Sign up for Dr. Martin Shaw's first-ever live online course, Christian Wonder Tales, starting November 12th. This 4-week, 8-hour course is hosted on the Symbolic World Circle Community. Patrons at the Involved level or higher get 10% off, apply your discount code at checkout: www.thesymbolicworld.com/courses/christian-wonder-tales Mythographer, writer, and storyteller Dr Martin Shaw takes us deep into the heart of what he calls Christian Wonder Tales. Profoundly mythic, these teaching stories range from the early saints through to the grandeur of the Round Table and Arthurian tradition. Shaw emphasises these stories as remerging providentially on time for the perils of modern life. Filled with vocation, sacrifice, and courage, these are an inheritance many of us simply didn’t know we had.
Hey Jonathan, I absolutely love the artwork done for the Christian Wonder Tales course. Any chance that would be available as a t-shirt or poster in the near future? Thanks, Tim
Native Americans went, and maybe still do, on vision quests. Isolation to meet one’s real self is innate in humans. One has to meet and conquer one’s personal shadow; the snake or the dragon within in order to be liberated from the limited ego self and realize the cosmic self.
Also the symbolism of the Catholic mass is the ultimate story; bread and wine symbolizing body and blood which symbolizes the ultimate mystery which is transubstantiation.
@JonathanPageau Can you help me work through why sacrifice and more in an ancient way of seeing sacrifice? I'm trying to work through the perspective we don't have that they did. In other words, it's more economically sound to sell the goat vs sacrifice it. God Bless.
@@PaulVanderKlay thanks to you, too, Paul, for being an integral connecting link in this growing network, and for my favourite descriptor "this little corner" (I know you don't take credit, but I'm giving it anyways 🙂) We have a small Estuary group here in Winnipeg now, which I started up but have since passed on to others, and hope it continues to grow. Lots of good things happening as the re-awakening to enchantment and spiritual reality continues to spread, and it's exciting to be a part of it. Hope to chat with you some day!
Lots of gems: "Christianity is very strange because on the one hand it has this great emphasis on humility but on the other it has this emphasis that your steps in this world matter and have consequence and you have to proceed like that but not be annihilated by your own ego" - being one of them.
"If you watch on a monster for a long time, that monster will destroy you." Very insightful. We should all ask and examine ourselves what is that monster we are conditioned to watch on without realizing we are actually destroyed by it?? On the contrary Jesus says to us He is like the Exodus serpent on the poll and whosoever gaze upon Him will be healed. What a contrast eh!!!!
My story is a book, out soon Lord Willing! “Confessions of a Controlaholic: Don’t Destroy Your Second Marriage Too!” My journey from 70s Berkeley to a Hindu cult for 13 years, a clinical psychology PhD, meeting Christ! Then through ten years Protestant, 8 years RC before God allowed me to come near His Holy Orthodox Church where I sit at 66 repenting joyfully!
I’m using this medium to appreciate you in particular as a fan of mine and I want you to keep supporting me while I bring more entertainment to your way. Love you ❤️.. feel free to send me a friend request so we can talk better… I will try every possible way to reply you
In my opinion the most neglected and the craziest part of a gospel: Mat 27:52-53: "And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many."
I’m just had to add that I am experiencing the Bible in the same way. Reading the OT, particularly Genesis, is moving my soul deeper. Makes the NT feel different.
So true… I had this thought months ago when I heard a very interesting story about St Symeon the prophet that held baby Christ in his arms. The tradition says that he one one of the people being resurrected at that day and appears to his family. He told them exactly what was going on at Hades while the souls were waiting for the Messiah and what happened when Jesus descended into Hades. They wrote things down and the Church has their writings. When St Symeon passed away he informed the souls that he held the Messiah and when John the Baptist passed away, he as well announced to the souls the ministry of the Messiah. He described that when Christ descended, He knocked the doors of Hades three times and after that the doors were shattered and the Light of the Lord entered Hades. The demons run to hide themselves and most of the souls ascended with Christ to Heaven. That’s why during the resurrection service, the doors at churches close and the priests knock 3 times and quotes Psalm 24:9
I LOVE the story of Parsifal! Redemption and self-sacrifice are divine themes, and in part this story was a seed that lead me to Christ. Like Parsifal, I also need forgiveness and I pray that God gives me the strength to sacrifice myself for the Ultimate Good, for Christ.
I’m using this medium to appreciate you in particular as a fan of mine and I want you to keep supporting me while I bring more entertainment to your way. Love you ❤️.. feel free to send me a friend request so we can talk better… I will try every possible way to reply you
I’m using this medium to appreciate you in particular as a fan of mine and I want you to keep supporting me while I bring more entertainment to your way. Love you ❤️.. feel free to send me a friend request so we can talk better… I will try every possible way to reply you❤
Jonathan, you made a comment in the video comparing an emasculated Christ with Saint Francis of Assisi. One of the areas in the story of Christianity that you may want to explore more deeply is the real life and ministry of St. Francis of Assisi (you may be missing something like the passage about the swords in Luke 22). He is not gentle. When I was considering becoming Catholic I seriously, was considering becoming Orthodox at the same time. I asked someone who I respected very much who had come into the Catholic church after studying Alexander Schmemann why he hadn't simply become Orthodox at the time. His answer was startling in its simplicity. As a Catholic he could have St. Francis of Assisi AND the rich wisdom of the Eastern fathers. This really struck me and convincing me that perhaps Francis was worth exploring more. As I've done so, I have discovered a tremendous wellspring of living water.
Wow, you probably have no idea how encouraging this is for me, Dr. Shaw! I am so happy that I am not the only Christian who feels exposed and extremely challenged by Jesus and who finds the Bible strange and disturbing at times. It is so refreshing and beautiful the way you talk about the Bible and the old stories, I am feeling really inspired, thank you so much!
I’m using this medium to appreciate you in particular as a fan of mine and I want you to keep supporting me while I bring more entertainment to your way. Love you ❤️.. feel free to send me a friend request so we can talk better… I will try every possible way to reply you
At face value it would seem that these two men have a completely different view on how to approach and interpret (or not interpret) a story and it’s really nice to find a convergence when hearing you speak together. I always enjoy it ❤
So nice to see someone from a part of the world I know - feels like I am completely surrounded by aliens in my small town, every person I try to talk to is being sucked into the insanity.. Every time I try to connect with other artists in my area I find my heart sinking as the conversation starts being infiltrated by words I recognise from the culture war (and not in a good way). I thought I had my family but even my children are being influenced somewhat despite my best efforts. I have lived my life surrounded by remnants of early Christianity, walking the dog past 7th century crosses, remains of chapels and places named after Arthurian myths so these feel very real and near at hand!
This may be the only thing that saves my faith. Feeling very disillusioned and jaded with Christianity. Converted from Protestantism to Roman Catholicism, but it hasn't been enough. So much toxicity and things that are problematic in this church. I may be on my way to Orthodoxy, but I think I need to wander in the world of story and myth for a while before I can even do that. I can't stand modernity and most of modern Christians of all persuasions. I feel like I'm a closet pantheistic pagan, but perhaps Christian Wonder Tales could be the bridge to help me find wonder in my faith again, or discover it for the first time.
Don’t give up! Sometimes God lets us experience those things in order to tear down the false image we have of Him. Trust Him, He will lead you through this dark forest.
It’s true! He did steal the show at Symbolic World. He’s the best prepared to show us how to tell stories again and re-enchant the world. Still over here trying to make a Rowan tree blush…..
I really like Martin. Similar journey as mine to Orthodoxy. (Same age too!! lol) He’s a keeper. Have him on more, Jonathan;) Thank you both. Those of us coming to Orthodoxy after growing up Protestant and then voyaging the world away from it, and then returning to the true faith…well, it’s just nice to know I’m not alone. It’s such a deep process.🙏🏻☦️🙏🏻
Wonderful conversation, as always. ❤ So many insights, wise gems, and a pervasive atmosphere of wonder and joy in your ongoing discovery of ever more truth and beauty. It has been an immense gift to watch the "Team" emerging from the trees around the world and converging in "this little corner of the internet" over the past years, and a great privilege to participate in this expanding movement as an avid observer of your conversations and other work. Thank you!
An idea or a concept or reason itself are strategies we employee to reconcile or make sense of a partially presented image or story which is our lives on this footstool we call the fallen world.
“Stories will Save the World” - The Literary Life Podcast and the House of Human Letters A good additional place to go if you enjoyed this conversation.
I don't know why, but I am sitting here weeping because this is exactly the apologetics I am trying to grasp and pass on as a homeschool mother who teaches not only her own children but other's children for 30 years so far. My instinct has always been to defend stories and story telling and I am once again at a crossroads with ideas about stories. This video has given me wind in my sails to once again defend the very nature of God and Jesus Christ through the multiple facets of story telling that reflect Him. I am very curious if you happened to watch the Epoch Times film "Up we soar"? I would love to see a conversation about some of the falun gong stories and parables that seem so imbedded in Christian theory. Sometimes as a Western christian I find myself challenged with the magnitude of the story of Christ and our christian fathers. When in the midst of the "nervous breakdown" of what God is calling us to, so many western christians want to circle the wagons and call names. I never see my Savior do that. I never see my Savior say anything but truth. We are not called to mimic the culture but to get into the river of the Logos. The story of God's dream from the beginning. I love so many of the analogies in this interaction. Thank you so much Jonathan and Dr. Shaw.
Great, Jonathan! It‘s brillant to bring Martin Shaw into the debate. Did you consider to reach out to Michael Meade? He might be relevant for your team, too.
I’m using this medium to appreciate you in particular as a fan of mine and I want you to keep supporting me while I bring more entertainment to your way. Love you ❤️.. feel free to send me a friend request so we can talk better… I will try every possible way to reply you
The two swords, sell your cloak and buy a sword part was always strange to me too until I really looked at it and it's to fulfill the prophecy that he will be counted among the transgressors so he has to tell the disciples to bring the swords so they will transgress against the law when the others come to take him by attacking the official. He knows what will happen but has to get them to bring the swords which will then allow them to do what needs to happen for the prophecy. The parts of the Gospels where Jesus does something seemingly out of character often seems to be to fulfill a certain prophecy that must come true about the messiah. Love this one, always great to have Martin on with you.
Great insight. This seems to be a pattern in the gospels, as in Jesus wants to go in a different direction compared to the Messiah of the Old Testament, but he is bound by the prophecies, and so in a lawyer-y way he adjusts reality to fit the minimum requirements for his role. In a weird way, this makes it sound like he's trying to "mantle" the role of Messiah, rather than being the expression of it. He fulfills some prophecies effortlessly, while for other ones he goes out of his way to make them come to pass.
In my Ruthenian church, I heard the legend that when the Holy Family fled to Egypt, their tracks were covered up by friendly spiders. Has anyone else ever heard of that ?
@@maryadjalal5435 I heard about spiders doing the same when perscecuted priests were in hiding, the Spider would make webs over hiding place doors, so the soldiers didn't bother looking behind them as it looked like the door hadn't been used in ages ...
If this is in reference to spiders covering a cave with webbing, then, yes, but in a different variant. As @katyoduin3452 said, there are other variants of that story. I am aware of a Judeo-Christian variant where a spider saves King David fleeing Saul's soldiers by building a web over the cave entrance. There is also a variant in Islam where a spider protects Muhammad in a similar manner. I don't know enough about this particular folktale to be able to tell you which is the oldest recorded occurrence, but it definitely appears to have been in the oral tradition amongst varying people groups around the Levantine Sea.
3:03 WoW! That is an excellent, amazing tale - what is the name of that story, where can I find it? 5:46 yes Yes YES! THESE are the sorts of tales I've been wanting to find. Thank you for helping me on my journey. Looking forward to the course!
Hello Dr Shaw, this was such an great conversation. The idea about what you forget in a story being something to grapple with, will ironically, stick with me for a long time I'm sure. I was wondering if there are any updates, or any way of following updates on the Shropshire monestary situation? I noticed that the website is no longer active.
I would be currious what stories in the Scandinavian pantheon he was talking about that are beyond redemption, or too suffused with witchcraft as he said
Wonder Tale makes me think of Wonder Ridebooks from Kamen Rider Saber. And honestly I'd totally love to see that show's designs reworked into a longer, deerper, less hindered by COVID and being a weekly series that wraps up in a year. It only scratched the surface of swordsmen with the power of stories and symbolism.
I’m using this medium to appreciate you in particular as a fan of mine and I want you to keep supporting me while I bring more entertainment to your way. Love you ❤️.. feel free to send me a friend request so we can talk better… I will try every possible way to reply you
I'm going to be telling the story of the ramayana to the other people from my childhood orphanage. Diwali lands on the same day as Halloween and All saints Day this year 🪔🎃🕯️
27:44 orthobros on the internet pontificating seem to think that way, but tens of millions of OTHER Christians seem to not mind the music being contemporary. Preaching to the choir much? And how much does that actually help anybody?
Hello Jonathan, I mistakingly put the wrong address on a jack book order, and I'm hoping to find a way to change it before shipment. Previous attempts to contact through website haven't worked so hoping you might see here.
@JonathanPageau ☝😀💡I have an idea! I know he's done a course for The Symbolic World, but why not also partner with Dr. Shaw to publish an anthology of these Christian wonder stories through the Symbolic World Press? I would love to add something like that to my collection. 😁
Oh he was saying that sometimes the Bible is just very surface and it says this happened that happened blah blah blah. So he tries to bring the feeling into it. I would like to point out but that’s just what The Chosen does. The Chosen gets deeper into these Bible stories and they do tell a story and they do tell interesting stories And I don’t know if this gentleman has listened to The Chosen but he’s probably got his own stories… But since I’m. Catholic we go deeper and you use your… imagination!!! St Ignatius!!!! I think that’s what he does in abundance.
Jonathan, I think you would really enjoy looking into the symbolism of fish-headed people in the ancient, in relation to the virgin creation myth. Parthenogenesis is what I think is being symbolized. I think they were asexual, pre-human vertebrates that were far superior to their contemporary “homo sapiens”. I think they realized that the monkeys (homo sapiens) would not sustain themselves, become violent, and destroy their way of life, so they tamed them and taught them agriculture. Not actual fish heads, parthenogenesis.
I know I'm a minority I don't like the story of Job. My reason is he's supposed to rejoice that he gets another set of children? What about the first set? That just breaks my heart every time I read it. Did he have a revelation that this life is like of second long vapor and that he would be with them forever? If so what about the days weeks and months and years where you're separated from them? I would die of a heart attack. I would not be that comforted by having a new set of children. Can anybody explain it to me?
@@storytellermistymator you have a new sub. I saw on your website that you are in Pittsburgh. My wife and I live about an hour north. Small world. I may attend a workshop sometime.
@@Brad-RB Thank you! Small world! I hope we are able to connect through a workshop sometime. If you're an hour northwest of Pittsburgh, you might be near the annual Beaver Tales Storytelling Festival and Ellwood City Storytelling Festival that happens every September. If you're interested in storytelling, it might be worth checking out next year.
Sign up for Dr. Martin Shaw's first-ever live online course, Christian Wonder Tales, starting November 12th. This 4-week, 8-hour course is hosted on the Symbolic World Circle Community. Patrons at the Involved level or higher get 10% off, apply your discount code at checkout: www.thesymbolicworld.com/courses/christian-wonder-tales
Mythographer, writer, and storyteller Dr Martin Shaw takes us deep into the heart of what he calls Christian Wonder Tales. Profoundly mythic, these teaching stories range from the early saints through to the grandeur of the Round Table and Arthurian tradition. Shaw emphasises these stories as remerging providentially on time for the perils of modern life. Filled with vocation, sacrifice, and courage, these are an inheritance many of us simply didn’t know we had.
Hey Jonathan,
I absolutely love the artwork done for the Christian Wonder Tales course. Any chance that would be available as a t-shirt or poster in the near future?
Thanks,
Tim
Native Americans went, and maybe still do, on vision quests. Isolation to meet one’s real self is innate in humans. One has to meet and conquer one’s personal shadow; the snake or the dragon within in order to be liberated from the limited ego self and realize the cosmic self.
Also the symbolism of the Catholic mass is the ultimate story; bread and wine symbolizing body and blood which symbolizes the ultimate mystery which is transubstantiation.
@JonathanPageau Can you help me work through why sacrifice and more in an ancient way of seeing sacrifice? I'm trying to work through the perspective we don't have that they did. In other words, it's more economically sound to sell the goat vs sacrifice it. God Bless.
There are few people as fun to have a conversation with than Martin. So much refreshment.
He is becoming one of my favorite people
Please do a talk with him! We don't get enough Shaw content around here anyways.
@@PaulVanderKlay thanks to you, too, Paul, for being an integral connecting link in this growing network, and for my favourite descriptor "this little corner" (I know you don't take credit, but I'm giving it anyways 🙂) We have a small Estuary group here in Winnipeg now, which I started up but have since passed on to others, and hope it continues to grow. Lots of good things happening as the re-awakening to enchantment and spiritual reality continues to spread, and it's exciting to be a part of it. Hope to chat with you some day!
"Little corner" stretches to Poland , Nowy Sącz @@dawnmuir5052 Greetings from this part of the world 😊
Lots of gems: "Christianity is very strange because on the one hand it has this great emphasis on humility but on the other it has this emphasis that your steps in this world matter and have consequence and you have to proceed like that but not be annihilated by your own ego" - being one of them.
“A constant low-level humiliation” is so great. We need to figure out how to “embrace” this.
What a great discussion.
i listened to this like 5 times on spotify, probably my favourite episode ever.
"Christian Wondertales" - I love it.
"A little bit of mischief and a little bit of beauty.... " that line in itself is the richest story.
"If you watch on a monster for a long time, that monster will destroy you." Very insightful. We should all ask and examine ourselves what is that monster we are conditioned to watch on without realizing we are actually destroyed by it?? On the contrary Jesus says to us He is like the Exodus serpent on the poll and whosoever gaze upon Him will be healed. What a contrast eh!!!!
my monsters are youtube and american politics.
“A constant low level humiliation.” Shoot. The only remedy is… “every experience of beauty prepares you for eternity.”
This talk felt strangely refreshing and nostalgic
Martin finding life in the Percival story spoke deeply to me…
My story is a book, out soon Lord Willing! “Confessions of a Controlaholic: Don’t Destroy Your Second Marriage Too!” My journey from 70s Berkeley to a Hindu cult for 13 years, a clinical psychology PhD, meeting Christ! Then through ten years Protestant, 8 years RC before God allowed me to come near His Holy Orthodox Church where I sit at 66 repenting joyfully!
Wow! Quite a journey. Funny how many people find Orthodoxy via Hindu stuff.
It sounds like I'm on a similar path as you. See my comment above.
Brilliant talk. I’m a 24/7 repentant. Hmm, Catholic Church did that! 😮 an ingrained hobby 😢
I almost didn’t watch this, and I’m so glad I did. This conversation is beyond inspirational!
Touching some deep streams running through my own soul, an enjoyable time listening and sweeping floors.
I’m using this medium to appreciate you in particular as a fan of mine and I want you to keep supporting me while I bring more entertainment to your way. Love you ❤️.. feel free to send me a friend request so we can talk better… I will try every possible way to reply you
In my opinion the most neglected and the craziest part of a gospel:
Mat 27:52-53: "And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose, And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many."
Yes, this is so weird. No one ever preaches about it, imo.
Ya that is a weird one!!
I’m just had to add that I am experiencing the Bible in the same way. Reading the OT, particularly Genesis, is moving my soul deeper. Makes the NT feel different.
So true… I had this thought months ago when I heard a very interesting story about St Symeon the prophet that held baby Christ in his arms. The tradition says that he one one of the people being resurrected at that day and appears to his family. He told them exactly what was going on at Hades while the souls were waiting for the Messiah and what happened when Jesus descended into Hades. They wrote things down and the Church has their writings. When St Symeon passed away he informed the souls that he held the Messiah and when John the Baptist passed away, he as well announced to the souls the ministry of the Messiah. He described that when Christ descended, He knocked the doors of Hades three times and after that the doors were shattered and the Light of the Lord entered Hades. The demons run to hide themselves and most of the souls ascended with Christ to Heaven. That’s why during the resurrection service, the doors at churches close and the priests knock 3 times and quotes Psalm 24:9
Great conversation.
Have to take up the cudgels for St. Francis. He is definitely not the feel-good Hippie the world wants him to be.
I LOVE the story of Parsifal! Redemption and self-sacrifice are divine themes, and in part this story was a seed that lead me to Christ. Like Parsifal, I also need forgiveness and I pray that God gives me the strength to sacrifice myself for the Ultimate Good, for Christ.
Martin Shaw is incredible. Would highly recommend watching one of his storytelling performances. The Fox Woman and the Hunter is a good start.
I’m using this medium to appreciate you in particular as a fan of mine and I want you to keep supporting me while I bring more entertainment to your way. Love you ❤️.. feel free to send me a friend request so we can talk better… I will try every possible way to reply you
I literally yelled YES when I heard Dr. Shaw is leading a course! Definitely signing up for that one
I needed to hear this intro at this moment…I’m making honey! There’s no such thing as wasted time…out Father makes use of it all…keep moving 🙏
"The soul is not fed entirely by logic ... " Thank God, otherwise most people would go hungry!
IN SPIRING AND HUMBLING..Deep BOW toy our both for sharing WISDOM in these increasingly ODD Tymes..
What a treat! Shaw can turn a single phrase that sends my imagination spinning.
I’m using this medium to appreciate you in particular as a fan of mine and I want you to keep supporting me while I bring more entertainment to your way. Love you ❤️.. feel free to send me a friend request so we can talk better… I will try every possible way to reply you❤
Jonathan, you made a comment in the video comparing an emasculated Christ with Saint Francis of Assisi. One of the areas in the story of Christianity that you may want to explore more deeply is the real life and ministry of St. Francis of Assisi (you may be missing something like the passage about the swords in Luke 22).
He is not gentle.
When I was considering becoming Catholic I seriously, was considering becoming Orthodox at the same time. I asked someone who I respected very much who had come into the Catholic church after studying Alexander Schmemann why he hadn't simply become Orthodox at the time.
His answer was startling in its simplicity. As a Catholic he could have St. Francis of Assisi AND the rich wisdom of the Eastern fathers.
This really struck me and convincing me that perhaps Francis was worth exploring more. As I've done so, I have discovered a tremendous wellspring of living water.
Always have time for Dr. Martin Shaw
Wow, you probably have no idea how encouraging this is for me, Dr. Shaw! I am so happy that I am not the only Christian who feels exposed and extremely challenged by Jesus and who finds the Bible strange and disturbing at times. It is so refreshing and beautiful the way you talk about the Bible and the old stories, I am feeling really inspired, thank you so much!
I’m using this medium to appreciate you in particular as a fan of mine and I want you to keep supporting me while I bring more entertainment to your way. Love you ❤️.. feel free to send me a friend request so we can talk better… I will try every possible way to reply you
At face value it would seem that these two men have a completely different view on how to approach and interpret (or not interpret) a story and it’s really nice to find a convergence when hearing you speak together.
I always enjoy it ❤
It seems alike. How do you think it’s different?
So nice to see someone from a part of the world I know - feels like I am completely surrounded by aliens in my small town, every person I try to talk to is being sucked into the insanity.. Every time I try to connect with other artists in my area I find my heart sinking as the conversation starts being infiltrated by words I recognise from the culture war (and not in a good way). I thought I had my family but even my children are being influenced somewhat despite my best efforts. I have lived my life surrounded by remnants of early Christianity, walking the dog past 7th century crosses, remains of chapels and places named after Arthurian myths so these feel very real and near at hand!
Stories are meant to prepare the soul but when we neglect the stewardship of stories we open ourselves up to deception.
This may be the only thing that saves my faith. Feeling very disillusioned and jaded with Christianity. Converted from Protestantism to Roman Catholicism, but it hasn't been enough. So much toxicity and things that are problematic in this church. I may be on my way to Orthodoxy, but I think I need to wander in the world of story and myth for a while before I can even do that. I can't stand modernity and most of modern Christians of all persuasions. I feel like I'm a closet pantheistic pagan, but perhaps Christian Wonder Tales could be the bridge to help me find wonder in my faith again, or discover it for the first time.
Don’t give up! Sometimes God lets us experience those things in order to tear down the false image we have of Him. Trust Him, He will lead you through this dark forest.
I'd really love to hear you expand on what has made you disillusioned and jaded. All in love brother
As a Catholic I’ll sometimes read GK Chesterton when I start to feel jaded
Go visit an Orthodox Church. It only took one time for me and I was IN! Glory to God 🙏🏻☦️
None of the denominations have it all right. Not Catholic, Orthodoxy nor Protestantism because they are run by fallible men.
Sold!!!! $$$ very excited! 😊
Martin’s my favorite.
It’s true! He did steal the show at Symbolic World. He’s the best prepared to show us how to tell stories again and re-enchant the world. Still over here trying to make a Rowan tree blush…..
I was so excited for this!!! ❤❤❤
I can only wait
I hope you meet up with Frances Hogan in Ireland one day. She explains the Bible in ways that are amazing. God bless.
i appreciate you fellows.
I really like Martin. Similar journey as mine to Orthodoxy. (Same age too!! lol) He’s a keeper. Have him on more, Jonathan;) Thank you both. Those of us coming to Orthodoxy after growing up Protestant and then voyaging the world away from it, and then returning to the true faith…well, it’s just nice to know I’m not alone. It’s such a deep process.🙏🏻☦️🙏🏻
My first Jonathan Pageau, Martin Shaw conversation . . . sooooo good!
Wonderful conversation, as always. ❤ So many insights, wise gems, and a pervasive atmosphere of wonder and joy in your ongoing discovery of ever more truth and beauty. It has been an immense gift to watch the "Team" emerging from the trees around the world and converging in "this little corner of the internet" over the past years, and a great privilege to participate in this expanding movement as an avid observer of your conversations and other work. Thank you!
This was one of my favourites since listening to Jonathan for almost 4 years. Thank you 🙏🏻 ❤
Thank you both! You two have been enriching my life and my faith so much!
Thank you, Martin. I love the way you turn phrases.
This is beautiful. Much love Jonathan. Much love Martin. I love the different takes to scriptures that are spoken.
Thank you!
An idea or a concept or reason itself are strategies we employee to reconcile or make sense of a partially presented image or story which is our lives on this footstool we call the fallen world.
Love this
CHRISTIAN WONDER TALES !!!!! I LOVE THISSSSSSSSSSS
I cant wait to listen to this!!!!!
“Stories will Save the World” - The Literary Life Podcast and the House of Human Letters
A good additional place to go if you enjoyed this conversation.
"The Holy Spirit goes where He will." 🕊 🩵
finally!!!!!!!!!
I don't know why, but I am sitting here weeping because this is exactly the apologetics I am trying to grasp and pass on as a homeschool mother who teaches not only her own children but other's children for 30 years so far. My instinct has always been to defend stories and story telling and I am once again at a crossroads with ideas about stories. This video has given me wind in my sails to once again defend the very nature of God and Jesus Christ through the multiple facets of story telling that reflect Him. I am very curious if you happened to watch the Epoch Times film "Up we soar"? I would love to see a conversation about some of the falun gong stories and parables that seem so imbedded in Christian theory. Sometimes as a Western christian I find myself challenged with the magnitude of the story of Christ and our christian fathers. When in the midst of the "nervous breakdown" of what God is calling us to, so many western christians want to circle the wagons and call names. I never see my Savior do that. I never see my Savior say anything but truth. We are not called to mimic the culture but to get into the river of the Logos. The story of God's dream from the beginning. I love so many of the analogies in this interaction. Thank you so much Jonathan and Dr. Shaw.
Great, Jonathan! It‘s brillant to bring Martin Shaw into the debate. Did you consider to reach out to Michael Meade? He might be relevant for your team, too.
A nod to medieval pole arms got me😅👍
Myth told me everything I needed to know about the conditions of life. Christianity showed me how to live it'...Word. Precisely my path past Campbell.
That struck me “you never hear someone say the one thing I can’t stand is a good story”
I’m using this medium to appreciate you in particular as a fan of mine and I want you to keep supporting me while I bring more entertainment to your way. Love you ❤️.. feel free to send me a friend request so we can talk better… I will try every possible way to reply you
The two swords, sell your cloak and buy a sword part was always strange to me too until I really looked at it and it's to fulfill the prophecy that he will be counted among the transgressors so he has to tell the disciples to bring the swords so they will transgress against the law when the others come to take him by attacking the official. He knows what will happen but has to get them to bring the swords which will then allow them to do what needs to happen for the prophecy. The parts of the Gospels where Jesus does something seemingly out of character often seems to be to fulfill a certain prophecy that must come true about the messiah. Love this one, always great to have Martin on with you.
Great insight. This seems to be a pattern in the gospels, as in Jesus wants to go in a different direction compared to the Messiah of the Old Testament, but he is bound by the prophecies, and so in a lawyer-y way he adjusts reality to fit the minimum requirements for his role.
In a weird way, this makes it sound like he's trying to "mantle" the role of Messiah, rather than being the expression of it. He fulfills some prophecies effortlessly, while for other ones he goes out of his way to make them come to pass.
I have been blessed today 🙏 two of my favorites, both incredibly gifted in the art of conversation 🔥 so much love, God bless you both 💖🕊️
Fun fact: the whole thumbnail photo reveals his boots are yellow.
In my Ruthenian church, I heard the legend that when the Holy Family fled to Egypt, their tracks were covered up by friendly spiders. Has anyone else ever heard of that ?
No, I haven’t. Thank you for telling me. I’m excited to learn about it.
@@maryadjalal5435 I heard about spiders doing the same when perscecuted priests were in hiding, the Spider would make webs over hiding place doors, so the soldiers didn't bother looking behind them as it looked like the door hadn't been used in ages ...
AMAZING
If this is in reference to spiders covering a cave with webbing, then, yes, but in a different variant. As @katyoduin3452 said, there are other variants of that story. I am aware of a Judeo-Christian variant where a spider saves King David fleeing Saul's soldiers by building a web over the cave entrance. There is also a variant in Islam where a spider protects Muhammad in a similar manner. I don't know enough about this particular folktale to be able to tell you which is the oldest recorded occurrence, but it definitely appears to have been in the oral tradition amongst varying people groups around the Levantine Sea.
Something will happen in the second hour of the Divine Liturgy...... Dude, every single time.
Thanks
Lovely 🥰
3:03 WoW! That is an excellent, amazing tale - what is the name of that story, where can I find it?
5:46 yes Yes YES! THESE are the sorts of tales I've been wanting to find. Thank you for helping me on my journey.
Looking forward to the course!
Foundations of Discipleship HERE
He’s exactly what you’d think a mythologist would look like
Failure can make honey. See he just did it.
Hello Dr Shaw, this was such an great conversation. The idea about what you forget in a story being something to grapple with, will ironically, stick with me for a long time I'm sure.
I was wondering if there are any updates, or any way of following updates on the Shropshire monestary situation? I noticed that the website is no longer active.
"Merry" is a word Thomas More used a few times.
I would be currious what stories in the Scandinavian pantheon he was talking about that are beyond redemption, or too suffused with witchcraft as he said
you must initiate, friends, before it is too late
Wonder Tale makes me think of Wonder Ridebooks from Kamen Rider Saber. And honestly I'd totally love to see that show's designs reworked into a longer, deerper, less hindered by COVID and being a weekly series that wraps up in a year. It only scratched the surface of swordsmen with the power of stories and symbolism.
I think we have something like these stories with Flannery O'Connor in the modern world
Pole-axed by wonder!
Listening to this at physio. This.
I would love to be on your team!
I’m using this medium to appreciate you in particular as a fan of mine and I want you to keep supporting me while I bring more entertainment to your way. Love you ❤️.. feel free to send me a friend request so we can talk better… I will try every possible way to reply you
The mirth is palpable.
59:55 Great conversation makes you want to join the team!
I'm going to be telling the story of the ramayana to the other people from my childhood orphanage. Diwali lands on the same day as Halloween and All saints Day this year 🪔🎃🕯️
Sounds demonically disgusting. Hard pass.
Let’s go 😤😤😤
somehow just noticed that their beards are a yin-yang.
27:44 orthobros on the internet pontificating seem to think that way, but tens of millions of OTHER Christians seem to not mind the music being contemporary. Preaching to the choir much? And how much does that actually help anybody?
Hello Jonathan, I mistakingly put the wrong address on a jack book order, and I'm hoping to find a way to change it before shipment. Previous attempts to contact through website haven't worked so hoping you might see here.
@JonathanPageau ☝😀💡I have an idea!
I know he's done a course for The Symbolic World, but why not also partner with Dr. Shaw to publish an anthology of these Christian wonder stories through the Symbolic World Press? I would love to add something like that to my collection. 😁
Groggily opened my phone and saw this started....tfw you realize you're on a different time zone then the poster. 😂
Oh he was saying that sometimes the Bible is just very surface and it says this happened that happened blah blah blah.
So he tries to bring the feeling into it. I would like to point out but that’s just what The Chosen does.
The Chosen gets deeper into these Bible stories and they do tell a story and they do tell interesting stories
And I don’t know if this gentleman has listened to The Chosen but he’s probably got his own stories…
But since I’m. Catholic we go deeper and you use your…
imagination!!!
St Ignatius!!!!
I think that’s what he does in abundance.
This was way too short! ❤
When and where can we watch your gospel series?
I feel catfished by Dr. Martin with that thumbnail
Jonathan, I think you would really enjoy looking into the symbolism of fish-headed people in the ancient, in relation to the virgin creation myth. Parthenogenesis is what I think is being symbolized. I think they were asexual, pre-human vertebrates that were far superior to their contemporary “homo sapiens”. I think they realized that the monkeys (homo sapiens) would not sustain themselves, become violent, and destroy their way of life, so they tamed them and taught them agriculture. Not actual fish heads, parthenogenesis.
After many years studying story, I am actually a little bit sick of great stories 😂
❤
Is this the real Tom Bombadil?
24:00 personal bookmark
God tells Abram HE will make his name great. This is the only way we can have our cake and eat it too.
"Saint" Francis of Assisi?
I know I'm a minority I don't like the story of Job. My reason is he's supposed to rejoice that he gets another set of children? What about the first set? That just breaks my heart every time I read it. Did he have a revelation that this life is like of second long vapor and that he would be with them forever? If so what about the days weeks and months and years where you're separated from them? I would die of a heart attack. I would not be that comforted by having a new set of children. Can anybody explain it to me?
1:01:30
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@@storytellermistymator you have a new sub. I saw on your website that you are in Pittsburgh. My wife and I live about an hour north. Small world. I may attend a workshop sometime.
@@Brad-RB Thank you! Small world! I hope we are able to connect through a workshop sometime.
If you're an hour northwest of Pittsburgh, you might be near the annual Beaver Tales Storytelling Festival and Ellwood City Storytelling Festival that happens every September. If you're interested in storytelling, it might be worth checking out next year.
@@storytellermistymator I will definitely check into the festivals. Thanks!
Pinpricks of eternity