bradleycoke15 it's nice to see understanding cis men. Because tbh. Other than elderly cis women I think thats the least understanding group in my country.
bradleycoke15 Can you tell me what does Cis means? They are some words that some people use and that I've seen here but I don't know the meanings, so I hope i'm not being disrespectful or anything
Hey Jake, I'm glad that you've found a label that fits you! I also really appreciate you talking about this subject. I'm a transguy but sometimes I have days of feeling less like a guy and more in the middle of the spectrum. I felt really bad about it until you started talking about relating to that. Ps. I think it's great that Alex is trying his best to learn about this more
I'm glad I'm not the only one who finds it dangerously easy to misgender somebody... uhm, does it count as misgendering using they/them to refer to someone whose pronouns are he/him or she/her? If not that could be a surefire option when you're unsure about someone's gender :D ...maybe... Also what Alex said about society, that's so true, people tend to get 'transgender' and 'transvestite' mixed up a lot! Love you both
Dartnix They/them is neutral so I find myself using it all the time for people who's pronouns I don't know yet, without even doing it deliberately. I guess I just subconsciously don't want to assume gender/pronouns because I know how it feels when other people do (I'm nb).
Dartnix using they/them for some one who you know uses he or she pronouns would be misgendering. I personally try to use they/them until such time as I find out definitively what they prefer.
Dartnix yes you should use they/them if you don't know someone's pronouns but if you for sure know their pronouns then use them because they might feel uncomfortable with they/them. Idk
Deliberately using they/them when you are aware that someone's pronouns are she/her or he/him or something else is misgendering but if you are not aware of pronouns it is probably safest to stick with they/them until you are aware of the correct pronouns.
I'm non binary trans masculine and for me the binary and non binary trans community in my life is very much part of the same community and are there for each other so its sucks that those people Alex was introduced to were so shitty..
@cosmos1044 ok, Im ignoring sausage's comments but i needed to say that isn't true, trans just means you dont identify with the gender you were assigned at birth. It's an umbrella word that includes non binary people.
@@deemah3602 have you done any research? Many doctors have confirmed that it exists and thought history many cultures have recognized nonbinary genders.
You're probably the most adorable couple on TH-cam tbh,I wish I were going to SITC but I'm going to Dorset instead. I hope you both have a lovely weekend!❤️
I love that Jake mentions feeling validated by Alex's actions. i feel like little actions often in the form of little gifts are such wonderful displays of support for trans nonbinary people. i know it meant so much to me when my mom came to me after I came out and gave me a pair of jeans from a male friend of hers.
Just because someone doesn't understand something fully does not mean they can be offensive & rude about it. I don't understand all the labels and different identities but I respect that they are real and valid and so should everyone else. Also you both are cute af :3
For the people saying can we stop just using labels, can you just be realistic? Thats not how people work. We as humans use language and labels help us be able to quickly generally understand what something is, etc. Lets stop pretending that we dont want to use labels because almost EVERY word is a label and it helps us and can sometimes hurt us. For the people who dont know what nonbinary is, its just not being strictly male OR female. It has nothing to do with just being feminine in your gender expression or the opposite. The clothes you wear isnt what makes a trans person trans, its simply how they SEE themselves.
I honestly just try to use 'they/them' for almost everyone I don't know because it's the most neutral (and is used for ppl u don't know the gender of in the English grammar anyway) and it hasn't really pissed anyone off yet or made uncomfortable as far as I know. Or they just didn't tell me.
I'm seeing a lot of comments saying they don't understand non-binary, it's complicated, it doesn't make sense, it's stupid, it's fake. That's a dangerous escalation of thought. There are so many things in this world that I do not understand for the life of me. But I don't immediately dismiss something as not real, purely because I don't understand. What I'm trying to say is, *you don't have to understand something to respect it.*
Really important video on explaining but also being real about the gender diverse community. The community can be loving and supportive, but also so bitter and petty about others identities. There's so much infighting that it's hard to present positive representation to wider communities
So much love for u two! I don't have the ability to articulate my thoughts coherently but just rly want u to know how much I respect and appreciate everything u are/do. This is so validating and comforting 💖💖💖💖
So far, this is the most positive nb comments I've seen on a video, so thank you from half on/out nb pal on heartening me so much and putting faith back in humans. X Thank you internet pals for being so mature and I respect your respect. xxx
That was really good. That's so true about non-binary, intersex and bisexuality all being in that grey area between the 2 established binaries. They're all kind of a connected struggle to show society tht not everything is black and white. peace x
I'm afraid of coming out as ftm nonbinary because here in Finland, you HAVE to be transgender to get treatment like hormones and surgeries so if I come out as nonbinary I won't get any treatment and I really do need hormones and other treatments.
Spookytomas can I just ask why you need hormones and such if you are nonbinary? I mean, a transgender person will go from mtf or ftm, the hormones and surgeries make that transition from one gender to the opposite one. So, what are you trying to become, I suppose I'm asking. I'm very curious as to what nonbinary people want to make their physical appearances go to, as to remain in that "neutral" state. I understand the whole personal comfort stuff, but if you're going to change your physical body vs just changing you style, how does that help? Will you not be perceived as a either a man or woman again after all of it? I've tried to ask a lot of nb people and I always get negative reactions, hopefully you could help clear up how hormones and such would help, if you're trying to stay in the "neutral" state, rather than that of man or woman? Thanks ahead of time if you reply
Jack Hart if they're non binary that doesn't mean they don't have dysphoria or needs which can only be provided by hormones and surgeries. Jake is non binary and he is on T, he wants top surgery. If you're trans mtf or ftm you don't HAVE to get certain surgeries and procedures, if you're non binary you don't either, it's about making someone comfortable in their own body.
I'm on the same boat as Alex with not always being sure how or if right place to ask on pronouns. I know it's better safe than sorry; I just don't like thinking that the aftermath might be them not feeling great that it wasn't seen as obvious for me, or they may even not be lgbtq+ friendly so I don't want to be there for that conversation. Though I will try Jake's method of waiting to hear what others call them and asking to clarify if okay, especially considering I just claimed full responsibility on being a douche for assuming and being wrong before.
rachtale it is also nice to say your name and your pronouns when you meet someone so they tell you their pronouns without feeling dysphoric from you asking :)
"People don't understand because they can't feel it" you perfectly explained it in that one sentence. It's so hard to explain to people who have literally no concept of how it feels to not relate to either gender (or wherever you fall on the spectrum). I just say fuck it. I'm nonbinary, I know how I feel and that's all that matters. Great video friends!
Watching u always makes me feel better! My entire life I've begged to not be labeled yet society forces it. I'm a bit older so many terms used now weren't used years ago & I "picked" Bi & spent yrs being told 2 get off the fence. Finally comfortable in some areas of myself I say I'm just me & i fall in love with a person's inside not out. Call it Pan or Bi I don't care. I'm also with someone very much younger & totally new to this community. Kinda cute to watch him use an old phrase then say OMG I'm sorry. He could careless what "label" I'm called, he said i sat as a kid made a list of what i wanted in a girl & you've got all plus some. Who cares about society if we're happy and support each other that's what matters. Thank you both for being so open & helpful...I rarely feel alone or so abnormal I question why I'm on this planet.
My significant other's pronouns are confusing and I don't know how to refer to them so I just refer to them by their name because I'm too awkward to ask and they were born as a girl but I don't know whether they want she/her or they/them but whenever I ask they avoid the question and it really annoys me because i love them but whenever i refer to them with she/her pronouns they get angry and ask if I've just assumed their gender and they won't tell me their bloody pronouns and sometimes i want to throttle them.
Nothing Special This seems to be that your s/o doesn't know their own pronouns. I think you just need to be patient, and they'll tell you when their ready.
i had an experience with a doctor where I had to come out to her and I said I was nonbinary and she said "that's okay, just let me know when you pick a side"
Ace Sz that sounds absolutely horrible. That's no different then asking a mixed-race person or a hearing-impaired person to "pick a side". Like, you can't help it!
+cosmos1044 are you going through the comment section trying to put everyone down? Half the rude comments I see are from you... Gender =/= sex and doctors really shouldn't be concerned with your gender identity unless you are seeing them for issues regarding gender identity. She had no reason to say what she did, and clearly has not received adequate training on dealing with gender identity.
Ive certainly had issues with some trans people in the past having that " chip on your shoulder " mentality and as Alex said it does is have to do with society, it's just so tiring to me as too why people within our own community can't be supportive of others... maybe cause I'm nearly 20 now I'm sick of all the drama and just wanna be left alone to be queer in peace. (Also off topic I'm so proud of you both after watching your channels for years and I can certainly see your both happier and more comfortable and i hope I can reach that level of comfortableness )
Regardless of your identity - you are both adorable and you love each other. I like the whole "no labels" thing. Be who you are! You all are pioneers coming out as yourselves. And you also both have great communication and you understand each other. I think it's great!
What really annoys me is that when you say you don't like someone than other think it is because them being lesbian/gay/bi etc... like it has nothing to do with that. But what i hate the most about being a Lesbian is now that pretty much every girl at my school hate on me because they are afraid i will make a move on them like no I only date nice people sorry.
cosmos1044 Lol, don't be so assuming and naive. Fear of losing a friendship will never make someone hate another person. Those hateful straight girls only see lesbians as predators, and that's fucked up. Don't defend them. Wake up.
I got called a pedo cause I'm in pe with my gf so when we get changed kids will drag us into the shower cubicles, let use both get changed (in different cubicles) and make sure everyone else is dressed then let us out... I'm used to it but it used to upset me alot
Jake, I hope I understand better because of the work you and Alex have done in helping educate me and hopefully others about these issues. You are looking good and pardon me if I use your post to say Alex looks fuckin fabulous.
I really need some advice so i guess I would say I'm confused about how I feel I don't really feel all that comfortable as a girl but I don't feel comfortable being changing to a different gender and I'm just confused and scared and I don't know I just don't know anyone who I can turn to
All you need to know is what you feel comfortable in. For a long time I thought I wanted to be a woman, but after a few years I grew to like the body I'm in. So I came out as Genderqueer. Seeing what gender you are takes times. You don't want to rush into transitioning and then realised it was a mistake. It took me a long while to figure who I was, and it could be the same for you. Just remember what ever gender you become, you'll be happy
I would suggest ignoring labels for the time being. If you can, take a good friend or trusted family member and go shopping with them, even just to browse. Try on some clothes, different ones, ones you would never wear usually and see how you feel in them. (Try mixing and matching women's and men's.) If you can't do that them drag everything out of your closet, organise them from most masc to most femme, and do the same thing. Even if you don't have a sudden revelation about your gender, find what makes you most comfortable, and then you can wear that whenever you're feeling confused about your identity. It helps settle my mind. Hopefully it will yours too.
just do what makes you happy and what makes you comfortable. maybe you'll find that your trans or maybe you'll find out that you're not but it's just important that you do what makes you comfortable and don't dwell on it too much
Honestly, I understand you so much! I was there too! Personally how I found out who I was was that I just ignored the labels and try to home in on what felt right and what felt wrong (by not means am I saying you should do this too, just a suggestion). Sometimes if you give yourself a label you could feel pressured to sign to the stereotypes - this might be because you've 'labeled' yourself too early - you can feel worser in the long run. But if you ever get asked 'what's your gender?' don't worry too much about it because as you grow you will change and like most of us, you just need time to put the language to how you feel.
I live for how everyone helps everyone out within these comments! whether that's decoding the video, helping them with finding who they are or even same tips. The video was amazing and made me think so much about what I say and who I am. I'm Non-binary and my friend group is known for being the LGBT group (most of us are in the community and we talk about and try to normalise is at our school) and watching this video has really helped try to not just put everyone into 'They/Them' categories on first meeting, thinking it will help and to actually ask. You guys have helped me so much it's unbelievable!! I meet you guys at sitc this weekend and never to go say it but thank you
I HAVE TO MEET YOU GUYS SOMEDAY! I have a feeling our personalities would get along quite well with being direct and sarcastic. :) I love the energy between you in discussing this. Much love to you both! And honestly this helps. I'm going through my own mental discoveries and have been for a while. Jake you are a bad ass.
True story from a cis person: I tried explaining to my boyfriend about assuming people's gender identity and he just did not get it. Then one day we met a person who presented extremely masculine but turned out she was a she (oops). He came to me later and said "Ok, I'll try to use 'they' if I don't know someone's pronouns." As a trans ally that made me so happy 😁
I don't understand why people don't respect non binary spectrum. It's okay not to understand it, because we live in a binary society and if you aren't non binary, it's really difficult to know and understand what a non binary person feels. I don't understand it neither, but I respect it. If someone wants to have they as prounoun, who gives a shit? Call them they or shut up.
I really wish we had some form of like... hand signal to ask what someone's pronouns are. And then a few different hand signals that represent the different pronouns. Like, you lock eyes with someone, and make a small descreet signal, and if they know what you're doing, they can signal back and BOOM no awkward conversation, you can do it in a group, in a crowd, whatever. And if the other person didn't know the signals, it would be discreet enough they wouldn't notice. Idk
i'm a trans guy and even though i know a decent amount about nonbinary identity, this was still a brilliant video!!! really interesting discussion from both of you, thanks so much
I love this video because I’m very much like jake in the sense that I’m a non binary person that wants to transition into a more masculine body and this makes me feel so much better knowing that I’m not the only person like this. Thank you for being you honestly.
i never thought about how being bisexual is similar to being non binary in how ppl end up telling you to pick a side...thanks for such an informative video!
I'm a non-binary, biologically female, 13 year old from the UK and I go to an all girls school. Watching both of your channels has helped me to feel more comfortable in I'm own skin, I still deal with dysphoria, anxiety and depression but it is a lot better thank to you both. THANK YOU 😊❤️
i've been gender fluid for years now, and only recently has the whole "special snowflake" thing gotten exponentially worse. i had a sarahah and a this crush (which are both anonymous message-leaving type of dealies) and i made them bc my cis friends were all doing it, but mine was filled with comments like "transtrender" and super invalidating shit. it's caused me to show that part of myself to a select few people, and hide it from the rest. congrats on being and staying so open jake. lots of love 💖
This is nice to see. I identify as nonbinary as well and have had similar experiences when I went to school in New York. It shed a bad light on it as well, even though I knew i identified as it. It was rather militant and I just didn't vibe with them and didn't want to be associated with them. Of course they all had reasons to be but it's hard for allies who come to support to try to learn in that environment. It's hard for nonbinary people to even be around that environment as well so I can't imagine how it feels for cisgender people.
I completely agree. Pronoun questions do really upset me, even though I really appreciate people taking the time to ask me! I fee like I'm not passing enough and even though you don't HAVE to pass to be trans, I want to pass and I want to be seen as a cisgender male.
I'm a trangender -gay- guy and still I wear makeup from time to time, and skirts, or crop tops. I think everyone can be whatever the hell they want as long as they are happy.♥
This was such an interesting video!!!! Sometimes I wonder that once I've been on T for awhile and pass 100%, if I will also question my gender again and maybe identify as nb as well
I feel you. Sometimes I stop myself from imagining myself as anything other than binary bc I don't want to be invalidated, but recently I've been thinking that after I go on T, I can do whatever the hell I want. Maybe I'm nb, we'll just have to wait and see.
fangirl crazy Honestly, being bi is so valid. l.g.B.t. You're in the four letter acronym, I'm a P for pansexual so. You're valid. Don't listen to the people who tell you to pick a side. You are allowed to like anyone you want.
Aaaaaaa I love this video I totally get it bc obviously you don't want to misgender anyone but also it's not always appropriate to ask someone's pronouns bc like Alex said they might feel dysphoric or like they're not passing or even they might have to out themselves? Usually they/them is okay for most people I think but it's a difficult situation to navigate...
I totally get the sentiment. I'm super awkward in general and, in practice, awful for making assumptions about people's genders. That said I think that if and when you're introducing yourself to new people if you include your own pronouns in your introduction it opens the door for the person you're meeting to do the same without it being about whether they are "passing" as their gender. If, as a society, we train ourselves to include our name and pronouns together as a standard part of introductions then it would hopefully be better than just using a "safe" option. I already do this when I introduce other people because the third person allows you to introduce a name and pronoun without call it to obvious attention: "This is Joe, I know them from college" etc is definitely something I do. Which I suppose fits into Jake listening out for a new person's friends' use of their pronouns.
I love just watching you two and letting my mind go back and forth seeing masc. and fem and ending up liking you two for both. I end up just liking you for who you are. Wish more people could watch you.
Hi, its Jake (Abi's friend) thanks so much for looking after her and letting us sit behind ur merch stall. U guys and lorc are probably the nicest people I've ever met.
Wow, did you need to wrap up this video quickly at the end there or what? :P Really great, informative video, though. It's so lovely to see Alex still being supportive and wanting to get to know more and understand Jake. Makes me (a non-binary person myself) pretty happy. (:
As a gay women, I accept everyone, but I don't think we should ask people their pronouns, unless you know they identify as what they do. Like the couple that didn't want their baby gendered. That's a personal thing, and it irks me off so much. No one has the right to choose for you what you identify as; gay, les, bi, trans, non-bi, and so on. People just need to be open-minded that these things are newly introduced and it takes time to understand
People should just stop labelling people. Everyone is an individual. Jake is just Jake, Alex is just Alex. I am just Jen...why must we stick labels on people.
I think a big issue people can have with it is that it kinda reinforces gender stereotypes, even though that is the opposite of what nb people stand for (i presume). I mean.. it's basically saying you can't completely be a man because you like wearing dresses or completely be a woman because you don't like being super feminine. And that's a mindset people have been fighting for soo long
I went to a gay picnic and as a lot of us hadn't met we did actually sit down and ask peoples names and pronouns because we didn't want to offend and most of them were gender fluid, a few like me weren't and some were trans so decided to say trans so he/him or they/them will work but I find it so hard to always use they and quite often he or she slips out and I always feel so fucking bad but the amazing thing is, is that they are really chill and don't mind so praise Jesus. So sitting in a circle is actually really useful in a huge group ya know?
Alex, my friend, you can have the ring resized so that it fits comfortably . . . just sayin' . . . Not long ago I made the comment to a friend of mine that I wondered if some of the negative public reaction to the "trans" issue isn't that so many people confuse trans with "cross dressing" and/or "drag". What do you think? I also believe that so much of the crap we all face every day is caused by "society's" propensity to want to "pigeonhole" and label everyone. Could we ever get the fuck over that? Please?! Love seeing you two together and this was both informative and entertaining. Love you both, 💝 💝
You guys inspire me so much I Live with a very homophobic family in until I started watching You guys I felt completely alone but you made me see light at the end of the tunnel
I stumbled across this video in my recommended and holy crap. Your nonbinary transmasculine identity is EXACTLY what I've just realised I am. Also, you are an adorable couple.
I haven't watched them in two years just cuz I've gotten into other channels and being busy and watching TH-cam less but I saw this and barely recognized them. They've grown up so much and look amazing!
I absolutely loved it when you @jake came out as non-binary! I always adored you and loved your confidence, but then finding that you are like me made me so happy inside!!!
I would not have survived without the trans community when I was first questioning and coming out, which is why it breaks my heart to see the anger between some binary trans and non binary people. We face the same oppression. United we stand and all that.
With my sexuality and stuff I have is so badly I’m pansexual, non-binary, and demisexual. So I’m constantly getting people saying that it’s not really and that I’m just trying to get attention.
Being a cisguy, videos like this are really helpful in helping me understand non-binary people.
bradleycoke15 it's nice to see understanding cis men. Because tbh. Other than elderly cis women I think thats the least understanding group in my country.
bradleycoke15 Can you tell me what does Cis means? They are some words that some people use and that I've seen here but I don't know the meanings, so I hope i'm not being disrespectful or anything
Pao Ochoa Cis means you identify with the body you were born with. In my case, this means I was born male, and I identify as male.
bradleycoke15 it's what ur assigned not born
Westley Morgan Thatcher Sorry, honest mistake.
Jake is probably the chilliest non-binary person I know
Ikr!!
Hi Kovu from the past
Hey Jake, I'm glad that you've found a label that fits you! I also really appreciate you talking about this subject. I'm a transguy but sometimes I have days of feeling less like a guy and more in the middle of the spectrum. I felt really bad about it until you started talking about relating to that.
Ps. I think it's great that Alex is trying his best to learn about this more
Pronouns can be difficult, but "never assuming" is good advice. I really hope I remember people's names! :) x
Gary C So does Jake use they instead of he? Just wondering because some non binary people use he or she
Mickey Rembiszewski Jake still uses he
I'm glad I'm not the only one who finds it dangerously easy to misgender somebody... uhm, does it count as misgendering using they/them to refer to someone whose pronouns are he/him or she/her? If not that could be a surefire option when you're unsure about someone's gender :D ...maybe...
Also what Alex said about society, that's so true, people tend to get 'transgender' and 'transvestite' mixed up a lot!
Love you both
Dartnix They/them is neutral so I find myself using it all the time for people who's pronouns I don't know yet, without even doing it deliberately. I guess I just subconsciously don't want to assume gender/pronouns because I know how it feels when other people do (I'm nb).
Dartnix using they/them for some one who you know uses he or she pronouns would be misgendering. I personally try to use they/them until such time as I find out definitively what they prefer.
Dartnix yes you should use they/them if you don't know someone's pronouns but if you for sure know their pronouns then use them because they might feel uncomfortable with they/them. Idk
Deliberately using they/them when you are aware that someone's pronouns are she/her or he/him or something else is misgendering but if you are not aware of pronouns it is probably safest to stick with they/them until you are aware of the correct pronouns.
All right, that makes sense, thank you all.
I'm non binary trans masculine and for me the binary and non binary trans community in my life is very much part of the same community and are there for each other so its sucks that those people Alex was introduced to were so shitty..
misamisa29 If you're trans masculine then you're not non binary..
Sausage Duncan I'm pretty sure that you aren't them so you really have no say in their identity. They are their own person, you oaf.
@cosmos1044 ok, Im ignoring sausage's comments but i needed to say that isn't true, trans just means you dont identify with the gender you were assigned at birth. It's an umbrella word that includes non binary people.
"Bisexuality is not real. Pick one side!"
"Nonbinary is not real. Pick one side!"
Oh my dear, this is a really good point! That you for your thoughts!
Bisexuality is scientific proved. Nonbinary isn't.
@@deemah3602 have you done any research? Many doctors have confirmed that it exists and thought history many cultures have recognized nonbinary genders.
Kater Schnurz I’m both non-binary and bi
You're probably the most adorable couple on TH-cam tbh,I wish I were going to SITC but I'm going to Dorset instead. I hope you both have a lovely weekend!❤️
Devin Molko hah me too mate its cold here have fun
Devin Molko omg I wanna go SITC too but I'm also going to Dorset
I LIVE IN DORSET
Ikr! I just left England yesterday to fly home :(
They live in Dorset 😂
I love that Jake mentions feeling validated by Alex's actions. i feel like little actions often in the form of little gifts are such wonderful displays of support for trans nonbinary people. i know it meant so much to me when my mom came to me after I came out and gave me a pair of jeans from a male friend of hers.
Just because someone doesn't understand something fully does not mean they can be offensive & rude about it. I don't understand all the labels and different identities but I respect that they are real and valid and so should everyone else. Also you both are cute af :3
For the people saying can we stop just using labels, can you just be realistic? Thats not how people work. We as humans use language and labels help us be able to quickly generally understand what something is, etc. Lets stop pretending that we dont want to use labels because almost EVERY word is a label and it helps us and can sometimes hurt us. For the people who dont know what nonbinary is, its just not being strictly male OR female. It has nothing to do with just being feminine in your gender expression or the opposite. The clothes you wear isnt what makes a trans person trans, its simply how they SEE themselves.
kuroichan101 THANK YOU
I honestly just try to use 'they/them' for almost everyone I don't know because it's the most neutral (and is used for ppl u don't know the gender of in the English grammar anyway) and it hasn't really pissed anyone off yet or made uncomfortable as far as I know. Or they just didn't tell me.
I love the candid-ness of this. Just having a casual conversation but also sharing personal experiences is so nice to see. Great video dudes 😊😊
I'm seeing a lot of comments saying they don't understand non-binary, it's complicated, it doesn't make sense, it's stupid, it's fake. That's a dangerous escalation of thought. There are so many things in this world that I do not understand for the life of me. But I don't immediately dismiss something as not real, purely because I don't understand. What I'm trying to say is, *you don't have to understand something to respect it.*
Really important video on explaining but also being real about the gender diverse community. The community can be loving and supportive, but also so bitter and petty about others identities. There's so much infighting that it's hard to present positive representation to wider communities
Thank you so much for making this video, all of these videos on gender and shiz are really helping me figure things out!! Y'all rock
So much love for u two! I don't have the ability to articulate my thoughts coherently but just rly want u to know how much I respect and appreciate everything u are/do. This is so validating and comforting 💖💖💖💖
So far, this is the most positive nb comments I've seen on a video, so thank you from half on/out nb pal on heartening me so much and putting faith back in humans. X Thank you internet pals for being so mature and I respect your respect. xxx
That was really good. That's so true about non-binary, intersex and bisexuality all being in that grey area between the 2 established binaries. They're all kind of a connected struggle to show society tht not everything is black and white. peace x
I'm afraid of coming out as ftm nonbinary because here in Finland, you HAVE to be transgender to get treatment like hormones and surgeries so if I come out as nonbinary I won't get any treatment and I really do need hormones and other treatments.
Spookytomas don't tell that u are non-binary . Keep it for yourself you don't need a coming out for wear makeup , dear~
You don't have to come out as non binary to your doctors or whatever, but rather can come out to your friends. Do what you need to get what you need
You could lie....?
Spookytomas can I just ask why you need hormones and such if you are nonbinary? I mean, a transgender person will go from mtf or ftm, the hormones and surgeries make that transition from one gender to the opposite one. So, what are you trying to become, I suppose I'm asking. I'm very curious as to what nonbinary people want to make their physical appearances go to, as to remain in that "neutral" state. I understand the whole personal comfort stuff, but if you're going to change your physical body vs just changing you style, how does that help? Will you not be perceived as a either a man or woman again after all of it? I've tried to ask a lot of nb people and I always get negative reactions, hopefully you could help clear up how hormones and such would help, if you're trying to stay in the "neutral" state, rather than that of man or woman? Thanks ahead of time if you reply
Jack Hart if they're non binary that doesn't mean they don't have dysphoria or needs which can only be provided by hormones and surgeries. Jake is non binary and he is on T, he wants top surgery. If you're trans mtf or ftm you don't HAVE to get certain surgeries and procedures, if you're non binary you don't either, it's about making someone comfortable in their own body.
I'm on the same boat as Alex with not always being sure how or if right place to ask on pronouns. I know it's better safe than sorry; I just don't like thinking that the aftermath might be them not feeling great that it wasn't seen as obvious for me, or they may even not be lgbtq+ friendly so I don't want to be there for that conversation. Though I will try Jake's method of waiting to hear what others call them and asking to clarify if okay, especially considering I just claimed full responsibility on being a douche for assuming and being wrong before.
rachtale it is also nice to say your name and your pronouns when you meet someone so they tell you their pronouns without feeling dysphoric from you asking :)
"People don't understand because they can't feel it" you perfectly explained it in that one sentence. It's so hard to explain to people who have literally no concept of how it feels to not relate to either gender (or wherever you fall on the spectrum). I just say fuck it. I'm nonbinary, I know how I feel and that's all that matters. Great video friends!
Watching u always makes me feel better! My entire life I've begged to not be labeled yet society forces it. I'm a bit older so many terms used now weren't used years ago & I "picked" Bi & spent yrs being told 2 get off the fence. Finally comfortable in some areas of myself I say I'm just me & i fall in love with a person's inside not out. Call it Pan or Bi I don't care. I'm also with someone very much younger & totally new to this community. Kinda cute to watch him use an old phrase then say OMG I'm sorry. He could careless what "label" I'm called, he said i sat as a kid made a list of what i wanted in a girl & you've got all plus some. Who cares about society if we're happy and support each other that's what matters. Thank you both for being so open & helpful...I rarely feel alone or so abnormal I question why I'm on this planet.
My significant other's pronouns are confusing and I don't know how to refer to them so I just refer to them by their name because I'm too awkward to ask and they were born as a girl but I don't know whether they want she/her or they/them but whenever I ask they avoid the question and it really annoys me because i love them but whenever i refer to them with she/her pronouns they get angry and ask if I've just assumed their gender and they won't tell me their bloody pronouns and sometimes i want to throttle them.
I'd say just use they/them, given that they have an issue with she/her
Layne Howlett they don't exactly have a problem with it but they just have days when they want she/her or they/them and it's confusing
Nothing Special This seems to be that your s/o doesn't know their own pronouns. I think you just need to be patient, and they'll tell you when their ready.
oh i see, they/them is always a safe spot to me
clearly_blurry thank you for this advice I appreciate it
i had an experience with a doctor where I had to come out to her and I said I was nonbinary and she said "that's okay, just let me know when you pick a side"
Ace Sz that sounds absolutely horrible. That's no different then asking a mixed-race person or a hearing-impaired person to "pick a side". Like, you can't help it!
+cosmos1044 are you going through the comment section trying to put everyone down? Half the rude comments I see are from you...
Gender =/= sex and doctors really shouldn't be concerned with your gender identity unless you are seeing them for issues regarding gender identity. She had no reason to say what she did, and clearly has not received adequate training on dealing with gender identity.
Lovelii oh shuuuuuutttt uuuuuppppp
Ace Sz and that's when you leave the doctors office and find a new one. The the fucking rudest shit I've ever heard. What the actual fuck.
cosmos1044 there isn't anything biological about gender, so what you said doesn't make any logic
Ive certainly had issues with some trans people in the past having that " chip on your shoulder " mentality and as Alex said it does is have to do with society, it's just so tiring to me as too why people within our own community can't be supportive of others...
maybe cause I'm nearly 20 now I'm sick of all the drama and just wanna be left alone to be queer in peace.
(Also off topic I'm so proud of you both after watching your channels for years and I can certainly see your both happier and more comfortable and i hope I can reach that level of comfortableness )
I love seeing you two in vids again. I also love seeing the love you have for one another! PDA reminds me of your early vids, that I loved!
Jake Edwards, you are my transition goals.
Regardless of your identity - you are both adorable and you love each other. I like the whole "no labels" thing. Be who you are! You all are pioneers coming out as yourselves. And you also both have great communication and you understand each other. I think it's great!
2:55 "I didn't wanna be gay about it" haha I died 😂
What really annoys me is that when you say you don't like someone than other think it is because them being lesbian/gay/bi etc... like it has nothing to do with that.
But what i hate the most about being a Lesbian is now that pretty much every girl at my school hate on me because they are afraid i will make a move on them like no I only date nice people sorry.
cosmos1044 Lol, don't be so assuming and naive. Fear of losing a friendship will never make someone hate another person. Those hateful straight girls only see lesbians as predators, and that's fucked up. Don't defend them. Wake up.
I got called a pedo cause I'm in pe with my gf so when we get changed kids will drag us into the shower cubicles, let use both get changed (in different cubicles) and make sure everyone else is dressed then let us out... I'm used to it but it used to upset me alot
Find someone who looks at you the way jake looks at alex
Jake, I hope I understand better because of the work you and Alex have done in helping educate me and hopefully others about these issues. You are looking good and pardon me if I use your post to say Alex looks fuckin fabulous.
am i the only one who thinks it's so cute that Alex is getting mad on Jake's behalf!?
I really need some advice so i guess I would say I'm confused about how I feel I don't really feel all that comfortable as a girl but I don't feel comfortable being changing to a different gender and I'm just confused and scared and I don't know I just don't know anyone who I can turn to
It's not about changing your gender but about understand who you are and what words define you the best
All you need to know is what you feel comfortable in. For a long time I thought I wanted to be a woman, but after a few years I grew to like the body I'm in. So I came out as Genderqueer. Seeing what gender you are takes times. You don't want to rush into transitioning and then realised it was a mistake. It took me a long while to figure who I was, and it could be the same for you. Just remember what ever gender you become, you'll be happy
I would suggest ignoring labels for the time being. If you can, take a good friend or trusted family member and go shopping with them, even just to browse. Try on some clothes, different ones, ones you would never wear usually and see how you feel in them. (Try mixing and matching women's and men's.) If you can't do that them drag everything out of your closet, organise them from most masc to most femme, and do the same thing. Even if you don't have a sudden revelation about your gender, find what makes you most comfortable, and then you can wear that whenever you're feeling confused about your identity. It helps settle my mind. Hopefully it will yours too.
just do what makes you happy and what makes you comfortable. maybe you'll find that your trans or maybe you'll find out that you're not but it's just important that you do what makes you comfortable and don't dwell on it too much
Honestly, I understand you so much! I was there too! Personally how I found out who I was was that I just ignored the labels and try to home in on what felt right and what felt wrong (by not means am I saying you should do this too, just a suggestion). Sometimes if you give yourself a label you could feel pressured to sign to the stereotypes - this might be because you've 'labeled' yourself too early - you can feel worser in the long run. But if you ever get asked 'what's your gender?' don't worry too much about it because as you grow you will change and like most of us, you just need time to put the language to how you feel.
In Finland we use one pronoun for all people, probably the only thing that is easy in our language 😂
Nina that’s so cool! I had no idea
Same thing in korean
I live for how everyone helps everyone out within these comments! whether that's decoding the video, helping them with finding who they are or even same tips. The video was amazing and made me think so much about what I say and who I am. I'm Non-binary and my friend group is known for being the LGBT group (most of us are in the community and we talk about and try to normalise is at our school) and watching this video has really helped try to not just put everyone into 'They/Them' categories on first meeting, thinking it will help and to actually ask. You guys have helped me so much it's unbelievable!! I meet you guys at sitc this weekend and never to go say it but thank you
I HAVE TO MEET YOU GUYS SOMEDAY! I have a feeling our personalities would get along quite well with being direct and sarcastic. :) I love the energy between you in discussing this. Much love to you both! And honestly this helps. I'm going through my own mental discoveries and have been for a while. Jake you are a bad ass.
True story from a cis person: I tried explaining to my boyfriend about assuming people's gender identity and he just did not get it. Then one day we met a person who presented extremely masculine but turned out she was a she (oops). He came to me later and said "Ok, I'll try to use 'they' if I don't know someone's pronouns." As a trans ally that made me so happy 😁
I don't understand why people don't respect non binary spectrum. It's okay not to understand it, because we live in a binary society and if you aren't non binary, it's really difficult to know and understand what a non binary person feels. I don't understand it neither, but I respect it. If someone wants to have they as prounoun, who gives a shit? Call them they or shut up.
You have earned my respect both of you. I was worried about watching this as I know a few trans people are against NB people. So thank you so much
"fart on the binary"- Jake 2k17
I really wish we had some form of like... hand signal to ask what someone's pronouns are. And then a few different hand signals that represent the different pronouns. Like, you lock eyes with someone, and make a small descreet signal, and if they know what you're doing, they can signal back and BOOM no awkward conversation, you can do it in a group, in a crowd, whatever. And if the other person didn't know the signals, it would be discreet enough they wouldn't notice.
Idk
i'm a trans guy and even though i know a decent amount about nonbinary identity, this was still a brilliant video!!! really interesting discussion from both of you, thanks so much
Ya know even if its almost 4 am and i have some quality shit to do tomorrow who needs sleep whenever jake posts
Thanks for the video, it's amazing! I love both channels, you guys are amazing😊💛
Ugh Jake you and Alex are such a cute couple
I love this video because I’m very much like jake in the sense that I’m a non binary person that wants to transition into a more masculine body and this makes me feel so much better knowing that I’m not the only person like this. Thank you for being you honestly.
i never thought about how being bisexual is similar to being non binary in how ppl end up telling you to pick a side...thanks for such an informative video!
This was really interesting, thank-you. Also you're both looking so gorgeous!
I'm a non-binary, biologically female, 13 year old from the UK and I go to an all girls school. Watching both of your channels has helped me to feel more comfortable in I'm own skin, I still deal with dysphoria, anxiety and depression but it is a lot better thank to you both. THANK YOU 😊❤️
"I didn't want to be gay about it" dead
'*kiss*
'Yay gay'
My heart
i've been gender fluid for years now, and only recently has the whole "special snowflake" thing gotten exponentially worse. i had a sarahah and a this crush (which are both anonymous message-leaving type of dealies) and i made them bc my cis friends were all doing it, but mine was filled with comments like "transtrender" and super invalidating shit. it's caused me to show that part of myself to a select few people, and hide it from the rest. congrats on being and staying so open jake. lots of love 💖
This is nice to see. I identify as nonbinary as well and have had similar experiences when I went to school in New York. It shed a bad light on it as well, even though I knew i identified as it. It was rather militant and I just didn't vibe with them and didn't want to be associated with them. Of course they all had reasons to be but it's hard for allies who come to support to try to learn in that environment. It's hard for nonbinary people to even be around that environment as well so I can't imagine how it feels for cisgender people.
yessss omg when jake talked about how the stereotype of nb people being whiney came about that made so much sense we all need to talk about that
they're so cute, i love the two of them... moreover, the videos are always like helpful to me
I completely agree. Pronoun questions do really upset me, even though I really appreciate people taking the time to ask me! I fee like I'm not passing enough and even though you don't HAVE to pass to be trans, I want to pass and I want to be seen as a cisgender male.
one of the best videos I've watched in a while, thanks! *big hug* :)
Their voice really reminds me of Daniel Radcliffe's voice
C McCloy i agree with u
C Spooky Alex's voice, or Jake's?
I'm a trangender -gay- guy and still I wear makeup from time to time, and skirts, or crop tops. I think everyone can be whatever the hell they want as long as they are happy.♥
I love this so much. Thanks for discussing these issues
Thank you so much Jake I really loved this video, it really broadened my understanding of non-binary people and the community ❤
look at you guys. how far you've come. pride is not the word I'm looking for. also alex's beard is a wonderful treasure.
This was such an interesting video!!!! Sometimes I wonder that once I've been on T for awhile and pass 100%, if I will also question my gender again and maybe identify as nb as well
I feel you. Sometimes I stop myself from imagining myself as anything other than binary bc I don't want to be invalidated, but recently I've been thinking that after I go on T, I can do whatever the hell I want. Maybe I'm nb, we'll just have to wait and see.
People have told me that being bi isn't real, and that i would "pick a side"
fangirl crazy Honestly, being bi is so valid. l.g.B.t. You're in the four letter acronym, I'm a P for pansexual so. You're valid. Don't listen to the people who tell you to pick a side. You are allowed to like anyone you want.
Aaaaaaa I love this video I totally get it bc obviously you don't want to misgender anyone but also it's not always appropriate to ask someone's pronouns bc like Alex said they might feel dysphoric or like they're not passing or even they might have to out themselves? Usually they/them is okay for most people I think but it's a difficult situation to navigate...
I totally get the sentiment. I'm super awkward in general and, in practice, awful for making assumptions about people's genders. That said I think that if and when you're introducing yourself to new people if you include your own pronouns in your introduction it opens the door for the person you're meeting to do the same without it being about whether they are "passing" as their gender. If, as a society, we train ourselves to include our name and pronouns together as a standard part of introductions then it would hopefully be better than just using a "safe" option.
I already do this when I introduce other people because the third person allows you to introduce a name and pronoun without call it to obvious attention: "This is Joe, I know them from college" etc is definitely something I do. Which I suppose fits into Jake listening out for a new person's friends' use of their pronouns.
I love how much I can learn from a youtube video, thank you two !
I love just watching you two and letting my mind go back and forth seeing masc. and fem and ending up liking you two for both. I end up just liking you for who you are. Wish more people could watch you.
I'm Alex, the way he gets confused about trying to be right with prounouns and not being sure and aaaarghh
But the video helped a lot, you're great!
Hi, its Jake (Abi's friend) thanks so much for looking after her and letting us sit behind ur merch stall. U guys and lorc are probably the nicest people I've ever met.
this was a good discussion. thanks for uploading
Wow, did you need to wrap up this video quickly at the end there or what? :P
Really great, informative video, though. It's so lovely to see Alex still being supportive and wanting to get to know more and understand Jake. Makes me (a non-binary person myself) pretty happy. (:
As a gay women, I accept everyone, but I don't think we should ask people their pronouns, unless you know they identify as what they do.
Like the couple that didn't want their baby gendered. That's a personal thing, and it irks me off so much. No one has the right to choose for you what you identify as; gay, les, bi, trans, non-bi, and so on. People just need to be open-minded that these things are newly introduced and it takes time to understand
People should just stop labelling people. Everyone is an individual. Jake is just Jake, Alex is just Alex. I am just Jen...why must we stick labels on people.
A group chat i am in with my friends was called Fuck the Binary for a long time
I think a big issue people can have with it is that it kinda reinforces gender stereotypes, even though that is the opposite of what nb people stand for (i presume). I mean.. it's basically saying you can't completely be a man because you like wearing dresses or completely be a woman because you don't like being super feminine. And that's a mindset people have been fighting for soo long
I missed your faces together and thanks for doing that I feel like I again learned a lot from you two just talking
I went to a gay picnic and as a lot of us hadn't met we did actually sit down and ask peoples names and pronouns because we didn't want to offend and most of them were gender fluid, a few like me weren't and some were trans so decided to say trans so he/him or they/them will work but I find it so hard to always use they and quite often he or she slips out and I always feel so fucking bad but the amazing thing is, is that they are really chill and don't mind so praise Jesus. So sitting in a circle is actually really useful in a huge group ya know?
I was very very happy about this notification
Alex, my friend, you can have the ring resized so that it fits comfortably . . . just sayin' . . .
Not long ago I made the comment to a friend of mine that I wondered if some of the negative public reaction to the "trans" issue isn't that so many people confuse trans with "cross dressing" and/or "drag". What do you think?
I also believe that so much of the crap we all face every day is caused by "society's" propensity to want to "pigeonhole" and label everyone. Could we ever get the fuck over that? Please?!
Love seeing you two together and this was both informative and entertaining. Love you both, 💝 💝
I have work in the morning, but I got this notification so screw sleep got to watch this amazing cinnamon bun 💜💜💜💜
You guys inspire me so much I Live with a very homophobic family in until I started watching You guys I felt completely alone but you made me see light at the end of the tunnel
BLACK AND WHITE but then THERES GREY!!!
I stumbled across this video in my recommended and holy crap. Your nonbinary transmasculine identity is EXACTLY what I've just realised I am. Also, you are an adorable couple.
I really hope we will one day get to a point where 'coming out' doesn't have to be a thing.
I haven't watched them in two years just cuz I've gotten into other channels and being busy and watching TH-cam less but I saw this and barely recognized them. They've grown up so much and look amazing!
I'm glad you shared this vid with us, Jake!! It's really good and it helped me understand everything in a btter way
I absolutely loved it when you @jake came out as non-binary! I always adored you and loved your confidence, but then finding that you are like me made me so happy inside!!!
They're so perfect, I started watching a couple years ago and they've grown so much and I can't!
My babes
I love this video and the ending is so cute I love you two so much I can't wait to see you at sitc!
“Whispers from the internet” my favorite phrase
I would not have survived without the trans community when I was first questioning and coming out, which is why it breaks my heart to see the anger between some binary trans and non binary people. We face the same oppression. United we stand and all that.
It's nice hearing other people out there who feel the same as I do !
For fuck sake. Look at me grinning at these two like the soft piece o'shit i am. We love you guys.
I've literally watched this video like 3 times because it's really helpful
My name is Alex and I'm a trans guy and I also gave my nonbinary boyfriend a set of really gay chokers for his birthday wtf
With my sexuality and stuff I have is so badly I’m pansexual, non-binary, and demisexual. So I’m constantly getting people saying that it’s not really and that I’m just trying to get attention.
i love u both sm and im so happy you both feel comfortable with yourselves and each other ♡