What do you mean by brain, mind and consciousness? | J. Krishnamurti
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 พ.ย. 2024
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Brockwood Park 1982 - Question #3 from Question & Answer Meeting #2
'What do you mean by brain, mind and consciousness?'
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Krishnamurti Foundation, Can you please provide subtitles or transcript for this?
3rd Question: Would you please clarify what you mean by brain, mind and consciousness?
(Repeats question)
I am not going to clarify, we will talk over together. First of all we are not professionals, thank god. We are enquiring. Not that professionals don’t enquire, I don’t mean that. We are ordinary laymen, we are enquiring into this very, very complex problem which is, consciousness, the quality of the… what is the… Quality, not the structure, the nature, the cells and all that, but the brain and the mind. Right? (Laughs) Please don’t look at me, look at yourselves.
First of all, consciousness, to be conscious, which is to be aware, which is to be attentive, not negligent, but diligently enquire into the nature of our consciousness. There has been the division as the unconscious and the conscious. The unconscious is all the past, all the inheritance, all the memories of thousands of years of man. Right? Unconsciously you may have the memories of being conditioned in Protestantism, Hindu, all the rest of it, two thousand years of Christianity and propaganda has sewn deeply the fear of heaven and hell, the saviour - you follow? - it is there deeply. And if you go to the Islamic world it is there also, and the Hindu world and so on. So, the unconscious is the movement of the past. We won’t go into too many details because it is a very complex question we are going into. The past is thousand memories, thousand years of pain, struggle, and all the travail of man. The unconscious is the idea that you are British, French and so on. And the conscious, as far as one observes - one may be wrong, one must always be doubting - the conscious is all the recent covering, education, technology - the covering. That is, the conscious mind has often the intimations of the unconscious. Right? You are following all this? And the conscious mind is always, if one is at all aware, is being guided by the unconscious. Following? So there is actually, if one is at all alive, aware, there is no unconscious and the conscious. It is one unitary movement, if one is alive, fully aware. And one is fully aware when there is a crisis, when there is some deep disturbing challenge everything, your whole consciousness comes to action, into action. And our consciousness is everything that thought has put there - right? - our belief, our tradition, our faith, our fears of heaven and hell, our fears of - you know, the whole movement of our life is our consciousness. That consciousness is part of our brain - of course. Without… if I have no brains I have no consciousness. So the brain is part and the necessary movement of consciousness, acting through, or in the brain. Right? Now, the brain - I am not professional, please, I have discussed this point with professionals but they won’t accept what I am… what we are saying, but that doesn’t matter, I may be false, I may be wrong. We are saying, which is the brain is now conditioned - right? - technologically, look how much energy has gone into technology. Our brain is limited, conditioned through vast experience, knowledge - conditioned. But to discover the quality of the brain which is not conditioned and therefore infinite capacity. Look at what the technological people are doing, they are not conditioned, they are enquiring, pushing, driving to find out, and therefore they have got extraordinary capacity - the atom bomb, the things that are… the technicians, the scientists are creating, some of you don’t even know about it, the horrors they are doing.
So, the brain has infinite capacity but it is conditioned now: as British, as French, as all the rest - I believe, I don’t believe, I believe in god, he is my guru, that guru is better than this guru - you follow? - all that nonsense is going on. So, as it is conditioned its capacity is limited, and only when that conditioning is totally free, that means no faith, no fear - you follow? - no attachment of any kind to anything, to past memories, past experiences. And they are that way when they are technologically involved, they are tremendously alive, I have talked to them. They have no time, they brush you off. So is it possible for the brain to be unconditioned? Which means is it possible for the brain to be free of the known? That is, I have to know where I have to go home, which road to take, what language I speak, I have to, there is knowledge, but to be free psychologically, which is the conditioning, which has been conditioned, which the brain has been conditioned, conditioned by knowledge, to be free of that, then it has got extraordinary capacity.
Then we are saying what is the mind? You understand? We talked of consciousness, the brain and the mind. When the brain is completely free of that psychological knowledge then the brain is the mind, because mind is infinite. So to understand all this you have to study yourself, not from books, not from other people, you have to look at your own life, give time, energy, patience, probing. We haven’t time because we are chattering all the time. So mind, brain and consciousness are really one, when there is total freedom of all conditioning.
Shall we go on?
@@KFoundation Thanks for ur work, helps many to understand ...
Thanks alot
J. Krishnamurti - Official Channel thanks
Thank you sir 🙏
“Please don’t look at me, look at yourself.” Jiddu Krishnamurti
😃
@@flixnow3072 ✨
Said 'I may be wrong wrong.' Without blinking an eye.🙏
One thing about consciousness is "It does not necessarily require human brain to manifest itself as creation...
Cat,mice,birds,fishes don't have a human brain but still are no less life than humans on an absolute level.
Thank you to Krishnamurti Foundation...you have saved my life guys....Thank you 😍😍
Brain -Hardware (Mother Board)
Mind - Software
Consciousness- Programme
Software is the result of executing a program.
Is it true for conciousness and mind also?
Consciousness is the electricity without which the Hardware ( Brain) and Software (Mind) cannot operate. Consciousness is the field of everything
Conciousness is to be aware of the program not the program.
Very Nice 😂. I wish it was that simple 😏. There is no analog for consciousness in computers or anywhere.
Thanks for sharing this
Unconsciousness - Beliefs
Mind - Ability to enquire
Consciousness - Enquiring with doubt, is a part of our brain
Consciousness is seen as everything including you and me and exists without everything including you and me just as clay is seen as all pots and exists without them.
NOT EXACTLY BC "CONSCIOUSNESS" IS INTANGIBLE WHILE CLAY IS....WELL , YOU GET THE GIST ?
That's just a analogy.@@lamontyancey9642
well said, consciousness is cosmic nature, possessed by 'the world of creation, pervading the whole universe , only one consciousness, shared , exists within and without , Clay good example , it acts through brain which is materialistic component objective, when brain dies, consciousness still there but not active, it never dies as it is eternal . infinity beyond time and mind cannot be explained only we can feel or realized
Thank you 😀 for the wisdom
Extraordinary!!! 🙏🧡🌻
JK is not for everyone. When the student is ready, the teacher appears.
Thank you 🙏🙏🙏
Words might confuse..
Conditioned: memory,fear,anger etc
Non conditioned: Fresh, no fear etc
That's it!
You are great.....
Brain is like your sensory organs and mind is like senses, and consciousness is like the message sent after sensing by the sensory. Brain receives messages from the sensory and mind processes it and consciousness evaluates as the potential of one’s ability…just like how some can hold more sand in their hands then others.
So does thoughts come from the mind ?
Great ❤
Got the answer thanks jk... 🙏🙏🙏🙏❤
What answer
LOVE HIM AND HIS PHILOSOPHY ❤️❤️❤️
He said nothing philosophical at all. He just said the house is for sale and come and have a look. This house is your own mind/life! That's it. I don't think he was so-called spiritual at all either. He was a lifestyle artist!
Hmmmm isn't the yin and yang sorta like the two wolves at battle within you
Looks like the intent of the question & Jk's response are two different things.
All life that we know of comes from The Earth. This planet is alive and is conscious and so, therefore, are we: each of us a perfect, fractal copy of the original.
Talvez mais do que comparar a consciência com a programação do computador ou com o barro de que sai feitos todos os potes sem neles se esgotar ou deles necessitar... melhor seria lembrar a filosofia vedanta. Nela, o ensinamento de JK de que precisamos esquecer o passado ou não nos apegarmos ao nosso condicionamento, assim mantendo livre e aberta a consciência ao agora infinito; nela encontramos um apoio alternativo ao mesmo que a fala de JK ensina.
Evidentemente não se trata de prioridade de quem antes ou melhor pensou a verdade. Mas na realidade efetiva do mundo é bom dispor, conforme insiste JK,
Totally excellent
Following sir ❤️
After a lifetime of studying the mind and consciousness, I was surprised that this was his answer. I expected more clarity, and I am struggling to see how this response addresses the question. Am I missing something here?
Consciousness, to be conscious is to be aware.
J. K, as usual puts in fuzzy, so here brain is just an organ just like eyes, ears etc., and it's doing it's job, as like any other organ. conscious is generating thought with awareness and unconscious is generation of thought out of your accumulated memory
Fully aware
Tremendous alive
Free from known
Great Sir
Vrey Great....
1. Consciousness is holding the same place in the universe what it holds in my dream.
2. My dream (Including me and others, who were living in my dream) was imagined, seen and known by consciousness, which was independent of my dream.
3. The universe(Including me and others who are living in the universe) is imagined, seen and known by consciousness, which is independent of the universe.
Which book do you read?? Please suggest me a spirituality book to go deep to the consciousness?
Nonsense.
I dont understand and I get the impression that most commenters dont either yet they claim they do
5:20 7:56 11:06
Krishnamurti's abstract, nonlinear way of speaking can be frustrating, especially when it feels like he's avoiding clear answers. He also rejected traditional methods and practices, which could leave some feeling lost, especially when discussing complex topics like the mind and consciousness. It seems like his approach is more about self-inquiry than providing definitive answers, which might explain why some find his responses unsatisfactory. Does anyone else feel this way about Krishnamurti's approach, or am I missing something important?
Words are symbols like numbers. 2+2=4 but four what?
Translation at 10:10 insted of possible it should be impossible and question mark should be removed I think. Pls check may be i am wrong.
Thoughts don’t exist and Consciousness is ever present.
Your identity as thoughts never existed. You were never unconscious (thoughts). You were always consciousness (conscious) tricking yourself into believing you were unconscious.
The organ, its internal processes, and the active use of those processes.
To understand the inner process, as JK suggests, spend time with yourself. Watch how your mind/ brain / consciousness is operating. He suggests this instead of describing the inner process because, the work must be done by you if you are to discover, first hand the truth about reality. He cannot tell you. It's like telling someone a stove is hot. If they have never experienced it first hand, they cannot begin to fathom what the word 'hot' means . . . the truth of it. So you see, there isn't a short-cut. And it isn't for intellectual curiosity or a passing interest. This investigation will only be taken by the most earnest. It is all the difference however, when uncovered. Life is never just the word. Like 'hot' . . . once uncovered, it is the reality of It, which is beyond description.
Lot of rhetoric and nothing practical, Janice. Ideologues with anecdotal evidence for "truth" all around.
Janice Shayne dude thats some dope.. You inspired me lel
Janice Shayne well said. Its very difficult to understand this by every body.
Conscious of inner Bliss 💚🌈☮️🕉
I still don’t get why JK complicates every answer, I am trying to think how hard it was to converse normally with him. He keeps dissecting and going in loops. very unhealthy thought pattern to expose ourselves. (Atleast for someone who is looking to untangle and find peace)
The problem with u and understanding Jk is that u always expect him to give a straight answer to every question being post to him
But if u critical understands him he is not like other scholars, he always want u to find the answers on your own but not from him, that’s why understanding him is difficult for u.I sometimes finds it difficult to get him too hence feeling he make things complicated for me but when I carefully look inside me i find answers to those questions whenever I critical inquire it
so is the brain conditioned by consciousness or does the brain condition consciousness ?
The question yet to be found... i am 50-50 on it... (agnostic view)
Yes you are correct
...???,
..what was....
...(they question) ⁉️
If you say consciousness is our attention then I agree with that is consciousness is attention. Otherwise i say there is no consciousness in humans. I can prove this.
So does thoughts come from the mind ?is the brain conditioned by consciousness or does the brain condition consciousness ?
7:30
His wisdom is confused about consciousness, he did not explain any single complex issue in a simple manner to the audience in his entire lecturing life. RIP.
He is hard to listen to...
Thank Goodness I’m not the only one! I’d go out of my mind listening to any more than this and even this was excruciating!
Hos teachings are not for low IQ people. He had absolute clarity about everything. Its you who is listening with a confused mind
Consciousness is associated with “Thinking” and is independent of “Thinking”.
This thought is understood only by Consciousness.
Incorrect. Consciousness is put together by thought and is in time as well. Both are related. Can thought be aware of itself?
@@suchmooch603 So does thoughts come from the mind ?is the brain conditioned by consciousness or does the brain condition consciousness ?
Ok
Consciousness is conscious of thinking. Consciousness is not thinking.
Like the child is aware of sound, but it has not known that it is sound or it has no name to things the child is aware of through 5 senses...
Let me know how to meet consciousness by abandoning 'I' that is our memory.
like hearing the silence and remenbering the substance of silence
Yes
Being a watcher of your mind without identifying with its content(thoughts and emotions)
Has anyones memory gotten worse with increase in meditation?
Me yesterday i was feeling g like i recently born
@@bernardamckinney357 how does it feels like?
@subash rimal can you explain how you Enquired yourself?
I am not sure if what Jk is saying is true.. I think only the brain exists and all our thoughts, and memory and so on is created by the brain...consciousness also comes from the brain....I am not sure if the brain is infinite or not....
what is infinite is mind and you acess it trough brain the brain mirrors the mind and creates a perception that is thought... all perception is limitless, like for exemple multiple geometric realitys you dont percibe them cause you dont have the right brain but they are in the mind so thought is limiteless when not conditioned by a brain hope that it help at least that's what i thinks is taslking about
sorry for my english not the right brain not the right mind xD
exactly only brain exists these dogmatic beliefs of eastern philosophy are false, thought, mind, concsiousness etc they all are the emergent properties of brain and brain is finite.
@@ruilopes6602 So does thoughts come from the mind ?is the brain conditioned by consciousness or does the brain condition consciousness ?
Lot of words, no clear answer
Why do you need answers from anyone? Why do you need conclusions without paying yourself?
5:22 om nom nom yes yes 'its alive'' like Frankenstein ;p
6:43