@@RollingThunder69 yes. There were several references to drinks... presumably, he was planning to go to a bar afterwards for continued conversation with whomever wished to join him. This is a common thing in some circles.
@@lightbeforethetunnel theists also do it and project it onto atheists. Tribalism is no good, individual people are perfectly capable of the same shit behaviour regardless of their philosophical framework
+Michael Rahm Not trying to belittle his argumentation, but it's easy to make sense if your arguments are based in reality while you're arguing against fairy tales.
I must tell you that it isn't often that I come across someone that sees things almost exactly the way I do. I was raised in a Lutheran church and school, so I had church on Wed and most Sundays, plus Catechism class. Confirmation thought 8th grade culminating in a Confirmation event at the end of the year. As a kid in school, I asked questions that didn't make much sense to me that didn't square with bible teaching, like where did the dinosaurs come from? Where did pre human hominids come from? And the answers they gave me didn't make much sense, so I just realized they didn't know. High school and college were spent with a lot of comparative religion, including occult. I saw religion for what it was, more of a control mechanism than anything else. I still do have a sense that something more is "out there" and that there's more than one dimension of existence, but as for organized religion, I see it as deeply flawed ideas promulgated by deeply flawed thinking. So, welcome to the Land of Free Thinking....
also agrees! four generations of hardcore Lutheran awkward silence in my family. I am glad aaronra is not a preacher. He could have all sorts of wives with that voice. maybe take ALL the ladies!
"I don't need to live forever. Whatever meaning my life has is what I mean to someone else. That is all. And that is enough." That, right there, that little collection of sentences are worth infinitely more than anything and everything in any and all of the world's "holy" book.
@TMPanos96 In the grand sceme of things, everything is worth nothing. But let us step away from that for a moment. It is humans who go to heaven, all other animals just die, yes? Well then why do ants trudge forth through the undergrowth, using all their might to protect and feed their queen? Why does it matter? It matters for them because that is what their life is, they do not worry about after. Now let us turn to a living thing you can more easily relate to- dogs, why do they eat, drink, bark, and play if their life means nothing in the end? Well, because it is their life, and many dogs find joy in causing joy, and find joy in just living. Why must there be more? Why must there be an eternal reason for life, why can't we just live? We are animals, yet we are the only animals foolish enough to worry about what happens after death, and the only animals brash enough to assert that we must have a greater cause
@@moonshadow1795 Nah. Your wrong you dont know what your talking about. They that know God will be humbled. They that know themselves will be in hell _-|-_
@@jeziscricket4448 Going to be tortured forever because we refuse to bow to your cruel and incompetent human sacrifice. And the option is to worship your brutal deity for all eternity. What a shitty god and shitty religion.
I never made any comment about Hitler other than refuting your lies and never, ever put words into someone's mouth, that is a sure way to lose you respect and credibility. I said the Catholic Church needs to be careful about bandying about Nazism and this is true given that Catholic priests in Italy assisted several Nazi war criminals escape to South America. This is a documented fact, look it up. The Pope at the time was also keen not to wade in and declare himself against Nazism, rather stating the war was caused by economics etc. The Nazis (excluding the more radical occultists, who by the way were not Atheists) had minor quarrel with Catholics in Germany compared to Jews, Homosexuals, Bolsheviks and the list goes on.
You mentioned Nazis. Hitler was the #1 Nazi Not all Catholics are Christians. Some Catholics follow the religion as part of their culture and not faith. There's the term "Christian Catholics". The distinction is made Because all Catholics are not christians. It is true Occultists like demons know that God exists thats why they hate him. Some atheist say they don't believe in God but some hate him and his followers anyway. There seems to be a contradiction here.
Ok so now we're getting into the definition of Catholicism which is irrelevant to my point and yours but I'lll go over it briefly. Catholicism is a branch of Christianity no matter how or why you follow it, ergo not all Christians are Catholics but all Catholics are Christian by definition. Religions are not democratic and are not defined by their followers views, i.e. whether Catholics have to be Christian or not, they are by definition as the religion they choose to follow, be it culturally or through faith is a Christian religion. I will not debate further on this point here (contact me by message if you wish to explain further) as it is irrelevant to the original point at hand which is; The Catholic Church did not condemn Nazism during the war. Priests within the church assisted Nazis in escaping from the punishment they so richly deserved at the end of the war. Ergo it is a fact that the Catholic Church does need to be careful when using Nazism as a political weapon.
When they hear their beliefs out loud, those beliefs sound as stupid to the believer as to the nonbeliever, and the discomfort of cognitive dissonance kicks in.
@@Stevevick-ve6kh I highly recommend Aron Ra's videos on evolution and abiogenesis, as clearly whatever education system you were enrolled in has failed you. I would also take a look at his series "Refuting the Unrefutable Proof of God" where he addresses a lot of misconceptions regarding evolution held by people that don't understand it. Honestly, though, I doubt you're actually going to care to comb through the mountains of evidence for evolution and how ridiculous the refutations are. Most people that don't believe in evolution are going to put their fingers in their ears whenever it comes up, because it's one of the best refutations of the Argument for Design and if you actually understood it entirely (and its implications for the rest of the universe) then you would no longer believe in a creator deity. But religion is literally a pseudoscience - it makes claims and then uses confirmation bias to support those claims, rather than making claims based off of evidence. So you can watch these videos and come to the slow realization that there isn't a God, or you can try to bait people into a one-sided argument where you just say they're influenced by Satan or that you have faith and that somehow magically discounts observable reality. You won't learn anything from egging people on here, you have to go educate yourself and leave your religious echo-chamber in the search for truth. There's no such thing as "evolutionists." There are just people that are scientifically literate.
@15:32 As an American soldier who has been in very real fox holes on 7 different occasions, I can say that there absolutely are athiests in fox holes. As an atheist who has been in 7 real fox holes during a war against a religious theology, I can say as a fact that there were even atheists on the other side.
mrbobmanbob _(referring to the "god montage")_ "Verily, that self-proclaimed 'God Warrior'...creature is a foul servant of Nurgle. Purge it in the name of the Emperor!" _(laughs)_ Seriously, though. If I were to see six-foot three-inch Gwendoline Christie... www.aceshowbiz.com/images/wennpic/gwendoline-christie-premiere-game-of-thrones-season-3-05.jpg ...cosplaying a Sister of Battle (and why not, when she already plays Brienne of Tarth on-screen?), *that* would be something to fetishize. _(grins)_
Re-watching this, I came across something when Aron mentioned the talking donkey in the Bible. In Shrek, Donkey, a talking donkey, is referred to as a "fairy-tale creature". That film has been promoting atheism this whole time and I never realized that :O
It's horrible seeing African Americans caught up as such solid believers in the Christian faith. Church attendance is statistically particularly high among ethnically black communities. Slavery was a terrible piece of history but what makes it even worse is the fact that those slave communities were so particular vulnerable to the influence of the Christian religion.
At the onset of slavery, christians COULD NOT be slaves. Thus, many Africans had incentive to convert to Christianity. After that was done away with, black-led churches were used to organize slave revolts or make plans for escape. Later on, during Reconstruction and Pre-Jim Crow, Christianity was a way to assimilate successfully into mainstream society. During Jim Crow, of course, you had the civil rights movement which was practically founded, organised and implemented within Southern Black Churches. Remember, MLKJ was a reverend. Black churches organized food drives and gave loans to businesses white institutions denied to black people. My point being, Christianity has always had a practical and even beneficial place for black people in America. They do not view the church in the same oppressive lenses that some white atheists do, because largely the some of the modern criticisms DO NOT apply to black churches founded by Africans (like the AME). They don't see their churches as a part of mainstream churches and its baggage. They think of it as civil rights, business loans, community development, etc. Its important to tell people about the errors of religions, and problematic elements of the bible that endorse slavery, but you cannot harken back to the ills and acts of mainstream churches to convince black people, mainly because they ARE NOT A PART OF THE MAINSTREAM CHURCH. I'm sick of seeing this tired argument and it's clear very few white atheists realize the enormous role black churches played past and present that impact current feelings about it.
You're arguing the social benefits of religion but that's hardly exclusive to black people at all. The argument that blacks still have a baseless faith in an god imposed upon them by the same people they were slaves to (an concept which their bible supports) has not been addressed, and there are numerous other issues you've overlooked, such as the fact that regardless of the social aspect these blacks are still deeply religious and mired in their faith and yet still are the most poverty stricken demographic in the US. In this respect, American Blacks (and now currently, even ever increasing amount of Africans) have had an religion imposed on them and have basically accepted indoctrination and stockholm syndrome on an cultural scale. Its no different than the Irish. So it appears even the social aspect of religion hasn't helped them out very much, leaving me to wonder what your argument even is.
Logic and reasoning at its finest!!! People r sheep being led nowhere and they r so blind and ignorant!!! Whats scary is i live with a Catholic woman and her religion!! She attacks people mentally with no cause and she does the same thing to me with such disrespect and dishonor and has been this way since i have been with her but she blames the world and me 4 her horrible and negative attitude. Her moral compass contradicts the very religion she follows!! Its sad and hypocritical not to mention very very scary one can act like her.
@@mariemm200 the truth is that if any group of Black people larger than 20 met any place other than a church - the police came. Church was the only place to meet together and organize marches, boycotts, and other peaceful protests. Additionally, by professing religious faith, Black people hoped to give racist America one less reason to persecute them.
@@mariemm200 I'm sick of seeing this tired argument and it's clear some people love to downplay the enormous harm churches in general did to blacks, as well as ignore the enormous role secular individuals had on the civil rights movement. From the beginning, slavery as well as racism generally were all justified via the bible. While churches were used to help blacks assimilate in society, they were also the meeting homes for the KKK and other racist organizations that had the explicit goal of removing blacks from American society. Meanwhile, all of the "white atheists" throughout the country's history were far ahead of the curve when it came to support for equal rights and opposition to racism. Furthermore, the positive role churches played in the 1950-60's civil rights era is vastly overstated. While King was a reverend, he surrounded himself with secularists and atheists and communists, many of whom such as A. Phillip Randolph were at least as central to the movement as King himself. The version of Christianity that King preached was so watered-down and whitewashed that it was virtually indistinguishable from secular humanism. There were also dozens of churches that fought against MLK's efforts, many of whom arguing that he was too revolutionary while others were themselves stewing pots pro-segregation anti-white racism. Care to remember, King's famous "Letter from Birmingham" was in response to criticism from other religious officials. And most importantly, the aggrandizing of the power of churches for black people has led to a whole new problem of frauds and hucksters to get away with whatever they want just because they're preachers. And finally, regardless of how people see it, black churches ARE part of mainstream churches and their baggage. They still teach the same hateful preachments against atheists, women, gays, trans, and sometimes even people of other races. They still engage in science denial. They still prize faith over reason. They still rake in millions of dollars without paying a dime of taxes. Remember, it was the white secularist Hamiltonians who started the first real abolitionist ideology in America. It was the white secularist Lincoln who ended up freeing the slaves. It was the white secularist Darwin who was able to empirically who that there was no justification for racism. It was the white secularist FDR who ensured that the economy was stable enough so that people had time and money to participate in the civil rights movement. It was the white secularist Kennedy who elevated King and his efforts and gave him the biggest platform in the world. And it was the white secularist LBJ who actually signed the Civil Rights Act and made sure that the efforts of the movement paid off. And while none of the people I mentioned were in fact atheists (except arguably Lincoln and Darwin), they all did the great things they did for secular reasons and were opposed every step of the way by the churches of America.
Once you get over the fear of hell, there's an amazing sense of liberation and responsibility that washes over you. It's not something I got to experience since I was never really a believer, but damn. I've seen it on other people, and it's kind of amazing.
@@Stevevick-ve6kh yeah, believe my bed time stories or else... Nothing will happen after you are dead except that you wasted a big chunk of your one and only life
@@Stevevick-ve6kh "Arrogance" says the one who claims to have a loving relationship to the most powerfull being imaginable xD You should think about which position is arrogant. So what i hear from you is arrogance and ignorance. But you 'll find out that you wasted your life after dead ;) ... wait a moment... No you won't, because you just simply won't exist then anymore. Sad... You are totally wrong and never will find it out.
@@Stevevick-ve6kh are you afraid of the flying spaghetti monster? Are you afraid of the monster under your bed? That's exactly how afraid i am. By the way, why do you expect i did not already read it? Reading the bible is the fastest way to become am athesist since most people see through the absurdities the bible claims. You literally believe in talking snakes, donkeys and unicorns combined with an immoral monster called god. There are countless contradictions in the "unfailable word of god". And even if you would manage to explain those away, the sheer existence of unclearity proofs that either god doesn't exist or don't want me to be sure about his existence what would contradict that he "reveals himself to everybody"
They know it. They're not unlike Holocaust deniers in that; it's very difficult to convince people to follow their evil ideology when people know what they actually believe.
I don't know how much of this is meant to be satire, and how much is just "having fun", but... the misogyny being shown (and/or parodied) here is so ugly.
Almost felt like pinching myself in the middle of that montage to assure myself I wasn't having a nightmare. That was absolutely horrifying and really sad to see that people like that still exists today. Disturbing. I wish all the strength to you rational folks over there who have to live surrounded by those people.
I bet if biblical literalists were no longer allowed to benefit from any science that contradicts their bible, they would suddenly become much more flexible in their views.
It's horrifying how many people admit they would be evil without their delusion. "Where's my moral compass?" Golden rule, Mr Harvey. I don't need the threat of eternal punishment to not be a terrible person.
"I don't need to live forever. The only meaning my life ever had was whatever my life meant to someone else. That is all, and that is enough" mark 34:25 Awesome Quote, Very beautiful Statement. If I wasn't going to be cremated one day, I would have this engraved on my tomb stone.
personally, I was taken by (I think it was) hitchens who talked about how when he died he wanted to be buried so to make sure that he gives back to the earth nutrients since he has taken many from the earth while alive.
I can tell that black girl felt personally offended. She heard him trash the belief system of Christianity and felt offended so she accused him and all atheists of all kinds of stuff he did not do. Trashing her and all Christians, misrepresenting the bible, etc. Definitely an emotional reaction. I guess that is what happens when the belief system is wrapped up in the person's identity. They probably came there to confront an atheist.
Richard1979hush all behavior is linked to belief which includes non-belief in God or any religious doctrines. i think its important to recognize that non-believers and believers alike can share given points within each of their systems.
Cognitive dissonance creates a lot of stress. That's why she seems so agitated. She is clearly using confirmation bias to attempt to resolve the cognitive dissonance and confirmation bias prevents her from seeing how badly she has failed to do so. Before you feel too superior, know that we are all vulnerable to confirmation bias. It is not in any way exclusive to religionists.
Richard1979hush _all behavior is linked to belief_ I really have to take exception to this. There's a growing body of work in a variety of different fields that suggest that our moral decisions are largely a product of instinct and that ideology plays a very minor role if it is involved at all. In most cases, I would argue that the purpose of ideologies is to provide rationalizations for decisions already made.
@@Furtherawaystill Sure, which also means Adolf Hitler, whom considered himself a Christian and defender of Christianity and invoked God to justify his evil deeds, is in heaven according to according to the tenets Christianity.
I actually shed a few tears when Aaron was talking about all that matters when he dies is that he mattered to someone in the here and now and that he made a difference.
You know what sucks? I went to Eastern Illinois University, and this wasn't advertised. I would have loved to go to this talk. I was on the verge of disbelief and just started learning about philosophy around the time this talk happened. It's nice to see an atheist shaking up Charleston, IL. Keep up the good work friend. You're doing great things *****. At least I can watch this talk now.
I feel sorry for the young lady during the Q and A session. She confuses criticism of her religion for denigrating people and she is amazingly ignorant of the content of her bible. Sadly, she chooses to be that way.
"I read the bible for myself and I understand it "this way".:" Well. I am so glad that the book as guided by the Allmighty one is one you can read in like a billion of ways and get different conclusions. I'm sure that's exactly what the plan of a perfect being, who has a specific message to bring people under him. Such a clever, totally not illusive and brain breaking plan.
It was sad and almost heartbreaking, to watch his eloquent and thoughtful speech. And then the gals in the audience, not understanding anything of the topic at all. The general response from them: „Why do you mock me?“
to the first woman (well, technically two) in the Q&A, I would've gone in a completely different rout by corrected her in describing what an atheist is: someone that (in this context) does not accept christianity in the same way that a person in a marketplace can say that they're not going to buy from a merchant, and continuing with that analogy, the woman is essentially asking why the person is trying to sell his merchandise to the merchant, when in reality, he's only describing why he's not buying from the merchant... which is, unfortunately, a fundamental misunderstanding that a LOT of people have
I'm saving this video to show my mom today. After 53 years of fundamental Christianity she is now questioning her faith, after witnessing the hypocrisy of her clergy. It hurts my heart to see her struggling with her waning faith. But, her starting to question things gas repaired so much damage in our relationship. I appreciate your knowledge.
I would highly consider watching videos by ThermaminTrees as well. His videos are a little more palatable, and I love Aron, but he can feel abrasive sometimes. ThereminTrees pulled me out faster than anything else.
During that montage of what religious people think of atheists, one guy said "what do they fill the void with? Stuff. Things." My guy, I am experiencing the world. I am living each day. I am seeing the beauty of the nature around me, and all of the wondeous creative things people have invented, entire fictional worlds as well. My brain is well-stimulated with wonder.
I'm an atheist, and I believe in *everyone's* eternity, I just don't believe in *my* eternity. The future will go on without me, but hopefully made better by me being here.
Ultimately heat death will end "us" if we survive the rest of the horrifyingly difficult challenges to come. Our climate is fucked. We have to find a new star at some point.
@@BumbleBee-eh3cn Are you serious? Who are YOU to state emphatically how things "work"? Great minds who study physics, the universe, human behavior, and history of life on this planet agree on just a few basic ideas. There is so much in debate in physics, the number of "realities", the essence of "time". You base your very simple thinking on religious teaching, which gets angry and battles other ways of thinking as being at war with their God and beliefs! How can something that narrows the human mind be any source of absolute truth? It can't.
@@2degucitas religions agree on a few basic ideas as well, one of them being the eternal soul. there is less disagreement than you might think. christian scientists in the middle ages deserve more credit, as do spiritual intellectuals everywhere.
i don't understand why people keep saying you're too close-minded to see god. on the contrary, in my "personal experience", believing in god is the easiest thing. any child can easily believe in some invisible being in the shadow. but i find everything in high school physics, chemistry, biology, mathematics so counter intuitive that you must retrain your brain to think in a ways that are not intuition-based. To NOT believe in god takes education.
Wow man. Just wow. You blow my mind on a regular basis. So respectful and well spoken as you eviscerate the lies we've been told. Thank you for helping me on my journey. You're an amazing man Aron.
@Dexter O'Shields sure she would, perhaps would've had more self restraint. Apparently science isn't where everyone places their faith so to speak. You shouldn't think them foolish if you're a true atheist.
@Dexter O'Shields faith just means complete trust and confidence in someone or something. And science means the intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behaviour of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment. Faith can be with or without knowledge and science is a conglamorad of any knowledge proven or theoretical. So in a sense you must have faith in science in order to believe in theories like evolution etc.
@Dexter O'Shields bingo faith doesn't require any of those like you just said. Faith by definition(not interpretation as in hebrews) means:noun 1.complete trust or confidence in someone or something. Science does require those though. Not everything in science can be demonstrated as proof, much of it is theoretical and hypothetical. Like Stephen Hawking was only a theoretical physicist ,meaning anything he theorized on was only tested out in a lab and not out in space like in real life. the intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behaviour of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment.
Those 2 women can't form a single coherent thought, let alone actually argue a point. When she said it actually doesn't promote slavery, at that moment I would have stood up brought her a bible and showed her otherwise.
Many believers are accustomed to yelling lies, untruth or misinformation just like many many outspoken dishonest priests pastors or even "believers scientists' like J. Lennon, Craig, . They are in the habit of uttering something knowing to be false or not believing it to be true, (that is what deception means)
The girl asking the questions is an exact example of what Aron said about christians projecting their behavior on atheist. And to top it off she didn't listen to anything that was said in the whole presentation, she came only to fight.
When Aron Ra dies he will not know, think, wish, remember, dream, or be anything - and yet, he will still be more intelligent and moral than a creationist.
Aron Ra, started as a child mistrusting religion, got hooked for years, then woke up around 39years old. Have had 30 years of happiness and freedom of mind ever since. Have had the time to learn and do so many wonderful things.The freedom far out weighed the criticism of people. It all seems so ridiculous to me now. The brain washing is sad.. Every religion thinks theirs is right and the others are brain washed.
Not just every religion but sects within the same religions think they are right and everyone else is wrong...They all need to wake up and see that all religions are wrong about everything.
I moved to a bigger town because religious people calling me avful because of my sexuality. I'm living in Sweden. I'm transsexual. People kicked and destroyed my bicycles. I don't want to live in Jahve anustown anymore.
I've watched many of Aron's public speaches now and this is the first one where we see christians defending their faith. Up until now I thought that only atheists exclusively attend these.
Those girls in the Q&A session don't know their bible AT ALL and came across as very gullible and annoying AF! I commend Aron Ra for his patience and politeness. Well done!
I must admit, I am a bit sad as an atheist, but not because I don't believe in god, because everyone judges me in an unfair way! other atheists are proud to be atheists because they have the ability to understand the world, sometimes more than myself, and for this... I am proud to be an atheist despite the depression and hatred I am forced to eat everyday! ALL HAIL SCIENCE!
I always come back here from time to time because this speech was one of AronRas best. I especially like the exchange from 50:23 to 54:15 about the meaning of life. His response was humorous but also very thoughtful. A wonderful listen!
I went to a Catholic school preschool to third grade. I was into it all the way. I met the Nun each morning and carried her heavy bag from the convent to the school, I was planning to be an alter boy.....then my Father got a nice work promotion and substantial pay raise. My parents were ask to meet with Pastor after church where our entire family was asked to leave the church and never return. I have never seen my Mother so sad...she cried all the way home. My Father was livid and when the smoke cleared I asked what happened....the church wanted the entire pay raise and if we didn't "donate" we had to leave the church........we left. I was telling my friends when an older kid asked...I suppose you believe in Santa and the Eater bunny too? He clearly pointed out that Religion was only deterrence. I don't remember who this person was but I consider him to be one of the best people I have ever met.
@@Ergeniz it’s a disease that has plagued our species for 1000s of years and just needs to be considered obsolete at this point. It didn’t benefit ancient tribal savages and it sure as shit doesn’t benefit us now
I like how people are attempting to say, "Hey the bible doesn't support slavery" and Aron is quite clear capable of pointing to the verse that they clearly never read.
@@guyparrish4349 No. Just because we don't believe there is a man in the sky giving us morality doesn't mean that we believe there is *nothing* inherently evil or wrong. There are other ways to determine if something is right or wrong beyond merely being told by an authority. I know this is just shocking for you, but some of us are able to actually look at slavery, it's effects, and decide for ourselves that it has no positive outcome, and is inherently an evil action based on it's own lack of merits. Seriously there are multiple different schools of thought on the best way to decide what is right or wrong. It's not just, 'My preacher said God doesn't like this' Or 'Free-for-all.' That's just bullshit. Besides, if you want to bring in hypocrisy, believing that the unchanging word of God is the only source of morality... and just ignoring the fact that morality under that religion has shifted massively over the thousands of years it existed is pretty hypocritical, don't you think? Or are you going to pull a no true Scottsman and say none of those historical Christians were actually Christians when they sited the bible as justification for owning slaves?
@@guyparrish4349 Okay, look, I'm not trying to answer for every atheist since that's not possible. We don't have scriptures to argue over interpretations of being the absolute truth. So every atheist might very well give you a completely different answer. As for your claim on if not God, then morality can not be objective, then... no, I completely disagree. Think of it this way. You're in a game, where every choice you make changes several stats. If you desire to get one of those stats to be as high as possible, then there is an objectively best way you should chose in order to maximize that outcome. While yes, the things one chooses to prioritize is subjective, the decision you should make to achieve it is not, but an objective fact. So to answer your question on why slavery is evil inherently in *my* view, that is because it deals excessive amounts of harm and suffering to a large population, for minor conveniences for a much smaller population that could even be gained in a different way, without causing the harm. This needlessly increases the suffering of the world, and I would argue is an inherent feature of slavery. Thus inherently it is evil. Now here is the things that might actually befuddle you. While I believe there is indeed an objective moral standard to achieve my desired outcome of maximizing human well-being, I do not believe, humans, with our limited perspective, can be certain of what it is. After all we can't predict the future or the full knock on effect of every decision especially when it mixes with every other decision ever made, so we have to operate on best principles. Things that while might not always have the most best of all possible outcomes, are reliably going to lead to positive outcomes. Applying to slavery, even if there are some situations where slavery might lead to an objectively beneficial state to humanity as a whole, we still shouldn't implement it, because the vast, vast, VAST majority of the time, slavery has horrendous outcomes, so simply isn't worth the risk to find the 'exceptions' should they even exist. Addressing your other points. Past: No, I do not believe gay was immoral a 100 years ago, nor now, and while I do think uncheck promiscuity does lead to harm, homosexuality doesn't inherently lead itself to that. I think the correct answer would and is to encourage sex between homosexual lines paralleling at least traditionally heterosexual cultural norms of only being within long term stable relationships as that seems to be the best for creating long term happiness. Repression and active persecution of them instead only lead to more suffering. Present: No, I do not believe putting people to death for drinking alcohol is moral. Perhaps an argument could be made that drinking excessively is also immoral but extreme punishments for minor moral misdeeds are not moral either, and are more likely to create excessive suffering then simple drinking. Future: No. I think the evidence is pretty clear that pedophilia inherently leads to the trauma and life long suffering to the vast majority of children that are on the receiving end of it and this does not change with the culture. While yes I could be convinced that an individual child might not suffer, I have to point out my best principle argument laid out above that, just because exceptions might exist, since we can't know, we shouldn't needless risk, especially for such minor conveniences as temporary sexual gratification for the pedophilia adult. Though it is possible to change my mind on any of the previously mentioned point, or indeed any other moral position I hold. All you have to do is provide evidence that convinces me that another position will lead to a consistently happier and better off population. After all, as they say, the proof is in the pudding. Now as for your objective moral standard. Even if the objective moral stand is what you say it is, the issue still remains that we can't know it. Your problem is the same as mine, in that we both can not be certain of what our objective moral standard actually is. After all, the interpretations of your has changed over the years. Ever Christian nation was pro-slavery at some point, despite the 'fixed moral eternal standard' of your God. In which case, I find your appeals to him completely useless. If you're just guessing at what your God wants, and claiming absolute truth in it, you are a liability to become a tyrant, not a saint. Most troubling, you will be one who thinks yourself righteous. And as such, I find your views on morality more likely to lead to evil, rather good outcomes, despite your best intentions.
@@guyparrish4349 1) That's not how anything works. Just because humans are not capable of certain beyond mathematical and logical proof, doesn't mean that things don't have an actual truth beyond faulty human perception. You might as well claim just because I can't be a hundred percent certain about reality, means things don't exist. No that doesn't follow in any way. Also, no you can't be certain about your own standard. You can only think you can, because once again, you are a faulty human, and can be wrong and wouldn't know it. In fact, you or another Christian *has* to be be wrong, since you disagree about aspects of the bible. Someone has to be wrong. That's my point, and your only escape from this is to claim all other Christians that disagree with your interpretation of the bible, aren't Christian which, you would have to prove, otherwise it's just a no true Scotsman. Second of all for you logical argument, the entire premise one is something I completely disagree with. I've explain an overview of philosophy, but you just aren't addressing it because you clearly didn't understand it. Your claims about atheists being unable to agree on a moral standard means it has to be subjective in our view is just laughable. That's like saying just because no one in the fifth century could give you a consistent of why things fall down, means not that we haven't discovered the reason why, but that it is subjective. No. We just haven't learned it yet. The reason things fall down is the same regardless of what humans think on it. And I'm proposing the same thing about morality. You clearly didn't understand my 'highscore' analogy and somehow thought it benefited your view point. Simply put since actions have effects, in order to maximize the effects there are objectively actions you should take. In other words you can have an objective standard for actions one ought to do without the need of a God. Secondly, you fail to understand I do not view social norms as having any direct connection to morality. Just because something is a social norm does not mean it is either moral or immoral. Also yes, if you can prove me wrong that means my understanding of my moral stand isn't complete and you've refined it. Just like when we discover that the speed gravity accelerates to the center of an object changes with the distance from it, that doesn't mean the initial framework was wrong, but rather incomplete and we have now can create one that has a wider and more accurate use case. 2) Really, okay, so you believe the bible says that Lucifer was in the Garden of Eden, and was the snake that tempted Eve, I presume. Well In the medieval times, that wasn't a belief, but instead it was Lilith, the first wife of Adam, who escaped after learning how to fly because she learned God's true name, and became a demon. This is a fairly major change I would think, considering most modern Christians I've ever interacted with don't believe that Lilith exists. Not to mention there are entire sections on how to treat slaves, despite this being against God's will right? Also, didn't Moses command that when conquer a people, you are to kill all the males, and all the women who 'have known the touch of a man' but the virgin women and girls are to be kept as slaves? Yes, your God really is the moral standard against slavery. 3)Your attitude doesn't align with that. You clearly act as if you think you are better then those who disagree with your assumption that god is real, due to a book that has been edited, translated, and interpreted by human hands over thousands of years, yet somehow nothing substantial changed with the meaning of it. 4)First of all, you are cherry picking hard core if you want to claim that atheists are responsible for the most suffering. First of all. Hitler of course, with "God with Us" proudly stamped on their belts and with the approval of at least members of the Catholic Church of the time. Not to mention the Crusades, the Inquisitions, the religious massacres, and conversion by the sword that just Christianity has done. Combine this with every other religion in the world, and it's pretty clear that's just human nature to be evil to those who are deemed outsiders. Second, you are pretending all atheists are of the same type. The primary reason why Stalin and Mao were anti-religion is because they didn't want any competition to their power grab. It make shock you, but I'm not only not a communist, I'm anti-communist. Now onto your assumptions on my character. I'm not attacking Christians, I'm friends with plenty, and respect their right to their beliefs... However, I am hostile to people who are arrogantly certain despite being wrong. So no I'm not trying to destroy your church, or your god, or even yourself. However I have no patience or respect for your arrogant certainty about things you can't know and smug self-assurances that you are a moral agent due to the fact you decided a book is the reason for you having a moral code.
@GUY Parrish Dude.....why are you typing essays in the comment section? If you're typing this much then it's safe to assume you're not saying anything important.
@GUY Parrish If you're too stupid to realize that nobody in their right mind is gonna an essay in the COMMENT section then who exactly are you embarrassing? If you believe in talking snakes, a flood that never happened on a global scale, as well as an event that's absent from actual historical documents then you yourself are not living in reality. If Jesus was alive then why doesn't he speak up for himself? Why doesn't he convince everybody by simply showing up? If an immortal can't actually die then wouldn't that defeat the purpose of having a sacrifice? How is Jesus both the son of God and God in the flesh? BTW Creationism isn't science.....whenever you guys claim to be talking about science you reference people that aren't even credible in that field of study. I don't see how you can think you're spouting truth when the Bible's claims don't exist in the history of other cultures.
We have as high a per capita number of religious believers and our Creationist believers aren't far behind the Americans. In fact we have our own George Dubya in office right now. Harper is a young earth creationist.
All faith is blind. It is not something to be proud of and is definitely not a good thing to use as a basis for making serious decisions about life. It is, in effect no better than guessing and wishful thinking, based on a desperate and futile hope. I think that Faith should be reclassified as one of the seven deadly sins. Faith gives a person permission not to think or reason. It is the last despairing action that people resort to when there is something in which they want or feel they desperately need to believe, but for which they have absolutely no evidence and no reason other than that do-or-die need to believe. Faith is simply another name for self-delusion.
Michael Dennis By keeping their followers ignorant of the facts and fearful of the consequences of not believing, religion has held back scientific and social development for centuries. I read an article some years ago that suggested that due to the negative effects of Religion, in all its forms, we are at least 500 years behind where we could have been, without it, both scientifically and socially.
Oh...There's to many variables to even say, that is why I left the comment short and as is. Since if religion never existed...well, none of us would be here either, the entire human history would have been altered.
"Morality" is not a term I use, but mutual aid is. As Kropotkin argued 120 years ago, co-operation, mutual support and caring for each other are an evolutionary advantage, and one of which our species is particularly capable through complex speech, our enormous brains, et. We have other evolutionary advantages of course, but mutual aid is a strong one. I view caring for, and doing no harm to my fellow humans and our common habitat on this fragile planet not as "morality" or "being good" but simply as practicing mutual aid.
The four virtues, as traditionally taught, were patience, justice, temperance and fortitude. None has anything to do with faith. The four virtues are secular, and anyone can learn and benefit from them.
if you are christian you dont have to obey to any law or moral because jesus saves you anyway. Atheists are held responsible for their actions. Similiar a comedian once said "I am a very religious person, as a child i always prayed for a bike, for years i prayed day and night but nothing happened....then i saw a beautiful bike belonging to someone else so i stole it and confessed to a pries. so i had a bike and was free of my sins and i figured...so thats how this works"
You do not have to obey, he is correct. You have to admit you do wrong and then you have to ask Jesus into your life as a person saving you from your sin. That is it. Also, you can never lose your salvation.
As for the bike, he may have gotten possession of the bike, but it was not his. He may have used it, but never really enjoyed it because it was not his and he knew that. Sin always has consequences and the sin consequences will catch up with thief. Also, Jesus forgives sin. God forgives sin. You do not have to go to priest. When you accept Jesus all sin before and ever after are forgiven. But forgiven does not mean you escape consequences of bad behavior on Earth. The bike thief will still have to pay in some form.
You obviously do not understand Christianity and are incapable of stringing together a coherent sentence . Lmao I am not a christian but I can tell you it's a little more complicated than that!
@@BumbleBee-eh3cn No... He won't. He will pay the actual crime of Theft. But this "Sin" of Theft... Yah all Christians even Moses would be in hell. Every sin is forgiven and all have a spot in Heaven... Except those who committed the sin of Disbelief
Erasmo Hernandez I have every right to mock your backward religious views. I will not sit down and shut up to pander to beliefs that deserve ZERO respect.
I don't need respect from you. My views and millions of others views come from the Bible. You don't believe the Bible thats your choice. The bible is our foundation. What is your foundation? Faith in Nothing?
I don't need faith. Faith is just subjective apologetics. Science is OBJECTIVE. I follow the evidence wherever it leads, and it doesn't lead to any deity any more than to Santa Claus or unicorns. Your position, Erasmo, amounts to "I don't know, therefore, magic".
Get your brain out of your limited world. There is more than meets the eye. I would not call the realm I experience every day magic. I would call it the spiritual realm. a kingdom you know nothing about because you refuse to be open to it. You don't know what you are missing.
46:52 this is describing me: when I was a Christian, I was hateful towards a lot people and of other things. When I became an atheist, that shell cracked and I became a humanist. Maybe because I realized that everyone deserves to be treated like a human being. I do have a higher power and that’s Love. Not a person, not a deity, but the principle of love as a power to appeal to when I come to a crossroads, I ask myself, “what would be the loving thing to do?” I don’t need a god to tell me what is right or wrong or what love is.
I fucking love this guy! My only complaint is that he doesn't have enough videos! I was an agnostic atheist before him, but he turned me into a gnostic atheist! Evolutionary theory is my passion and he delivers on that front as well!
When I was a child I remember hearing the verse about faith being able to move mountains. As I couldn't move mountains, I figured I must not have enough faith, I didn't consider the alternative. That really made me feel terrible though because I thought that I should have and that I was doing something wrong.
I love the ending to this speech, particularly about 33:50 onward. The Q&A bit was hard to watch though. I find it really sad and pitiful to see people who are offended rather than enlightened.
It's always nice to read a lot of alliteration in a perpetually (pretentious) presuppositionalist proposition, especially if parentheses are purported to be involved in perpetuating this pathetic position...
like your screen name. Somehow it is a virtue, guess Jesus is saying, trusting in my fathers words. Who to trust? that is question. God says trust me for a more abundant and loving everlasting life. What is the other side offering?
Sometimes I despair for Amerika (The K is intentional) , a once beautiful idea of freedom and liberty descending into fascism and socialism backed with religious fervor and the largest military on the planet. As an Australian atheist I watch friends and colleagues in Amerika try to spread common sense and scientific method continually repudiated and mocked by people that are essentially uneducated fools, the great shame of which is how much stupidity comes from the main stream media there.
America was founded on bigotry, inequality, and violence (much like Australia). It’s tradition to war and violate, to engage in facism and aggressive religious idiocy. We are not socialist (my native ancestors were) by a long shot. The ideas of liberty and freedom were only ever truly allowed to wealthy Christian white men.
Wow those questions from the religious in the crowd were very interesting. Their way of thinking truly is different from my own in a significant way. Like they have some sort of mental block.
+Roedy Green That is the thing, I have read a lot of the bible and it is a vile book. Christians cherry pick or try to contextualize it to reinterpret it to make it seem like it is full of good things. That is why they have to rely on a tangled web of beliefs that in the end make no sense and have no logic behind it. Also if all else failed they just say well it is god's will or just have faith. It literally fouls the mind and twists it. Which is why believers act in a way that seem utterly mad.
+Seofthwa I read the bible at 9, by the time I got to Cain & Abel, I just screamed "This is bat shit crazy! And I must read it carefully in order to torture the nuns." That was then end of my faith. When some creationist comes on & makes an ass of him/herself, I ask them the question that made sister Mary-Magdalene throw her teeth at me. "After Cain Killed Abel, who was this woman of NOD he had sex with?" I still don't get an answer on that.
The bible isn't evil, YOU ARE! (in my best Anthony Robbins voice) But seriously the WORLD is evil, PEOPLE are evil , so why would the bible not be full of evil. No one understands what the tree of the knowledge of good and evil even is. One day Adam woke up and said Being naked is evil and put on a fig leaf. That is just a story trying to explain where the concept of evil arose if god created all good. PEOPLE created evil by simply defining it as such. Jesus tried to repair some of the damage by saying JUDGE NOT! do not create evil! What goes around comes around and karma will fullfill the LEST YE BE JUDGED IN LIKE MANNER. Look at the cycle of rebellion. EVIL people oppress others until the others rise up and overthrow those evil people. POWER CORRUPTS so the others become the EVIL PEOPLE and oppress the NEW OTHERS and the endless eternal cycle of EVIL PEOPLE goes around and around and around...
The first young lady that talked seemed to miss the montage from earlier. She’s mad people would call her beliefs irrational, and yet seems to think atheists receiving rape and death threats and accusations of being the most evil and vile scum on the earth, worthy of death and damnation, are somehow the same? No, Aaron made fun of religious beliefs, and of the evil practices in the Catholic Church that the church itself perpetuated and kept under wraps. He poked fun at the beliefs of people, he didn’t attack the people themselves. Even the pedophiles within the church were attacked bu proxy with the picture, and yet this person is mad someone made fun of their religion? When someone attacks you as a person, they have done something worse than making fun of your beliefs, they have acted with anger and hatred towards you, and Aaron didn’t do that. If you’re mad that he didn’t respect beliefs, sorry, but only people deserve respect, beliefs can be ridiculed as much as they will be when people are discussing whether to believe them or not. People deserve respect, not beliefs, and Aaron respected her and her beliefs more than many religious people respect him and his beliefs. Don’t criticize someone for a fault you are more guilty of, it only serves to make you look bad.
I see a lot of venom for those two women in the video. But at least they asked something , and perhaps they took something away from it. You cannot undo a lifetime of indoctrination in one small interaction, and maybe they will examine their beliefs with more scrutiny. Aron handled it beautifully, with great tact and never backed away from his point no matter how they tried to divert the argument.
That Twilight Zone episode about Anthony is exactly what I always think about when I picture "God". Glad I'm not the only one who made that connection.
"I cant change your mind because you've decided in advance that it doesnt matter what reason I give"
Love that line
mushroomfat jjjj
At 35 minutes in, did he say "drinks"?
@@RollingThunder69 yes. There were several references to drinks... presumably, he was planning to go to a bar afterwards for continued conversation with whomever wished to join him. This is a common thing in some circles.
I love that line too, as a theist. Atheists do precisely that, then project it onto Theists.
@@lightbeforethetunnel theists also do it and project it onto atheists.
Tribalism is no good, individual people are perfectly capable of the same shit behaviour regardless of their philosophical framework
AronRa makes more sense to me than 10 yrs of Lutheran school. I'm glad I found this guy.
+Michael Rahm Agreed. He is a big part of my becoming an atheist.
+Michael Rahm Not trying to belittle his argumentation, but it's easy to make sense if your arguments are based in reality while you're arguing against fairy tales.
I must tell you that it isn't often that I come across someone that sees things almost exactly the way I do.
I was raised in a Lutheran church and school, so I had church on Wed and most Sundays, plus Catechism class. Confirmation thought 8th grade culminating in a Confirmation event at the end of the year.
As a kid in school, I asked questions that didn't make much sense to me that didn't square with bible teaching, like where did the dinosaurs come from? Where did pre human hominids come from? And the answers they gave me didn't make much sense, so I just realized they didn't know.
High school and college were spent with a lot of comparative religion, including occult. I saw religion for what it was, more of a control mechanism than anything else.
I still do have a sense that something more is "out there" and that there's more than one dimension of existence, but as for organized religion, I see it as deeply flawed ideas promulgated by deeply flawed thinking.
So, welcome to the Land of Free Thinking....
+Michael Rahm i only went to church school to make my parents happy xD
also agrees! four generations of hardcore Lutheran awkward silence in my family. I am glad aaronra is not a preacher. He could have all sorts of wives with that voice. maybe take ALL the ladies!
This man just sat here and *absolutely demolished* a group of creationists like I've never seen done before.
Saddest part is, it ain't hard.
"I don't need to live forever. Whatever meaning my life has is what I mean to someone else. That is all. And that is enough."
That, right there, that little collection of sentences are worth infinitely more than anything and everything in any and all of the world's "holy" book.
I don't like to live forever. I need retirement at some time in my life., Permenant retirement.
@Stefan Urban wth. Nah. Your the person who is just asserting things
@TMPanos96 In the grand sceme of things, everything is worth nothing.
But let us step away from that for a moment. It is humans who go to heaven, all other animals just die, yes? Well then why do ants trudge forth through the undergrowth, using all their might to protect and feed their queen? Why does it matter? It matters for them because that is what their life is, they do not worry about after.
Now let us turn to a living thing you can more easily relate to- dogs, why do they eat, drink, bark, and play if their life means nothing in the end? Well, because it is their life, and many dogs find joy in causing joy, and find joy in just living. Why must there be more? Why must there be an eternal reason for life, why can't we just live? We are animals, yet we are the only animals foolish enough to worry about what happens after death, and the only animals brash enough to assert that we must have a greater cause
@@moonshadow1795 Nah. Your wrong you dont know what your talking about.
They that know God will be humbled. They that know themselves will be in hell _-|-_
@@jeziscricket4448 Going to be tortured forever because we refuse to bow to your cruel and incompetent human sacrifice. And the option is to worship your brutal deity for all eternity.
What a shitty god and shitty religion.
The Catholic church needs to be very, VERY careful when throwing around the Nazi card.
Wow, he really wasn't, sorry but that is a lie, nothing less.
What history books are you reading?
Are you saying Hitler loved christians and jews and that he was not an evil man?
I never made any comment about Hitler other than refuting your lies and never, ever put words into someone's mouth, that is a sure way to lose you respect and credibility.
I said the Catholic Church needs to be careful about bandying about Nazism and this is true given that Catholic priests in Italy assisted several Nazi war criminals escape to South America. This is a documented fact, look it up.
The Pope at the time was also keen not to wade in and declare himself against Nazism, rather stating the war was caused by economics etc.
The Nazis (excluding the more radical occultists, who by the way were not Atheists) had minor quarrel with Catholics in Germany compared to Jews, Homosexuals, Bolsheviks and the list goes on.
You mentioned Nazis. Hitler was the #1 Nazi
Not all Catholics are Christians. Some Catholics follow the religion as part of their culture and not faith.
There's the term "Christian Catholics". The distinction is made Because all Catholics are not christians.
It is true Occultists like demons know that God exists thats why they hate him. Some atheist say they don't believe in God but some hate him and his followers anyway. There seems to be a contradiction here.
Ok so now we're getting into the definition of Catholicism which is irrelevant to my point and yours but I'lll go over it briefly.
Catholicism is a branch of Christianity no matter how or why you follow it, ergo not all Christians are Catholics but all Catholics are Christian by definition. Religions are not democratic and are not defined by their followers views, i.e. whether Catholics have to be Christian or not, they are by definition as the religion they choose to follow, be it culturally or through faith is a Christian religion. I will not debate further on this point here (contact me by message if you wish to explain further) as it is irrelevant to the original point at hand which is;
The Catholic Church did not condemn Nazism during the war. Priests within the church assisted Nazis in escaping from the punishment they so richly deserved at the end of the war. Ergo it is a fact that the Catholic Church does need to be careful when using Nazism as a political weapon.
It doesn't take much to offend the religious. Apparently you can offend them simply by telling them what they believe.
or even existing in some instances
Religious doctrine defies logic and critical thought.
When they hear their beliefs out loud, those beliefs sound as stupid to the believer as to the nonbeliever, and the discomfort of cognitive dissonance kicks in.
lol
@@Stevevick-ve6kh I highly recommend Aron Ra's videos on evolution and abiogenesis, as clearly whatever education system you were enrolled in has failed you. I would also take a look at his series "Refuting the Unrefutable Proof of God" where he addresses a lot of misconceptions regarding evolution held by people that don't understand it.
Honestly, though, I doubt you're actually going to care to comb through the mountains of evidence for evolution and how ridiculous the refutations are. Most people that don't believe in evolution are going to put their fingers in their ears whenever it comes up, because it's one of the best refutations of the Argument for Design and if you actually understood it entirely (and its implications for the rest of the universe) then you would no longer believe in a creator deity. But religion is literally a pseudoscience - it makes claims and then uses confirmation bias to support those claims, rather than making claims based off of evidence.
So you can watch these videos and come to the slow realization that there isn't a God, or you can try to bait people into a one-sided argument where you just say they're influenced by Satan or that you have faith and that somehow magically discounts observable reality. You won't learn anything from egging people on here, you have to go educate yourself and leave your religious echo-chamber in the search for truth. There's no such thing as "evolutionists." There are just people that are scientifically literate.
@15:32 As an American soldier who has been in very real fox holes on 7 different occasions, I can say that there absolutely are athiests in fox holes. As an atheist who has been in 7 real fox holes during a war against a religious theology, I can say as a fact that there were even atheists on the other side.
That montage of how people view atheists just sickened me. The amount of projection is just unbelievable.
Same. That was like torture.
That's what's in Room 101 for people like us
tfw atheists fetishize warhammer 40k because they wish they were catholics
Disgusting. I'm downloading it and uploading it as its own video to share on social media.
mrbobmanbob
_(referring to the "god montage")_ "Verily, that self-proclaimed 'God Warrior'...creature is a foul servant of Nurgle. Purge it in the name of the Emperor!"
_(laughs)_ Seriously, though. If I were to see six-foot three-inch Gwendoline Christie...
www.aceshowbiz.com/images/wennpic/gwendoline-christie-premiere-game-of-thrones-season-3-05.jpg
...cosplaying a Sister of Battle (and why not, when she already plays Brienne of Tarth on-screen?), *that* would be something to fetishize. _(grins)_
Nicholas Knudson I was JUST about to state the same thing.
Aron knows more about religion than anyone in the room
You've saved me having to type all of that out; thank you😀
Re-watching this, I came across something when Aron mentioned the talking donkey in the Bible. In Shrek, Donkey, a talking donkey, is referred to as a "fairy-tale creature". That film has been promoting atheism this whole time and I never realized that :O
I'm glad I wasn't the only one to notice this.
Viking TheLucid
"Well, that's good for 10 shillings.... If you can PROVE it!"
BlackEpyon Yeah! That must be the reason for donkey's appeal, good nature and amusing presence!
Rapsodi Blue
I enjoyed the character without it. I only just recently put 2 and 2 together
BlackEpyon holy shit
shrek really *is* love
It's horrible seeing African Americans caught up as such solid believers in the Christian faith. Church attendance is statistically particularly high among ethnically black communities.
Slavery was a terrible piece of history but what makes it even worse is the fact that those slave communities were so particular vulnerable to the influence of the Christian religion.
At the onset of slavery, christians COULD NOT be slaves. Thus, many Africans had incentive to convert to Christianity. After that was done away with, black-led churches were used to organize slave revolts or make plans for escape. Later on, during Reconstruction and Pre-Jim Crow, Christianity was a way to assimilate successfully into mainstream society. During Jim Crow, of course, you had the civil rights movement which was practically founded, organised and implemented within Southern Black Churches. Remember, MLKJ was a reverend. Black churches organized food drives and gave loans to businesses white institutions denied to black people. My point being, Christianity has always had a practical and even beneficial place for black people in America. They do not view the church in the same oppressive lenses that some white atheists do, because largely the some of the modern criticisms DO NOT apply to black churches founded by Africans (like the AME). They don't see their churches as a part of mainstream churches and its baggage. They think of it as civil rights, business loans, community development, etc. Its important to tell people about the errors of religions, and problematic elements of the bible that endorse slavery, but you cannot harken back to the ills and acts of mainstream churches to convince black people, mainly because they ARE NOT A PART OF THE MAINSTREAM CHURCH.
I'm sick of seeing this tired argument and it's clear very few white atheists realize the enormous role black churches played past and present that impact current feelings about it.
You're arguing the social benefits of religion but that's hardly exclusive to black people at all.
The argument that blacks still have a baseless faith in an god imposed upon them by the same people they were slaves to (an concept which their bible supports) has not been addressed, and there are numerous other issues you've overlooked, such as the fact that regardless of the social aspect these blacks are still deeply religious and mired in their faith and yet still are the most poverty stricken demographic in the US. In this respect, American Blacks (and now currently, even ever increasing amount of Africans) have had an religion imposed on them and have basically accepted indoctrination and stockholm syndrome on an cultural scale. Its no different than the Irish.
So it appears even the social aspect of religion hasn't helped them out very much, leaving me to wonder what your argument even is.
Logic and reasoning at its finest!!! People r sheep being led nowhere and they r so blind and ignorant!!! Whats scary is i live with a Catholic woman and her religion!! She attacks people mentally with no cause and she does the same thing to me with such disrespect and dishonor and has been this way since i have been with her but she blames the world and me 4 her horrible and negative attitude. Her moral compass contradicts the very religion she follows!! Its sad and hypocritical not to mention very very scary one can act like her.
@@mariemm200 the truth is that if any group of Black people larger than 20 met any place other than a church - the police came. Church was the only place to meet together and organize marches, boycotts, and other peaceful protests. Additionally, by professing religious faith, Black people hoped to give racist America one less reason to persecute them.
@@mariemm200 I'm sick of seeing this tired argument and it's clear some people love to downplay the enormous harm churches in general did to blacks, as well as ignore the enormous role secular individuals had on the civil rights movement.
From the beginning, slavery as well as racism generally were all justified via the bible. While churches were used to help blacks assimilate in society, they were also the meeting homes for the KKK and other racist organizations that had the explicit goal of removing blacks from American society. Meanwhile, all of the "white atheists" throughout the country's history were far ahead of the curve when it came to support for equal rights and opposition to racism.
Furthermore, the positive role churches played in the 1950-60's civil rights era is vastly overstated. While King was a reverend, he surrounded himself with secularists and atheists and communists, many of whom such as A. Phillip Randolph were at least as central to the movement as King himself. The version of Christianity that King preached was so watered-down and whitewashed that it was virtually indistinguishable from secular humanism. There were also dozens of churches that fought against MLK's efforts, many of whom arguing that he was too revolutionary while others were themselves stewing pots pro-segregation anti-white racism. Care to remember, King's famous "Letter from Birmingham" was in response to criticism from other religious officials. And most importantly, the aggrandizing of the power of churches for black people has led to a whole new problem of frauds and hucksters to get away with whatever they want just because they're preachers.
And finally, regardless of how people see it, black churches ARE part of mainstream churches and their baggage. They still teach the same hateful preachments against atheists, women, gays, trans, and sometimes even people of other races. They still engage in science denial. They still prize faith over reason. They still rake in millions of dollars without paying a dime of taxes.
Remember, it was the white secularist Hamiltonians who started the first real abolitionist ideology in America. It was the white secularist Lincoln who ended up freeing the slaves. It was the white secularist Darwin who was able to empirically who that there was no justification for racism. It was the white secularist FDR who ensured that the economy was stable enough so that people had time and money to participate in the civil rights movement. It was the white secularist Kennedy who elevated King and his efforts and gave him the biggest platform in the world. And it was the white secularist LBJ who actually signed the Civil Rights Act and made sure that the efforts of the movement paid off. And while none of the people I mentioned were in fact atheists (except arguably Lincoln and Darwin), they all did the great things they did for secular reasons and were opposed every step of the way by the churches of America.
This was the last nail in the coffin for me. Thank you from the bottom of my heart.
Once you get over the fear of hell, there's an amazing sense of liberation and responsibility that washes over you. It's not something I got to experience since I was never really a believer, but damn. I've seen it on other people, and it's kind of amazing.
@@Stevevick-ve6kh yeah, believe my bed time stories or else...
Nothing will happen after you are dead except that you wasted a big chunk of your one and only life
@@Stevevick-ve6kh if they are bed time stories i do not need to "hear them again". Because they are irrelevant to anything.
@@Stevevick-ve6kh "Arrogance" says the one who claims to have a loving relationship to the most powerfull being imaginable xD You should think about which position is arrogant.
So what i hear from you is arrogance and ignorance. But you 'll find out that you wasted your life after dead ;) ... wait a moment... No you won't, because you just simply won't exist then anymore. Sad...
You are totally wrong and never will find it out.
@@Stevevick-ve6kh are you afraid of the flying spaghetti monster? Are you afraid of the monster under your bed? That's exactly how afraid i am.
By the way, why do you expect i did not already read it? Reading the bible is the fastest way to become am athesist since most people see through the absurdities the bible claims.
You literally believe in talking snakes, donkeys and unicorns combined with an immoral monster called god.
There are countless contradictions in the "unfailable word of god". And even if you would manage to explain those away, the sheer existence of unclearity proofs that either god doesn't exist or don't want me to be sure about his existence what would contradict that he "reveals himself to everybody"
when women are literally available at half price in the bible and these people dont even know it.........
Can do half the work, stay sane half the month, and needs clean up after each period. The costs make sense
They know it. They're not unlike Holocaust deniers in that; it's very difficult to convince people to follow their evil ideology when people know what they actually believe.
They cost even less if you damage their purity beforehand. S\
I don't know how much of this is meant to be satire, and how much is just "having fun", but... the misogyny being shown (and/or parodied) here is so ugly.
@@DavidLindes None of it is satire, that's actually how women are treated in the bible.
Almost felt like pinching myself in the middle of that montage to assure myself I wasn't having a nightmare. That was absolutely horrifying and really sad to see that people like that still exists today. Disturbing. I wish all the strength to you rational folks over there who have to live surrounded by those people.
What's worse is that all of the creationists in the audience are raising children now
I bet if biblical literalists were no longer allowed to benefit from any science that contradicts their bible, they would suddenly become much more flexible in their views.
What we need is a disease that only kills credulous fools.
well, there is a disease that uses credulous fools to kill. does that count?
Those people exist, they’re called amish, the flexible ones are called mennonites.
But amish do use some modern invention, medicine especially.
Someone should make a reality tv show based upon that premise!
Thank you Aron for calling Texas your state and sticking to your hard work to make it better. You must love Texas and America.
It's horrifying how many people admit they would be evil without their delusion.
"Where's my moral compass?" Golden rule, Mr Harvey. I don't need the threat of eternal punishment to not be a terrible person.
"I don't need to live forever. The only meaning my life ever had was whatever my life meant to someone else. That is all, and that is enough" mark 34:25 Awesome Quote, Very beautiful Statement. If I wasn't going to be cremated one day, I would have this engraved on my tomb stone.
have it put on the urn!
arch angel Urns are cramped I plan to be dead in the wind, tossed off a mountain or something. Not that I will know LOL
personally, I was taken by (I think it was) hitchens who talked about how when he died he wanted to be buried so to make sure that he gives back to the earth nutrients since he has taken many from the earth while alive.
arch angel All your nutrients return to the earth no matter what way you decompose.
MalawisLilleKanal
isn't burning your body destroying nutrients?
I can tell that black girl felt personally offended. She heard him trash the belief system of Christianity and felt offended so she accused him and all atheists of all kinds of stuff he did not do. Trashing her and all Christians, misrepresenting the bible, etc. Definitely an emotional reaction. I guess that is what happens when the belief system is wrapped up in the person's identity.
They probably came there to confront an atheist.
every belief system is wrapped up in an individuals identity. One doesn't have to have a religion or belief in God to have a belief system.
Richard1979hush
all behavior is linked to belief which includes non-belief in God or any religious doctrines. i think its important to recognize that non-believers and believers alike can share given points within each of their systems.
Cognitive dissonance creates a lot of stress. That's why she seems so agitated.
She is clearly using confirmation bias to attempt to resolve the cognitive dissonance and confirmation bias prevents her from seeing how badly she has failed to do so.
Before you feel too superior, know that we are all vulnerable to confirmation bias. It is not in any way exclusive to religionists.
Richard1979hush i don't believe you !
Richard1979hush
_all behavior is linked to belief_
I really have to take exception to this.
There's a growing body of work in a variety of different fields that suggest that our moral decisions are largely a product of instinct and that ideology plays a very minor role if it is involved at all. In most cases, I would argue that the purpose of ideologies is to provide rationalizations for decisions already made.
Did that woman just compare "rape" to being mocked for her beliefs? GFYS
@@Furtherawaystill Forgives them all... rape included
@@Furtherawaystill Sure, which also means Adolf Hitler, whom considered himself a Christian and defender of Christianity and invoked God to justify his evil deeds, is in heaven according to according to the tenets Christianity.
I actually shed a few tears when Aaron was talking about all that matters when he dies is that he mattered to someone in the here and now and that he made a difference.
Edit your post so that his name is spelled correctly, (Aron) since you want to honor him.
Yes, and that's basically all we can aspire to be.
You know what sucks?
I went to Eastern Illinois University, and this wasn't advertised. I would have loved to go to this talk. I was on the verge of disbelief and just started learning about philosophy around the time this talk happened. It's nice to see an atheist shaking up Charleston, IL. Keep up the good work friend. You're doing great things *****.
At least I can watch this talk now.
Tim McGrath Welcome to reality (or at least as close as we can reasonably get), brother.
Well, just read the bible sincerely you will become not believing in all those nonsense
I feel sorry for the young lady during the Q and A session. She confuses criticism of her religion for denigrating people and she is amazingly ignorant of the content of her bible. Sadly, she chooses to be that way.
TC Sam why so condescending? I feel sorry for you. Sad. #ramen
that young lady total missed the hole point of what aronra was talking about
Mario Pantoja He wasn’t condescending at all.
TC Sam this is what religious brainwashing does to people. This young woman’s mind is fucked up!
vilcantroper it’s called cognitive dissonance. They totally brainwashed!
"I read the bible for myself and I understand it "this way".:" Well. I am so glad that the book as guided by the Allmighty one is one you can read in like a billion of ways and get different conclusions. I'm sure that's exactly what the plan of a perfect being, who has a specific message to bring people under him. Such a clever, totally not illusive and brain breaking plan.
It was sad and almost heartbreaking, to watch his eloquent and thoughtful speech.
And then the gals in the audience, not understanding anything of the topic at all.
The general response from them: „Why do you mock me?“
to the first woman (well, technically two) in the Q&A, I would've gone in a completely different rout by corrected her in describing what an atheist is: someone that (in this context) does not accept christianity in the same way that a person in a marketplace can say that they're not going to buy from a merchant, and continuing with that analogy, the woman is essentially asking why the person is trying to sell his merchandise to the merchant, when in reality, he's only describing why he's not buying from the merchant...
which is, unfortunately, a fundamental misunderstanding that a LOT of people have
I am an atheist married to a christian to whom I was married before I became atheist. This video and others like it are my link to sanity. Thank you.
I hope you come back around and accept the Lord again.
@@scruffythejanitor4368 lol
@@scruffythejanitor4368 lol
@@scruffythejanitor4368 “When you meet your God tell him to leave me alone.” - Guts
I'm saving this video to show my mom today. After 53 years of fundamental Christianity she is now questioning her faith, after witnessing the hypocrisy of her clergy. It hurts my heart to see her struggling with her waning faith. But, her starting to question things gas repaired so much damage in our relationship. I appreciate your knowledge.
I would highly consider watching videos by ThermaminTrees as well. His videos are a little more palatable, and I love Aron, but he can feel abrasive sometimes. ThereminTrees pulled me out faster than anything else.
Good
During that montage of what religious people think of atheists, one guy said "what do they fill the void with? Stuff. Things."
My guy, I am experiencing the world. I am living each day. I am seeing the beauty of the nature around me, and all of the wondeous creative things people have invented, entire fictional worlds as well. My brain is well-stimulated with wonder.
I'm an atheist, and I believe in *everyone's* eternity, I just don't believe in *my* eternity.
The future will go on without me, but hopefully made better by me being here.
Being overly humble ain't good for ya.
Ultimately heat death will end "us" if we survive the rest of the horrifyingly difficult challenges to come. Our climate is fucked. We have to find a new star at some point.
Sorry, does not work that way. You are eternal. You have to decide- good or bad side. No middle.
@@BumbleBee-eh3cn
Are you serious? Who are YOU to state emphatically how things "work"? Great minds who study physics, the universe, human behavior, and history of life on this planet agree on just a few basic ideas. There is so much in debate in physics, the number of "realities", the essence of "time". You base your very simple thinking on religious teaching, which gets angry and battles other ways of thinking as being at war with their God and beliefs! How can something that narrows the human mind be any source of absolute truth? It can't.
@@2degucitas religions agree on a few basic ideas as well, one of them being the eternal soul. there is less disagreement than you might think. christian scientists in the middle ages deserve more credit, as do spiritual intellectuals everywhere.
i don't understand why people keep saying you're too close-minded to see god. on the contrary, in my "personal experience", believing in god is the easiest thing. any child can easily believe in some invisible being in the shadow. but i find everything in high school physics, chemistry, biology, mathematics so counter intuitive that you must retrain your brain to think in a ways that are not intuition-based. To NOT believe in god takes education.
To believe in God takes faith.
Wow man. Just wow. You blow my mind on a regular basis. So respectful and well spoken as you eviscerate the lies we've been told. Thank you for helping me on my journey. You're an amazing man Aron.
Aron is incredible and is truly a beacon of hope for us critical thinking people who live in the real world. I am a major follower of Aron Ra.
I am pretty sure the two Christians were taking offense because they equate insulting Christianity as insulting them personally.
The 2 black young girls, really weird that they read the bible of their generational 'slavemasters'
Or perhaps they were just virtuous in their faith?
@Dexter O'Shields sure she would, perhaps would've had more self restraint. Apparently science isn't where everyone places their faith so to speak. You shouldn't think them foolish if you're a true atheist.
@Dexter O'Shields faith just means complete trust and confidence in someone or something. And science means the intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behaviour of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment. Faith can be with or without knowledge and science is a conglamorad of any knowledge proven or theoretical. So in a sense you must have faith in science in order to believe in theories like evolution etc.
@Dexter O'Shields bingo faith doesn't require any of those like you just said. Faith by definition(not interpretation as in hebrews) means:noun
1.complete trust or confidence in someone or something.
Science does require those though. Not everything in science can be demonstrated as proof, much of it is theoretical and hypothetical. Like Stephen Hawking was only a theoretical physicist ,meaning anything he theorized on was only tested out in a lab and not out in space like in real life. the intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behaviour of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment.
Sad to see the thought process abandon folks who have been taught what to think and not how to think.
+Tom Nissen It's the same tired arguments which haven't changed for centuries.
+Al Swedgin They should go to DKM solitaire. They have logic puzzles. It'll teach them how to think. They better just work on the easy ones first.
+Marilyn Newman
My friend, do you think we can be blinded by science?
Isn't that a song?
I often listen to Aron when going to sleep, just weird but his voice grounds me and is comforting.
I don't understand how anyone can listen to a whole speech of Aron's then stand up and think they have any chance of getting over on him.
Those are deluded spoonfed poison by priests
You have helped me. You and many other atheists have helped me. Thank you, AronRa.
Those 2 women can't form a single coherent thought, let alone actually argue a point. When she said it actually doesn't promote slavery, at that moment I would have stood up brought her a bible and showed her otherwise.
I had the most difficult time discerning what they were even trying to ask. Just emotional babble.
Many believers are accustomed to yelling lies, untruth or misinformation just like many many outspoken dishonest priests pastors or even "believers scientists' like J. Lennon, Craig, . They are in the habit of uttering something knowing to be false or not believing it to be true, (that is what deception means)
The girl asking the questions is an exact example of what Aron said about christians projecting their behavior on atheist. And to top it off she didn't listen to anything that was said in the whole presentation, she came only to fight.
When Aron Ra dies he will not know, think, wish, remember, dream, or be anything - and yet, he will still be more intelligent and moral than a creationist.
When that black girl said "i cant look past all of those things"....and Aron says "why cant your god do that?"
Classic.
Hell is excessively believing in religion. Heaven is waking up from the lies.
Xcristian here Thank you so much for what you do Aron.♥
Aron Ra, started as a child mistrusting religion, got hooked for years, then woke up around 39years old. Have had 30 years of happiness and freedom of mind ever since. Have had the time to learn and do so many wonderful things.The freedom far out weighed the criticism of people. It all seems so ridiculous to me now. The brain washing is sad.. Every religion thinks theirs is right and the others are brain washed.
Not just every religion but sects within the same religions think they are right and everyone else is wrong...They all need to wake up and see that all religions are wrong about everything.
I'm so glad I wasn't born in America. Being an athiest in the UK is super easy in comparison.
I moved to a bigger town because religious people calling me avful because of my sexuality. I'm living in Sweden. I'm transsexual. People kicked and destroyed my bicycles. I don't want to live in Jahve anustown anymore.
@Starfall 21X Mainly because the lack of said separation is at most a technicality.
@Starfall 21X Mate, tell it to someone who actually needs to know. I'd prefer if you'd avoid making stereotypes of the people here.
@Starfall 21X
Maybe not so ironic if the imposition stimulates rejection.
Churches in the UK are empty except the ones chosen to host BBC’s Songs of Praise.
Aron, your voice is essential on these issues! Thank you for this kind of talk. It's highly appreciated.
I've watched many of Aron's public speaches now and this is the first one where we see christians defending their faith. Up until now I thought that only atheists exclusively attend these.
Those girls in the Q&A session don't know their bible AT ALL and came across as very gullible and annoying AF! I commend Aron Ra for his patience and politeness. Well done!
THEY DIDNT NEED TO KNOW THEIR BIBLE !!! THE DISCUSSION WAS ON FAITH AND VIRTUE !! THEY COULD HAVE USED ANY RELIGION AS AN EXAMPLE !
Patience is a virtue...nuff said.
@@RollingThunder69 WTF DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT / ARE YOU LIKE 12 ?? LMAO
@@flatearth9140 11 and three quarters....but I can lift very heavy things.
@@RollingThunder69 OH !! WELL THEN NEVER MIND !!
I must admit, I am a bit sad as an atheist, but not because I don't believe in god, because everyone judges me in an unfair way! other atheists are proud to be atheists because they have the ability to understand the world, sometimes more than myself, and for this... I am proud to be an atheist despite the depression and hatred I am forced to eat everyday! ALL HAIL SCIENCE!
I always come back here from time to time because this speech was one of AronRas best. I especially like the exchange from 50:23 to 54:15 about the meaning of life. His response was humorous but also very thoughtful. A wonderful listen!
I went to a Catholic school preschool to third grade. I was into it all the way. I met the Nun each morning and carried her heavy bag from the convent to the school, I was planning to be an alter boy.....then my Father got a nice work promotion and substantial pay raise. My parents were ask to meet with Pastor after church where our entire family was asked to leave the church and never return. I have never seen my Mother so sad...she cried all the way home. My Father was livid and when the smoke cleared I asked what happened....the church wanted the entire pay raise and if we didn't "donate" we had to leave the church........we left. I was telling my friends when an older kid asked...I suppose you believe in Santa and the Eater bunny too? He clearly pointed out that Religion was only deterrence. I don't remember who this person was but I consider him to be one of the best people I have ever met.
In the end, religion is a business.
@@Ergeniz it’s a disease that has plagued our species for 1000s of years and just needs to be considered obsolete at this point. It didn’t benefit ancient tribal savages and it sure as shit doesn’t benefit us now
I like how people are attempting to say, "Hey the bible doesn't support slavery" and Aron is quite clear capable of pointing to the verse that they clearly never read.
@@guyparrish4349 No. Just because we don't believe there is a man in the sky giving us morality doesn't mean that we believe there is *nothing* inherently evil or wrong. There are other ways to determine if something is right or wrong beyond merely being told by an authority.
I know this is just shocking for you, but some of us are able to actually look at slavery, it's effects, and decide for ourselves that it has no positive outcome, and is inherently an evil action based on it's own lack of merits.
Seriously there are multiple different schools of thought on the best way to decide what is right or wrong. It's not just, 'My preacher said God doesn't like this' Or 'Free-for-all.' That's just bullshit.
Besides, if you want to bring in hypocrisy, believing that the unchanging word of God is the only source of morality... and just ignoring the fact that morality under that religion has shifted massively over the thousands of years it existed is pretty hypocritical, don't you think? Or are you going to pull a no true Scottsman and say none of those historical Christians were actually Christians when they sited the bible as justification for owning slaves?
@@guyparrish4349 Okay, look, I'm not trying to answer for every atheist since that's not possible. We don't have scriptures to argue over interpretations of being the absolute truth. So every atheist might very well give you a completely different answer.
As for your claim on if not God, then morality can not be objective, then... no, I completely disagree. Think of it this way. You're in a game, where every choice you make changes several stats. If you desire to get one of those stats to be as high as possible, then there is an objectively best way you should chose in order to maximize that outcome. While yes, the things one chooses to prioritize is subjective, the decision you should make to achieve it is not, but an objective fact.
So to answer your question on why slavery is evil inherently in *my* view, that is because it deals excessive amounts of harm and suffering to a large population, for minor conveniences for a much smaller population that could even be gained in a different way, without causing the harm. This needlessly increases the suffering of the world, and I would argue is an inherent feature of slavery. Thus inherently it is evil.
Now here is the things that might actually befuddle you. While I believe there is indeed an objective moral standard to achieve my desired outcome of maximizing human well-being, I do not believe, humans, with our limited perspective, can be certain of what it is. After all we can't predict the future or the full knock on effect of every decision especially when it mixes with every other decision ever made, so we have to operate on best principles. Things that while might not always have the most best of all possible outcomes, are reliably going to lead to positive outcomes. Applying to slavery, even if there are some situations where slavery might lead to an objectively beneficial state to humanity as a whole, we still shouldn't implement it, because the vast, vast, VAST majority of the time, slavery has horrendous outcomes, so simply isn't worth the risk to find the 'exceptions' should they even exist.
Addressing your other points.
Past: No, I do not believe gay was immoral a 100 years ago, nor now, and while I do think uncheck promiscuity does lead to harm, homosexuality doesn't inherently lead itself to that. I think the correct answer would and is to encourage sex between homosexual lines paralleling at least traditionally heterosexual cultural norms of only being within long term stable relationships as that seems to be the best for creating long term happiness. Repression and active persecution of them instead only lead to more suffering.
Present: No, I do not believe putting people to death for drinking alcohol is moral. Perhaps an argument could be made that drinking excessively is also immoral but extreme punishments for minor moral misdeeds are not moral either, and are more likely to create excessive suffering then simple drinking.
Future: No. I think the evidence is pretty clear that pedophilia inherently leads to the trauma and life long suffering to the vast majority of children that are on the receiving end of it and this does not change with the culture. While yes I could be convinced that an individual child might not suffer, I have to point out my best principle argument laid out above that, just because exceptions might exist, since we can't know, we shouldn't needless risk, especially for such minor conveniences as temporary sexual gratification for the pedophilia adult.
Though it is possible to change my mind on any of the previously mentioned point, or indeed any other moral position I hold. All you have to do is provide evidence that convinces me that another position will lead to a consistently happier and better off population. After all, as they say, the proof is in the pudding.
Now as for your objective moral standard. Even if the objective moral stand is what you say it is, the issue still remains that we can't know it. Your problem is the same as mine, in that we both can not be certain of what our objective moral standard actually is. After all, the interpretations of your has changed over the years. Ever Christian nation was pro-slavery at some point, despite the 'fixed moral eternal standard' of your God. In which case, I find your appeals to him completely useless. If you're just guessing at what your God wants, and claiming absolute truth in it, you are a liability to become a tyrant, not a saint. Most troubling, you will be one who thinks yourself righteous. And as such, I find your views on morality more likely to lead to evil, rather good outcomes, despite your best intentions.
@@guyparrish4349 1) That's not how anything works. Just because humans are not capable of certain beyond mathematical and logical proof, doesn't mean that things don't have an actual truth beyond faulty human perception. You might as well claim just because I can't be a hundred percent certain about reality, means things don't exist. No that doesn't follow in any way. Also, no you can't be certain about your own standard. You can only think you can, because once again, you are a faulty human, and can be wrong and wouldn't know it. In fact, you or another Christian *has* to be be wrong, since you disagree about aspects of the bible. Someone has to be wrong. That's my point, and your only escape from this is to claim all other Christians that disagree with your interpretation of the bible, aren't Christian which, you would have to prove, otherwise it's just a no true Scotsman.
Second of all for you logical argument, the entire premise one is something I completely disagree with. I've explain an overview of philosophy, but you just aren't addressing it because you clearly didn't understand it. Your claims about atheists being unable to agree on a moral standard means it has to be subjective in our view is just laughable. That's like saying just because no one in the fifth century could give you a consistent of why things fall down, means not that we haven't discovered the reason why, but that it is subjective. No. We just haven't learned it yet. The reason things fall down is the same regardless of what humans think on it. And I'm proposing the same thing about morality. You clearly didn't understand my 'highscore' analogy and somehow thought it benefited your view point. Simply put since actions have effects, in order to maximize the effects there are objectively actions you should take. In other words you can have an objective standard for actions one ought to do without the need of a God. Secondly, you fail to understand I do not view social norms as having any direct connection to morality. Just because something is a social norm does not mean it is either moral or immoral. Also yes, if you can prove me wrong that means my understanding of my moral stand isn't complete and you've refined it. Just like when we discover that the speed gravity accelerates to the center of an object changes with the distance from it, that doesn't mean the initial framework was wrong, but rather incomplete and we have now can create one that has a wider and more accurate use case.
2) Really, okay, so you believe the bible says that Lucifer was in the Garden of Eden, and was the snake that tempted Eve, I presume. Well In the medieval times, that wasn't a belief, but instead it was Lilith, the first wife of Adam, who escaped after learning how to fly because she learned God's true name, and became a demon. This is a fairly major change I would think, considering most modern Christians I've ever interacted with don't believe that Lilith exists. Not to mention there are entire sections on how to treat slaves, despite this being against God's will right? Also, didn't Moses command that when conquer a people, you are to kill all the males, and all the women who 'have known the touch of a man' but the virgin women and girls are to be kept as slaves? Yes, your God really is the moral standard against slavery.
3)Your attitude doesn't align with that. You clearly act as if you think you are better then those who disagree with your assumption that god is real, due to a book that has been edited, translated, and interpreted by human hands over thousands of years, yet somehow nothing substantial changed with the meaning of it.
4)First of all, you are cherry picking hard core if you want to claim that atheists are responsible for the most suffering. First of all. Hitler of course, with "God with Us" proudly stamped on their belts and with the approval of at least members of the Catholic Church of the time. Not to mention the Crusades, the Inquisitions, the religious massacres, and conversion by the sword that just Christianity has done. Combine this with every other religion in the world, and it's pretty clear that's just human nature to be evil to those who are deemed outsiders. Second, you are pretending all atheists are of the same type. The primary reason why Stalin and Mao were anti-religion is because they didn't want any competition to their power grab. It make shock you, but I'm not only not a communist, I'm anti-communist.
Now onto your assumptions on my character. I'm not attacking Christians, I'm friends with plenty, and respect their right to their beliefs... However, I am hostile to people who are arrogantly certain despite being wrong. So no I'm not trying to destroy your church, or your god, or even yourself. However I have no patience or respect for your arrogant certainty about things you can't know and smug self-assurances that you are a moral agent due to the fact you decided a book is the reason for you having a moral code.
@GUY Parrish Dude.....why are you typing essays in the comment section? If you're typing this much then it's safe to assume you're not saying anything important.
@GUY Parrish If you're too stupid to realize that nobody in their right mind is gonna an essay in the COMMENT section then who exactly are you embarrassing? If you believe in talking snakes, a flood that never happened on a global scale, as well as an event that's absent from actual historical documents then you yourself are not living in reality. If Jesus was alive then why doesn't he speak up for himself? Why doesn't he convince everybody by simply showing up? If an immortal can't actually die then wouldn't that defeat the purpose of having a sacrifice? How is Jesus both the son of God and God in the flesh? BTW Creationism isn't science.....whenever you guys claim to be talking about science you reference people that aren't even credible in that field of study. I don't see how you can think you're spouting truth when the Bible's claims don't exist in the history of other cultures.
Thank you so much for what you do Aron.
Take heart guys Canada has always accepted American Refugees.
Get out while the getting's good.
Cool, Eh!
We have as high a per capita number of religious believers and our Creationist believers aren't far behind the Americans. In fact we have our own George Dubya in office right now. Harper is a young earth creationist.
Alex Kilgour UK it is then.
9 months to the bubble pop. Time to wake up kiddies.
how's that for timing?
im an atheist marine in a fox hole
Bullshit! Marines don't use fox holes, Soldiers do. Marines use fighting holes! Fox holes are for hiding, fighting holes are for fighting!
Thank yoi for your service
Fynox Adavius lol awesome
Stay SHARP Jarhead, come back alive.
Don’t overdose on crayons while you’re in there
"faith" = gullibility
I've watched most of your videos, and I think this one is the most beautiful of them...
I love Aron Ra. What an articulate speaker and mind. Need to meet him one day and shake his hand. I hope he got through to some of those kids...
All faith is blind. It is not something to be proud of and is definitely not a good thing to use as a basis for making serious decisions about life. It is, in effect no better than guessing and wishful thinking, based on a desperate and futile hope. I think that Faith should be reclassified as one of the seven deadly sins.
Faith gives a person permission not to think or reason. It is the last despairing action that people resort to when there is something in which they want or feel they desperately need to believe, but for which they have absolutely no evidence and no reason other than that do-or-die need to believe. Faith is simply another name for self-delusion.
+Honestman400 Blind and deaf and dumb
Michael Dennis By keeping their followers ignorant of the facts and fearful of the consequences of not believing, religion has held back scientific and social development for centuries.
I read an article some years ago that suggested that due to the negative effects of Religion, in all its forms, we are at least 500 years behind where we could have been, without it, both scientifically and socially.
+Honestman400 Mmm, that part is debatable though. I doubt that some things would have been discovered earlier merely if we lacked religion.
Firecage Such as?
Oh...There's to many variables to even say, that is why I left the comment short and as is. Since if religion never existed...well, none of us would be here either, the entire human history would have been altered.
"Morality" is not a term I use, but mutual aid is. As Kropotkin argued 120 years ago, co-operation, mutual support and caring for each other are an evolutionary advantage, and one of which our species is particularly capable through complex speech, our enormous brains, et. We have other evolutionary advantages of course, but mutual aid is a strong one. I view caring for, and doing no harm to my fellow humans and our common habitat on this fragile planet not as "morality" or "being good" but simply as practicing mutual aid.
The four virtues, as traditionally taught, were patience, justice, temperance and fortitude. None has anything to do with faith. The four virtues are secular, and anyone can learn and benefit from them.
The more I watch this, the better sense this makes. Makes you think.
Brilliant. Especially the Q&A. You are great at thinking on your feet, Aron!
I've been following Aron for years , and I never saw the Q&A to this video. I'm so glad I did now.
Words cant even describe the amount of hooah i feel when i watch a good Aronra speech :)
I’m happy you’re doing the work, I get your coming from. I’ve always avoided arguments. It’s better to be like you and take a stand.
I like how Aron gets bitched out but still calmly defeats them anyway.
if you are christian you dont have to obey to any law or moral because jesus saves you anyway. Atheists are held responsible for their actions.
Similiar a comedian once said "I am a very religious person, as a child i always prayed for a bike, for years i prayed day and night but nothing happened....then i saw a beautiful bike belonging to someone else so i stole it and confessed to a pries. so i had a bike and was free of my sins and i figured...so thats how this works"
You do not have to obey, he is correct. You have to admit you do wrong and then you have to ask Jesus into your life as a person saving you from your sin. That is it.
Also, you can never lose your salvation.
As for the bike, he may have gotten possession of the bike, but it was not his. He may have used it, but never really enjoyed it because it was not his and he knew that. Sin always has consequences and the sin consequences will catch up with thief. Also, Jesus forgives sin. God forgives sin. You do not have to go to priest. When you accept Jesus all sin before and ever after are forgiven. But forgiven does not mean you escape consequences of bad behavior on Earth. The bike thief will still have to pay in some form.
You obviously do not understand Christianity and are incapable of stringing together a coherent sentence . Lmao I am not a christian but I can tell you it's a little more complicated than that!
@@BumbleBee-eh3cn No... He won't. He will pay the actual crime of Theft.
But this "Sin" of Theft... Yah all Christians even Moses would be in hell.
Every sin is forgiven and all have a spot in Heaven... Except those who committed the sin of Disbelief
Impressed that the girls had the guts to speak up to Aron at the perceived slight. I can't believe she said the bible opposed slavery.
The stained glass window @20:45 is priceless.
Jesus mows my lawn and cooks at an Applebee's. He also speaks Spanish and isn't white.
Jesus died to save you from Hell. And he will not be mocked.
Erasmo Hernandez I have every right to mock your backward religious views. I will not sit down and shut up to pander to beliefs that deserve ZERO respect.
I don't need respect from you. My views and millions of others views come from the Bible. You don't believe the Bible thats your choice. The bible is our foundation. What is your foundation? Faith in Nothing?
I don't need faith. Faith is just subjective apologetics. Science is OBJECTIVE. I follow the evidence wherever it leads, and it doesn't lead to any deity any more than to Santa Claus or unicorns. Your position, Erasmo, amounts to "I don't know, therefore, magic".
Get your brain out of your limited world. There is more than meets the eye. I would not call the realm I experience every day magic. I would call it the spiritual realm. a kingdom you know nothing about because you refuse to be open to it. You don't know what you are missing.
46:52 this is describing me: when I was a Christian, I was hateful towards a lot people and of other things. When I became an atheist, that shell cracked and I became a humanist. Maybe because I realized that everyone deserves to be treated like a human being. I do have a higher power and that’s Love. Not a person, not a deity, but the principle of love as a power to appeal to when I come to a crossroads, I ask myself, “what would be the loving thing to do?” I don’t need a god to tell me what is right or wrong or what love is.
"God please protect me from your followers"
Best bumper sticker i ever saw.
I fucking love this guy! My only complaint is that he doesn't have enough videos! I was an agnostic atheist before him, but he turned me into a gnostic atheist! Evolutionary theory is my passion and he delivers on that front as well!
Aron, that was fucking beautiful. I really hope to meet you someday. Thank you for all you do sir.
9yrs later but thanks Aron for all you have taught me it really means a lot. Thank you.
As always excellent presentation.
When I was a child I remember hearing the verse about faith being able to move mountains. As I couldn't move mountains, I figured I must not have enough faith, I didn't consider the alternative. That really made me feel terrible though because I thought that I should have and that I was doing something wrong.
I love the ending to this speech, particularly about 33:50 onward.
The Q&A bit was hard to watch though. I find it really sad and pitiful to see people who are offended rather than enlightened.
Faith is based on belief without evidence.
"to have faith is precisely to lose one's mind so as to win God."
- Søren Kierkegaard
Pope blames atheists for Hitler.
Meanwhile...
“I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so”
[Adolph Hitler, to Gen. Gerhard Engel, 1941]
"lindsay lohan's lesbian love life". Lot of "L's" in that sentence.
Decropolis Yay for alliteration
It's always nice to read a lot of alliteration in a perpetually (pretentious) presuppositionalist proposition, especially if parentheses are purported to be involved in perpetuating this pathetic position...
He's fairly fucking famous for his awesome alliterative attempts.
Here's two more: LOL!!
Faith..."To have pride in the absence of knowledge or rejection of proven facts in favor of superstition". Doesn't sound like a virtue to me.
like your screen name. Somehow it is a virtue, guess Jesus is saying, trusting in my fathers words. Who to trust? that is question. God says trust me for a more abundant and loving everlasting life. What is the other side offering?
@@BumbleBee-eh3cn So... you're proving OP's point?
Enjoyed that, and love the question and answers section. You are awesome.
I don't know which I enjoy more - the lecture or the Q&A. I just can't decide.
It's the spoon-fork debate going on in my head.
Thank you so much for your eloquence in expressing the many similar thoughts I've had but lacked the ability to put it so clearly.
I've always said, "how is being called gay insulting"?
It's about as insulting as being called "plain looking".
Really nice ending imo. :) I think you are great Aron.
50:58
We are urged to help others, not by some worry about their soul, but by a desire to make their short, human life as good as we can.
54 minutes is a pretty amazing reversal of Pascal's Wager
I think your previous talks are the best. Thanks for you're work!
A wonderful man.
💕
Sometimes I despair for Amerika (The K is intentional) , a once beautiful idea of freedom and liberty descending into fascism and socialism backed with religious fervor and the largest military on the planet. As an Australian atheist I watch friends and colleagues in Amerika try to spread common sense and scientific method continually repudiated and mocked by people that are essentially uneducated fools, the great shame of which is how much stupidity comes from the main stream media there.
America was founded on bigotry, inequality, and violence (much like Australia). It’s tradition to war and violate, to engage in facism and aggressive religious idiocy. We are not socialist (my native ancestors were) by a long shot. The ideas of liberty and freedom were only ever truly allowed to wealthy Christian white men.
It's making me mad that women is asking a question. They're suppose to ask there husban when they get home.
their *
😂😂😂
Wow those questions from the religious in the crowd were very interesting. Their way of thinking truly is different from my own in a significant way. Like they have some sort of mental block.
The woman with the glasses should resolve to read the whole bible cover to cover. She will be shocked how evil it is. She has been cherrypicking.
+Roedy Green That is the thing, I have read a lot of the bible and it is a vile book. Christians cherry pick or try to contextualize it to reinterpret it to make it seem like it is full of good things. That is why they have to rely on a tangled web of beliefs that in the end make no sense and have no logic behind it. Also if all else failed they just say well it is god's will or just have faith. It literally fouls the mind and twists it. Which is why believers act in a way that seem utterly mad.
+Seofthwa I read the bible at 9, by the time I got to Cain & Abel, I just screamed "This is bat shit crazy! And I must read it carefully in order to torture the nuns." That was then end of my faith. When some creationist comes on & makes an ass of him/herself, I ask them the question that made sister Mary-Magdalene throw her teeth at me. "After Cain Killed Abel, who was this woman of NOD he had sex with?" I still don't get an answer on that.
The bible isn't evil, YOU ARE! (in my best Anthony Robbins voice)
But seriously the WORLD is evil, PEOPLE are evil , so why would the bible not be full of evil. No one understands what the tree of the knowledge of good and evil even is. One day Adam woke up and said Being naked is evil and put on a fig leaf. That is just a story trying to explain where the concept of evil arose if god created all good. PEOPLE created evil by simply defining it as such.
Jesus tried to repair some of the damage by saying JUDGE NOT! do not create evil!
What goes around comes around and karma will fullfill the LEST YE BE JUDGED IN LIKE MANNER.
Look at the cycle of rebellion. EVIL people oppress others until the others rise up and overthrow those evil people. POWER CORRUPTS so the others become the EVIL PEOPLE and oppress the NEW OTHERS and the endless eternal cycle of EVIL PEOPLE goes around and around and around...
"Power" in and of itself does not corrupt, it is the *love of power* that corrupts.
The first young lady that talked seemed to miss the montage from earlier. She’s mad people would call her beliefs irrational, and yet seems to think atheists receiving rape and death threats and accusations of being the most evil and vile scum on the earth, worthy of death and damnation, are somehow the same? No, Aaron made fun of religious beliefs, and of the evil practices in the Catholic Church that the church itself perpetuated and kept under wraps. He poked fun at the beliefs of people, he didn’t attack the people themselves. Even the pedophiles within the church were attacked bu proxy with the picture, and yet this person is mad someone made fun of their religion?
When someone attacks you as a person, they have done something worse than making fun of your beliefs, they have acted with anger and hatred towards you, and Aaron didn’t do that. If you’re mad that he didn’t respect beliefs, sorry, but only people deserve respect, beliefs can be ridiculed as much as they will be when people are discussing whether to believe them or not. People deserve respect, not beliefs, and Aaron respected her and her beliefs more than many religious people respect him and his beliefs.
Don’t criticize someone for a fault you are more guilty of, it only serves to make you look bad.
I see a lot of venom for those two women in the video. But at least they asked something , and perhaps they took something away from it. You cannot undo a lifetime of indoctrination in one small interaction, and maybe they will examine their beliefs with more scrutiny. Aron handled it beautifully, with great tact and never backed away from his point no matter how they tried to divert the argument.
Loved the Q&A thanx Aron
That Twilight Zone episode about Anthony is exactly what I always think about when I picture "God". Glad I'm not the only one who made that connection.