Honestly, this was perfectly explained. It took me 40 plus carts for me to finally solo Fatalis. And now I can solo it with Defender weapons just because I simply gotten much better than I was 4 years ago.
I'm glad you mention that timeline actually, since originally when I planned to write this script it was going to be *much* more negative lol. However I thought "ya know, it really wouldn't be fair to write this considering I've only beaten the monster 2 or 3 times, and without even haven't proper endgame gear so lemme see what the fight is like if I have full fatalis and weapons augmented a bit" and I'm really glad I did since in doing so not only did I get a much better understanding of the fight, but I also just got a whole lot better at it! It's crazy how much more fun this fight becomes as you improve
Im a massive fatalis fan and I will die on the hill that Fatty is one of the best bossfights ever. However I do agree with some of your points. Some of his hitboxes are janky especially the tail slam, quick bite, and his flame sweep (i get damaged before fire hits me???). I guess its just personal tolerance. The music, buildup and spectacle along with a tough fight just makes everything else feel fantastic tho, despite the flaws. I really felt like I was fighting the OG Black Dragon, so imo the difficulty felt justified. Its quite fascinating how everyone has such different opinions on the same thing
I think all in all I've grown to like the boss quite a lot. It's not my favorite boss but it holds a very special place in my heart not only for the reasons I went over in the video, but just for the context of it all. Feels really good to finally have this guy crossed off the list of hard bosses I have to beat lol
I remember fighting this boss 4 years ago when I was still new to monster hunter and getting really frustrated at it and eventually quit after 400 hours on that save file. 4 years later after playing all sorts of games, I came back after hearing about Wilds on a new save file but this time,it was different cause now I knew I had to prepare for these sorts of things so when I finally beat it,I screamed. It actually felt like 4 years of experience led up to this and now I absolutely love this boss cause it showed me that I've grown.
Just saw the title & the thumbnail and here's my answer: Difficulty becomes artificial when the complexity & engagement of the enemy is no longer the force pushing the player to be better, but is rather the very high(sometimes unavoidable) damage along with possibly too much health. This causes the players to beat the enemy via pure war of attrition rather than by purposeful adaptation
If Fatass attacks and hitboxes weren't enough... This visual excuse for a dragon have these "flinches" if you do exactly 4500 part damage to the head. This works as a separate partbreak hp bar. So there are three in total. But what's so bad about it? Fatalis can have 1 hp in this "flinch bar", flinch happens. But excess damage don't follow into next bar. This makes this fight feels extremely inconsistent when fighting with larger weapons because... "Why is he doing his nova now? I didn't do 2 flinches." It's artificially fixed to be this way to make head breaking even worse. Did I mentioned it's head have fixed 44 hitzone value for guns? Yeah. Weakness Exploit don't trigger on Fatalis head, even softened. Hitboxes are one thing. Preparing for a hunt are second. But specifically hindering weapons to not perform in certain cases is artificial however you might name it. And don't get me wrong here. This fight is... Weird. People may call Alatreon an Artificial garbage with Escaton judgement but it's absolutely possible to do it with Frostfang gear. His hitboxes are clean, telegraphs are clean and visible, breaking horns and disabling one shot isn't that hard. What's really difficult about Alatreon is the amount of moves this beast have and recognizing them in split second decisions. His "slam into knockdown" move stops targeting player around a second before strike itself occurs. There's clear chance for a player to move out of this attack range and counterattack. Not like some "Waterfowl Lady" which dislocate her own skeleton to attack player...
I love the musical progression in this video. As soon as Fatalis introduces itself The Forest and Hills theme starts to play. That might not seem like it makes much sense but this theme is basically the old school Fatalis theme without the choir. Then the actual Fatalis theme kicks in. Specifically the phase 2 version. You would think this is the end of the road but no there is a nother Fatalis theme. One that was also used in the Alatrean video. White Fatalis‘s music having a banger intro really helps elevate what‘s being talked about. Anyway, it‘s Proof of a Hero time, a little earlier than I expected to be honest. It makes sense though since the final phase is currently being discussed. It fits great with where the video‘s at right now but what’s gonna play at the ending now? Well, I’m glad you asked. It‘s a succession of different melodies that make you think of a sunny summer day in Seliana. What melodies? I think you already know. It‘s Succession of Light.
I think you know this already, but in case you don't, I absolutely love these comments. I put a crazy amount of work into these videos and so to have someone notice the little things like the forest and hills theme being a reference to old school fatalis makes me so happy
30 minute cap was the worst part to me. even when I do everything right I just ended up running out of time. 😅 Edit: I posted before I got to the last part of the video, I just realized I haven't attempted fatalis with the complete fatalis armor set because I don't have it yet.
That's the catch 22 though! With full fatalis gear the timer becomes a non issue, but to get full fatalis gear you have to (in theory) beat fatalis without full fatalis gear first. I think if you have fully augmented gear and weapons along with maybe a few lucky decos, the timer probably isn't as much of an issue since I'd imagine maxed out normal gear is somewhere close normal fatalis gear, but I personally didn't have the time nor the will to farm the guiding lands for 60+ hours LMAO
@@mhswoocer dont think you need 60+ hours for full augment on weapons, basically just 3 locales at level 7 and a couple of kills, which doesnt take that long. Farming decos on the other hand... I've had to kill Teostra over 200 times to get most of necessary decorations, which is still less than 30 hours KEK
I don’t think the Fatalis armor helps as much as people think. I have done it with defender gear and other high rank sets, but that comes from mastering the fight. My first real solo kill was done with a fully augmented Teostra, Brachydios set and it took 24 minutes. I did died a lot but that is part of learning the fight. Nowdays I can do the same fight with this set on an average of twelve minutes. I constantly see people getting to this fight and getting one shotted because as soon as they finished the mains story they do the line of quests that lead to this fight, without having understanding of building, or augmentation of armor and weapons. I don’t even think that’s the players fault, there is a very sudden change of philosophy in this fight that can be lethal for some players. A lot of people will play the game slow in a very defensive manner, waiting for the biggest openings to deal damage, and the game lets them finish quests in 30/40 minutes without problem. Then they get to alatreon and Fatalis, and if they don’t try to optimize their damage windows they will fail by means of escaton/ time out. I love both of those fights, Fatalis is my all time favorite boss, I don’t think they are the problem here. The game should have other quests throughout the progression that signalizes better that the player should upgrade their gear, that they should engage more offensively in combat, and that they should counter build for the monster. Before alatreon and Fatalis I think the only two monster I ever counter build for were Val hazzak and nightshade paolumo. Now, is the timer artificial difficulty? I think it is, but in a good way. Without it people would just cheese it with temporal mantle and farcasters, and with a longer timer it would make the fight easier, but would take away a lot of the joy of the first kill. Outside of gunners the fight is well balanced to be done in that time window with the top gear at the time of launch by the above average player. It is a fight designed to be difficult, and that’s fun by me.
People usually just say "artificial difficulty" when they mean "this is too difficult for me." All difficulty is artificial. It only becomes a problem when the difficulty is too high for them.
thats a rather unnuanced take akin to "whoever the writers wants to win will win." difficulty can be achieved in an innumerable amount of ways, and some methods definitely bring less to the table than others, or may harm the experience. i've personally played many too many games that just throw an obnoxious amount of enemies at you or just have instakills, and i can attest, you dont need to necessarily be unable to beat an encounter to claim that you don't agree with the creator's implementation of difficulty. artificial difficulty may be mostly a buzzword, but it's the closest term we have for a poor execution of mechanics or gameplay experience that punishes the player in unjust ways or don't test the player in any meaningful fashion.
I think calling all difficulty artificial is uselessly simplifying the term, because then you have to make levels of artificiality. I.e., giving an enemy more health and damage on a higher difficulty with no other changes is a high level of artificiality while giving it a new move set or tweaking its ai would be a lower level of artificiality. This is also the issue with the artificial difficulty argument, being it’s difficult to narrow down what exactly constitutes artificial difficulty and isn’t simply a skill issue, which means pretty much every instance has to be taken on a case by case basis.
Kinda but go look at ninja gaiden yaiba z that game is pure artificial difficulty it doesn't change enemy patterns or introduce new enemies. It makes the game harder by throwing multiple mini bosses at you at once. Or black ops 6 zombies after round 35 the game gets harder because it'll spawn 4+ mangler at you at once. Instead of increasing zombie agression.
@@JZblue9 "difficulty can be achieved in an innumerable amount of ways, and some methods definitely bring less to the table than others, or may harm the experience" Nothing I said contradicts this. Perhaps I could have been more clear in my comment to prevent mistaken extrapolations of my beliefs. "i've personally played many too many games that just throw an obnoxious amount of enemies at you... or just have instakills, and i can attest, you dont need to necessarily be unable to beat an encounter to claim that you don't agree with the creator's implementation of difficulty" Exactly. Having more than one enemy or having enemies do damage isn't inherently bad, it's only when these vectors of difficulty are taken beyond an acceptable point for you that they suddenly become "artificial." I never said you can't disagree with the way difficulty is implemented, I just think the term doesn't mean much on its own. I never mentioned anything about being unable to beat an encounter. "artificial difficulty may be mostly a buzzword, but it's the closest term we have for a poor execution of mechanics or gameplay experience that punishes the player in unjust ways or don't test the player in any meaningful fashion." I don't think it's a very helpful term at all. I think people should just be specific about what exactly they don't like about the difficulty or mechanics of a game, rather than slapping that label on it and saying it's bad.
On the Alatreon video I told you I'd go back to World to take on Alatreon and Fatalis (and AT Velk but she's more of a bonus) I can now happily say I've bested all three on my own, and they are some of my favourite bosses ever. Now it's time to grind another 200 hours to get an atk 4 decoration!
Love all your takes on the series. It took me 4 years to get back into Iceborne to finish Alatreon and Fatalis at the beginning of this year. I had to get past my whining and force myself to farm up to the actual proper gear level of augments and dedicated counter builds and practice for weeks. It definitely took me way more than 8 tries, closer to 50 each. Now I personally really respect and love the monsters and enjoy the hunts... even if I don't like the DPS checks when it comes to Escaton Judgement and Fatalis time limit. I can understand why those mechanics are needed in MMOs.. and while I really, really want Monster Hunter to retain it's co-op nature and that is definitely the absolute most enjoyable way to play.. I want Monster Hunter to also have viability as a solo story experience too, especially for those who don't have the co-op with friends option. Both critique and moderation are definitely needed. Thanks to that, Wilds is shaping up to be the best hunt ever, and that has me hyped.
One thing you didn't mention is that you not only have the Evade Window skill but also the Evade Extender skill (which increases dodge distance). Because, as you mentioned, the size of a lot of Fatalis' attacks feel overtuned it helps you cover enough distance to get out of most of his attacks. Overall Fatalis is a great thematic final fight against the 'strongest monster' and also a good test of skill imo. But he does feel bullshit sometimes.
I used to never use evade extender but I started to in either sunbreak or rise (can't remember, I think it was sb) and I've never looked back. It's actually such a game changer against a lot of bosses
@@mhswoocer I started using it after trying out the Arena quest with Magnamalo on Hammer. Then eventually stopped using extender and just embolden as I got better at timing dodges. Helps a lot in getting used to unfamiliar territory!
I have a love hate relationship with this boss as well. Ive slain him seven times and failed countless more. A lot of this fight for me isnt simply dodging but rather recovery. Hes still an awesome fight, and I respect that he demands you use everything you have at your disposal. Though the thirty minute mark sucks, its there to make sure youre being aggressive rather than timid. Hes not perfect, but no challenge had made me feel greater than conquering the Black Dragon of Legends and Nightmares.
Really nice video literally sums up my problem with fatalis like I wouldn't have minded him having really high damage if the hitboxes were clean like alatreon and that's why I prefer it over him also all of the people online defending his nonsense didn't help as well but at the end of the day these types fight have to happen so that the game improves as long as we don't repeat the same mistakes also I really like how you say get or got better instead of the usual useless git gud that does not help anyone and it's actually an indirect insult to player
Let's consider this scenario: If Base or even Special Investigation Risen Shagaru Magala( had larger hitboxes than shown (e.g., his laser extending 10 feet further), was on a 25-minute time limit, and every attack could one-shot you in his risen state( even with 1000 armor and 250 HP) do you think people would give excuses for him? Maybe a few might, but most likely wouldn't. Fatalis benefits from a significant bias, much like Nergigante in the eyes of fans-it's all about the spectacle. I had a friend who despised the advanced quest of CG Val in base Rise due to the damage and HP, even though that boss has more accurate hitboxes. Yet, this same friend loves Fatalis more and considers it a fairer fight. 18:10 gear checks are particularly punishing for solo players, given the scaling mechanics. This approach works better in games like Warframe, where gear is the primary means of increasing difficulty. 18:24 "Death by a thousand cuts" describes much of World in general. IIXXION made an insightful video detailing the questionable UI decisions. 19:50 Complaints about these issues are valid, as Capcom frequently changes monster moves and strategies from game to game. Ryukishi's video effectively demonstrates the shift in fight philosophy from World to Rise, with a direct side-by-side comparison. It's a shame it's not more popular, as it highlights the progression seen even more clearly from the Wilds demo.
I genuinely love the idea of the time limit because if it takes you more than 30 minutes to kill this thing you have so much room for improvement, and I think there needs to be a line where they say yeah it's taking too long and you need to understand your weapon more if you want to say you beat the final challenge. 30 minutes is a good compromise because there are people beating this in ridiculous times, so they could be harsher, but 99% of people who get hardstuck behind the timer aren't far off from grabbing a narrow victory. The problem to me is the implementation of the time limit. It is so anti climactic to just interrupt the fight, they should have him go into an instant nova even stronger than the others that wipes everything out and ends the quest. It's too immersion breaking the way it is, and leaves a sour taste when you know you would've had him if the game didn't stop you in your tracks. It's so natural to time out on this fight too given that on a new monster you learn to survive before trying to punish everything, especially when you are used to the longer time limits. Probably my only gripe with this boss, and it's one that applies to every other, it just pokes its head out a bit more with Fatalis.
The timer being 30 minutes is a psychological issue, basically the glass half full or half empty way of thinking. Since it is half of max time it is easy for some people to see it as a bad thing, while others can see it as plenty to complete the task. If the timer was set to even 35 minutes then I beleive a vast majority of people would admit that they need to learn the fight more, simply because it is over the half way mark.
This was such an interesting fight for me to take on as I'd known just how far the horror stories went with THIS fight in particular. -Big gigantic wall of text from way too avid recent-experiencer of MH World: To preface: I played effectively 99% of World recently, mostly solo, some with buds, as a "bit". Not entirely taking the gaming experience of it >that< seriously. Why? Long story shortened- Many years ago, I tried out World because I saw a cool dual blades clip that enticed me enough to try the game, went in and immediately didn't like how the controls and the game felt, and thus swore off the game. Years later Rise comes out, I try it hesitantly with a friend, and I finally love the combat flow of Monster Hunter. Then very recently, I try out World in expectation for Wilds, and find out very quickly that all the weapons feel mostly the same. As a "full-circle" challenge for myself, I would play through World before the beta of Wilds. Fast forward and I've beaten many enemies I once thought would be nightmarish given the horror stories from my friends- The low rank Anjanath! Kirin! Rajang! They were mostly just.. alright. Rajang is definitely a lot more punishing in World though, his moves seemed bigger with a lot less time to react. Then near the end- Alatreon. I heard horror stories about this guy's mighty Escaton- the DAMAGE CHECK! .. and I spent 2 days figuring out his fight, his moves- mostly solo. And beat him without even doing any Safi or Kulve raids, just a Frostfang hammer and a funny personally-charged bit. Fast forward to >>now
All righty... you reminded me I didn't beat him because I didn't beat Alatreon... because I never like the DPS builds and focus more on learning to dodge, survive and play the game as an old game hunt and not speedrun. So I need to go back and beat Alatreon now... HOWEVER you reminded me as well about the last Malzeno in Rise and to me that was perfect, if you have the knowledge by previous battles and you can win by skill and knowledge while using the core mechanic of the game it is fine, but sometimes it just isn't, being forced to achieve a DPS mark on a 50min hunt that doesn't matter because you die before if you don't reach the DPS mark is absurd. Also Monster Hunter as well other games sometimes FORCES you to use specific stuff to beat some bosses, there are combos from monsters or situations that can't be avoided by skill, like Vaal Hazak blight and many stuff like that, there is where I think to myself "Is it fine that the game is forcing me to play like this and cutting my freedom?" Being said that... as far as those elements are easy to obtain and implement on your gameplay/build then it is OK for specific situations, but when it is hard to do or you must grind/sacrifice many hours to do that because skill alone and knowledge are not enough then it is really bad design.
I love that you bring up primordial malzeno since I feel like it's the perfect example of capcom responding to the community's complaints about fatalis and alatreon. It's still an incredibly challenging fight not because it has any auto lose mechanics, but instead because it's just fundamentally hard. The monster feels extremely skill heavy and when you lose it really does feel like you have no one to blame but yourself. You didn't lose to a timer or a hydrogen bomb that you failed to defuse, you lost the the boss you're fight, and I really like that
So I have defeated Fatalis multiple times and I agree with you, it is flawed. For me is the cone attack, he does the attack out of nowhere and really can not be read. If He took just a little longer to charge the attack then I could show skill and recognize the incoming danger to avoid it but no, you blink and he is already cooking you. The head mechanic also doesn't feel rewarding enough. It just reduces Fatalis damage so you only lose 100% of you HP instead of 150%... Yes, you are dead anyways. With Alatreon you can get him stuck in the Element that you prefer and also prevent the wipe making you feel rewarded for breaking his horns.
I think the flaws that fatalis had IS what made him my fav boss of all time I remember doing alatreon for the first time and the sheer speed of its attacks had me laughing outloud I just freaking beat raging brachy which was STUPIDLY fast and now THIS IS EVEN FASTER WHAT? but instead of getting mad I was happy, it felt more real that the next big bad is much worse than the last one and then with fatalis it took me 3 months (they were busy months and the 2nd month was a training arc, averaging around 12 to 18 tries a week) of course with the time I spent I had enough mats to craft full fatalis gear basically when I beat him but that didn't make it easy I was struggling hard and in every single try I never felt bad or cheated I was just so happy that this makes alatreon look like a small fry and I have a challenge that could possible last forever (as in I can never beat it solo) which made me happy that I can always have a challenge if I wanted to but of course with time I got better, way better since before fatty I sucked hard and it made me learn the game its EASILY my fav boss fight of all time by a long shot, without these flaws it had I think I wouldn't have enjoyed it as much (but I have to admit I only once failed due to time after soloing him the first time it was always do or die) oh and a side note, if you mash dodge fast enough to superman dive you can not get hit by the cone I survived it a few times because of that
I personally think these sort of fights fatalis, malenia, alatreon and the final boss of the elden ring dlc is fine being overtuned and “bs” because of their status in these games both in lore and as final bosses. We arent fighting insert dragon #19 we are fighting THE BLACK DRAGON FATALIS. same way we arent fighting knight #21, we are fighting the warrior who didnt lose her battles. And imo these fights should feel hard as if they didnt i personally feel they would be underwhelming no matter how bs they feel. For example i am a firm escaton judgement defender as i personally think a black dragon in lore would and should be able to do bs like that. Do i think its fair, no absolutely not, but do i think its fitting and good design that a world ending dragon can in fact world end yeah. And i personally consider fatalis one of 3 peaks of monster hunter behind the final bosses of GU and Sunbreak with my only issue with fatalis being his timer.
I honestly really like this point of view and it definitely helps me a lot in coming to terms with the insane difficulty of a lot of these fights. Like yeah they kill in one hit and have crazy combos and all that, but they're kinda... supposed to? LMAO They're described as legendary figures who literally *haven't lost* so of course they're gonna be insanely hard. It's a nice way of demonstrating their status through gameplay and I don't totally hate it
This is a ridiculous amount of cope, nobody want those bosses to be easy, I think most people want them to be overturned, but that doesn't mean that the boss design can be a load of crap.
@@jakeislavic3024 to each their own but i am genuinely curious what you consider bad boss design as i am heavily biased towards harder bosses as i am a masochist who even enjoys monster hunter frontier.
Monster Hunter is a game of Chang if you can’t defeat a boss in your current armor than you need to upgrade side armor or get new equipment. For me I use specific weapons and effects depending on the boss.
Fatalis and Alatreon are the only Monsters I don't have the patience to solo, however I do find their fights phenomenal. Fatalis especially is extremely epic. Alatreon I got close to solo it, but with all the element switching and 2 horn break limit its a level of stress I'm not looking for in Monster Hunter.
extremoth tho wasnt really built for solo hunts it doesnt scale HP with solo/duo, so you have to basically put out as much DPS solo as 4 hunters. safi'jiiva on release/HR kulve taroth iirc werent scaled as well
@@JerkTheHuman doesn't matter if he's not meant for solo or not his moveset is just bs, and not to mention the damage check he'll just spam his one shot over and over again if you dont meet it even if you already carted and just entered the arena he'll do that immediately so that practically means you already lost despite having more chances left also I'm a ps user and I refuse to give money on that shty subscription so I have to beat everything solo...which I have except for that mofo
man, fatalis and alatreon are the best fights in the game, not only because you actually need to get better and choose an actual build that fits your playstyle (alatreaon exeption since you need to dps check elemental damage) but you are told that those monsters are heralds of the end of times, fatalis woke up and destroyed a whole castle, of course the hitboxes are kinda wacky sometimes, but the music and the lore just makes you feel that you are actually saving the world, both monsters starts the fight confident that they will win, when you "pass the phases" they become afraid and start to act more desperally because they're trying to survive, its a whole experience, of course they're difficult, they should be!
Another Swoocer video on Monster Hunter Bosses another excuse for me to say "but what about the Bowguns?" as if I'm not making a great point that he should've acknowledged in his video
So what you are saying is … it is munster hunter :v If you have got that far in the game (by yourself) then you should have known, the fist half of “git gut” is planing and preparation (having a plan, know the monster), then the second half is execution (don’t make mistakes during the fight). Some of the 1st and 2nd gen mosters have lot of questionable design choices, thou :v
I wonder whether or not people who struggled with time limit also stuggled with breaking Fatalis head just as much? Because I certainly did. And that's why his 3rd phase was a pain in the ass for me. Imo, if you can consistantly break his head in the first two phases, then the time limit shouldn't be a problem at all, you already should have enough DPS at that point to finish in 30 minutes.
It's funny you mention that, in a previous version of this script I actually went more in depth on the head breaks but I ended up cutting it because of how much it varies between weapons. I never had a problem breaking the head with swax but axe mode has tempest axe which just gives you part breaker for free. However (as you probably saw in the video) I struggled a lot with the cones. I spoke to a friend about it who said they really struggled to break the head because they played IG but that the cones were never really a problem since they could... ya know... fly LMAO That's part of what makes discussing specific things like this in MH so challenging, the sheer variety of these games is incredible and I love it.
I want to fight all of the elder dragons in sunbreak(my first monster hunter), maybe soon once I upgrade my laptop and actually need to stop losing to Khezu in high rank, idk if its the monster, my main weapon (bow) or skill issue but I can hold my own against a Rajang(still lost, but it was a question mark on the map so I got curious and woke it up)
lmao all these people being like omg so true man fatalis is my favorite fight ever when op is really saying that its a dumb trash fight that's artificial gimmick bullshit
I think the boss that epitomizes artificial difficulty for me is Demon of Hatred from Sekiro. The Demon’s raw stats are essentially the only thing that makes the fight as difficult as it is. He has twice as much health as every other boss in Sekiro and over half of the moves in his arsenal can kill you in one hit even with max health upgrades. In regards to Monster Hunter, I think Alatreon would have been a much better example to use than Fatalis. Escaton judgement is a perfect example of artificial difficulty since this one move will most likely account for the vast majority of your deaths during the hunt. If Alatreon didn’t have Escaton judgement then his hunt would be many times easier than it is. At least Fatalis has multiple different mechanics in his fight that are difficult to deal with. His nova attack is tough to avoid consistently. His charged fireballs are extremely difficult to dodge. And he punishes you immensely for attacking his head despite the fact that breaking his horns is practically a necessity to complete the hunt without carting. The difficulty of Fatalis isn’t based around a single mechanic or purely his raw stats like the other bosses I mentioned. He is hard for a numerous reasons.
Imo low time limit is the only way Capcom can make Fatalis fight harder than Alatreon. Think about it, if we have normal 50 minutes Fatalis is way easier than Alatreon (minus the big dmg but so does Alatreon) because there is no artificial time limit like Alatreon which is the Escaton (do certain dmg under certain time limit or die).
@@lw9194 even without time limit Fatalis is much harder than Alatreon purely based on him being faster, more damaging and using much more AOE attacks, that also hit like a truck. They give you 5 carts for a reason on your special assignment. Also wiggling his head like a snake, while Alatreon mostly stays in one place, so learning how to hit his head is much harder than Alatreon's and very punishing if you dont hit it. But. I can agree that the time limit feels like artificial difficulty before first kill, for sure, but, on the other hand it pushes you to be more agressive, which really fits for the final fight. On subsequent kills tho time limit never was a problem for me, even when I didnt have any of fatalis gear yet.
@@gorkemucar3312 technically the weapon you can carry is way more liberated than Alatreon. True that raw dmg weapon can defeat Alatreon but that felt like you fought Vaal Hazak without Effluvia resistance or Nightshade Paolumu without sleep resistance, doable but very annoying and more like punishing yourself. What I meant was the time limit on Fatalis was the answer as to how to make the battle way more difficult than Alatreon without make the dmg too big as it is and its hp too bloated as it is. I might be wrong because I also still struggle against Fatalis.
Artificial difficulty doesn't exist. "Real" difficulty only exists as far as someone is willing to let it exist, until a form of difficulty becomes too far removed from their comfort zone or their level of understanding, at which point one will try to justify their inability to beat it with "it's not real difficulty", so they don't have to put in the potential tremendous amount of work and practice to win. Difficulty is difficulty. Keep trying and you can overcome anything a videogame, or even real life throws at you. Maybe you need to think outside the box and apply a different strategy entirely. Maybe you are missing critical fundamental knowledge. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter. If others can beat it but you can't, then you are the problem. And that's fine, just don't be a loser. Go improve and be a winner. Those who beat it had to put in the same effort. Also fun fact this is a skill you can apply to everything in life.
I hate the gaming nomenclature where the second someone suggests a boss might be overtuned in a game they are immediately met with hordes of people just telling them to get gud and they're stupid. It's cancerous and had always annoyed me.
Artificially difficult? No. For bow though? 100% They get one shotted and have to deal with blue flame due to Capcom trying to nerf HBG ranged HZV's It makes it unbearable learning the fight and the gear for it is a necessity due to the slots, its the worst match up in history lmao
There is no artificial difficulty in MH, just skill issues LMAO. I've solo'd Fatalis with every single weapon type multiple times. Best fight in the game.
Honestly, this was perfectly explained. It took me 40 plus carts for me to finally solo Fatalis. And now I can solo it with Defender weapons just because I simply gotten much better than I was 4 years ago.
I'm glad you mention that timeline actually, since originally when I planned to write this script it was going to be *much* more negative lol. However I thought "ya know, it really wouldn't be fair to write this considering I've only beaten the monster 2 or 3 times, and without even haven't proper endgame gear so lemme see what the fight is like if I have full fatalis and weapons augmented a bit" and I'm really glad I did since in doing so not only did I get a much better understanding of the fight, but I also just got a whole lot better at it! It's crazy how much more fun this fight becomes as you improve
10:30 that one shot binder hitting the vigorwasp is the most painful part of the video
oh wow... I just realized *that's* why it didn't bind. That's... that's rough LMAO
Im a massive fatalis fan and I will die on the hill that Fatty is one of the best bossfights ever. However I do agree with some of your points. Some of his hitboxes are janky especially the tail slam, quick bite, and his flame sweep (i get damaged before fire hits me???). I guess its just personal tolerance.
The music, buildup and spectacle along with a tough fight just makes everything else feel fantastic tho, despite the flaws. I really felt like I was fighting the OG Black Dragon, so imo the difficulty felt justified. Its quite fascinating how everyone has such different opinions on the same thing
I think all in all I've grown to like the boss quite a lot. It's not my favorite boss but it holds a very special place in my heart not only for the reasons I went over in the video, but just for the context of it all. Feels really good to finally have this guy crossed off the list of hard bosses I have to beat lol
I remember fighting this boss 4 years ago when I was still new to monster hunter and getting really frustrated at it and eventually quit after 400 hours on that save file. 4 years later after playing all sorts of games, I came back after hearing about Wilds on a new save file but this time,it was different cause now I knew I had to prepare for these sorts of things so when I finally beat it,I screamed. It actually felt like 4 years of experience led up to this and now I absolutely love this boss cause it showed me that I've grown.
Just saw the title & the thumbnail and here's my answer:
Difficulty becomes artificial when the complexity & engagement of the enemy is no longer the force pushing the player to be better, but is rather the very high(sometimes unavoidable) damage along with possibly too much health. This causes the players to beat the enemy via pure war of attrition rather than by purposeful adaptation
Good answer!
If Fatass attacks and hitboxes weren't enough...
This visual excuse for a dragon have these "flinches" if you do exactly 4500 part damage to the head. This works as a separate partbreak hp bar. So there are three in total.
But what's so bad about it? Fatalis can have 1 hp in this "flinch bar", flinch happens. But excess damage don't follow into next bar.
This makes this fight feels extremely inconsistent when fighting with larger weapons because... "Why is he doing his nova now? I didn't do 2 flinches." It's artificially fixed to be this way to make head breaking even worse.
Did I mentioned it's head have fixed 44 hitzone value for guns? Yeah. Weakness Exploit don't trigger on Fatalis head, even softened.
Hitboxes are one thing. Preparing for a hunt are second. But specifically hindering weapons to not perform in certain cases is artificial however you might name it.
And don't get me wrong here. This fight is... Weird.
People may call Alatreon an Artificial garbage with Escaton judgement but it's absolutely possible to do it with Frostfang gear. His hitboxes are clean, telegraphs are clean and visible, breaking horns and disabling one shot isn't that hard. What's really difficult about Alatreon is the amount of moves this beast have and recognizing them in split second decisions. His "slam into knockdown" move stops targeting player around a second before strike itself occurs. There's clear chance for a player to move out of this attack range and counterattack. Not like some "Waterfowl Lady" which dislocate her own skeleton to attack player...
I love the musical progression in this video. As soon as Fatalis introduces itself The Forest and Hills theme starts to play. That might not seem like it makes much sense but this theme is basically the old school Fatalis theme without the choir. Then the actual Fatalis theme kicks in. Specifically the phase 2 version. You would think this is the end of the road but no there is a nother Fatalis theme. One that was also used in the Alatrean video. White Fatalis‘s music having a banger intro really helps elevate what‘s being talked about. Anyway, it‘s Proof of a Hero time, a little earlier than I expected to be honest. It makes sense though since the final phase is currently being discussed. It fits great with where the video‘s at right now but what’s gonna play at the ending now? Well, I’m glad you asked. It‘s a succession of different melodies that make you think of a sunny summer day in Seliana. What melodies? I think you already know.
It‘s Succession of Light.
I think you know this already, but in case you don't, I absolutely love these comments. I put a crazy amount of work into these videos and so to have someone notice the little things like the forest and hills theme being a reference to old school fatalis makes me so happy
Beating iceborne fatalis solo is one of my 2020 quarantine achievement
30 minute cap was the worst part to me. even when I do everything right I just ended up running out of time. 😅
Edit: I posted before I got to the last part of the video, I just realized I haven't attempted fatalis with the complete fatalis armor set because I don't have it yet.
That's the catch 22 though! With full fatalis gear the timer becomes a non issue, but to get full fatalis gear you have to (in theory) beat fatalis without full fatalis gear first. I think if you have fully augmented gear and weapons along with maybe a few lucky decos, the timer probably isn't as much of an issue since I'd imagine maxed out normal gear is somewhere close normal fatalis gear, but I personally didn't have the time nor the will to farm the guiding lands for 60+ hours LMAO
@@mhswoocer dont think you need 60+ hours for full augment on weapons, basically just 3 locales at level 7 and a couple of kills, which doesnt take that long.
Farming decos on the other hand... I've had to kill Teostra over 200 times to get most of necessary decorations, which is still less than 30 hours KEK
you can get the full gear without beating it with plunder blade, there are plenty of videos out there than can help cheese the gear
I don’t think the Fatalis armor helps as much as people think. I have done it with defender gear and other high rank sets, but that comes from mastering the fight. My first real solo kill was done with a fully augmented Teostra, Brachydios set and it took 24 minutes. I did died a lot but that is part of learning the fight. Nowdays I can do the same fight with this set on an average of twelve minutes.
I constantly see people getting to this fight and getting one shotted because as soon as they finished the mains story they do the line of quests that lead to this fight, without having understanding of building, or augmentation of armor and weapons.
I don’t even think that’s the players fault, there is a very sudden change of philosophy in this fight that can be lethal for some players. A lot of people will play the game slow in a very defensive manner, waiting for the biggest openings to deal damage, and the game lets them finish quests in 30/40 minutes without problem. Then they get to alatreon and Fatalis, and if they don’t try to optimize their damage windows they will fail by means of escaton/ time out.
I love both of those fights, Fatalis is my all time favorite boss, I don’t think they are the problem here. The game should have other quests throughout the progression that signalizes better that the player should upgrade their gear, that they should engage more offensively in combat, and that they should counter build for the monster. Before alatreon and Fatalis I think the only two monster I ever counter build for were Val hazzak and nightshade paolumo.
Now, is the timer artificial difficulty? I think it is, but in a good way. Without it people would just cheese it with temporal mantle and farcasters, and with a longer timer it would make the fight easier, but would take away a lot of the joy of the first kill. Outside of gunners the fight is well balanced to be done in that time window with the top gear at the time of launch by the above average player. It is a fight designed to be difficult, and that’s fun by me.
People usually just say "artificial difficulty" when they mean "this is too difficult for me." All difficulty is artificial. It only becomes a problem when the difficulty is too high for them.
I 99% agree, the only really artificial difficulty in games imo is a time limit, like mentioned and gank fights
thats a rather unnuanced take akin to "whoever the writers wants to win will win." difficulty can be achieved in an innumerable amount of ways, and some methods definitely bring less to the table than others, or may harm the experience. i've personally played many too many games that just throw an obnoxious amount of enemies at you or just have instakills, and i can attest, you dont need to necessarily be unable to beat an encounter to claim that you don't agree with the creator's implementation of difficulty. artificial difficulty may be mostly a buzzword, but it's the closest term we have for a poor execution of mechanics or gameplay experience that punishes the player in unjust ways or don't test the player in any meaningful fashion.
I think calling all difficulty artificial is uselessly simplifying the term, because then you have to make levels of artificiality. I.e., giving an enemy more health and damage on a higher difficulty with no other changes is a high level of artificiality while giving it a new move set or tweaking its ai would be a lower level of artificiality. This is also the issue with the artificial difficulty argument, being it’s difficult to narrow down what exactly constitutes artificial difficulty and isn’t simply a skill issue, which means pretty much every instance has to be taken on a case by case basis.
Kinda but go look at ninja gaiden yaiba z that game is pure artificial difficulty it doesn't change enemy patterns or introduce new enemies. It makes the game harder by throwing multiple mini bosses at you at once. Or black ops 6 zombies after round 35 the game gets harder because it'll spawn 4+ mangler at you at once. Instead of increasing zombie agression.
@@JZblue9 "difficulty can be achieved in an innumerable amount of ways, and some methods definitely bring less to the table than others, or may harm the experience"
Nothing I said contradicts this. Perhaps I could have been more clear in my comment to prevent mistaken extrapolations of my beliefs.
"i've personally played many too many games that just throw an obnoxious amount of enemies at you... or just have instakills, and i can attest, you dont need to necessarily be unable to beat an encounter to claim that you don't agree with the creator's implementation of difficulty"
Exactly. Having more than one enemy or having enemies do damage isn't inherently bad, it's only when these vectors of difficulty are taken beyond an acceptable point for you that they suddenly become "artificial." I never said you can't disagree with the way difficulty is implemented, I just think the term doesn't mean much on its own. I never mentioned anything about being unable to beat an encounter.
"artificial difficulty may be mostly a buzzword, but it's the closest term we have for a poor execution of mechanics or gameplay experience that punishes the player in unjust ways or don't test the player in any meaningful fashion."
I don't think it's a very helpful term at all. I think people should just be specific about what exactly they don't like about the difficulty or mechanics of a game, rather than slapping that label on it and saying it's bad.
On the Alatreon video I told you I'd go back to World to take on Alatreon and Fatalis (and AT Velk but she's more of a bonus)
I can now happily say I've bested all three on my own, and they are some of my favourite bosses ever. Now it's time to grind another 200 hours to get an atk 4 decoration!
a lack of skill doesn't imply a poorly designed boss fight, and vice versa too. well said!
Love all your takes on the series. It took me 4 years to get back into Iceborne to finish Alatreon and Fatalis at the beginning of this year. I had to get past my whining and force myself to farm up to the actual proper gear level of augments and dedicated counter builds and practice for weeks. It definitely took me way more than 8 tries, closer to 50 each. Now I personally really respect and love the monsters and enjoy the hunts... even if I don't like the DPS checks when it comes to Escaton Judgement and Fatalis time limit. I can understand why those mechanics are needed in MMOs.. and while I really, really want Monster Hunter to retain it's co-op nature and that is definitely the absolute most enjoyable way to play.. I want Monster Hunter to also have viability as a solo story experience too, especially for those who don't have the co-op with friends option. Both critique and moderation are definitely needed. Thanks to that, Wilds is shaping up to be the best hunt ever, and that has me hyped.
Sees fatalis outline with primordial malzeno switchaxe: so fuckin confused but excited too
One thing you didn't mention is that you not only have the Evade Window skill but also the Evade Extender skill (which increases dodge distance). Because, as you mentioned, the size of a lot of Fatalis' attacks feel overtuned it helps you cover enough distance to get out of most of his attacks.
Overall Fatalis is a great thematic final fight against the 'strongest monster' and also a good test of skill imo. But he does feel bullshit sometimes.
I used to never use evade extender but I started to in either sunbreak or rise (can't remember, I think it was sb) and I've never looked back. It's actually such a game changer against a lot of bosses
@@mhswoocer I started using it after trying out the Arena quest with Magnamalo on Hammer.
Then eventually stopped using extender and just embolden as I got better at timing dodges.
Helps a lot in getting used to unfamiliar territory!
I have a love hate relationship with this boss as well. Ive slain him seven times and failed countless more. A lot of this fight for me isnt simply dodging but rather recovery. Hes still an awesome fight, and I respect that he demands you use everything you have at your disposal. Though the thirty minute mark sucks, its there to make sure youre being aggressive rather than timid. Hes not perfect, but no challenge had made me feel greater than conquering the Black Dragon of Legends and Nightmares.
The classic games felt wayy more honest and straight forward in terms of diffulty.
Really nice video literally sums up my problem with fatalis like I wouldn't have minded him having really high damage if the hitboxes were clean like alatreon and that's why I prefer it over him also all of the people online defending his nonsense didn't help as well but at the end of the day these types fight have to happen so that the game improves as long as we don't repeat the same mistakes
also I really like how you say get or got better instead of the usual useless git gud that does not help anyone and it's actually an indirect insult to player
Let's consider this scenario:
If Base or even Special Investigation Risen Shagaru Magala( had larger hitboxes than shown (e.g., his laser extending 10 feet further), was on a 25-minute time limit, and every attack could one-shot you in his risen state( even with 1000 armor and 250 HP) do you think people would give excuses for him? Maybe a few might, but most likely wouldn't.
Fatalis benefits from a significant bias, much like Nergigante in the eyes of fans-it's all about the spectacle. I had a friend who despised the advanced quest of CG Val in base Rise due to the damage and HP, even though that boss has more accurate hitboxes. Yet, this same friend loves Fatalis more and considers it a fairer fight.
18:10 gear checks are particularly punishing for solo players, given the scaling mechanics. This approach works better in games like Warframe, where gear is the primary means of increasing difficulty.
18:24 "Death by a thousand cuts" describes much of World in general. IIXXION made an insightful video detailing the questionable UI decisions.
19:50 Complaints about these issues are valid, as Capcom frequently changes monster moves and strategies from game to game. Ryukishi's video effectively demonstrates the shift in fight philosophy from World to Rise, with a direct side-by-side comparison. It's a shame it's not more popular, as it highlights the progression seen even more clearly from the Wilds demo.
I genuinely love the idea of the time limit because if it takes you more than 30 minutes to kill this thing you have so much room for improvement, and I think there needs to be a line where they say yeah it's taking too long and you need to understand your weapon more if you want to say you beat the final challenge. 30 minutes is a good compromise because there are people beating this in ridiculous times, so they could be harsher, but 99% of people who get hardstuck behind the timer aren't far off from grabbing a narrow victory.
The problem to me is the implementation of the time limit. It is so anti climactic to just interrupt the fight, they should have him go into an instant nova even stronger than the others that wipes everything out and ends the quest. It's too immersion breaking the way it is, and leaves a sour taste when you know you would've had him if the game didn't stop you in your tracks. It's so natural to time out on this fight too given that on a new monster you learn to survive before trying to punish everything, especially when you are used to the longer time limits. Probably my only gripe with this boss, and it's one that applies to every other, it just pokes its head out a bit more with Fatalis.
The timer being 30 minutes is a psychological issue, basically the glass half full or half empty way of thinking. Since it is half of max time it is easy for some people to see it as a bad thing, while others can see it as plenty to complete the task.
If the timer was set to even 35 minutes then I beleive a vast majority of people would admit that they need to learn the fight more, simply because it is over the half way mark.
when i saw the title i thought this was going tobe about alatreon, what a surprise
This was such an interesting fight for me to take on as I'd known just how far the horror stories went with THIS fight in particular.
-Big gigantic wall of text from way too avid recent-experiencer of MH World:
To preface: I played effectively 99% of World recently, mostly solo, some with buds, as a "bit". Not entirely taking the gaming experience of it >that< seriously. Why? Long story shortened- Many years ago, I tried out World because I saw a cool dual blades clip that enticed me enough to try the game, went in and immediately didn't like how the controls and the game felt, and thus swore off the game. Years later Rise comes out, I try it hesitantly with a friend, and I finally love the combat flow of Monster Hunter. Then very recently, I try out World in expectation for Wilds, and find out very quickly that all the weapons feel mostly the same. As a "full-circle" challenge for myself, I would play through World before the beta of Wilds.
Fast forward and I've beaten many enemies I once thought would be nightmarish given the horror stories from my friends- The low rank Anjanath! Kirin! Rajang! They were mostly just.. alright. Rajang is definitely a lot more punishing in World though, his moves seemed bigger with a lot less time to react.
Then near the end- Alatreon. I heard horror stories about this guy's mighty Escaton- the DAMAGE CHECK!
.. and I spent 2 days figuring out his fight, his moves- mostly solo. And beat him without even doing any Safi or Kulve raids, just a Frostfang hammer and a funny personally-charged bit. Fast forward to >>now
All righty... you reminded me I didn't beat him because I didn't beat Alatreon... because I never like the DPS builds and focus more on learning to dodge, survive and play the game as an old game hunt and not speedrun. So I need to go back and beat Alatreon now... HOWEVER you reminded me as well about the last Malzeno in Rise and to me that was perfect, if you have the knowledge by previous battles and you can win by skill and knowledge while using the core mechanic of the game it is fine, but sometimes it just isn't, being forced to achieve a DPS mark on a 50min hunt that doesn't matter because you die before if you don't reach the DPS mark is absurd.
Also Monster Hunter as well other games sometimes FORCES you to use specific stuff to beat some bosses, there are combos from monsters or situations that can't be avoided by skill, like Vaal Hazak blight and many stuff like that, there is where I think to myself "Is it fine that the game is forcing me to play like this and cutting my freedom?" Being said that... as far as those elements are easy to obtain and implement on your gameplay/build then it is OK for specific situations, but when it is hard to do or you must grind/sacrifice many hours to do that because skill alone and knowledge are not enough then it is really bad design.
I love that you bring up primordial malzeno since I feel like it's the perfect example of capcom responding to the community's complaints about fatalis and alatreon. It's still an incredibly challenging fight not because it has any auto lose mechanics, but instead because it's just fundamentally hard. The monster feels extremely skill heavy and when you lose it really does feel like you have no one to blame but yourself. You didn't lose to a timer or a hydrogen bomb that you failed to defuse, you lost the the boss you're fight, and I really like that
So I have defeated Fatalis multiple times and I agree with you, it is flawed.
For me is the cone attack, he does the attack out of nowhere and really can not be read. If He took just a little longer to charge the attack then I could show skill and recognize the incoming danger to avoid it but no, you blink and he is already cooking you.
The head mechanic also doesn't feel rewarding enough. It just reduces Fatalis damage so you only lose 100% of you HP instead of 150%... Yes, you are dead anyways. With Alatreon you can get him stuck in the Element that you prefer and also prevent the wipe making you feel rewarded for breaking his horns.
I think the flaws that fatalis had IS what made him my fav boss of all time
I remember doing alatreon for the first time and the sheer speed of its attacks had me laughing outloud
I just freaking beat raging brachy which was STUPIDLY fast and now THIS IS EVEN FASTER WHAT? but instead of getting mad I was happy, it felt more real that the next big bad is much worse than the last one
and then with fatalis it took me 3 months (they were busy months and the 2nd month was a training arc, averaging around 12 to 18 tries a week)
of course with the time I spent I had enough mats to craft full fatalis gear basically when I beat him but that didn't make it easy I was struggling hard
and in every single try I never felt bad or cheated I was just so happy that this makes alatreon look like a small fry and I have a challenge that could possible last forever (as in I can never beat it solo) which made me happy that I can always have a challenge if I wanted to
but of course with time I got better, way better since before fatty I sucked hard and it made me learn the game
its EASILY my fav boss fight of all time by a long shot, without these flaws it had I think I wouldn't have enjoyed it as much (but I have to admit I only once failed due to time after soloing him the first time it was always do or die)
oh and a side note, if you mash dodge fast enough to superman dive you can not get hit by the cone I survived it a few times because of that
I personally think these sort of fights fatalis, malenia, alatreon and the final boss of the elden ring dlc is fine being overtuned and “bs” because of their status in these games both in lore and as final bosses.
We arent fighting insert dragon #19 we are fighting THE BLACK DRAGON FATALIS. same way we arent fighting knight #21, we are fighting the warrior who didnt lose her battles. And imo these fights should feel hard as if they didnt i personally feel they would be underwhelming no matter how bs they feel.
For example i am a firm escaton judgement defender as i personally think a black dragon in lore would and should be able to do bs like that. Do i think its fair, no absolutely not, but do i think its fitting and good design that a world ending dragon can in fact world end yeah.
And i personally consider fatalis one of 3 peaks of monster hunter behind the final bosses of GU and Sunbreak with my only issue with fatalis being his timer.
I honestly really like this point of view and it definitely helps me a lot in coming to terms with the insane difficulty of a lot of these fights. Like yeah they kill in one hit and have crazy combos and all that, but they're kinda... supposed to? LMAO They're described as legendary figures who literally *haven't lost* so of course they're gonna be insanely hard. It's a nice way of demonstrating their status through gameplay and I don't totally hate it
This is a ridiculous amount of cope, nobody want those bosses to be easy, I think most people want them to be overturned, but that doesn't mean that the boss design can be a load of crap.
@@jakeislavic3024 to each their own but i am genuinely curious what you consider bad boss design as i am heavily biased towards harder bosses as i am a masochist who even enjoys monster hunter frontier.
Monster Hunter is a game of Chang if you can’t defeat a boss in your current armor than you need to upgrade side armor or get new equipment. For me I use specific weapons and effects depending on the boss.
TBH fatalis is a monster meant to test your skills and augmented endgame gear. It is really hard to win if you don't grind those augmentations. 🤔
You can also avoid the cone by being behind a lance/gunlance user in multiplayer who's blocking it
Fatalis and Alatreon are the only Monsters I don't have the patience to solo, however I do find their fights phenomenal. Fatalis especially is extremely epic. Alatreon I got close to solo it, but with all the element switching and 2 horn break limit its a level of stress I'm not looking for in Monster Hunter.
Unsighted soundtrack!
If you think fatalis have an artificial difficulty then oh boy....try soloing extreme behemoth that mofo ain't artificial he's borderline bs
Facts,day 1 hunters know the real pain of soloing extremoth and ancient Leshen.
extremoth tho wasnt really built for solo hunts
it doesnt scale HP with solo/duo, so you have to basically put out as much DPS solo as 4 hunters.
safi'jiiva on release/HR kulve taroth iirc werent scaled as well
@@JerkTheHuman doesn't matter if he's not meant for solo or not his moveset is just bs, and not to mention the damage check he'll just spam his one shot over and over again if you dont meet it even if you already carted and just entered the arena he'll do that immediately so that practically means you already lost despite having more chances left also I'm a ps user and I refuse to give money on that shty subscription so I have to beat everything solo...which I have except for that mofo
man, fatalis and alatreon are the best fights in the game, not only because you actually need to get better and choose an actual build that fits your playstyle (alatreaon exeption since you need to dps check elemental damage) but you are told that those monsters are heralds of the end of times, fatalis woke up and destroyed a whole castle, of course the hitboxes are kinda wacky sometimes, but the music and the lore just makes you feel that you are actually saving the world, both monsters starts the fight confident that they will win, when you "pass the phases" they become afraid and start to act more desperally because they're trying to survive, its a whole experience, of course they're difficult, they should be!
I only beat this guy once with a friend helping, it was so satisfying but I didn't get the urge to try again 😅
Another Swoocer video on Monster Hunter Bosses another excuse for me to say "but what about the Bowguns?" as if I'm not making a great point that he should've acknowledged in his video
Oh wow this JUST came out?! Lezzgoo!
So what you are saying is … it is munster hunter :v
If you have got that far in the game (by yourself) then you should have known, the fist half of “git gut” is planing and preparation (having a plan, know the monster), then the second half is execution (don’t make mistakes during the fight). Some of the 1st and 2nd gen mosters have lot of questionable design choices, thou :v
To answer the question in the title, as soon as it’s too hard for me to beat within whatever I believe to be a reasonable amount of tries. 😂😂😂😂
fence sitter have the guts to pick a side
Hum, Radanh
I wonder whether or not people who struggled with time limit also stuggled with breaking Fatalis head just as much? Because I certainly did. And that's why his 3rd phase was a pain in the ass for me.
Imo, if you can consistantly break his head in the first two phases, then the time limit shouldn't be a problem at all, you already should have enough DPS at that point to finish in 30 minutes.
It's funny you mention that, in a previous version of this script I actually went more in depth on the head breaks but I ended up cutting it because of how much it varies between weapons. I never had a problem breaking the head with swax but axe mode has tempest axe which just gives you part breaker for free. However (as you probably saw in the video) I struggled a lot with the cones. I spoke to a friend about it who said they really struggled to break the head because they played IG but that the cones were never really a problem since they could... ya know... fly LMAO That's part of what makes discussing specific things like this in MH so challenging, the sheer variety of these games is incredible and I love it.
All difficulty is difficulty, just because something is unfair it does not mean its not difficult, we just need to admit that its too hard.
Wohoooo new video
I want to fight all of the elder dragons in sunbreak(my first monster hunter), maybe soon once I upgrade my laptop and actually need to stop losing to Khezu in high rank, idk if its the monster, my main weapon (bow) or skill issue but I can hold my own against a Rajang(still lost, but it was a question mark on the map so I got curious and woke it up)
I don't really agree, but for the sake of understanding your perspective better. What do you think is the best difficult fight in the MH series?
number go up
lmao all these people being like omg so true man fatalis is my favorite fight ever when op is really saying that its a dumb trash fight that's artificial gimmick bullshit
I think the boss that epitomizes artificial difficulty for me is Demon of Hatred from Sekiro. The Demon’s raw stats are essentially the only thing that makes the fight as difficult as it is. He has twice as much health as every other boss in Sekiro and over half of the moves in his arsenal can kill you in one hit even with max health upgrades.
In regards to Monster Hunter, I think Alatreon would have been a much better example to use than Fatalis. Escaton judgement is a perfect example of artificial difficulty since this one move will most likely account for the vast majority of your deaths during the hunt. If Alatreon didn’t have Escaton judgement then his hunt would be many times easier than it is.
At least Fatalis has multiple different mechanics in his fight that are difficult to deal with. His nova attack is tough to avoid consistently. His charged fireballs are extremely difficult to dodge. And he punishes you immensely for attacking his head despite the fact that breaking his horns is practically a necessity to complete the hunt without carting. The difficulty of Fatalis isn’t based around a single mechanic or purely his raw stats like the other bosses I mentioned. He is hard for a numerous reasons.
Imo low time limit is the only way Capcom can make Fatalis fight harder than Alatreon. Think about it, if we have normal 50 minutes Fatalis is way easier than Alatreon (minus the big dmg but so does Alatreon) because there is no artificial time limit like Alatreon which is the Escaton (do certain dmg under certain time limit or die).
@@lw9194you can use a high raw weapon and kill alatreon while carting to every escaton judgement tho. You can't force it like that on fatalis
@@lw9194 even without time limit Fatalis is much harder than Alatreon purely based on him being faster, more damaging and using much more AOE attacks, that also hit like a truck. They give you 5 carts for a reason on your special assignment. Also wiggling his head like a snake, while Alatreon mostly stays in one place, so learning how to hit his head is much harder than Alatreon's and very punishing if you dont hit it.
But. I can agree that the time limit feels like artificial difficulty before first kill, for sure, but, on the other hand it pushes you to be more agressive, which really fits for the final fight. On subsequent kills tho time limit never was a problem for me, even when I didnt have any of fatalis gear yet.
@@gorkemucar3312 technically the weapon you can carry is way more liberated than Alatreon. True that raw dmg weapon can defeat Alatreon but that felt like you fought Vaal Hazak without Effluvia resistance or Nightshade Paolumu without sleep resistance, doable but very annoying and more like punishing yourself.
What I meant was the time limit on Fatalis was the answer as to how to make the battle way more difficult than Alatreon without make the dmg too big as it is and its hp too bloated as it is. I might be wrong because I also still struggle against Fatalis.
It's funny you mention Alatreon, I made a similar video about him about a month ago already LMAO
Artificial difficulty doesn't exist.
"Real" difficulty only exists as far as someone is willing to let it exist, until a form of difficulty becomes too far removed from their comfort zone or their level of understanding, at which point one will try to justify their inability to beat it with "it's not real difficulty", so they don't have to put in the potential tremendous amount of work and practice to win.
Difficulty is difficulty. Keep trying and you can overcome anything a videogame, or even real life throws at you. Maybe you need to think outside the box and apply a different strategy entirely. Maybe you are missing critical fundamental knowledge. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter.
If others can beat it but you can't, then you are the problem. And that's fine, just don't be a loser. Go improve and be a winner. Those who beat it had to put in the same effort.
Also fun fact this is a skill you can apply to everything in life.
Yup that's my take as well.
Alatreon. Next
Actually if you can believe it, that was my previous iceborne video from about a month ago lol
I hate the gaming nomenclature where the second someone suggests a boss might be overtuned in a game they are immediately met with hordes of people just telling them to get gud and they're stupid. It's cancerous and had always annoyed me.
i have no idea what you're saying
Artificially difficult? No. For bow though? 100% They get one shotted and have to deal with blue flame due to Capcom trying to nerf HBG ranged HZV's
It makes it unbearable learning the fight and the gear for it is a necessity due to the slots, its the worst match up in history lmao
Speedruns say otherwise.
please dont mention texas
yeah this fatty fight was lame sorry not sorry and this is from a die hard mh fan thats been playing since the ps2 days.
There is no artificial difficulty in MH, just skill issues LMAO. I've solo'd Fatalis with every single weapon type multiple times. Best fight in the game.
🤓 Erm Actuwally normal dodge in MHW is 13 fwames 🤓 (but yeah it doesn't feels good to dodge without Evade Window)