Nice video, nice car.. I wish to share my years of experience with Chevy V8.. These comments are not meant to criticize anyone elses methods or procedures. This is just what I have learned over the years.. - Many comments here are confused that first it is set for initial timing, then changes it again for the total timing. I think he is setting the initial timing for a first start up after the distributor has been removed or disturbed. The most important timing is total timing as he demonstrated. For me, when starting an engine for the first time, I just rotate the distributor as someone is cranking it with the key to get it to fire up, then warm it up and move on to adjust the total timing somewhere in the mid to high 30s. Skipping the initial timing adjustment is just a preference. - Its best to clamp the inductive pickup clamp of the timing light closest to the spark plug and not near the distributor cap. Closer to the plug gives more realistic spark arrival at the cylinder as it does take time for the spark to travel through the plug wire. - I don't trust those adjustable timing lights. Many have given false or distorted readings. You are better off using timing tape or preferably a balancer with the scale stamped in it. Summit Racing has a selection of timing tape and balancers. - I made a pre-fabricated piece of metal to wedge into the idle screw stop to create a fast-idle. Fabricate the wedge to hold the fast idle at around 3000 RPM. This will free up one hand and allow you to focus on the task at hand. With the engine noise, heat and fan air blowing at you, you need both hands and brain free from distractions. - The total timing is different for many, but should be somewhere in the mid-high 30s. The variables include cam shaft, fuel delivery, octane and fuel type which may contain ethanol.. - I found the best way to find the optimum total timing is to start with it into the high 30s until it pings under load while driving under acceleration. Back down the total timing a degree at a time until the ping goes away. This will be the sweet spot. My big-block 454 likes it at 37 degrees.. Small block chevys with the smaller bore piston will come in around the mid 30s. - Because of ethanol fuel which burns hotter, I use a 160 degree thermostat. The lower temp reduces ping and allows more total timing. Also, to keep it cooler, I use as much aluminum components on the engine... ie radiator, water pump, intake etc... Ethanol fuel has really challenged these engines to run properly. The old Chiltons manuals give initial timing setting at idle which is essentially useless with todays fuel and any engine mods that it may have as described above. Total timing should be the focus. I hope this helps someone.. Again, not to criticize or claim 100 percent. Just from years of experience. 👍✌
Thanks so much for these videos! I could never wrap my head around the total timing thing but you made it perfectly clear to me. I had an advance timing light until my alternator sucked the cord in and whipped it into the fan. Long story short no damage to anything except the timing gun. The reason I'm talking about this is hoping that someone will remember this and be really careful.
I had this happen but little different couple years ago. The fans kicked on and pushed the cord to the water pump and around and around it went. Had a death grip on timing gun put my hat over the carb and stalled it out. Some connectors and shrink tube later all fixed. Scared the hair out of me 😂. My dad ran it over a day later after using it on his truck 😂. I didn't leave it on the ground I put it where I got it. Wheel sure looks like it was the same tire pattern you have.
You saved me from my despair with this video. Particularly the paper tip!!! Never herd of, simple, but brilliant! I couldn't get to the pully I needed to turn in my 88 monte ss without removing radiator. I was bummed because I had researched how to do timing (never done before) and I had hope to get my car running tonight. Now I have hope ! It actually started after sitting in my garage for nearly 6 months. Thanks!
Base timing also known as initial timing for a 350 should be about 8 degrees before top dead Center for an automatic car or about 5 for a manual car. You instructed to set initial timing at 0 degrees top dead center. You will end up with hard start condition setting initial timing at 0 degrees. Total timing should be about 31 or so on a stock engine and you may be able to get up to 36 with a performance cam
The video is excellent, after completion just wondering if the timing will be advance to far when hooking up the vacuum lines that's the only thing I was hoping you would show at the end or is there nothing to be concerned about
The timing for the 69 Corvette is TDC for the 350 except the 350 HP engine which is 8 degrees before TDC according to Chilton. That being said the small block chevy likes some advance at initial timing in a range between 4 to 8 degrees. To set total timing you will need a timing tape on the harmonic balancer if you don't have a timing light like in the video. I don't trust the lights anyway. I might have missed it in the video but the vacuum advance should be hooked back up for total timing. To address moving the distributor for total timing there is available an adjustable vacuum advance to dial in total advance. IMHO 36 degrees is a bit too much for a stock engine. 32-34 degrees seems to be the magic number. There are all kinds of cam shafts available for this engine so check with the manufacturer for total advance.
Great video, very informative. I just purchased a 69 coupe with 350/300 with a mild street cam. Converted the distributor to HEI and now I want to set the timing due to engine not performing like a cammed 350 should. I understand all data/information provided, am I required to check the total advance timing again after I reconnect the vacuum line to distributor advance pot and unplug golf tie to carburetor vacuum line to ensure we don't have excessive (50+) advance time? Or should vacuum lines be reconnect for setting total advance timing? No flames intended, just want to perform my first ever timing of a vehicle!! Any words of wisdom will be welcomed, thanks Mike
Brother that was such a fantastic explanation from start to finish! I appreciate u ! Bcuz like u said & i agree most to all videos dont give u the complete understanding of this procedure & none of them gave me the understanding for me to say oh ok i get it now, none ... .. Well thanks to ur video i can happily say i have a complete understanding of it now sir!, & for that i must thank u sir! Awesome!! I really do appreciate the way u went about explaining it! U took ur time & explained wich left me with no questions from me to u sir I THANK U! GOD BLESS U & keep it hot rodding!
Excellent video. I did feel like you were putting the light on number two wire but maybe your cap is different setup than my 350. I do have one clarification question. Should the vacuum be plugged back in after you set initial and before setting total timing because won’t that factor in to your desired 36 and therefore be more when plugged back in?
4th time I've watched this video. You explain these procedures so good that makes it easy to understand. I like your quadrajet video too. You helped me to set my way too rich choke on my 83 305 k10 pickup. Hope your doing well! Stay safe and keep the small block chevy videos coming
I had to watch a few times I finally get now how to use my digital timing light. You have to set the gun to the engines ignition timing then rotate distributor to show tdc on harmonic bslancer. I'm setting the timing on a 4 cylinder Mitsubishi engine lol but the same principles apply as it does on a v8
Hey, good video thanks, however my timing light is an antique, old craftsman just a trigger no static pickup, ( need to clip onto #1) got to use the timing marks on the timing cover, is there a screw or stick on method ?? many thanks. working on a C10 5.0 to 5.7 swap. J.
This is a great video that I will likely come back to and watch multiple times. Do you have any advice on converting a C5 from EFI to a carburetor with the overall goal of having a dual carb blower scoop. (Advice other than, don't do it). It's kinda of a dream passion project
Here's what does not makes since there's obviously no reason to check basic timing without the vacuum because you're selling it for mechanical vacuum after the fact and changing your basic timing now if you went back and checked your basic timing with the vacuum canister plugged up you would see that it was changed so running 34 to 36 advance is a ballpark depending on compression I appreciate your effort and this is why you had a hunt down other videos cuz all that really matters is mechanical timing and to make sure that that is functioning properly all you got to do is check your basic timing after you're done
Anyway you could share a few more details? What will “base” timing be when you have set advance timing to 36 degrees on a Chevy 350? Also will the distributor and carb both need to plugged for the advance timing to be accurate?
You only used the base timing to get your engine running. It varies between vehicles and doesn't matter, once you set the advance timing. No you don't need to plug the distributor because the vacuum signal comes from the carb.
I'm trying to learn to set total advance. So initial is set and done. Then remove golf tee and plug vacuum back into vac advance to check total timing? If it's at 20 or whatever how do you adjust the vac advance to get to 36 just rev the engine or dial in with timing light or adjust vac canister with an Allen wrench and start over til you get it at 36?? ..????
finding TDC #1 if you dont have a buddy handy is to use a compression tester with a hose that screws into the spark plug hole and watch the guage as you bump it over once the needle starts to move stop and rotate crankshaft by hand with breaker bar and socket on balancer bolt to TDC
@@disht2 My friend did similar and struggled for days trying to start his car. He called me, I listened to it crank, then asked how he installed the distributor. He put the timing on 0 and pointed the rotor to #1. I didn't even bother with anything else, I just rotated the rotor 180 and said try it now. He was both super annoyed that he didn't know that, and happy it was running. So to answer your question; it's works perfectly - half the time ;)
@@ignacioromero5014 NO, not done cause you dont know if it was on compression stroke. This is why shady tree clowns like you should not be building engines.
Hi again , today when I time my engine I remember that EGR are connected,my questions is should the EGR be blocked or connected when timing the engine. Many thanks
Hop, as an owner of a 69 Vette I love your how to videos. Have you ever converted the cable driven tachometer to electronic? I would love to see a video on calibration and installation.
Loved the video and nice Corvette. So let me see if I understand. After you set your total advance timing to 36º it looks like at idle your initial timing was around 12º. Is that about right?
hi there thank for the video, but my question is your engine stock or modified because i am looking to check my timing on my z28 1978 camaro with 350 chevy is the setting in the video works with my engine. thanks
Thanks for replying, just a another quation my engine tag have the initial timing to 6 degree , should i but intial timing to 6 degree and the total timing 36 which mean the advance to 29 degree at the 3000 rpm(6+29=36). what do you think ? thanks
If the engine is running, I would just turn the distributer sightly until you hear a slight valve knocking, then turn it back until the knocking goes away. My bet is it will then be around 8 - 10 degrees advance at initial timing if you check it.@@ramthaLord
I don't know.....I learned that after you set your initial timing at between 8 and 12 degrees, then you use the timing light to see what you have at 2500-3000 rpms. 36 would be ideal. After you see that figure at 2500-3000 rpm, you should tighten the distributor up, hook up your vacuum advance and see what your timing is then 2500-3000. This will tell you how much your vacuum advance is 'advancing' your timing. Don't let it go over 56 degrees, bad for your engine.
David T is correct, I use a vacuum pump connected to adjustable vacuum advance...dial in the max advance you want without the driving and trial method. I go 12* initial...36* @ 2500RPM and 12* max vacuum. That gives max total 48 degrees. Total mechanical 36* plus 12* @ max vacuum = 48*
TheJhaley12 yes it will change your initial setting. The first setting is just to help you start the engine easily. Think of it as just a guess. Then setting the total timing will give you a balance of both. Most distributors have adjustable range so you can find the best of both worlds but typically if you buy a distributor designed for your engine it isn’t needed for stock applications. Cam shafts and higher compression can skew these numbers and will require trial and error
Not sure why you removed #1 spark plug, as you were just moving the timing mark on the balancer to the timing tab. Plus, I sure hope you remembered to reinstall #1 spark plug.
I know you unhook the vacuum line from the distributor and plug the port on the carb for initial timing, like when putting in a new distributor. The problem is when setting total timing theoretically you would need to have the vacuum advanced hooked up. If you set total timing without it then when you hook it up it will advance your timing past where you set it. Can you elaborate, am I missing something?
Research Vacuum advance on an engine. Engines make different levels of Vacuum throughout the rpm range. The Vacuum advanced distributor is supposed to keep the engine in the "sweet spot' and also save fuel, hence racing engines don't bother with anything Vacuum because they have no use for it and big camshafts produce very little.
Si el vacío está desconectado entonces realmente no se debe llamarse avance total Que yo sepa avance total es el avance inicial más centrífugo más vacío. Saludos desde Barranquilla Colombia
Hi, so I plan to set timing on a 74 corvette, and the timing light I purchased is just a light, it doesn't have buttons to set degrees or anything, but is the process still the same? Should I just make sure at 2500 rpms the white mark is at the red mark?
Yes, set your timing to about 8-10 degrees advance with you timing light at zero at idle. Make sure the car is warmed up first if possible. Back off on the timing when if you hear the valve start to make a tapping sound. If it all sounds good make sure you are also set about 800 rpm at idle.
? If you were to raise your RPM to 3000 to 3500 Does your H.B. white line move? Mine does. My maximum total timing is 50 at 3200 RPM. Do I have a bad HEI distributor Advanced setup? I'm working on a Chevy 383 stroker in my 4X4.
Probablemente está muy avanzado y deberías sentir cascabeleo cuando el motor está a temperatura max y bajo carga.Los que saben ponen 30 grados a 3000 rpm . maximo 36 con vacío conectado.Te estoy hablando de máximo rendimiento demostrado en dinamómetro a menos que tengas culatas o pistones de baja compresión.
He did mention paper blowing out of #1 cylinder, however if you do that,pass the mark and crank the engine until the white mark comes back around, #1 isn't back on top. It doesn't matter if you marks line up initially for a timing light. Hook the light to #1, start the engine,rotate the distributor till your where you want to be. Now if you're installing a distributor, you want #1 top dead center.
My timing light shows RPM on a small screen on the timing light. Another way is the have a separate rpm gauge or someone in the car looking at the rpm guage.
He is hoping at 2,500 rpm the advance weights will be thrown out as much as they will go. Depends on the springs as to what you need to rev it to, heavier springs = later advance = more revs.
I got an ATK crate motor from Dallas, TX. 325 hp. Have tried two different distributors, a Pertronix and an MSD and I am getting 50 degrees total timing with both. Recommended with what cam the motor has is 36. I have initial at about 12, it won't run with 8. The car runs hot and I believe it is due to timing and detonation. I am going to try an AC Delco stock type HEI and see if that will work. My last resort that I know to try is an advance stop plate. Anybody know a solution to my problem please comment.
Did you put a harmonic balancer on it or did it come with one if your engine had the timing tab already and no balancer it’s possible that you are not getting a correct reading because it is the wrong size for the tab they installed
Good question. A good indicator is once the car is started. You turn the distributor until you start to hear the inlet/exhaust valves make slight a tapping noise. Then turn the distributor in the opposite direction until the tapping noise of the valves stops. Drive the car around a little bit and see how it performs. Some small adjustments may need to be made afterwards on the distributor based on performance.
The white line was marked by you. You only need to go through the first steps if you are installing the distributor, but that's a different story. Locking in total timing also locks initial timing. The truth is that the only way to get close to being correct is to have the engine dynode. and the ignition curve has to be plotted for different rpm. This involves distributor weights and distributor cam lobe changes. For maximum power this will be unique for each engine. And your engine will need be re-dynode if you make changes to engine power. What I am saying is that Your method is just a guess. If you look at the service manuals each engine option has a different curve. Bummer.
You set initial and then total but never went back and showed the initial again. why didn't the initial change when you moved the distributer for the total adjustment?
i'm currently pulling my hair out trying to get my 350 to run right. It will fire right up so i must have set the initial timing right but misfires really badly, new plugs and wires but watching this video i realised i didnt plug my vacuum advance when setting the initial timing, could this be contributing to the misfire?
Yes it can. Also check the teeth on the bottom of the didtributer. Make sure the teeth are not worn. A good ground for the distributor is also very important.
@@TheWhatisright thank you, its a brand new summit distributor with holley sniper/msd6al so a bit trickier to diagnose than a carb (which i had even less luck with)
LS are easy to make power with & they make more hp / tq stock than SOME sbc and bbc, but, they´re played out and they aren´t that much of a god send..I will give the LS the credit for OEM cylinder head flow, skirted blocks, 6 bolt mains, some aluminum block / heads applications. Getting the ECM ¨tuned¨ each time you do a simple bolt on is lame, you either pay alot for someone to do it or you study your ass off and learn how. These old engines make power just as easy as the truck LS and gen 3 & some gen 4 car engines once you step into the aftermarket and the parts are way cheaper. Compare a simple gear drive for a small or big block to a LS. There are multiple companies that make gear drives for these old engines ranging from a little over $100 up to a few $100..now on to the LS there are only one or two companies that make gear drives for them and they are between $600-$800. Nothing beats the simplicity of these ¨gen 1¨ sbc and bbc. Wiring the starter on these old engines is so easy it isn´t even funny..same with installing the distributor and setting the timing. HEI (like what is used in the video) has nothing to do with gap, dwell, external mount coil, etc..that is all for points ignition, even then it isn´t that difficult setting the gap or using a dwell meter. HEI is far superior to points. For example HEI has a coil in cap VS points external mount coil. HEI can supply efficent spark in higher rpm. HEI you can set timing and ¨forget¨ it, no messing around with points in any way, size, shape or form..HEI also only has 1 wire to run to 12V to power the coil & then you can set your timing. It is so so simple to run a old engine such as these stand alone with an HEI dizzy..assuming your engine is assembled, from carb to oil pan and anything else, all you have to do is run 4 wires..points is similar but a bit different. These wires to run HEI equipped engine stand alone are as follows: a ground wire from - at battery to somewhere metal on the engine, then run a wire from ¨batt" terminal on dizzy to + at battery (this energizes coil), then run a wire from ¨S¨ terminal on starter solenoid to + at battery (this will engage starter to flywheel/flexplate, touch wire to power when you want to engage starter) and lastly a wire from + at battery to the biggest center terminal on the starter solenoid (this will provide power to starter solenoid) Holley (my prefrence) carbs are super easy to tune as well. All the maintinence is easy on these old ones too. Fuel injection definetly has its place, don´t get me wrong. I understand how the sensors work and everything electrical wise. I´m not ¨scared¨ of fuel inj, it is nice to jump in your vehicle and drive from the West Coast to the East Coast and not have to adjust your air fuel mixture one single time..but if im going to be racing and swapping parts often im sticking with purely mechanical carbureted old school Chevys. As you can see I am not against LS I just perfer these old small / big blocks, as they are bare bones essentials..super simple, no sensors, no 100ft of wiring, super cheap parts, I could go on and on. Regardless of your preferred platform keep on wrenchin!
Where does the initial timing need to be set on to be in 30-35 total timing with out going through adjusting at high rpm?or is it a engine to ending thing?i don't have a tach
@@tymigliore6390 It varies depending on distributor so you really need to rev it. You don't need a tach, just rev until it won't advance anymore. If you're afraid of revving it you can use light advance weights or no weights. Yes, each eng has a different ideal # so you'll just have to look online for that ideal total is for yours. Mine was 32. Once you dial that in you let it idle and wherever it lands is your new initial timing. Every oem car I've checked has too little total timing when set to the suggested initial. Eg oem might be 8 deg at idle, but total is something like 25. So if you adjusted that example car to 32, then initial would be 15, which imo is closer to where it should be. Each eng varies but I've never ran less than 15 initial on any car. Less than that is, imo, for emissions by people who don't care that you're hurting the engine and wasting gas. If you have a cam, the bigger the cam the more initial timing you can use. With my eng I found 27deg initial timing netted the best power off the line, then a total of 32 deg, so only 5 deg mechanical advance. More low rpm timing means better mpg and the eng runs cooler. If I were to set mine at the oem 8 deg, I would overheat at every stoplight in summer. At 27 my idle is stronger, low end power much stronger, mpg better and runs a lot cooler. With an oem or mild cam I'd imagine 15-20 deg initial is likely the limit but each eng varies. A great many older cars have overheating issues and bumping the timing is the fix imo, which I've done many times to many cars. Usually the vacuum advance will now add too much at part load and it'll ping, sometimes badly, so you need to modify the vacuum advance to come in later and less of it. When the mechanical timing advances is also important and may need adjusting. The oem mechanical advance usually comes in late so it may be fine as-is, but if it needs to come in later I trim the weights down. To make vacuum advance come in later you need to set it so it's partially advanced by limiting the travel by shortening the slot where it rides. You'll see it in there, a slot where the vac rod moves in. You want make the slot shorter so it's pushing on the diaphragm, or partially advanced. I soldered a bar to the plate that blocks half the slot to hold it advanced. Oem the diaphragm adds 20deg which starts advancing very soon. Mine only advances half that and doesn't start advancing until an oem unit would be after it's hit the 10deg mark, because I'm literally limiting from going lower. So by the time an unmodified unit hits 11deg, mine is 1 deg. 15 deg and mine is 5 etc. If I recall, mine starts advancing around 10-11" vacuum. How to tell how much initial and total on both mechanical and vacuum timing is right, plus when they start, is trail and error.
How many guys adjust their timing by ear, seriously? After running it down the road and pulling over to make adjustments until you hit that sweet spot.
I need help setting my 1981 c10 in time , it has a swap from a 80 to 68 350 not sure what year casting number is (3970010) it has several marks so i dont know which one is right dont know what degree to set the timing gun on for initial timing go get the right mark as of the moment it still turns on
For Total Advance Timing, your timing gun should be at 36 degrees with a 350 Chevy. For initial timing, set your timing gun at zero. most 350 Chevy engines run great between 8 - 10 degrees advance on your timing mark at idle. In fact, once I finished my total advance timing on my car, I looked at my timing mark with the timing gun and it was 10 degrees advance at idle. Another way is to just start the car and turn the distributor until it runs its best. Make sure you do not hear any tapping noice from the engine. If that does not work, then you have another problem (maybe plugs, spark plug wires, coil, disp cap, rotor). I hope this helps. Corvette Hop
CorvetteHop thanks im adavance, i just have a little confusion about how do i know what 8-10 degress is the mark? Is the mark the one that says tdc ? Make sure is on 0 ? Like my confusion is what mark on the balancer
CorvetteHop or it works like initial time is tdc mark on balancer at 0° on the tooths with timing gun at 0 , advance is tdc mark on balancer and 0° on tooths but with gun at 36° degree and 2,500-3,000 rpm? Which once is done it by it selfs moves 10 degress advance ?
No problem, If you are looking at intial timing then make sure the timeing gun is set at Zero at idle (engine warmed up warmed up). Point the timing gun on the timing mark (balancer) and turn the Dirstibuter until the timing mark is about 8 - 10 degrees advance. Hopefully, the engine will run better.
Remember, in the video I said Total Advance Timing is the perfect goal. "O" mark balancer and timing gun is only at idle (engine warmed up and at around 850 rpms). However, advance timing helps your car run better at all speeds (example, idle, normal speed and highway). That is when the 36 degrees on the timing gun comes into play. This is what I found out after I did initial and advance timing on my car. Once it was all done on my 350 chevy, I went back and check how the initial timing mark changed at idle. When I set the timing gun back to zero after total advance timing the timing mark at idle was 10 degrees advance. So, if a chevy engine has not had any modification, special cam or special springs in the Distributor you should be able to just set the initial idle at 8 - 10 degrees at idle and be done with it. By the way, 8 - 10 degrees at idle is also the manufactur setting. The key is, I had to find out what that timing mark was for my engine. In other words, I did not know if the person before me did any special modifications to the engine (ie, cams, heads or anything). Now, I know, I just need to set it at 8-10 degrees advance at idle eveytime.
Too much unexplained here (for the average guy). You go through the trouble of setting base timing, you undo it when you re- twist the distributor to set total timing. Now base is changed.
Jim, agree. And also a very good question/comment. Yes, base (initial timing) is changed slightly for the perfect timing mark position. I think base timing has to be shown first. If someone does any major modification like a new cam or heads they need to know how to set initial timing. However, how do they know it is at the perfect position (timing mark) after a modification. Anyone will tell you once a performance cam or performance head is installed it may alter the timing. Total Advance timing is the answer. I do agree if the car already starts then the initial times does not need to be explained. Also, if the car is already running perfect, then total advance timing does not need to be explained. Thank you for the comment.
My timing gun has a RPM readout. I push the button and it switches to RPM. Push the button again and the timing gun goes back to timing. Another way is to have separate timing meter. Or have some in the driver seat giving you an indication.
please review the terms you're using. TDC is not the perfect combustion position.. It merely is the location of the crankshaft and other components attached to it. Camshaft via gear or chain, and the valve train and the position of the valves (Closed), and finally the distributor and rotor/cap pointing directly at #1 cylinder. 36 is not optimal for every engine, as detonation could occur if too much advance timing is used and possibly damage your engine. just saying...This video will confuse the hell out of someone who knows a little, but those who don't know anything at all will find it very helpful. An engine tuner will laugh out loud, seriously it is that bad.
Nope, sorry friend. IGNITION timing first, so you can start the car. Ignition or what is also referred to as initial timing must be set after major maintenance on the engine such as cam, heads, valves, piston or rings to insure the car starts. Otherwise, the car may or will not start. Once that is complete, move on to total timing for fine tuning.
@@Mylee837 That is correct. However, how do you know what total timing is unless you can start the engine first. If you have already set your total timing and have no engine modifications to your engine you can do that because nothing has changed. If you did engine modifications your engine can be 180 degrees off TDC. Timing marks and TDC can be off and engine will not start. Especially if your cam, timing gear or timing chain has been changed. This video is designed from start to finish. Not if your engine is already running. If your engine is already running thin all you need to do is adjust total timing.
After you stuck the napkin/paper towel in the #1 plug hole, you never mentioned putting the plug back in before starting the engine. Wear your safety glasses!
this guy is not making any sense to me he's telling us to set the initial timing at the regular normal idle speed but when he does the timing he's turning the speed up to 3000 RPMs and then he's telling us to turn it up to 36 degrees Advanced you're not supposed to go that high
First off, one needs to set initial time to start the engine after major maintenance such as a new cam, heads or major work on the engine. You can not just put the engine at 36 and expect it to work. Next, in order to have the engine running at it best advance timing needs to be set. How in the world do you know the mark for advance timing if you can not even start the engine after major maintenance? What if you are 180 degrees off timing? What is your new timing mark based on a high performance cam or heads? This video was not just designed to set the timing (i.e., one ever year or two with the nine already running). It was designed to get it all running correctly after major engine maintenance. The video was designed to help those who do not know much about time and to get the engine running after major work.
@@flyingBrian115 Not uptight at all. Just explaining as the video did. You are correct that you can jump to advance timing if the car is already working fine. And you have a good point it all is well in the car operations. I just wanted to make sure someone does not try to start the car after major maintenance and wonder why the car will not start. Thank you for the input.
CorvetteHop Jesus how hard is it to understand that when you sent the initial timing that’s just the basic suggested timing when you set it at advance that is for total performance, so basically if you’re not looking for maximum power just set your initial time and he want the most out of your engine set an advanced. I think you did an excellent job if you can’t understand that you should be paying someone to work on your car for the love of God that was as basic as it gets, it’s your car you may have to back it off or you may have to advance it more depending on the gasoline that you’re using but don’t tell anybody that because my god if they can’t understand your video they’ll definitely be lost. Lol
Once your timing is set to the factory spects to set the advance you mess with springs located on the distributor cams. Lighter ones for more advance, heavier ones for less. You don't have to move the distributor again.
Nice video, nice car.. I wish to share my years of experience with Chevy V8.. These comments are not meant to criticize anyone elses methods or procedures. This is just what I have learned over the years..
- Many comments here are confused that first it is set for initial timing, then changes it again for the total timing. I think he is setting the initial timing for a first start up after the distributor has been removed or disturbed. The most important timing is total timing as he demonstrated.
For me, when starting an engine for the first time, I just rotate the distributor as someone is cranking it with the key to get it to fire up, then warm it up and move on to adjust the total timing somewhere in the mid to high 30s. Skipping the initial timing adjustment is just a preference.
- Its best to clamp the inductive pickup clamp of the timing light closest to the spark plug and not near the distributor cap. Closer to the plug gives more realistic spark arrival at the cylinder as it does take time for the spark to travel through the plug wire.
- I don't trust those adjustable timing lights. Many have given false or distorted readings. You are better off using timing tape or preferably a balancer with the scale stamped in it. Summit Racing has a selection of timing tape and balancers.
- I made a pre-fabricated piece of metal to wedge into the idle screw stop to create a fast-idle. Fabricate the wedge to hold the fast idle at around 3000 RPM.
This will free up one hand and allow you to focus on the task at hand. With the engine noise, heat and fan air blowing at you, you need both hands and brain free from distractions.
- The total timing is different for many, but should be somewhere in the mid-high 30s. The variables include cam shaft, fuel delivery, octane and fuel type which may contain ethanol..
- I found the best way to find the optimum total timing is to start with it into the high 30s until it pings under load while driving under acceleration. Back down the total timing a degree at a time until the ping goes away. This will be the sweet spot.
My big-block 454 likes it at 37 degrees.. Small block chevys with the smaller bore piston will come in around the mid 30s.
- Because of ethanol fuel which burns hotter, I use a 160 degree thermostat. The lower temp reduces ping and allows more total timing.
Also, to keep it cooler, I use as much aluminum components on the engine... ie radiator, water pump, intake etc...
Ethanol fuel has really challenged these engines to run properly. The old Chiltons manuals give initial timing setting at idle which is essentially useless with todays fuel and any engine mods that it may have as described above. Total timing should be the focus.
I hope this helps someone.. Again, not to criticize or claim 100 percent. Just from years of experience.
👍✌
Thanks so much for these videos! I could never wrap my head around the total timing thing but you made it perfectly clear to me. I had an advance timing light until my alternator sucked the cord in and whipped it into the fan. Long story short no damage to anything except the timing gun. The reason I'm talking about this is hoping that someone will remember this and be really careful.
I had this happen but little different couple years ago. The fans kicked on and pushed the cord to the water pump and around and around it went. Had a death grip on timing gun put my hat over the carb and stalled it out. Some connectors and shrink tube later all fixed. Scared the hair out of me 😂. My dad ran it over a day later after using it on his truck 😂. I didn't leave it on the ground I put it where I got it. Wheel sure looks like it was the same tire pattern you have.
You saved me from my despair with this video. Particularly the paper tip!!! Never herd of, simple, but brilliant! I couldn't get to the pully I needed to turn in my 88 monte ss without removing radiator. I was bummed because I had researched how to do timing (never done before) and I had hope to get my car running tonight. Now I have hope ! It actually started after sitting in my garage for nearly 6 months. Thanks!
I am happy everything worked out. Hop
I needed that, much appreciated! Somebody gotta help the rookies...
Don't listen to this guy at all for God's sake...
This is the only video cone across explaining both timings and the more important one advanced timing thank you cheers
Base timing also known as initial timing for a 350 should be about 8 degrees before top dead Center for an automatic car or about 5 for a manual car. You instructed to set initial timing at 0 degrees top dead center. You will end up with hard start condition setting initial timing at 0 degrees. Total timing should be about 31 or so on a stock engine and you may be able to get up to 36 with a performance cam
Farmer Jim Very True!!!
Total timing should be around 34-36 degrees for most engines depending on fuel used and compression ratio. You want max advance WITHOUT detonation.
@@mascotgraphics 8 degrees seems to run my engine smooth. I just tried 14 and it was hard starts. This is on a marine engine. 4.3L Volvo Penta
Hmm just got a 350/265 crate from gm. No problem getting 36 2800 RPM runs great no ping great power.
Yall don't have to keep finding top dead center if you're not taking your distributor out
The video is excellent, after completion just wondering if the timing will be advance to far when hooking up the vacuum lines that's the only thing I was hoping you would show at the end or is there nothing to be concerned about
Exactly what was needed👌 Thanks a million bud😎 all the way in South Africa👌
The timing for the 69 Corvette is TDC for the 350 except the 350 HP engine which is 8 degrees before TDC according to Chilton. That being said the small block chevy likes some advance at initial timing in a range between 4 to 8 degrees. To set total timing you will need a timing tape on the harmonic balancer if you don't have a timing light like in the video. I don't trust the lights anyway. I might have missed it in the video but the vacuum advance should be hooked back up for total timing. To address moving the distributor for total timing there is available an adjustable vacuum advance to dial in total advance. IMHO 36 degrees is a bit too much for a stock engine. 32-34 degrees seems to be the magic number. There are all kinds of cam shafts available for this engine so check with the manufacturer for total advance.
Yeah this dude has the right idea but his advice is wrong.
Are you referring to 4° to 8° before TDC or after?
Esa si es una apreciación de un experto y estoy de acuerdo
Great video, very informative. I just purchased a 69 coupe with 350/300 with a mild street cam. Converted the distributor to HEI and now I want to set the timing due to engine not performing like a cammed 350 should. I understand all data/information provided, am I required to check the total advance timing again after I reconnect the vacuum line to distributor advance pot and unplug golf tie to carburetor vacuum line to ensure we don't have excessive (50+) advance time? Or should vacuum lines be reconnect for setting total advance timing? No flames intended, just want to perform my first ever timing of a vehicle!!
Any words of wisdom will be welcomed, thanks Mike
Brother that was such a fantastic explanation from start to finish! I appreciate u ! Bcuz like u said & i agree most to all videos dont give u the complete understanding of this procedure & none of them gave me the understanding for me to say oh ok i get it now, none ... .. Well thanks to ur video i can happily say i have a complete understanding of it now sir!, & for that i must thank u sir! Awesome!! I really do appreciate the way u went about explaining it! U took ur time & explained wich left me with no questions from me to u sir I THANK U! GOD BLESS U & keep it hot rodding!
Excellent video. I did feel like you were putting the light on number two wire but maybe your cap is different setup than my 350. I do have one clarification question. Should the vacuum be plugged back in after you set initial and before setting total timing because won’t that factor in to your desired 36 and therefore be more when plugged back in?
thank you for taking the time to do this. very informative
4th time I've watched this video. You explain these procedures so good that makes it easy to understand. I like your quadrajet video too. You helped me to set my way too rich choke on my 83 305 k10 pickup. Hope your doing well! Stay safe and keep the small block chevy videos coming
So easy to understand you had to watch it 4 times! Not bad.....
@@CatRacer1A2A lol exactly
I think he did a fine job explaining how to set timing 5 🌟 🌟 🌟 🌟 🌟
I had to watch a few times I finally get now how to use my digital timing light. You have to set the gun to the engines ignition timing then rotate distributor to show tdc on harmonic bslancer. I'm setting the timing on a 4 cylinder Mitsubishi engine lol but the same principles apply as it does on a v8
Happy it worked out friend.
This guy is the typical old Corvette owner. Old, dressed head to toe in Corvette gear. Probably has Corvette underwear on too.
Great video and explanation of setting the timing! Where did you have your engine idle set too when setting the initial timing?
Hey, good video thanks, however my timing light is an antique, old craftsman just a trigger no static pickup, ( need to clip onto #1) got to use the timing marks on the timing cover, is there a screw or stick on method ?? many thanks. working on a C10 5.0 to 5.7 swap. J.
Is that a corrected hei dist cap? Looks like you pointed to the #2 position on the hei cap instead of #1
This is a great video that I will likely come back to and watch multiple times.
Do you have any advice on converting a C5 from EFI to a carburetor with the overall goal of having a dual carb blower scoop.
(Advice other than, don't do it).
It's kinda of a dream passion project
You want a dual carb setup but dont know how? You dont need a dual carb then...
Nice Effort on the Video.
Here's what does not makes since there's obviously no reason to check basic timing without the vacuum because you're selling it for mechanical vacuum after the fact and changing your basic timing now if you went back and checked your basic timing with the vacuum canister plugged up you would see that it was changed so running 34 to 36 advance is a ballpark depending on compression I appreciate your effort and this is why you had a hunt down other videos cuz all that really matters is mechanical timing and to make sure that that is functioning properly all you got to do is check your basic timing after you're done
curious what the initial timing is at now after setting the total
Your videos help so much. You taught me how to adjust a too rich choke on a quadrajet carburetor. Subscriber for life
You are welcome. I hope you enjoy all the videos. I will have a few more in the near future. Thank you for taking the time to make a comment. Hop
Anyway you could share a few more details? What will “base” timing be when you have set advance timing to 36 degrees on a Chevy 350? Also will the distributor and carb both need to plugged for the advance timing to be accurate?
You only used the base timing to get your engine running. It varies between vehicles and doesn't matter, once you set the advance timing. No you don't need to plug the distributor because the vacuum signal comes from the carb.
I'm trying to learn to set total advance. So initial is set and done. Then remove golf tee and plug vacuum back into vac advance to check total timing? If it's at 20 or whatever how do you adjust the vac advance to get to 36 just rev the engine or dial in with timing light or adjust vac canister with an Allen wrench and start over til you get it at 36?? ..????
finding TDC #1 if you dont have a buddy handy is to use a compression tester with a hose that screws into the spark plug hole and watch the guage as you bump it over once the needle starts to move stop and rotate crankshaft by hand with breaker bar and socket on balancer bolt to TDC
remove spark plug drop a long screw driver in the cylinder rotate the crankshaft until the screw driver is all the way out as much as possible. Done
@@ignacioromero5014 so how do you know if you're on the compression stroke?
@@disht2 My friend did similar and struggled for days trying to start his car. He called me, I listened to it crank, then asked how he installed the distributor. He put the timing on 0 and pointed the rotor to #1. I didn't even bother with anything else, I just rotated the rotor 180 and said try it now. He was both super annoyed that he didn't know that, and happy it was running.
So to answer your question; it's works perfectly - half the time ;)
@@ignacioromero5014 NO, not done cause you dont know if it was on compression stroke. This is why shady tree clowns like you should not be building engines.
Hi again , today when I time my engine I remember that EGR are connected,my questions is should the EGR be blocked or connected when timing the engine. Many thanks
Hop, as an owner of a 69 Vette I love your how to videos. Have you ever converted the cable driven tachometer to electronic? I would love to see a video on calibration and installation.
Thank you. No but I sure have thought about it. I do believe it is more accurate.
Very informative great job sir
Thanks truly this video really helped me out
So you do this with vacuum adv disconnected? 36 degree @ 3000 RPM with no distributor vacuum adv?
Loved the video and nice Corvette. So let me see if I understand. After you set your total advance timing to 36º it looks like at idle your initial timing was around 12º. Is that about right?
No, the idle timing ended up ay 8 degrees.
What dizzy are you running Brand
hi there thank for the video, but my question is your engine stock or modified because i am looking to check my timing on my z28 1978 camaro with 350 chevy is the setting in the video works with my engine.
thanks
Yes, it should be close to the same. I do have an upgraded cam and head but they are mild performance so not much change at all over stock.
Thanks for replying, just a another quation my engine tag have the initial timing to 6 degree , should i but intial timing to 6 degree and the total timing 36 which mean the advance to 29 degree at the 3000 rpm(6+29=36). what do you think ?
thanks
If the engine is running, I would just turn the distributer sightly until you hear a slight valve knocking, then turn it back until the knocking goes away. My bet is it will then be around 8 - 10 degrees advance at initial timing if you check it.@@ramthaLord
One other thing, make sure you adjust the RMS to about 850 rpm at idle.
I don't know.....I learned that after you set your initial timing at between 8 and 12 degrees, then you use the timing light to see what you have at 2500-3000 rpms. 36 would be ideal. After you see that figure at 2500-3000 rpm, you should tighten the distributor up, hook up your vacuum advance and see what your timing is then 2500-3000. This will tell you how much your vacuum advance is 'advancing' your timing. Don't let it go over 56 degrees, bad for your engine.
David T is correct, I use a vacuum pump connected to adjustable vacuum advance...dial in the max advance you want without the driving and trial method. I go 12* initial...36* @ 2500RPM and 12* max vacuum. That gives max total 48 degrees. Total mechanical 36* plus 12* @ max vacuum = 48*
So ported or manifold vacuum?? I bet your timing is more than 36 degrees total when your reconnected your vacuum.
So you set the initial timing first, then you set it again at 2500-3000 rpms, doesn't this change the first setting? I'm confused.
TheJhaley12 yes it will change your initial setting. The first setting is just to help you start the engine easily. Think of it as just a guess. Then setting the total timing will give you a balance of both. Most distributors have adjustable range so you can find the best of both worlds but typically if you buy a distributor designed for your engine it isn’t needed for stock applications. Cam shafts and higher compression can skew these numbers and will require trial and error
@@benhebert2322 what do you do when the timing is suppose to be 6 degrees set by the factory...89 c4
Not sure why you removed #1 spark plug, as you were just moving the timing mark on the balancer to the timing tab. Plus, I sure hope you remembered to reinstall #1 spark plug.
I know this isn’t a classic car you have but if my car starts right up, can I just go straight to advanced timing??
I have a 1956 Oldsmobile 324
You'd need to know what your total advance timing should be, but yes, if you know what that # is.
It definitely runs best at 36 total. 350 small block. And vac advance on manifold vacuum.
Was the total timing done with the vaccum lines connected from the distributor to the carb
I know you unhook the vacuum line from the distributor and plug the port on the carb for initial timing, like when putting in a new distributor. The problem is when setting total timing theoretically you would need to have the vacuum advanced hooked up. If you set total timing without it then when you hook it up it will advance your timing past where you set it. Can you elaborate, am I missing something?
Research Vacuum advance on an engine. Engines make different levels of Vacuum throughout the rpm range. The Vacuum advanced distributor is supposed to keep the engine in the "sweet spot' and also save fuel, hence racing engines don't bother with anything Vacuum because they have no use for it and big camshafts produce very little.
Si el vacío está desconectado entonces realmente no se debe llamarse avance total
Que yo sepa avance total es el avance inicial más centrífugo más vacío.
Saludos desde Barranquilla Colombia
With today's crap gasoline, never go more than 34 deg. total advance.
Hi, so I plan to set timing on a 74 corvette, and the timing light I purchased is just a light, it doesn't have buttons to set degrees or anything, but is the process still the same? Should I just make sure at 2500 rpms the white mark is at the red mark?
Yes, set your timing to about 8-10 degrees advance with you timing light at zero at idle. Make sure the car is warmed up first if possible. Back off on the timing when if you hear the valve start to make a tapping sound. If it all sounds good make sure you are also set about 800 rpm at idle.
If mark on balancer moves erratically,doing total,what does it mean
? If you were to raise your RPM to 3000 to 3500 Does your H.B. white line move? Mine does. My maximum total timing is 50 at 3200 RPM. Do I have a bad HEI distributor Advanced setup? I'm working on a Chevy 383 stroker in my 4X4.
Probablemente está muy avanzado y deberías sentir cascabeleo cuando el motor está a temperatura max y bajo carga.Los que saben ponen 30 grados a 3000 rpm . maximo 36 con vacío conectado.Te estoy hablando de máximo rendimiento demostrado en dinamómetro a menos que tengas culatas o pistones de baja compresión.
He did mention paper blowing out of #1 cylinder, however if you do that,pass the mark and crank the engine until the white mark comes back around, #1 isn't back on top. It doesn't matter if you marks line up initially for a timing light. Hook the light to #1, start the engine,rotate the distributor till your where you want to be. Now if you're installing a distributor, you want #1 top dead center.
Hi my name is Dr hunt I'm trying to set up the timing on a 2000 Chevy express van v 8 having a little trouble need a little help
If u turn the key several times to get the white line to line up how u no the number one piston is still to the top of that cylinder
thought the same thing it also lines up on the exhaust stroke where the piston is at the bottom.
@@ignacioromero5014 if I'm understanding the question, pull #1 spark plug and make sure you're on compression stroke.
How do you know when you reach 2,500 RPM when holding the timing light and revving the engine with the throttle linkage?
My timing light shows RPM on a small screen on the timing light. Another way is the have a separate rpm gauge or someone in the car looking at the rpm guage.
He is hoping at 2,500 rpm the advance weights will be thrown out as much as they will go. Depends on the springs as to what you need to rev it to, heavier springs = later advance = more revs.
I got an ATK crate motor from Dallas, TX. 325 hp. Have tried two different distributors, a Pertronix and an MSD and I am getting 50 degrees total timing with both. Recommended with what cam the motor has is 36. I have initial at about 12, it won't run with 8. The car runs hot and I believe it is due to timing and detonation. I am going to try an AC Delco stock type HEI and see if that will work. My last resort that I know to try is an advance stop plate. Anybody know a solution to my problem please comment.
Did you put a harmonic balancer on it or did it come with one if your engine had the timing tab already and no balancer it’s possible that you are not getting a correct reading because it is the wrong size for the tab they installed
I don't always introduce foreign objects into my engine, but when I do I make sure that inject enough paper Towles into my cylinder to cause damage.
Hell do you have manifold or vacuum
Venturi ? To your distributor
Great video!
Thank you.
How do you know your at TDC just by the mark on the balancer? What if the white mark is off 10-15 degrees????
Good question. A good indicator is once the car is started. You turn the distributor until you start to hear the inlet/exhaust valves make slight a tapping noise. Then turn the distributor in the opposite direction until the tapping noise of the valves stops. Drive the car around a little bit and see how it performs. Some small adjustments may need to be made afterwards on the distributor based on performance.
CorvetteHop true, but I have a t-bucket with sprint style headers. I can’t hear shit....
The white line was marked by you. You only need to go through the first steps if you are installing the distributor, but that's a different story. Locking in total timing also locks initial timing. The truth is that the only way to get close to being correct is to have the engine dynode. and the ignition curve has to be plotted for different rpm. This involves distributor weights and distributor cam lobe changes. For maximum power this will be unique for each engine. And your engine will need be re-dynode if you make changes to engine power. What I am saying is that Your method is just a guess. If you look at the service manuals each engine option has a different curve. Bummer.
You set initial and then total but never went back and showed the initial again. why didn't the initial change when you moved the distributer for the total adjustment?
lmao, your lucky the paper didnt get sucked in on the intake stroke, and the clamp is called an induction clamp, and its not called a humanic balancer
i'm currently pulling my hair out trying to get my 350 to run right. It will fire right up so i must have set the initial timing right but misfires really badly, new plugs and wires but watching this video i realised i didnt plug my vacuum advance when setting the initial timing, could this be contributing to the misfire?
Yes it can. Also check the teeth on the bottom of the didtributer. Make sure the teeth are not worn. A good ground for the distributor is also very important.
@@TheWhatisright thank you, its a brand new summit distributor with holley sniper/msd6al so a bit trickier to diagnose than a carb (which i had even less luck with)
All this after you set points and dwell angle lol I’m so over my carbureted engine I’m ready for my ls1
LS are easy to make power with & they make more hp / tq stock than SOME sbc and bbc, but, they´re played out and they aren´t that much of a god send..I will give the LS the credit for OEM cylinder head flow, skirted blocks, 6 bolt mains, some aluminum block / heads applications.
Getting the ECM ¨tuned¨ each time you do a simple bolt on is lame, you either pay alot for someone to do it or you study your ass off and learn how.
These old engines make power just as easy as the truck LS and gen 3 & some gen 4 car engines once you step into the aftermarket and the parts are way cheaper.
Compare a simple gear drive for a small or big block to a LS. There are multiple companies that make gear drives for these old engines ranging from a little over $100 up to a few $100..now on to the LS there are only one or two companies that make gear drives for them and they are between $600-$800.
Nothing beats the simplicity of these ¨gen 1¨ sbc and bbc. Wiring the starter on these old engines is so easy it isn´t even funny..same with installing the distributor and setting the timing. HEI (like what is used in the video) has nothing to do with gap, dwell, external mount coil, etc..that is all for points ignition, even then it isn´t that difficult setting the gap or using a dwell meter.
HEI is far superior to points. For example HEI has a coil in cap VS points external mount coil. HEI can supply efficent spark in higher rpm. HEI you can set timing and ¨forget¨ it, no messing around with points in any way, size, shape or form..HEI also only has 1 wire to run to 12V to power the coil & then you can set your timing.
It is so so simple to run a old engine such as these stand alone with an HEI dizzy..assuming your engine is assembled, from carb to oil pan and anything else, all you have to do is run 4 wires..points is similar but a bit different.
These wires to run HEI equipped engine stand alone are as follows: a ground wire from - at battery to somewhere metal on the engine, then run a wire from ¨batt" terminal on dizzy to + at battery (this energizes coil), then run a wire from ¨S¨ terminal on starter solenoid to + at battery (this will engage starter to flywheel/flexplate, touch wire to power when you want to engage starter) and lastly a wire from + at battery to the biggest center terminal on the starter solenoid (this will provide power to starter solenoid)
Holley (my prefrence) carbs are super easy to tune as well. All the maintinence is easy on these old ones too.
Fuel injection definetly has its place, don´t get me wrong. I understand how the sensors work and everything electrical wise. I´m not ¨scared¨ of fuel inj, it is nice to jump in your vehicle and drive from the West Coast to the East Coast and not have to adjust your air fuel mixture one single time..but if im going to be racing and swapping parts often im sticking with purely mechanical carbureted old school Chevys.
As you can see I am not against LS I just perfer these old small / big blocks, as they are bare bones essentials..super simple, no sensors, no 100ft of wiring, super cheap parts, I could go on and on.
Regardless of your preferred platform keep on wrenchin!
Thanks for sharing :- )
You are welcome. I am still working on some editing with the video brightness.
I liked your show, but as I was taught in school don't say this, that, here, or there, it helps people understand. Somewhat.
Thank you so much for the input. I will keep that in mind next time. Hop
it will be close to 50* at full vacuum and full mechanical advance.
350 Chevy initial 10-16 total (advance) 32-34
Where does the initial timing need to be set on to be in 30-35 total timing with out going through adjusting at high rpm?or is it a engine to ending thing?i don't have a tach
@@tymigliore6390 It varies depending on distributor so you really need to rev it. You don't need a tach, just rev until it won't advance anymore. If you're afraid of revving it you can use light advance weights or no weights. Yes, each eng has a different ideal # so you'll just have to look online for that ideal total is for yours. Mine was 32. Once you dial that in you let it idle and wherever it lands is your new initial timing. Every oem car I've checked has too little total timing when set to the suggested initial. Eg oem might be 8 deg at idle, but total is something like 25. So if you adjusted that example car to 32, then initial would be 15, which imo is closer to where it should be. Each eng varies but I've never ran less than 15 initial on any car. Less than that is, imo, for emissions by people who don't care that you're hurting the engine and wasting gas.
If you have a cam, the bigger the cam the more initial timing you can use. With my eng I found 27deg initial timing netted the best power off the line, then a total of 32 deg, so only 5 deg mechanical advance. More low rpm timing means better mpg and the eng runs cooler. If I were to set mine at the oem 8 deg, I would overheat at every stoplight in summer. At 27 my idle is stronger, low end power much stronger, mpg better and runs a lot cooler. With an oem or mild cam I'd imagine 15-20 deg initial is likely the limit but each eng varies. A great many older cars have overheating issues and bumping the timing is the fix imo, which I've done many times to many cars.
Usually the vacuum advance will now add too much at part load and it'll ping, sometimes badly, so you need to modify the vacuum advance to come in later and less of it.
When the mechanical timing advances is also important and may need adjusting. The oem mechanical advance usually comes in late so it may be fine as-is, but if it needs to come in later I trim the weights down. To make vacuum advance come in later you need to set it so it's partially advanced by limiting the travel by shortening the slot where it rides. You'll see it in there, a slot where the vac rod moves in. You want make the slot shorter so it's pushing on the diaphragm, or partially advanced. I soldered a bar to the plate that blocks half the slot to hold it advanced. Oem the diaphragm adds 20deg which starts advancing very soon. Mine only advances half that and doesn't start advancing until an oem unit would be after it's hit the 10deg mark, because I'm literally limiting from going lower. So by the time an unmodified unit hits 11deg, mine is 1 deg. 15 deg and mine is 5 etc. If I recall, mine starts advancing around 10-11" vacuum. How to tell how much initial and total on both mechanical and vacuum timing is right, plus when they start, is trail and error.
How many guys adjust their timing by ear, seriously? After running it down the road and pulling over to make adjustments until you hit that sweet spot.
Actually, Many do. That was the old school way.
I do ear first then use tools for dial in
Yup, time it by ear until it's snappy, assuming you have a decent carb. Read the plugs, then fine tune on fuel settings.
I need help setting my 1981 c10 in time , it has a swap from a 80 to 68 350 not sure what year casting number is (3970010) it has several marks so i dont know which one is right dont know what degree to set the timing gun on for initial timing go get the right mark as of the moment it still turns on
For Total Advance Timing, your timing gun should be at 36 degrees with a 350 Chevy. For initial timing, set your timing gun at zero. most 350 Chevy engines run great between 8 - 10 degrees advance on your timing mark at idle. In fact, once I finished my total advance timing on my car, I looked at my timing mark with the timing gun and it was 10 degrees advance at idle. Another way is to just start the car and turn the distributor until it runs its best. Make sure you do not hear any tapping noice from the engine. If that does not work, then you have another problem (maybe plugs, spark plug wires, coil, disp cap, rotor). I hope this helps. Corvette Hop
CorvetteHop thanks im adavance, i just have a little confusion about how do i know what 8-10 degress is the mark? Is the mark the one that says tdc ? Make sure is on 0 ? Like my confusion is what mark on the balancer
CorvetteHop or it works like initial time is tdc mark on balancer at 0° on the tooths with timing gun at 0 , advance is tdc mark on balancer and 0° on tooths but with gun at 36° degree and 2,500-3,000 rpm? Which once is done it by it selfs moves 10 degress advance ?
No problem, If you are looking at intial timing then make sure the timeing gun is set at Zero at idle (engine warmed up warmed up). Point the timing gun on the timing mark (balancer) and turn the Dirstibuter until the timing mark is about 8 - 10 degrees advance. Hopefully, the engine will run better.
Remember, in the video I said Total Advance Timing is the perfect goal. "O" mark balancer and timing gun is only at idle (engine warmed up and at around 850 rpms). However, advance timing helps your car run better at all speeds (example, idle, normal speed and highway). That is when the 36 degrees on the timing gun comes into play. This is what I found out after I did initial and advance timing on my car. Once it was all done on my 350 chevy, I went back and check how the initial timing mark changed at idle. When I set the timing gun back to zero after total advance timing the timing mark at idle was 10 degrees advance. So, if a chevy engine has not had any modification, special cam or special springs in the Distributor you should be able to just set the initial idle at 8 - 10 degrees at idle and be done with it. By the way, 8 - 10 degrees at idle is also the manufactur setting. The key is, I had to find out what that timing mark was for my engine. In other words, I did not know if the person before me did any special modifications to the engine (ie, cams, heads or anything). Now, I know, I just need to set it at 8-10 degrees advance at idle eveytime.
Too much unexplained here (for the average guy). You go through the trouble of setting base timing, you undo it when you re- twist the distributor to set total timing. Now base is changed.
Jim, agree. And also a very good question/comment. Yes, base (initial timing) is changed slightly for the perfect timing mark position. I think base timing has to be shown first. If someone does any major modification like a new cam or heads they need to know how to set initial timing. However, how do they know it is at the perfect position (timing mark) after a modification. Anyone will tell you once a performance cam or performance head is installed it may alter the timing. Total Advance timing is the answer. I do agree if the car already starts then the initial times does not need to be explained. Also, if the car is already running perfect, then total advance timing does not need to be explained. Thank you for the comment.
You have to have Tru tdc marks or non of this will work
Ya but how do you know if it’s running at 2500-3000 rpms?
My timing gun has a RPM readout. I push the button and it switches to RPM. Push the button again and the timing gun goes back to timing. Another way is to have separate timing meter. Or have some in the driver seat giving you an indication.
Thanks and the reason I was asking is because my truck doesn’t have a tachometer
Understand that. I think auto zone sales a cheap tach meter. Not all timing guns have a tach meter on them like mine.
By the sound, if you can't hear about what rpm you are at you may not have a ear for tuning a motor
Just rev it until ti stops advancing. If you're uncomfortable with that, read the reply I put above
Dang I wish my truck had an rpm gauge
please review the terms you're using. TDC is not the perfect combustion position.. It merely is the location of the crankshaft and other components attached to it. Camshaft via gear or chain, and the valve train and the position of the valves (Closed), and finally the distributor and rotor/cap pointing directly at #1 cylinder. 36 is not optimal for every engine, as detonation could occur if too much advance timing is used and possibly damage your engine. just saying...This video will confuse the hell out of someone who knows a little, but those who don't know anything at all will find it very helpful. An engine tuner will laugh out loud, seriously it is that bad.
Christ the intro is a minute long...
I did change that in video all afterwards. The nice thing is we have fast forward. Thanks for the comment.
Thanx
what if you have backfire
initial timing better known as Idle timing
You have to set your total timing first before ignition timing dude.
Nope, sorry friend. IGNITION timing first, so you can start the car. Ignition or what is also referred to as initial timing must be set after major maintenance on the engine such as cam, heads, valves, piston or rings to insure the car starts. Otherwise, the car may or will not start. Once that is complete, move on to total timing for fine tuning.
Think about it if you start with initial timing first then go to total timing last this Will off set the initial timing a couple of degrees.
@@Mylee837 That is correct. However, how do you know what total timing is unless you can start the engine first. If you have already set your total timing and have no engine modifications to your engine you can do that because nothing has changed. If you did engine modifications your engine can be 180 degrees off TDC. Timing marks and TDC can be off and engine will not start. Especially if your cam, timing gear or timing chain has been changed. This video is designed from start to finish. Not if your engine is already running. If your engine is already running thin all you need to do is adjust total timing.
I can agree on that 👍
After you stuck the napkin/paper towel in the #1 plug hole, you never mentioned putting the plug back in before starting the engine. Wear your safety glasses!
Base timing at 0 degrees is wrong
That was a very poor example,terrible explanation.
👍🏼👍🏼
Oh wow. 😂😂😂
Your camera don't take enough frames per 2nd to catch the timing mark gotta take over 23 frames per 2nd That's what the human eyes can see
*second
Set initial timing at 0? Hahaha.....NO. Im out.
This is 90% wrong.
Thank you for the input.
this guy is not making any sense to me he's telling us to set the initial timing at the regular normal idle speed but when he does the timing he's turning the speed up to 3000 RPMs and then he's telling us to turn it up to 36 degrees Advanced you're not supposed to go that high
First off, one needs to set initial time to start the engine after major maintenance such as a new cam, heads or major work on the engine. You can not just put the engine at 36 and expect it to work. Next, in order to have the engine running at it best advance timing needs to be set. How in the world do you know the mark for advance timing if you can not even start the engine after major maintenance? What if you are 180 degrees off timing? What is your new timing mark based on a high performance cam or heads? This video was not just designed to set the timing (i.e., one ever year or two with the nine already running). It was designed to get it all running correctly after major engine maintenance. The video was designed to help those who do not know much about time and to get the engine running after major work.
@@TheWhatisright I just didn't under stand you no need to uptight about it
@@flyingBrian115 Not uptight at all. Just explaining as the video did. You are correct that you can jump to advance timing if the car is already working fine. And you have a good point it all is well in the car operations. I just wanted to make sure someone does not try to start the car after major maintenance and wonder why the car will not start. Thank you for the input.
CorvetteHop Jesus how hard is it to understand that when you sent the initial timing that’s just the basic suggested timing when you set it at advance that is for total performance, so basically if you’re not looking for maximum power just set your initial time and he want the most out of your engine set an advanced. I think you did an excellent job if you can’t understand that you should be paying someone to work on your car for the love of God that was as basic as it gets, it’s your car you may have to back it off or you may have to advance it more depending on the gasoline that you’re using but don’t tell anybody that because my god if they can’t understand your video they’ll definitely be lost. Lol
Once your timing is set to the factory spects to set the advance you mess with springs located on the distributor cams. Lighter ones for more advance, heavier ones for less. You don't have to move the distributor again.