I enjoy learning about more things aside from beat making. Being a current bedroom beat maker, these kind of videos make me more interested and invested into it. Thank you so much.
But again what's the market value of "[Someone] type beats"? According to Economic Theory, it is the value that people want to pay. If 5000 producers are ready to produce type-beat for $120, there is no way you do just the same for $10000. The same thing is in any other business (got it from experience): if you make an average product, you make average money. But I agree with DJ Pain: if you provide some additional value - you can build relationship with your customer and do upsales and cross-sales (like for mixing and mastering). So the Beatstars thing seems like a normal "first touch" place.
Took notes on this one too. Great refresher on a lot of concepts. "You need content strat, consistency, funnel, periodic promos. Upload to 10 platforms if you need to. Lead with value." Your vids make the information accessible because they aren't overproduced + not needing to wait through constant promo and ads. Great perspectives.
Yeah. I’ve produced on and off for like 30 years At the time I was able to sell a beat in 1994-99 for 250$ as and get it Like you said you have to adjust it’s basically saturated now as opposed to the 90’s Most of my sells come in person. I e built a reputation in my area for being solid and versatile I still give out free beats and charge a lot less I’m happy not wealthy by any means Just love doing it and still have my day job
GREAT VID, the roads where art and business cross is a very CHAOTIC / CROWDED intersection . music creation has become more streamlined and monetizable than it ever has and I get why these tatics should be discussed and built upon amongst the community. with that being said TO ME (to me just my opinion) all this stuff sounds icky and goes against the core values of the genre (HIPHOP) not talking about pop or rock producers specifically speaking on HIPHOP. there is NO LOSSes when making a track. there is NO LOSS in the creation of a quality instrumental . if you gave it away for free there is no loss. if no one else heard it but you there is no loss... since these labels liquidated and hid behind entities like distrokid and tiktok . all of a sudden the artists are starting to sound more an more like the labels. (partly because now artists are starting to understand what it feels like to genuinely invest money in a volatile product like art) NOBODY WANTS TO LOSE. sorry somebody gotta lose, MOST PEOPLE ARE GONNA LOSE. most ppl creating music now.... shouldn't even be creating music . the real community needs to finally pull together and focus on making the overall group an actual commodity. the majority of money made from music is NEVER ever routed back into the community of artists that make it . RIGHT NOW its like a snake eating its own tail.. we need to focus on pension programs. venture capitalist investment groups. crypto currency infrastructure , credited houses of education. the solidification of hip hop on a religious/spirtual level. political voting blocks (a hip hop political party) IT'S TIME to really start playing the game, and stop faking the funk we have to break past the nickel and diming. there is NO AMOUNT OF MONEY that can truly represent how much the process of making a beat is worth. its outer worldly. with all the tools we have at hand now . we need to focus on building SYSTEMS that allow the ppl that SHOULD be creating to create while receiving proper funds because they are creating and are actively or retro actively adding to cultural market and or its progression
Thanks Pain, good video and while Im not a fan of Busy I do like to see someone like You talk about Him with something to actually say vs others who basically names drop and troll Him for views.
Man back in the 2007-2012 Soundclick days people were payin insane amounts of money to stay at the top of the charts lol shit was unreal. I miss that era of the internet, super nostalgic to look back on 🤣 Anyone remember Imeem? That was like the Myspace of beatmaking 😆
@@DJPain1 eh it is what it is bud. You still made a successful career out of this and that my friend is a massive fucking win. Been makin music since about 06, was in a 45mph head-on car collision due to a drunk driver swerving into my lane, chronic back pain for the rest of my life... Being creative while being in pain is hell, still make music here and there but I definitely gave up on trying to turn it into a career by 2012 or so.
You know what’s crazy, I am good at marketing. I have online businesses and all kind of pages with big following making money. But for some reason, I just don’t want to market my music. So much to the point where I just say fcc it and forget I do what I do. Like the business side of music I just don’t want because I just want to make the music
Free beats isn’t the issue.. Monster has trucks of people giving out free energy drinks and they’re a billion dollar company… The issue is producers not following up with leads, not having more than one product, not running ads, not going to events and networking, and not creating content to attract their perfect client… At the end of the day the producers that treat this like a business sell beats… the rest don’t.
@@thmlife free beats is the issue when we want to get paid tor making beats. Most humans don't support and much less want to make energy drinks. False equivalent.
make a ranking list (for yourself) of your beats from less "premium" to more and put the less ones for free in a "buy 1 get 3 free" discount - could be a good strategy...people allways want as much as possible for their money, so the question of best price becomes secondary
The Buy 1 Get 1 Free automatic bulk deal never worked for me. I remember telling a customer years ago that he could get another beat as well if he wanted and he didn't respond but completely x'd himself out of my email list and blocked my email address so I could never reach him again. I think he only cared about getting the 1 beat he wanted and dipping and not giving a toss about what else I had to say. To this day, I am still humbled and have never tried to run this deal again
I don't think thats the reason he blocked you. Some people just get what they need from you and take an exit, its weird but you shouldn't take that as a personal hit, it probably has nothing to do with you. Don't let that hinder you from freely experimenting in the future. Now when it comes to buy 1 get 1 free deal, never really saw success with it either and have heard from other producers that it really isn't an incentive for artists to buy beats because originally they only wanted one, they'll end up tossing the other one. buy 2 get 1 has seemingly given me better results, but I can't really say that the 3rd beat was really needed by the artist. I'm not saying those deals never work, but its not def not the incentive for artists to buy beats 100% of the time. When it comes to bulk deals, what has worked for me is offering them when someone is interested in buying exclusive beats. I give a bigger discount if they buy more than 1. Those have been the biggest paydays for me throughout the years.
About the “me” type beats thing: I got no room to knock people for doing what they want but at the same time, it’s like…damn, you can’t at least see Wifisfuneral or Cordae on it? The stuff Tierra Whack has done, the stuff Monaleo gets on, the stuff that Redveil hops on, and you can’t at least see them on it?
I’ll just say it if you won’t: if you can’t hear anybody on your beats and you can’t assign a genre, mood or era to them, your beats are messed up or your ear as a producer is messed up.
Nothing is wrong with labeling your beat after you or your style. As beat makers uour market is not the world it's other artist and starting with a select few is the way it has always been done.
One other thing, in regards to pricing. I think when some have this conversation they forget we're talking about leases. You want to sell your exclusive for $1million dollars? Go ahead if you can. But I saw a guy selling his MP3 lease for $100. C'mon dawg 😂 🤦🏾♂️
So I’ve been producing music seriously for 7 years now and I’ve gotten sales here and there but I never made consistent sales ever in all these years…. Do you do one on one consulting?
Takes money to make money! Hardwork and determination right!? I pay for new equipment, updates, samples, sample clearance, ect.... so I agree $180 a year is nothing!! It takes time and marketing skills... I always tell people the beat saelling game really is 90% marketing and 10% beatmaking IMO. As always appreciate your advice opinion and all the content you do PAIN!!!
Should be focusing on bringing people to your own personal site, charting on a site takes a lot more effort and money that can be put into your own page imo.
The sharing mechanisms that exist on social media don’t extend to personal websites. Beatstars has a built in user base of customers, just like eBay or Etsy.
How do you list all your beats for “X percent off” without having to go into each beat and do it manually? Maybe I’m just dumb cause that’s what I did before but it takes hella long😂
@@DJPain1that I’m aware of I was mainly talking about changing the titles of all your beats to say for example[50% off get 9 free] like you see in the trending page. I’m not sure if you can only do that manually for every single beat on your page but I’m just lazy to go through every beat and change the title😂
@@DJPain1 ok, but these are not regular customers, they are "customers" that have customers as well. If a customer buys a chair for their house, they might be inclined to shoo at that place again if they like the experience. The difference is a contractor buys a tool and though the customer experience is appreciated, the functionality of the tool is of the most importance. In many of our scenarios the music is a tool and the customer experience is such a small part of the entire project. I think we devalue artist by thinking of them as customers vs skilled artisans looking for a highly functional tool.
Yall can use black hat marketing to easily make sales. Scraping, cold emails..etc I just don’t want to bro I guess imma be stuck until I find me somebody that go do it for me lol
Has Beatstars ever put out how their charts/ranking algorithm works? I know its based on sales but if thats the case then why bother with correctly tagging seo'ing the beat if the top charts is going to just be full of a certain type of beat anyway?
Yeah it’s just based on sales. And to answer your question, I haven’t had a beat in their top charts for years and I’m still making six figures, so that’s why you handle your SEO. Just because you’re not charting doesn’t mean you’re not selling.
Definition of ‘expose’ is ‘make (something) visible by uncovering it.’ He made the average cost of the top charting beats visible by doing the math to uncover those figures, then we both analyzed the implications of that
Pain I just watched a old video of yours and noticed that mole on your cheek has got a lot larger over the past few years, It is probably nothing but I would definitely get it checked out if I was you.
I get it this is a business but respectfully this dude makes horrendous music no Spotify plays and doesn’t even sell beats his take on selling beats is completely bullshit yes if u make awful music u prob will have to resort to these tactics for a sale Please value your work you do not need to make type beats or 20 leases to be successful
Don’t pay to get your music on Spotify. Use the promo code “ATODDS” at www.toolost.com for free premium distribution for three months.
Thank you !!
You're the Best! Thank you so much for everything!
Thank YOU
Busyworks is a legend fr💪🏼
I love seeing you n busy work together yo even if just a shout out
Appreciate these types of videos Pain. You're for sure a valuable figure in the producer community.
Appreciate you for watching
@@DJPain1 Just sent you an email Pain. 🎵
I enjoy learning about more things aside from beat making. Being a current bedroom beat maker, these kind of videos make me more interested and invested into it. Thank you so much.
Thank YOU
My goal atm is the build a catalog first then push with ads.
I hate that whole system because it killed the value of music production pricing with that kind of gross undercut.
Yeah it's a pure race to the bottom where the people doing the most work, producers, are compensated the least. Shit is so slimy.
But again what's the market value of "[Someone] type beats"?
According to Economic Theory, it is the value that people want to pay.
If 5000 producers are ready to produce type-beat for $120, there is no way you do just the same for $10000.
The same thing is in any other business (got it from experience): if you make an average product, you make average money.
But I agree with DJ Pain: if you provide some additional value - you can build relationship with your customer and do upsales and cross-sales (like for mixing and mastering).
So the Beatstars thing seems like a normal "first touch" place.
Took notes on this one too. Great refresher on a lot of concepts.
"You need content strat, consistency, funnel, periodic promos. Upload to 10 platforms if you need to. Lead with value."
Your vids make the information accessible because they aren't overproduced + not needing to wait through constant promo and ads.
Great perspectives.
@@TRXST.ISSUES thank you so much
Yeah. I’ve produced on and off for like 30 years At the time I was able to sell a beat in 1994-99 for 250$ as and get it Like you said you have to adjust it’s basically saturated now as opposed to the 90’s Most of my sells come in person. I e built a reputation in my area for being solid and versatile I still give out free beats and charge a lot less I’m happy not wealthy by any means Just love doing it and still have my day job
Gabe (from LegionBeats) explains the business side of this in a great way also!
Blessings Pain1 and Busy Works
🙏🏽🙏🏽
Great, actionable advice as always 🔥💯
Appreciate it!
GREAT VID, the roads where art and business cross is a very CHAOTIC / CROWDED intersection . music creation has become more streamlined and monetizable than it ever has and I get why these tatics should be discussed and built upon amongst the community. with that being said TO ME (to me just my opinion) all this stuff sounds icky and goes against the core values of the genre (HIPHOP) not talking about pop or rock producers specifically speaking on HIPHOP. there is NO LOSSes when making a track. there is NO LOSS in the creation of a quality instrumental . if you gave it away for free there is no loss. if no one else heard it but you there is no loss... since these labels liquidated and hid behind entities like distrokid and tiktok . all of a sudden the artists are starting to sound more an more like the labels. (partly because now artists are starting to understand what it feels like to genuinely invest money in a volatile product like art) NOBODY WANTS TO LOSE. sorry somebody gotta lose, MOST PEOPLE ARE GONNA LOSE. most ppl creating music now.... shouldn't even be creating music .
the real community needs to finally pull together and focus on making the overall group an actual commodity. the majority of money made from music is NEVER ever routed back into the community of artists that make it . RIGHT NOW its like a snake eating its own tail.. we need to focus on pension programs. venture capitalist investment groups. crypto currency infrastructure , credited houses of education. the solidification of hip hop on a religious/spirtual level. political voting blocks (a hip hop political party) IT'S TIME to really start playing the game, and stop faking the funk
we have to break past the nickel and diming. there is NO AMOUNT OF MONEY that can truly represent how much the process of making a beat is worth. its outer worldly. with all the tools we have at hand now . we need to focus on building SYSTEMS that allow the ppl that SHOULD be creating to create while receiving proper funds because they are creating and are actively or retro actively adding to cultural market and or its progression
Thanks Pain, good video and while Im not a fan of Busy I do like to see someone like You talk about Him with something to actually say vs others who basically names drop and troll Him for views.
He’s a popular target for trolling
@@DJPain1 Definitely.👍🏻
Man back in the 2007-2012 Soundclick days people were payin insane amounts of money to stay at the top of the charts lol shit was unreal. I miss that era of the internet, super nostalgic to look back on 🤣
Anyone remember Imeem? That was like the Myspace of beatmaking 😆
Wish I had been active online then 🤦🏽
@@DJPain1 eh it is what it is bud. You still made a successful career out of this and that my friend is a massive fucking win.
Been makin music since about 06, was in a 45mph head-on car collision due to a drunk driver swerving into my lane, chronic back pain for the rest of my life... Being creative while being in pain is hell, still make music here and there but I definitely gave up on trying to turn it into a career by 2012 or so.
You know what’s crazy, I am good at marketing. I have online businesses and all kind of pages with big following making money. But for some reason, I just don’t want to market my music. So much to the point where I just say fcc it and forget I do what I do. Like the business side of music I just don’t want because I just want to make the music
It’s a psychological roadblock. I know a lot of people like this.
@@DJPain1 Yo, you dead right bro. I can't even argue.
@@iceprada2 it’s worth exploring. You don’t want to live with regrets.
Just what i needed to hear 😊
This helped a lot thanks pain💪🏼
Thanks for watching
I Blame all the Producers in the 2010s for giving out Free Beats and Kits ! Messed up the whole game for Clout ☠️
I got two plaques off of giving away free sample packs
@@DJPain1 I Understand there is always someone that can pull it off. but I'm talking about the other 85% . Free Isn't For Everyone !
1 persons success is not a guarantee for anyone else.@@DJPain1
Free beats isn’t the issue.. Monster has trucks of people giving out free energy drinks and they’re a billion dollar company…
The issue is producers not following up with leads, not having more than one product, not running ads, not going to events and networking, and not creating content to attract their perfect client…
At the end of the day the producers that treat this like a business sell beats… the rest don’t.
@@thmlife free beats is the issue when we want to get paid tor making beats. Most humans don't support and much less want to make energy drinks. False equivalent.
Scam is by far the most overused word today. It simply tells me that a person doesn't know what's going on when they say it. 🤷🏾♂️
Can think of one other overused word but I’d lose my channel. But you’re absolutely right
😂😂😂😂No one more relaxed than you Pain!!🤷🏾♂️
uploading to 10 platforms is a lot. I don't even think I can name 10 (not including the trendy ones).
I upload to about 7 and that doesn’t include voisy, soundclick or SoundCloud
@@DJPain1 Where are the wells gang?! Put the pdf out already, funnel me bro!
make a ranking list (for yourself) of your beats from less "premium" to more and put the less ones for free in a "buy 1 get 3 free" discount - could be a good strategy...people allways want as much as possible for their money, so the question of best price becomes secondary
I believe at this point I need to do a consultation..I wanted beat sales to be my retirement gig, but it's not working out
Yessir here’s the link: bsta.rs/0171bfe5f
The Buy 1 Get 1 Free automatic bulk deal never worked for me. I remember telling a customer years ago that he could get another beat as well if he wanted and he didn't respond but completely x'd himself out of my email list and blocked my email address so I could never reach him again. I think he only cared about getting the 1 beat he wanted and dipping and not giving a toss about what else I had to say. To this day, I am still humbled and have never tried to run this deal again
I don't think thats the reason he blocked you. Some people just get what they need from you and take an exit, its weird but you shouldn't take that as a personal hit, it probably has nothing to do with you. Don't let that hinder you from freely experimenting in the future.
Now when it comes to buy 1 get 1 free deal, never really saw success with it either and have heard from other producers that it really isn't an incentive for artists to buy beats because originally they only wanted one, they'll end up tossing the other one. buy 2 get 1 has seemingly given me better results, but I can't really say that the 3rd beat was really needed by the artist. I'm not saying those deals never work, but its not def not the incentive for artists to buy beats 100% of the time.
When it comes to bulk deals, what has worked for me is offering them when someone is interested in buying exclusive beats. I give a bigger discount if they buy more than 1. Those have been the biggest paydays for me throughout the years.
thank you for the share
Thanks for that info bro 😊
Thank you for the content some good stuff
Pain 1 incredible share 👊
🙏🏽🙏🏽
About the “me” type beats thing:
I got no room to knock people for doing what they want but at the same time, it’s like…damn, you can’t at least see Wifisfuneral or Cordae on it? The stuff Tierra Whack has done, the stuff Monaleo gets on, the stuff that Redveil hops on, and you can’t at least see them on it?
I’ll just say it if you won’t: if you can’t hear anybody on your beats and you can’t assign a genre, mood or era to them, your beats are messed up or your ear as a producer is messed up.
@@DJPain1 agreed, and I think regardless of which of us says it, it has to be said, you know?
Nothing is wrong with labeling your beat after you or your style. As beat makers uour market is not the world it's other artist and starting with a select few is the way it has always been done.
We need a video on email marketing and customer rentation. Please!
Yessir I have a couple of those
💯pain1... great vid no doubt
Great video. Do you think it would be helpful if Beatstars made a limit of how low you could sell a beat for?
I don’t think it would help anybody tbh
The word scam has lost its meaning. It's unfortunate that most people who want to do something with the thing they love forget it's a business.
Exactly
Should I offer a free download for my tracks with a BeatStars follow or no?
I wouldn’t. The only options that come with data ownership are email or sms
One other thing, in regards to pricing. I think when some have this conversation they forget we're talking about leases. You want to sell your exclusive for $1million dollars? Go ahead if you can. But I saw a guy selling his MP3 lease for $100. C'mon dawg 😂 🤦🏾♂️
So I’ve been producing music seriously for 7 years now and I’ve gotten sales here and there but I never made consistent sales ever in all these years….
Do you do one on one consulting?
Yessir here’s the link www.djpain1beats.com/services/97
Takes money to make money! Hardwork and determination right!? I pay for new equipment, updates, samples, sample clearance, ect.... so I agree $180 a year is nothing!! It takes time and marketing skills... I always tell people the beat saelling game really is 90% marketing and 10% beatmaking IMO. As always appreciate your advice opinion and all the content you do PAIN!!!
Thank you for your thoughts! Do you spend money on ads to market your actual beat (e.g. beatstars promo or youtube ads)?
Yes I do
Should be focusing on bringing people to your own personal site, charting on a site takes a lot more effort and money that can be put into your own page imo.
The sharing mechanisms that exist on social media don’t extend to personal websites. Beatstars has a built in user base of customers, just like eBay or Etsy.
Busy works beatssssss
You said at the end that you pay $180/mo for Beatstars? Did you mean $180 a year?
Ugh yeah 180 a year
How do you list all your beats for “X percent off” without having to go into each beat and do it manually? Maybe I’m just dumb cause that’s what I did before but it takes hella long😂
You go into Beatstars and click on ‘discounts’ and create a code
@@DJPain1that I’m aware of I was mainly talking about changing the titles of all your beats to say for example[50% off get 9 free] like you see in the trending page. I’m not sure if you can only do that manually for every single beat on your page but I’m just lazy to go through every beat and change the title😂
@@farraribeats I believe you can just change it on your display name, but I’ve never done thay
Return customers are easy if the beat helps them to make money.
If the customer experience is good and the musical chemistry is there, that’s what tends to matter ime
@@DJPain1 ok, but these are not regular customers, they are "customers" that have customers as well.
If a customer buys a chair for their house, they might be inclined to shoo at that place again if they like the experience. The difference is a contractor buys a tool and though the customer experience is appreciated, the functionality of the tool is of the most importance.
In many of our scenarios the music is a tool and the customer experience is such a small part of the entire project.
I think we devalue artist by thinking of them as customers vs skilled artisans looking for a highly functional tool.
🔥🔥
So, according to 5:17 you should become a lawyer to make $250k? (just kidding)
Yall can use black hat marketing to easily make sales. Scraping, cold emails..etc I just don’t want to bro I guess imma be stuck until I find me somebody that go do it for me lol
Glad I got mailchimp 😮😂
Will somebody give tips or strageties on beatstars promo?
My interview with anywaywell addresses this. Hoping to make a video about it myself though
Has Beatstars ever put out how their charts/ranking algorithm works? I know its based on sales but if thats the case then why bother with correctly tagging seo'ing the beat if the top charts is going to just be full of a certain type of beat anyway?
Yeah it’s just based on sales.
And to answer your question, I haven’t had a beat in their top charts for years and I’m still making six figures, so that’s why you handle your SEO. Just because you’re not charting doesn’t mean you’re not selling.
GOAT!!!!
Hope you’re well
@@DJPain1 yessir..
I’m about to contact you
@@cuevaswalker 👀
Oh SH*T!
wait so where was the 'exposing Beatstars' part? 😂
Definition of ‘expose’ is ‘make (something) visible by uncovering it.’ He made the average cost of the top charting beats visible by doing the math to uncover those figures, then we both analyzed the implications of that
Brings me back to the future producers forum 😂 ayyyyyyyy🫡Pain
Oh man that place
@@DJPain1 It was the friends we made along the way bro😂🫡
Pain I just watched a old video of yours and noticed that mole on your cheek has got a lot larger over the past few years,
It is probably nothing but I would definitely get it checked out if I was you.
It’s not a mole; it’s hyperpigmentation from a scar
I get it this is a business but respectfully this dude makes horrendous music no Spotify plays and doesn’t even sell beats his take on selling beats is completely bullshit yes if u make awful music u prob will have to resort to these tactics for a sale Please value your work you do not need to make type beats or 20 leases to be successful