think maybe you could do an Electric Cordless Brushless Drywall Screw Gun comparison. Two brands I know of right away are Milwaukee waukee and Kobalt.
Great suggestion! Thank you
Testing screws, never thought of that. Great job. Something that would help me is testing masonry drill bits. Have a place in Florida & it’s all cement & cinder block. Haven’t found a good bit yet.
Thanks! Thanks for the video idea.
He tested some last year, check the back videos.
I've always been curious if those torque sticks (or as Amazon calls them: Torque limiting extensions) that impact wrenches are even remotely accurate. It might not make a good comparison video, but it'd be interesting.
Thanks as always for the great videos!
Thanks! Thanks for the video idea.
As a mechanic, I use torque sticks all the time. No, they are not very accurate but I still prefer them to torque wrenches. I’ve never lost a wheel with torque sticks but have lost one using a torque wrench. Also when customers come in with loose wheels, it’s often due to tire shops using torque wrenches. I have no problem with techs using torque wrenches, but it’s crucial to retorque them after 100kms or less. With torque sticks I haven’t ever had to retorque a wheel.
A torque stick typically torques more than what it’s rated for. But this also is effected by the torque output of the impact. Air and cordless make a difference and the blows per minute of the impact makes a difference.
A wheel I’d say seats better to the hub using torque sticks than it would with a torque wrench. It also saves a lot of time.
@@ThatGuy-sd3zl No way I'd trust final torque to a torque stick. Too dependent on air line pressure and gun settings. They are fine for limiting the gun's torque, but final torque needs to set with a torque wrench. Question: Would you final torque the engine head bolts with a torque stick?
Yeah,this exactly. They aren't very accurate but they have a time and place and they depend on being matched to the right impact set up. They're great for things like rims and frame mount hradware but are a disastrous or at best poor choice for actual torque specific critical things like engine ead bolts. Actaully anything on the actual engine torque sticks are bad choice.
Ya, I don't use them for the final torque -- always use a torque wrench for that. What I find them useful for it to prevent over-torqueing wheel nuts when reinstalling a wheel. If torque spec is say, 100 ft-lbs, I put a 90 ft-lb torque limiting extension on the impact driver and install all the nuts, then go back with a torque wrench for the final 100 ft-lb spec. This makes sure that I don't over-torque the nuts using the impact driver.
I just saw this. I am rebuilding a 48 year old deck. Your video helped quite a bit. Thank you
Glad to hear!
Hey! Love the content! You are one of the best on TH-cam!
Idea: best multi bit screwdriver (maybe ratcheting?) nice to have in a car or something in case you don’t want a full set
Thank you for the video idea!
Interesting results! It will definitely have me looking closer at my normal deck screws when I remove them from temporary projects. I already had the unpleasant experience of removing SPAX deck screws that were maybe 10 years old: they held up much worse than whatever other brand the previous owner used (it was a less distinctive design) - nearly all the SPAX corroded and either stripped out the head, or the head snapped off. For those I could remove, they were far more eaten away than the other brand. I definitely won't be buying any. I've had some of the larger GRK structural screws, and they hold up well so far, including in reuse.
Thanks for the feedback.
Hey, one of my suggestions got tested! Really appreciate it! Especially the starting test on the drill press! When you have to install 1000+ of them, that makes all the difference. The Grip Fast brand from Menards seems to be particularly poor at that and are such a pain that they're almost not worth using
You are welcome!
This guy gets right to the point. No chit chat. One of best and most informative reviews I’ve seen.
Thanks so much!
Using engineered lumber would better eliminate the wood from being a possible variable factor of the results
I recommend PSL Parallams. They are the OSB version of common lumber.
Thanks for the feedback.
Amazing video Todd… glad you did t25 instead of #2 Philips
Thank you very much!
I am just a weekend hobbyist, but I absolutely loathe Philips screw heads. Torx may not be the best screw head around, but it's the best of those that are reasonably easy to find, and for small projects around the garage, paying a few extra bucks for coated deck screws with Torx heads instead of drywall screws is well worth the money in my opinion, if just for ease of installation.
@@jayschafer1760 The PH screw heads have their use, drywall and automatic screw guns are some of them. Deck screws like this, is not. Also, I always recommend Stainless Steel, Acid Proof fasteners for decks... It holds up better in the long run.
I actually didn't know there was a difference in deck screws, I've always used deck mate in the past but I'll start looking at them a little closer now.
As always another great video, thanks.
Thanks and you are welcome! Thanks for the feedback.
A thing to remember is the smooth or different thread pitch help pull the closer side against what you are securing it to.
Here in Montana we trust "Big Timber" screws - I'm always impressed and never let down.
Thanks for sharing.
Definitely one of the best channels on youtube!
Suggestion: It would be nice to see comparison charts on which screw would be best for which application ex: for low-corrosion environments this is the strongest bang for your buck, for reduced drilling time & effort this screw is great for lightweight projects. Sometimes it's not only about best-of-the-best. I guess what I'm trying to say is it could be helpful to compare related charts before the final conclusion.
I would also appreciate a test of various liquids that could be sprayed or dipped onto the screws as or just before being used. Dripped or squirted into pre-drilled holes as well. I have found beeswax to work for several decades with plain or galvanized hardware.
Thanks! Thanks for the video idea.
SPAX are awesome, you can pull anything together, close a gap or drive them darn near all the way through the board and out the other side if you want I just wish they used the more common t25 size torx bit and the are pretty expensive. The grip right from Lowes are my basic go to unless I need something special.
Agreed on SPAX. Grabbed some on a whim a few years ago for a honey-do project and have been sold on their screws since. Great quality.
Thanks for the feedback.
@Ross Radford he did that too. I made two comments. This one and I suggested testing razor knife blades to see which ones actually last the longest without dulling, rusting or breaking. He responded to that comment also
After building dozens of decks, installing cabinets, building raised beds and installing various structural and non-structural elements over the years I by chance settled on GRK and Spax and the go to's with Grip RIte as the third alternate. Fortunately most people won't pay extra for the GRK or Spax screws so they always seem to be available. A bonus by default. The only issue I ever had with Grip Rite was the higher rate of unusuable screws due to excess coating application clogging the drive slots. And the rare shearing of the head when driven into harder, old wood. Maybe that's not a factor now but I can't remember a GRK or Spax screw shearing off. I'm sure it happened but not often enough to stick with me.
Thanks for sharing.
I can't tell you how much I love this channel. I will not buy anything without checking with you first, and I almost always buy the product that you recommend. What an invaluable resource!
After watching the deck screw reviews I have to ask: have you considered testing composite deck boards? I currently have a bunch of people asking me which one to buy, all because of a brief comment on the Nextdoor app. Around here (Houston) we have intense heat and tons of rain and wood just doesn't cut it. Pretty much everyone with a wooden deck, dock, or walkway wants to or needs to replace it with composite. Along with composite we're all looking at aluminum, plastic, and the Weardeck fiberglass (a leading contender). Man would we love to see you do your thing on all of these options!
I'd say the most important aspect is corrosion resistance. In reality if you use any of these in a building project, you're going to have sufficient strength. But whether or not the project lasts for 30 years is pretty much solely reliant on if your screws rust out and give up or not.
Yes, great point!
Mmhmm. We've all seen 15 year old decks with massive cupping and lifting because half the screws have broken right in half
Found that to be true on fence rails! 😕
At this point I don't have to worry if anything lasts for 30 years because I won't be around then.
Color matters as well.
My assumption was that GRK and Spax would be at the top of the list. The Grip-Rite was a surprise to me. Generally I've avoided the brand for one of the poorer performing screws. Why? Because the Grip-Rite boxes always fall apart before they're half empty.
Thanks for the feedback.
Great information & timely for me as I've got two decks to build this spring. I do wish you had tested torque to twist off a screw and torque to camout the drive - those were the problems I've had with stainless Phillips and square drive. Frustrating to run a screw in and then have the head twist off while countersinking itself.
Thanks for the constructive feedback.
I wasn't planning on watching the WHOLE video but there was never a dull moment! Just raw consistent information!
I appreciate that!
Absolutely loved this! Now I would really really like to see this done again, except with multi material construction screws.
In particular Spax, mostly because according to the box they are meant to go into concrete.
I want to see a video just like this testing out that multi material claim.
In particular going in to sheet metal, concrete and drywall (no anchor).
Is there a savings (and safety!) In using a multi material construction screw or are you better off with focus fired screws such as tapcon, expansion anchors, sheet metal screws or drywall anchors?
Thanks! Thanks for the video idea.
FWIW as a result of wood rot, I replaced all the decking on my deck in 2009 with treated wood. The old screws were horribly corroded (I don't think they even used coated screws), so I wanted to make sure the same thing didn't happen. So I bit the bullet and bought stainless steel screws. The deck is in a shady location, so dampness is an issue, plus the winters here are harsh.
11 years later I had to disassemble part of the steps to route some gutter drains underneath them. The screws had no visible corrosion. Same story on some other boards I removed and replaced from rot from carpenter ants.
I'd say sulfuric acid is a shade too aggressive of a corrosion agent against stainless.
Where I live, Acid Proof (A4) stainless Steel is the standard for things like this... Not all stainless steel screws are equal!
Thanks for sharing.
@@TheDaniel85 It depends on the concentration of the acid, and of course the type of acid. It looks like these screws were soaked in concentrated sulfuric acid, which is a very powerful reducing agent. Stainless varies from resisting 3% sulfuric, 20% sulfuric, and some even higher.
@@stevesether Yes, the resistance is specified in the A2/A4 spec sheet...
I'd like the thoughts of others about pre-drilling with these screws. Many say they don't need it, but I have found that taking the time to make pilot holes really makes for a cleaner result that seems to stay tightened for longer. Is this just chance (or a myth), and is there a science with how the wood fibers work with the fastener with and without pilot holes?
100% agree. I wonder this every time I have to drill more than a handful of pilot holes.
Assuming no splitting, is no pilot hole the strongest fastening strength and longevity?
If not, is it better to drill a pilot hole just smaller than the shaft excluding the thread diameter?
And how big is the difference?
I replaced al the decking on my deck in 2009 with 2 x 6 inch treated wood. 13 years later and there's no splitting, and they haven't loosened. And this is on treated wood, which of course will shrink a little.
I couldn't tell you with other types of wood if you need pilot holes or not. There's been a small number of pieces that have rotted due to carpenter ants, but that's the only maintenance issue I've had.
Thanks for the video idea.
This channel is what youtube is all about. Great work you do here Sir, don't ever change you have nailed it!
Thanks!
When timing how long it takes to screw in, wouldn't it make more sense to use the drill press for consistency? Put the bit in the chuck and use your weight to drive the press down into wood. Would remove the human part of it. Just a thought, unless I'm overlooking something.
Downward pressure doesn't matter with screws as they self feed, and a drill press doesn't have enough starting torque to drive a screw without a running start
@@Robert-qm7yi I'd go out and test but its too damn cold in my garage, lol.
I'm with the other guy, downward pressure only matters in getting the screw started. Once the threads grab it's irrelevant, instead you're just chasing the screw as it pulls itself into the wood.
Which is why torx or square drive screws are so much easier to work with vs Phillips.
Can't really comment on the torque aspect of using a drill press, however it makes sense. Especially since most drill presses change speed via adjusting a v belt (which slips easily) and they are usually just on/off vs a variable speed trigger.
One test I would like to see with something like this is end insertions and see which did the least amount of damage to the wood itself, such as splitting. To me, when I'm doing builds or installations, the ability to predrill better than another is important.
Thanks for the video idea.
@@ProjectFarm you're welcome. That would be a tough one, because of the variability of the end grain of the wood but I'm sure you'd be the one to figure it out :)
Yes, I wonder if the self drilling tips actually make a difference. From my experience they do. I went through a box of guard dog and won't use them again due to how many splits I was having. Separately pre drilling is a waste of time.
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I have always used GRK. They have been exposed to freezing snow driven weather with no rusting and were easy to drive. They don’t try to walk when driving. Great video. Thanks again.
Thanks and you are welcome!
@@ProjectFarm I will be emailing you soon. Thanks again.
Not screwing around in this video. We all LOVE these videos...kind of use them as a reference library for buying, tire inflators, drill press cutting oil, masking tape, automotive ceramic coating, grease, glue and the list keeps going...just hope this channel helps pay the bills...off to buy some merch!
Thanks!
I recently installed deckmate screws on my deck and was kicking myself for not finding this video first.
In the beginning of this video I was worried the corrosion resistance wasn't going to be good enough but after watching until the end I am happy to see that they didn't have corrosion even after visible damage to the coating 😃
Thanks for another helpful video!
You are welcome! Thanks for sharing!
Your Review was very helpful in helping me pick out my Deck Screws over the weekend. Thank-you!
B9USA Sr.
You are welcome! Glad to hear!
I like Spax and GRK -- just learned about Grip-Rite.
Thanks for sharing.
Great tests! When I bought my house it came with 10,031 projects. I randomly picked Grip Rite construction screws after seeing an entire aisle filled with options, and they have been great. I did find a couple, randomly, where the bit wouldn't work because the hole was packed with something.
Thanks for sharing.
I really appreciate all the work, this man does for us.
His attention to detail and the extreme testing procedures, I say this hard working, resourceful man deserves a hand and praise.
Thanks!
No nonsense reviews without loud fancy 1-minute splash pages. A national treasure 👍🏻
Thanks!
I would not have believed there was that much difference in the screws. Thanks for testing.
You are welcome!
Firstly, the testing done on this channel is among the best I have ever seen! Not just on TH-cam, but that I have EVER seen!!!
So it's not without irony and humor that I point this out:
"Power pro looks very good, with no visible chipping..."
Rolls it over and shows a relatively GIANT chip... 🤣
I'm so glad I found this channel. I would love to see a video on the best engine parts cleaning solution. I just dismantled my 67' VW Beetle engine and it has stubborn grease deposits on nearly every part and surface. There are so many solvents and solutions on the market; I would love to see them go head-to-head.
Thanks for the video ideda.
Before I leave to the store I ALWAYS watch his videos.! Super appreciated and ALWAYS informative! Great job as always PF!
Awesome! Thank you!
Excellent testing methodology. I've given up using phillips head deck screws for obvious reasons. The last deck I replaced had rusted out phillips head screws and every one of the screw heads broke off when trying to remove them.
Thanks! Thanks for sharing.
Planning a deck renovation next summer; this information is timely and incredibly helpful--great content and production quality. Thank you!
Thanks! Glad to hear!
I'M SO GLAD YOU MENTIONED NAILS HAVING MORE SHEAR STRENGTH 💪 SO MANY PEOPLE IN THE INDUSTRY USE SCREWS WHERE NAILS ARE NEEDED AND NAILS WHERE SCREWS ARE NEEDED. SCREWS SQUEEZE TWO THINGS TOGETHER (TENSILE STRENGTH) , NAILS STOP TWO THINGS FROM SLIDING APART (SHEAR STRENGTH) . WANT TORNADO 🌪 RESISTANT? USE BOTH!
Thanks for the feedback.
Awesome! I'll change brands based on your analysis. Easy to follow, no bull without bias. This is my third visit to your channel and I'll be back!
Thanks!
Before even watching this I have been buying GRK and Grip rite (tip from a home builder I know) glade to here my last 10 years of projects are held together well. great vid very well done!
Thanks!
Excellent set of tests. Comprehensive. I’ve been using SPAX stainless screws for exterior treated wood and redwood - I know they are “softer” and I was (pleasantly) surprised at how well the stainless screw performed. Especially since I had little choice according to the various manufacturers’ instructions. Thanks for the review.
Thanks and you are welcome!
You are right about the Deck Pro, I had a wooden walkway built three years ago, we live in Michigan, and a lot of the screws have come loose. They were purchased at Home Depot.
Thanks for the feedback.
Awesome head to head! Planning to build a deck and purgula this fall. Thank you! Your test fixtures are the best! Cheers from Wisconsin.
Thanks!
I definitely got a screenshot of that chart of the sheer strengths. Awesome that you made that
Thanks!
You know what would really be useful, Those gas can spouts that are "leakproof" that always cause spills.....PLZ!! Love your content
I love the new angle you went with when testing the shear strength, gives a great view of the weight as well as the actual testing happening
Thanks!
Love the final comprehensive spreadsheet! You should do this on all videos.
Thanks!