The call is so damning. Jirard is so screwed. It’s funny because Muta and Karl didn’t even want to release this audio, but Jirard forced their hands. Thank you so much for sharing the truth.
and seems like they even did him a favor by not releasing the beginning of this call that probably has info about the personal in-fighting between Jirard and his family.
@@TheBlueGoldenHawkhonestly, part of me thinks that infighting is what has jirard doing this legal action crap, like he doesn't want to go against his family for some reason, but yeah, this is all nasty stuff
Jirard legit hurt himself in his confusion. Karl and Muta gave him a chance to clean this up honorably, instead he threatened to sue them, forcing their hand on sharing the truly damning stuff.
If they only made the first videos that's what would have happened. But in the second videos that alleged that Jirard is a crook even though the money was already donated by then, which is the only reason why he threatened legal action.
@@MatsThyWit Yes, I am defending him. I do not believe the actions committed by him and Open Hand were illegal. Alleging that what he did is illegal may be slander. The courts will decide this. If Karl never said that he's a fraudster and let the audit process happen, he wouldn't be fearing another lawsuit right now.
That's the thing too. He is literally on the OHF board along with his family. He is SUPPOSE to know about the money being a board member. It's amazing he's trying to downplay that.
agreed. Now the truth is actually out there and his simps can't play it off bc lack of context, he got caught in more lies and his true colors are on full display. Homie started talking like DSP lol. You can feel the desperation grow as the call goes on and then he winds up in near perfect DSP cadence, it's uncanny.
Something tells me that his family played a big part in this. Of course, that does not absolve him. His family knew about all of these and they were working with him. so I assume they pressured him into that foolish, foolish response. Which ironically removed all doubt.
@@pilgrimspromise1132 Yeah that was suspicious. I think that was his justification for why he only donated as much as indieland made, and not the golf money. But it seems he completely fumbled that tactic because Muta and Karl didnt even find out about that when they where doing the call.
As Karl pointed out in the segment when Jirard's phone died, there was a lot of guilt tripping in this call. The purpose on Jirard's side was to see if he could get it hidden without legal action. It was fairly effective on Muta, and I suspect he'd have succeeded in getting this hidden if not for the ferocity of Karl, it's honestly a lucky break they interviewed him together. Legal action would have been more effective against Karl if he didn't perform the due diligence of taking Jirard's statement, which he stated he was planning on uploading without speaking to Jirard, and I think it's within the realm of possibility that Muta would've folded in sympathy if Karl didn't help to ground him in those moments.
@@cagejones7757 something feels up considering the tone of how he said that. either way, so far the whole thing really felt like Jirard scrambling to save his self-image and no longer for his mother. whatever I said may be up to speculation but hey, that's my opinion.
@@Aeternum_Zephyria I think in this call he is earnest and honest. His brother or father likely are the ones mismanaging the money the most. But in his response video he is super angry and the decision to sue wasn't made by him alone but together with the rest of the family. He read a script and it's clear it isn't the same Jirad speaking there as it is here.
Objective Right Thats what we call being a "bad actor" now. Not giving the benefit of the doubt when you have no actual proof on what they are refering to is what we call "being objective". I bet he has spycameras in the houses of the Jirard family thats how he knows that what he "corrects" muta on is true.
Muta is clearly an empath, he didn't want to do this. Karl isn't - which isn't a bad thing, it's just his personality type. It makes for a nice good cop/bad cop thing though haha
Him being the manipulator he is, that's probably right...he probably went to his lawyers and was like "these guys are accusing me of financial crimes make it go away *whaaaaaaaa*"
@@Turbovolver Muta says he's not accusing him of embezzlement, but you can see on the foundation's tax filings that they have $10k+ in expenses at times despite Jirard saying 100% of the donations would go to charity. Whether you embezzled 10% or 100% of the donations doesn't change that, but Jirard was trying to make it sound like they'd accused him of 100% to make their allegations seem overstated/exaggerated or just take away from their credibility. On the other hand, I can understand why Jirard was nervous about things being misrepresented. I think Karl did a really good job of clarifying what happened, what was wrong, and why it was wrong, but people still seem to think the money was laundered or that he spent it on the 3DS eShop or whatever. So, Jirard was sort of right in assuming the internet would assume the worst of him, but also you kind of open yourself up to those assumptions when you commit fraud and embezzle money.
Karl and Muta have been good about not saying the embezzling word because they don't have any direct proof that Jirard or one of his family members were embezzling any funds. They did a good job sticking to claims they have backing of evidence for it. Though Karl in his response video, did make the claim that Jirard was essentially embezzling funds (though not outright), but that's only because Jirard admitted to it using the funds in essentially that way in his video. In all likelihood, there's a good chance that the money from the golf tournament was stolen. They just don't have any proof it was so they're avoiding saying it was, only saying that it's suspicious and the math doesn't math.
I love the silence and complete tonal change from Jirard at 33:55 when he got confirmation that Muta and Karl are going public with this. This is the exact moment Jirard knew for a fact that it’s all over.
Jirard should have known this revelation was going to happen EVENTUALLY. The tax filings are public, it was only a matter of time before people found out. Thankfully it didn't take ANOTHER 10yrs, but really Jirard should've known this shit was coming. No sympathy for his situation
@@ExWifeHaver287 The legal stuff is objectively more important, but a person like Jirard seems like he's worried about his image more than anything. He knows he's on the other side of Cancel Culture now and that he can't dig himself out of it.
@@ZetaCancri Yeah I came out of this with so much more respect for Muta. He just came off so maniacal in some of his videos I thought he'd be just as stone cold. He's still human. I am flat on Karl, he behaved exactly as I expected lol. Dude's seen some shit and built up a good callous over the years.
I respect Muta more, although he may have gone a little too far in his accusations in the 3rd video about the golf money and in the video after Jirard’s response, he did his best research and wanted a net positive, but he should have waited for higher authorities to investigate the situation. He still did a good job. Karl on the other hand is a monster with his last video, he assumed the absolute worst and didn’t give Jirard time to turn this around, indirectly hurting his rep despite Jirard willing to cooperate with an audit and admitting to lying and irresponsibility. And now a ton of people dogpile Jirard with cancel culture instead of giving constructive criticism. Jirard obviously needs to hold himself more accountable, he only did the bare minimum. Both sides are at fault to some extent.
@@itsbeebabyhe means that if going off looks alone Muta is very hairy and looks like a stereotypical muscular hairy man that’s aggressive lol and Karl os the opposite
It's honestly so incredibly impressive how objective and professional Karl is able to be and how seemingly effortlessly he's able to keep his emotions out of his work.
@@dr.wolfstar1765actually causing people to be on guard is far better and in this caused Jirard to take a definite stance where either he stands his ground or falls which has lead to the investigation to go further without any confusion on what Jirard mean't. And especially in this scenario if Jirard didn't know what was up right away he could have easily backed out saying it was a misunderstanding in a casual conversation which would have made things tougher for further investigation.
Hope the lawsuit threat was worth it jirard. So far from what I’m hearing is he is being heavily manipulative, has that crying tone but not actually crying and is trying to get them not to make the video as it will destroy his career, just a straight guilt trip. Muta sounded really conflicted by it but Karl wasn’t buying it and neither was going to back down but you can tell in the first couple videos that they treated him with such kid gloves and for him to change his tune from this apologetic sniveling to threatening lawsuits and saying he did nothing wrong shows it’s all an act.
For context, Karl's mum had just died (he talks about it on Twitter so I'm not spreading private news) So Karl was probably in a bitter mood and not taking Kindly to Jirard constantly bringing up his dead mom as a defense for what looks like fraud
Muta isn't really a journalist. He's a sensationalist drama-tuber. His presentation is usually riddled with digs, humor and overall very subjective bias. NOT TO DISREGARD his efforts in this, I'm sure he was integral. However Karl IS a journalist. He presents all of his findings as objectively and factual as he can. His goal is TRUTH, and while he makes jabs, and jokes here and there... the BULK of his content could be written as an article and read extremely professionally. So Karl was never going to give him the benefit of the doubt. He means business when he is investigating things.
I'm listening to this call now, and it is incredibly damning. The fact that Jirard even mentioned embezzlement or tax evasion in his response video honestly blows my mind. Multiple times throughout the call Jirard says, "there's no embezzlement" and Karl literally cuts him off and says, "yeah no one is insinuating that". It's obvious that Jirard got on the call to try and guilt trip Karl and Muta to not make videos because it was for a good cause in honor of his late mother. I mean he goes on a tangents throughout the whole call about the mouths to feed, how it's going to end him, and how he's just going to walk away. But the craziest thing is the tone change after he asks this question. Muta talks about how he is now uncomfortable with all TH-camr charities, Karl and Muta offer some sympathy saying it's not a simple situation, then Jirard responds with: "I take it you guys are deadset on making pieces about this?" And when they say yeah, the tone complete tone change Jirard has is incredible. He gets really quite, and says, "I guess that's it, I guess that's all she wrote" And you can just hear the absolute deflation in his voice. It feels like he's saying this both for the call, and for his channel, his career, Indieland, everything. Later Karl says, "If you're going to make another comment, make it more honest" Which we know that was not done. The "Any other fundraiser whether private or public I have nothing to do with" comment seems to come completely out of left field. And honestly, had it not been for this comment, I'm not sure Karl and Muta would've been as quick to look into the golf event. Towards the end of the video Jirard asks, "Do you guys have a timeline of when the videos will come out" so he can evaluate how much time he has to "force" the organization to donate the money (then followed up by some useless stuff about how he's walking away from everything). They don't give him a definite answer, but he then waited more than 2 weeks to make any donation. I'm glad Karl and Muta released this whole call because this really does paint a bigger picture, and is just more nails in Jirard's already buried coffin. Why he chose to say the things in his response video that he did make no sense. They tell him to be honest, make the donation, and you might be able to walk away. He does not do this, and threatens these two with lawsuits after they offer him sympathy in the call. Jirards true colors have been shown, and they're 50 shades of a manipulating liar.
Very well said. It's extremely telling how often he brings up random things out of nowhere, it's because he's thinking about those things. Also he appears to keep dropping hints at bribing them into silence. Plus the fear turned despair in his voice. It all reeks of waaaay more going on behind the scenes than just what we know.
The more Jirard mentioned embezzlement while no one else did (at least until Karl's latest video where he describes a situation as textbook embezzlement, long after this convo and Jirard's response) makes me wonder more and more if it's embezzlement.
It's like in a missing person case, when cops are just asking basic questions, like what mood the person was in or if they had any troubles ect. And the person they're asking goes "I didn't do anything to them". Or in a case of murder, someone is just being asked about the victim's life and they go "I had nothing to do with it" when that option wasn't even on the table...
This was fantastically put. The whole reason Jirard made this call, was to convince the 2 guys not to make a video. that's all he cared about. they kept on telling him what he could to do to make It right, And what Gerard really wanted to say was "tell me what I should do to make it right so that you won't post this video" While he never outright said "don't make a video", he strongly implied it and kept on asking about it. I feel like if he wouldn't have made this call, He wouldn't be in such a big hole. I'm surprised his lawyers didn't intervene and say. "Don't make this call."
His tone changed quickly in a matter of days. From a shaky, scared voice, that doesn't know what to do, to a angry man who's gonna "defend" his family's name. It's so obvious he's guilty.
Exactly. His question "so i take it that you're going to make a piece on this" (not exact quote since i have bad memory but something like that) is proof that he was hoping to convince them not to make a video on it.
This call proves you and Karl went incredibly easy on and kind to him. You gave him the time, space and courtesy to respond and make amends the best way possible. You were more than fair in your reporting of this. Truly classy handling of the situation guys. Too bad Jirard went the total opposite route and let his ego and a shit lawyer tank his career. If he had handled it better I think his channel would have survived. But after his response and all of this call coming out I think he’s done.
Nah, if Logan Paul can scam his fans back to back, and they still give him millions of views. Jirad should be fine aslong as he continues to provide good quality videos.
@@axelmok498uh... no, those aren't even close to being equivalents. Logan Paul is a much bigger TH-camr with a following that is primarily younger. They'll continue to watch him because they're obvious to his scam BS or simply don't care. He can handle losing millions of subs. Jirard's audience is much different and while I think he absolutely could come back from this... how he chose to handle the situation will make that much more difficult.
tbh, I don't think there's any version of this playing out where Jirard could have kept the bulk of his channel and followers. Even if he came clean to everything and apologized immediately, he still committed charity fraud for a decade. That's not a "Oh, everyone makes mistakes" kinda thing, that's a "This guy tried to steal exorbitant amounts of charity money and he is absolute scum that can never be trusted ever again" kinda thing.
Jirard is the kind of person who would walk into a store, stuff products into his coat and try to leave, and when the security guard tries to stop him he runs outside shouting "but my mom died"
Again, again, again: As someone who has worked with several charities, both local and national, it is nowhere near as hard to make restricted donations, ESPECIALLY when you are in a partnership with them, as Jirard has claimed. Zero due diligence was done by Open Hand. In addition, no charity is ever going to tell you that tens of thousands to hundreds of thousands of dollars going towards their cause is going to waste. 1. That's absurd. 2. It won't.
It's so strange that Jirard expected people to believe that they offered donations to these charities but they replied, "no, that's not enough to matter." What charity would ever do that?
I wouldn't say NO charity would do that, there are some charities with absurd overhead... A certain charity in the EU got in trouble for having more than 90% overhead costs, because most of their funds went back into advertising campaigns and hiring people to go door by door (and a large payout for the CEO to boot for doing a good job with "record donations"). They were honest about it to their partners, but misrepresented it to the public. They justified it as "it helps us raise more", and apparently the companies that partnered with them (and got tax cuts from it) either bought into it or didn't care... But yea, in general, it would be hard to find a charity that bad, let alone not find any charity that's better.
Yeah on that second point I have only ever heard the opposite of what Jirard claims, virtually every charity will scream from the top of their lungs *"EVERY DOLLAR COUNTS!"* Literally never heard of an organization that was "Meh, don't bother we only want big donations."
Exactly, it's such a illogical response that I wonder if he put his trust in someone from his family, and they fucked all this up. And he's trying to cover for them?
I gained a ton of respect for Karl after hearing this. Manipulators will try to tug at your heart strings, but Karl wasn’t having it. That’s called covering a story objectively.
@@kamitoringsOr maybe that's exactly what objective means but our view of "objective" got hijacked by people often having ulterior motives for selfish reasons we simply forgot it's about telling facts and letting viewer decide?
That was not objective lmao he hates jirard. He assumed jirard is the same as billy mitchell or other scam artists and never gave him a single benefit of the doubt, particularly when there’s not a real answer pending having to take more time than a discord call to go over all the numbers and accounts and the times Jirard personally funded IndieLand and when they used funds to cover costs, which according to Jirard were small costs compared to what they were raising.
@@EndorphinSauce You realize that Completionist never shown any receipt about him personally financing anything, so that is just another "believe me bro" from him? I don't know how much more objective can you be if what you say actually ends up being correct.
I just lost my grandmother to vascular dementia and it angers me to hear Jirard saying he doesn't want it going to anything "useless" when the end of life care is just as important as finding a cure. The end stages of dementia are so scary for the person going through it and making that experience as smooth as possible makes a world of difference for the families affected. I'd rather see people like my grandmother getting help from that money than seeing Jirards hip pocket being the main beneficiary.
And also to peoples paycheck, like OPEN HAND HAD PAYCHECKS TOO DESPITE NOT EVEN BEING A FUNCTIONING CHARITY!! At least if they initially donated it, it couldve gone to doctors paychecks rather than whatever they used it for. His concept of what is and isnt useful isn't applicable when the money he's donating isnt his. If YOU think your donation wont make a difference, fine, don't donate, but that doesn't give you the right to hold on to OTHER PEOPLES donations.
Literally almost, if not every expense for organizations researching a disease are important. Paychecks keep doctors, nurses, and researchers working there, fed, and healthy enough to keep working. End of life care keeps those at the end stages as comfortable as possible. The research helps to find out more about the disease and possibly find a cure. Everything is important. You may want to donate to one specific part, which is fine, but that doesn't make any other part any less important.
@@sinfulpuritan3430 exactly, he may not like "some nurse" getting a salary for providing hospice, but that nurse could provide some alternative care suggested from the family, and if it helps the patient, a case study can open the doors for new avenues of treatment. It's sickening how he just keeps jumping to the most plausible excuses without ever directly admitting guilt for what he knows he did wrong.
My papal has Deminta & is now living in a nursing home because we can't take care of him, we visit him weekly, so he doesn't forget us he it hurts me that the charity money didn't go anywhere while I didn't donate personally. I am sorry to the victims who Donated it is never ok to commit Fraud. I hope he can learn from this. He can be redeemed eventually but it hurts me seeing how it affects others.
I know this was in the first video but it still baffles me how this man can say “we haven’t found a benefactor we are completely happy with” but felt completely happy name dropping organizations that would get people to donate. Every time I hear it I just shake my head man.
Jirad mentions he wanted someone who can come on and talk about what the money is doing. There are plenty of charities worth the donation but one that you can use to promote your organization are probably non-existent
"I was made aware in 2022 that the money hadn't been moved yet... That's not fucking cool," Really? It's not cool? But wait, I thought this was the plan all along? According to Jirard, the plan was always to look for a great charity and then donate it in one large lump sum. At least that's what he said in his latest, and allegedly last, response. So, which is it? Was he lying here about only finding out in 2022, or was he lying in his response about it always being the plan? Or, here's a twist, what if they're both lies? He knew long before 2022 that the money wasn't being donated, and he also wasn't planning on donating it to just one charity in one big payout.
Even so, he said that the money was being donated at Indieland this year. What he said both then and in this call confirmed him as a liar. Then we have the discrepancies with the golf tournament and so many more thanks to Jirard himself in that horrible apology video. I doubt he's going to see jail, but definitely going to be heavily fined by the government. Along with people like Jamie Lee Curtis who donated quite a bit of money to Open Hand. This is the beginning of a long legal battle Jirard and his family have set for themselves.
He clarifies later that it was his family's plan from the beginning, but he was not in on that plan. Even still, he's well aware that they were misleading people because (if one believes what he says in the call) he was misled himself. Regardless, he was continuing to mislead people after he became aware, so it really doesn't matter much.
Jirard has also said in the past that his charity raises 600k PER YEAR. But he only just donated about that much in response to being called out. There's money missing, just going by his own words.
Things like this are why he really can't afford to sue Karl or Muta. All of this would become court record, and for him to prove they lied, he'd have to provide accurate records of all the money the Open Hand Foundation has ever received or spent in the last 10 years. That would pretty much make it a snap of the fingers to bust him for charity fraud.
I love how this call shows how reasonable Muta has been so far. When Jirard threatened to sue, Muta became the embodiment of; "You mistook my kindness for weakness!" *posts this*
@@gdizzzl Exposing someone for lying isn't a bad thing. They recorded the call probably in case something like this would happen and to keep facts straight. Remember, memory isn't infallible but recording are. Keep your receipts and you'll be covered for whenever you need them.
@@gdizzzl This is objectively an insane comment on more than a few levels. Lol And no im not one of the weirdos claiming "embezzlement, he was planning on stealing it all" or some other bull that not even muta believes, whats supposed to be the take away from that comment anyways? we should not expose obvious wrong? any type of exposing is a nefarious plot? please it doesnt make sense
@@gdizzzlthey literally told Jirard it was being recorded and Jirard decided to speak anyways. This is not a secret from the parties involved, and Jirard decided to hang himself with the rope that was meant to claw him out of the hole he dug. I'm excited to see whether the Completionist can "complete" his promise on litigation because I'm more interested in that
Here’s the thing. You and Karl sound basically the same as you do in your videos, but the difference between how Jirard sounds on this call and how he sounds in his response video is enormous. The way he repeatedly asks you what you want him to do and then pivots to, “Are you dead set on going with this?” just reeks of sleaze.
Thats what happens when you make a character / fake persona online (not saying its a bad thing, and most youtubers do it) just is what it is when you see behind the veil of these PG youtubers.
Everything up to that point was manipulation, thinking he could flatter and guilt them into holding back. After they make it clear they're still running it, he turns into a pouting dejected child.
the way jirards brain works is really strange to a normalish person. like, they didn't create the issue, they're not coming to your house with baseball bats or something. anyone could at any day of the week by just pure chance break the story. only reason nobody did that is that not many people thought even to look for the filings because it's so blatantly stupid and dishonest what jirard did. the issue wouldn't go away if muta and karl didn't make their videos. it could still happen any monday that boom it's out there in wider public. muta and karl knew that too! they knew that by sitting on the story waiting they were possibly losing the dibs on it. the issue would still always be there if he didn't address it and admit to lying pro-actively - just donating the money wouldn't change the years of filing that they didn't donate during those years.
weird that he spends 20+ minutes asking what they want him to do, in a call about them trying to find out why the money he raised for charity hasn't actually gone to any charity he said it has been for 10 years. real brain teaser as to what one could do to right that situation huh?
6:10 I love that he throws Projared under the bus, especially after Projared was one of the few people that blindly supported him on twitter when this all started to come out
Same though I don't blame Jared (kinda) given his controversy and how several people (including myself) blindly assumed he was a giant piece of crap for cheating and sending nudes to minors IIRC. Innocent til proven Guilty, is what some tried to do in this situation.
All Jirard had to do was simple. Just say "you're right, I've been irresponsible, I will look to donate everything in the account within the month." That's it. Accept his mistake, apologize for it, and make amends. Not worry about his image and try to convince people not to release the story.
@@Richforce1 i mean if he really was clever he could have turned the whole thing into more content for his channel. make a video coming clean, make videos having a call with several dementia charities, make a poll on twitter or something asking viewers which org they agreed with the most, make a video revealing he split the funds amongst all 3... i think ethically turning this into content would be wrong, but if he really wanted to he could have spun this into a positive PR move.
@@Richforce1he could still play the family card, saying there's a lot he could not disclose right now as to why it took so long to donate, because of it being a family matter, he would only simply concede they were right and that he would make it a priority to get it donated right away, and tell them that in the future he would come clean and explain it in a video, again, maintaining they're right and that the most important thing is to get the money donated. It was indeed that simple
There are two positive things that came from this situation: 1. [SOME of] the money got donated. 2. Jirard isn't going anywhere near another charity. Edit: Okay, there was only one positive thing. There's still a lot of money missing.
Listening to the whole call you can tell that Muda and Karl were exceedingly generous when showing the original edits of this call. They were more than professional, they were sympathetic even. You don't see many journalists taking these steps to not make the person look terrible.
@@ImSidgr One of them you have to study at a school for and need a degree in. The other one is a career based around shilling sponsorships and getting involved in drama. Btw I'm not trying to defend Jirard's actions but the Karl and Mutahar dickriding needs to stop, especially after Muta's habit of DMCAing videos in the past.
Holy crap, Karl EVEN told him to donate it to ALL the organizations he promised the money was going to and he STILL only sent one lump sum to one of the charities.
@@Azazelea Jirard could have slit the $600K up between multiple charities. Jirarad could have done as Karl suggested and donate to all the charities mentioned in the fund raisers. My theory of why he gave all the money to one charity is they figured out a way to get some sort of kickback from the charity. The charity he paid may hire a family member of the charity may hire Jirard to make them a video. A lot of shady charities get money from the charity account to personal accounts by hiring family members as "consultants."
@ddegn I thought half his defence was you need a big donation to not be wasted? I feel 600k to one is way better then split where it would just sit in a different bank for another 10 years
@@Azazelea Perhaps not even left. $600k was probably what they could scrounge together in a short period of time. I'd be shocked if Jirard produces a bank statement from before the drama began showing $600k in an Open Hand account.
I feel uncomfortable that Muta and Karl tried so hard to mouth feed Jirard a valid legal excuse for this problem, and yet this man had the audacity to basically spit in their face and say no I can feed my self and proceeds to make a mess.
They were giving him the benefit of the doubt. Especially as he claimed the money was still there. It was better that the money was donated, and he owned up to his mistakes. Instead, he donated some of the money. Lied about things in his response. And threatened to sue them over their proven allegations.
@@zenoblues7787 That's the thing. The allegations aren't "proven" as you say. They are alleging theft/embezzlement. Yet the funds were essentially untouched for 10 years. Save for a some administrative costs that made up a low %. All charities have administrative costs so that isn't proof of any crime or intent. It's a fishy and complicated situation. Yes it's suspicious he held onto the funds and didn't donate them. Could have been planning to take it all for himself down the line. And he certainly lied about certain stuff. At the same time, if somebody is a thief and scammer....Leaving THAT big of an amount essentially untouched for 10 years takes A LOT of restraint. If someone was planning to steal it, why would they have waited all these years? Wouldn't they think after a year or two or three that nobody has caught on yet and start taking the money because they thought they were in the clear? It's hard to prove intent with certainty when the money was just sitting there. Had half of it been missing or something then the picture becomes much clearer. But it wasn't. It just sat there, but he lied about making donations. It's possible he was waiting for a sizeable amount to make a big "restricted" donation.
My grandmother and my uncle died from dementia. So when this news broke out, it hit pretty close to home. Thank you both for covering this situation and bringing about change. It really means a lot to me, as I'm sure it does for many others.
Yeah, if I was in Jirard's shoes, I'd be in a panic too. Everything he had built over many years is now crumbling around him, that'd be terrifying to anyone really. Whatever he had built he won't be able to get back.
well yeah, he probably never expected anyone to actually look through his documents. If you were getting away with something (lets say an alleged crime) for an actual decade and two people pull up in your dms like 'we know what you did, we have proof and we're going public, this is just a curtesy' you would probably be in panic mode as well.
"The way you were saying that it made it seem like we were moving money around and it's not true." Bro literally no one said that. The way this man projects is insane. Hope he gets audited.
Aussies have a very good "bullshit detector" and our way of handling highly emotional/stressful situations is the "she'll be right" mentality. Basically take things as they come and keep moving. It leads to an ability to look at things from a more objective or less emotional perspective.
Muta and Karl, you two are class. Muta hesitantly and empathetically saying that 600k+ will set it straight, Karl saying it doesn't matter. Both of them are saying it as honest as can be. You decide how you feel... Muta and Karl both spoke honestly. Respect
And they're both right. The 600k gets the money into the right hands and Karl would agree when it comes to making it right to the organizations. But to the public? We all know that unless Jirard outright apologizes for misleading the public, then he and the organization would be potentially found liable for charity fraud for making misleading statements, even after he found out on his own words. Once that happened, Jirard individually lost all plausible deniability and has no choice but to "defend" himself or literally admit to alleged fraud by the textbook definition. He can't self incriminate but he lost ALL solace and any remaining credibility the second he said he will sue Muta (who never alleged anything other than charity fraud by the textbook definition and wisely chose specific If statements) and Karl did so as well. In fact, watching their videos, they really only raises questions and it's reaffirmed in this call. And there is nothing illegal questioning. And Jirard self admits there were real clerical errors so an audit Is justified
can you actually say something insightful instead and actually wait until more information from a legal professional is released? Obviously he lied and fucked up but he is ready for the audit and willing to cooperate. He still needs to do better and be more accountable. If he does come out innocent it will take a long time for him to earn our trust again. He should have done a better job at being transparent about where the money was going and if it was really donated. Too many people making comments like these dogpiling on him instead of actually giving constructive criticism. Keep in mind he had a very positive rep back then and never had any malicious intentions, with many developers and creators who know and respect him. At least some money got donated and some money was only put toward expenses to run the charity event, it could have been a lot worse (unless there is more information from legal professionals you can invalidate whatever I said)
@@theawesomeali8834 The Completionist is planning to sue Muta and Karl according to his video... Sorry but I don't see why OP has to hold back when Jirard himself isn't, legally. Practicing legal experts have looked at what's available and also concluded that Jirard has committed charity fraud in a documented way. Whether he had malicious intent or not is actually irrelevant when charged with charity fraud.
I lost both my aunt and my grandmother to two different forms of dementia. Even worse, by a cruel twist of fate, they were both affected at the same time. Grandma was old, and got hit with Alzheimers, and aunt got hit with FTD like Jirard's mom. It's remarkable and painful how different they are; Alzheimers taking memory first while leaving function largely intact, a perfectly normal-looking, sweet old lady who had no recognition in her eyes when she looked at me. FTD did the opposite, first taking away my aunt's ability to communicate, to care for herself, but leaving her memory for last; a woman who couldn't speak or go up even a single stair without help, but whose eyes lit up with joy every time she saw me, until the end. A mother and daughter both slowly disappearing, their minds being eaten away from opposite ends while their family watched, helpless. I will never forget how it felt to watch them go. So I speak with some authority when I say that the way Jirard is using his mother as a tool of emotional manipulation and a shield against criticism? It makes me _sick._
Sorry you had to go through that. It's exceedingly frustrating to know that all this money didn't go to research because there are so many potential discoveries/treatments that could have been accelerated along with it.
Lost my grandad to ftd and had no idea it was dementia until the end because his memory wasn’t bad or anything. He just got increasingly violent, impulsive and irrational
You speak with authority? is that your definition? Cause you also seem to speak without human empathy. What a weird move to use your family members as a point of connection with someone in a similar situation, only to use it as a hall pass to pile on a guy… ball-less hypocrite.
Goddamn Karl just going "I don't believe any of the bullshit this is straight up Jirard's fault," is WILD. Like Karl has an immovable moral compass and doesn't budge for any silver-tongued response.
@@franklinturtleton6525because the facts are all there. How do you bust your ass raising hundreds of thousands of dollars for years and not know where the money goes? Especially when he is so proud of this. He is a liar and that's it.
i respect that, he hears bullshit and shoots straight past it, he's straight up calling him out and in this case it works wonders. I love the contrast between Karl and Mutah though. Mutah is trying to make sense of it when there's no real good reason behind it. then you got Karl who is like "yeah, no, he's lying it's very clear, fuck him" (not a literal quote) you need someone who doesn't easily fall for bullshit, but you also need someone who can symphatise with someone.
@@DarkDyllon Honestly, though this experience has once again shown me to never meet your idols, I do admire both of them for their unique ways of looking at the situation. At the end of the day, they're both solid dudes, doing what they can to inform and educate the public, and I wish them the best... Presuming it doesn't come out that Karl's been hacking Goldeneye for the past 20 years or some nonsense.
Hind side is 20-20 eh? Also, who are you to claim that he wasn't honest and perfectly truthful in the call but realized that he had to weasel himself out of his truthful statements later? It's always so annoying to read statements of ppl, who are unable to see more than their own opinionated opinion. Karl didn't buy his emotions, because he was already angry about how he used his mother for all of it. So everyone stating "oh karl so rational bla bla" is just blind...he literally admits to this fact himself in his own video. Mutar just sympathized with him, because of the family drama, knowing that his career might be over, and all of it not being entirely his fault. It's just two people with two different opinions about the same person and situation..
You can tell Muta didn’t want to do any of this once he heard Jirads voice crack. It’s sad he wants to act like some kind of investigative journalist but be so chill about the person he’s investigating
Muta wants to give him the benefit of the doubt and is isn't calling him on his lies. Karl is just sick of him lying and deceiving and he doesn't buy any of it. He even calls him on it pretty much every time.
That’s cuz Karl is more interested in spreading hate than revealing the truth. His intentions are bad regardless of the outcome. Karl is just a despicable a person imo.
In the end he wanted to clear everything up behind the scenes. What he TRULY cared about was his public image. As his public image is everything to him his money livelihood clout steaks you name it. To me what he was trying to do was insanely scummy. "Don't put this out it'll ruin me please." Then you shouldn't have done dirt to those that literally gave you THEIR money and livelihood.
what do you expect? of course his reputation is at stake, and Muta along with many others kept pressing further assuming the worst situation possible instead of giving him time to fix the situation and allowing for a legal investigation from the IRS, figure out what happened to the golf money, and be transparent with everything. Not trying to say muta’s research shouldn’t have happened, this situation needed to be brought to light. But other people went to dog pile on him instead of waiting for more information. If Jirard does turn out innocent, he still has a long way to go to earn our trust again and he needs to do better. He knows he lied but is ready for an audit so he can clear his name. Both sides here are at fault. Keep in mind money got donated and that is a net positive despite inflation, and money covered event expenses which is common, it could have been a lot worse. An audit and investigation would clear things up significantly.
This call proves how misplaced Jirards aggression was at the end of his response video. He for sure knows his career is over and was just lashing out which was such a childish move. It's very sad how he was someone who has seeming generated such a positive and prosperous space for indie developers while being the front for a foundation that lied about helping people who suffer from such a horrible disease.
It wasn't misplaced, it was actually really intentional. Re-watch Jirard's response after seeing this video. Now think of why he'd want to sue. My bet is that it's classic attempt at a SLAPP suit, where a whistleblower rings a public alarm bell and exposes somebody's bad actions in a matter of public interest and the person turns around and tries to use legal threats or legal action to intimidate the whistleblower into being quiet on it. Should be noted that in most countries this is seen as blatant misuse and abuse of legal systems. If you followed the CryptoZoo Coffeezilla saga, you'd recognize that move as the exact same one Logan Paul tried to pull in his response video.
The thing is his career probably wasn't over. There are people who got away with much worse but because he decided to pull this shit afterwards instead of just apologising and proving himself to people he made shit 1000 times worse and actually looks like a scumbag.
@@gyrthez246and that attitude isn’t working on either karl or muta, and besides, karl is already in the midst of being sued by billy mitchell. does jirard really think legal threats are going to scare karl?
He could've kept some sort of career had he just admitted he fucked up, donated the money and said that due to his irresponsible running of the charity, that he would pass it on to someone else more responsible. But no. He proved that it wasn't just irresponsibility and or lazyness that caused this. He really had ill intent in all of it.
@@sadsatan..I agree. If he handled his response video with integrity and humility he could have been fine over time and continued to have a career. Of course things would never be the same but it's better than nothing.
call them out...BeatEmUps is the most disappointing youtuber to me because I actually enjoy his content and I thought he was a decent fellow but F that guy now
well he first tried to copyright strike the videos and when that failed they went silent for a bit then out came the threats and pity plee video. And then threats came from others in the family of legal action on reddit i believe. They could not have handled this any worse.
41:23 did anybody find it odd that he mentioned he has nothing to do with any open hand foundation stuff besides indieland? Like he knew to distance himself from the rest of the foundation
For anyone who’s ever lived with liars, Jirad is hitting all the tell tell sings of someone who’s fibbing. Could be a lot of stuff or just some things, but he is acting very sus.
That was my thought as well. A liar will give you reasons for why their lie isn't a lie. Someone telling the truth will simply tell the truth ... there's no "reason" for their truth when given. Then the guilt trips and the changes in voice tone. There's folks on TH-cam who do videos on how to spot a liar. This call would be great content for that.
@@orangejjay Yep, you got it. And side note I LOVE those types of videos. Especially when they are done regarding interrogations. As for this dude, it’s so many things. The pressured speech. The over explaining. The shift of responsibility. The fact that he’s all over the place. I came into this situation pretty neutral on Jirard but hearing what I’ve heard, I don’t even care if it was a simple mistake. His response video was hard to watch. It was like watching a drowning man thrashing in water to stay alive. Except he only cares about himself and his personal crew. If he wanted to really make good on things, that video should have said “I messed up and I am sorry. I hope you can forgive me”…. and that’s it.
As much as I'm not a fan of the current reaction or muta/karl's actions in a lot of this... yeah, pretty much this comment 100%. I'd been wanting to hear this for a while and there is a lot of small details that could just be a guy under a lot of stress with internal family drama or someone scrambling like shit to come up with anything that sticks.
@@goblinarsonist Yeah, I don’t particularly love how Karl went about this either. The whole thing just feels like “gotcha” content. And he *could* just be feeling overwhelmed. Good money, though, says he lying about either some stuff or a lot.
@@leeartlee915 It's not surprising that it turned into a gotcha. They went extremely easy in their first videos, and look how it turned out--Jirard's supporters dug their heads in the sand and believed every attempted by Jirard to play innocent. Sometimes you have to rub people's nose in it for them to admit it's there.
The only reason he took this call is because he was trying to convince them not to release the information. He clearly wanted to bribe them, but he could tell they weren't into it. He asked several times what he could do for them and told them how great they were and how well respected they were. He constantly reminded them how much damage it would do to him and other innocent people. I wondered why he would take this call without a lawyer present, but after hearing the call, the reason he didn't have a lawyer present was because he was hoping to do something unscrupulous and he didn't want a lasting record. Here's a tip, never try to do something off the record with two reporters who are planning to do a story on you. This was an attempt to bury the story.
@@justinmartin4407 Listening to the full recording on SOG's channel is very interesting. Both SOG and Jobst seem to be more open to this being a simple act of incompetence in the call, but between when Jirard drops out of the call and then re-enters the discussion, Karl really shows he's not buying it, and is mostly not trying to scare Jirard off.
What's interesting is I was a Jirard fan. He posted his video and I looked into just what he was responding to and it became obvious he's full of it. Unsubbed from him and subbed to SomeOrdinaryGamer instead after watching these videos about the truth of things.
@@DigitalGamerPixel I'm also a former fan. I'm also someone who lost their grandfather to self deletion during one of his states of dementia and so learning about this was not only sickening, it just flat out broke my heart. The fact that he's been using his mother's name to deflect from all this just adds even more insult to injury.
@@averagejackmedia609 < Someone whos never seen an episode of FPS or listened to the 2m of them addressing it And no before you go assuming things i dont support jirard, im just a fan of FPS and everyone on the pod
he wouldn't stop saying he took money from the foundation to cover expenses for indieland, but it was only a little and it it were "too much" he wouldn't caus that's not right... Karl was trying to clue him in on their better be some kinda connection there or else it would just be taking 401c3 money and using it for personal use (doesn't matter if the personal use is funding a different project) What he described was embezzlement and off the books... he should thank Karl for being able to get in front of it...
It's still wild to me that Jirard didn't just apologize in his video and promise to do better and instead wanted to further escalate his crimes. Insanity.
Once your mistake is made known by the internet there's no apologizing. It's a damned if you do damned if you don't situation, so the only thing you could do is making sure you're not making any mistake that'll bite you in the future in the first place
@@Boiled_Pizza i mean he could've atleast mended the situation a bit. By apologizing and just straight up donating the money asap and quitting any future fund raisers.
@Boiled_Pizza Definitely feel like he couldve licked his wounds and recovered. Just accept the L, claim the accountability, promise to do better and in the very next time he attempted this be completely 100% open on it. Yea he wouldve still lost trust with people but he definitely couldve repaired it over time by just saying "hey I am a complete idiot who fucked up and I want to make this better" and prove it. Things wont 180 but repairing trust takes time
@@Boiled_Pizza nah he coulda immediately donated a very large sum and apologized and he'd have less heat on him now would probably still get audited anyway though so doesn't really matter
Bro just lowered the casket that is Jirard’s career into the ground with this one. Muta thank you to you and Karl for bringing this whole thing to light. Without you guys people probably would have never learned about these heinous actions and kept donating. Keep up the great work!
I love how Muta and Karl were super kind and even gave him so much grace and advice and after every piece of advice all Jirard kept saying was “soooo y’all still gonna make that video or..?” Like he did not care about this issue beyond himself. he just wanted to know if he worked his sympathy card to his benefit and got one over on these two. Very egotistical
I loved the “Guys I’m not asking you if you’re okay with me paying you money to not go through with this. That would be pretty silly, right haha but seriously, y’all down with it, or…?”
That's exactly what I gathered from the call as well. Jirard the Conpletionist is super self centered and only worried about his image and his company. Not once did he mention how it affected his fans or community who were the people who gave him the opportunity to be successful on TH-cam. And yet some of his fans still defend him.
All he cared about was his image. And then when they posted a friendly version of this call, he decided to double down and sue them, that forced Muta to lay down his hand to be like, "Lol Jirard is a bastard."
This is literally a perfect "Good Cop, Bad Cop" type of situation. Muta being the good cop, feeling empathetic and almost feeling sorry for Jirard where as Karl being the bad cop isn't letting the heart string tugging affect him and staying straight and direct on course. Really good choice for them to work on this together. Perfect dichotomy of interrogative personalities getting to bottom of the really fucked up situation.
that was my thought too. I've watched a good amount of police interviews and these two do the "mutt and Jeff" with more effectiveness and subtlety than a lot of trained interrogators ive seen.
That moment of silence after Karl and Muta confirm that they're still going ahead with their pieces... gave me goosebumps. You can hear the penny drop...
I used to be a supervisor at my previous job. This reminds me of so many difficult conversations I had with employees, and Jirard is so desperate to save himself that it makes me sad. When you get caught in a lie, you have to keep improvising more lies to cover it up. Props to Karl and Muta for handling this whole situation in the most professional way possible - they gave Jirard a chance to explain himself, and he blew it.
Jontron was incredibly based, mass immigration bad, diversity bad, but unfortunately he presented himself and his ideas poorly with no research and made a bit of a fool of himself, as he admits
@@aetherius6221 Well personally I think horrible racist nonsense is bad no matter which way you cut it. I don't really care about how slick the rhetoric is.
Seriously can't believe Jirard went to threaten legal action against these guys after how fair they were with him in this call... Holy crap, if he just apologized after donating the money this would be another story. Now i get why Karl and Muta were so unhinhedly pissed about this, they really gave him a fair chance and were very nice to him.
I think the most important thing to note about Jirard's behavior is the fact that he's concerned about his reputation rather than the money not actually being donated. Throughout this call he is constantly worried about the perceptions of others onto himself, rather than the perceptions of others onto his family or charity as a whole. He tries to guilt trip Karl & Mutahar into sympathizing with his personal anxieties and struggles, and he barely seems to care about the actual cause, which are victims of dementia and Alzheimer's. If he was TRULY dedicated to donating and contributing to the research, he would only be concerned with donating the money quickly, rather than worrying about his reputation and whether or not Karl & Muta would make videos about it. Jirard's focus is solely on himself, not the people he could be helping, and to me that's the most damning aspect of this entire situation, and is more than what any document, statement, or tax filing could prove. To him, this situation is about himself and his own career, rather than the missed opportunities with the charity funds, or the developers and partners he's screwed over. That to me shows me his true intentions: maintain a positive image rather than actively contribute to a good cause. Jirard was one of the most respected creators on the platform, it absolutely sucks for him to be exposed in this manner. He deserves whatever he gets in the coming months.
It made me angry how many times Mutahar gave Jirard answers on what to reflect on and somewhat what to do and Jirard just focused again and again on what videos would be made (about him), what things would be said (about him) and how he was going to be seen by people. All I heard was a man concerned about himself, not the cause he defrauded, not his mother, not the people he lied to. Just a sad situation.
Very well said, and I hope others who don’t yet see it watch/listen to this call. The fact that Jirard even took this call is wild and easily one of the most ill-advised things he’s done probably ever. After listening to the whole thing, it’s abundantly clear that the only reason he took this call was to try to persuade Muta and Karl to reconsider covering this whole thing. He doesn’t say it explicitly, but every time he says, “What do you guys want me to do to make this right?”, what he’s asking between the lines is, “Is there anything I can do today to convince you two to not make videos about this?”
Jirard deserves it, dude has been lying for years. Had no one talked about this, he would have done it again, not even him receiving concerns about whether or not the money is being donated is enough for him to confess.
@@MajimaNightlord This is sadly the case with many a TH-camr I've seen that's come into a lot of fame and money and it just changes them for the worse. There's been few cases of where it actually made them a much better person in the long run.
I love how he mentions ProJared and Jontron as if their controversies don’t pale in comparison to his at this point. And even funnier that Jared beclowned himself again for this dude.
Normal people when they see legal cases: Wow thats screwed up. I hope the evidence provided is sound You: "Wow I believe every little detail I hear from people like its just regular drama and dont look up anything myself that they talk about to make an informed opinion. Legal and career ruining accusations are just entertainment to me" NPC
My jaw dropped hearing Karl say that. But it was earned at that point. They interviewed him, they actually censored the worst parts to give him the chance to step forward and take the reigns of this exposure and to handle it himself. He would have looked so much better if he just bit the bullet and started working on how to make it right. Instead he spat in their face. Grovels, begs and insinuates bribing them in the call, then turning around and acting like they were being malicious towards him.
Yeah he wasn't gonna do anything disrespectful in just his first video. Things escalated astronomically after that and more of the truth about Jirard was revealed, so their videos after that first one weren't upheld to their original agreement.
@@mainboysmusic6985 I feel like Jirard didnt know that the call was being recorded or forgot entirely.Hence,he thought he could still twist the narrative more than what Muta and Carl would allow him to
I was thinking the same thing! I like how he keeps a level head, and even guides Muta to not get affected emotionally. That's a journalist mind right there haha
I disagree with the statement that Karl had no empathy. Listen to 33~ when he says he feels for Jirard. I think Karl was just being objective when he says the emotion behind the excuses was irrelevant
@@attykarly yes that seems a bit of harsh of me when I read back. Clearly he has some empathy, the first reply to my comment that worked along the lines of Karl guiding Muta to not be blinded by a clearly in distress Jirad works better. I agree with you Atty!
I think you read it wrong. Karl definitely has emotions. Muta was using the emotion card to see how far the dude goes with his shit and also maybe hear a bit of his side no matter how malicious it may sound. You can see after he disconnects in part 1 where Muta changes from “oh man, that hard, tough situation considering his mom and stuff” to “phew that was something, something , so there is definitely fraud involved”. But I maybe be wrong too. Interesting watch tho. Honestly if he just donates the money, it should be just okay and people will forget most of it as time goes.
TBH I don't know what kind of hack lawyer would read the script of his response video and tell him: "sure, go for it, go get 'em tiger!" Considering he revealed more damning details like he used money to "offset some costs". I guess a decent lawyer would've told him to just shut up.
Blatant manipulation. "If you tell the internet, its over for me", "Everything iv done for my mother will be tarnished", "I just want to make the world a better place and be a game developer"@@BobDevV Well Jirard why didn't you go to university and study game development and go get a job as a game dev? Instead you and your family set up a dodgy foundation to get rich off. Outside of youtube etc did Jirard ever have a job? He wants Karl and Muta to feel sorry for him and not expose what was going on. I think if he had got his way, he would have paid Karl and Muta to be quiet.
This whole thing reminds me of when Wendy wanted to fight Cartman (South Park) and he kept apologizing in private but kept saying he'd fight publicly lol
The whole call is nuts. One of my favorite points is when he says "I don't want the money to just go to some doctor's salary". Isn't that exactly what the money should be going towards? Some PhD trying to find a cure??
there is not just one PhD that will "solve" dementia thats not how cures work, and that is a legit concern donating to certain charities that it goes to just one top brass. He's made a lot of bad calls but that part ain't the damning one
Usually muta speaks strongly about punishing people that do wrong things and i think here is no different, the difference is that he is being cautious to not fk up and seek the truth, for me is the being smart while seeking the truth that makes this situation so good
Muta was fortunately lenient and gave him the benefit of the doubt but didn’t do too much of a good job in the 3rd video and the video after Jirard’s response. Still, Muta did a good job overall highlighting the situation with missing golf money and telling Jirard he needs to do something and he only wants answers, nothing else. Karl didn’t give him a chance and instead assumed the absolute worst, overblew this situation, and now people are dogpiling Jirard with cancel culture instead of them and Karl actually letting higher authorities investigate the situation
It's so interesting comparing Muta and Karl's reaction after Jirard first drops off. Muta seems almost disturbed and moved by a clearly distraught Jirard, but Karl sees right through it immediately.
muta was seeing through the eyes of a fan. and someone with empathy. but you cannot have those things in the face of injustice. this is how atrocities are carried out. it's why the two police in my home city of minneapolis just allowed chauvin to kneel on a clearly overdosing and panicked man's neck for that long. they had no spine and were protecting their friend.
@@FEBRIZIOtv This is a totally bonkers comparison. Jirard's actions are very shitty. Absolutely, undoubtedly shitty behavior on his part, but comparing him to a "man" kneeling on another's neck until death is ridiculous. Murderers should never so easily be mixed in with non violent acts.
28:38 Jirard being upset at the thought of the money going to some big organisation to cover expenses and not doing anything useful is gut-busting hilarious.
Jirard: "we couldn't find any charities that wouldn't take money off the top for their expenses, that's why we didn't donate." Jirard (each year): "so let's take a little money off the top, we have expenses.."
Insane that every time he wants to talk about "doing right" it's almost solely for his reputation and not for the thousands of people who donated funds.
@@VCV95Same man, my mom passed away almost 3 years ago and people would make “mom” jokes to me and I would just laugh and joke with them lol I understand everyone is different, but this guy uses it way too damn much to try and seek pity.
This whole thing could've just been a short scandalous smear on Jirard's admittedly strong career, but instead, by threatening legal action (never threaten it, just sue if you think there is a crime being committed) he instead spilled his whole can of worms, revealing himself to be so obviously manipulative and two-faced. Now we know who Jirard is, a combative, dodgy, dishonest person.
He literally could have just donated the money same day this call happened, pushed out a video explaining the situation and he's shutting down the open hand foundation going forward. And Karl and muta probably would have just ended things there...but jarard is too much of a egotistical person to do that. Dude doesn't seem capable of taking a loss without bringing up his dead mom, or trying to manipulate the whole thing to make him the absolute victim.
Yeah, it really does seem like he wanted to give Jirard the chance to resolve it at his own discretion but alas he responded like a 6 year old and further condemned himself and his family.
well you'd be terrified, no matter whether you are lying or not, it's like saying you look nervous in an interrogation room, you must be guilty, you're not really understanding how humans work under pressure, guilty or not you'll fold if pressured long enough.
@@kamitoringsYou are absolutely right. However, what the original commenter meant (I think) is that since we definitely know he's lying, him being worried about his reputation is very telling of his character. It's not that (I hope not) people believe that he's lying simply for being nervous. No, a mountaintop of evidence proves his guilt. His desperate attempt to gag Karl and Muta is just disgusting given the facts.
I agree. To me it seemed like Jirard thought he could "sob story" his way out of them making the videos. When they said they were going through with it, he gave up.
At that point he's already thinking strategically, it's clear for him that only the truth would be acceptable for Karl and Muta, and for many reasons he's not ready to disclose the truth behind it all, so he's already thinking about how he'll deal when their videos come out. Just look at how he even asks for a specific timeframe.
Muta this might be the best work you've ever done. Really impressed with how you two dug into this and fairly assessed the situations. One thing i wish you guys had called out on this call is, kept asking how to make it right with you and i think he needed to be set straight that he needs to make it right with the donators and his audience, not you guys. It really sounds like he was just asking how to make it all go away.
I was genuinely waiting for the moment he was gonna come back on this idea of offering them money for their silence. the simple fact he mentionned it makes him sound quite evil. You can tell in the way he speaks that he'd do anything to make it go away, I'm sure it was burning him.
I think I would act like Muta in this situation - knowing you're in the right, but trying to find a silver lining and constantly second guessing every step to make sure it's all correct. But we have absolute legend Karl, just sure about what's happening, and compromising nothing. Just being competent with confidence. These two guys are incredible.
He was testing the waters, to see what would catch. He tried money, wording it very carefully of course, to actually include the word "NOT" in there, but meaning the opposite of course. He tried guilt tripping them using motives such as family, other people under his care, himself and his public image, even offered them that he would simply walk away from everything, but they never fell for any of it. He could not simply ask them directly, so this indirect way of offering them a way not to come out with a video is very preceptible, at least for me it was, clear as day
He definitely was. You can tell because he keeps bringing it up, as if it somehow ISN'T an attempt at bribing just because he says it isn't. When he kept asking them what he should do going forward to avoid any sort of backlash, how this would ruin his image, he wasn't asking Muta and Karl for advice, he was asking what THEY wanted to make this all go away. That's why he sounds COMPLETELY UNINTERESTED when they advise him on what the next thing to do to make it right would be. Because he knows what he needs to do to make it right, he just doesn't care at all. You can tell by the tone in his voice that he doesn't CARE what they thing is the right thing to do, he wants to know what he should do to shut them up.
"I'm not trying to be like do you guys want money..." is such a dementedly criminal thing for Jirard to say because there was LITERALLY nothing Muta or Karl said to prompt that. Jirard just whipped that out, courtesy of nothing, clearly trying to dangle it as a possibility to see if it'd take. The dude is a f ucking criminal.
It really gives away his mindset in this. It's all a numbers game to him, if Muta and Karl are going after him it must be because they want money by turning the "drama" (as he calls it) into content. If he offers them money, he can just give them enough to compensate for the ad revenue and then they won't have to make it public. He doesn't seem to believe this is a serious issue, and that the only reason they'd ever want to make him look like a bad person is because they want money. Everything is about who makes more money to him, which has troubling implications in a case of potential charity fraud.
It's a lot easier to puff your chest and act tough when you aren't actually directly talking to the people you're addressing and don't have to deal with their responses in real time.
Funny how you guys still gave him the chance to do things right and what he does? Threatens to sue. 😂 No matter how many examples there are out there of TH-camrs having the chance to redeem themselves and failing, it seems no one learns.
@@kina8575 Considering a lot of his fans went on to defend him and instead attacked Karl and Muta for being "drama youtubers", Jirard was probably confident that his response video would undo any damage to his reputation. His threat of taking legal action against them was probably an attempt to have his audience turn against Karl and Muta.
I like how Jirard's tone about the subject completely changed from his original "woe is me" demeanor when they said they weren't being quiet about it. The multiple indifferent "sure" as his response after the fact just illustrate he's pissed he couldn't snow them over with a pity party.
When jirard heard muta that this will make a story no matter what he does. His demeanor just change from begging to sure. How narcissist Jirard really is.
I'm actually glad that Muta got Karl into this, because I could tell he needed to have someone like that involved in this investigation and this call proved it. Seeing Muta feeling sympathetic and Karl immediately reminding him what's involved.
This conversation just makes Jirards response video even more of a head scratcher. Mutahar had a very reasonable take saying "while what happened wasn't right, the money is still there and can ultimately go to helping people." He also mentioned that the situation can be amended as long as this happens. But then Jirard makes a horrible "apology" video that's more about attacking his detractors than admitting mistakes and giving the full honest story.
I swear his "im sorry *you* felt mislead by my statements" trying to gaslight people into thinking his statements didnt outright directly state he made donations, or that its an unreasonable assumption that a CHARITY wouldnt just SIT ON MONEY for over a decade, that whole "apology" is the worst part of all of this. If he had just made the donation, owned up to lying and his other mistakes, that would be that. At least as far as the public is concerned, frankly I dont give a rats butt what that would mean for him legally.
@@Yipper64 I don't think it was gaslighting. I think a lawyer probably told him to say that. Lawyers give horrible PR tips for TH-cam. I think a lawyer probably told him to say this to cover him from lawsuits. It was a horrible response though.
It may be that the Open Hand Situation isn‘t the worst thing about this. The golf tournament with its major sponsors may be a much bigger thing. They may want to use this scandal to minimise the golf part? I would expect that the golf tournament has brought in much more money than Indieland and the gaming side. Maybe that (and the father) dictated how Jirard reacted.
he really did, even the "how much would it cost...what would it take....oh you guys are seriously gonna make this public?" yes. Silence. Its why he ended his response video by puffing his chest out all cave man like and threatening lawsuits. All he had to do was say "Yes, we didnt send the money. I fucked up. I cant even begin to apologise enough. I failed my community, i failed you guys. Here's the print out of the transfer made yesterday. I'm standing down as chairman of the foundation and taking a break. Im sorry guys, i failed you"
Just heard "I just want the money to go in the right spot" yikes like it MIGHT not be what he's doing but at this point I wouldn't even put it past him, especially since he knows he's being recorded. What a blessing his true nature is being exposed but what a shame that this is what it is
@@AzguardMikeif what you described had happened instead of what did, I think we’d be in a much better place. I’ve been watching Jirard’s videos for years now, I don’t want to see this unfolding the way it is, but… it is. I was waiting to see what his response would be, hoping that it’d be like this and things could move on eventually. Not really moving in that direction right now though. :/
but it did work. They ended up pitying him even thought they did not accept the bribery itself. But if anything, it should be a red flag for them to look deeper. Perhaps Karl did so. Good thing that both Karl and Muda were there. Since they are so different and don't know each other enough, one of them might be temped by the offer itself. Tho I think taking a piece of the charity money can be used against them too.
Jirard dragged Jontron and ProJared without hesitation to deflect from his own issues. Supposed friends of his at least at one time. Pretty fucked if you ask me
The worst part is they gave him a fucking out. They gave him a glidepath to recovery and instead he decided to fuck it all up. He gets everything coming to him. I hope he and his family get prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.
I'm confused he was already commiting charity fraud and the numbers didn't add up, how he got out? Would Karl and Muta just stop reporting and they hide his crimes? He was fucked from the start the only difference is he made it worse but the evidence was already out there.
@@megarotom1590 Donating is not just a "click here" and done thing in this case. Pretty sure he donated as quickly as possible. ANd even that would not have changed anything. He lied, at least as we factually know it from his own statement, this year about where the money goes. He could've used Indiland 2023 to say "hey guys, I found out about the money, we are still raising money and are looking for a beneficiary asap, but we wanted to restrict it. I only learned about the money still being with us a year ago." That's the only thing that could've saved him....or not talking to Muta and Karl and opening up about for how long he knew about it.
I severely doubt an audit will reveal the money was in that account the entire time. The whole story does not make sense, at all. And the fact that Jirard keeps trying to deflect from embezzling tax scamming, despite Karl and Muta's continued insistence that that is not what they suspect, speaks volumes.
yeah same. something does not smell right at all. it also looks like jirard is woefully uneducated about how accounting in a charity org works. he seemed to not at all understand what karl was asking him about how revenue and expenses from indieland (run by a wholly separate entity from the charity) would have to be reflected on a balance sheet. the people running the foundation are in way over their heads.
- Also stated he knew and was waiting for the right charity to donate the money to, thus contradicting his own "I didn't know the money wasn't being donated." statement.
The call is so damning. Jirard is so screwed. It’s funny because Muta and Karl didn’t even want to release this audio, but Jirard forced their hands. Thank you so much for sharing the truth.
and seems like they even did him a favor by not releasing the beginning of this call that probably has info about the personal in-fighting between Jirard and his family.
@@TheBlueGoldenHawkhonestly, part of me thinks that infighting is what has jirard doing this legal action crap, like he doesn't want to go against his family for some reason, but yeah, this is all nasty stuff
Yes, Jirad is so Dumb they got his ass now.
How did he force their hand?
thats wrong, they were going to release it no matter what happened.
Jirard legit hurt himself in his confusion. Karl and Muta gave him a chance to clean this up honorably, instead he threatened to sue them, forcing their hand on sharing the truly damning stuff.
If they only made the first videos that's what would have happened. But in the second videos that alleged that Jirard is a crook even though the money was already donated by then, which is the only reason why he threatened legal action.
@@amiiboacid4785 You're not seriously still trying to defend Jirard are you? There is no defense for any of this.
@@MatsThyWit Yes, I am defending him. I do not believe the actions committed by him and Open Hand were illegal. Alleging that what he did is illegal may be slander. The courts will decide this. If Karl never said that he's a fraudster and let the audit process happen, he wouldn't be fearing another lawsuit right now.
@@amiiboacid4785 There's is already plenty of evidence out there proving that charity fraud occurred, so that's not slander
"Gave him a chance", no, they were always after him, they wanted to farm and they did.
For someone who had no idea where the money was going, Jirard knows pretty much everything about where the money was going
I don’t know where this money was going, but the gun at my head says it definitely wasn’t used illegally.
Greed is one helluva of a drug
That's the thing too. He is literally on the OHF board along with his family. He is SUPPOSE to know about the money being a board member. It's amazing he's trying to downplay that.
The Schrodinger's Charity Funds of Jirard.
Jirard is like the culprit in Phoenix Wright games who gradually becomes more unhinged on the stand as their mask slips
Bro… someone should put the ace Attorney ost over this. Lmao
His freak out animation is his response video, threatening to sue the court.
Someone needs to animate this call in the games style.
I mean, anyone would with this kind of pressure lol
Absolutely brilliant.
Uploading the call itself with no additional commentary is some of the most based shit you could do. Much appreciated 👍🏾
agreed. Now the truth is actually out there and his simps can't play it off bc lack of context, he got caught in more lies and his true colors are on full display.
Homie started talking like DSP lol. You can feel the desperation grow as the call goes on and then he winds up in near perfect DSP cadence, it's uncanny.
No sympathies when he threatens to sue them
It’s nuts that after this 100% reasonable and amicable call, Jirard threatened to sue them.
Something tells me that his family played a big part in this. Of course, that does not absolve him. His family knew about all of these and they were working with him. so I assume they pressured him into that foolish, foolish response. Which ironically removed all doubt.
Don't forget the random throw away line about not being involved with the golf stuff.....
@@pilgrimspromise1132 Yeah that was suspicious. I think that was his justification for why he only donated as much as indieland made, and not the golf money. But it seems he completely fumbled that tactic because Muta and Karl didnt even find out about that when they where doing the call.
As Karl pointed out in the segment when Jirard's phone died, there was a lot of guilt tripping in this call. The purpose on Jirard's side was to see if he could get it hidden without legal action. It was fairly effective on Muta, and I suspect he'd have succeeded in getting this hidden if not for the ferocity of Karl, it's honestly a lucky break they interviewed him together. Legal action would have been more effective against Karl if he didn't perform the due diligence of taking Jirard's statement, which he stated he was planning on uploading without speaking to Jirard, and I think it's within the realm of possibility that Muta would've folded in sympathy if Karl didn't help to ground him in those moments.
@@pilgrimspromise1132- That was super spot on trying to distance himself from a crime he is well aware of.
Jirard: please don't drag my family into it
Also Jirard: constantly deflects using his family
which timestamp was the part where jirard said "please don't drag my family into it" I didn't catch it-
@@Aeternum_Zephyria not verbatim, based on 43:03
@@Aeternum_ZephyriaHe goes ‘I have 20 mouths to feed’ implying that going after him would be immoral basically
@@cagejones7757 something feels up considering the tone of how he said that. either way, so far the whole thing really felt like Jirard scrambling to save his self-image and no longer for his mother. whatever I said may be up to speculation but hey, that's my opinion.
@@Aeternum_Zephyria I think in this call he is earnest and honest. His brother or father likely are the ones mismanaging the money the most. But in his response video he is super angry and the decision to sue wasn't made by him alone but together with the rest of the family. He read a script and it's clear it isn't the same Jirad speaking there as it is here.
Karl did a good job keeping Muta on track and staying objective.
Objective
Right
Thats what we call being a "bad actor" now.
Not giving the benefit of the doubt when you have no actual proof on what they are refering to is what we call "being objective". I bet he has spycameras in the houses of the Jirard family thats how he knows that what he "corrects" muta on is true.
Muta is clearly an empath, he didn't want to do this. Karl isn't - which isn't a bad thing, it's just his personality type. It makes for a nice good cop/bad cop thing though haha
Something tells me jirard didn't inform his attorneys that this voice call existed.
Not even Better Call Saul could fix this
Not even Alan Shore (From Boston Legal) with his not exactly legal methods could fix this mess.@@goldensaiyan4
Him being the manipulator he is, that's probably right...he probably went to his lawyers and was like "these guys are accusing me of financial crimes make it go away *whaaaaaaaa*"
Ya, this was a huge mistake. Being involved in your own outing is just braindead. Never self snitch, no matter what.
He for sure informed them of his moms death tho.
Muta: there’s still a silver lining here
Karl: peace was never an option
Karl and Muta: No one is saying you're embezzling.
Jirard: They accused me of embezzlement.
To be fair, by the time Jirard said that they sort of had with their second round of videos suggesting money was missing.
@@Turbovolverwhich makes it all the more hilarious that he admits to embezzling in that very same video
@@Turbovolver Muta says he's not accusing him of embezzlement, but you can see on the foundation's tax filings that they have $10k+ in expenses at times despite Jirard saying 100% of the donations would go to charity. Whether you embezzled 10% or 100% of the donations doesn't change that, but Jirard was trying to make it sound like they'd accused him of 100% to make their allegations seem overstated/exaggerated or just take away from their credibility. On the other hand, I can understand why Jirard was nervous about things being misrepresented. I think Karl did a really good job of clarifying what happened, what was wrong, and why it was wrong, but people still seem to think the money was laundered or that he spent it on the 3DS eShop or whatever. So, Jirard was sort of right in assuming the internet would assume the worst of him, but also you kind of open yourself up to those assumptions when you commit fraud and embezzle money.
Karl and Muta have been good about not saying the embezzling word because they don't have any direct proof that Jirard or one of his family members were embezzling any funds.
They did a good job sticking to claims they have backing of evidence for it. Though Karl in his response video, did make the claim that Jirard was essentially embezzling funds (though not outright), but that's only because Jirard admitted to it using the funds in essentially that way in his video.
In all likelihood, there's a good chance that the money from the golf tournament was stolen. They just don't have any proof it was so they're avoiding saying it was, only saying that it's suspicious and the math doesn't math.
@@Turbovolverbecause money was missing. It still is. At least 60k in donations and who knows how much else due to the tournaments.
I love the silence and complete tonal change from Jirard at 33:55 when he got confirmation that Muta and Karl are going public with this. This is the exact moment Jirard knew for a fact that it’s all over.
Jirard should have known this revelation was going to happen EVENTUALLY. The tax filings are public, it was only a matter of time before people found out. Thankfully it didn't take ANOTHER 10yrs, but really Jirard should've known this shit was coming. No sympathy for his situation
Indeed, reminds me of the nuclear bomb scene from Oppenheimer.
Hes afraid of the cancel culture
@@mathieul4303it has nothing to do with cancel culture. We’re talking real world illegal stuff here.
@@ExWifeHaver287 The legal stuff is objectively more important, but a person like Jirard seems like he's worried about his image more than anything.
He knows he's on the other side of Cancel Culture now and that he can't dig himself out of it.
Man this should have come out first. Muta is so kind and empathetic while Karl is straight ruthless lol
muta and carl make a great good cop bad cop duo
And we can see what being "empathetic" to this guy accomplished. Karl was right.
Muta cares, Karl is a gangster lol
@@ZetaCancri Yeah I came out of this with so much more respect for Muta. He just came off so maniacal in some of his videos I thought he'd be just as stone cold. He's still human. I am flat on Karl, he behaved exactly as I expected lol. Dude's seen some shit and built up a good callous over the years.
I respect Muta more, although he may have gone a little too far in his accusations in the 3rd video about the golf money and in the video after Jirard’s response, he did his best research and wanted a net positive, but he should have waited for higher authorities to investigate the situation. He still did a good job. Karl on the other hand is a monster with his last video, he assumed the absolute worst and didn’t give Jirard time to turn this around, indirectly hurting his rep despite Jirard willing to cooperate with an audit and admitting to lying and irresponsibility. And now a ton of people dogpile Jirard with cancel culture instead of giving constructive criticism. Jirard obviously needs to hold himself more accountable, he only did the bare minimum. Both sides are at fault to some extent.
Muta and Karl are the absolute perfect example of Good cop and Bad cop and they make a fantastic duo.
Waiting for the inevitable anime adaptation
And you'll never guess who's the bad cop and good cop based on their appearance
@@rahyansuryaramadhan7082what do you mean?
@@itsbeebabyhe means that if going off looks alone Muta is very hairy and looks like a stereotypical muscular hairy man that’s aggressive lol and Karl os the opposite
@@catnip202xch. Karl is like Holden Ford in "Mindhunter" ;)
we should take a shot every time jirard mentions his mom
Alcohol poisoning has entered the chat
My liver would prefer we don’t do that
I don't even have enough spicy ramen to combat the hangovers
We would be killed.
Speedruning liver failure
Karl's "Hey Jirard!" warning to Muta was so funny when Jirard came back into the call, lmao.
Yeah, i was like "did you not hear the someone has joined sound of discord" 😅
Timestamp?
Timestamp? 😊
Timestamp is 12:36, you can hear the discord sound at around 12:32
It's honestly so incredibly impressive how objective and professional Karl is able to be and how seemingly effortlessly he's able to keep his emotions out of his work.
Yea but he's not a good interrogator. He kinda made jirad guarded right off the bat, instead of easing him into telling the full truth
@@dr.wolfstar1765actually causing people to be on guard is far better and in this caused Jirard to take a definite stance where either he stands his ground or falls which has lead to the investigation to go further without any confusion on what Jirard mean't. And especially in this scenario if Jirard didn't know what was up right away he could have easily backed out saying it was a misunderstanding in a casual conversation which would have made things tougher for further investigation.
That’s what happens when you deal with shitty people all the time lol
He's seen some stuff. Calloused and embittered after years of exposure.
him and muta have a good cop bad cop type of dynamic throughout this call. kind of interesting.
Hope the lawsuit threat was worth it jirard.
So far from what I’m hearing is he is being heavily manipulative, has that crying tone but not actually crying and is trying to get them not to make the video as it will destroy his career, just a straight guilt trip.
Muta sounded really conflicted by it but Karl wasn’t buying it and neither was going to back down but you can tell in the first couple videos that they treated him with such kid gloves and for him to change his tune from this apologetic sniveling to threatening lawsuits and saying he did nothing wrong shows it’s all an act.
Dude. For real.
For context, Karl's mum had just died (he talks about it on Twitter so I'm not spreading private news)
So Karl was probably in a bitter mood and not taking Kindly to Jirard constantly bringing up his dead mom as a defense for what looks like fraud
He won't file a lawsuit. He would have to disclose all the documents concerning his charity in order to prove they are wrong.
Muta isn't really a journalist. He's a sensationalist drama-tuber. His presentation is usually riddled with digs, humor and overall very subjective bias. NOT TO DISREGARD his efforts in this, I'm sure he was integral. However Karl IS a journalist. He presents all of his findings as objectively and factual as he can. His goal is TRUTH, and while he makes jabs, and jokes here and there... the BULK of his content could be written as an article and read extremely professionally.
So Karl was never going to give him the benefit of the doubt. He means business when he is investigating things.
considering Karl's mum died and he got PISSED during his video, more likely he knows deep down Jirard was using his dead mom to shield himself
I'm listening to this call now, and it is incredibly damning.
The fact that Jirard even mentioned embezzlement or tax evasion in his response video honestly blows my mind. Multiple times throughout the call Jirard says, "there's no embezzlement" and Karl literally cuts him off and says, "yeah no one is insinuating that".
It's obvious that Jirard got on the call to try and guilt trip Karl and Muta to not make videos because it was for a good cause in honor of his late mother. I mean he goes on a tangents throughout the whole call about the mouths to feed, how it's going to end him, and how he's just going to walk away. But the craziest thing is the tone change after he asks this question. Muta talks about how he is now uncomfortable with all TH-camr charities, Karl and Muta offer some sympathy saying it's not a simple situation, then Jirard responds with:
"I take it you guys are deadset on making pieces about this?"
And when they say yeah, the tone complete tone change Jirard has is incredible. He gets really quite, and says, "I guess that's it, I guess that's all she wrote" And you can just hear the absolute deflation in his voice. It feels like he's saying this both for the call, and for his channel, his career, Indieland, everything.
Later Karl says, "If you're going to make another comment, make it more honest"
Which we know that was not done.
The "Any other fundraiser whether private or public I have nothing to do with" comment seems to come completely out of left field. And honestly, had it not been for this comment, I'm not sure Karl and Muta would've been as quick to look into the golf event.
Towards the end of the video Jirard asks, "Do you guys have a timeline of when the videos will come out" so he can evaluate how much time he has to "force" the organization to donate the money (then followed up by some useless stuff about how he's walking away from everything). They don't give him a definite answer, but he then waited more than 2 weeks to make any donation.
I'm glad Karl and Muta released this whole call because this really does paint a bigger picture, and is just more nails in Jirard's already buried coffin. Why he chose to say the things in his response video that he did make no sense. They tell him to be honest, make the donation, and you might be able to walk away. He does not do this, and threatens these two with lawsuits after they offer him sympathy in the call. Jirards true colors have been shown, and they're 50 shades of a manipulating liar.
Very well said. It's extremely telling how often he brings up random things out of nowhere, it's because he's thinking about those things. Also he appears to keep dropping hints at bribing them into silence. Plus the fear turned despair in his voice. It all reeks of waaaay more going on behind the scenes than just what we know.
The more Jirard mentioned embezzlement while no one else did (at least until Karl's latest video where he describes a situation as textbook embezzlement, long after this convo and Jirard's response) makes me wonder more and more if it's embezzlement.
It's like in a missing person case, when cops are just asking basic questions, like what mood the person was in or if they had any troubles ect. And the person they're asking goes "I didn't do anything to them". Or in a case of murder, someone is just being asked about the victim's life and they go "I had nothing to do with it" when that option wasn't even on the table...
This call recontextulised the entire response video.
This was fantastically put. The whole reason Jirard made this call, was to convince the 2 guys not to make a video. that's all he cared about. they kept on telling him what he could to do to make It right, And what Gerard really wanted to say was "tell me what I should do to make it right so that you won't post this video" While he never outright said "don't make a video", he strongly implied it and kept on asking about it. I feel like if he wouldn't have made this call, He wouldn't be in such a big hole. I'm surprised his lawyers didn't intervene and say. "Don't make this call."
His tone changed quickly in a matter of days. From a shaky, scared voice, that doesn't know what to do, to a angry man who's gonna "defend" his family's name. It's so obvious he's guilty.
Exactly. His question "so i take it that you're going to make a piece on this" (not exact quote since i have bad memory but something like that) is proof that he was hoping to convince them not to make a video on it.
I'm sure his lawyer was like, why the heck did you go on a recorded call 😂
This call proves you and Karl went incredibly easy on and kind to him. You gave him the time, space and courtesy to respond and make amends the best way possible. You were more than fair in your reporting of this. Truly classy handling of the situation guys. Too bad Jirard went the total opposite route and let his ego and a shit lawyer tank his career. If he had handled it better I think his channel would have survived. But after his response and all of this call coming out I think he’s done.
True gentlemen
Nah, if Logan Paul can scam his fans back to back, and they still give him millions of views.
Jirad should be fine aslong as he continues to provide good quality videos.
that's what really depresses me. @@axelmok498
@@axelmok498uh... no, those aren't even close to being equivalents. Logan Paul is a much bigger TH-camr with a following that is primarily younger. They'll continue to watch him because they're obvious to his scam BS or simply don't care. He can handle losing millions of subs. Jirard's audience is much different and while I think he absolutely could come back from this... how he chose to handle the situation will make that much more difficult.
tbh, I don't think there's any version of this playing out where Jirard could have kept the bulk of his channel and followers. Even if he came clean to everything and apologized immediately, he still committed charity fraud for a decade. That's not a "Oh, everyone makes mistakes" kinda thing, that's a "This guy tried to steal exorbitant amounts of charity money and he is absolute scum that can never be trusted ever again" kinda thing.
Jirard would not last a single second in court without mentioning his mom
He'd try to make eye contact with the jurors, too. He seems like the typa weasel to think the jury will eat up his sob story.
“You see your honor, my mom….” He can last four words anyway lolol
emotional appeal is a legitimate strategy in court, so yea he would mention his mom because it would be pretty important in this situation.
Jirard is the kind of person who would walk into a store, stuff products into his coat and try to leave, and when the security guard tries to stop him he runs outside shouting "but my mom died"
@@demifolk8940Yeah. Luckily people can now see through how manipulative, deflective and disgusting Jirard is by using his mom's name like this.
You guys went so easy on him with the parts you included of the call in the original videos honestly, crazy that he tried to threaten you AFTER this
and people said those were just the bad parts, turns out they were actually the good parts
They tried to give him a chance. But his ‘Apology’ had them drop the nukes.
They gave him softball questions and he couldn't hit them. Just immediately went to defense.
It is wild. They were honestly such gentlemen about it originally
Again, again, again:
As someone who has worked with several charities, both local and national, it is nowhere near as hard to make restricted donations, ESPECIALLY when you are in a partnership with them, as Jirard has claimed. Zero due diligence was done by Open Hand.
In addition, no charity is ever going to tell you that tens of thousands to hundreds of thousands of dollars going towards their cause is going to waste.
1. That's absurd.
2. It won't.
It's so strange that Jirard expected people to believe that they offered donations to these charities but they replied, "no, that's not enough to matter." What charity would ever do that?
I wouldn't say NO charity would do that, there are some charities with absurd overhead... A certain charity in the EU got in trouble for having more than 90% overhead costs, because most of their funds went back into advertising campaigns and hiring people to go door by door (and a large payout for the CEO to boot for doing a good job with "record donations"). They were honest about it to their partners, but misrepresented it to the public. They justified it as "it helps us raise more", and apparently the companies that partnered with them (and got tax cuts from it) either bought into it or didn't care...
But yea, in general, it would be hard to find a charity that bad, let alone not find any charity that's better.
Bro was like 600k+ is not enough lol what a 🤡
Yeah on that second point I have only ever heard the opposite of what Jirard claims, virtually every charity will scream from the top of their lungs *"EVERY DOLLAR COUNTS!"*
Literally never heard of an organization that was "Meh, don't bother we only want big donations."
Exactly, it's such a illogical response that I wonder if he put his trust in someone from his family, and they fucked all this up. And he's trying to cover for them?
I gained a ton of respect for Karl after hearing this. Manipulators will try to tug at your heart strings, but Karl wasn’t having it. That’s called covering a story objectively.
eh, he wasnt really being objective, but compared to most journalists, yeah, pretty good.
@@kamitoringsOr maybe that's exactly what objective means but our view of "objective" got hijacked by people often having ulterior motives for selfish reasons we simply forgot it's about telling facts and letting viewer decide?
That was not objective lmao he hates jirard. He assumed jirard is the same as billy mitchell or other scam artists and never gave him a single benefit of the doubt, particularly when there’s not a real answer pending having to take more time than a discord call to go over all the numbers and accounts and the times Jirard personally funded IndieLand and when they used funds to cover costs, which according to Jirard were small costs compared to what they were raising.
I gave karl some shit about an ad. After hearing this. I deleted the comment and fully support him. Holyshit. Big respect to him and muta.
@@EndorphinSauce You realize that Completionist never shown any receipt about him personally financing anything, so that is just another "believe me bro" from him? I don't know how much more objective can you be if what you say actually ends up being correct.
The dead silence when both and Karl and Muta say yea were going to go public with this.
what minute
@@henveee 2:34? I don't hear that there.
@@FoolsJourney4 near the end, prob 40-something
@@MagicCookieGaming neither do i
It’s about 42 minutes.
I just lost my grandmother to vascular dementia and it angers me to hear Jirard saying he doesn't want it going to anything "useless" when the end of life care is just as important as finding a cure. The end stages of dementia are so scary for the person going through it and making that experience as smooth as possible makes a world of difference for the families affected. I'd rather see people like my grandmother getting help from that money than seeing Jirards hip pocket being the main beneficiary.
And also to peoples paycheck, like OPEN HAND HAD PAYCHECKS TOO DESPITE NOT EVEN BEING A FUNCTIONING CHARITY!! At least if they initially donated it, it couldve gone to doctors paychecks rather than whatever they used it for. His concept of what is and isnt useful isn't applicable when the money he's donating isnt his. If YOU think your donation wont make a difference, fine, don't donate, but that doesn't give you the right to hold on to OTHER PEOPLES donations.
Literally almost, if not every expense for organizations researching a disease are important. Paychecks keep doctors, nurses, and researchers working there, fed, and healthy enough to keep working. End of life care keeps those at the end stages as comfortable as possible. The research helps to find out more about the disease and possibly find a cure. Everything is important. You may want to donate to one specific part, which is fine, but that doesn't make any other part any less important.
@@sinfulpuritan3430 exactly, he may not like "some nurse" getting a salary for providing hospice, but that nurse could provide some alternative care suggested from the family, and if it helps the patient, a case study can open the doors for new avenues of treatment. It's sickening how he just keeps jumping to the most plausible excuses without ever directly admitting guilt for what he knows he did wrong.
It's even worse than that because he stated many times that the money was directly helping with family support, EoL care, etc.
My papal has Deminta & is now living in a nursing home because we can't take care of him, we visit him weekly, so he doesn't forget us he it hurts me that the charity money didn't go anywhere while I didn't donate personally. I am sorry to the victims who Donated it is never ok to commit Fraud. I hope he can learn from this. He can be redeemed eventually but it hurts me seeing how it affects others.
I know this was in the first video but it still baffles me how this man can say “we haven’t found a benefactor we are completely happy with” but felt completely happy name dropping organizations that would get people to donate. Every time I hear it I just shake my head man.
Jirad mentions he wanted someone who can come on and talk about what the money is doing. There are plenty of charities worth the donation but one that you can use to promote your organization are probably non-existent
And "finding" a worthy charity almost immediately after this call after 10 years of "searching".
"I was made aware in 2022 that the money hadn't been moved yet... That's not fucking cool," Really? It's not cool? But wait, I thought this was the plan all along? According to Jirard, the plan was always to look for a great charity and then donate it in one large lump sum. At least that's what he said in his latest, and allegedly last, response. So, which is it? Was he lying here about only finding out in 2022, or was he lying in his response about it always being the plan? Or, here's a twist, what if they're both lies? He knew long before 2022 that the money wasn't being donated, and he also wasn't planning on donating it to just one charity in one big payout.
Even so, he said that the money was being donated at Indieland this year. What he said both then and in this call confirmed him as a liar. Then we have the discrepancies with the golf tournament and so many more thanks to Jirard himself in that horrible apology video. I doubt he's going to see jail, but definitely going to be heavily fined by the government. Along with people like Jamie Lee Curtis who donated quite a bit of money to Open Hand. This is the beginning of a long legal battle Jirard and his family have set for themselves.
He clarifies later that it was his family's plan from the beginning, but he was not in on that plan. Even still, he's well aware that they were misleading people because (if one believes what he says in the call) he was misled himself. Regardless, he was continuing to mislead people after he became aware, so it really doesn't matter much.
He changed it from 21 to 22 very quickly as if to make it look not as bad
Jirard has also said in the past that his charity raises 600k PER YEAR. But he only just donated about that much in response to being called out. There's money missing, just going by his own words.
Things like this are why he really can't afford to sue Karl or Muta. All of this would become court record, and for him to prove they lied, he'd have to provide accurate records of all the money the Open Hand Foundation has ever received or spent in the last 10 years. That would pretty much make it a snap of the fingers to bust him for charity fraud.
I love how this call shows how reasonable Muta has been so far.
When Jirard threatened to sue, Muta became the embodiment of;
"You mistook my kindness for weakness!" *posts this*
@@gdizzzl Exposing someone for lying isn't a bad thing. They recorded the call probably in case something like this would happen and to keep facts straight. Remember, memory isn't infallible but recording are. Keep your receipts and you'll be covered for whenever you need them.
@@gdizzzl This is objectively an insane comment on more than a few levels. Lol
And no im not one of the weirdos claiming "embezzlement, he was planning on stealing it all" or some other bull that not even muta believes, whats supposed to be the take away from that comment anyways? we should not expose obvious wrong? any type of exposing is a nefarious plot? please it doesnt make sense
@@gdizzzlah yes what evil devils they are. How dare they call him out for charity fraud
@@gdizzzlthey literally told Jirard it was being recorded and Jirard decided to speak anyways. This is not a secret from the parties involved, and Jirard decided to hang himself with the rope that was meant to claw him out of the hole he dug. I'm excited to see whether the Completionist can "complete" his promise on litigation because I'm more interested in that
Trap card activated
Here’s the thing. You and Karl sound basically the same as you do in your videos, but the difference between how Jirard sounds on this call and how he sounds in his response video is enormous.
The way he repeatedly asks you what you want him to do and then pivots to, “Are you dead set on going with this?” just reeks of sleaze.
Thats what happens when you make a character / fake persona online (not saying its a bad thing, and most youtubers do it) just is what it is when you see behind the veil of these PG youtubers.
He realised he was backed into a corner and had no other option but to lash out like a rabid animal lol
Everything up to that point was manipulation, thinking he could flatter and guilt them into holding back. After they make it clear they're still running it, he turns into a pouting dejected child.
the way jirards brain works is really strange to a normalish person. like, they didn't create the issue, they're not coming to your house with baseball bats or something. anyone could at any day of the week by just pure chance break the story. only reason nobody did that is that not many people thought even to look for the filings because it's so blatantly stupid and dishonest what jirard did.
the issue wouldn't go away if muta and karl didn't make their videos. it could still happen any monday that boom it's out there in wider public. muta and karl knew that too! they knew that by sitting on the story waiting they were possibly losing the dibs on it. the issue would still always be there if he didn't address it and admit to lying pro-actively - just donating the money wouldn't change the years of filing that they didn't donate during those years.
weird that he spends 20+ minutes asking what they want him to do, in a call about them trying to find out why the money he raised for charity hasn't actually gone to any charity he said it has been for 10 years. real brain teaser as to what one could do to right that situation huh?
6:10 I love that he throws Projared under the bus, especially after Projared was one of the few people that blindly supported him on twitter when this all started to come out
Same though I don't blame Jared (kinda) given his controversy and how several people (including myself) blindly assumed he was a giant piece of crap for cheating and sending nudes to minors IIRC. Innocent til proven Guilty, is what some tried to do in this situation.
All Jirard had to do was simple. Just say "you're right, I've been irresponsible, I will look to donate everything in the account within the month." That's it. Accept his mistake, apologize for it, and make amends. Not worry about his image and try to convince people not to release the story.
Yep, that muta been the right thing. I karl believe he didn't
Except I think there might be something deeper with the family, either way he would have been just plan screwed.
@@Richforce1 i mean if he really was clever he could have turned the whole thing into more content for his channel. make a video coming clean, make videos having a call with several dementia charities, make a poll on twitter or something asking viewers which org they agreed with the most, make a video revealing he split the funds amongst all 3...
i think ethically turning this into content would be wrong, but if he really wanted to he could have spun this into a positive PR move.
@@Richforce1he could still play the family card, saying there's a lot he could not disclose right now as to why it took so long to donate, because of it being a family matter, he would only simply concede they were right and that he would make it a priority to get it donated right away, and tell them that in the future he would come clean and explain it in a video, again, maintaining they're right and that the most important thing is to get the money donated. It was indeed that simple
MrCharity Inc DBA Beast Philanthropy doesn't even have their 990 forms publicly available which is a red flag if I've ever seen one.
There are two positive things that came from this situation:
1. [SOME of] the money got donated.
2. Jirard isn't going anywhere near another charity.
Edit: Okay, there was only one positive thing. There's still a lot of money missing.
jirard shouldve stopped with number 1 and just made an apology video but noooooooooo. he felt like he needed to flex on karl and muta.
Some of the money got donated. A lot is stil missing.
@@Haarschmuckfachgeschafttadpolehe SAID SOME of the money got donated.
but his family still will be involved in charity.
3. jirard and some of his family might be going to prison
4. his frankly mediocre content will be reevaluated
Listening to the whole call you can tell that Muda and Karl were exceedingly generous when showing the original edits of this call. They were more than professional, they were sympathetic even. You don't see many journalists taking these steps to not make the person look terrible.
They aren't journalists, they're TH-camrs
@@charliekelly735what’s the difference?
@@charliekelly735those 2 things aren't mutually exclusive just fyi
@@charliekelly735 sure but what they're doing is by definition journalism
@@ImSidgr One of them you have to study at a school for and need a degree in. The other one is a career based around shilling sponsorships and getting involved in drama. Btw I'm not trying to defend Jirard's actions but the Karl and Mutahar dickriding needs to stop, especially after Muta's habit of DMCAing videos in the past.
All I heard from Jirard in this interview was "How can I escape this and look good". That tells you everything you need to know right there.
Jirard: keep the family stuff to a minimum
Also Jirard: but my mom...
Jirard : My mom and her spinal cord ...
pretty much "I want to keep my family out of this but my mom died."
The Completionist Story
Starring Vin Diesel as Jirard Khalil
No one:
Literally no one:
Jirard: LOOK AT THIS AUTOPSY REPORT!
The fact that he keeps bringing up his mum as like a sympathise card to feel bad for him is just ridiculous
Holy crap, Karl EVEN told him to donate it to ALL the organizations he promised the money was going to and he STILL only sent one lump sum to one of the charities.
I bet it was cos that WAS all the money LEFT lmao
@@Azazelea Jirard could have slit the $600K up between multiple charities. Jirarad could have done as Karl suggested and donate to all the charities mentioned in the fund raisers.
My theory of why he gave all the money to one charity is they figured out a way to get some sort of kickback from the charity. The charity he paid may hire a family member of the charity may hire Jirard to make them a video.
A lot of shady charities get money from the charity account to personal accounts by hiring family members as "consultants."
@ddegn I thought half his defence was you need a big donation to not be wasted? I feel 600k to one is way better then split where it would just sit in a different bank for another 10 years
@@Azazelea Perhaps not even left. $600k was probably what they could scrounge together in a short period of time. I'd be shocked if Jirard produces a bank statement from before the drama began showing $600k in an Open Hand account.
If you know his tweet fomr the past, Jirard said he makes 600k A YEAR... Which means millions of dollars worth of donations are missing.
I feel uncomfortable that Muta and Karl tried so hard to mouth feed Jirard a valid legal excuse for this problem, and yet this man had the audacity to basically spit in their face and say no I can feed my self and proceeds to make a mess.
"I can feed myself!" [Gives himself *food poisoning* ]
They were giving him the benefit of the doubt. Especially as he claimed the money was still there. It was better that the money was donated, and he owned up to his mistakes.
Instead, he donated some of the money. Lied about things in his response. And threatened to sue them over their proven allegations.
@@zenoblues7787 That's the thing. The allegations aren't "proven" as you say. They are alleging theft/embezzlement. Yet the funds were essentially untouched for 10 years. Save for a some administrative costs that made up a low %. All charities have administrative costs so that isn't proof of any crime or intent.
It's a fishy and complicated situation. Yes it's suspicious he held onto the funds and didn't donate them. Could have been planning to take it all for himself down the line. And he certainly lied about certain stuff. At the same time, if somebody is a thief and scammer....Leaving THAT big of an amount essentially untouched for 10 years takes A LOT of restraint. If someone was planning to steal it, why would they have waited all these years? Wouldn't they think after a year or two or three that nobody has caught on yet and start taking the money because they thought they were in the clear? It's hard to prove intent with certainty when the money was just sitting there. Had half of it been missing or something then the picture becomes much clearer. But it wasn't. It just sat there, but he lied about making donations. It's possible he was waiting for a sizeable amount to make a big "restricted" donation.
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.
@@ScribbleNuts never attribute malice what can be adequately explained by stupidity *the first time*.
My grandmother and my uncle died from dementia. So when this news broke out, it hit pretty close to home. Thank you both for covering this situation and bringing about change. It really means a lot to me, as I'm sure it does for many others.
Over half an hour of Jirard attempting to guilt trip Karl and Muta
Honestly I think it almost worked on Muta if Karl wasn't there to help ground him in the segment where Jirard's phone died
Jirard literally sounds like he's hyperventillating in panic over this.
Yeah, if I was in Jirard's shoes, I'd be in a panic too. Everything he had built over many years is now crumbling around him, that'd be terrifying to anyone really. Whatever he had built he won't be able to get back.
well yeah, he probably never expected anyone to actually look through his documents. If you were getting away with something (lets say an alleged crime) for an actual decade and two people pull up in your dms like 'we know what you did, we have proof and we're going public, this is just a curtesy' you would probably be in panic mode as well.
Dude spent a decade building a brand based around being a youtube G rated nice guy. He's absolutely screwed
@@TheEvilRayquaza That and he and the people involved with his charity could face prison time.
average reaction to play stupid games with stupid prizes
"The way you were saying that it made it seem like we were moving money around and it's not true." Bro literally no one said that. The way this man projects is insane. Hope he gets audited.
he should be in jail
@@hyperstimmed audit's gotta happen first
damn; Karl is so pragmatic. I'm not actually surprised, but seeing a non-scripted version of his persona is something else.
Yeah, pragmatic and professional, making sure there is an emotional disconnect to handle things fairly and balanced
True .. I love it
@CaleseCrowder86 Yeah 😅
Aussies have a very good "bullshit detector" and our way of handling highly emotional/stressful situations is the "she'll be right" mentality. Basically take things as they come and keep moving. It leads to an ability to look at things from a more objective or less emotional perspective.
@@jessbellis9510 This has nothing to do with Australians. Super weird insertion here.
Muta and Karl, you two are class. Muta hesitantly and empathetically saying that 600k+ will set it straight, Karl saying it doesn't matter. Both of them are saying it as honest as can be. You decide how you feel... Muta and Karl both spoke honestly. Respect
And they're both right.
The 600k gets the money into the right hands and Karl would agree when it comes to making it right to the organizations.
But to the public? We all know that unless Jirard outright apologizes for misleading the public, then he and the organization would be potentially found liable for charity fraud for making misleading statements, even after he found out on his own words.
Once that happened, Jirard individually lost all plausible deniability and has no choice but to "defend" himself or literally admit to alleged fraud by the textbook definition. He can't self incriminate but he lost ALL solace and any remaining credibility the second he said he will sue Muta (who never alleged anything other than charity fraud by the textbook definition and wisely chose specific If statements) and Karl did so as well.
In fact, watching their videos, they really only raises questions and it's reaffirmed in this call. And there is nothing illegal questioning. And Jirard self admits there were real clerical errors so an audit Is justified
Don't worry Muta, Jirard will take about a decade before he finds the right lawyer to file the lawsuit 😂
And pay in 10 years
lol nice one
Lmaoo, i'll give you an upvote at completionist speed
can you actually say something insightful instead and actually wait until more information from a legal professional is released? Obviously he lied and fucked up but he is ready for the audit and willing to cooperate. He still needs to do better and be more accountable. If he does come out innocent it will take a long time for him to earn our trust again. He should have done a better job at being transparent about where the money was going and if it was really donated. Too many people making comments like these dogpiling on him instead of actually giving constructive criticism. Keep in mind he had a very positive rep back then and never had any malicious intentions, with many developers and creators who know and respect him. At least some money got donated and some money was only put toward expenses to run the charity event, it could have been a lot worse (unless there is more information from legal professionals you can invalidate whatever I said)
@@theawesomeali8834 The Completionist is planning to sue Muta and Karl according to his video... Sorry but I don't see why OP has to hold back when Jirard himself isn't, legally. Practicing legal experts have looked at what's available and also concluded that Jirard has committed charity fraud in a documented way. Whether he had malicious intent or not is actually irrelevant when charged with charity fraud.
I lost both my aunt and my grandmother to two different forms of dementia. Even worse, by a cruel twist of fate, they were both affected at the same time. Grandma was old, and got hit with Alzheimers, and aunt got hit with FTD like Jirard's mom. It's remarkable and painful how different they are; Alzheimers taking memory first while leaving function largely intact, a perfectly normal-looking, sweet old lady who had no recognition in her eyes when she looked at me. FTD did the opposite, first taking away my aunt's ability to communicate, to care for herself, but leaving her memory for last; a woman who couldn't speak or go up even a single stair without help, but whose eyes lit up with joy every time she saw me, until the end.
A mother and daughter both slowly disappearing, their minds being eaten away from opposite ends while their family watched, helpless. I will never forget how it felt to watch them go. So I speak with some authority when I say that the way Jirard is using his mother as a tool of emotional manipulation and a shield against criticism? It makes me _sick._
Sorry you had to go through that. It's exceedingly frustrating to know that all this money didn't go to research because there are so many potential discoveries/treatments that could have been accelerated along with it.
Lost my grandad to ftd and had no idea it was dementia until the end because his memory wasn’t bad or anything. He just got increasingly violent, impulsive and irrational
You speak with authority? is that your definition? Cause you also seem to speak without human empathy. What a weird move to use your family members as a point of connection with someone in a similar situation, only to use it as a hall pass to pile on a guy… ball-less hypocrite.
@@vealchop2490what?
@@vealchop2490 This guy deserves all the piling on he's getting. Quit your grandstanding.
Goddamn Karl just going "I don't believe any of the bullshit this is straight up Jirard's fault," is WILD. Like Karl has an immovable moral compass and doesn't budge for any silver-tongued response.
When did he say that?
@@andrewjames7438 not a direct quote but Muta tried to offer up possible explanations and he shot down all of them.
@@franklinturtleton6525because the facts are all there. How do you bust your ass raising hundreds of thousands of dollars for years and not know where the money goes? Especially when he is so proud of this. He is a liar and that's it.
i respect that, he hears bullshit and shoots straight past it, he's straight up calling him out and in this case it works wonders.
I love the contrast between Karl and Mutah though.
Mutah is trying to make sense of it when there's no real good reason behind it.
then you got Karl who is like "yeah, no, he's lying it's very clear, fuck him" (not a literal quote)
you need someone who doesn't easily fall for bullshit, but you also need someone who can symphatise with someone.
@@DarkDyllon Honestly, though this experience has once again shown me to never meet your idols, I do admire both of them for their unique ways of looking at the situation. At the end of the day, they're both solid dudes, doing what they can to inform and educate the public, and I wish them the best... Presuming it doesn't come out that Karl's been hacking Goldeneye for the past 20 years or some nonsense.
Karl seeing through the bs emotional manipulation is insane. It's rough setting aside emotions to nail a story and he did it perfectly.
It’s very easy and if you have a modicum of discernment
@@BrainWasherAttendenti mean there are people saying that jihard was under duress in this call so there is that
Karl literally was not going for the bullsht at all. He knew the game Jirard was trying to play
Hind side is 20-20 eh? Also, who are you to claim that he wasn't honest and perfectly truthful in the call but realized that he had to weasel himself out of his truthful statements later?
It's always so annoying to read statements of ppl, who are unable to see more than their own opinionated opinion.
Karl didn't buy his emotions, because he was already angry about how he used his mother for all of it. So everyone stating "oh karl so rational bla bla" is just blind...he literally admits to this fact himself in his own video.
Mutar just sympathized with him, because of the family drama, knowing that his career might be over, and all of it not being entirely his fault.
It's just two people with two different opinions about the same person and situation..
You can tell Muta didn’t want to do any of this once he heard Jirads voice crack. It’s sad he wants to act like some kind of investigative journalist but be so chill about the person he’s investigating
Lmao Muta is a sympathetic dude and Karl is just a savage
The good old classic good cop bad cop
Muta wants to give him the benefit of the doubt and is isn't calling him on his lies. Karl is just sick of him lying and deceiving and he doesn't buy any of it. He even calls him on it pretty much every time.
Empathetic. Sympathy is more about understanding because you've been there yourself.
@@Althexia Wait, I thought it was the other way around??
That’s cuz Karl is more interested in spreading hate than revealing the truth. His intentions are bad regardless of the outcome.
Karl is just a despicable a person imo.
The fact that Muta and Karl gave him advice and Jirard turned on them with threats is insane!
They where going so easy on him too.
Hit dogs holler. Jirard is ungrateful AF because Karl and Muta were so classy about this initially.
In the end he wanted to clear everything up behind the scenes. What he TRULY cared about was his public image. As his public image is everything to him his money livelihood clout steaks you name it. To me what he was trying to do was insanely scummy. "Don't put this out it'll ruin me please." Then you shouldn't have done dirt to those that literally gave you THEIR money and livelihood.
@@AlexPerez-tt9ruGiving him softball questions. Every opportunity to save himself. Lol
what do you expect? of course his reputation is at stake, and Muta along with many others kept pressing further assuming the worst situation possible instead of giving him time to fix the situation and allowing for a legal investigation from the IRS, figure out what happened to the golf money, and be transparent with everything. Not trying to say muta’s research shouldn’t have happened, this situation needed to be brought to light. But other people went to dog pile on him instead of waiting for more information. If Jirard does turn out innocent, he still has a long way to go to earn our trust again and he needs to do better. He knows he lied but is ready for an audit so he can clear his name. Both sides here are at fault. Keep in mind money got donated and that is a net positive despite inflation, and money covered event expenses which is common, it could have been a lot worse. An audit and investigation would clear things up significantly.
This call proves how misplaced Jirards aggression was at the end of his response video. He for sure knows his career is over and was just lashing out which was such a childish move. It's very sad how he was someone who has seeming generated such a positive and prosperous space for indie developers while being the front for a foundation that lied about helping people who suffer from such a horrible disease.
It wasn't misplaced, it was actually really intentional. Re-watch Jirard's response after seeing this video. Now think of why he'd want to sue.
My bet is that it's classic attempt at a SLAPP suit, where a whistleblower rings a public alarm bell and exposes somebody's bad actions in a matter of public interest and the person turns around and tries to use legal threats or legal action to intimidate the whistleblower into being quiet on it. Should be noted that in most countries this is seen as blatant misuse and abuse of legal systems.
If you followed the CryptoZoo Coffeezilla saga, you'd recognize that move as the exact same one Logan Paul tried to pull in his response video.
The thing is his career probably wasn't over. There are people who got away with much worse but because he decided to pull this shit afterwards instead of just apologising and proving himself to people he made shit 1000 times worse and actually looks like a scumbag.
@@gyrthez246and that attitude isn’t working on either karl or muta, and besides, karl is already in the midst of being sued by billy mitchell. does jirard really think legal threats are going to scare karl?
He could've kept some sort of career had he just admitted he fucked up, donated the money and said that due to his irresponsible running of the charity, that he would pass it on to someone else more responsible. But no. He proved that it wasn't just irresponsibility and or lazyness that caused this. He really had ill intent in all of it.
@@sadsatan..I agree. If he handled his response video with integrity and humility he could have been fine over time and continued to have a career. Of course things would never be the same but it's better than nothing.
Jirard speedrunning "hero to villain story arc" like a pro.
He's not just speedrunning it, he's completing it, too
he completed the charity fraud section
The road to jail speed run any% lol
He’s “the nice guy” though.
gotta make sure he gets that plat trophy
When begging didn't work, Jirard threatened them with lawsuits. People who defend him are delusional at best.
call them out...BeatEmUps is the most disappointing youtuber to me because I actually enjoy his content and I thought he was a decent fellow but F that guy now
well he first tried to copyright strike the videos and when that failed they went silent for a bit then out came the threats and pity plee video. And then threats came from others in the family of legal action on reddit i believe. They could not have handled this any worse.
The people defending him are his way inclined deep down is why. Especially other 'content creator' types.
41:23 did anybody find it odd that he mentioned he has nothing to do with any open hand foundation stuff besides indieland? Like he knew to distance himself from the rest of the foundation
@@juancharley3203 he was part of the board according to his own response video.
For anyone who’s ever lived with liars, Jirad is hitting all the tell tell sings of someone who’s fibbing. Could be a lot of stuff or just some things, but he is acting very sus.
That was my thought as well.
A liar will give you reasons for why their lie isn't a lie. Someone telling the truth will simply tell the truth ... there's no "reason" for their truth when given.
Then the guilt trips and the changes in voice tone.
There's folks on TH-cam who do videos on how to spot a liar. This call would be great content for that.
@@orangejjay Yep, you got it. And side note I LOVE those types of videos. Especially when they are done regarding interrogations.
As for this dude, it’s so many things. The pressured speech. The over explaining. The shift of responsibility. The fact that he’s all over the place. I came into this situation pretty neutral on Jirard but hearing what I’ve heard, I don’t even care if it was a simple mistake. His response video was hard to watch. It was like watching a drowning man thrashing in water to stay alive. Except he only cares about himself and his personal crew. If he wanted to really make good on things, that video should have said “I messed up and I am sorry. I hope you can forgive me”…. and that’s it.
As much as I'm not a fan of the current reaction or muta/karl's actions in a lot of this... yeah, pretty much this comment 100%. I'd been wanting to hear this for a while and there is a lot of small details that could just be a guy under a lot of stress with internal family drama or someone scrambling like shit to come up with anything that sticks.
@@goblinarsonist Yeah, I don’t particularly love how Karl went about this either. The whole thing just feels like “gotcha” content. And he *could* just be feeling overwhelmed. Good money, though, says he lying about either some stuff or a lot.
@@leeartlee915 It's not surprising that it turned into a gotcha. They went extremely easy in their first videos, and look how it turned out--Jirard's supporters dug their heads in the sand and believed every attempted by Jirard to play innocent. Sometimes you have to rub people's nose in it for them to admit it's there.
I swear to god you can hear Jirard go through the 5 stages of grief in this call.
Pretty sure he went through bargaining at least twice.
It felt like a Five staged boss fight between them and Jirard. LOL
The only reason he took this call is because he was trying to convince them not to release the information. He clearly wanted to bribe them, but he could tell they weren't into it. He asked several times what he could do for them and told them how great they were and how well respected they were. He constantly reminded them how much damage it would do to him and other innocent people.
I wondered why he would take this call without a lawyer present, but after hearing the call, the reason he didn't have a lawyer present was because he was hoping to do something unscrupulous and he didn't want a lasting record. Here's a tip, never try to do something off the record with two reporters who are planning to do a story on you.
This was an attempt to bury the story.
@@justinmartin4407 Listening to the full recording on SOG's channel is very interesting. Both SOG and Jobst seem to be more open to this being a simple act of incompetence in the call, but between when Jirard drops out of the call and then re-enters the discussion, Karl really shows he's not buying it, and is mostly not trying to scare Jirard off.
I love how absolute Karl is with these things. He does not candy coat shit and that's how you have to handle underhanded people.
You’re telling me that I really AM an absolute legend? 😮😃
Exactly and he does not feed into emotional manipulation at all. The facts are the facts.
Aussie VS Canadian in a nutshell
100 percent
I didn't know anything about Karl or muta before this but this debacle made a new fan
I can’t wait for Jirard’s friends and fans to ignore this and keep blindly defending him
Absolutely. They'll deflect then go to the tried and tested method of calling everyone a n*zi or right wing or racist. Pick your victim card word soup
What's interesting is I was a Jirard fan. He posted his video and I looked into just what he was responding to and it became obvious he's full of it. Unsubbed from him and subbed to SomeOrdinaryGamer instead after watching these videos about the truth of things.
He's already been dropped from the "friends per second" podcast. These friends are cutting him out like a cancer.
@@DigitalGamerPixel I'm also a former fan. I'm also someone who lost their grandfather to self deletion during one of his states of dementia and so learning about this was not only sickening, it just flat out broke my heart. The fact that he's been using his mother's name to deflect from all this just adds even more insult to injury.
@@averagejackmedia609 < Someone whos never seen an episode of FPS or listened to the 2m of them addressing it
And no before you go assuming things i dont support jirard, im just a fan of FPS and everyone on the pod
Note to self: Do not ever get on Karl’s bad side.
Note to self: don't commit charity fraud
@@hexywesky But I wanna! My mom died of boneitis. D:
As his viewers say; unless you broke a world record on a speedrun, you DO NOT want Karl to make a video about you lol
Stay away from speedrun then
@@ectothermic is that where she has bones in her pizza?
For someone who claims they didn’t embezzle the money, jirard sure likes bringing up embezzlement
he wouldn't stop saying he took money from the foundation to cover expenses for indieland, but it was only a little and it it were "too much" he wouldn't caus that's not right... Karl was trying to clue him in on their better be some kinda connection there or else it would just be taking 401c3 money and using it for personal use (doesn't matter if the personal use is funding a different project) What he described was embezzlement and off the books... he should thank Karl for being able to get in front of it...
I can practically hear muta and Karl raise an eyebrow at this with their silence at those parts
It's still wild to me that Jirard didn't just apologize in his video and promise to do better and instead wanted to further escalate his crimes. Insanity.
Once your mistake is made known by the internet there's no apologizing. It's a damned if you do damned if you don't situation, so the only thing you could do is making sure you're not making any mistake that'll bite you in the future in the first place
@@Boiled_Pizza i mean he could've atleast mended the situation a bit. By apologizing and just straight up donating the money asap and quitting any future fund raisers.
@Boiled_Pizza Definitely feel like he couldve licked his wounds and recovered. Just accept the L, claim the accountability, promise to do better and in the very next time he attempted this be completely 100% open on it. Yea he wouldve still lost trust with people but he definitely couldve repaired it over time by just saying "hey I am a complete idiot who fucked up and I want to make this better" and prove it. Things wont 180 but repairing trust takes time
his whole family's in on it, he's going down with the ship
@@Boiled_Pizza nah he coulda immediately donated a very large sum and apologized and he'd have less heat on him now
would probably still get audited anyway though so doesn't really matter
Bro just lowered the casket that is Jirard’s career into the ground with this one. Muta thank you to you and Karl for bringing this whole thing to light. Without you guys people probably would have never learned about these heinous actions and kept donating. Keep up the great work!
I love how Muta and Karl were super kind and even gave him so much grace and advice and after every piece of advice all Jirard kept saying was “soooo y’all still gonna make that video or..?” Like he did not care about this issue beyond himself. he just wanted to know if he worked his sympathy card to his benefit and got one over on these two. Very egotistical
Yup 33:34
I loved the “Guys I’m not asking you if you’re okay with me paying you money to not go through with this. That would be pretty silly, right haha but seriously, y’all down with it, or…?”
That's exactly what I gathered from the call as well. Jirard the Conpletionist is super self centered and only worried about his image and his company. Not once did he mention how it affected his fans or community who were the people who gave him the opportunity to be successful on TH-cam. And yet some of his fans still defend him.
He is very egotistical and I also think there are some damming things that he doesn't want coming to light.
All he cared about was his image. And then when they posted a friendly version of this call, he decided to double down and sue them, that forced Muta to lay down his hand to be like, "Lol Jirard is a bastard."
This is literally a perfect "Good Cop, Bad Cop" type of situation. Muta being the good cop, feeling empathetic and almost feeling sorry for Jirard where as Karl being the bad cop isn't letting the heart string tugging affect him and staying straight and direct on course. Really good choice for them to work on this together. Perfect dichotomy of interrogative personalities getting to bottom of the really fucked up situation.
that was my thought too. I've watched a good amount of police interviews and these two do the "mutt and Jeff" with more effectiveness and subtlety than a lot of trained interrogators ive seen.
That moment of silence after Karl and Muta confirm that they're still going ahead with their pieces... gave me goosebumps. You can hear the penny drop...
Jirard: "What do you guys want me to do?"
Logic: "DONATE THE GODDAMN MONEY"
The rapper?
@@bigdubskis8699 IS THE MONEY BIRACIAL?
and while he did, it was *only* because of the pressure. And there's still a lot of unaccounted for money with the golf tournaments.
I used to be a supervisor at my previous job. This reminds me of so many difficult conversations I had with employees, and Jirard is so desperate to save himself that it makes me sad. When you get caught in a lie, you have to keep improvising more lies to cover it up. Props to Karl and Muta for handling this whole situation in the most professional way possible - they gave Jirard a chance to explain himself, and he blew it.
It's typical narcissism.
"I was friends with jontron when he was a racist" is what killed everything he said for me. Snake, he is deflecting with bs drama
But fr tho who else remembers the racist jontron days? Grim.
@@LittleWeevil Don't think he's changed. But who knows.
Jontron was incredibly based, mass immigration bad, diversity bad, but unfortunately he presented himself and his ideas poorly with no research and made a bit of a fool of himself, as he admits
@@aetherius6221 Well personally I think horrible racist nonsense is bad no matter which way you cut it. I don't really care about how slick the rhetoric is.
Seriously can't believe Jirard went to threaten legal action against these guys after how fair they were with him in this call... Holy crap, if he just apologized after donating the money this would be another story. Now i get why Karl and Muta were so unhinhedly pissed about this, they really gave him a fair chance and were very nice to him.
I think the most important thing to note about Jirard's behavior is the fact that he's concerned about his reputation rather than the money not actually being donated.
Throughout this call he is constantly worried about the perceptions of others onto himself, rather than the perceptions of others onto his family or charity as a whole. He tries to guilt trip Karl & Mutahar into sympathizing with his personal anxieties and struggles, and he barely seems to care about the actual cause, which are victims of dementia and Alzheimer's. If he was TRULY dedicated to donating and contributing to the research, he would only be concerned with donating the money quickly, rather than worrying about his reputation and whether or not Karl & Muta would make videos about it.
Jirard's focus is solely on himself, not the people he could be helping, and to me that's the most damning aspect of this entire situation, and is more than what any document, statement, or tax filing could prove. To him, this situation is about himself and his own career, rather than the missed opportunities with the charity funds, or the developers and partners he's screwed over. That to me shows me his true intentions: maintain a positive image rather than actively contribute to a good cause.
Jirard was one of the most respected creators on the platform, it absolutely sucks for him to be exposed in this manner. He deserves whatever he gets in the coming months.
Typical classic of narcissist
It made me angry how many times Mutahar gave Jirard answers on what to reflect on and somewhat what to do and Jirard just focused again and again on what videos would be made (about him), what things would be said (about him) and how he was going to be seen by people.
All I heard was a man concerned about himself, not the cause he defrauded, not his mother, not the people he lied to. Just a sad situation.
Very well said, and I hope others who don’t yet see it watch/listen to this call. The fact that Jirard even took this call is wild and easily one of the most ill-advised things he’s done probably ever.
After listening to the whole thing, it’s abundantly clear that the only reason he took this call was to try to persuade Muta and Karl to reconsider covering this whole thing.
He doesn’t say it explicitly, but every time he says, “What do you guys want me to do to make this right?”, what he’s asking between the lines is, “Is there anything I can do today to convince you two to not make videos about this?”
Jirard deserves it, dude has been lying for years. Had no one talked about this, he would have done it again, not even him receiving concerns about whether or not the money is being donated is enough for him to confess.
@@MajimaNightlord This is sadly the case with many a TH-camr I've seen that's come into a lot of fame and money and it just changes them for the worse. There's been few cases of where it actually made them a much better person in the long run.
I love how he mentions ProJared and Jontron as if their controversies don’t pale in comparison to his at this point. And even funnier that Jared beclowned himself again for this dude.
The irony of ProJared quickly defending Jirard then make a quick u-turn....
@@khairulanam7777 That initial tweet he made was something else. "I didn't watch the video, but..." Like, really dude? After what you went through?
@@khairulanam7777did he really backtrack from his original tweet on the matter?
idk, jontron outed as a racist is pretty bad as well
Iunno, would you really say this is worse than denouncing an entire subset of humans or dating a minor?
normal people when their mum gets dementia: oh no, i hope she's gonna be okay :(
jirard when his mum gets dementia: i can milk you
Normal people when they see legal cases: Wow thats screwed up. I hope the evidence provided is sound
You: "Wow I believe every little detail I hear from people like its just regular drama and dont look up anything myself that they talk about to make an informed opinion. Legal and career ruining accusations are just entertainment to me"
NPC
@@GikamesShadow He lied for a decade, he stole for a decade. That's a fact and no legal decision has any bearing on that. Cope harder
@@GikamesShadow why are you defending jirad in multiple comments?
@@GikamesShadow blind fans when the youtuber known for lying tells them to believe him: yessir 🫡
Karl at 44:12: "I won't do anything that you'll find completely disrespectful"
Karl after being completely disrespected: "What a pathetic b*tch"
Legend
My jaw dropped hearing Karl say that. But it was earned at that point. They interviewed him, they actually censored the worst parts to give him the chance to step forward and take the reigns of this exposure and to handle it himself. He would have looked so much better if he just bit the bullet and started working on how to make it right. Instead he spat in their face. Grovels, begs and insinuates bribing them in the call, then turning around and acting like they were being malicious towards him.
Yeah he wasn't gonna do anything disrespectful in just his first video. Things escalated astronomically after that and more of the truth about Jirard was revealed, so their videos after that first one weren't upheld to their original agreement.
@@mainboysmusic6985 I feel like Jirard didnt know that the call was being recorded or forgot entirely.Hence,he thought he could still twist the narrative more than what Muta and Carl would allow him to
@@safi6749 depending on their states/ canadas laws, jirard might have had to know.
I would never ever in my life want to get on the wrong side of Karl. Impressive how he keeps emotion out of it, straight facts. Big up xx
I was thinking the same thing! I like how he keeps a level head, and even guides Muta to not get affected emotionally. That's a journalist mind right there haha
I disagree with the statement that Karl had no empathy. Listen to 33~ when he says he feels for Jirard. I think Karl was just being objective when he says the emotion behind the excuses was irrelevant
@@attykarly yes that seems a bit of harsh of me when I read back. Clearly he has some empathy, the first reply to my comment that worked along the lines of Karl guiding Muta to not be blinded by a clearly in distress Jirad works better. I agree with you Atty!
@attykarly he's not saying Karl is devoid of empathy. Just that he's not letting his empathy cloud the facts of the story.
I think you read it wrong. Karl definitely has emotions. Muta was using the emotion card to see how far the dude goes with his shit and also maybe hear a bit of his side no matter how malicious it may sound. You can see after he disconnects in part 1 where Muta changes from “oh man, that hard, tough situation considering his mom and stuff” to “phew that was something, something , so there is definitely fraud involved”. But I maybe be wrong too. Interesting watch tho. Honestly if he just donates the money, it should be just okay and people will forget most of it as time goes.
He sounds more secure when he has a lawyer telling him what to do, but that's the voice of someone who only feels fear
TBH I don't know what kind of hack lawyer would read the script of his response video and tell him: "sure, go for it, go get 'em tiger!" Considering he revealed more damning details like he used money to "offset some costs". I guess a decent lawyer would've told him to just shut up.
Blatant manipulation. "If you tell the internet, its over for me", "Everything iv done for my mother will be tarnished", "I just want to make the world a better place and be a game developer"@@BobDevV
Well Jirard why didn't you go to university and study game development and go get a job as a game dev? Instead you and your family set up a dodgy foundation to get rich off. Outside of youtube etc did Jirard ever have a job?
He wants Karl and Muta to feel sorry for him and not expose what was going on. I think if he had got his way, he would have paid Karl and Muta to be quiet.
The way he kept on saying "are you sure your going to make a video on me?" basically is so sickening
This whole thing reminds me of when Wendy wanted to fight Cartman (South Park) and he kept apologizing in private but kept saying he'd fight publicly lol
His video was a trainwreck, the lawyer behind that text is a fraudster.
The Completionist has 100%ed the social media life cycle, very impressive.
He's earned an all new title: Jirfraud the Conpletionist
@@orangejjay Jirard the con artist sounds better
I give it a completionist rating of Finish it!!!
The whole call is nuts. One of my favorite points is when he says "I don't want the money to just go to some doctor's salary". Isn't that exactly what the money should be going towards? Some PhD trying to find a cure??
He thinks the money is going straight to a petri dish called " Dementia"
there is not just one PhD that will "solve" dementia thats not how cures work, and that is a legit concern donating to certain charities that it goes to just one top brass. He's made a lot of bad calls but that part ain't the damning one
weed fixes dementia... 😮it does actually and small amount of shrooms... calmer nerves etc
@@TriloByte101a charity scam is not the place to be promoting weed, get a grip on reality for once please
@@rorolmoney Difference between a researcher conducting actual research and some CEO overseeing operations.
I gained a lot of respect for Muta listening to this. Muta tried to have mercy on him
Usually muta speaks strongly about punishing people that do wrong things and i think here is no different, the difference is that he is being cautious to not fk up and seek the truth, for me is the being smart while seeking the truth that makes this situation so good
Meanwhile I gained respect for Karl. He wasn't having none of this guys manipulative shenanigans or lies. He knew the game being played.
nobody cares@@kristoffer8609
Muta was fortunately lenient and gave him the benefit of the doubt but didn’t do too much of a good job in the 3rd video and the video after Jirard’s response. Still, Muta did a good job overall highlighting the situation with missing golf money and telling Jirard he needs to do something and he only wants answers, nothing else. Karl didn’t give him a chance and instead assumed the absolute worst, overblew this situation, and now people are dogpiling Jirard with cancel culture instead of them and Karl actually letting higher authorities investigate the situation
@@theawesomeali8834 Go away.
It's so interesting comparing Muta and Karl's reaction after Jirard first drops off. Muta seems almost disturbed and moved by a clearly distraught Jirard, but Karl sees right through it immediately.
muta was seeing through the eyes of a fan. and someone with empathy. but you cannot have those things in the face of injustice. this is how atrocities are carried out. it's why the two police in my home city of minneapolis just allowed chauvin to kneel on a clearly overdosing and panicked man's neck for that long. they had no spine and were protecting their friend.
@@FEBRIZIOtvLol come on comparing Jirard to Derek Chauvin even indirectly is taking things WAY overboard
MrCharity Inc DBA Beast Philanthropy doesn't even have their 990 forms publicly available which is a red flag if I've ever seen one.
@@FEBRIZIOtv This is a totally bonkers comparison. Jirard's actions are very shitty. Absolutely, undoubtedly shitty behavior on his part, but comparing him to a "man" kneeling on another's neck until death is ridiculous. Murderers should never so easily be mixed in with non violent acts.
@@MuShinneni guess he should've stayed in the car instead of being finiky 🤷 its not like he ran to them in need of help and they did that.
28:38 Jirard being upset at the thought of the money going to some big organisation to cover expenses and not doing anything useful is gut-busting hilarious.
Jirard: "we couldn't find any charities that wouldn't take money off the top for their expenses, that's why we didn't donate."
Jirard (each year): "so let's take a little money off the top, we have expenses.."
Insane that every time he wants to talk about "doing right" it's almost solely for his reputation and not for the thousands of people who donated funds.
because that is what Jirard was most concerned with, the reputation of himself and his family, he doesnt care about the rest
It's become very clear during this fiasco that Jirard has some serious narcissism/ego issues.
My mom died too. It unfortunately happens to everyone. It can’t be used as an excuse for the rest of your life.
Well not everyone is a reprehensible human being like Jirard to use his mother's illness and death as a means to get money out of it.
Shit I joke about my mom being dead. It can't be a crutch, all you can do is get through the grief and use good memories and jokes to keep going.
@@VCV95Same man, my mom passed away almost 3 years ago and people would make “mom” jokes to me and I would just laugh and joke with them lol I understand everyone is different, but this guy uses it way too damn much to try and seek pity.
This whole thing could've just been a short scandalous smear on Jirard's admittedly strong career, but instead, by threatening legal action (never threaten it, just sue if you think there is a crime being committed) he instead spilled his whole can of worms, revealing himself to be so obviously manipulative and two-faced. Now we know who Jirard is, a combative, dodgy, dishonest person.
He named so many names! Ahahahaaaa
He literally could have just donated the money same day this call happened, pushed out a video explaining the situation and he's shutting down the open hand foundation going forward. And Karl and muta probably would have just ended things there...but jarard is too much of a egotistical person to do that. Dude doesn't seem capable of taking a loss without bringing up his dead mom, or trying to manipulate the whole thing to make him the absolute victim.
You don't just sue. You get a lawyer and you send a cease and desist letter first and after that you sue if there's no compliance.
@@DeformedConscience
You mean he named so many people.
You can tell Muta is a very kind and forgiving person. Just an awesome person. Bless his heart.
Yeah, it really does seem like he wanted to give Jirard the chance to resolve it at his own discretion but alas he responded like a 6 year old and further condemned himself and his family.
True. Muta gave the chances to let that fraudster explain but he still refused to come out clean
They have a really impressive good-cop-bad-cop-routine going
The part where Jirard asks if Karl and Muta are definitely covering it feels so telling. Like he realizes that he’s caught and it’s over.
well you'd be terrified, no matter whether you are lying or not, it's like saying you look nervous in an interrogation room, you must be guilty, you're not really understanding how humans work under pressure, guilty or not you'll fold if pressured long enough.
@@kamitoringsYou are absolutely right. However, what the original commenter meant (I think) is that since we definitely know he's lying, him being worried about his reputation is very telling of his character. It's not that (I hope not) people believe that he's lying simply for being nervous. No, a mountaintop of evidence proves his guilt. His desperate attempt to gag Karl and Muta is just disgusting given the facts.
He only cares about himself and his image. Not the people he wronged
I agree. To me it seemed like Jirard thought he could "sob story" his way out of them making the videos. When they said they were going through with it, he gave up.
At that point he's already thinking strategically, it's clear for him that only the truth would be acceptable for Karl and Muta, and for many reasons he's not ready to disclose the truth behind it all, so he's already thinking about how he'll deal when their videos come out. Just look at how he even asks for a specific timeframe.
Muta this might be the best work you've ever done. Really impressed with how you two dug into this and fairly assessed the situations. One thing i wish you guys had called out on this call is, kept asking how to make it right with you and i think he needed to be set straight that he needs to make it right with the donators and his audience, not you guys. It really sounds like he was just asking how to make it all go away.
I was genuinely waiting for the moment he was gonna come back on this idea of offering them money for their silence. the simple fact he mentionned it makes him sound quite evil. You can tell in the way he speaks that he'd do anything to make it go away, I'm sure it was burning him.
The second that topic came up I could hear Karl or Muta recoil almost immediately.
I think I would act like Muta in this situation - knowing you're in the right, but trying to find a silver lining and constantly second guessing every step to make sure it's all correct.
But we have absolute legend Karl, just sure about what's happening, and compromising nothing. Just being competent with confidence.
These two guys are incredible.
I keep getting the feeling Jirard is low key offering a bribe for this to go away this entire call
He was testing the waters, to see what would catch. He tried money, wording it very carefully of course, to actually include the word "NOT" in there, but meaning the opposite of course. He tried guilt tripping them using motives such as family, other people under his care, himself and his public image, even offered them that he would simply walk away from everything, but they never fell for any of it. He could not simply ask them directly, so this indirect way of offering them a way not to come out with a video is very preceptible, at least for me it was, clear as day
He definitely was. You can tell because he keeps bringing it up, as if it somehow ISN'T an attempt at bribing just because he says it isn't. When he kept asking them what he should do going forward to avoid any sort of backlash, how this would ruin his image, he wasn't asking Muta and Karl for advice, he was asking what THEY wanted to make this all go away. That's why he sounds COMPLETELY UNINTERESTED when they advise him on what the next thing to do to make it right would be. Because he knows what he needs to do to make it right, he just doesn't care at all. You can tell by the tone in his voice that he doesn't CARE what they thing is the right thing to do, he wants to know what he should do to shut them up.
He's trying to emotionally manipulate his way out
"I'm not trying to be like do you guys want money..." is such a dementedly criminal thing for Jirard to say because there was LITERALLY nothing Muta or Karl said to prompt that. Jirard just whipped that out, courtesy of nothing, clearly trying to dangle it as a possibility to see if it'd take. The dude is a f ucking criminal.
It really gives away his mindset in this. It's all a numbers game to him, if Muta and Karl are going after him it must be because they want money by turning the "drama" (as he calls it) into content. If he offers them money, he can just give them enough to compensate for the ad revenue and then they won't have to make it public. He doesn't seem to believe this is a serious issue, and that the only reason they'd ever want to make him look like a bad person is because they want money. Everything is about who makes more money to him, which has troubling implications in a case of potential charity fraud.
I like how he is terrified in the call but trying to be a bad ass in his response video threatening to sue the both of you.
It's a lot easier to puff your chest and act tough when you aren't actually directly talking to the people you're addressing and don't have to deal with their responses in real time.
And after consulting with the "legal team" , probably an Open Hand expense
Technically, he was scared in his response video.
Funny how you guys still gave him the chance to do things right and what he does?
Threatens to sue. 😂 No matter how many examples there are out there of TH-camrs having the chance to redeem themselves and failing, it seems no one learns.
You would think after Logan Paul failed to follow through on his threats of legal action towards Coffeezilla these idiots would learn.
Agreed I just don’t understand why he would sue them.. especially when he acted grateful to them
@@kina8575 Considering a lot of his fans went on to defend him and instead attacked Karl and Muta for being "drama youtubers", Jirard was probably confident that his response video would undo any damage to his reputation. His threat of taking legal action against them was probably an attempt to have his audience turn against Karl and Muta.
@@veeaxis3892 now that is drama
They all live in their own little worlds@@JustAFatGuyInTX
I like how Jirard's tone about the subject completely changed from his original "woe is me" demeanor when they said they weren't being quiet about it. The multiple indifferent "sure" as his response after the fact just illustrate he's pissed he couldn't snow them over with a pity party.
When jirard heard muta that this will make a story no matter what he does. His demeanor just change from begging to sure. How narcissist Jirard really is.
I'm actually glad that Muta got Karl into this, because I could tell he needed to have someone like that involved in this investigation and this call proved it. Seeing Muta feeling sympathetic and Karl immediately reminding him what's involved.
Karl's lost both his parents. And his mother recently. Jirad using his own mothers passing as a crux is absolutely wild to me
Yeah that's crazy.
ngl that explains more why karl is so harsh, i understand his pov.
This conversation just makes Jirards response video even more of a head scratcher. Mutahar had a very reasonable take saying "while what happened wasn't right, the money is still there and can ultimately go to helping people." He also mentioned that the situation can be amended as long as this happens. But then Jirard makes a horrible "apology" video that's more about attacking his detractors than admitting mistakes and giving the full honest story.
I swear his "im sorry *you* felt mislead by my statements" trying to gaslight people into thinking his statements didnt outright directly state he made donations, or that its an unreasonable assumption that a CHARITY wouldnt just SIT ON MONEY for over a decade, that whole "apology" is the worst part of all of this. If he had just made the donation, owned up to lying and his other mistakes, that would be that. At least as far as the public is concerned, frankly I dont give a rats butt what that would mean for him legally.
@@Yipper64 I don't think it was gaslighting. I think a lawyer probably told him to say that. Lawyers give horrible PR tips for TH-cam. I think a lawyer probably told him to say this to cover him from lawsuits. It was a horrible response though.
@@wahwahwah6690 It's the same thing, lawyers are paid to gaslight lol.
He's been driven into a corner.
It may be that the Open Hand Situation isn‘t the worst thing about this. The golf tournament with its major sponsors may be a much bigger thing. They may want to use this scandal to minimise the golf part? I would expect that the golf tournament has brought in much more money than Indieland and the gaming side.
Maybe that (and the father) dictated how Jirard reacted.
This whole call really sounded like he wanted to bribe you guys into not making a story
he really did, even the "how much would it cost...what would it take....oh you guys are seriously gonna make this public?" yes. Silence. Its why he ended his response video by puffing his chest out all cave man like and threatening lawsuits. All he had to do was say "Yes, we didnt send the money. I fucked up. I cant even begin to apologise enough. I failed my community, i failed you guys. Here's the print out of the transfer made yesterday. I'm standing down as chairman of the foundation and taking a break. Im sorry guys, i failed you"
The open ended questions Jirard made to Karl and Muda are basically an attempt of bribery.
Just heard "I just want the money to go in the right spot" yikes like it MIGHT not be what he's doing but at this point I wouldn't even put it past him, especially since he knows he's being recorded.
What a blessing his true nature is being exposed but what a shame that this is what it is
@@AzguardMikeif what you described had happened instead of what did, I think we’d be in a much better place. I’ve been watching Jirard’s videos for years now, I don’t want to see this unfolding the way it is, but… it is. I was waiting to see what his response would be, hoping that it’d be like this and things could move on eventually. Not really moving in that direction right now though. :/
but it did work. They ended up pitying him even thought they did not accept the bribery itself. But if anything, it should be a red flag for them to look deeper. Perhaps Karl did so.
Good thing that both Karl and Muda were there. Since they are so different and don't know each other enough, one of them might be temped by the offer itself. Tho I think taking a piece of the charity money can be used against them too.
Jirard dragged Jontron and ProJared without hesitation to deflect from his own issues. Supposed friends of his at least at one time. Pretty fucked if you ask me
Especially after ProJared posted to defend him. Yikes
All three of them were a part of Normal Boots so I'm not surprised their names eventually got brought up in some way. I find it pretty fucked as well.
The worst part is they gave him a fucking out. They gave him a glidepath to recovery and instead he decided to fuck it all up. He gets everything coming to him. I hope he and his family get prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.
He was always done for, no matter what out they tried to give him. That is how the interweb works.
@@--_DJ_-- this all happened before they exposed him I'm pretty sure. So if he just donated there wouldn't be a drama in the first place
I'm confused he was already commiting charity fraud and the numbers didn't add up, how he got out? Would Karl and Muta just stop reporting and they hide his crimes? He was fucked from the start the only difference is he made it worse but the evidence was already out there.
His family as well? What the fuck
@@megarotom1590 Donating is not just a "click here" and done thing in this case. Pretty sure he donated as quickly as possible. ANd even that would not have changed anything. He lied, at least as we factually know it from his own statement, this year about where the money goes. He could've used Indiland 2023 to say "hey guys, I found out about the money, we are still raising money and are looking for a beneficiary asap, but we wanted to restrict it. I only learned about the money still being with us a year ago."
That's the only thing that could've saved him....or not talking to Muta and Karl and opening up about for how long he knew about it.
I severely doubt an audit will reveal the money was in that account the entire time.
The whole story does not make sense, at all.
And the fact that Jirard keeps trying to deflect from embezzling tax scamming, despite Karl and Muta's continued insistence that that is not what they suspect, speaks volumes.
yeah same. something does not smell right at all. it also looks like jirard is woefully uneducated about how accounting in a charity org works. he seemed to not at all understand what karl was asking him about how revenue and expenses from indieland (run by a wholly separate entity from the charity) would have to be reflected on a balance sheet. the people running the foundation are in way over their heads.
> Doesn’t know 600k wasn’t donated
> Uses portions of said 600k to reimburse IndieLand costs for several years
- Also stated he knew and was waiting for the right charity to donate the money to, thus contradicting his own "I didn't know the money wasn't being donated." statement.
@@RuSosan Shrodinger’s Charity: The money’s both donated and not donated, until you look at the taxes filed.
@@mrshmuga9
Indeed, lol.
They literally told Jirard how to handle this situation, and he failed spectacularly. It's like 10x worse because of Jirard's horrible response.