As a Wing Chun man myself,I think Zen's techniques were awesome. To my way of thinking,it's not about who is better or worse,it's about what works in a real situation. The utmost respect to all styles of martial arts.
Zen's applications and techniques were effective and were just as effective as the Wing Chun's. I would like to see such a video comparing Wing Chun, Karate, and Hung Gar (what I studied), in terms of self defense.
me too I am into wing chun wong shun leung for 7 years. WC is a superb style and way of thinking and knowledge of the body. But this karate was also superb: I love a lot of moves seen in this video. wc is faster but karate can quit a combat in less moves
I also have a suspicion he threw in that singing at the end as a sneaky little reference to Jesse. He can’t keep getting away with destroying the barriers between worlds like this.
My 2 cents, from someone who practiced Karate Shito-Ryu for 12 years and Wing Chun for about 20: the difference is in the practitioner. If you only do katas and chi sao, you’re screwed no doubt. If you do sparring and pressure training, you may succeed with any martial art.
As someone who is still practicing Shotokan karate- kata's are very useful, once you know the Bunkai (application) of using it, in a street fight, if you're just doing the moves, without applying it in real life, yes, it's just for show.
@@pauljohnson6019 Yeah, kata without bunkai is... I do not know how to describe it - it is just not enough. Without bunkai, it is just a dance, a body exercise.
I wasn't going to comment but after skimming the section I wanted to make this observation: Zen's karate is very technical and looks great. I did Shotokan for 7 years as a kid, so while I am no expert or even a practitioner anymore, I have seen enough instructors/competitors to know when somebody moves well and he definitely does. Okinawan styles have less rigid movement and emphasize the whipping motion more at the end of their techniques. Kevin was great as always, I just wanted to throw a compliment in Zen's way too.
Zen was very fluid in his movements for a Karate practitioner. Normally, Karate in the modern-day sense is more brute force and to win points... Zen is smooth as silk.
Wing Chun should have won by one point when you tried to disarm an opponent with a weapon on hand. If you look closely, Wing Chun disarmed an opponent's weapon which you should always go for while karate went for the opponent's body instead of the weapon. Let's not the forget that the weapon was near his neck if you watch the video again.
I'd also like to add that the Wing Chun guy cleared the line of attack from the knife and kept excellent control over the weapon, whereas the Karate guy blocked it straight on and if the block was weaker or slightly off he would have got hit, and there were several times where if the attack was really onto it, could have cut him
After seeing you and Jesse Enkamp do similar videos on this it would be great to see a bunch of different martial arts used and compared for these common attacks
Timestamps for the Wing chun moves: 1. Haymaker: 1:57 2. Knife stab: 2:20 3. Knife slash: 2:43 4. Shirt grab and punch to the face: 3:08 5. Front tackle: 3:34 6. Headbutt: 5:44 7. Headlock: 6:11 8. Knee to the groin: 6:38 9. Low kick to the leg: 7:05 10. Bearhug from behind: 7:38
This video is amazing. I have trained in Seibukan Karate at the Brown Belt level, and I've also practiced a verry bit of Wing Chun from one of your fellow students under Sifu Francis Fong. Thank you for this fantastic video, and I wish you good health.
Effectiveness & Practicality: ----------------------------------------------- 1. Haymaker: Wing Chun 2. Knife Stab: Wing Chun 3. Knife Slash: Wing Chun 4. Shirt Grab & Face Punch: Wing Chun 5. Front Tackle: Both but Slant to Karate 6. Head Butt: Wing Chun (chain palm strike to the face / Bil Jee Eye jab) or Karate nose palm strike) 7. Head Lock: Karate 8. Knee to Groin: Wing Chun 9. Low kick to leg: Wing Chun 10. Bear Hug: Wing Chun
From my information, wing chun is a type of kung fu. Kung fu from what I know was meant to protect, not attack. Whilst karate is way better for being offensive and attacking straight forward
I heard that some people think that Wing Chun is useless, but personally I think that any martial art can be effective, that depends on the person who practices
Honestly, both practitioners looked pretty amazing in this. I feel like both of them executed their defenses very well. The only one that I disagree with is the knife stab. I would have given that to Wing Chun, because I was taught that if you can get the knife out of your attacker's hand, it's best to do so to prevent them from attempting to attack you with it again. Nothing wrong with how Zen performed his take down, that shin kick to get the knife away just seems more practical to me!
Disagree. The karate-ka didn't grab his arm, but the arm was placed outside not to let the opponent have a better position of stabbing; however, an opponent with the knife on hand is still dangerous.
Wow! I've never seen Seibukan represented online! His demonstration gave me some serious nostalgia. I was lucky to have trained at the Seibukan dojo in Okinawa many years ago. Shimbakuro!
@@ryogahibiki7806 They're brother & sister. Wing Chun is the older sister (founded by a woman centuries earlier) whilst Karate was founded by various pioneers from Ryukyu (renamed Okinawa) in the 1800s
I am a Wing Chun woman.... LOVED this video Kevin... proves the art is in the practitioner....every move was impressive and practice makes perfect!... loved Zen's moves but yours were just as awesome, just different. React how you feel you can best deal with attack, regardless of what martial art you practice. I do LOVE Wing Chun though👊👊👊
First off, I'm honored to have seen such immense skill on display. Simply wonderful! From my observations, it would be very difficult to actually judge better or worse because the styles in question are so very different. Karate seems much more aggressive and made up of strong, direct motions. Ving Sun, on the other hand, seems to use much smaller, redirecting motions, which, to my eye, seemed both faster and more elusive than it's more direct cousin. Now, I'm no martial artist. I'm just making observations based on what happened, how many strikes were used, how quickly the opponent was subdued and how open the defender left themselves during each situation presented . In all 10 cases, Ving Sun seemed to be faster, and in 6 or 7 of these scenarios, also landed more blows or left themselves less open. The Vung Sun takedowns seemed faster as well. Either way, it was an honour and a pleasure to watch and I am both humbled by, and grateful for, your skillful demonstrations. Extra thanks to Master Zen for being a part of this lesson. Thanks to all of you! May your time be joyful and your peace complete.
Both very well performed. Something you should consider in my humble opinion: which one left the attacker in the worst condition to avoid a recovery and counter attack?
Thank you Kevin for this video! I love the demonstration on two different styles in a street fight. After seeing your video training with sifu Francis I've been a fan. Keep up the great work you are doing! I hope to find a class soon to train!
Fun video. That WC throw on the front tackle looked a lot like a Solar Puter Kepala. I know both Kevin Lee and Sifu Francis train Silat with Guru Inosanto. Is that a traditional WC throw?
These were fun. If I'd been scoring it would have been... 1) Haymaker to Wing Chun -- simpler, faster, more direct 2) Knife Stab to Wing Chun -- got to get off the line...both solutions were Hollywood, but just catching it with an x-block is a little too Hollywood 3) Knife Slash to Karate -- its not so much that I didn't like the Wing Chun solution, but I give karate the nod for getting off the line and for the flashiness of sword handing the brain stem 4) Shirt Grab to Wing Chun -- this is Wing Chun's wheelhouse...love the neck control 5) Front Tackle to Wing Chun -- they're very similar, but I go with Wing Chun because of the elbow strike 6) Headbutt to Karate -- I wanted to give this one to Wing Chun because its at trapping range, but I didn't think the choreography came across as well 7) Headlock to Wing Chun -- the Wing Chun sweep was more efficient than the karate double leg 8) Knee to the Groin to Wing Chun -- again, I think karate thinking its going to stuff a full body knee with an x-block is fantasy land and the karate sequence sort of relies on the attacker leaving his knee there to be captured...whereas the Wing Chun sequence moves off the line and just parries the knee 9) Low Kick to Karate -- the knee kick to ridgehand was nice...I think the attacker really has to telegraph for the Wing Chun counter to work 10) Bearhug to Wing Chun -- i like the Wing Chun groin strike more than karate's magic shrug to make space...also, I like the immediate neck control by wing chun more than karate expecting the guy to stand there and eat a sweep So I would have scored it 7-3 for Wing Chun. I am biased though. Also, they're demo choreography so its all just in good fun anyway. We knew it was going to end up tied. lol
Karate, Kung Fu, both works when needed in certain situations and environments. There's no such thing as a "better system or method." It all depends on the practitioner! Based on my own experiences, it's best to know both thoroughly! Respect!
I can see that Shotokan Karate is for long range attack especially weaponed opponent, and Wing tsun quan is for short range especially is grabbed by opponent.
that is true. Practicing on my own also Shorin- Ryu (in my case Matsubayashi-Ryu Karate, lineage Nagamine- Shima- Oshiro), I notice during sparring sessions that I am a little bit confused if a "Shotokan guy" starts from the distance.. but here we have Seibukan (Sakunaihayashi)
WCs longest weapons, are the Front Kick, and the Finger Strike techniques. But you have to remember... in order for the Attacker to be able to Strike you... they NEED to get close enough. As such... the moment the attacker steps towards you... is usually when you Counter + Counterstrike. Also realize, that there is a large difference between Sparring, and actual Barefist combat. In sparring... fighters often hop around just outside of each others Ranges. However, in the bar / nightclub... when some dude gets aggressive... they charge at you like a Bull... with fists flying rapidly and repeatedly. There is no "Dancing" outside of ranges. In fact, many will often assume that they might eat a punch.. in order to deliver their own.
As a student of wing chun for 40+ years, I find the video authentic. Both Wing Chun and Karate are effective in a "bar brawl" situation, which is represented here. Karate, when properly executed, would eliminate the opponent before they got close. In a crowded area, like most bars, Wing Chun, being a close combat art, would be more effective.
@@johndough8115absolutely, learning a bit of wingchun close quarter fighting or Muay Thai clinching is an added skill for 2nd layer protection since most attacks are surprising in nature and we may find our safe distance breached in a real fight situation. Close quarter is like ground BJJ skills but for the stand up fight. 🙌
Both Zen Parker and you Kevin are really good at your styles, it's kinda hard to tell who won. For my personal experience, I noticed that there ain't a specific style that works all the time and against everyone. Bruce Lee was perfectly right in saying that there's useful stuff in all styles and useless stuff in all styles. Wing Chun has a stunning characteristic which is "attacking while defending", and in the few times I had to defend myself I noticed that if you defend and attack simultaneously your opponent will fall down because you catch him off guard. But there's also to say that Wing Chun has so many movements which can be redundant and useless, meanwhile Karate goes more for the throat. The key is to get to know as many styles as you can and then figure out what works better, and always consider the difference between sparring in the gym, fighting on a ring with rules and stuff and fighting in the street where you must expect the worst. In the street you need something fast to end the fight immediately.
Anyone else saw how fast Kevin's fists were in the Shirt grab and Punch to face was? Imagine how painful that's going to be if he was trying to hit as hard as he can.
Great video, but I would love to see what each martial artist would do when they had not known beforehand what the stuntman would do, and score based on that. Afterall, that's how a street fight goes.
Yes karate may be cooler but wing chin is more faster and has more power. It doesn't matter about h cool shit they do. It's about the defense and offense. You are just saying karate because it's more cool. I am not trying to disrespect you but it is wrong to just assume it is better for coolness.
Depends on what you are good at and your ability to apply your system in a real situation. Both guys techniques are worth learning irrespective of style. Nice works guys❤
i also do Wing Chun kung fu (i started learning it 8 years ago) and i recognise the moves btw i've noticed that karate has simular moves to Wing Chun and Wing Chun is also using techniques from other martial arts :D
Want an honest opinion I do ata songahm taekwondo currently first dan black belt 3 years so far of training admittedly its not ud say great for self defense but nor horrible but if I get to 3rd degree and do boxing would that be a good enough combo to be able to defend myself in a street fight assuming it's not a weapon involved or multiple people?
As a wing chun practitioner its not about what style is best its how efficient is the person in that specific style to perform those techniques. Respect to all martial arts
You do, Kung Fu or you do, dodo was told to me by my teacher lol I think that all forms of Martial arts are useful in different situations. I see a lot of the techniques used in many other forms that can lead right back to wing chun or could easily be adapted to. Great video
Would have been nice to get an explanation as to why they got the point. I think they were both really good but in a real fight I was like that would work and that wouldn’t work but 🤷♀️ lol
@@dalehill6127 To demonstrate who would win in a simulated fight? There are plenty of videos out there like that, I was hoping for a more real one that’s all 🤷 That being said, I do enjoy his videos so I’m not being a hater. I do like his traveling videos and also the one where he took a trip to Stephen Wonderboy Thompson’s gym. Pretty cool!
This is great! I love how both sides use different techniques to counter certain situations and noticed how Kevin used plenty of takedowns when he’s up. Both sides used good takedowns. Zen used a sepai move in the knee to groin scenario. Loved the last move Kevin used from the Ip-Man movie. As a Goju Ryu karateka, I thought of some counters as well: 1) Haymaker: use the first 3 moves of Gekisai 1 or 2 2) Knife stab: use the throw move in Kururunfa 3) Knife slash: rising block to then grab knife hand and break the arm from Seipai 4) Shirt Grab + Punch: 2nd to last move in Seiyunchin 5) Front Tackle: Final three moves in Seipai 6) Headbutt: Uppercut+back fist+downward block as a takedown from Seiyunchin 7) Headlock: Leg pick+ and down toss from Seipai 8) Knee to groin: same as #7 9) Low kick to leg: Lift front leg to Stomp Kick to kicking leg and take down from Sanseru 10) Bear hug from Behind: Cat stance+ back elbow from Seiyunchin combined with open palm strikes from Shisochin
It was a surprise to see Sensei Seth appear in the video. 😎 Both looked very effective in self defence. It’s looking like it’s better to know both styles. 🤔
It's not just about the style, it's about the proponent. Wing Chun suits me (and my age) better, but I respect all style of Martial Arts and the dedication it takes to perfect them. Better to be open to what works from other styles than your own, than being protective of your style like a baby. "Learning is like swimming upstream. The moment you stop, you go backwards"
Hello Kevin, can you please make a tutorial on Wing Chun footwork, i still have no idea what stance is the best for fighting, so it's comfortable for you to bridge, i mean I can't go with the boxing stance, and i wanna know what foot position we use in wing chun when fighting
WC stance, is a standard forwards lead leg stance.. but you want to spread the legs apart more... so that the lead toe, is directly in line with the rear Heel. You dont tend to want both of your heels on the same line (other than some special cases). All of your body mass, should remain directly over your rear Leg... and your rear legs knee should remain bent deep enough... so that the knee is directly in line with the toes (at all times). In WC... to move... you do an Arrow Step / Sliding Step. Basically.. you extend your lead leg a bit in front of you.. quickly planting it, then just as quick.. sliding your rear leg back underneath you. Depending on the surface you are fighting on... and the grip of your shoes... you might not easily be able to Side your rear foot. As such, you would simply try to keep the rear foot at low to the ground as possible... as you step it into place. The weight should always be over the rear leg... and the lead legs foot should barely be resting on the ground (as light as a butterfly on a Leaf). This allows your lead leg to be able to Kick or Defend against a kick... within a Fraction of a Second Timeframe. If any of your mass is over the lead leg... you will have a "de-weight" time period... before you are able to move it. In that time... someone could kick your kneecap, shin ..etc... long before you had the chance to move your leg. And if the OP charged at you suddenly, you might not be able to kick them before they got close enough to land a strike on you. There are other steps, like: Circling Steps. Sidestepping. Diagonal Steps. Ghost Footwork (double steps). But most of these are using the same Sliding Step principles. The circle step just clears the space in front of you (using a half circle with your lead leg) as you are stepping forwards. A bib problem with many WC practitioners... is that when they step forwards... Both heels end up on the same Line. This makes your stance weak from the sides. As its very similar to being on a narrow skateboard. Anyone that pushes you from the sides... in such a narrow lined stance... and you would easily be taken down / put off balance. As such, when you step forwards, make sure your lead foots heel, doesnt move into the centerline... and both of your feet stay the proper distance apart. I also should mention, that both of the feet should be pointing 45 degrees. Your shoulders, Hips, and Body.. should be perfectly straight, rather than having anything at an angle. You can have a angled thin stance... if the OP is far outside of combat ranges. However, as soon as they get close.. you want to "Square" everything.
@@ricksterdrummer2170 Ive learned from 3 different Wing Chun teachers. One of which was Steve Lee Swift... whom was part of the Yipman Lineage. The teaching was ALWAYS to put the mass over the rear leg. It was NEVER 50/50. If that has changed... then it was because people have CORRUPTED it. I started training in WC, when I was 20. I just turned 51. One of my teachers had lineage knowledge from Moy Yat, and from Benny Meng. I cant recall which lineage Benny started out in.. but he eventually started learning an older version of WC, called Hung Fi Yi. And via these connections, I got to learn various versions of WC, as a result. That said... the Older version of WC... was using more of a 50/50 stance. I complained to the teacher about this... and he, nor Benny, could give me a good reason for this. Then one day my teacher in HFY, decided to do some mild sparring with me. I used an oblique kick to his knee.. with a small amount of Fajin expression on it. It impacted like a wrecking ball... and yet was fast as a Jab. He was Shocked, and immediately told me to ease up. I told him, that was light... but that Id reduce it further. I believe that experience, completely changed his perspectives that day.
I like when Wing Chun finishes off the last blow to disable the opponent. Like a knife kick off the hand on #2. Also, where #8 when Wing Chun kicks the knee cap to totally disable the opponent. 👏
Both very impressive, both have different techniques, they also both have great results. I did subscribed to Kevin Lee, last week. I find that he goes out of his way to show you the differences and he is humble about it. I recently started taking JKD at home and learning Wing Chun. But my background is Krav Maga. Very impressive video.
This was a lot of fun, but I would reverse the first 2 and would give the first one to karate and the knife stab to Wing Chun with the way he was able to send the knife flying out of the stuntman's hand. Also the groin kick was a close contest, I still give it to karate but that knee stomp from Wing Chun was awesome.
4:13 boy, am I glad you stepped in. I could not understand this scoring at all. What a goofy and arbitrary way to decide who comes out on top! If you really want to see which is better, just have them face off in a controlled, yet no holds barred, face off. Let them spar, or full on fight and see who is left standing. I love and respect both martial arts. This has been a question of mine for as long as I can remember. Which is better? Kung Fu or Karate? Wing Chun or Bushido? In the end, I just think it comes down to the individual fighter.
I think we should add both practicality & simplicity to the judging categories, because that's exactly what you need in a street fight. While a number of these techniques are effective, a few also seem a bit unnecessarily complicated. Focusing on simplicity & practicality, I gotta rate it: Haymaker: Karate Knife Stab: Wing Chun Knife Slash: Karate Shirt Grab: Wing Chun Front Tackle: Karate Headbutt: Karate Headlock: Wing Chun Knee To Groin: Wing Chun Low Kick: Wing Chun Bearhug: Karate RESULT: Still Ends in Tie....damn
Just so you know, Wing Chun is about saving time! Energy preservation, and speed. It's actually not a style. It's really just applying higher IQ in hand to hand fighting. I'd also like to say that every Wing Chun is not the same! People have many different expressions of it. Although based on the same fundamentals, it varies per person. Karate, one strike one kill theory differs in mindset. It was a great comparison. Thanks for the video! Lastly, I know to many the short Wing Chun strikes appear powerless, but I can assure you, from a well trained person short range power can feel like getting hit by a mack truck!
I have studied both arts.. Remember, karate originated in China..Both are good martial arts, you defined how you treat others and how you walk your life's journey. THAT is martial arts.
Both systems have a lot to offer, but I think that karate's basics are a lot more powerful and easier to perform and therefore are more likely to allow a new student to successfully defend themselves in a street encounter.
That was really interesting, but I would have given it to Kevin because I think he did better with the knife attacks. The first one he disarmed the attacker, the second one he was controlling the weapon hand the whole time.
Karate won. The moves were more practical, although I think the Wing Chun was too orthodox in execution. Reality is different from what is seen. But, the Karate man won the contest.
I am a layman, but I thought the "softness" of the wing chun and "hardness" of the karate were easily noticeable. Zen excelled in explosive, powerful moves, but his form was a little disjointed and robotic. Kevin didn't seem to hit as hard in general, but he excelled in fluidity of motion which also seems like it would be important in a real fight. These relative differences really fit with what I conceive karate and wing chun to be, so I got the sense that the contrast we see is authentic.
Who won?
Both of them 😇
Loved how both sides showed their moves. Very cool!
WING CHUN all the way! James Franco had no chance 😂☯️🐉🐲
We the one who was watching😂
Both of U did GR8
Holy crap I didn’t realize I was talking for so long 😂😂
Yes you did😂😂😂
Felt like you were channeling Master Ken there 😆
This being added in voluntarily by Kevin makes me like the both of you ten times more. lol
Lmao 😅
You also looked sleepy sensei, coz probably you were!😂
As a Wing Chun man myself,I think Zen's techniques were awesome. To my way of thinking,it's not about who is better or worse,it's about what works in a real situation. The utmost respect to all styles of martial arts.
Thank you , I agree ! My name is Ruben Karate Joe Wilson . I like you , you have a lot of respect for the Martial World 😔
Yes Wing Chun was alot faster
Zen's applications and techniques were effective and were just as effective as the Wing Chun's. I would like to see such a video comparing Wing Chun, Karate, and Hung Gar (what I studied), in terms of self defense.
me too I am into wing chun wong shun leung for 7 years. WC is a superb style and way of thinking and knowledge of the body. But this karate was also superb: I love a lot of moves seen in this video. wc is faster but karate can quit a combat in less moves
Correct my wing chun teacher says there are no wrong moves only performed at the wrong time.
The real winner is us. We got to see some dope choreography and Sensei Seth sneaking in to talk some smack.
I can’t believe Sensei Seth infiltrated my video! 😟
He interrupted the program for a quick announcement like a breaking newscaster lol
I also have a suspicion he threw in that singing at the end as a sneaky little reference to Jesse. He can’t keep getting away with destroying the barriers between worlds like this.
😂😂😂😂😂
but he sings in the video, I pressed the like button at that very moment 😅👍
😂I thought it was a TH-cam commercial!
That karate had some amazing moves you can tell he studies a legit style and is so crisp with everything, I aspire to be as good as him one day.
Seth’s collaboration is good to understand from another point of view
Anyone think that Seth looks like Luka Doncic?
@@jfearless3420 Always. 😂😂🤣🤣 Genetics are fascinating.
My 2 cents, from someone who practiced Karate Shito-Ryu for 12 years and Wing Chun for about 20: the difference is in the practitioner. If you only do katas and chi sao, you’re screwed no doubt. If you do sparring and pressure training, you may succeed with any martial art.
As someone who is still practicing Shotokan karate- kata's are very useful, once you know the Bunkai (application) of using it, in a street fight, if you're just doing the moves, without applying it in real life, yes, it's just for show.
@@pauljohnson6019 Yeah, kata without bunkai is... I do not know how to describe it - it is just not enough. Without bunkai, it is just a dance, a body exercise.
I did boxing and kickboxing. Dabbled in some MMA. In my experience the guys that do karate, taekwondo wing chung etc can't fight for shit.
me too for WC, you're right!
Pleasure to get beat up by these talented Martial Artist and the headgear was much appreciated!
I wasn't going to comment but after skimming the section I wanted to make this observation: Zen's karate is very technical and looks great. I did Shotokan for 7 years as a kid, so while I am no expert or even a practitioner anymore, I have seen enough instructors/competitors to know when somebody moves well and he definitely does. Okinawan styles have less rigid movement and emphasize the whipping motion more at the end of their techniques. Kevin was great as always, I just wanted to throw a compliment in Zen's way too.
Zen was very fluid in his movements for a Karate practitioner. Normally, Karate in the modern-day sense is more brute force and to win points... Zen is smooth as silk.
Lol, "That is Karate, you can tell by the way that it is..." I wasn't expecting a Neature Walk reference from Seth.
Wing Chun should have won by one point when you tried to disarm an opponent with a weapon on hand. If you look closely, Wing Chun disarmed an opponent's weapon which you should always go for while karate went for the opponent's body instead of the weapon. Let's not the forget that the weapon was near his neck if you watch the video again.
Less movement on the wing chun seems like the karate is all over
That's what I was thinking
I'd also like to add that the Wing Chun guy cleared the line of attack from the knife and kept excellent control over the weapon, whereas the Karate guy blocked it straight on and if the block was weaker or slightly off he would have got hit, and there were several times where if the attack was really onto it, could have cut him
i agree, karate's opponent had his knife to his back, wing chun had a safer distance too
People forget that Kevin has skills from other MARTIAL ARTS(Muay Thai, Savate, Eskrima, BJJ, etc...) hidden in his Wing Chun. HE HAS THE POWER.
Wing Chun works greatly without them but that is true, he has the power.
After seeing you and Jesse Enkamp do similar videos on this it would be great to see a bunch of different martial arts used and compared for these common attacks
Timestamps for the Wing chun moves:
1. Haymaker: 1:57
2. Knife stab: 2:20
3. Knife slash: 2:43
4. Shirt grab and punch to the face: 3:08
5. Front tackle: 3:34
6. Headbutt: 5:44
7. Headlock: 6:11
8. Knee to the groin: 6:38
9. Low kick to the leg: 7:05
10. Bearhug from behind: 7:38
Moves that aren't even wing chun, dude had a bland of other styles
@@H3llzrav3n like the kick to the head, it is a wing-chun classic lol
I felt with the knife attacks, the karate moves controlled the knife arm more than the wing chun techniques.
lol "you took the last one from the ip man movie..." 🤣💯
As a Kung fu guy,I was partial to Wing Chun, but the Karate guy was cool too!😎
This video is amazing. I have trained in Seibukan Karate at the Brown Belt level, and I've also practiced a verry bit of Wing Chun from one of your fellow students under Sifu Francis Fong. Thank you for this fantastic video, and I wish you good health.
@@chiphan6729 that’s awesome!!!!
Effectiveness & Practicality:
-----------------------------------------------
1. Haymaker: Wing Chun
2. Knife Stab: Wing Chun
3. Knife Slash: Wing Chun
4. Shirt Grab & Face Punch: Wing Chun
5. Front Tackle: Both but Slant to Karate
6. Head Butt: Wing Chun (chain palm strike to the face / Bil Jee Eye jab) or Karate nose palm strike)
7. Head Lock: Karate
8. Knee to Groin: Wing Chun
9. Low kick to leg: Wing Chun
10. Bear Hug: Wing Chun
From my information, wing chun is a type of kung fu. Kung fu from what I know was meant to protect, not attack. Whilst karate is way better for being offensive and attacking straight forward
I heard that some people think that Wing Chun is useless, but personally I think that any martial art can be effective, that depends on the person who practices
Wing Chun is Chinese style and karate Japanese
Wing Chun is useless
@MitchellBPYao thank you captain obvious
I had fun watching this.I'm asking for more "such" duels. Kudos to the stuntman.
Honestly, both practitioners looked pretty amazing in this. I feel like both of them executed their defenses very well.
The only one that I disagree with is the knife stab. I would have given that to Wing Chun, because I was taught that if you can get the knife out of your attacker's hand, it's best to do so to prevent them from attempting to attack you with it again. Nothing wrong with how Zen performed his take down, that shin kick to get the knife away just seems more practical to me!
Great video! Different techniques, but each one has its own efficiency. Thanks for posting!
❤
I love how Zen's response for #10 was straight-up just Naihanchi
How can the second move go to karate when the opponent is still holding the knife at the back of your neck?
He's holding the knife hand you silly goose.
Disagree. The karate-ka didn't grab his arm, but the arm was placed outside not to let the opponent have a better position of stabbing; however, an opponent with the knife on hand is still dangerous.
Nice Chum Kiu Form Kevin.
Great vid🤛 Loved the Seth cameo😂
Both of them are great!
Kevin! Your are absolute amazing!
Wow! I've never seen Seibukan represented online! His demonstration gave me some serious nostalgia. I was lucky to have trained at the Seibukan dojo in Okinawa many years ago. Shimbakuro!
Given the fact that Wing Chun & Karate are both siblings and have the same parent art (White Crane) I think they're equal & deserve that tie.
Wingchun is like karate’s young cousin, both descendant from the same grandfather
@@ryogahibiki7806 They're brother & sister. Wing Chun is the older sister (founded by a woman centuries earlier) whilst Karate was founded by various pioneers from Ryukyu (renamed Okinawa) in the 1800s
@@SonOfVenus92494 ok I already lost which is older but I agree, and yeah i also consider wingchun female
I am a Wing Chun woman.... LOVED this video Kevin... proves the art is in the practitioner....every move was impressive and practice makes perfect!... loved Zen's moves but yours were just as awesome, just different. React how you feel you can best deal with attack, regardless of what martial art you practice. I do LOVE Wing Chun though👊👊👊
Ameri-Dote is #1
Always restomp
@@kidflash9905 x10 re-stomp that groin
😂
It’s too deadly to test 🤷🏾♂️
Hail Master Ken!!! I think the “Hurticane” may do well in these instances 😂
People critiquing this vid are taking it WAY too seriously 😂
we're just commenting, same reason we are watching the video :)
First off, I'm honored to have seen such immense skill on display. Simply wonderful! From my observations, it would be very difficult to actually judge better or worse because the styles in question are so very different. Karate seems much more aggressive and made up of strong, direct motions. Ving Sun, on the other hand, seems to use much smaller, redirecting motions, which, to my eye, seemed both faster and more elusive than it's more direct cousin. Now, I'm no martial artist. I'm just making observations based on what happened, how many strikes were used, how quickly the opponent was subdued and how open the defender left themselves during each situation presented . In all 10 cases, Ving Sun seemed to be faster, and in 6 or 7 of these scenarios, also landed more blows or left themselves less open. The Vung Sun takedowns seemed faster as well. Either way, it was an honour and a pleasure to watch and I am both humbled by, and grateful for, your skillful demonstrations. Extra thanks to Master Zen for being a part of this lesson. Thanks to all of you! May your time be joyful and your peace complete.
Very entertaining! I think they’re pretty close in effect but personally I think Wing Chun got it.
each style could play out in a real-life situation. Great breakdown of the strengths and weaknesses!
So happy when I saw that recreated Ip Man scene lol. Great vid.
Both very well performed. Something you should consider in my humble opinion: which one left the attacker in the worst condition to avoid a recovery and counter attack?
6:39 I was anticipating for you to catch his foot in the goat stance.
Thank you Kevin for this video! I love the demonstration on two different styles in a street fight. After seeing your video training with sifu Francis I've been a fan. Keep up the great work you are doing! I hope to find a class soon to train!
I think to determinate the winner, it must be a spar Kevin vs seth
Fun video. That WC throw on the front tackle looked a lot like a Solar Puter Kepala. I know both Kevin Lee and Sifu Francis train Silat with Guru Inosanto. Is that a traditional WC throw?
this was a hilarious video and Zen’s new name is Zen Bushido. lol
His karate reminds me of a long fist style of kungfu with lots of standing grappling like judo and long fist kungfu had baby
These were fun. If I'd been scoring it would have been...
1) Haymaker to Wing Chun -- simpler, faster, more direct
2) Knife Stab to Wing Chun -- got to get off the line...both solutions were Hollywood, but just catching it with an x-block is a little too Hollywood
3) Knife Slash to Karate -- its not so much that I didn't like the Wing Chun solution, but I give karate the nod for getting off the line and for the flashiness of sword handing the brain stem
4) Shirt Grab to Wing Chun -- this is Wing Chun's wheelhouse...love the neck control
5) Front Tackle to Wing Chun -- they're very similar, but I go with Wing Chun because of the elbow strike
6) Headbutt to Karate -- I wanted to give this one to Wing Chun because its at trapping range, but I didn't think the choreography came across as well
7) Headlock to Wing Chun -- the Wing Chun sweep was more efficient than the karate double leg
8) Knee to the Groin to Wing Chun -- again, I think karate thinking its going to stuff a full body knee with an x-block is fantasy land and the karate sequence sort of relies on the attacker leaving his knee there to be captured...whereas the Wing Chun sequence moves off the line and just parries the knee
9) Low Kick to Karate -- the knee kick to ridgehand was nice...I think the attacker really has to telegraph for the Wing Chun counter to work
10) Bearhug to Wing Chun -- i like the Wing Chun groin strike more than karate's magic shrug to make space...also, I like the immediate neck control by wing chun more than karate expecting the guy to stand there and eat a sweep
So I would have scored it 7-3 for Wing Chun. I am biased though.
Also, they're demo choreography so its all just in good fun anyway. We knew it was going to end up tied. lol
i trained almost 8 years of taekwondo, so its similar to karate, but i also gotta give it to wing chun
Karate, Kung Fu, both works when needed in certain situations and environments. There's no such thing as a "better system or method." It all depends on the practitioner! Based on my own experiences, it's best to know both thoroughly! Respect!
This was awesome and had my full attention the whole tim! Next, Wing Chun vs Muay Thai or Taekwondo.
I can see that Shotokan Karate is for long range attack especially weaponed opponent, and Wing tsun quan is for short range especially is grabbed by opponent.
that is true. Practicing on my own also Shorin- Ryu (in my case Matsubayashi-Ryu Karate, lineage Nagamine- Shima- Oshiro), I notice during sparring sessions that I am a little bit confused if a "Shotokan guy" starts from the distance..
but here we have Seibukan (Sakunaihayashi)
WCs longest weapons, are the Front Kick, and the Finger Strike techniques. But you have to remember... in order for the Attacker to be able to Strike you... they NEED to get close enough. As such... the moment the attacker steps towards you... is usually when you Counter + Counterstrike.
Also realize, that there is a large difference between Sparring, and actual Barefist combat. In sparring... fighters often hop around just outside of each others Ranges. However, in the bar / nightclub... when some dude gets aggressive... they charge at you like a Bull... with fists flying rapidly and repeatedly. There is no "Dancing" outside of ranges. In fact, many will often assume that they might eat a punch.. in order to deliver their own.
As a student of wing chun for 40+ years, I find the video authentic.
Both Wing Chun and Karate are effective in a "bar brawl" situation, which is represented here.
Karate, when properly executed, would eliminate the opponent before they got close. In a crowded area, like most bars, Wing Chun, being a close combat art, would be more effective.
This isnt shotokon
@@johndough8115absolutely, learning a bit of wingchun close quarter fighting or Muay Thai clinching is an added skill for 2nd layer protection since most attacks are surprising in nature and we may find our safe distance breached in a real fight situation. Close quarter is like ground BJJ skills but for the stand up fight. 🙌
Sensei Seth coming in the middle of the video with his commentary was the best 🤣🤣🤣🤣
First time I see one of the most perfect Karate movements in my whole life. Getting my black belt in few month wish me luck!
Both Zen Parker and you Kevin are really good at your styles, it's kinda hard to tell who won. For my personal experience, I noticed that there ain't a specific style that works all the time and against everyone. Bruce Lee was perfectly right in saying that there's useful stuff in all styles and useless stuff in all styles. Wing Chun has a stunning characteristic which is "attacking while defending", and in the few times I had to defend myself I noticed that if you defend and attack simultaneously your opponent will fall down because you catch him off guard. But there's also to say that Wing Chun has so many movements which can be redundant and useless, meanwhile Karate goes more for the throat. The key is to get to know as many styles as you can and then figure out what works better, and always consider the difference between sparring in the gym, fighting on a ring with rules and stuff and fighting in the street where you must expect the worst. In the street you need something fast to end the fight immediately.
the stuntman was awesome!
Great idea, guys
Anyone else saw how fast Kevin's fists were in the Shirt grab and Punch to face was? Imagine how painful that's going to be if he was trying to hit as hard as he can.
Great video, but I would love to see what each martial artist would do when they had not known beforehand what the stuntman would do, and score based on that. Afterall, that's how a street fight goes.
Shoutout to Grayson for being such a sport as the punching bag.
Yes karate may be cooler but wing chin is more faster and has more power. It doesn't matter about h cool shit they do. It's about the defense and offense. You are just saying karate because it's more cool. I am not trying to disrespect you but it is wrong to just assume it is better for coolness.
Depends on what you are good at and your ability to apply your system in a real situation. Both guys techniques are worth learning irrespective of style.
Nice works guys❤
i also do Wing Chun kung fu (i started learning it 8 years ago) and i recognise the moves btw i've noticed that karate has simular moves to Wing Chun and Wing Chun is also using techniques from other martial arts :D
@@Error_404-2-k 💯💯💯
Want an honest opinion I do ata songahm taekwondo currently first dan black belt 3 years so far of training admittedly its not ud say great for self defense but nor horrible but if I get to 3rd degree and do boxing would that be a good enough combo to be able to defend myself in a street fight assuming it's not a weapon involved or multiple people?
As a wing chun practitioner its not about what style is best its how efficient is the person in that specific style to perform those techniques. Respect to all martial arts
Wing chun is the best always in my eyes
You do, Kung Fu or you do, dodo was told to me by my teacher lol I think that all forms of Martial arts are useful in different situations. I see a lot of the techniques used in many other forms that can lead right back to wing chun or could easily be adapted to. Great video
Would have been nice to get an explanation as to why they got the point. I think they were both really good but in a real fight I was like that would work and that wouldn’t work but 🤷♀️ lol
It’s easy to predict a countermeasure when you know what the attack is going to be
Repeat after me: DE-MON-STRA-TION.😊
@@dalehill6127 To demonstrate who would win in a simulated fight?
There are plenty of videos out there like that, I was hoping for a more real one that’s all 🤷
That being said, I do enjoy his videos so I’m not being a hater. I do like his traveling videos and also the one where he took a trip to Stephen Wonderboy Thompson’s gym. Pretty cool!
You guys were both good and are a real commercial for your respective martial arts
this feels more like something that goes in your CV so you can get a job in a martial arts movie.
I have a personal mantra: black dog, yellow dog; if it retrieves pheasants, then it's a good dog.
Great video!
This is great! I love how both sides use different techniques to counter certain situations and noticed how Kevin used plenty of takedowns when he’s up. Both sides used good takedowns. Zen used a sepai move in the knee to groin scenario. Loved the last move Kevin used from the Ip-Man movie.
As a Goju Ryu karateka, I thought of some counters as well:
1) Haymaker: use the first 3 moves of Gekisai 1 or 2
2) Knife stab: use the throw move in Kururunfa
3) Knife slash: rising block to then grab knife hand and break the arm from Seipai
4) Shirt Grab + Punch: 2nd to last move in Seiyunchin
5) Front Tackle: Final three moves in Seipai
6) Headbutt: Uppercut+back fist+downward block as a takedown from Seiyunchin
7) Headlock: Leg pick+ and down toss from Seipai
8) Knee to groin: same as #7
9) Low kick to leg: Lift front leg to Stomp Kick to kicking leg and take down from Sanseru
10) Bear hug from Behind: Cat stance+ back elbow from Seiyunchin combined with open palm strikes from Shisochin
It was a surprise to see Sensei Seth appear in the video. 😎
Both looked very effective in self defence. It’s looking like it’s better to know both styles. 🤔
Zen: *You used that from the IP Man movie right?* Kevin: *Still works.* Me if I was there: *Wing Chun, IP Man.😂😂😂
It's not just about the style, it's about the proponent. Wing Chun suits me (and my age) better, but I respect all style of Martial Arts and the dedication it takes to perfect them. Better to be open to what works from other styles than your own, than being protective of your style like a baby.
"Learning is like swimming upstream. The moment you stop, you go backwards"
Hello Kevin, can you please make a tutorial on Wing Chun footwork, i still have no idea what stance is the best for fighting, so it's comfortable for you to bridge, i mean I can't go with the boxing stance, and i wanna know what foot position we use in wing chun when fighting
WC stance, is a standard forwards lead leg stance.. but you want to spread the legs apart more... so that the lead toe, is directly in line with the rear Heel. You dont tend to want both of your heels on the same line (other than some special cases). All of your body mass, should remain directly over your rear Leg... and your rear legs knee should remain bent deep enough... so that the knee is directly in line with the toes (at all times).
In WC... to move... you do an Arrow Step / Sliding Step. Basically.. you extend your lead leg a bit in front of you.. quickly planting it, then just as quick.. sliding your rear leg back underneath you. Depending on the surface you are fighting on... and the grip of your shoes... you might not easily be able to Side your rear foot. As such, you would simply try to keep the rear foot at low to the ground as possible... as you step it into place.
The weight should always be over the rear leg... and the lead legs foot should barely be resting on the ground (as light as a butterfly on a Leaf). This allows your lead leg to be able to Kick or Defend against a kick... within a Fraction of a Second Timeframe. If any of your mass is over the lead leg... you will have a "de-weight" time period... before you are able to move it. In that time... someone could kick your kneecap, shin ..etc... long before you had the chance to move your leg. And if the OP charged at you suddenly, you might not be able to kick them before they got close enough to land a strike on you.
There are other steps, like: Circling Steps. Sidestepping. Diagonal Steps. Ghost Footwork (double steps). But most of these are using the same Sliding Step principles. The circle step just clears the space in front of you (using a half circle with your lead leg) as you are stepping forwards.
A bib problem with many WC practitioners... is that when they step forwards... Both heels end up on the same Line. This makes your stance weak from the sides. As its very similar to being on a narrow skateboard. Anyone that pushes you from the sides... in such a narrow lined stance... and you would easily be taken down / put off balance. As such, when you step forwards, make sure your lead foots heel, doesnt move into the centerline... and both of your feet stay the proper distance apart.
I also should mention, that both of the feet should be pointing 45 degrees. Your shoulders, Hips, and Body.. should be perfectly straight, rather than having anything at an angle. You can have a angled thin stance... if the OP is far outside of combat ranges. However, as soon as they get close.. you want to "Square" everything.
@@johndough8115 In Wing Chun the weight is always 50/50. Wing Tsun uses the rear leg principle.
@@ricksterdrummer2170 Ive learned from 3 different Wing Chun teachers. One of which was Steve Lee Swift... whom was part of the Yipman Lineage.
The teaching was ALWAYS to put the mass over the rear leg. It was NEVER 50/50.
If that has changed... then it was because people have CORRUPTED it.
I started training in WC, when I was 20. I just turned 51.
One of my teachers had lineage knowledge from Moy Yat, and from Benny Meng. I cant recall which lineage Benny started out in.. but he eventually started learning an older version of WC, called Hung Fi Yi. And via these connections, I got to learn various versions of WC, as a result.
That said... the Older version of WC... was using more of a 50/50 stance. I complained to the teacher about this... and he, nor Benny, could give me a good reason for this. Then one day my teacher in HFY, decided to do some mild sparring with me. I used an oblique kick to his knee.. with a small amount of Fajin expression on it. It impacted like a wrecking ball... and yet was fast as a Jab. He was Shocked, and immediately told me to ease up. I told him, that was light... but that Id reduce it further. I believe that experience, completely changed his perspectives that day.
I like when Wing Chun finishes off the last blow to disable the opponent. Like a knife kick off the hand on #2. Also, where #8 when Wing Chun kicks the knee cap to totally disable the opponent. 👏
I had a lot of fun watching your movie. Each one is good at his art. And the stunt man did a good job, too adding some theatre to his play.
LOL!!! The stunt dude is gettin beat! LOL and he's the one doin the scoring?!? LOL Too good Kev!
Both very impressive, both have different techniques, they also both have great results. I did subscribed to Kevin Lee, last week. I find that he goes out of his way to show you the differences and he is humble about it. I recently started taking JKD at home and learning Wing Chun. But my background is Krav Maga. Very impressive video.
Thank you for subscribing!
The starting wing chun looked like a dance
This was a lot of fun, but I would reverse the first 2 and would give the first one to karate and the knife stab to Wing Chun with the way he was able to send the knife flying out of the stuntman's hand. Also the groin kick was a close contest, I still give it to karate but that knee stomp from Wing Chun was awesome.
Really great video! Seth was just perfect!
4:13 boy, am I glad you stepped in. I could not understand this scoring at all. What a goofy and arbitrary way to decide who comes out on top!
If you really want to see which is better, just have them face off in a controlled, yet no holds barred, face off. Let them spar, or full on fight and see who is left standing.
I love and respect both martial arts. This has been a question of mine for as long as I can remember. Which is better? Kung Fu or Karate? Wing Chun or Bushido?
In the end, I just think it comes down to the individual fighter.
I love how sensei Seth just got prideful and had to make his point🤣🤣
I'm a black belt karate user and wing Chun beginner it is good ?
i'm thinking about combining the two. Wing chun for close range, karate for long range
I enjoyed that ! I think both styles are really good, feel sorry for their crash test dummy 😗😉(fun to watch, thanks !!
Thanks for the video, I practice wing chun and karate.
Based
I got influenced to start karate and now i am a black belt this video is epic
Threwing Punches style gets me lol
I think we should add both practicality & simplicity to the judging categories, because that's exactly what you need in a street fight. While a number of these techniques are effective, a few also seem a bit unnecessarily complicated. Focusing on simplicity & practicality, I gotta rate it:
Haymaker: Karate
Knife Stab: Wing Chun
Knife Slash: Karate
Shirt Grab: Wing Chun
Front Tackle: Karate
Headbutt: Karate
Headlock: Wing Chun
Knee To Groin: Wing Chun
Low Kick: Wing Chun
Bearhug: Karate
RESULT: Still Ends in Tie....damn
Just so you know, Wing Chun is about saving time! Energy preservation, and speed. It's actually not a style. It's really just applying higher IQ in hand to hand fighting. I'd also like to say that every Wing Chun is not the same! People have many different expressions of it. Although based on the same fundamentals, it varies per person. Karate, one strike one kill theory differs in mindset. It was a great comparison. Thanks for the video! Lastly, I know to many the short Wing Chun strikes appear powerless, but I can assure you, from a well trained person short range power can feel like getting hit by a mack truck!
you forgot the most impotant thing in thsi world is to rip bruce lee the inventor and best fighter o all time
Entertaining! Thanks for posting.
I have studied both arts..
Remember, karate originated in China..Both are good martial arts, you defined how you treat others and how you walk your life's journey. THAT is martial arts.
very impresive, both techniques. Before Ip Man nobody knew Wing Chun and Karate was very popular....
this content is great but underrated
I hope Jesse Enkamp will watch this.
Both systems have a lot to offer, but I think that karate's basics are a lot more powerful and easier to perform and therefore
are more likely to allow a new student to successfully defend themselves in a street encounter.
Alright idk if this is just another brand there (cuz I’m not American) but is that a stradman merch he wearing?
It was funny how their approach to the front tackle was nearly identical.
That was really interesting, but I would have given it to Kevin because I think he did better with the knife attacks. The first one he disarmed the attacker, the second one he was controlling the weapon hand the whole time.
0:25 I thought he's james franco
Karate won. The moves were more practical, although I think the Wing Chun was too orthodox in execution. Reality is different from what is seen. But, the Karate man won the contest.
I am a layman, but I thought the "softness" of the wing chun and "hardness" of the karate were easily noticeable. Zen excelled in explosive, powerful moves, but his form was a little disjointed and robotic. Kevin didn't seem to hit as hard in general, but he excelled in fluidity of motion which also seems like it would be important in a real fight. These relative differences really fit with what I conceive karate and wing chun to be, so I got the sense that the contrast we see is authentic.