@@ronathanjonathan257 the game's lore and other random crap have NOTHING to do with two fucking songs that barely have anything to do with eachother. Matpat actually conceives theories and even if he DOES say random crap that isn't related (which he barely does) he actually makes it entertaining.
"if you squint" lol I was watching a stream of Sonic 06 this past week, heard the soundtrack to Silver's Tropical Jungle stage, and those notes stood out to me immediately.
2:28 Koopa's Road 4:31 Crisis City ~The Flame ~ Skyscraper ~ Whirlwind ~ Tornado~ nah, it's just you imagine what would happen if every song was accused of plagiarism for using 4 similar notes from another melody.
I actually had to check if this was uploaded on April Fools. It's obvious that Nintendo doesn't just *own* a chord progression. Where even is the argument here?
As a music student in high school band, I can CONFIDENTLY SAY that this is a HUGE STRETCH to say that SEGA copied a 4 note chromatic that just so happened to sound “similar” to Mario64. “Not placing blame” my a-double-s.
Pianist of 10 years here. I see where you’re finding the similarities, but there’s some big problems in the analysis. 1) Songs use the same/similar chord progression all the time. Crisis city and loops road happen to share the same progression - you’ll see this occur in pop songs, game songs, etc.. There are even notes/chord progressions so popular, they’re given names (for example, the Royal Road Progression or the Dies Irae melody). This isn’t a good way to determine if a song is stealing from another. 2) Other than this chord progression, the songs appear quite unique from each other. If Crisis City had used the same melody as in Koopa Road, then this would make more sense. However, the songs are unique in their own respective ways. It’s cool to see the similarities between the two songs, but you need to consider more factors before making a conclusion like this. Nonetheless, I hope you continue to make neat musical observations like this and improve your analyses.
Hey, as a musician, I've come here to say that its very likely that its not a "stolen motif" Its a very simple note progression in the minor scale that gives a feeling of anticipation or possible danger. Hell I've used it a few times myself. I'm sure if you really wanted to, you could find it in songs for other games as well. Great video either way
“If you look at the sheet music they’re indistinguishable” crisis city is 3 octaves moving stepwise, koppa road is a sustained 5th in the bass with 4ths moving stepwise on top. There are some similarities but they are not indistinguishable.
It’s a similar movement, but I hate to point out that this motif is used all over the place. It’s literally an ascending minor scale. This is used in rock music as well along with several other video games. It’s also used as the intro riff to His World
It’s a chord progression you’ll hear pretty much anywhere if you pay enough attention. It’s just how music works, chord patterns will be used by any and every musician. Listen to Flying Battery, Inkwell Hell from Cuphead, and James Bond’s theme.
@@ChrisSmith-po3di Yes! I'm not sure what it's called, but that four note chord pattern is common amongst those three, though they're in different keys. Was just pointing that out, there are chord similarities in pretty much any song out there
The note progression is a lot more common than you might think. In fact, the soundtracks for The Matrix movies all have instances of this note progression.
You do realize that chord progressions can sound similar without being stolen, right? These songs are barely similar at all. Even the part with similar chords is a different tempo and instrument. I honestly dont even think this was worthy of a video lmao
If he feels the urge to make a whole video after finding 4 notes that happen to be almost identical in 2 unrelated games then he’d have a stroke if he heard just about any 2 songs from undertale
5:23 _No_ *Crisis City:* C, D, Eb, F *Koopa's Road:* AD, BE, CF, DG with DA throughout in the bass. They're not even the same notes. Also... Crisis city uses single notes with octaves. Koopa's Road uses chordioids + dissonance. These are just partial scales, or stepwise motion. It's very common. You do need to be a music student apparently.
It's just a simple progression that goes up the natural minor scale. The progression may only contain fifths and no major/minor thirds, but it would simply be a i-ii-III-IV progression or something similar.
I don't think Sega would intentionally skirt causing copyright problems, and if Nintendo felt they were being copied, they likely would have already gone after Sega for it.
it's a pretty common "buildup" progression used in a lot of compositions, all pretty unrelated to each other. and in video games in particular i can point out quite a few such as Meltdown 2 from Cave Story, and Cutscene 4 from the PS1 Cyborg Kuro-chan game. It is essentially a composing tool more so than a... melody to be taken from something.
Not to be annoying or anything, but you do realize this is part of the song is quite literally just a directly ascending progression, D-E-F-G, and I guarantee you you can hear this very simple progression in many other songs. Hell, I can even think of Nintendo songs that use that melody, perhaps one of the Castle themes is what I’m thinking. Also, while yes, the main notes may be the same, they still have different, (mind I am not very musically inclined) backing notes for the progression. I’m sure this simple note progression sounded foreboding and the composers liked it. Not to burst your bubble, but seriously. This isn’t a big deal. When my memory decides to kick in, I’ll put some songs with the same progression in the replies section of this comment.
The Mega Man X2 Reploid Factory track uses the same progression, yet again, at the beginning of the song, backing up what I said about being foreboding.
Quite frankly, to say that a shared intro chord progression (which is, to be clear, what this is) constitutes "stealing" is stunning. Haven't you seen Axis of Awesome's "4 Chords" vid? Or listened to electroswing? Don't get me wrong! I love being included in things; I just want to make sure that I'm actually there.
Okay imma stop here at 6:17, this is not unique to Mario & Sonic and happens in countless other pieces of music, it’s more common than you may think, and it happens because as with all things there’s a known ‘formula’ that’s proven to work that just gets remixed over and over. And as for Generations, Crisis City was actually down to a popularity fan poll, the stage just so happened to get the most votes, so SEGA & Sonic Team just went with that when deciding on what Stages to include, it was really a great time to be a Sonic Fan around that time.
Well, in music, there's one thing called chord progressions, and a lot of songs use the exact same chord proggression. If the main melody was similar i could consider this an option, but the only clear similarity between these two songs are the chord progression you mentioned, because if you listen to crisis city, you'll notice the melody completely changes after a while, and doesn't sound similar to koopa road anymore. also a curiosity that no one cares about: they're not in the same key, koopa's road is in D minor, while crisis city is in C minor lol.
5:09 apparently i did have to be a music student to tell you that those are NOT the same. they are similar in the point that the chords are moving to the next degree each bar, but crisis city is only octaves of the notes, while koopa road maintains the same notes on the bass and tenor voices (the lower ones) during the whole 4 bars while it’s the alto and soprano voices (the higher ones) that are moving, and even then they are making perfect 4th intervals (or descending 5ths), not octaves.
It is literally just a really common leitmotif. I bet there are a lot of songs that has the same progression heck actually I'm learning to play trumpet I believe I played a song that had a similar part to that.
1) You can't copyright a chord progression. 2) These aren't even the same chord progression. By this logic. Take On Me by Aha and Don't Stop Believing by Journey are the same song.
As someone who’s a musician, I can tell you that this is a very basic start for many songs. Just 4 whole ascending notes. You said those notes are basically the same when it’s just the progression that’s the same. Crisis city’s chords are 3 c’s in a different octive while Koopa road uses a more dynamic progression. They both do their job at setting up the song. I’ve played many video games and performed many songs, you hear songs that have a very similar feel to it or even the same progression. For example, the American in Paris Suite has a progression that’s very similar to certain Star Wars songs yet it isn’t stealing. Stealing is just simply copying a peice of music for a part of a big part of song. Not to get confused with sampling or plagiarism where the line gets blurry.
Remember, when any article title contains a question, the answer is usually "No". So it is here. Silly argument, clickbait title. That's a "no" from me.
5:11 they are not the same, the chord progression is the same but the notes aren't exactly the same It's in the same key and the root notes are the same but the chords are different and the tone is different
Funny thing about songwriters, many draw inspiration from a competitive source. Like how Pokemon Black and White had Celestial Tower/Dragonspiral Tower/Giant Chasm theme sounding very similar to Chrono Trigger's Secret of the Forest.
as someone who knows an ok amount about theory, it's a common chord progression. definitely a coincidence. not in a rude way, but i dont think you need to know any theory to figure that out either
It’s literally a scale, you can barely call it a motif. (A scale is like (A,B,C,E,F,G) You can find many songs of today using a scale chord progression let alone pieces from orchestral pieces way way way older than these background music. If Nintendo were to try to sue Sega for it, it wouldn’t work because it’s literally a scale. Also according to the photo in your video, Crisis City is written in Bb major and koopa road in C major. Notice how many people are commenting that they’re similar to other songs? It’s scale
Well made video but even starting to consider the idea that someone working on Crisis City copied it from Mario 64 is pretty ridiculous, lots of songs share the same progression
One thing you need to understand about music is that there is a finite amount of chord progressions out there (at least on the 12-temperament system). Things are bound to be repeated. Although the parts are similar, one can't say they're copies. The chord progression works very well in both songs, and adds the impact they need. This chord progression specifically is used a TON by a LOT of people making intense songs. Now I am not saying all of this as criticism, but rather for you to learn something new. I bet that if you look in other big games, movies, etc. You'll find that very exact progression.
It's such a simple chord progression, in a different key, different style... I'm sure there is other music out there with similar things (Mega Man 1, Wily Stage 2). It really doesn't sound like copying at all. I've heard many similar bits in lots of different music. You want something that was copied? Hear "A Searing Struggle" from Ys III, and "Forgotten Path" from Jim Power.
a song having the same chord progression isn't enough to make it a copy of the same song besides both of these songs are absolute bangers and crisis city is definitely the better of the two in my opinion
They simply share the same chord progression, another example of this would be the “Peaches” song from the Mario movie using the same chord progression in Never Gonna Give You Up by Rick Astley. However its also just generally a popular chord progression, so it doesn’t make sense to compare it specifically to the most popular song that used it.
for anybody who agrees with him. this is not a copy of anything, it is a similar chord progression. In this case it's purpose is to build tension as in both cases the player is in a dangerous place. In Bowser Stages in SM64, the player has to overcome countless obstacles in order to find Bowser. In Crisis City, the first section the player is skateboarding on metal at high speeds while buildings collapse, things explode, other things burst into flames, and various enemies try to kill the player all without the ability to stop. Without the chord progression or even the music at all, both game's mentioned stages would still be hard but without the psychological aspect of tension the music provided which in turn can increase the difficulty.
Well, considering that most pop song are using the same chords / chord progression, and are still not considered copies of the others, I think we can let this slip
The similarity of the two melody lines is incidental, as it is a straightforward progression of walking up the first four notes of the minor scale. Something as simple and fundamental as stepwise motion up the minor scale, is not something you can claim as musical IP, nor is it plagarism if another composition features it. This video was frustrating to watch because the thesis is unconvincing, and is itself is only about 15 seconds of content, but the video is padded with everyone-knows filler statements like "Company X made Game Y which had Very Great music such as example Z." in order to stall on delivering on the thesis. Whether this deceptive presentation format is common in youtube videos nowadays, is irrelevant in regard to the fact that I experienced it as a misleading misuse of my time.
Crisis City is the better song honestly. Koopa’s Road is cool too but it doesn’t hit the same. If we’re going to call the music “stolen” as supposed to just “similar”, you forget Mario 64 likely “stole” its main melody from Doom’s song Suspense from the level Phobos Lab. Also, The Legend of Zelda on FDS “stole” its overworld theme from Ultima 4: Quest of the Avatar’s town or castle theme. (Original DOS version)
Sorry no. Koopas road is better. crisis city repeats the same thing every 20 seconds. However koopas road repeats about every minute. Basically crisis city gets anoying
@@pikminfan7044 Wrong. Crisis City doesn’t actually repeat that much at all. You’re probably thinking of the classic version in Generations. Koopa’s Road sucks compared to Crisis City and so does your incorrect opinion.
bruh, I'm sorry but even in the sheet music you are stretching it, they are not the same. this is like saying Moonknight is a copy of Batman, or PS4 Spiderman ripped off Batman arkam series, or The Good Dinosaur and The Croods. I'm sorry cus of course you put work into this and I wanna commend/acknowledge artistic/creative work(which I consider YT videos being a form of it), but it's a bad take, you proved you _do_ need to be a music student(or have some level of music knowledge) before calling another's artwork something as serious as a 'rip-off', you could argue if you squint they are similar on a surface level, but so does a lot of art (and no, the notes are not the same, the sheet proves that exact opposite of what you claim ), the details matter, and the take is made even worse by the 5 minutes of padding, plus the fact you double down on 6:00 actively saying It IS stolen(wether it be intentional or not by Sega), which also comes off all sorts of wrong/arrogant. I felt like this was almost a prank/April fools when I looked at the musical sheet. But, to leave on a more generous note- they carry a similar chord progression(not exact tho), if you try to hear 'Koopa Road' in it, you can, but this is so common on music(look up video game chord progressions or musical 'Mode' by 8-bit music theory), you could probably find many more instances of this just between Mario and sonic soundtracks using the same criteria of "similar enough you can hear this in it". point is- you're not wrong in the observation, but definitely on the judgement.
Thanks for the feedback! I'm sorry you felt I came off as arrogant. I definitely didn't want to seem that way. Thanks for the long comment! In hindsight, I agree that using the words "copy paste" did make it seem like I was accusing Sega of something they definitely didn't do. I understand what you mean when you say its just a chord progression, and I get it: that's not an uncommon thing. What caught my attention was just how long that progression was repeated for. If you do a little transposing, you'll find it actually is the same four notes held for the same duration. I appreciate the feedback, but in my defence I wouldn't say that it is "so common on music" as you said. I made this video with the intent of pointing out an observation, not accusing someone of stealing, and I'm sorry my video made it seem contrary to that. Again, thanks for the comment!
@@lemoncakestudios3031 the duration isn’t anything special though. They’re all just whole notes, the most common approach for a chord progression. If they had different durations that both versions shared then you could make an argument
So I’m no musician, heck I’m pretty sure I’m tone deaf. Lol but here’s the thing with music, it’s just a combination of notes coming from different instruments. There’s only so many combinations that can be made, and millions of songs in existence. There’s bound to be similarities and nearly identical “copies”. It’s like the Phineas&Ferb quote, “If I had a nickel for every time this happened, I’d have 2 nickels, which isn’t a lot. It’s just weird that it happened twice.” It’s not the first time this has happened. Famous musicians “copy” each other all the time.
@@axl256gamesx7 While i agree to some degree, A Motif is very much symbolic to a single work, If you were to here the overworld theme from smb1 in a modern pop song, You would associate it with Mario. Motifs are a powerful tool and when they are used correctly It gives it identity, In addition, In the video They actively ignore the fact the the chord progression is actively different, It may just seem like one note But this purely ignores any other musical context, Like the obvious fact that this is a chord progression, Or that it isnt even remotely the same timing, OR THE FACT THAT THE SONGS ARE IN DIFFERENT KEYS.
Wow, 4 NOTES! basically, if you go by the logic that having the 4 same notes is stealing, almost every single piece of music ever made in unoriginal. A lot of the time, notes arent the defining traits of a song , but the instruments, tempo, ect. So yeah, this isnt "stealing" by any means.
Well thats a strange comment because it dosent mean that you copy nintendo you just like mario types games but you rather to have WAY WAY TOO MUCH THINGS HAPPENIG AT ONCE (i know you can get used to it)
5:08 "You don't have to be a music student to see those look virtually identical" Similar? Yes. Identical? No. There's a complete different key sig lol
Sorry but this was a waste of time. It's whole step, whole step, half step all ascending. And it's all evenly spaced timing. I hate that I live in a world where people think something like that deserves copyright protection. Also "if you look just at the sheet music" (5:20), they are distinguishable. The Sonic bit is entirely parallel motion and the Mario bit is a mixture of parallel and oblique motion. It's even more distinguishable if you look at more than four bars from each song. Moving on...
Cord progression don’t really matter in a big way especially if they’re simple. This was both a waste of time and was definitely reaching too hard only to not get much
Song Similarity :
2:28 - Koopa Road
4:31 - Crisis City
Hey is the power puff girl intro song
Thank you for saving me time. This is such a non video
nah its not the smae
I KNOW I THOUGTH OF IT TOO
eh, they kinda sound the same, but I wouldn’t say that it’s a copy and paste
tldr: these two songs share ONE chord progession
That's it, I saved you six minutes of your life
Underrated comment speaking the truth.
Reminds me of how I should stop procrastinating to save more time in my life, thanks
Exsactly
Thank you. I figured this video was bullshit.
I've straight up never seen someone make so many mistakes in explaining music while not even actually explaining the music
Dude went through the whole mario and sonic lore to show us two songs
Isn’t that what Matpat does?
@@EpicNika but matpat does it right and to tell something
@@EpicNika you right, if someone else does it then it can’t be wrong
@@ronathanjonathan257 the game's lore and other random crap have NOTHING to do with two fucking songs that barely have anything to do with eachother.
Matpat actually conceives theories and even if he DOES say random crap that isn't related (which he barely does) he actually makes it entertaining.
But you watched it didn't you?
I'm no musician, but calling these songs identical because they both have a section with 4 notes linearly escalating upwards is extremely farfetched
it's TH-cam, they gotta pull content outta their ass
@@supersaga24-f3k it's TH-cam, there's at least 2 channels dedicated to music theory, and then this guy just spouting bs.
TH-camrs were never good
@@Cade_Squirrel what about pewdiepie
@@Cade_SquirrelHey!
Imma just say this: nobody owns a chord progression.
This kinda thing happens all the time in pop music.
“First, we’re gonna need a little history”
Why?
Five fucking minutes of padding just to get to "Koopa Road sounds kind of like Crisis City if you squint".
jesus no need to hate so much
@@xr_366 this video is entirely pointless and the actual “meat” is like 50 seconds
"if you squint" lol I was watching a stream of Sonic 06 this past week, heard the soundtrack to Silver's Tropical Jungle stage, and those notes stood out to me immediately.
@@TeeTop_ Care to explain?
This entire video is the definition of "He's a little confused, but he's got the spirit"
2:28 Koopa's Road
4:31 Crisis City ~The Flame ~ Skyscraper ~ Whirlwind ~ Tornado~
nah, it's just you
imagine what would happen if every song was accused of plagiarism for using 4 similar notes from another melody.
I actually had to check if this was uploaded on April Fools. It's obvious that Nintendo doesn't just *own* a chord progression. Where even is the argument here?
It’s almost like there are thousands of other songs with the same progression
he's disabled dislikes he probably knows
@@commanderdemonno9819 dislikes are disabled for every TH-cam video now though.
@@commanderdemonno9819He disabled dislikes 90% of people don’t even have the plugin to see dislikes anyway lmao 💀
@@CS-om3kj oh that's why
This video is like trying to reach the minimum word count in an essay.
As a music student in high school band, I can CONFIDENTLY SAY that this is a HUGE STRETCH to say that SEGA copied a 4 note chromatic that just so happened to sound “similar” to Mario64. “Not placing blame” my a-double-s.
"aas"
@@lordsuinax3470 … double-s makes two a’s?
@@MaricCraft wwwwwhoops. Yeah, guess I'm the aas, my bad
@@lordsuinax3470 lol
Pianist of 10 years here. I see where you’re finding the similarities, but there’s some big problems in the analysis.
1) Songs use the same/similar chord progression all the time. Crisis city and loops road happen to share the same progression - you’ll see this occur in pop songs, game songs, etc.. There are even notes/chord progressions so popular, they’re given names (for example, the Royal Road Progression or the Dies Irae melody). This isn’t a good way to determine if a song is stealing from another.
2) Other than this chord progression, the songs appear quite unique from each other. If Crisis City had used the same melody as in Koopa Road, then this would make more sense. However, the songs are unique in their own respective ways.
It’s cool to see the similarities between the two songs, but you need to consider more factors before making a conclusion like this. Nonetheless, I hope you continue to make neat musical observations like this and improve your analyses.
A 6 minute video on how ONE song happens to sound similar is crazy
7ish minutes
@@sayanston1634no is not
Hey, as a musician, I've come here to say that its very likely that its not a "stolen motif"
Its a very simple note progression in the minor scale that gives a feeling of anticipation or possible danger. Hell I've used it a few times myself. I'm sure if you really wanted to, you could find it in songs for other games as well.
Great video either way
Even I could see that
I never studied music
@Liam Cremers I fit more on the "class clown" role, but ok
Yeah the chords are rising under the bass pedal point
The rainbow road themes do this but in major keys
That's called a chord progression. You can't steal one.
This man ☝️: “Well, according to my calculations…”
@@popcornUNNERFED ☝️🤓
@@BeegChaosControls 👆🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓🤓
@@DemoniTed Well, Actually what happened 🤓🤓🤓🤓☝️☝️☝️☝️☝️☝️☝️
@@big_goop191well actually ☝️🤓
This dude just discovered chord progression
ikr
As a person with functioning ears, the songs are 100% NOT the same.
Bro knew how awful this was and thus disabled the like button
EDIT: And put comments on newest first by default to avoid showing good comments
ikr, bro might as well hide the video to save face.
@@horpuscorpus8299 lmaoo
“If you look at the sheet music they’re indistinguishable” crisis city is 3 octaves moving stepwise, koppa road is a sustained 5th in the bass with 4ths moving stepwise on top. There are some similarities but they are not indistinguishable.
It’s a similar movement, but I hate to point out that this motif is used all over the place. It’s literally an ascending minor scale. This is used in rock music as well along with several other video games. It’s also used as the intro riff to His World
It’s a chord progression you’ll hear pretty much anywhere if you pay enough attention. It’s just how music works, chord patterns will be used by any and every musician. Listen to Flying Battery, Inkwell Hell from Cuphead, and James Bond’s theme.
Actually Inkwell Hell and Flying Battery zone sounds similar, but have different notes. Same with James Bond's theme. Same pattern, different notes
@@ChrisSmith-po3di Yes! I'm not sure what it's called, but that four note chord pattern is common amongst those three, though they're in different keys. Was just pointing that out, there are chord similarities in pretty much any song out there
@@AethoriousMC Right? They are all incredibly similar
The note progression is a lot more common than you might think. In fact, the soundtracks for The Matrix movies all have instances of this note progression.
as a musician, the songs are 100% NOT the same.
Why do you have to be a musician to recognize that they’re not the same lmao
Apparently you need a PhD in Human Biology to define what a woman is so...
As a musician I know that I make music
Yea, there's an uncountable amount of songs that use the same chord progression, it's bound that that would happen with two popular game franchises
:0
4:31 the part you're actually here for instead of 4 minutes of filler and the answer is no, they didn't steal it, it's just a coincidence
Thank you Mark's Goldfish for saving 4.5 minutes of my life
Thx, sure is a lot of filler. I am skeptical of the conclusion that "it was a coincidence", we just do not know.
This video took nearly 5 minutes to get to the point and it was embarrassingly a stretch
It's just a I, II, III, IV scale with whole notes. Crisis City is in Cm and Koopa Road is in Dm.
It’s called a
*Chord progression*
That’s kinda how music works
Five notes going up 😱 what a very unique and unheard of thing to do
not even five notes
omg 😨😨😨😨😨😨😨😨😨😨❗❗❓❓
You can't steal a chord progression, otherwise all of jazz would be theft
"oh my goodness gracious 4 notes going up in pitch every bar in another song!!!! obviously stolen!!!!!!!!"
Dude… seriously…
@@bunayogaming_q2841 i know right bro it's almost like i'm being sarcastic isn't that insane
As a non musician I can confirm, Nintendo did not invent rising notes in that scale. They just share that scale, dude. Your def overthinking it.
Actually you don't need to be a music student to know they're not the same thing 😂😂😂
He said the some notes were the same not that THE WHOLE NOTES WERE THE SAME
@@malcolmali915true
@@malcolmali915 alright well uhh
1. im having a stroke trying to read this
2. he said they had the exact same 5-note progression (yes, he said 5-note)
@malcolmali915 actually none of those notes are the same
The content is located at 2:16 - 2:50 and 4:28 - 5:24.
Yeah, that's my bad. I should've thrown in a time stamp.
You do realize that chord progressions can sound similar without being stolen, right? These songs are barely similar at all. Even the part with similar chords is a different tempo and instrument. I honestly dont even think this was worthy of a video lmao
Yeah I second this comment. This video was really just reaching... Ehhhhhhhh 🤷🏻♂️
This video explains the same situation in a different context th-cam.com/video/Tpi4d3YM79Q/w-d-xo.html
@@ChunterInfoNah without looking I know u lying
@Roroprin
He said that in the vidio
If using the same chord progression is stealing, then every artist in the history of artists are stealing. Also it's not a motif.
If he feels the urge to make a whole video after finding 4 notes that happen to be almost identical in 2 unrelated games then he’d have a stroke if he heard just about any 2 songs from undertale
"WTH HOW UNORIGINAL CAN THIS GUY GET, OMG HE DID THE SAME WITH THE FOLLOW-UP GAME BRUH"
5:23
_No_
*Crisis City:* C, D, Eb, F
*Koopa's Road:* AD, BE, CF, DG with DA throughout in the bass.
They're not even the same notes. Also...
Crisis city uses single notes with octaves.
Koopa's Road uses chordioids + dissonance.
These are just partial scales, or stepwise motion. It's very common.
You do need to be a music student apparently.
I was just about to make a comment about this, but you hit the nail on the head!
It's just a simple progression that goes up the natural minor scale.
The progression may only contain fifths and no major/minor thirds, but it would simply be a i-ii-III-IV progression or something similar.
Bro thought he discovered something special 💀
imma just say, sega didnt really steal, you cant steal a chord/note progression, but i like the video anyway, i never noticed the connection lol
If people got copyrighted for using a non original chord progression 99% of composers would be criminals
There have been a LOT of lawsuits these last few years of artists suing and being sued for their generic chord progressions and melodies.
@@SupraViperhead yeah but like 99% of them were proven innocent
@@SupraViperhead but who
the most awful comparison ive seen yet
funnier part is how he got comment bots. ive spotted multiple.
I don't think Sega would intentionally skirt causing copyright problems, and if Nintendo felt they were being copied, they likely would have already gone after Sega for it.
it's a pretty common "buildup" progression used in a lot of compositions, all pretty unrelated to each other. and in video games in particular i can point out quite a few such as Meltdown 2 from Cave Story, and Cutscene 4 from the PS1 Cyborg Kuro-chan game. It is essentially a composing tool more so than a... melody to be taken from something.
Not to be annoying or anything, but you do realize this is part of the song is quite literally just a directly ascending progression, D-E-F-G, and I guarantee you you can hear this very simple progression in many other songs. Hell, I can even think of Nintendo songs that use that melody, perhaps one of the Castle themes is what I’m thinking. Also, while yes, the main notes may be the same, they still have different, (mind I am not very musically inclined) backing notes for the progression. I’m sure this simple note progression sounded foreboding and the composers liked it. Not to burst your bubble, but seriously. This isn’t a big deal. When my memory decides to kick in, I’ll put some songs with the same progression in the replies section of this comment.
The Mega Man X2 Reploid Factory track uses the same progression, yet again, at the beginning of the song, backing up what I said about being foreboding.
Bro it’s just the same chord progression, pop music does the same exact thing.
Quite frankly, to say that a shared intro chord progression (which is, to be clear, what this is) constitutes "stealing" is stunning. Haven't you seen Axis of Awesome's "4 Chords" vid? Or listened to electroswing?
Don't get me wrong! I love being included in things; I just want to make sure that I'm actually there.
Okay imma stop here at 6:17, this is not unique to Mario & Sonic and happens in countless other pieces of music, it’s more common than you may think, and it happens because as with all things there’s a known ‘formula’ that’s proven to work that just gets remixed over and over.
And as for Generations, Crisis City was actually down to a popularity fan poll, the stage just so happened to get the most votes, so SEGA & Sonic Team just went with that when deciding on what Stages to include, it was really a great time to be a Sonic Fan around that time.
Man does not know chord progressions exist
Well, in music, there's one thing called chord progressions, and a lot of songs use the exact same chord proggression. If the main melody was similar i could consider this an option, but the only clear similarity between these two songs are the chord progression you mentioned, because if you listen to crisis city, you'll notice the melody completely changes after a while, and doesn't sound similar to koopa road anymore.
also a curiosity that no one cares about: they're not in the same key, koopa's road is in D minor, while crisis city is in C minor lol.
5:09 apparently i did have to be a music student to tell you that those are NOT the same. they are similar in the point that the chords are moving to the next degree each bar, but crisis city is only octaves of the notes, while koopa road maintains the same notes on the bass and tenor voices (the lower ones) during the whole 4 bars while it’s the alto and soprano voices (the higher ones) that are moving, and even then they are making perfect 4th intervals (or descending 5ths), not octaves.
True they are Not the same
It is literally just a really common leitmotif. I bet there are a lot of songs that has the same progression heck actually I'm learning to play trumpet I believe I played a song that had a similar part to that.
1) You can't copyright a chord progression.
2) These aren't even the same chord progression.
By this logic. Take On Me by Aha and Don't Stop Believing by Journey are the same song.
As someone who’s a musician, I can tell you that this is a very basic start for many songs. Just 4 whole ascending notes. You said those notes are basically the same when it’s just the progression that’s the same. Crisis city’s chords are 3 c’s in a different octive while Koopa road uses a more dynamic progression. They both do their job at setting up the song. I’ve played many video games and performed many songs, you hear songs that have a very similar feel to it or even the same progression. For example, the American in Paris Suite has a progression that’s very similar to certain Star Wars songs yet it isn’t stealing. Stealing is just simply copying a peice of music for a part of a big part of song. Not to get confused with sampling or plagiarism where the line gets blurry.
no, they don't look identical at all, it's just a common chord progresion LOL
Remember, when any article title contains a question, the answer is usually "No". So it is here. Silly argument, clickbait title. That's a "no" from me.
5:11 they are not the same, the chord progression is the same but the notes aren't exactly the same
It's in the same key and the root notes are the same but the chords are different and the tone is different
That's what I noticed
Funny thing about songwriters, many draw inspiration from a competitive source.
Like how Pokemon Black and White had Celestial Tower/Dragonspiral Tower/Giant Chasm theme sounding very similar to Chrono Trigger's Secret of the Forest.
as someone who knows an ok amount about theory, it's a common chord progression. definitely a coincidence. not in a rude way, but i dont think you need to know any theory to figure that out either
5:09 yeah, it’s a chord progression.
i absolutely love the fact that literally half of the video is just him rambling.
It’s literally a scale, you can barely call it a motif. (A scale is like (A,B,C,E,F,G) You can find many songs of today using a scale chord progression let alone pieces from orchestral pieces way way way older than these background music. If Nintendo were to try to sue Sega for it, it wouldn’t work because it’s literally a scale. Also according to the photo in your video, Crisis City is written in Bb major and koopa road in C major.
Notice how many people are commenting that they’re similar to other songs? It’s scale
Hmm... I feel like Crisis City is written in Eb, but I could be wrong. Lol
@@chandlerpaulk4518 It was based on the photo, should have specified
Well made video but even starting to consider the idea that someone working on Crisis City copied it from Mario 64 is pretty ridiculous, lots of songs share the same progression
As wise musician Will Wood once said "the nature of song writing is that there are only 12 fuckin' notes!"
One thing you need to understand about music is that there is a finite amount of chord progressions out there (at least on the 12-temperament system). Things are bound to be repeated. Although the parts are similar, one can't say they're copies. The chord progression works very well in both songs, and adds the impact they need. This chord progression specifically is used a TON by a LOT of people making intense songs.
Now I am not saying all of this as criticism, but rather for you to learn something new. I bet that if you look in other big games, movies, etc. You'll find that very exact progression.
It's such a simple chord progression, in a different key, different style... I'm sure there is other music out there with similar things (Mega Man 1, Wily Stage 2). It really doesn't sound like copying at all. I've heard many similar bits in lots of different music. You want something that was copied? Hear "A Searing Struggle" from Ys III, and "Forgotten Path" from Jim Power.
I hate how badly the Sonic games and other properties are treated when people put so much into these. Like the music and animation
Well, not all Sonic games
this video literally made no sense and had no reason to be made lmao
This guy feels like a half-baked, Dollar store version of Game Theory
Michael Jordan 1996 Space Jam type reaching on this one
a song having the same chord progression isn't enough to make it a copy of the same song
besides both of these songs are absolute bangers and crisis city is definitely the better of the two in my opinion
They simply share the same chord progression, another example of this would be the “Peaches” song from the Mario movie using the same chord progression in Never Gonna Give You Up by Rick Astley. However its also just generally a popular chord progression, so it doesn’t make sense to compare it specifically to the most popular song that used it.
Now I just want Jack Black bowser to sing a rickroll
@@aidenvera5920 real
@@Zinkle_ 🙂
Yfw you hear a normal chord progression:
Did Lemonkake Studios STEAL the name from Lemoncak3?
How the tables have turned
for anybody who agrees with him.
this is not a copy of anything, it is a similar chord progression.
In this case it's purpose is to build tension as in both cases the player is in a dangerous place. In Bowser Stages in SM64, the player has to overcome countless obstacles in order to find Bowser. In Crisis City, the first section the player is skateboarding on metal at high speeds while buildings collapse, things explode, other things burst into flames, and various enemies try to kill the player all without the ability to stop. Without the chord progression or even the music at all, both game's mentioned stages would still be hard but without the psychological aspect of tension the music provided which in turn can increase the difficulty.
Well, considering that most pop song are using the same chords / chord progression, and are still not considered copies of the others, I think we can let this slip
just to clarify, CHORD PROGRESSIONS ARE NOT INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY, JESUS CHRIST
ok
Seriously, any legitimate musician or composer would slap this man in the face if he came up to them trying to convince them this is plagiarism
Nintendo doesnt own chord progressions bro
The similarity of the two melody lines is incidental, as it is a straightforward progression of walking up the first four notes of the minor scale. Something as simple and fundamental as stepwise motion up the minor scale, is not something you can claim as musical IP, nor is it plagarism if another composition features it.
This video was frustrating to watch because the thesis is unconvincing, and is itself is only about 15 seconds of content, but the video is padded with everyone-knows filler statements like "Company X made Game Y which had Very Great music such as example Z." in order to stall on delivering on the thesis. Whether this deceptive presentation format is common in youtube videos nowadays, is irrelevant in regard to the fact that I experienced it as a misleading misuse of my time.
I wan't expecting Sonic music guy himself to crossover in the comment section XD!
Perhaps you could break down Koopa Road some day, please...
The man himself
one of the biggest wastes of time ever
@@MortonMcCastle still probably the first time I ended a video asking “that’s it?” in like a year
Sonic Team chose the levels in Generations due to polls they made for the fans to choose their favorite levels from each game btw
Crisis City is the better song honestly. Koopa’s Road is cool too but it doesn’t hit the same. If we’re going to call the music “stolen” as supposed to just “similar”, you forget Mario 64 likely “stole” its main melody from Doom’s song Suspense from the level Phobos Lab.
Also, The Legend of Zelda on FDS “stole” its overworld theme from Ultima 4: Quest of the Avatar’s town or castle theme. (Original DOS version)
Sorry no. Koopas road is better. crisis city repeats the same thing every 20 seconds. However koopas road repeats about every minute. Basically crisis city gets anoying
@@pikminfan7044 Wrong. Crisis City doesn’t actually repeat that much at all. You’re probably thinking of the classic version in Generations. Koopa’s Road sucks compared to Crisis City and so does your incorrect opinion.
"getting to the point of the video" challenge (impossible)
Dude it's FOUR NOTES THAT ARE IN A VERY BASIC PATTERN
bruh, I'm sorry but even in the sheet music you are stretching it, they are not the same. this is like saying Moonknight is a copy of Batman, or PS4 Spiderman ripped off Batman arkam series, or The Good Dinosaur and The Croods.
I'm sorry cus of course you put work into this and I wanna commend/acknowledge artistic/creative work(which I consider YT videos being a form of it), but it's a bad take, you proved you _do_ need to be a music student(or have some level of music knowledge) before calling another's artwork something as serious as a 'rip-off', you could argue if you squint they are similar on a surface level, but so does a lot of art (and no, the notes are not the same, the sheet proves that exact opposite of what you claim ), the details matter, and the take is made even worse by the 5 minutes of padding, plus the fact you double down on 6:00 actively saying It IS stolen(wether it be intentional or not by Sega), which also comes off all sorts of wrong/arrogant. I felt like this was almost a prank/April fools when I looked at the musical sheet.
But, to leave on a more generous note- they carry a similar chord progression(not exact tho), if you try to hear 'Koopa Road' in it, you can, but this is so common on music(look up video game chord progressions or musical 'Mode' by 8-bit music theory), you could probably find many more instances of this just between Mario and sonic soundtracks using the same criteria of "similar enough you can hear this in it". point is- you're not wrong in the observation, but definitely on the judgement.
Thanks for the feedback! I'm sorry you felt I came off as arrogant. I definitely didn't want to seem that way. Thanks for the long comment! In hindsight, I agree that using the words "copy paste" did make it seem like I was accusing Sega of something they definitely didn't do. I understand what you mean when you say its just a chord progression, and I get it: that's not an uncommon thing. What caught my attention was just how long that progression was repeated for. If you do a little transposing, you'll find it actually is the same four notes held for the same duration. I appreciate the feedback, but in my defence I wouldn't say that it is "so common on music" as you said. I made this video with the intent of pointing out an observation, not accusing someone of stealing, and I'm sorry my video made it seem contrary to that. Again, thanks for the comment!
@@lemoncakestudios3031 the duration isn’t anything special though. They’re all just whole notes, the most common approach for a chord progression. If they had different durations that both versions shared then you could make an argument
So I’m no musician, heck I’m pretty sure I’m tone deaf. Lol but here’s the thing with music, it’s just a combination of notes coming from different instruments. There’s only so many combinations that can be made, and millions of songs in existence. There’s bound to be similarities and nearly identical “copies”. It’s like the Phineas&Ferb quote, “If I had a nickel for every time this happened, I’d have 2 nickels, which isn’t a lot. It’s just weird that it happened twice.” It’s not the first time this has happened. Famous musicians “copy” each other all the time.
it's just a simple walk up the minor scale. 1-2-b3-4
Dude
Is just a 5 note progression
Those things are everywhere
I expected similar leitmotifs or something
But this was kinda dissapointing
And anyways
Motifs don't "belong" to anyone
This is merely a coincidence
@@axl256gamesx7 While i agree to some degree, A Motif is very much symbolic to a single work, If you were to here the overworld theme from smb1 in a modern pop song, You would associate it with Mario.
Motifs are a powerful tool and when they are used correctly It gives it identity,
In addition, In the video They actively ignore the fact the the chord progression is actively different, It may just seem like one note
But this purely ignores any other musical context, Like the obvious fact that this is a chord progression, Or that it isnt even remotely the same timing, OR THE FACT THAT THE SONGS ARE IN DIFFERENT KEYS.
@@MelakiraMusic right, forgot bout that, my bad
Its just the same chord progression that doesnt even use the same exact notes. Most songs share chord progressions thats not copying.
Wow, 4 NOTES! basically, if you go by the logic that having the 4 same notes is stealing, almost every single piece of music ever made in unoriginal. A lot of the time, notes arent the defining traits of a song , but the instruments, tempo, ect. So yeah, this isnt "stealing" by any means.
I like Sonic Better than Mario... there, I said it. Are you going to say I copy nintendo too??? Lol
Well thats a strange comment because it dosent mean that you copy nintendo you just like mario types games but you rather to have WAY WAY TOO MUCH THINGS HAPPENIG AT ONCE (i know you can get used to it)
5:08 "You don't have to be a music student to see those look virtually identical"
Similar? Yes. Identical? No.
There's a complete different key sig lol
the best part of the video was when you made marge simpson out of clay, the rest felt like filler
e
Real
bro it's just a simple chord progression
thank u for being real, this vid makes me feel smart
fr
Sorry but this was a waste of time. It's whole step, whole step, half step all ascending. And it's all evenly spaced timing. I hate that I live in a world where people think something like that deserves copyright protection. Also "if you look just at the sheet music" (5:20), they are distinguishable. The Sonic bit is entirely parallel motion and the Mario bit is a mixture of parallel and oblique motion. It's even more distinguishable if you look at more than four bars from each song. Moving on...
I wont get back 6mins of my life
@@Jangos64 It's okay. Dude's just testing the waters. Honestly his production is good, he just flopped on the subject.
@@leigel3 The subject being the most important part of a video.
I mean, it's a simple 4 chord rise. It's more shocking to not find MORE things like this.
Cord progression don’t really matter in a big way especially if they’re simple. This was both a waste of time and was definitely reaching too hard only to not get much