Instead of pricing their Folds at $1900 and then offering crazy trade-ins and rebates, just list this at $1499 out of the gate. Many people see the ~$2000 price point and have no idea how much Samsung generally knocks off. They’re scaring those customers away.
It's about the math. At $2k, shows dollars in sales. The rebate is a a different line item. Look at T-Mobile. Their 'rebate' is a billing credit. Not the same as a rebate. But, not cash in your pocket either.
It's been well documented that at least in the U.S. market buyers would rather feel they are getting better deal with discounts over paying a lower cost. Just look into what happened when J.C. Penny tried pricing things at a lower cost instead of keeping the higher price and giving out discounts and sales. Also in the U.S. market many buyers equate a higher price with higher quality. So a lower starting starting price goes against the psychology involved in selling to the mass U.S. consumer.
@@culpjp in today's market, bottom line may hold a stronger sway. Showing higher dollar sales, is in some ways, a stronger indicator to some market watchers. In Samsungs case, they hold a much higher position in the SK market than other companies producing devices. If Samsung phones failed and disappeared, the impact to Samsung as a whole might be minimal. It might be better to investigate how Samsung does business outside of devices to see if they are trying something that works in other areas of their company. 🤷🏼♂️
@@philsaitta8820 Look at how they sell their tv's and other appliances in the U.S. market. They do the same as with mobile phones. They charge a high price and offer large discounts $700 or $1300 off. So Samsung is trying what other retailers already know about the U.S. consumer.
100% agree shane..Seems like samsungs main objective is to alienate the customer base to the point of no return. Absolutely unbelievable how they are approaching this situation.
I replaced my Z5 with a Z6 and absolutely love it. But cost is a factor. I'm certainly aware that eventually, and in the best interest to my wallet, to switch to the Ultra and just get a tablet.
All I'm saying is for the price, I need S24 Ultra specs in the fold. So that means same cameras, wider outer screen like the new fold SE, and the outer screen needs the anti glare coating. Do that and the majority of us will stop crying about prices if we feel like we are getting our money's worth
Bro, forget the crazy specs, just make it more durable. You can get the z fold 6 for 1500, it sucks that you then need like an extra 500 for Samsung care plus and potential repairs.
I just don't understand why they needed to remove the S-Pen support or shrink the battery when Honor has a digitizer on BOTH displays and a larger battery at a super thin size. Surely Samsung has a decent R&D depart??
I think this is a just a variant they considered for the original Z Fold 6. Then someone in sales and marketing came and said, "we need to release something in China quick". But R&D takes time, and they clearly did not expect their sales would be so bad, so this is 100% not something they planned a year ago. More likely someone was like, let's take the B variant we scraped 80% through development, change a few things and start hyping that.
My z fold 4 screen failed and the cover display has pink lines ( typical of Samsung ). I really love foldables but the price and durability leaves alot to be desired. I really wanted a more OEMS to adopt Surface Duo design Sigh..... i miss LG😭😭
I think people are forgetting the costs of these replacements screens and also the fact that Samsung R&D team worked hard on making that phone actually durable. Other foldables on the market really don't come close. Look at JerryRigEverything videos, or I remember seeing a video where someone used a machine to fold flip phones around 200,000 times or something and in the end only Samsung phone survived. That can't be cheap to do, and lowering the price to stay competitive with brands that are likely just now finding out how expensive it is to support warranty claims on their foldables is not a smart move.
What I'm taking from this decision from Samsung not to release a cheaper foldable is either that economically speaking, they either can't make these any cheaper and still meet their minimum profit margins on each unit sold or the other alternative is they can't make it cheaper and still maintain their minimum quality standards. I don't know how many units Samsung produces of the Z Fold annually and they are all made by them at their various facilities throughout Asia or some of those manufacturing is contracted to a third party like Foxconn and how this compares a Huawei or Honor or Vivo/Oppo and XIaomi but my guess on this would be those other Chinese brands making foldables are willing to take a bigger hit on profit margin than Samsung is and I don't see that changing unless Samsung feels it's the only way to cling on to the market share they have left and not continue losing what they have.
I have always wanted to buy a folding phone but I am afraid of the thin screens on the folding portion. And then with you having 2 failures with these folding devices, it makes me even more nervous. Then spending more for insurance on top of a really expensive phone makes it even worse. The final drawback is that despite the high cost, they are not flagship devices.
I have been considering samsung fold phones since its release but i just never been able to like the outer screen. I know there are other "normal" looking folding phones but i have trust issues with warranty specially with chinese made phones.
I remember the last time Samsung had a dilemma with their phones it was 2019 - 2021. They released lower end models of their flagships (S10E, Note 10, Note 20, S21 with a plastic back, etc.) They didn't know what they were doing but by 2022 they finally found a way out of it and have continued as such IMO it'll prolly be until 2026 until Samsung will finally be able to get out of the hot water they somehow stumbled into. I definitely agree that reducing the price is the way to go (since price does heavily influence a customer's buying decision), but judging by how poorly their budget flagships did from 2019 - 2021 I'm pretty sure they want to refine the budget fold concept until the time is right Or, worst case scenario, Apple releases a flip (not a fold), completely destroying the folding phone market and shelving the "fold" idea for good. Flips make more sense than folds anyways from a "phone" standpoint so it may not be far fetched to see the end of the fold lineup after Apple releases their flip
Makes sense to me. People absolutely love to be super critical of Samsung Folds and when durability was a huge pain point, why make a cheaper model that is forced to cut corners? I dont think it's alienating customers, I think it because the standards have to be high. 6 Generations in and id argue Samsung has the most polished Fold on the market. Making a cheaper model would reverse some of those achievements.
@scaryifliteral Because part of the package is durability. Every year, they improve the hinge, the screen, and resistance ratings. It's not like a slab phone where all you need to do is change the metal and glass. You also need to be able to create a distinguishable line between the Z Fold6 and Z Fold "FE" to drive sales to the more premium model. That would require using older parts and materials to cut costs. Also, there is more to it than just durability. For years, Samsung and other manufacturers see little adoption to foldables. It's growing, but I don't think the growth is quite there for a Z Fold "FE" to exist. For there to be a Fan Edition, I think you'd need more fans. Samsung is in a good spot right now and especially with the addition of the Special Edition model. We are getting a glimpse of a near perfect form of the Samsung Fold. In a few years, I think the adoption rate will be high enough where a "FE" model would be on the cards but for now, I don't see the problem of where it is now. I love my Z Fold6 and feel like it was worth every dime. While people seem to hate the front screen, I think it's a small price to pay for a near perfect inner aspect ratio. And the front screen isn't that bad. The inner screen is super comfortable to type on, and I see no issue with the dual app screen real estate. Although I would love for a bigger Z Fold, I'm glad to see the Special Edition gives me hope for that to come next iteration.
Removing the stylus for a Chinese market specific foldable googles the mind. Chinese text input with a stylus is way more efficient than using a keyboard.
Last week: “We are in crisis and want to fix things…” This week “…by raising prices and putting our products even more out of reach of most customers!” #winning
I think it is absolutely crazy to launch a product that is still a bit worse in terms of specs than competition for a higher price and only in the territory where they are completely losing... I have a long experience in business but this I cannot understand from any point of view...
I suppose when the SE comes out that would make the Fold 6 the cheaper option. Maybe after the SE they'll release a SE Ultra then there will be even more pricing options. 😂 These companies are so out of touch. Don't lower the price, just offer more expensive options so the lowest costing one seems affordable' 😂😂
I'm thinking they are testing waters. They are extremely cautious about that big screen market and it takes a bit more to manufacture I think they are testing to see if there is potential market hopefully this initial tests run will show that there is and make way for more bigger foldable devices next year This recent release is just... kind of poorly timed
And I have no interest in Samsung foldables. Because they can't do right by the customer. Even the " special edition" comes with unacceptable downsides. Especially for $2,000
It's funny how their sales went down as other foldable devices became available on the market... Maybe they'll get off their arse and actually start innovating again instead of resting on their laurels and collecting $$$$'s. Seriously, slow charging, thin narrow outer displays and 10 year old cameras. And increasing the price for the same old hardware. Hopefully they'll fix they're mistake and stop following Apple.
I feel like a lot of people who buy folding phones are tech enthusiasts, not your average everyday consumer. Maybe they should start marketing it as such. Go back to the drawing board. Start heavily flexing that your cameras are the best, that you're hardware is the best, that everything about your device is superior to the Chinese models, and actually back up that promise and make it happen. Samsung fully has the money and ability to do this if they choose to, I would argue even more so than these Chinese companies can.
Instead of pricing their Folds at $1900 and then offering crazy trade-ins and rebates, just list this at $1499 out of the gate. Many people see the ~$2000 price point and have no idea how much Samsung generally knocks off. They’re scaring those customers away.
This. I like to keep my devices instead of trading them in. Seeing the price in the $2000 range puts it off for me
It's about the math. At $2k, shows dollars in sales. The rebate is a a different line item. Look at T-Mobile. Their 'rebate' is a billing credit. Not the same as a rebate. But, not cash in your pocket either.
It's been well documented that at least in the U.S. market buyers would rather feel they are getting better deal with discounts over paying a lower cost. Just look into what happened when J.C. Penny tried pricing things at a lower cost instead of keeping the higher price and giving out discounts and sales. Also in the U.S. market many buyers equate a higher price with higher quality. So a lower starting starting price goes against the psychology involved in selling to the mass U.S. consumer.
@@culpjp in today's market, bottom line may hold a stronger sway. Showing higher dollar sales, is in some ways, a stronger indicator to some market watchers. In Samsungs case, they hold a much higher position in the SK market than other companies producing devices. If Samsung phones failed and disappeared, the impact to Samsung as a whole might be minimal. It might be better to investigate how Samsung does business outside of devices to see if they are trying something that works in other areas of their company. 🤷🏼♂️
@@philsaitta8820 Look at how they sell their tv's and other appliances in the U.S. market. They do the same as with mobile phones. They charge a high price and offer large discounts $700 or $1300 off. So Samsung is trying what other retailers already know about the U.S. consumer.
100% agree shane..Seems like samsungs main objective is to alienate the customer base to the point of no return. Absolutely unbelievable how they are approaching this situation.
I replaced my Z5 with a Z6 and absolutely love it. But cost is a factor. I'm certainly aware that eventually, and in the best interest to my wallet, to switch to the Ultra and just get a tablet.
All I'm saying is for the price, I need S24 Ultra specs in the fold. So that means same cameras, wider outer screen like the new fold SE, and the outer screen needs the anti glare coating.
Do that and the majority of us will stop crying about prices if we feel like we are getting our money's worth
Should've been this way from the start and then release a FE version.
Bro, forget the crazy specs, just make it more durable. You can get the z fold 6 for 1500, it sucks that you then need like an extra 500 for Samsung care plus and potential repairs.
I just don't understand why they needed to remove the S-Pen support or shrink the battery when Honor has a digitizer on BOTH displays and a larger battery at a super thin size. Surely Samsung has a decent R&D depart??
I think this is a just a variant they considered for the original Z Fold 6. Then someone in sales and marketing came and said, "we need to release something in China quick". But R&D takes time, and they clearly did not expect their sales would be so bad, so this is 100% not something they planned a year ago. More likely someone was like, let's take the B variant we scraped 80% through development, change a few things and start hyping that.
My z fold 4 screen failed and the cover display has pink lines ( typical of Samsung ). I really love foldables but the price and durability leaves alot to be desired. I really wanted a more OEMS to adopt Surface Duo design Sigh..... i miss LG😭😭
So well analyzed Shane. Most definitely Samsung making a Folded decision that just might Fold them in the future.
I think people are forgetting the costs of these replacements screens and also the fact that Samsung R&D team worked hard on making that phone actually durable. Other foldables on the market really don't come close. Look at JerryRigEverything videos, or I remember seeing a video where someone used a machine to fold flip phones around 200,000 times or something and in the end only Samsung phone survived. That can't be cheap to do, and lowering the price to stay competitive with brands that are likely just now finding out how expensive it is to support warranty claims on their foldables is not a smart move.
I wish they would honour their warranties better. So many fold 4 customers have had their device fail so much
What I'm taking from this decision from Samsung not to release a cheaper foldable is either that economically speaking, they either can't make these any cheaper and still meet their minimum profit margins on each unit sold or the other alternative is they can't make it cheaper and still maintain their minimum quality standards.
I don't know how many units Samsung produces of the Z Fold annually and they are all made by them at their various facilities throughout Asia or some of those manufacturing is contracted to a third party like Foxconn and how this compares a Huawei or Honor or Vivo/Oppo and XIaomi but my guess on this would be those other Chinese brands making foldables are willing to take a bigger hit on profit margin than Samsung is and I don't see that changing unless Samsung feels it's the only way to cling on to the market share they have left and not continue losing what they have.
I missed the old ceo of Samsung.. The one who gave us everything on the note 9...bring him back 🎉
I have always wanted to buy a folding phone but I am afraid of the thin screens on the folding portion. And then with you having 2 failures with these folding devices, it makes me even more nervous. Then spending more for insurance on top of a really expensive phone makes it even worse. The final drawback is that despite the high cost, they are not flagship devices.
I have been considering samsung fold phones since its release but i just never been able to like the outer screen. I know there are other "normal" looking folding phones but i have trust issues with warranty specially with chinese made phones.
I've just returned my Pixel 9 Fold Pro, just wasn't keeping up with the performance I expected. Out of curiosity, what's your daily Shane?
Could you elaborate on this?
I remember the last time Samsung had a dilemma with their phones it was 2019 - 2021. They released lower end models of their flagships (S10E, Note 10, Note 20, S21 with a plastic back, etc.) They didn't know what they were doing but by 2022 they finally found a way out of it and have continued as such
IMO it'll prolly be until 2026 until Samsung will finally be able to get out of the hot water they somehow stumbled into. I definitely agree that reducing the price is the way to go (since price does heavily influence a customer's buying decision), but judging by how poorly their budget flagships did from 2019 - 2021 I'm pretty sure they want to refine the budget fold concept until the time is right
Or, worst case scenario, Apple releases a flip (not a fold), completely destroying the folding phone market and shelving the "fold" idea for good. Flips make more sense than folds anyways from a "phone" standpoint so it may not be far fetched to see the end of the fold lineup after Apple releases their flip
Long term, Samsung may ditch the folding phone entirely as i dont think its been as beneficial as they originally thought.
A bigger battery size would have maybe justify the $2000.
The Apple employee running their mobile seems to think they could do anything and everyone will buy
Makes sense to me. People absolutely love to be super critical of Samsung Folds and when durability was a huge pain point, why make a cheaper model that is forced to cut corners? I dont think it's alienating customers, I think it because the standards have to be high. 6 Generations in and id argue Samsung has the most polished Fold on the market. Making a cheaper model would reverse some of those achievements.
Why would being cheaper mean less durable?
@scaryifliteral Because part of the package is durability. Every year, they improve the hinge, the screen, and resistance ratings. It's not like a slab phone where all you need to do is change the metal and glass. You also need to be able to create a distinguishable line between the Z Fold6 and Z Fold "FE" to drive sales to the more premium model. That would require using older parts and materials to cut costs.
Also, there is more to it than just durability. For years, Samsung and other manufacturers see little adoption to foldables. It's growing, but I don't think the growth is quite there for a Z Fold "FE" to exist. For there to be a Fan Edition, I think you'd need more fans. Samsung is in a good spot right now and especially with the addition of the Special Edition model. We are getting a glimpse of a near perfect form of the Samsung Fold. In a few years, I think the adoption rate will be high enough where a "FE" model would be on the cards but for now, I don't see the problem of where it is now. I love my Z Fold6 and feel like it was worth every dime. While people seem to hate the front screen, I think it's a small price to pay for a near perfect inner aspect ratio. And the front screen isn't that bad. The inner screen is super comfortable to type on, and I see no issue with the dual app screen real estate. Although I would love for a bigger Z Fold, I'm glad to see the Special Edition gives me hope for that to come next iteration.
Removing the stylus for a Chinese market specific foldable googles the mind. Chinese text input with a stylus is way more efficient than using a keyboard.
real deal, front is too narrow, still too fragile, especially with dust
Last week: “We are in crisis and want to fix things…” This week “…by raising prices and putting our products even more out of reach of most customers!” #winning
Z Fold 4 plus ?
I think they see themselves wanting to be Apple
I think it is absolutely crazy to launch a product that is still a bit worse in terms of specs than competition for a higher price and only in the territory where they are completely losing... I have a long experience in business but this I cannot understand from any point of view...
It only makes sense if there are reasons they can't compete spec for spec and dollar for dollar.
@@scaryifliteral I am biased in evaluating their strategy - as Samsung and foldable fan, I am angry that they did not make it available for me 😬
I suppose when the SE comes out that would make the Fold 6 the cheaper option. Maybe after the SE they'll release a SE Ultra then there will be even more pricing options. 😂 These companies are so out of touch. Don't lower the price, just offer more expensive options so the lowest costing one seems affordable' 😂😂
I'm thinking they are testing waters.
They are extremely cautious about that big screen market and it takes a bit more to manufacture
I think they are testing to see if there is potential market hopefully this initial tests run will show that there is and make way for more bigger foldable devices next year
This recent release is just... kind of poorly timed
That being said
What is with that price
And I have no interest in Samsung foldables. Because they can't do right by the customer. Even the " special edition" comes with unacceptable downsides. Especially for $2,000
It's funny how their sales went down as other foldable devices became available on the market... Maybe they'll get off their arse and actually start innovating again instead of resting on their laurels and collecting $$$$'s.
Seriously, slow charging, thin narrow outer displays and 10 year old cameras. And increasing the price for the same old hardware. Hopefully they'll fix they're mistake and stop following Apple.
Samsung is becoming the Asian version of Apple
Nonody should buy this shit . Samsung has gone nuts .
Lol doesnt huawei own honor? So ~50% is huawei
I feel like a lot of people who buy folding phones are tech enthusiasts, not your average everyday consumer. Maybe they should start marketing it as such.
Go back to the drawing board. Start heavily flexing that your cameras are the best, that you're hardware is the best, that everything about your device is superior to the Chinese models, and actually back up that promise and make it happen.
Samsung fully has the money and ability to do this if they choose to, I would argue even more so than these Chinese companies can.