2 Stroke Cylinder Honing Facts and How I do it
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 ต.ค. 2024
- 2 Stroke Cylinder Honing Facts and How I do it
In this video...
I explain what I've learned about 2 stroke honing
Going over the tools needed to remove piston transfer
Going over the different honing tools available
Honing the cylinder
Cleaning the cylinder
BRUSH RESEARCH MANUALS - info.brushresea...
Tools/Fluids
Flex Hone (71-73mm) - amzn.to/2EiKFZe
Brush Hone (63-76mm) - amzn.to/3ggYeWv
Stone Hone (2-7inches) - amzn.to/3iQRNeq
Bore Brush - amzn.to/2Yjo469
Muriatic Acid - amzn.to/34eaEvT
Engine ICE - amzn.to/2FKUFvf
Honing Oil - amzn.to/3hhTkK1
Red Scotch Brite Pads - amzn.to/2S5I4pD
Milwaukee M12 Fuel Kit - amzn.to/3b9GXvL
If you enjoyed, please comment, like, share and subscribe!
Thank you for watching!
Support the channel and up your swag with Mike Sabo merchandise! Visit www.teespring.com/stores/michael-sabo
Equipment I use!
Wireless Mic - amzn.to/2VeEATV
Tripod - amzn.to/2T4ZHW7
Tripod Phone Mount - amzn.to/37OzFfh
Phone Gimble - amzn.to/2vWDTnG
GoPro Hero 7 Black - amzn.to/2HQMMSp
Video Editing - amzn.to/39Ug66z
Thumbnail Editing - amzn.to/2HJuanv
My Favorite Energy Drinks... and they're cheap 😎
Reign Energy - amzn.to/2vXv5hk
Strikeforce Energy use Promo Code: SABO20
Companies and Sponsors please contact: michaelsabo350@gmail.com
Add me on Instagram @michaelsabo350
DBC Racing
Website: www.dbcracing.com
Instagram: @dbc_racing
I own the license to use any and all music in this video.
Other Music is as follows...
Track 1
Thank you for watching my video; I hope this helps anyone that needs to hone their cylinder. Links are below!
BRUSH RESEARCH MANUALS - info.brushresearch.com/downloa...
Tools/Fluids
Flex Hone (71-73mm) - amzn.to/2EiKFZe
Brush Hone (63-76mm) - amzn.to/3ggYeWv
Stone Hone (2-7inches) - amzn.to/3iQRNeq
Bore Brush - amzn.to/2Yjo469
Muriatic Acid - amzn.to/34eaEvT
Engine ICE - amzn.to/2FKUFvf
Honing Oil - amzn.to/3hhTkK1
Red Scotch Brite Pads - amzn.to/2S5I4pD
Milwaukee M12 Fuel Kit - amzn.to/3b9GXvL
Awesome video man, very educational. Keep up the great work.
So glad to see she's running bro!!!!! Think you nailed the honing!!!!
Great to see it run again will we get another first ride soon ?
@@Bendover-ri5tx yessir, it will be live at 6:15 PM ET Saturday!
Probably could of had a machine shop hone it for the cost it was for buying all the hones
I feel like people that take their time and research with an Open mind are a rare breed. Much love and respect 🖤💪🏿
Indeed 🤙
👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Thank you so much man 🤘
@@250rtrxjunkie .q.q 1.ĺlĺĺĺ1
He’s getting payed too
Hey Michael! Great video. Thanks for the recognition. I must say I am impressed with the job you did removing the aluminum transfer from the cylinder wall. I'm even more impressed with the hone job. That cylinder looked great! You did exactly what you should have by rotating the hone in both directions. The brush hone that you tried was probably too large in diameter like you said, but you really don't need it. Trust me, that cylinder finish is great. If i had to nit pick anything, it would be to oscillate the drill a bit faster to get a little steeper angle on the crosshatch. It is still going to work great, I'm splitting hairs here. Sounded good when you ran it, just make sure you heat cycle the engine a few times to seat those new rings in that fresh bore. You have to find "too rich" and "too lean" with your carb jetting to know where "just right" is. This will take some time and effort. Shoot me a text or give me a call if i can assist in any way.
Thanks again and God bless!
Thanks for giving him advise so he could relay it. I appreciate you
Thanks Herb for spending all this time with Mike. You just didnt help him out you helped me out and prob a lot of others. Thank you very much sir! :)
@@just_in_time5518 Glad to be able to help. You're welcome.
@@FreedomInc Glad to help!
I too appreciate your expert advice that can be a help to many.
This was a blessing in disguise. Not only did you learn how to hone, doing a great job at it btw but giving us awesome content. Thanks brother.
Great video. I am about to dive into rebuilding two 2-stroke bikes for my wife and myself, without spending new bike money. Appreciate your research and detail. Keep the vids coming!
I'm relieved to see that you took my advice and removed the transfer by hand before honing. The cylinder looks great. The only thing I would suggest is that you hone way less and then check your work. It generally does not take near that much honing to do the job. Looks great though!
All I have ever used in my old 2t bikes was a ball hone. All I have ever heard about the stone hones is that they tend to leave groves in the cylinder where the ends of the stones contact the bore. Nice job and look forward to hearing the bike run again.
Nothing like the sound of a 2 stroke, big smile when it fired up. Waiting for the next video of cylinder reassembly. Great video Michael.
Great information in this video! I am rebuilding a 1979 ts125 that I was going to use a stone hone on, and boy am I glad I decided to research before I jumped into it.
Now I just need to find me some acid and a ball hone!
Phenomenal job saving that cylinder 🤙🏼 this channel keeps getting better
Thank you bro! 🤘
I really like your videos, I thank you for explaining what you are doing before hand especially because something very similar just happened to my polaris 400 2 stroke , thanks again and great job on 250r
I appreciate the feedback man; thank you for watching my videos!
It doesn't hurt a thing to round out the edges of your ports ...if you don't keep a good chamfer on the ports ..the sharp edges will destroy a new set of piston rings in about a day ...there are specs for chamfering the ports in the Honda cr250r service manual .
Also specs for the concave of the bridge port on the exhaust ....if it is too shallow ..it will burn the piston ring at that same spot
Used the Flex hone on my YZ426 and older CR250...came out perfect.
Did you happen to run a stock piston or did you need to measure for a new size after honing?
A great video - wondering what grit flex hone you used? Seems about 320. Great result, exactly the job I need to do. Thanks.
I use the same ball Hone when repairing chainsaws. Your cylinder came out great. Maybe next time I will try the acid . I usually use sandpaper to remove the transfer. Nice video
U never fail to keep me interested and waiting on the next episode keep up the good work brother cant wait to see u ripping this thing!!!!!
I was told to only run the flex hone clockwise, as it wants to come apart reversed. With ports, there is a need to go both directions. Knowing that it works in reverse and the acid trick makes me want to repair an old KX250 that's been sitting around 14 years. Thanks.
That's what I'm doing to my 2000 rm 250,she been sitting over 10yrs in the basement. Port value has anick above it,eat the last piston looks like a shark bite in the old piston. Watched another video think I can get away with just weld n copy exactly what he does in this video. Keeping my fingers crossed it works 💪, let's Ride! # Tha Real McCoy
Dude great video! Thanks for going into detail with these hones! Not alot of info out there video wise. I just used the ball hone ( flex hone) a month ago on my top end rebuild for my 1996 rm125. And it worked great! Sounds great again! Big thanks to Herb also for giving u all this info for us also! i learned a lot!
Michel sabo is such an inspiration! Just rebuilt my rm 85 top to bottom and she is a beast!
Hell yea I want to see him get that thing tuned right and ride the hell out of it 🤘🤘🤘🖒🖒🖒
Nice job.first time i did that was on a 85 ATC 250r.I was nervous as hell.
Awesome video great information I’ve honed out a cylinder of my own with a stone hone like yours and it worked great some people do say not to use it on a 2 stroke because of the ports and I agree with them I used my hone on a crf70 4 stroke because the cylinder was so worn out it made a noticeably big ridge in the cylinder so much you could feel it pretty good with your finger and all I did was buy a bigger piston and honed the cylinder out so the cylinder was even all the way around this was my first time ever trying something like this and the bike runs just fine no smoke and good compression i recommend just doing it on 4 strokes with this particular hone just to be safe and when doing 2 strokes do the same thing and get a ball hone you can use a ball on 4 strokes but they are more expensive just my own opinion
He knows his stuff. Hell of a mechanic 🧰
Awesome to see u get her running again
I've been building engines for 30 years and when I was a beginner and poor and didn't know any better I used the tripple stone hones. I would never use one now because everyone knows a ball hone is the real deal. I have never seen or heard of a brush hone until these last 2 videos. I really do enjoy your videos and especially your personality. Id rather hire a less experienced mechanic who's not too cool to ask questions than one who thinks he knows it all.
@@jaysmokey Wrong!
Use a ball hone only to deglaze the surface and to restore the cross hatch. Honing to size is a different thing and you gotta use the stones.
Been building engines in your garage maybe, you have not been building them professionally, obviously.
Good job Michael. You have done some good research. Please mention Plateau Honing next time. Several good reference articles are available on the WEB. Thanks for covering this topic.
Thanks for doing research. I work mostly on large Diesel engines. I was quite amazed at the muriatic acid trick. I forsure thought-the cylinder was scrap.
I’ve watched this 3 different times and everytime I fall asleep and this is why I’m here for a 4th time goodnight boys
Hell yeah brother!! Man I love this 250 love the hole build cant wait to see it ripping again! Great job not rushing it
Great video. Learning , learning all the time. Thanks for sharing.
Getting drunk af and watching your videos is the best🤟🏻 can’t wait to rip
Dont ride drunk I learnt that the hard way
Nice job with the honing, she looks good as new. Getting to hear it run in the end was worth the days of waiting. As for me, I found out my truck has more problems than I thought. The mechanic I brought it to found some structural rot on the frame and wouldn't fix the fuel issue. It's just too unsafe to be on the road. It's a bummer, but the upside is I got a brand new truck coming to me. It had to be brought in from another dealer, so we'll be picking it up Monday. So it looks like the YZ will be napping for a while longer, getting to work is more important. I'm also quite excited, it may only be a lease, but this is my first new vehicle. Everything thing I've owned has been hand-me-downs that were on their last legs. :)
I actually use some of that muriatic acid on my 1984 Yamaha YZ250 I was told by a servicing mechanic at action Motorsports that putting that muriatic acid in a spray bottle soaking down the cylinder let it sit for about 1 to 2 minutes and then use the red Scotch-Brite do it again and again until the aluminum is gone
The 9 dislikes must be the couple guys that were mad this process worked super well! LOL! Killer video again Mike. Cant wait to rip LS with you soon.
Thanks for sharing the Brush Search Company looks like an A one company
I’ve been looking at company to buy from for awhile as I do quad Moto x and jet ski work 👍👍
Just want to say I have rebuilt around 45 bikes in 2 years and have watched an outrageous amount of videos but this is by far the best one I've seen. I thought honing was way to much work and very "sketchy" but you just made me add this to my shop! Amazing video man!! Taking time and doing research and sharing with us. Appreciate it! Keep up the work!!
First I wanna say badass shirt I just got mine a few weeks ago! I love it because I had the exact same quad that’s on the shirt ! 2nd killer video and thanks for all the great content man! Good job
great video, thanks for sharing all of your hard work with us!
Can’t wait to see it up and running again
I got abit upset thinking I wouldn’t hear it running in this video....them BAM like always mike stuck to his word and let us hear the heart beat once again😍
I always send my snowmobile or dirtbike Nikasil cylinders to a diamond hone shop... Costs me $25 the cylinder ! Then I'm good for a couple more seasons. Cylinders come back looking brand new with a whole lot of cross hatchings !
Yeah thats how I honed mine thanks for sharing the motor sounds perfect great job
Great job man happy to see her up and running again, definitely looking forward to future videos
One more thing where the Plastics were hitting your frame you put that rubber gasket on the Plastics pull that back off slenderize your Plastics more. If I lived by I bring that 40 mm Mikuni carb over so you can do A and B test with all your carburetors just to see which one has more power. Very good job bud
I really wish you would have measured the bore size before and after. Still a great video!
Your video production is looking very polished. Your content is thorough and educational. Nice work!
Millennium Technologies advises to NOT hone Nikasil. The grit permanently imbeds into the Nikasil. They recommend an ultra finish plateau style bone if you need to de glaze. Maroon scotch brite also works.
That was myckey mouse job oh my good, the cylinder will by never ever straid, you have to mashure THE CYLINDER ,guys i dont recomendet this crazy metod , the micro film of oil wiil by not even in the cylinder , he will fuck the piston one more time , OHHHHHHHHHH
I would certainly send out for a repair and nikasil coat they size with diamond hones. You left the power valve flapper the exhaust hope you removed it and cleaned really good.
Excellent video!
Any twostroke with all those ports in the barrel/sleeve require fixed honing stones that are perfectly parallel to bore... those flex crap things fling out from centrifugal force and damage ports... FACT... worst honers to use on any engine. But catastrophic for twostroke engines... seriously, very disturbing to watch someone using those dodgy crap honers... there are excellent fixed stone honers that can be adjusted for bore size and even semi fixed that swivel in centre of stone are still better than flex crap...
Been waiting for this video for a long time!!
Fresh hot pizza
hell yeah!!! i cant wait to see riding videos with the 250r!!
Thanks, this really helped me out a lot
Nice, very informative, thank you
Awesome video!! Question: how big is your bore and what size did you buy your hone? I have a 50mm bore cilinder which I want to hone. Should I get the 50mm or the 51mm flex hone? Also what grit size is recommended?
Thank, man! I’m a big fan ❤
Will honing my cylinder remove any small scoring?
Anything steel near your bench will rust from the vapors of that acid. Ask me how I know, lol. I now keep it outside and only bring in the partial cap ful needed for the job.
Always take off your reeds the stuff that comes off with Honing can hide in the reeds that was a rookie mistake regardless if you sed you were being lazy
Defo reeds needs cleaned
Looks legit but like I said before dial bore gauge to check. Hone will still remove material from the bore. Maybe next time try a drill press to help keep it square to the bore. Because you can remove more material from one spot over another. Machinist by trade myself here and everything the other sub said is still pretty spot on.
I use Flex hones almost daily in my shop and just for record the Flex hone used for Plated cylinders is a "Aluminum Oxide" compound instead of the usual "Silicon Carbide" compound used for cast iron and steel bores. Those Stone hones with the arms on it are trash and should be thrown in the trash where they belong. A real stone hone is a ridged hone and is whats used to final size a bore and keep it concentric and straight and is used in a machine(How its done in my shop and many other engine shops) and flooded with honing oil. Nice Video Mike and its good to educate and debonk some of the myths and misinformation that runs wild on the internet.
😮flex honing brush is the best
Good job man. I still don't know if I'd use it on nikasil. Those cylinders are smooth. The ones I've worked on anyway. Cheers bro 🍺
You cannot hone nicasil cylinders
@@kvrfilms5008 6:38
How to make a muriatic acid bomb: (it's not as bad as it sounds)
1. Get a plastic bottle. 20oz works pretty well. Can use bigger.
2. Crumple up a tiny bit of aluminum foil. Crumple loosely, not tight. About the size of your thumb tip.
3. Put foil into 20oz bottle.
4. Get cap ready for bottle. Pour muriatic acid into bottle until it fills up those dimples usually found on the bottom of 20oz drinks.
5. Quickly screw cap on tight and shake the bottle for a few seconds. You should start to see smoke forming.
6. Throw it!!!! Doesn't have to be super far.
7. If it doesn't swell up and eventually go boom, you may have used too little or too much foil/acid.
The acid eats the foil and gives off toxic fumes which fill the bottle until it goes boom. Depending on the mixture of foil to acid and if you shook it, you should have about 10 seconds before it explodes. The bottle will start to expand and heat up (that sizzling), it should not be in your hand at this point. I used to do brick work and we would use this, diluted, to clean excess brick mortar off the walls. It's as safe as firing bottle rockets at other people for comparison. I wouldn't recommend doing it, but I've had them explode next to my feet without any risk of injury (had jeans on). I still don't recommend being near it. It just makes a loud boom. It will not leave a crater in your yard or blow up a mailbox or anything, it's not that kind of boom. It's just a gas bomb really.
Might want to get your affairs in order. The Feds will be knocking on your door real soon after making this post.
@@betarider9392 LOL. No they won't. Like I said, it's not a bomb in the traditional sense.
We used to do this with toilet bowl cleaner instead of muratic acid. @JarofMayonaise
Looking forward to seeing you riding it!
Ball hone first,then finish with brush hone for plateau finish.
i had to shave a bit of material in my jug , the piston was scratching a defective part that was due to casting issues
Great video, could you tell me what grit hone you used?
Nice helpfull vid, awesome channel!
Nice work Mike!
Nice video. Thank you. Always a controversial topic.
From my research I’ve read:
With this product one is deglazing and cross hatching. Not officially “honing” …..not cutting down and increasing bore size.
1. How smooth or rough the cylinder wall required somewhat depends upon the material used in your piston ring.
2. Cast Iron piston rings (used years ago but can still be purchased) require a rough cylinder wall. Here you would use a rough grit (120) - Silicone Carbide (SC) Flex-Hone. This is considered rough grit.
3. Alloy Steel piston rings (this is today’s industry standard used in almost all top end kits) in a Cast Iron (sleeve) cylinder head recommends the use of (SC) Silicon Caribe Flex-Hone at 180 (Medium) Grit.
3. A Nikasil (Nickel Plated) Cylinder requires the use of an (AO) Aluminum Oxide Flex-Hone at 240 (Fine) Grit as recommended by BRM.
From snowmobile experience, always a good idea to use higher end “forged” pistons. More expensive than cast pistons but worth it.
4. You can order specific piston rings from Hastings if desired. (Cast Iron, Alloy Steel, Stainless Steel)
hastingspistonrings.com
You have to sit there and just hone your arm off to knock it out of bore.. plus if you got a good brand piston the rings can be filed to fit properly
wow, great results!
You honed the cilinder with the Reed valve , and the exhaust valve still in the cilinder? Wow.
How long will a cylinder last by honing these. Instead of nikasil plating.
Hey bro can you tell me a size of flex hone ball..
Am totally confused .
If Cummins piston is 102mm then which size I prefer..
Pls let me kwn
For piston transfer you can probably use toilet bowl cleaner or drain cleaner but It may be worth looking into
nice little hone job - BUT you should remove those reeds and power valve ....... cheers.
Power of chemistry baby
Good shit Mike💨💨👍🏻
Ball hones are just used for getting a good cross hatch. The only negative experience I’ve had using them especially on 2 strokes is balls actually falling off during honing.
Whats up Michael love the 250r vids
Great video, thank Michael
There are many ways to skin a cat that is true, If you just think about it a little bit when the factory built that engine, they didn’t use either one of those kind of homes to produce the cross hatch pattern in the cylinder.
They used the kind of home that a machine shop uses a locking hone or a rigid hone. They’re both the same.
This is the only way to accurately true a cylinder out of its egg shape form. But if the cylinder isn’t worn too badly, you can probably get away with any type of hone.
How did you get the cylinder outside shiny or clean?
Question: What grit flex-hone do did you use. I'm thinking the 240 or 320 but there are like 10 options on brushresearch.coms website. Thanks for your time bud.
I just answered my own question after clicking on the link you posted for the hone. No need to reply bud. Thanks again.
Disassemble and clean with mineral spirits! Assemble with ultra slick and back in business
Super glad you got that thing up and running bro great job on honing and cleaning the cylinder out bro I enjoyed watching love it 🤘🤘🖒🖒
Awesome video!
Is there any chance some of that sulphuric acid got down that exhaust port and started eating away at the cast aluminium
It's not sulfuric. Its muriatic.
Cody Weien my bad, either way do you recon it’s could have got in those exhaust ports
That's a logical question. He really should have removed the powervalve and reeds before doing all this. Small chunks of those ballhones break off and he has no way of knowing 100% if he got all of them out. The suspense would kill me.
Your videos are excellent but you really should have removed the power valve, especially since it is so simple. If any residue or grit got trapped in there it's going to accelerate wear. You may have also worn down the face of your valve--it is aluminum. You don't want to increase that gap between the valve and the piston because it bleeds off pressure, which is the whole point of the valve.
Hi Michael , How did or do you determine the size of the [flex/ball] hone and GRIT? To cylinder bore size? Mine is 3.60, So would I go with a 3.75 or a 4.00 size ball hone, My cylinder's look like yours did as per condition and piston transfer .Thanks
You said that you were going to hone on the other side of the cylinder, and you stayed on the same side... Did you mean you were going to reverse the drill and hone it again?
Dude awesome video, I've been doing the exact same reasearch for the last month on my sons kx80 swapped supermini cylinder, and ended up getting the exact same ball hone as you, wish youd made this video 4 days ago lol! Sub'd
Ah man, well I'm glad it still worked out for you. Thank you for subscribing!
Dang bro you went really long on that. You should have checked at least once or twice throughout that process to see how it was doing and if you needed to go longer. You probably removed some of that coating possibly unnecessarily
Bit dodgy should've removed the power valve and reads before you started
All the best mate just remember from an old dog cleanliness is next to godliness clean before and after you do a job also chamfer the piston skirt so the oil stays on the cylinder 😃💪👍🇦🇺
Could you tell me what was the grit of the flex hone?
Flex brush is the most safest
Thank you! I have 2 YZ250's I'm redoing the top ends and was wondering if I should hone them or not. After watching your video I know exactly what to do, how and why. Perfect video!