If I remember correctly, Atelier had DLC only party members in Firis (I forgot which, but I think it's the knight girl and the monster tamer kid), Lydie & Suelle (Ilmeria & Lucia) and Lulua (Totori & Meruru), thankfully since Firis with Lydie & Suelle had re-release not to long ago, you can get all of the DLCs on the DX version of the game (minus Lydie & Suelle crossover DLC costumes). As for Lulua, you still had to spent some money to unlock Totori and Meruru.
Good video good voice ! Keep it up ! Thought you were a bigger channel but I’ll stick around to see you get there one day! Hoping to see more JRPG content like the new mana games and stuff
Another complaint about the persona series specifically is the re-release of basically the exact same game with just another arc that happens way too often. P3 into P3FES, P4 into P4 Golden, and P5 into P5R all feel really bad as a consumer because there's no feasible way I can justify to myself paying a full game price AGAIN for something like P5R after buying P5 given that it's 80% the same game. I've been thinking that when P6 releases I should just skip it entirely and wait for P6 that releases later just to get the full game experience instead of wasting money.
I want to do the same, but I am afraid of spoilers; but with a game as long as Persona, playing it twice seems too tiresome. I was liking Persona 4 Golden and someone spoiled the ending to me, which made me drop the game not long afterwards.
@@manamaster6 Yeah, it's a really tough mix because while persona gameplay can be interesting, ultimately the best part of it is the plot/social links IMO, and it's probably basically impossible to not get any spoilers at all of the game while waiting for the "definitive" edition... It's rough. On the other hand, I get you, because I played P5 first and finishing P5R was a struggle.
Atelier is a boutique series. Too many people would balk at a $100 price tag, though, so they split the price between game and DLC. It is what it is. That's what allows the games to continue at the quality they are. I wish Atlus would go back to charging the Atlus tax (every Atlus game on the 3DS sold for $50 rather than the $40 of mainline titles) rather than the day one DLC, but it doesn't look like that's going to happen...
Good topic, and ngl I do want to quote that one famous clip from Smiling Friends S2, but I'll wait till you watch S2. and yeah it can't be expressed enough that a lot of these JRPGs do go far with their DLCs, tho more so with the Publishers/Companies than say the developers, as Greed is their fuel inside. SEGA (recently with the Expansion Pass of P3 Reload and locking NG+ behind paywell with LAD Infinite Wealth), Bandai Namco (with mainly the Tales series, infamously LV-Gald, DLC Skits and DLC Artes) and Koei Tecmo (for mostly anything with Atelier, and anything else even the first Fairy Tail game made by Gust 4 years ago was a victim to this) and obviously NISA with recent Falcom titles. Maybe one day, do a topic of Re-Releases lol
@@madkaiser4887 honestly this dlc rabbit hole is so insane i may do a part 2 talking about it more, cause i can trll I’ve barely scratched the surface of this! Also that rerelease idea is interesting, but what exactly would i talk about is the biggest question
I loved in Symphonia how many outfits there were to discover as part of the sidequests, since they jumped to the PS3, costumes became DLC and the fun of getting/wearing them vanished. In Zestiria the Milla Maxwell's outfit involved jiggle physics for Rose for no reason.
Bless trails swimsuit To me, the dlc for trails really felt like the tales series direction, specially since tales went 3d and had the dlcs first. Tales only beat trails in environments & Berseria/Xillia 1 were the only top games
@@Crimsonrosso Grace F was good, literally the only game ever where I ship two guys together - and it has an very bad post game sadly - Vesperia is also good but held back by the combat Xillia 2 was such an let down, my god Zesteria the worst, even has an water temple that the worst in the series and Arise really didn't feel like tales, specially that second act where it become more movie than an game
The fact that pointless and expensive DLCs are so common in games nowadays only tells me that there are enough people that are willfully buying it all up to make them worth chucking in. They take no effort to implement and can potentially make more money than the sale of the actual game itself. Companies won't care that people complain if they're making such easy profit with these things.
I might be playing Devil's advocate here but when these investors see that there are enough people out there that just buys these DLCs without complain why wouldn't they this ? Whenever I see this types of debates online, I always find people who say that they prefer these as DLCs rather than as unlockables in the game (like say complete this quest to get this costume or item) saying that they have a busy life nad prefer a quicker option for these stuff. While I prefer the older method of having them as unlockables, I feel like people like us are in minority nowadays (granted my job is wfh so I get more time to play) Edit - And this is coming from someone who started playing RPGs through F2P gachas (and still play lol) and even I prefer the old way
@@anmoldembla4743 i have a full time job myself and still prefer earning them through in game work. And with games now costing 60/70 dollars if you want them day one. Then I really shouldn’t have to spend even more money for alternative outfits, they should just be in game unlockables. The idea of “my life is super busy to work on getting an in game unlockable” is weird to me cause…its a video game. Theres not really meant to be a time limit on them, you play to have fun. Like no one is holding a gun to your head ordering you to get the cosmetic as fast as possible outside of maybe MMOS.
I find it so weird how the Trails games are always set at full price of £40-50 and never go on sale, yet are still bold enough to charge players for outfits. Paying full price for an older game but not even getting the complete version is something i could never respect
@@ostrichlord9097 ? Trails games go on sale quite often on steam, falcom is usually pretty consistent with doing sales for there games. Unless you mean on consoles
Gonna have to agree about the Bandai-Namco’s Treatment of the Most Recent Tales game. Arise is Plagued with issues! DLC isn’t an Option. It’s a FUNCTION of the game! Sure they say you Don’t Need it! But Then They Tacked on An Extra Campaign in the form of “Beyond the Dawn” that hardly fixes anything in regards to the Game! It’s honestly really disappointing how these New Tales games basically strips the Game of Fun and Rewards! The Best Costumes are Forcibly Sold off in Packs or in the Ultimate Edition of the game! Though it’s Equally worse when you Realize how MANY DAY ONE PRE-ORDERED DLC there is between Chains like GameStop! Since I played this game All the Way to the End! Let me Sum up How Shit this all is! Not Counting any DLC since I Played the Based Version of this game! Between Every Character, there’s Only a Total of FIVE UNIQUE COSTUMES! With Kisara and Rinwell having only FOUR unique Outfits! As Everyone’s Main Character Attire Has at least Three REPAINTS! While Alphen and Shionne are the only ones to Have EIGHT Unique Costumes! The DLC store has NINE COSTUME PACKS! With the Most Expensive Ones Being the “PREMIUM” and SAO (Sword Art Online) Packs! WHICH is Fucking Awful!
@@danielramsey6141 yea i loved arise when i played it but after berseria let youvunlock literal mountains of free stuff, it really sucjs how bare arise felt outside of reskin outfits
@@Crimsonrosso Yeah! And Compared to Past Tales Games, these Outfit are So LACK LUSTER! Sure! while they do Give Extra Parts and Pieces to your Characters! There are only Two SLOTS Available for Any Changes! This Just Shows that the Creation of this New Game Engine has only Worsened The Franchise’s name! And it’s about on the Same LEVEL as the Final Fantasy 13 games! As Both Suffer from the Same Problems! -Throwing Reskinned Enemies in Waves at you! All of them Being Damage Sponges! -Dealing with A Terrible story that barely has any Memorable Villains! -Shoving DLC crap in our Game to A Level of Annoyance!
Atleast JRPGs are more worth playing than whatever Western games are releasing nowadays 😂. But one thing do annoy me is Altus with it's rereleasing of games, instead of making an expansion they release the whole full game again just with extra scene and characters. You know you don't necessarily have to buy the DLC for Trails series, it's just costumes.
I don't mind Trails DLC ngl, it's basically just bonus outfit or items (so absolutely not necessary to play the game, you won't lose anything not buying them) basically a way to support the game maker more if you want and you got a little thing in exchange, it's thanks to those that game got more budget (and a faster translation possibly) As a comparison, while i love the Mass Effect trilogy, and several of their DLCs are among the best you can find, they put mission that are essential to the main story as DLC, which was just disgusting as someone who already bought the game need to spend even more to get the story of the game already bought
I can definitely see where your coming from on that aspect, and while i do believe fhese should jusr be in game unlockables i can see why some people do it as a way of supporting companies they are fans of. My issue is much more on how insanely overpriced they have become, like if they were around 5-8 dollars i probably wouldn’t be as annoyed but weve reached 30 dollars for costumes and quite frankly thats just ridiculous imo. Also ive never heard of that mass effect stuff since i have never played ( i do plan to someday) was it really that bad?
@@Crimsonrosso True they may have gone a little crazy with the price, for that price they could do some side mission with it kinda how Valkyria chronicle 4 did (another excellent game btw) where you have to actually find the swimsuit on the battlefield in a half-serious half wtf is happening? mood lmao About Mass Effect The DLCs were excellent don't get me wrong But the main villain origin story as DLC? One of the most mysterious character revealed + development for one of the main cast as DLC? (develoment that happen in the main game regardless, but without the DLC it come out of nowhere) The event that literally lead to the start of the 3rd game as DLC? Companion (especially an important one lorewise in ME3) as DLC? That's bs Those game are in my top 3 of all time and their DLCs are among the best i played, but honestly it's at a point where without the DLC you lose a good chunk of the experience and story which is dumb for a game that got his success through said story (fortunately the legendary edition that exist now have all 3 games with all DLC included so that's not an issue anymore, but back in the day it was disgusting)
@@Crimsonrosso Only real issue with your pricing preference is do you mean per costume, per pack, or all costumes altogether sold as dlc. The former would be a horrible change as each costume individually already comes at a cheaper cost than that if I'm right ($2 to $4 if I'm right outside of a few that are more detailed/cameo to some 3rd party IP). The 2nd would be awesome yeah but somewhat unrealistic as the packs price themselves the $15 to $30 Kuro has right now for instance give the costumes at about $2 per costume as there's at minimum 16 costumes in said packs (1 swimsuit for the main 8 characters and then the school uniforms as well for all 8 or some other equivalent costume) if I'm right (and maybe a couple others besides that)...while I personally think costumes shouldn't be more than $1 this would still be fair when compared to many other company's costume prices so it'd nowhere be near the worst. Ideally they'd let you buy whichever ones you wanted separately but it seems liek the industry or platform holder/launcher may be pushing packs nowadays (wouldn't be surprised if Sony/Nintendo/Steam/Xbox just didn't want to have as many dlc entries and thus they try to force them into packs now tbh). And honestly in comparison to other series Trails costume dlc at least didn't feel as BS as them mainly due to the fact Trails, until CS, never even had costumes as an option anyway (probably cause they were closer to 3D pixel like models in Sky/Crossbell but even those could've had dlcs if they wanted to add them...granted Sky came out before dlc started/just as it started and the Crossbell games came out before all games started pushing them of course but even in CS1 to CS4 if I'm right they don't really have more than just the default option as far as costumes go if I'm right...maybe towels for the hotsprings/baths and casual clothes they wore rather than their uniforms but that's it and if I'm right Kuro does the same with NG+ options so unlike something like Tales it's not like they're neutering side quests by removing costumes as a series staple reward for those side quests (and even with tales it was only Symphonia, Legendia, and Abyss that had them before Vesperia introduced dlc in the PS3 version (granted Japan only a the time, for the west I guess it was Graces F). In and ideal world all this would be in the base game of course but unfortunately the world doesn't work that way and the only way we could get it at this point would be if we're willing to spend $100 minimum on standard edition copies of games from now on rather than $60 for most jrpgs (some very few $70 due to the push in AAA (trash) gaming for the higher prices (still don't give us anything more than what they've been giving though which is already less than what the PS2 days gave)). If the option is likely $100 to get all this crap into games (which yes they're already pushing for and they'll likely push for beyond that if given in less than a year just like with the minimum wage pushes) I'd rather spend a few bucks via dlc for the handful of things I do want or not buy dlc at all (costumes/dlc stories/etc)...that extra $40 can go into another game (2/3rds the price alone) and chances are they'll still release dlc even at $100+ retail prices...at the very least we still have the argument that they can sell extra shit as dlc so we can get the base game/story and some side shit at a reasonable price than the BS asking price they want to demand just for access to the game.
Some JRPGs went way too far with DLC at times. For me, Awakening, Fates and Echoes are some examples. Awakening I found it's DLC to be alright since they did add more to the overall game. Fates however, hoo boy. The third story was locked to DLC and with the eShop and servers gone, guess what. It's lost along with all the DLC to boot. Echoes though.... yeah. When the DLC overall is more expensive than the base game, who thought that was a good idea. Seriously. Take it from me. I bought all that. Awakening. Fates. Echoes. All the DLC. It's just nuts. But hey, I enjoy it for what it is.
Charging for cosmetics in a single player game is the dumbest thing ever. Why would I ever buy that stuff, especially if you play on pc where you could just mod in the skins for free. And thats the most annoying part too because I know if I really wanted to I could just mod all these skins in myself for free, but I just don't really give a damn that much to go through the effort.
I think that's the point, you don't need it, one can buy them to support the game makers (or if they really do want those cosmetic stuff or bonus items) but that's absolutely not necessary so no one will feel they lack something if they don't want or can't take them, that may be my humble opinion, but i prefer those kind of DLCs that are really not necessary rather than having to pay for important part of the game like some other games did* *First in line being Mass Effect trilogy, imo ones of the best games of all time and most of the DLCs are incredible... but so incredible and well integrated that they should be in the main story, literally important companion, character development, beating of one of the most mysterious character, conclusion of the crew, the origin of the main villains or even the most important thing that happen between 2 and 3 are in DLCs, which is just disgusting as someone who doesn't want or can't buy the DLCs will miss a big part of the main game that he already bought
some games do take dlc a bit too far, and to think this all started with horse armor from Bethesda... *sigh* xD in terms of Trails I do wish the extra costumes were unlockable or simply buyable from a special store in ng+ or something but I won't hold my breath they'll change anytime soon. I'm guilty of buying them myself, and it's an easy way to get some extra cash that's just pure profit. From a business standpoint it makes perfect sense. At least in Reverie, they let you unlock all kinds of costumes and accessories through the gacha system so that was fun.
Fire Emblem Fates imo gets a pass because it was experimental and while the story might not have been great overall... 40 dollars for the base game and then getting 2 expansions that're basically the same content wise for 20 bucks a pop making it 80 dollars for 3 full games worth of content... That's not that bad, specially with games being 70 dollars now and releasing half baked.
@@RetroNerdyGamer tbh thats fair, i was mainly referencing awakening with this spot, with fates being more secondary Although i still thinkvthey should have let you just choose revelations instead of forcing you to buy it imo. Maybe even just make it a new game plus optional route.
@@Crimsonrosso I mean yeah true, but it wouldnt make sense because then like how would htey handle the other route? Revelation needs both to be played to get whats going on in a way. Either way I get it. Awakening/Echoes DLC were a bit weirder imo but Fates did it ok, it at least gave you the content for the money
Gotta disagree with 1 aspect of this video: #1 should probably be FF...mainly due to FFXV's character dlcs putting pretty much ALL main character development for the characters into the dlc (or just outside the game via videos and the like) and selling it all for $25 on release...throw in the Ardyn's dlc and the dlc that revamped Noctis's 13 swords modes (forget what it was called) and the multiplayer dlc and so on. Then throw in past games going back to the 13 series (first one to have dlc if I'm right...well 13-2 if I'm right (can't remember if 13-1 did or if it released right before dlc started to invade console dlcs a lot) which if I'm right had tons of ridiculous shit going on and even with VIIR part 1 I will say the Intergrade dlc can also be thrown in (good dlc from what I've seen in TH-cam videos mind you) due to 1 main reason: they shafted PS4 FFVIIR buyers by not making a version of the dlc for them (even if it was downgraded a bit)...if they were never gonna release all dlc on said version they should've just made Part 1 PS5 only as well. Will also say Sega is far worse than Tales when it comes to amounts of dlc and specifically the prices (Tales is generally $1 to $2 max int he last few games....worse was probably Graces F where if I'm remembering right all costumes were $6 apiece...they were probably tryign to figure out how far they could go and I assume enough people said fuck off with those prices and didn't buy them as from Xillia onwards I think it was at most $3 or less outside of large cameo packs like SAO/Evangelion/etc where I can almost see the other IP holders for those IPs having a say in the prices too). Only real bad practice they have right now is putting all their dlcs in packs with Arise imo (think it's what $6 for all male costumes and then $6 for all female costumes of each type for 3 different costume sets and then the $10 to $15 for the SAO, Premium, and Tales Cameo sets if I'm right...and well yeah it sucks but at least that's about $2, nearly $3 in some packs per costume rather than some that go for about $5 still in other games...ideallyt hey'd just let you buy them separately of course (at least for all the non cameo (well any cameos that aren't 3rd party Namco could go lower if they wanted as they own the IPs and don't need to share profits with other companies/invidual artists and the like)/Tales cameo costumes). As for the +5 Levels/gold/etc every other jprg on this list does it too and in some cases with worse prices than Tales (if I'm right all of those are no more than $.99) and all the x2 gold/exp/grade does, if I'm right, is unlock the bonuses early on before hitting NG+...I don't buy them though so could be wrong but pretty sure they don't stack with NG+ runs (at best they may let them get that stuff if they don't have enough grade to buy them in their 2nd run onwards). Worst Tales dlc was the Zesty story dlc imo as it was 3 hours of just recapping end game events to a party member that leaves the party early (for a badly written reason too)...Arise's story dlc as far as quality goes was much better imo (gave me 55 hours anyway and was just little bit worse than Tales of Graces F Lineage and Legacies after story in terms of quality/amount of content given) but I do think it should've been about $10 less...or at worse $5 less rather than $25 (only dlc I bought for Arise). Personally I wouldn't hate the idea of costume dlc (and don't really too much tbh) if they at least gave at minimum 3 very unique costume dlcs as unlockables for different quests in the game and at least 2 costume sets for all playable characters gained in the same quest for all characters that fit a theme (swimsuit is the easiest example but also formal if you think of Symphonia's formal costume quest (rather get all in 1 playthrough than 2 though as you can only get 5 in the same run, same with swimsuits), eastern/kimono wear (if we take Trails series as an example for doing this in Kuro/Reverie, etc...granted each of these costumes should look unique and not the same (like Symphonia/Abyss/Veseperia's swimsuit costumes for example rather than Berseria's Swimsuit costumes you get in game or the waiter costumes which are just almost the same costumes on each character with very minor tweaks)). Give me that many in the game and I won't mind buying a few dlc costumes/story dlcs (granted they need to be of at least decent quality now for me to consider...something like Zesty's story dlc or the Code Vein mission dlcs and even some SAO dlcs are not up to the standard I want and it shouldn't be as clearly obvious as the FFXV's character dlcs that major character or world lore focused plot points that were more or less necessary to develop the character/world were removed to use as dlc (Arise's dlc was very clearly not an example of this which is why I rate it highly as it's a clear after story to the base game's main events and was clearly made to build off events from the base game to show how the game's world was progressing post end credts...either a dlc story needs to do this or if it occurs at teh same time as the game be clearly disconnected to mainline events enough to NOT have required character development/lore that should've been in the game to begin with...basically it could dive deeper into something a side quest covered as it's main focus for the dlc...the ONLY reasonable way/exception it could cover mroe mainline game plot points is if it was clearly made well after the game's release and didn't start development when the game released (Elden Ring Shadow the Erd Tree dlc is prime example of this done right for instance as it adds lore into the existing game rather than being an after story or the like...as for pricing for such dlc it would depend on how long, replay value, and amount of content/quality of the content but ideally no more than about $20 would be ideal imo for a dlc that adds say 30+ hours or more and about 60 side quests, new moves, new costumes as part of the story dlc, new enemies, about 4 new dungeons before the final one and 2 to 3 new regions and at least one new town and then 1 more final dungeon and then an extra post dlc dungeon too etc (Tales of Arise was just missing a couple of these but otherwise matched these requirements))) /maybe even attachment dlcs as long as the prices aren't BS high (basically no more than $2 per costume, preferably $1 or even less if that was possible).
@@ifrit1937 funnily enough I actually talked about that FF 15 DLC stuff back when I reviewed. If i rver do a part 2 (which may honestly happen due to just how well this video is doing) there definitely gonna be added
Tbh this script was written like a year ago before i had seen more of segas library so i focused solely on oersona, but after seeing the shit there forcing into series like yakuza i can definitely say they would belong on this list
To be fare, the developer team Gust is or was realy struggling with money and had to bring out game after game, only after first Atelier Ryza game they made good money. So the fact that thous dlc bring near nothing except the one thing big games thous days would never give you - attractive woman in attractive clothes. And no kne forces you to buy thous dlc the same way no one forces you to play suicide squat or thous woke shooters.
Every game that's an RPG honestly. DLC will be inaccessible later down the line. People who try KH3 in the future might not get to experience remind. Rereleases should be a standard practice for preserving games. DLC is paying to not own parts of content and sometimes QOL updates and changes to a game. Thats more terrifying than overpriced costumes. I am so glad Atlus does rereleases of successful games cause of this. DLC is anti consumer on so many levels when its story dlc and extra content and more should be afraid of games they loved in the past being incomplete in the future. DS FE DLC has nothing on 3houses and Engage exapnsion pass DLC which is very bad in the long run.
Well yeah that aspect of dlcs possibly being taken away from you sucks (hell almost faced that with Tales of Xillia when I decided to boot up my PS3 to make sure it was working fine recently where the game wouldn't even start up and gave me 'you do not have the license for a dlc attached to the game...I eventually got it to work though by connecting the PS3 to my home's internet so it's showing dlc and likely even digital games NEED some internet connection to work as of the PS3 era due to DRM BS (my guess is they check for the current date to confirm the dlc's expiration date (usually around 2099 if I'm right which will be well after we're all likely to be dead and likely well after our platform of choice will break down or in the case of say a digital only one like Steam's/any digital storefront may shut down/become obsolete) is what caused it). With that said even if you never get dlc or buy a digital game and only get physical it may still happen due to companies possibly making it so any patch series after release may need a similar check when starting up the game so if you ever patch a game to a new version it may also be affected in this way and pretty much ALL games get patched nowadays...so outside of playing all games physically using the 1.0 builds or unofficial modded builds that addresses issues you risk playing games with game breaking bugs/poor balancing issues/etc and almost certainly no multiplayer capability (well official multiplayer anyway)...any fixing/multiplayer would need to be done via mods at that point and risk lawsuits from game companies (look at how happy Nintendo is to go after anyone for the littlest thing...hell just a few years ago they went after some Zelda creators for the multiplayer BotW run and forced that to stop and threated channels that showed content with it....surprised they haven't done the same for the randomizer channels too tbh...and since the series was mentioned in the video the same can be said about the fan translations of the Trails series too...the moment NiSA finally decided to release the games here everyone stopped it (both translating and even having walkthroughs of the pertinent fan subs) due to cease and desist)
![Tales of Xillia Group Battle Victory Quotes Compilation [English]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/IQhveoYfvYk/mqdefault.jpg)
I enjoyed the video. You've earned a new subscriber
If I remember correctly, Atelier had DLC only party members in Firis (I forgot which, but I think it's the knight girl and the monster tamer kid), Lydie & Suelle (Ilmeria & Lucia) and Lulua (Totori & Meruru), thankfully since Firis with Lydie & Suelle had re-release not to long ago, you can get all of the DLCs on the DX version of the game (minus Lydie & Suelle crossover DLC costumes). As for Lulua, you still had to spent some money to unlock Totori and Meruru.
@@ramaluminus wait they had DLC only party members!!! THATS INSANE! Like i can get dlc characters for stuff like fighting games but PARTY MEMBERS!!!
Good video good voice ! Keep it up ! Thought you were a bigger channel but I’ll stick around to see you get there one day! Hoping to see more JRPG content like the new mana games and stuff
@@abrahamirl21 expect a lot of RPG content if ya do stick around
Another complaint about the persona series specifically is the re-release of basically the exact same game with just another arc that happens way too often. P3 into P3FES, P4 into P4 Golden, and P5 into P5R all feel really bad as a consumer because there's no feasible way I can justify to myself paying a full game price AGAIN for something like P5R after buying P5 given that it's 80% the same game. I've been thinking that when P6 releases I should just skip it entirely and wait for P6 that releases later just to get the full game experience instead of wasting money.
Honestly yea, not sure whats up with those rereleases but atlus needs to bring them to an end!
I'm surprised that there isn't more uproar about this. I bought both the base PS5 and SMTV games and feel kind of screwed over.
@@Drstrange3000 it’s definitely starting to get talked about more nowadays, but it is kinda shocking it wasnt til recently that it blew up as much
I want to do the same, but I am afraid of spoilers; but with a game as long as Persona, playing it twice seems too tiresome.
I was liking Persona 4 Golden and someone spoiled the ending to me, which made me drop the game not long afterwards.
@@manamaster6 Yeah, it's a really tough mix because while persona gameplay can be interesting, ultimately the best part of it is the plot/social links IMO, and it's probably basically impossible to not get any spoilers at all of the game while waiting for the "definitive" edition... It's rough. On the other hand, I get you, because I played P5 first and finishing P5R was a struggle.
You Named atlus without naming their Day 1 Story DLC for Soul Hackers 2?! Wild.
NGL I thought about it but i feel like persona overall needed to be talked about considering just how many times it happens.
Atelier is a boutique series. Too many people would balk at a $100 price tag, though, so they split the price between game and DLC. It is what it is. That's what allows the games to continue at the quality they are. I wish Atlus would go back to charging the Atlus tax (every Atlus game on the 3DS sold for $50 rather than the $40 of mainline titles) rather than the day one DLC, but it doesn't look like that's going to happen...
Good topic, and ngl I do want to quote that one famous clip from Smiling Friends S2, but I'll wait till you watch S2.
and yeah it can't be expressed enough that a lot of these JRPGs do go far with their DLCs, tho more so with the Publishers/Companies than say the developers, as Greed is their fuel inside. SEGA (recently with the Expansion Pass of P3 Reload and locking NG+ behind paywell with LAD Infinite Wealth), Bandai Namco (with mainly the Tales series, infamously LV-Gald, DLC Skits and DLC Artes) and Koei Tecmo (for mostly anything with Atelier, and anything else even the first Fairy Tail game made by Gust 4 years ago was a victim to this) and obviously NISA with recent Falcom titles.
Maybe one day, do a topic of Re-Releases lol
@@madkaiser4887 honestly this dlc rabbit hole is so insane i may do a part 2 talking about it more, cause i can trll I’ve barely scratched the surface of this!
Also that rerelease idea is interesting, but what exactly would i talk about is the biggest question
I used to love the Tales of series...
@@manamaster6 I definitely need to play more of the games myself
I loved in Symphonia how many outfits there were to discover as part of the sidequests, since they jumped to the PS3, costumes became DLC and the fun of getting/wearing them vanished.
In Zestiria the Milla Maxwell's outfit involved jiggle physics for Rose for no reason.
Bless trails swimsuit
To me, the dlc for trails really felt like the tales series direction, specially since tales went 3d and had the dlcs first. Tales only beat trails in environments & Berseria/Xillia 1 were the only top games
Ngl tales is a series i gotta check out more! Just kinda insane what sone companies decide they can milk your wallet for 😭😭😭
@@Crimsonrosso Grace F was good, literally the only game ever where I ship two guys together - and it has an very bad post game sadly -
Vesperia is also good but held back by the combat
Xillia 2 was such an let down, my god
Zesteria the worst, even has an water temple that the worst in the series
and Arise really didn't feel like tales, specially that second act where it become more movie than an game
@@lulukomadori9651 ill have to check im out, Epsically xillia
The fact that pointless and expensive DLCs are so common in games nowadays only tells me that there are enough people that are willfully buying it all up to make them worth chucking in. They take no effort to implement and can potentially make more money than the sale of the actual game itself. Companies won't care that people complain if they're making such easy profit with these things.
great video but you are pronuncing Atelier completly wrong buddy XD
@@francgodgaud LMAO sorry im now to the franchise 😭😭😭
I might be playing Devil's advocate here but when these investors see that there are enough people out there that just buys these DLCs without complain why wouldn't they this ? Whenever I see this types of debates online, I always find people who say that they prefer these as DLCs rather than as unlockables in the game (like say complete this quest to get this costume or item) saying that they have a busy life nad prefer a quicker option for these stuff. While I prefer the older method of having them as unlockables, I feel like people like us are in minority nowadays (granted my job is wfh so I get more time to play)
Edit - And this is coming from someone who started playing RPGs through F2P gachas (and still play lol) and even I prefer the old way
@@anmoldembla4743 i have a full time job myself and still prefer earning them through in game work.
And with games now costing 60/70 dollars if you want them day one. Then I really shouldn’t have to spend even more money for alternative outfits, they should just be in game unlockables.
The idea of “my life is super busy to work on getting an in game unlockable” is weird to me cause…its a video game. Theres not really meant to be a time limit on them, you play to have fun. Like no one is holding a gun to your head ordering you to get the cosmetic as fast as possible outside of maybe MMOS.
Also i hope im not coming across as a dick, thats not my intention
@@Crimsonrosso Oh no don't worry, I have same view on this as you. And this was my first time on the channel so consider a new sub from me
@@anmoldembla4743 oh thanks! Good to hear im not alone in thinking this way! Hope the channel entertains ya from here on!
How about the BLUE REFLECTION: Season Pass that costs 79,99 Dollars and is only Costumes
@@Arekusandaa1986 WAIT. WHAT!!! Ive heard of the blue reflection series but 80 bucks got costumes!!!! Thats bonkers
I find it so weird how the Trails games are always set at full price of £40-50 and never go on sale, yet are still bold enough to charge players for outfits. Paying full price for an older game but not even getting the complete version is something i could never respect
@@ostrichlord9097 ?
Trails games go on sale quite often on steam, falcom is usually pretty consistent with doing sales for there games.
Unless you mean on consoles
@@Crimsonrossoyeah im on console. Never seen any of then on sale there
@@ostrichlord9097 ah ok, yea its rare for them to ho on sale on consoles in comparison to PC where it feels like every other month there half off
@Crimsonrosso PC users are eating good with the rpgs. Well, better they're cheap somewhere than nowhere right
@@ostrichlord9097 yea but I really hope falcom starts doing this for consoles as well. More people need to experience this amazing series
Gonna have to agree about the Bandai-Namco’s Treatment of the Most Recent Tales game.
Arise is Plagued with issues! DLC isn’t an Option. It’s a FUNCTION of the game!
Sure they say you Don’t Need it! But Then They Tacked on An Extra Campaign in the form of “Beyond the Dawn” that hardly fixes anything in regards to the Game!
It’s honestly really disappointing how these New Tales games basically strips the Game of Fun and Rewards!
The Best Costumes are Forcibly Sold off in Packs or in the Ultimate Edition of the game!
Though it’s Equally worse when you Realize how MANY DAY ONE PRE-ORDERED DLC there is between Chains like GameStop!
Since I played this game All the Way to the End! Let me Sum up How Shit this all is!
Not Counting any DLC since I Played the Based Version of this game!
Between Every Character, there’s Only a Total of FIVE UNIQUE COSTUMES!
With Kisara and Rinwell having only FOUR unique Outfits! As Everyone’s Main Character Attire Has at least Three REPAINTS!
While Alphen and Shionne are the only ones to Have EIGHT Unique Costumes!
The DLC store has NINE COSTUME PACKS! With the Most Expensive Ones Being the “PREMIUM” and SAO (Sword Art Online) Packs!
WHICH is Fucking Awful!
@@danielramsey6141 yea i loved arise when i played it but after berseria let youvunlock literal mountains of free stuff, it really sucjs how bare arise felt outside of reskin outfits
@@Crimsonrosso
Yeah! And Compared to Past Tales Games, these Outfit are So LACK LUSTER! Sure! while they do Give Extra Parts and Pieces to your Characters!
There are only Two SLOTS Available for Any Changes! This Just Shows that the Creation of this New Game Engine has only Worsened The Franchise’s name!
And it’s about on the Same LEVEL as the Final Fantasy 13 games!
As Both Suffer from the Same Problems!
-Throwing Reskinned Enemies in Waves at you! All of them Being Damage Sponges!
-Dealing with A Terrible story that barely has any Memorable Villains!
-Shoving DLC crap in our Game to A Level of Annoyance!
The DLC costumes for Arise were pretty bad, to say the best ones were sold off in packs
Atleast JRPGs are more worth playing than whatever Western games are releasing nowadays 😂.
But one thing do annoy me is Altus with it's rereleasing of games, instead of making an expansion they release the whole full game again just with extra scene and characters.
You know you don't necessarily have to buy the DLC for Trails series, it's just costumes.
I don't mind Trails DLC ngl, it's basically just bonus outfit or items (so absolutely not necessary to play the game, you won't lose anything not buying them) basically a way to support the game maker more if you want and you got a little thing in exchange, it's thanks to those that game got more budget (and a faster translation possibly)
As a comparison, while i love the Mass Effect trilogy, and several of their DLCs are among the best you can find, they put mission that are essential to the main story as DLC, which was just disgusting as someone who already bought the game need to spend even more to get the story of the game already bought
I can definitely see where your coming from on that aspect, and while i do believe fhese should jusr be in game unlockables i can see why some people do it as a way of supporting companies they are fans of.
My issue is much more on how insanely overpriced they have become, like if they were around 5-8 dollars i probably wouldn’t be as annoyed but weve reached 30 dollars for costumes and quite frankly thats just ridiculous imo.
Also ive never heard of that mass effect stuff since i have never played ( i do plan to someday) was it really that bad?
@@Crimsonrosso True they may have gone a little crazy with the price, for that price they could do some side mission with it kinda how Valkyria chronicle 4 did (another excellent game btw) where you have to actually find the swimsuit on the battlefield in a half-serious half wtf is happening? mood lmao
About Mass Effect The DLCs were excellent don't get me wrong
But the main villain origin story as DLC? One of the most mysterious character revealed + development for one of the main cast as DLC? (develoment that happen in the main game regardless, but without the DLC it come out of nowhere) The event that literally lead to the start of the 3rd game as DLC? Companion (especially an important one lorewise in ME3) as DLC? That's bs
Those game are in my top 3 of all time and their DLCs are among the best i played, but honestly it's at a point where without the DLC you lose a good chunk of the experience and story which is dumb for a game that got his success through said story (fortunately the legendary edition that exist now have all 3 games with all DLC included so that's not an issue anymore, but back in the day it was disgusting)
@@guifire9747 i would of been doen for mission dlc lmao
oof that sounds like it was brutal. Ill pick up tge legendary edition to get around that then
@@Crimsonrosso Only real issue with your pricing preference is do you mean per costume, per pack, or all costumes altogether sold as dlc.
The former would be a horrible change as each costume individually already comes at a cheaper cost than that if I'm right ($2 to $4 if I'm right outside of a few that are more detailed/cameo to some 3rd party IP).
The 2nd would be awesome yeah but somewhat unrealistic as the packs price themselves the $15 to $30 Kuro has right now for instance give the costumes at about $2 per costume as there's at minimum 16 costumes in said packs (1 swimsuit for the main 8 characters and then the school uniforms as well for all 8 or some other equivalent costume) if I'm right (and maybe a couple others besides that)...while I personally think costumes shouldn't be more than $1 this would still be fair when compared to many other company's costume prices so it'd nowhere be near the worst. Ideally they'd let you buy whichever ones you wanted separately but it seems liek the industry or platform holder/launcher may be pushing packs nowadays (wouldn't be surprised if Sony/Nintendo/Steam/Xbox just didn't want to have as many dlc entries and thus they try to force them into packs now tbh).
And honestly in comparison to other series Trails costume dlc at least didn't feel as BS as them mainly due to the fact Trails, until CS, never even had costumes as an option anyway (probably cause they were closer to 3D pixel like models in Sky/Crossbell but even those could've had dlcs if they wanted to add them...granted Sky came out before dlc started/just as it started and the Crossbell games came out before all games started pushing them of course but even in CS1 to CS4 if I'm right they don't really have more than just the default option as far as costumes go if I'm right...maybe towels for the hotsprings/baths and casual clothes they wore rather than their uniforms but that's it and if I'm right Kuro does the same with NG+ options so unlike something like Tales it's not like they're neutering side quests by removing costumes as a series staple reward for those side quests (and even with tales it was only Symphonia, Legendia, and Abyss that had them before Vesperia introduced dlc in the PS3 version (granted Japan only a the time, for the west I guess it was Graces F).
In and ideal world all this would be in the base game of course but unfortunately the world doesn't work that way and the only way we could get it at this point would be if we're willing to spend $100 minimum on standard edition copies of games from now on rather than $60 for most jrpgs (some very few $70 due to the push in AAA (trash) gaming for the higher prices (still don't give us anything more than what they've been giving though which is already less than what the PS2 days gave)). If the option is likely $100 to get all this crap into games (which yes they're already pushing for and they'll likely push for beyond that if given in less than a year just like with the minimum wage pushes) I'd rather spend a few bucks via dlc for the handful of things I do want or not buy dlc at all (costumes/dlc stories/etc)...that extra $40 can go into another game (2/3rds the price alone) and chances are they'll still release dlc even at $100+ retail prices...at the very least we still have the argument that they can sell extra shit as dlc so we can get the base game/story and some side shit at a reasonable price than the BS asking price they want to demand just for access to the game.
Some JRPGs went way too far with DLC at times. For me, Awakening, Fates and Echoes are some examples. Awakening I found it's DLC to be alright since they did add more to the overall game. Fates however, hoo boy. The third story was locked to DLC and with the eShop and servers gone, guess what. It's lost along with all the DLC to boot. Echoes though.... yeah. When the DLC overall is more expensive than the base game, who thought that was a good idea. Seriously. Take it from me. I bought all that. Awakening. Fates. Echoes. All the DLC. It's just nuts. But hey, I enjoy it for what it is.
I do agree the DLC is enjoyable but these devs GOTTA learn limits. Thankfully it seems the fire emblem creators have lol
Charging for cosmetics in a single player game is the dumbest thing ever. Why would I ever buy that stuff, especially if you play on pc where you could just mod in the skins for free. And thats the most annoying part too because I know if I really wanted to I could just mod all these skins in myself for free, but I just don't really give a damn that much to go through the effort.
Remember the days when you could just win this stuff in minigames? I certainly do
I think that's the point, you don't need it, one can buy them to support the game makers (or if they really do want those cosmetic stuff or bonus items) but that's absolutely not necessary so no one will feel they lack something if they don't want or can't take them, that may be my humble opinion, but i prefer those kind of DLCs that are really not necessary rather than having to pay for important part of the game like some other games did*
*First in line being Mass Effect trilogy, imo ones of the best games of all time and most of the DLCs are incredible... but so incredible and well integrated that they should be in the main story, literally important companion, character development, beating of one of the most mysterious character, conclusion of the crew, the origin of the main villains or even the most important thing that happen between 2 and 3 are in DLCs, which is just disgusting as someone who doesn't want or can't buy the DLCs will miss a big part of the main game that he already bought
some games do take dlc a bit too far, and to think this all started with horse armor from Bethesda... *sigh* xD in terms of Trails I do wish the extra costumes were unlockable or simply buyable from a special store in ng+ or something but I won't hold my breath they'll change anytime soon. I'm guilty of buying them myself, and it's an easy way to get some extra cash that's just pure profit. From a business standpoint it makes perfect sense. At least in Reverie, they let you unlock all kinds of costumes and accessories through the gacha system so that was fun.
honestly i thought after reverie letting you unlcok outfits that would be the standerd going forword but guess not lol
Fire Emblem Fates imo gets a pass because it was experimental and while the story might not have been great overall... 40 dollars for the base game and then getting 2 expansions that're basically the same content wise for 20 bucks a pop making it 80 dollars for 3 full games worth of content... That's not that bad, specially with games being 70 dollars now and releasing half baked.
@@RetroNerdyGamer tbh thats fair, i was mainly referencing awakening with this spot, with fates being more secondary
Although i still thinkvthey should have let you just choose revelations instead of forcing you to buy it imo. Maybe even just make it a new game plus optional route.
@@Crimsonrosso I mean yeah true, but it wouldnt make sense because then like how would htey handle the other route? Revelation needs both to be played to get whats going on in a way. Either way I get it. Awakening/Echoes DLC were a bit weirder imo but Fates did it ok, it at least gave you the content for the money
Gotta disagree with 1 aspect of this video: #1 should probably be FF...mainly due to FFXV's character dlcs putting pretty much ALL main character development for the characters into the dlc (or just outside the game via videos and the like) and selling it all for $25 on release...throw in the Ardyn's dlc and the dlc that revamped Noctis's 13 swords modes (forget what it was called) and the multiplayer dlc and so on. Then throw in past games going back to the 13 series (first one to have dlc if I'm right...well 13-2 if I'm right (can't remember if 13-1 did or if it released right before dlc started to invade console dlcs a lot) which if I'm right had tons of ridiculous shit going on and even with VIIR part 1 I will say the Intergrade dlc can also be thrown in (good dlc from what I've seen in TH-cam videos mind you) due to 1 main reason: they shafted PS4 FFVIIR buyers by not making a version of the dlc for them (even if it was downgraded a bit)...if they were never gonna release all dlc on said version they should've just made Part 1 PS5 only as well.
Will also say Sega is far worse than Tales when it comes to amounts of dlc and specifically the prices (Tales is generally $1 to $2 max int he last few games....worse was probably Graces F where if I'm remembering right all costumes were $6 apiece...they were probably tryign to figure out how far they could go and I assume enough people said fuck off with those prices and didn't buy them as from Xillia onwards I think it was at most $3 or less outside of large cameo packs like SAO/Evangelion/etc where I can almost see the other IP holders for those IPs having a say in the prices too). Only real bad practice they have right now is putting all their dlcs in packs with Arise imo (think it's what $6 for all male costumes and then $6 for all female costumes of each type for 3 different costume sets and then the $10 to $15 for the SAO, Premium, and Tales Cameo sets if I'm right...and well yeah it sucks but at least that's about $2, nearly $3 in some packs per costume rather than some that go for about $5 still in other games...ideallyt hey'd just let you buy them separately of course (at least for all the non cameo (well any cameos that aren't 3rd party Namco could go lower if they wanted as they own the IPs and don't need to share profits with other companies/invidual artists and the like)/Tales cameo costumes). As for the +5 Levels/gold/etc every other jprg on this list does it too and in some cases with worse prices than Tales (if I'm right all of those are no more than $.99) and all the x2 gold/exp/grade does, if I'm right, is unlock the bonuses early on before hitting NG+...I don't buy them though so could be wrong but pretty sure they don't stack with NG+ runs (at best they may let them get that stuff if they don't have enough grade to buy them in their 2nd run onwards). Worst Tales dlc was the Zesty story dlc imo as it was 3 hours of just recapping end game events to a party member that leaves the party early (for a badly written reason too)...Arise's story dlc as far as quality goes was much better imo (gave me 55 hours anyway and was just little bit worse than Tales of Graces F Lineage and Legacies after story in terms of quality/amount of content given) but I do think it should've been about $10 less...or at worse $5 less rather than $25 (only dlc I bought for Arise).
Personally I wouldn't hate the idea of costume dlc (and don't really too much tbh) if they at least gave at minimum 3 very unique costume dlcs as unlockables for different quests in the game and at least 2 costume sets for all playable characters gained in the same quest for all characters that fit a theme (swimsuit is the easiest example but also formal if you think of Symphonia's formal costume quest (rather get all in 1 playthrough than 2 though as you can only get 5 in the same run, same with swimsuits), eastern/kimono wear (if we take Trails series as an example for doing this in Kuro/Reverie, etc...granted each of these costumes should look unique and not the same (like Symphonia/Abyss/Veseperia's swimsuit costumes for example rather than Berseria's Swimsuit costumes you get in game or the waiter costumes which are just almost the same costumes on each character with very minor tweaks)). Give me that many in the game and I won't mind buying a few dlc costumes/story dlcs (granted they need to be of at least decent quality now for me to consider...something like Zesty's story dlc or the Code Vein mission dlcs and even some SAO dlcs are not up to the standard I want and it shouldn't be as clearly obvious as the FFXV's character dlcs that major character or world lore focused plot points that were more or less necessary to develop the character/world were removed to use as dlc (Arise's dlc was very clearly not an example of this which is why I rate it highly as it's a clear after story to the base game's main events and was clearly made to build off events from the base game to show how the game's world was progressing post end credts...either a dlc story needs to do this or if it occurs at teh same time as the game be clearly disconnected to mainline events enough to NOT have required character development/lore that should've been in the game to begin with...basically it could dive deeper into something a side quest covered as it's main focus for the dlc...the ONLY reasonable way/exception it could cover mroe mainline game plot points is if it was clearly made well after the game's release and didn't start development when the game released (Elden Ring Shadow the Erd Tree dlc is prime example of this done right for instance as it adds lore into the existing game rather than being an after story or the like...as for pricing for such dlc it would depend on how long, replay value, and amount of content/quality of the content but ideally no more than about $20 would be ideal imo for a dlc that adds say 30+ hours or more and about 60 side quests, new moves, new costumes as part of the story dlc, new enemies, about 4 new dungeons before the final one and 2 to 3 new regions and at least one new town and then 1 more final dungeon and then an extra post dlc dungeon too etc (Tales of Arise was just missing a couple of these but otherwise matched these requirements))) /maybe even attachment dlcs as long as the prices aren't BS high (basically no more than $2 per costume, preferably $1 or even less if that was possible).
@@ifrit1937 funnily enough I actually talked about that FF 15 DLC stuff back when I reviewed. If i rver do a part 2 (which may honestly happen due to just how well this video is doing) there definitely gonna be added
Tbh this script was written like a year ago before i had seen more of segas library so i focused solely on oersona, but after seeing the shit there forcing into series like yakuza i can definitely say they would belong on this list
These games are more bloated with DLC than my stomach is bloated with gas, which says a TON 😂😂😂
To be fare, the developer team Gust is or was realy struggling with money and had to bring out game after game, only after first Atelier Ryza game they made good money.
So the fact that thous dlc bring near nothing except the one thing big games thous days would never give you - attractive woman in attractive clothes.
And no kne forces you to buy thous dlc the same way no one forces you to play suicide squat or thous woke shooters.
Dude what the hell do the “ woke” shooters have to due with a video about companies that over release dlcs 😭😭😭
Stay in school, everybody.
Every game that's an RPG honestly. DLC will be inaccessible later down the line. People who try KH3 in the future might not get to experience remind. Rereleases should be a standard practice for preserving games. DLC is paying to not own parts of content and sometimes QOL updates and changes to a game. Thats more terrifying than overpriced costumes. I am so glad Atlus does rereleases of successful games cause of this. DLC is anti consumer on so many levels when its story dlc and extra content and more should be afraid of games they loved in the past being incomplete in the future. DS FE DLC has nothing on 3houses and Engage exapnsion pass DLC which is very bad in the long run.
Well yeah that aspect of dlcs possibly being taken away from you sucks (hell almost faced that with Tales of Xillia when I decided to boot up my PS3 to make sure it was working fine recently where the game wouldn't even start up and gave me 'you do not have the license for a dlc attached to the game...I eventually got it to work though by connecting the PS3 to my home's internet so it's showing dlc and likely even digital games NEED some internet connection to work as of the PS3 era due to DRM BS (my guess is they check for the current date to confirm the dlc's expiration date (usually around 2099 if I'm right which will be well after we're all likely to be dead and likely well after our platform of choice will break down or in the case of say a digital only one like Steam's/any digital storefront may shut down/become obsolete) is what caused it).
With that said even if you never get dlc or buy a digital game and only get physical it may still happen due to companies possibly making it so any patch series after release may need a similar check when starting up the game so if you ever patch a game to a new version it may also be affected in this way and pretty much ALL games get patched nowadays...so outside of playing all games physically using the 1.0 builds or unofficial modded builds that addresses issues you risk playing games with game breaking bugs/poor balancing issues/etc and almost certainly no multiplayer capability (well official multiplayer anyway)...any fixing/multiplayer would need to be done via mods at that point and risk lawsuits from game companies (look at how happy Nintendo is to go after anyone for the littlest thing...hell just a few years ago they went after some Zelda creators for the multiplayer BotW run and forced that to stop and threated channels that showed content with it....surprised they haven't done the same for the randomizer channels too tbh...and since the series was mentioned in the video the same can be said about the fan translations of the Trails series too...the moment NiSA finally decided to release the games here everyone stopped it (both translating and even having walkthroughs of the pertinent fan subs) due to cease and desist)