This is funny to me cause as beautiful as the back sides of drivers are and the engineering work that manufacturers put in to making them as proficient as possible, we immediately place them in boxes never to be seen again. So this is a glorious answer to such. Art, Beauty and Sound! 😳🔥🔥🔥👍🏽
Great job with those speakers. I loved hearing your nephew talk about his experience with the soundstage😁. I Love speakers with "domed mids" or low crossed over tweeters. just a tip (from a contractor) for other viewers that would like to stick with the cheaper wood. If you go to an actual lumber yard, they have fir and pine that is still inexpensive but is graded where you can more easily find clear wood that still happens to be just construction grade with similar pricing. Local lumber yards choose their wood. HD just buys the most for the least. BTW, while you were knocking on the wood, the boards were still leaning against the others, mitigating, just a tad, the intent. 😁 I guarantee those coats of green helped the final paint job as far as grain fill and priming.
That is a fair point and that was the original plan. However, after trying it out, the tweeter in did not add much in terms of high frequency content, resolution or as some people call it sparkle,. However, it did take away from the sound stage. so what I did was bring up the highs a little bit with the DSP amp and kept everything above 1kHz coming from a single source . That gives an incredible point source like sound stage where in truly feels like things are coming from the center in between the speakers.
That's a midrange, not a tweeter. Which is why your Transfer Magnitude Graph shows a roll-off around 10Kh. Your set-up is beautiful, but would benefit greatly with a dedicated tweeter.
You, sir, are correct in that. They are typically for Mids. That was my original plan to incorporate a tweeter above 10-16kHz, however, after doing some measurements and testing I realized that second Tweeter did not add that much at all and without the second tweeter I get much better sound stage as a point source. I was also able to PEQ just a bit on these drivers to get a little bit higher in the treble while keeping the sound stage as a point source.
@@StasAudio I think these speakers look good. This HiVi dome midrange is a fantastic choice. If you care for some feedback about drivers and about how to use them, you would get a fantastic full package if you would incorporate a tweeter to this setup (just locate it to front baffle, close to the midrange). This HiVi dome midrange is at it's best somewhere around 1kHz to 4kHz. A tweeter could be set to play from 4kHz up. Just a random tweeter from parts express would be Peerless by Tymphany NE19VTS-04. Small face plate (52mm by datasheet) and would maybe fit to Your existing baffle. To do this You would have to design a passive/active filter. But, If You enjoy them like they are now then just ignore this :)
@ I appreciate the feedback. I have not tried the tweeters that you are suggesting and it’s worth a try for the next project for sure. However, I did try another tweeter for 16Hz and up with it and what I found was that this Mid by hivi was able to cover majority of the highs without any DSP. When I added a tweeter with it, I noticed that they added very little that wasn’t already there however the sound stage suffered. The finding was when you only have one treeter that close to your listing position and it goes as low as it does it creates an unbelievable sound stage like a point source. So I decided to just stick with one for this project.
@ thanks, that’s very interesting. I would not mind trying it. I am on the lookout for tweeters that can go pretty low. I found that is the key to creating an incredible sound stage when a tweeter goes pretty low and has a wide coverage.
You’re talking about when I’m knocking on the wood. Yes I am. I’m trying to see which one has the highest frequency. The way to really do it is to put a accelerometer on it and hit it with a little hammer.
Thanks for the video, i got a bin of 6 ceiling speakers (Niles branded) from a house that got flooded in the basement, and they ended up doing a full remodel of the first and second floor as well, which is where the speakers came from, so they still work and ive been meaning to do something like this with them as i rent. The speakers i have also have little switches on them to cut the bass or treble which is neat
Thanks for the build details, lots of good info in here and great production quality. Just recently made an open baffle sub and I'm a believer, the accuracy of the bass is so much better.
@@nsdhanoa I’m definitely gonna build a sub at some point and I think I’m gonna follow something like in this video here: th-cam.com/video/u7udYtP1Bjg/w-d-xo.htmlsi=dnLunCinWoYKlGHJ
Thank you for sharing your knowledge and excellent craftsmanship. Nice design too, put them up for sale, you will sell tons of them! Especially of you have a tweeter, mid and bass all separate.
@@thefamily512 thanks Jack! It’s not out of the question and I think in the future that will be possible. I had to move out of my shop around Covid times, but I am looking for a new wood and finishing shop to move into.
Very interesting work, very nicely executed! I'm an old hi-fi guy so not familiar with your technologies but all kudos to you for this nice looking pair of near-field speakers. My own taste prefers Zak's pair in satin black. They look like a million dollars. I would have been concerned about resonances in the baffles and side pieces being made out of solid wood instead of MDF or birch ply. I know open baffle has quite a following - eg. those from Danny Ritchie at GR Research. I wish you had mentioned your name, like, "Hi, I'm Chris from Stas Audio" because Ixd like to start with Hi Chris or whatever yourr name is. You're a lucky guy having your Dad help you - I would love to do that with my kids. Wishing you all the best, Rob in Switzerland
Hi @@RobWhittlestone I am Stas from Stas Audio :-) you do have a point about residence and perhaps using more uniform material such as MDF of HDF would shift those residence frequencies higher. However, I don’t think it makes that big of a difference and it is much more pleasant to work with real wood in this application. Thanks Rob
Very lovely looking speakers, im curious to know if this setup might lack in the low range/ bass? or maybe in person it carries over a more fuller sound profile.
There is more bass than I know what to do with. These are near field monitors and in my listening position it sounds like this. Listen to this one preferably in headphones. th-cam.com/users/shortsn_qb6NV7GOQ?si=3Fz-kL5WC2hsDhEA
Not at the moment. I do plan on making those in the near future. Currently, you can follow along in the video. It should have everything you need to build a pair just like them. Also feel free to reach out to me for help.
Super video! What a great step by step instructions. I did not know that Zach was so determined about his speakers color! Thank you, Stas! You are the Star audio engineer!❤️❤️❤️
What frequency did you crows to the midrange? My favorite part of open baffle is the open/dipole midrange section. More than the bass, more than the treble. This to me is the magic of open baffle.
@@NakeanWickliff I crossed them over at the 1kHz. My philosophy is to cross them over as low as I possibly can with the Mid/Tweeter able to handle it. To me sound stage is very important. Also, in the second video on this channel, I go in detail about the crossover and everything.
Got my acoustas amp up and running with custom open baffle Ladolce 10 inch coaxial, and SB audience 15OB350. Wow, dude, I’m happy. Wish for more power but this is quite amazing. And I guess I can hook up an external amp for the bass. Never going to use physical crossovers again.
That sounds like a great combination of speakers and amp. Would love to see and hear these speakers. I actually have the same 15 inch. SB audience ready for the next OB build. To get more power for bass you can always use external amp connected through either 2 optical channels or 2 RCA channels. You can also use channels 1-6 and connect them directly to a differential inputs of external amplifier. Just don’t ground those channels(1-6) and turn them down via the app to desired gain.
@ the SB 15OB rolls off hard below 36 hz. Depending on the song it could matter. I’ve got mine set to 50hz to 200hz and using a dedicated subwoofer. I really like tweaking the settings. Midrange 10 inch is 200 to 8000. I wish there was a way to hard set an output for high pass… it’s too easy to make a mistake and hurt a tweeter.
Well, that should sound pretty incredible. I like the crossover points. Are you adding any EQs to the 15s? The suggestion about putting(heard set) some sort of a safety warning for high pass filter I think is a good idea and we will add that into the next or the one after update.
@@StasAudioyes, lowered bump at 160hz. Also depending on how high the crossover is, you have to blend in the midrange with eq. My 10 inch is only 20 watts max so I’m experimenting putting more frequencies to the 15.
Great video. Considering the size of these speakers I assume they would work well in a medium room as stereo speakers too? Anyway, I am only familiar with the traditional crossover DIY and stereo in general. Could you go into more details about the DSP where you clarify how the speakers get enough power from only the DSP, cause I did not see any receiver connected. AND, what connections options it has if I was to run like a CD player or something analogue through it.
@@Rockit66 thank you, for a medium size room I think that would be OK however I would suggest enclosing them if you’re not gonna be at the listening position that I’m at or at least connecting one or two of the wings/stabilizers directly to the baffle. That is to increase the base response when you listening position is further back. What I’m using power and tune is actually a DSP amplifier. It’s my all-in-one Acoustas AC650 DSP Amp. This model does not have an analog in it is all digital, however most CD players do have coaxial out. This way, the signal stays digital throughout the signal chain, including through the DSP all the way up until it is amplified for each driver. This keeps The signal optimized.
The best part of open baffle is the clean bass, but that's only possible with large baffles. You could try to EQ the drop-off on a small baffle but then you will be excursion limited at modest listening volumes
@@ABC-rh7zc I think you have an interesting point and I’m glad to talk about it. In general, you’re absolutely right when you’re talking about bigger open baffle speakers and you’re sitting on the couch away from them and you’re also powering them with a single amplifier with passive crossovers. Here I’m sitting relatively close to them and I am powering each driver with a DSP amplifier. Check out the listening session in the description. I was truly surprised myself.
@@StasAudio Most important thing is that you're enjoying them! Maybe there is sufficient excursion available with those drivers at such a close distance. My comment was intended as a warning to others who might expect to be able to use open baffle speakers of this size to drive a room. It just can't be done.
@ I think you’ve got somewhat of a point there. Usually people have a subwoofer in addition an easy thing to do with these is to just enclose the back with one box and you would get more base than you know what to do with in a normal bedroom or a living room.
@ magnets and electronics don’t go well together. Specifically old school CRTs (which no one uses) but hard drives and other computer components may be affected. If your PC is not near the speakers then it doesn’t matter.
@ that’s interesting I see what you’re saying. It might be an issue with smaller signals like pre-amplified vinyl player lines, maybe but ultimately I don’t think it’s a problem even in the slightest. The signals are much larger in voltage and current. Either way in the actual acoustic sound quality, there’s no audible difference even if I put the speaker wires directly on the magnet.
@ no, other way around. Your electronics would have the issue, not the sound/speakers. Hold a magnet up to a CRT monitor and you’ll see what I mean. Either way you answered my question. Thank you.
@ interesting thoughts. The electronics are thoroughly shielded with an all aluminum case and there’s some additional shielding inside so there’s no problem there.
Great looking speakers, bet they sound great near field! Large drivers do start to "beam" or get narrow in dispersion at higher frequencies, which is why the sweet spot is small. Your dome midrange could probably use a tweeter to help it out in the top octave, it just won't keep up to a good tweeter up there, too much mass, and it too will beam as frequencies increase.
Thanks for the comment and it’s very good point. My original design did have another Twitter in there however I took it out because I was able to increase the extremely high frequencies above 16 kHz with a little bit of PEQ on my DSP amp and still keep the sound stage as a point source from these speakers. In other words, my sound stage is much better now instead of introducing another driver into the mix. What Twitter are you referring to that is better suited?
You certainly have a very good point and a lot of things that you said. I did audition quite a few tweeters to go with this design, however, I could not find anything that would add any serious contribution so I opted in for this design because it offered much better sound stage almost like a point source . Do you have any favorite tweeters that you want to suggest that I try in the next project?
That’s a great question. So when I first started out with this design, I did a 4 inch fiberglass and it was just not enough bass. I would have to enclose it. I did the same thing with the 6 inch driver. It was more bass, but I still wasn’t getting that low extension with out a lot of DSP assistance then I had the company send me their 8 inch driver…And it was like night and day. Now, not only I can hear the base I could feel it because it extended very low and I’m sitting really close. As an example, when I’m playing Ghost Rider it is intense. In a very good way. Besides that I could’ve easily used even the 4 inch epic speakers.
Much obliged for the indepth response. :) Yeah I totally get that, when the gaming component comes into play, more is betterer!! haha I'm thinking about doing a 4" full range driver, maybe those pimped tang band W4-1879. Think your design layout would still work, with the gap in-between the front board and the side pieces with a set-off/gap between the two?
@ oh yeah, not just gaming but also watching concerts and songs by people like Allan Taylor and Chris Jones with that deep base. It sounds absolutely incredible soul piercing . Do you mean the 4 inch tang bang would be the Twitter/Mid? Then still having some bass drivers on top and bottom? If so, I do believe that would work.
@ if you’re gonna be doing this for near field, I think you’re in good shape. If you ever wanna listen to these a little bit further, I would recommend going with at least 8 inch driver for full range to get vocals and acoustic instruments sounding very lively. this is based on my experience and also talking to Sean from Zu Audio that I did in an interview with with him. It’s the very latest video as of right now.
@@StasAudio aha, but what i mean i sthe design of the hardware.... your vid shows some softwrae where you cn odel your seakerr... what is that? does not look like Sketchup
@@StasAudio I have some diy HiVi speakers that use those dome mids, but never built them, I have 2 different DIY HiVi sets actually in mt storage. Time... Ive built plenty of speakers without kits and love doping it. I have used different dome mids and 1500 and up in the past and they were harsh past 10k, but they were aluminum domes from Dayton. I am interested to hear what they sound like now, Maybe Ill try to assemble the kit even if its winter.
@ if you have a DSP you can really bring out the highs even further. You can check out a quick video in my shorts, there’s a sound sample. Also I have a measurements video showing my initial crossover points and DSP settings. These are really good mid/highs definitely give them a listen.
Building OB bass unit, 2x15" SB bianco with ess amt tweeter per side. Crossoverpoint around 1000hz. miniDSP to go active. Total cost €1200 excluding the amp. Those ess AMT tweeters are a steal and would work in a desktop mtm OB as well
@StasAudio you have a good chance getting their first 🤣 want to chain 2 miniDSP to get a three-way and use my acoustat x electrostats from 80 to 15k. All in all I will be busy next year, specially because that left and right will be joined by three pair of quad esl57 to make a nice home Atmos setup. Need a reason for not having to sell any of my precious gear 😎😎 Keep me/us posted if you are going that route, should sound grand. I am going for a bass baffle with the AMT on top, not MTM.
They Look great nice work, will say the alt midbasses suggested are no way intended for open baffle the Qts is way too low, the Daytons will hit Xlim real quick unfortunately there's very slim pickings in the 8" range
@@st170ish you have a very point I did look into that. However, a few power each one separately like I am, it should work out ok with Dayton. I do agree that in the 8 inch range there’s not much.
@@Thomas..Anderson great question Thomas. They absolutely do have a purpose. The main thing is I would like for the base to get canceled out on the sides for two reasons. The most important one is that the base will get canceled out on the sides quite substantially with that the room modes are not as excited however, I still get the focused fast concentrated base at my listening position. Second reason is that my neighbors and my kids go to bed somewhat early and I can listen to a lot of low end at my listening position with the music above 90 dB sometimes well above.
@@StasAudio Hmmm. The sound cancelation 90° of axis is a common feature of dipole radiators. Wider baffle lower the frequency at which cancelation takes effect (and introduces some other problems). Side wings achieve almost the same without widening the front baffle. Almost the same because the radiation pattern starts moving towards cardioid pattern. To large side wings create a quarter wave cavity and cause resonances. So I was wondering about that slots of yours if they do have a purpose in shaping the pattern. And yes, one of the advantages of dipoles id figure eight radiation pattern, for the same SPL at on axis there is less radiated power and less room excitations. Actually a close field dipole monitor is not a bad idea if you have enough room behind speakers. Would love to know more about the dipole EQ and crossover implementation.
@ your input is awesome. I think I should play around with doing one wing on the insides of both speakers and see if that enhances the pattern or maybe brings up frequencies below 90 Hz. Currently, I feel like there’s more than enough base plus I can add more base with PEQ using my DSPamp. I have another bigger project. I’m working on right now where I can experiment with this.
I'm a fan of OB's and I feel its a good effort and if you're happy its awesome, but I dont think small OB's make much sense at least not without a subwoofer, and also it would not be ideal for a studio-ish result and the desk cannot be against a wall due to the rear reflections. Also a dedicated high frequency driver would be really good to have as what you have there is a dome midrange.
@@svtcontour you have some very good points my friend, and I thought about the same exact thing before building these. I’ll tell you this. I have more than enough base that I know what to do with at this point. The issue is decoupling it for my desk. As far as adding a tweeter to these, I’ve also tried that as well, however that takes away from points source sound stage that these produce. I wish you could hear these and I’m sure you would be a believer. These are very different from your standard high sensitivity open baffle speakers.
@@StasAudio Its true, adding a tweeter now would be a bit of an issue nearfield (possibly), but one option would have been something like the Seas midwoofer/tweeter coaxial combo. SB Acoustics also has one. At least it would maintain the point source nature and allow good extension past 10K. Just a thought :)
@svtcontour I truly appreciate it. I have some projects in the pipeline for this channel and I will check those out. If you have specific drivers, you would recommend based on personal experience let me know.
@@StasAudio Sounds great :) Also I've got a pair of DIY OBs as well but mine are really big - so definitely not for desk usage but since 2013 I've been a huge fan of the OBs when I built my first one. This one is version 2.0 LOL
@@StasAudio Very welcome my friend. So i"ve not specifically given the coaxials a try and I've not done any smaller builds in a while. These days I'm going big and use pro audio drivers. My existing OBs are 2x15", 2x10", compression driver/horn in a WMTMW setup but if anything jumps out at me i'll reach out :)
You know to be honest I’m not sure about that. Currently the sound stage is absolutely incredible vertically aligned with the woofers and I’m not sure if moving them off center is actually a good idea. However, I’m not dismissing it fully. I think it does deserve a good AB comparison in the future.
The plans will be available as soon as I get a chance to write it up and put it on the website. Meanwhile, you can follow the video and if you have any questions, feel free to ask.
Honestly if you're going to be making circles like that forget a route or just buy a hole saw it'll be a lot faster with a lot less dust or like you said get a router with a plunge bit but honestly the whole saw is the best fastest way to do it consistently every time All you have to do is find the center point and boom
You are now giving more sound out of the back of your speakers.if you close the back to the sound frequenties will kick back to the opening in the front for the rest good build like it
@@sefauludag3955 yes I would have more base that is for sure. These are near field monitors. I am considering building a version of this speaker with a closed box to compare for a different room. However, there is more base than I need as is at my desk. Have you ever listened to open baffle speakers before?
100%. For the ones that are finished in natural wood I used brass fasteners, but they could be much better if they were hacks or torques. Next project I will improve this.
@@andreicopaci7713 the wood is definitely not dead. It does vibrate, but not a lot. I think of these more or less like an instrument than speakers. Although I do wonder how they would sound if I use more dense wood. Another thing is I’m still looking for better feet right now. I’m using rubber feet and I do get vibration into the table.
@@Shylockza you sir are probably right MDF or HDF is more consistent and will probably result in less distortion. However there’s something beautiful about working with natural woods and you can also pick the wood that is right for you. It’s almost like you’re building an acoustic instrument like a guitar
That is more like a pair of mid range tweeters (reason why you can cut it so low) and four bass-midwoofers (too much rubber) ? You are doing what Bose made with the 901. You get a speaker that on its own does not sound good and try to correct what you have with software (in their case they had an equalizer). The work itself is great. Not very impressed with the speaker choice. Sorry for being honest.
@@beflabbergasted325 I truly appreciate your input. I totally understand why you’re skeptical but these are nothing like Bose 901s by the way those are historic. I do very little PEQ to these or correction. Yes I cross them over with a DSP Amp and yes, I power each driver separately. I bet you would speak very differently if you heard them.
@StasAudio the 901s were just an example to better illustrate my comment. I am sure you made them sound better than they would sound without all those corrections but you failed to understand my point. I designed speakers all my life and made sure the drivers were able to perform as I expected them to before making the speakers. Looking at those, straight away I see drivers with too much extension for a two way system and mid range teeter drivers that will not be able to resent the range and detail I expect from a pair of good speakers. But, sound is very subjective. If, for you, that is what good sound is then kudos for you.
They're very nice good job but the wrong design of speaker for studio quality sound at your desk 💯 Open baffle speakers use the room itself as the enclosure. Therefore, if you have a large room, you’ll need large woofers to achieve full, deep bass. The bigger woofers help move more air in the larger space, which compensates for the lack of a traditional speaker box. The reason I mention this is that, even if you place open baffle speakers close to you at your desk, you won’t get any real bass response. While they may sound good in the mid-bass range, that’s not studio-grade quality. For true studio-quality, flat bass response, you would have been better off building an enclosure. In that room, you’ll also need a subwoofer to achieve a true, flat response in the bass region.
I’m not sure if you actually watched the whole video because you could see my measurements right in there. They go down to about 30 Hz. There’s more than enough base from the speakers if anything sometimes it’s too much. Don’t believe me put on some nice headphones and watch the TH-cam short on this channel. Also everything you said about how open baffle speakers use the room as a box is not accurate. I mean, yes they are within a room, but it’s much better to think of them as they are dipole pattern acoustic sources. If you’re in the recording world sometimes microphones have that pattern. Matter fact, they don’t really excite the room in the same way like pressure wave woofers do so when you’re using them as a near field monitor you actually don’t get the nulls of the room that you would from a conventional subwoofer.
Yes sound demo video would be great. Interesting idea on the slots for desktop speakers.
Here is a quick demo of the bass Insane Desktop Speakers | Open Baffle |
th-cam.com/users/shortsn_qb6NV7GOQ?feature=share
I also have a demo in the description of the video you can download
This is funny to me cause as beautiful as the back sides of drivers are and the engineering work that manufacturers put in to making them as proficient as possible, we immediately place them in boxes never to be seen again. So this is a glorious answer to such. Art, Beauty and Sound! 😳🔥🔥🔥👍🏽
What a great comment. I could not agree more.
Great job with those speakers. I loved hearing your nephew talk about his experience with the soundstage😁. I Love speakers with "domed mids" or low crossed over tweeters.
just a tip (from a contractor) for other viewers that would like to stick with the cheaper wood. If you go to an actual lumber yard, they have fir and pine that is still inexpensive but is graded where you can more easily find clear wood that still happens to be just construction grade with similar pricing. Local lumber yards choose their wood. HD just buys the most for the least.
BTW, while you were knocking on the wood, the boards were still leaning against the others, mitigating, just a tad, the intent. 😁
I guarantee those coats of green helped the final paint job as far as grain fill and priming.
Thanks you for the comment. I think it is very useful and for my next build I’ll definitely go to a local lumberyard.
Thank you. You're absolutely fabulous
Add some tweeters to those speakers and you will get full high quality sound. The big dome driver is actually a midrange
That is a fair point and that was the original plan. However, after trying it out, the tweeter in did not add much in terms of high frequency content, resolution or as some people call it sparkle,. However, it did take away from the sound stage. so what I did was bring up the highs a little bit with the DSP amp and kept everything above 1kHz coming from a single source . That gives an incredible point source like sound stage where in truly feels like things are coming from the center in between the speakers.
That's a midrange, not a tweeter. Which is why your Transfer Magnitude Graph shows a roll-off around 10Kh. Your set-up is beautiful, but would benefit greatly with a dedicated tweeter.
You, sir, are correct in that. They are typically for Mids. That was my original plan to incorporate a tweeter above 10-16kHz, however, after doing some measurements and testing I realized that second Tweeter did not add that much at all and without the second tweeter I get much better sound stage as a point source. I was also able to PEQ just a bit on these drivers to get a little bit higher in the treble while keeping the sound stage as a point source.
@@StasAudio I think these speakers look good. This HiVi dome midrange is a fantastic choice.
If you care for some feedback about drivers and about how to use them, you would get a fantastic full package if you would incorporate a tweeter to this setup (just locate it to front baffle, close to the midrange). This HiVi dome midrange is at it's best somewhere around 1kHz to 4kHz. A tweeter could be set to play from 4kHz up. Just a random tweeter from parts express would be Peerless by Tymphany NE19VTS-04. Small face plate (52mm by datasheet) and would maybe fit to Your existing baffle.
To do this You would have to design a passive/active filter.
But, If You enjoy them like they are now then just ignore this :)
@@StasAudio Arent ribbon tweeters supposed to go very low, making it maybe a possible option as a tweeter for this?
@ I appreciate the feedback. I have not tried the tweeters that you are suggesting and it’s worth a try for the next project for sure. However, I did try another tweeter for 16Hz and up with it and what I found was that this Mid by hivi was able to cover majority of the highs without any DSP. When I added a tweeter with it, I noticed that they added very little that wasn’t already there however the sound stage suffered. The finding was when you only have one treeter that close to your listing position and it goes as low as it does it creates an unbelievable sound stage like a point source. So I decided to just stick with one for this project.
@ thanks, that’s very interesting. I would not mind trying it. I am on the lookout for tweeters that can go pretty low. I found that is the key to creating an incredible sound stage when a tweeter goes pretty low and has a wide coverage.
Checking for the resonance in the wood for sound quality
You’re talking about when I’m knocking on the wood. Yes I am. I’m trying to see which one has the highest frequency. The way to really do it is to put a accelerometer on it and hit it with a little hammer.
Thanks for the video, i got a bin of 6 ceiling speakers (Niles branded) from a house that got flooded in the basement, and they ended up doing a full remodel of the first and second floor as well, which is where the speakers came from, so they still work and ive been meaning to do something like this with them as i rent. The speakers i have also have little switches on them to cut the bass or treble which is neat
That could potentially work. It all depends on the drivers.
Stunning design. Congrats!
Thanks for the build details, lots of good info in here and great production quality. Just recently made an open baffle sub and I'm a believer, the accuracy of the bass is so much better.
@@nsdhanoa I totally agree
Great feedback. Not something I would have considered doing but sounds like a fun experiment
@@nsdhanoa I’m definitely gonna build a sub at some point and I think I’m gonna follow something like in this video here:
th-cam.com/video/u7udYtP1Bjg/w-d-xo.htmlsi=dnLunCinWoYKlGHJ
@@michaelz6870 if you’re talking about building a sub I have not done that yet, but I will after I build the large open baffle speakers coming up.
@StasAudio good gravy, that's quite a setup they have!
Thank you for sharing your knowledge and excellent craftsmanship. Nice design too, put them up for sale, you will sell tons of them! Especially of you have a tweeter, mid and bass all separate.
@@thefamily512 thanks Jack! It’s not out of the question and I think in the future that will be possible. I had to move out of my shop around Covid times, but I am looking for a new wood and finishing shop to move into.
Very interesting work, very nicely executed! I'm an old hi-fi guy so not familiar with your technologies but all kudos to you for this nice looking pair of near-field speakers. My own taste prefers Zak's pair in satin black. They look like a million dollars. I would have been concerned about resonances in the baffles and side pieces being made out of solid wood instead of MDF or birch ply. I know open baffle has quite a following - eg. those from Danny Ritchie at GR Research. I wish you had mentioned your name, like, "Hi, I'm Chris from Stas Audio" because Ixd like to start with Hi Chris or whatever yourr name is.
You're a lucky guy having your Dad help you - I would love to do that with my kids.
Wishing you all the best, Rob in Switzerland
Hi @@RobWhittlestone I am Stas from Stas Audio :-) you do have a point about residence and perhaps using more uniform material such as MDF of HDF would shift those residence frequencies higher. However, I don’t think it makes that big of a difference and it is much more pleasant to work with real wood in this application. Thanks Rob
Very lovely looking speakers, im curious to know if this setup might lack in the low range/ bass? or maybe in person it carries over a more fuller sound profile.
There is more bass than I know what to do with. These are near field monitors and in my listening position it sounds like this. Listen to this one preferably in headphones. th-cam.com/users/shortsn_qb6NV7GOQ?si=3Fz-kL5WC2hsDhEA
Halo has increasingly turned into an audio benchmark over the years 😆
@@SP95 ha ha ha it does have some really good bass rumble.
Do you happen to have detailed plans for this build? I would love to build myself a pair.
Not at the moment. I do plan on making those in the near future. Currently, you can follow along in the video. It should have everything you need to build a pair just like them. Also feel free to reach out to me for help.
Super video! What a great step by step instructions. I did not know that Zach was so determined about his speakers color! Thank you, Stas! You are the Star audio engineer!❤️❤️❤️
What frequency did you crows to the midrange? My favorite part of open baffle is the open/dipole midrange section. More than the bass, more than the treble. This to me is the magic of open baffle.
@@NakeanWickliff I crossed them over at the 1kHz. My philosophy is to cross them over as low as I possibly can with the Mid/Tweeter able to handle it. To me sound stage is very important. Also, in the second video on this channel, I go in detail about the crossover and everything.
Got my acoustas amp up and running with custom open baffle Ladolce 10 inch coaxial, and SB audience 15OB350. Wow, dude, I’m happy. Wish for more power but this is quite amazing. And I guess I can hook up an external amp for the bass. Never going to use physical crossovers again.
That sounds like a great combination of speakers and amp. Would love to see and hear these speakers. I actually have the same 15 inch. SB audience ready for the next OB build.
To get more power for bass you can always use external amp connected through either 2 optical channels or 2 RCA channels. You can also use channels 1-6 and connect them directly to a differential inputs of external amplifier. Just don’t ground those channels(1-6) and turn them down via the app to desired gain.
@ the image is great, but kinda low because they sit on the ground. It’s all about the tone right now though I could build taller ones.
@ the SB 15OB rolls off hard below 36 hz. Depending on the song it could matter. I’ve got mine set to 50hz to 200hz and using a dedicated subwoofer. I really like tweaking the settings. Midrange 10 inch is 200 to 8000.
I wish there was a way to hard set an output for high pass… it’s too easy to make a mistake and hurt a tweeter.
Well, that should sound pretty incredible. I like the crossover points. Are you adding any EQs to the 15s?
The suggestion about putting(heard set) some sort of a safety warning for high pass filter I think is a good idea and we will add that into the next or the one after update.
@@StasAudioyes, lowered bump at 160hz. Also depending on how high the crossover is, you have to blend in the midrange with eq. My 10 inch is only 20 watts max so I’m experimenting putting more frequencies to the 15.
Great video. Considering the size of these speakers I assume they would work well in a medium room as stereo speakers too?
Anyway, I am only familiar with the traditional crossover DIY and stereo in general. Could you go into more details about the DSP where you clarify how the speakers get enough power from only the DSP, cause I did not see any receiver connected. AND, what connections options it has if I was to run like a CD player or something analogue through it.
@@Rockit66 thank you, for a medium size room I think that would be OK however I would suggest enclosing them if you’re not gonna be at the listening position that I’m at or at least connecting one or two of the wings/stabilizers directly to the baffle. That is to increase the base response when you listening position is further back.
What I’m using power and tune is actually a DSP amplifier. It’s my all-in-one Acoustas AC650 DSP Amp. This model does not have an analog in it is all digital, however most CD players do have coaxial out. This way, the signal stays digital throughout the signal chain, including through the DSP all the way up until it is amplified for each driver. This keeps The signal optimized.
The best part of open baffle is the clean bass, but that's only possible with large baffles. You could try to EQ the drop-off on a small baffle but then you will be excursion limited at modest listening volumes
@@ABC-rh7zc I think you have an interesting point and I’m glad to talk about it. In general, you’re absolutely right when you’re talking about bigger open baffle speakers and you’re sitting on the couch away from them and you’re also powering them with a single amplifier with passive crossovers. Here I’m sitting relatively close to them and I am powering each driver with a DSP amplifier. Check out the listening session in the description. I was truly surprised myself.
@@StasAudio Most important thing is that you're enjoying them! Maybe there is sufficient excursion available with those drivers at such a close distance. My comment was intended as a warning to others who might expect to be able to use open baffle speakers of this size to drive a room. It just can't be done.
@ I think you’ve got somewhat of a point there. Usually people have a subwoofer in addition an easy thing to do with these is to just enclose the back with one box and you would get more base than you know what to do with in a normal bedroom or a living room.
Well done! Unlike mine these speakers are relatively small. Maybe I need a bigger screen 🤣
I thought these were the biggest desktop speakers I’ve ever seen or heard, but maybe not.
Any issues with non-shielded woofers being so close to electronics?
@@Augcliffe no definitely not. Maybe I am misunderstanding. What kind of issues are you thinking of?
@ magnets and electronics don’t go well together. Specifically old school CRTs (which no one uses) but hard drives and other computer components may be affected. If your PC is not near the speakers then it doesn’t matter.
@ that’s interesting I see what you’re saying. It might be an issue with smaller signals like pre-amplified vinyl player lines, maybe but ultimately I don’t think it’s a problem even in the slightest. The signals are much larger in voltage and current. Either way in the actual acoustic sound quality, there’s no audible difference even if I put the speaker wires directly on the magnet.
@ no, other way around. Your electronics would have the issue, not the sound/speakers. Hold a magnet up to a CRT monitor and you’ll see what I mean. Either way you answered my question. Thank you.
@ interesting thoughts. The electronics are thoroughly shielded with an all aluminum case and there’s some additional shielding inside so there’s no problem there.
Nice,thanks:)
Great looking speakers, bet they sound great near field! Large drivers do start to "beam" or get narrow in dispersion at higher frequencies, which is why the sweet spot is small. Your dome midrange could probably use a tweeter to help it out in the top octave, it just won't keep up to a good tweeter up there, too much mass, and it too will beam as frequencies increase.
Thanks for the comment and it’s very good point. My original design did have another Twitter in there however I took it out because I was able to increase the extremely high frequencies above 16 kHz with a little bit of PEQ on my DSP amp and still keep the sound stage as a point source from these speakers. In other words, my sound stage is much better now instead of introducing another driver into the mix. What Twitter are you referring to that is better suited?
You certainly have a very good point and a lot of things that you said. I did audition quite a few tweeters to go with this design, however, I could not find anything that would add any serious contribution so I opted in for this design because it offered much better sound stage almost like a point source . Do you have any favorite tweeters that you want to suggest that I try in the next project?
First of all, great vid! 🙏🙏
So why such big drivers? Using 8's do to the open baffle design? 🤔🤔
That’s a great question. So when I first started out with this design, I did a 4 inch fiberglass and it was just not enough bass. I would have to enclose it. I did the same thing with the 6 inch driver. It was more bass, but I still wasn’t getting that low extension with out a lot of DSP assistance then I had the company send me their 8 inch driver…And it was like night and day. Now, not only I can hear the base I could feel it because it extended very low and I’m sitting really close.
As an example, when I’m playing Ghost Rider it is intense. In a very good way. Besides that I could’ve easily used even the 4 inch epic speakers.
Much obliged for the indepth response. :) Yeah I totally get that, when the gaming component comes into play, more is betterer!! haha
I'm thinking about doing a 4" full range driver, maybe those pimped tang band W4-1879. Think your design layout would still work, with the gap in-between the front board and the side pieces with a set-off/gap between the two?
@ oh yeah, not just gaming but also watching concerts and songs by people like Allan Taylor and Chris Jones with that deep base. It sounds absolutely incredible soul piercing .
Do you mean the 4 inch tang bang would be the Twitter/Mid? Then still having some bass drivers on top and bottom? If so, I do believe that would work.
@StasAudio yessir. That speaker is a "full range" driver, 55 to 20,000Hz but I'd be using an existing REL 10" sub I use in my den.
@ if you’re gonna be doing this for near field, I think you’re in good shape. If you ever wanna listen to these a little bit further, I would recommend going with at least 8 inch driver for full range to get vocals and acoustic instruments sounding very lively. this is based on my experience and also talking to Sean from Zu Audio that I did in an interview with with him. It’s the very latest video as of right now.
Nice work!
What app are you using to design the speakers in?
I am using the Acoustas App to do crossovers and PEQ on the DSP amp.
@@StasAudio aha, but what i mean i sthe design of the hardware.... your vid shows some softwrae where you cn odel your seakerr... what is that? does not look like Sketchup
@@iBeaver1973 oh I see what you’re saying that is fusion 360
Interesting way to do it using dome mid-ranges as a mid-tweeter combo on paper and the frequency response is up 800hz to 9khz only
@ it is quite a bit higher. Check out my measurements video that I published right after.
@@StasAudio I have some diy HiVi speakers that use those dome mids, but never built them, I have 2 different DIY HiVi sets actually in mt storage.
Time...
Ive built plenty of speakers without kits and love doping it.
I have used different dome mids and 1500 and up in the past and they were harsh past 10k, but they were aluminum domes from Dayton.
I am interested to hear what they sound like now, Maybe Ill try to assemble the kit even if its winter.
@ if you have a DSP you can really bring out the highs even further. You can check out a quick video in my shorts, there’s a sound sample. Also I have a measurements video showing my initial crossover points and DSP settings. These are really good mid/highs definitely give them a listen.
@@StasAudio I have a cheap Dayton Audio 4x8 DSP that I bought and never used. It was intended for my car
Building OB bass unit, 2x15" SB bianco with ess amt tweeter per side. Crossoverpoint around 1000hz. miniDSP to go active.
Total cost €1200 excluding the amp. Those ess AMT tweeters are a steal and would work in a desktop mtm OB as well
@@annebokma4637 this is kind of wild. I believe you’re reading my mind. I was just researching that for my living room today.
@StasAudio you have a good chance getting their first 🤣 want to chain 2 miniDSP to get a three-way and use my acoustat x electrostats from 80 to 15k. All in all I will be busy next year, specially because that left and right will be joined by three pair of quad esl57 to make a nice home Atmos setup. Need a reason for not having to sell any of my precious gear 😎😎
Keep me/us posted if you are going that route, should sound grand.
I am going for a bass baffle with the AMT on top, not MTM.
They Look great nice work, will say the alt midbasses suggested are no way intended for open baffle the Qts is way too low, the Daytons will hit Xlim real quick unfortunately there's very slim pickings in the 8" range
@@st170ish you have a very point I did look into that. However, a few power each one separately like I am, it should work out ok with Dayton. I do agree that in the 8 inch range there’s not much.
I get it those are dipole speakers, but still I wonder. Do those slotted side skirts have any purpose or are they pure design choice?
@@Thomas..Anderson great question Thomas. They absolutely do have a purpose. The main thing is I would like for the base to get canceled out on the sides for two reasons. The most important one is that the base will get canceled out on the sides quite substantially with that the room modes are not as excited however, I still get the focused fast concentrated base at my listening position. Second reason is that my neighbors and my kids go to bed somewhat early and I can listen to a lot of low end at my listening position with the music above 90 dB sometimes well above.
@@StasAudio Hmmm. The sound cancelation 90° of axis is a common feature of dipole radiators. Wider baffle lower the frequency at which cancelation takes effect (and introduces some other problems). Side wings achieve almost the same without widening the front baffle. Almost the same because the radiation pattern starts moving towards cardioid pattern. To large side wings create a quarter wave cavity and cause resonances. So I was wondering about that slots of yours if they do have a purpose in shaping the pattern.
And yes, one of the advantages of dipoles id figure eight radiation pattern, for the same SPL at on axis there is less radiated power and less room excitations. Actually a close field dipole monitor is not a bad idea if you have enough room behind speakers.
Would love to know more about the dipole EQ and crossover implementation.
@ your input is awesome. I think I should play around with doing one wing on the insides of both speakers and see if that enhances the pattern or maybe brings up frequencies below 90 Hz. Currently, I feel like there’s more than enough base plus I can add more base with PEQ using my DSPamp. I have another bigger project. I’m working on right now where I can experiment with this.
I'm a fan of OB's and I feel its a good effort and if you're happy its awesome, but I dont think small OB's make much sense at least not without a subwoofer, and also it would not be ideal for a studio-ish result and the desk cannot be against a wall due to the rear reflections.
Also a dedicated high frequency driver would be really good to have as what you have there is a dome midrange.
@@svtcontour you have some very good points my friend, and I thought about the same exact thing before building these. I’ll tell you this. I have more than enough base that I know what to do with at this point. The issue is decoupling it for my desk. As far as adding a tweeter to these, I’ve also tried that as well, however that takes away from points source sound stage that these produce. I wish you could hear these and I’m sure you would be a believer. These are very different from your standard high sensitivity open baffle speakers.
@@StasAudio Its true, adding a tweeter now would be a bit of an issue nearfield (possibly), but one option would have been something like the Seas midwoofer/tweeter coaxial combo. SB Acoustics also has one. At least it would maintain the point source nature and allow good extension past 10K. Just a thought :)
@svtcontour I truly appreciate it. I have some projects in the pipeline for this channel and I will check those out. If you have specific drivers, you would recommend based on personal experience let me know.
@@StasAudio Sounds great :) Also I've got a pair of DIY OBs as well but mine are really big - so definitely not for desk usage but since 2013 I've been a huge fan of the OBs when I built my first one. This one is version 2.0 LOL
@@StasAudio Very welcome my friend. So i"ve not specifically given the coaxials a try and I've not done any smaller builds in a while. These days I'm going big and use pro audio drivers. My existing OBs are 2x15", 2x10", compression driver/horn in a WMTMW setup but if anything jumps out at me i'll reach out :)
The tweeter should probably be off centre btw.
You know to be honest I’m not sure about that. Currently the sound stage is absolutely incredible vertically aligned with the woofers and I’m not sure if moving them off center is actually a good idea. However, I’m not dismissing it fully. I think it does deserve a good AB comparison in the future.
funny you watch a dutch recording of whatever band that was :) in the beginning 2 voor 12
I wish someone would sell open baffle enclosures , , some of us are not good at DIY
Why No plans if there that good ?
The plans will be available as soon as I get a chance to write it up and put it on the website. Meanwhile, you can follow the video and if you have any questions, feel free to ask.
Honestly if you're going to be making circles like that forget a route or just buy a hole saw it'll be a lot faster with a lot less dust or like you said get a router with a plunge bit but honestly the whole saw is the best fastest way to do it consistently every time All you have to do is find the center point and boom
Maybe I’m missing something but the bigger speakers are 8 inch in diameter. Also, how do you make them flush with the front baffle?
Jasper or Mobile solutions circle jigs. Nothing better
@@apexpredator_jku thank you very much. I’ll give that a try.
You kept the better looking ones and your nephew got the not so great ones 😂
@@andreicopaci7713 that’s funny because I think so but people have told me that the black ones look better. Also, he chose his own color.
You are now giving more sound out of the back of your speakers.if you close the back to the sound frequenties will kick back to the opening in the front for the rest good build like it
@@sefauludag3955 yes I would have more base that is for sure. These are near field monitors. I am considering building a version of this speaker with a closed box to compare for a different room. However, there is more base than I need as is at my desk. Have you ever listened to open baffle speakers before?
Next time, use something other than standard Phillips screws instead to mount the drivers. Your design deserves that. Makes it look more high end.
100%. For the ones that are finished in natural wood I used brass fasteners, but they could be much better if they were hacks or torques. Next project I will improve this.
Hey! Find a wood supplier in your area. It will prob be equal cost but 2x the quality
How dead the wood sounds...
@@andreicopaci7713 the wood is definitely not dead. It does vibrate, but not a lot. I think of these more or less like an instrument than speakers. Although I do wonder how they would sound if I use more dense wood. Another thing is I’m still looking for better feet right now. I’m using rubber feet and I do get vibration into the table.
MDF is a better product for speakers being acoustically neutral.
@@Shylockza you sir are probably right MDF or HDF is more consistent and will probably result in less distortion. However there’s something beautiful about working with natural woods and you can also pick the wood that is right for you. It’s almost like you’re building an acoustic instrument like a guitar
MDF looks cheap and fragile with the benefits being marginal
That is more like a pair of mid range tweeters (reason why you can cut it so low) and four bass-midwoofers (too much rubber) ? You are doing what Bose made with the 901. You get a speaker that on its own does not sound good and try to correct what you have with software (in their case they had an equalizer).
The work itself is great. Not very impressed with the speaker choice. Sorry for being honest.
@@beflabbergasted325 I truly appreciate your input. I totally understand why you’re skeptical but these are nothing like Bose 901s by the way those are historic. I do very little PEQ to these or correction. Yes I cross them over with a DSP Amp and yes, I power each driver separately. I bet you would speak very differently if you heard them.
@StasAudio the 901s were just an example to better illustrate my comment. I am sure you made them sound better than they would sound without all those corrections but you failed to understand my point. I designed speakers all my life and made sure the drivers were able to perform as I expected them to before making the speakers. Looking at those, straight away I see drivers with too much extension for a two way system and mid range teeter drivers that will not be able to resent the range and detail I expect from a pair of good speakers. But, sound is very subjective. If, for you, that is what good sound is then kudos for you.
They're very nice good job but the wrong design of speaker for studio quality sound at your desk 💯
Open baffle speakers use the room itself as the enclosure. Therefore, if you have a large room, you’ll need large woofers to achieve full, deep bass. The bigger woofers help move more air in the larger space, which compensates for the lack of a traditional speaker box.
The reason I mention this is that, even if you place open baffle speakers close to you at your desk, you won’t get any real bass response. While they may sound good in the mid-bass range, that’s not studio-grade quality. For true studio-quality, flat bass response, you would have been better off building an enclosure. In that room, you’ll also need a subwoofer to achieve a true, flat response in the bass region.
I’m not sure if you actually watched the whole video because you could see my measurements right in there. They go down to about 30 Hz. There’s more than enough base from the speakers if anything sometimes it’s too much. Don’t believe me put on some nice headphones and watch the TH-cam short on this channel.
Also everything you said about how open baffle speakers use the room as a box is not accurate. I mean, yes they are within a room, but it’s much better to think of them as they are dipole pattern acoustic sources. If you’re in the recording world sometimes microphones have that pattern. Matter fact, they don’t really excite the room in the same way like pressure wave woofers do so when you’re using them as a near field monitor you actually don’t get the nulls of the room that you would from a conventional subwoofer.
Wire
Wire…good