Don't hate on Neos CAUSE HE SHININ…
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 ก.พ. 2022
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Let's all pay respects to Air Neos who will probably never get reprinted again.
F
And Neo Spacian support
Well, Air Neos has never been reprinted. He has one print in strike of neos. XD
Can’t they just errata it’s name to Wind Neos or some shit?
@@RhyperiorRanger i think it's cause air neos' design is too close to another character (I don't remember who) and Konami got a lawsuit because of it
3 Stages of a Real Neos:
Struggle - Grind - Shine
Lmfao The disrespect shown to Neos, but then the praise for Neos. It's giving me whiplash. XD
I mean he's not wrong,
Vanilla Neos is trash,
But it's a necessary part of the deck
Weird that yuma only got 1 card we could have used a new zw monster that does piercing damage
@@BramLastname every Vanilla, by and large, are all gar-BAJH but they all have their unique means to an end. The first of which being the first ever time we see an effect that could win the duel with 4 seemingly useless pieces of an anatomy with the head serving as the “effect” (Dr Evil air quotation marks mp3.).
@@DavidAKJohnson world chalice is the only deck I can think where the vanilla monsters have great value to bring out stronger monsters.
you call that disrespect ? on a card released in 2006 ? excuse me it didnt have 10 negates with a floating effect and an azathot effect on summon =)
Spirit of Neos not changing its name to Neos is very sad
"Jaden help, I'm trying to fight the Light of Destruction but I'm dummy thicc and the clap of my ass cheeks keeps alerting Sartorius."
Wait what?
@@hellkaiser1366 Neos has a dumptruck ass
I understood that reference cowboy
😄
Hahaha funny as hell
"Dont hate on Neos cause He Shinin'" the best damn Quote in this Video Glad you cover the Neos/E-Hero Support
This looks like some fun stuff.
I thought for a moment that it said "Poly-spell" on the new Neos.
Which would have been cool, because searching super poly in a Hero deck would be
busted
Not yet, not yet
Never thought I'd see the day when Neos of all things got support that works around, and even encourages, the drawbacks that his contact fusions have.
have you not seen all the legacy support dm & destiny heros get? o.o Armed dragons got support in Lightning overdrive & Neos in Cybernetic Horizon.
why wouldn't they get more support o.o it's one of Jaden's core archetype.
Look at Gustos if you want something obscure for support 😹
Ever heard of volcanics?
@@blackfiresproutU misunderstood what they said lol
E HERO Spirit of Neos should had been treated as E HERO Neos while on the field.
However I do love Neos support; wondering if they are coming to Master Duel.
Probably not for now tbh, but hopefully that won't be the case for too long 😅
Eventually, of course
I think the reason he’s not “Elemental HERO Alternative Neos” is because Konami wants you to have him on hand as a searcher and not cheese with connector
@@Keurgui1 like I get that, but it would be so sick If we could just draw into connecter, summon the spirit neos, shearch one of the new cards and just start going off from there 😌
not for half a year, since thats how far back master duel is right now
Why not let Spirirt of Neos also be "Elemental Hero Neos" in the hand, field, or graveyard?
Same reason Konami still wants you to use the OG Dark Magaician and Dark Magician Girl. Too iconic
@@ChaddyFantome *Looks over at Blue Eyes White Dragon*
@@ChaddyFantome yeah, they dont want people to completely remove them from their decks. Same reason BE Alt still needs og blue eys
Honest Neos should've also been treated as the original.
@@kawaki4441 thatd make no sense
As a GX stan, these cards plus Wake Up Your E Hero, Evolution Result Burst (ITS THE BEST MOMENT AND THEY KNEW IT AAAAAAAAAAAAAH) and Duel Academy have got me so damned hype! Maybe now we'll finally get Neos Kluger...
we allready have 2 of them wtf
Wait, we don't have wiseman yet? I thought that was leaked like a billion years ago
@@REvoLverj98 Kluger and Wiseman aren't the same card. Wiseman is old and kind of shit main deck monster, Kluger is a currently unimported Fusion from Legendary Gold Box.
@@AztecCroc Wiseman is literally the translation of Kluger. Klug means smart in German, so Kluger means smart man, or a wise man
@@REvoLverj98 but they are not the same card. Both have different effects and one was released on TCG and the another one not.
Glad to have more Neos support. He's my favorite hero!
My favourite’s wingman glad they combined them
@@Deathmare235 nice. Hail to the OG heroes. Friggin Clayman, Sparkman and burstinatrix gotta have a spotlight at some point soon hopefully!
They can't make good support for the life of them
@@raystrife234 they need a fusion with the five
@@asseroya if they refrain them and knowing Konami its a 50/50
Nice thing about Engage is that it lets you pitch shadow mist which nets you another hero. Also I think Spirit of Neos can search Neos fusion so that’s nice I think. It always interesting to see Neos get support.
Fun Fact: the Effect of Spirit to Special Summon itself is a reference to the Bonds Beyond Time movie when Stardust attacked Jaden
Nice reference
Isnt it a reference to the many times jaden summoned neos with a hero emerges?
It's a reference to Jaden summoning Neos' duel spirit to protect himself in general. The BBY is the best example of it though
Actually it was rainbow dragon, but yeah, super cool f***ing reference
Plus, its effect to not be destroyed by battle the turn its special summoned is also a reference to Neos barely surviving Stardust Dragon's Shooting Sonic/Cosmic Flare attack
Now that the Flame Wingman line has been noticed by Konami, my hope for an Evil HERO version of Shining Flare Wingman is renewed
And then we get a Evil HERO Neos and then a Shining Neo Wingman version to complete the circle.
@@Keyblade-Knight we’d still need Shining Neo Phoenix Enforcer
@@Keyblade-Knight Maybe get some relevant main deck evil heroes too. Malicious Bane is solid, but there's not enough Evil Heroes, good or not, to run him outside a general HERO deck playing one Adusted Gold and one Dark Calling.
@@NightWing1800 There at least 7 missing one. Plus it weird to me that Tempest and Blade Edge never got fusions
@@badd7407 Bladeedge got the Wildheart Fusion and I think that was it.
This fusion is awesome for a few reasons, but my favorite is that it implies we can get more fusions using "Wingman" cards or other E HERO fusions. Opens a weird world of possibilities with that pseudo-archetypal wording.
Hey who knows, we may even get an "advanced" wingman fusion featuring each of the original e heros! well except for a Sparkman fusion of course, They kinda already made two different versions for him 😅
Flame Neos Wingman 😏
Well if we get that we are going to need retrains for the og elemental heroes
@@abdullahamr9941 God I wish they would do that, them and the og neo spacians do jack shiz for the decks playstyle. If even a few of them were just retrained to say "this card is treated as being x elemental hero while on the field or in the graveyard" and did things like searching poly or adding cards other cards from the deck or graveyard to the hand, they'd atleast be somewhat more viable.
@@deltadreamer1647 I got some ideas in mind
Elemental hero Strom avian level 3 wind monster 1000atk 1000def this card is treated as elemental hero avain in hand or filed when this card is sent to the graveyard as fusion material you can activate this effect the monster used to summon it can attack all monster your opponent controls
Elemental hero magma burstinex 1200atk 800 defthis card is treated as elemental hero burstinex when this card is used as fusion material you can activate this effect target one hero monster form your grave yard add it to your hand
Elemental hero Gaia clayman
800atk/2000def
This card is treated as elemental hero clayman when this card is sent to the grave yard as fusion Material you can activate this effect summon elemental hero in defence mode and it can't be destroyed by battle
Here are some (imo) interesting facts about Shining Neos Wingman:
1) This card has 600 ATK and 500 DEF more than Elemental HERO Neos (3100 ATK and 2500 DEF) much like Red-Eyes Dark Dragoon has 600 ATK and 500 DEF more than Red-Eyes Black Dragon (3000 ATK and 2500 DEF). Both Neos and REBD carry similar fusion powers (Neos Fusion and Red-Eyes Fusion), while both Shining Flare Wingman and Dark Magician have 2500 ATK and 2100 DEF.
2) 3100 ATK is the ATK of Flame Wingman (boosted by the effect of Skyscraper) when he destroyed Ancient Gear Golem and in Jaden's first duel in GX.
3) Effect-wise this card seems to be a Fusion of all the previous Wingman Fusion monsters: His ATK-increasing effect and effect-damage effect are the upgraded effects of Shining Flare Wingman, his card-destroying effect is a sidegrade of Wild Wingman's effect, and his protection from destruction by card effects is a sidegrade of the effect of Phoenix Enforcer who is a sidegrade of Flame Wingman.
4) This card is a Fusion (Shining Neos Wingman) of a Fusion (Shining Flare Wingman) of a Fusion (Flame Wingman).
5) Flame Wingman is a Fusion of 2 Normal monsters and Shining Flare Wingman and Shining Neos Wingman are both Fusions of a Fusion monster and a Normal monster. So Shining Neos Wingman is technically a Fusion of 4 Normal monsters.
6) Despite the fact this card's Special Summon is featured in the artwork of Favorite Contact, this monster cannot be Contact Summoned except by other cards' effects.
7) Neos Wiseman and Neos Kluger are Fusions of Jaden's 1st Ace monster (Yubel) and 3rd Ace monster (Neos). This card is a Fusion of Jaden's 2nd Ace monster (Shining Neos Wingman) and 3rd Ace monster. In a way these two cards are counterparts of each other (Fusion of this card and Yubel when, Komoney).
8) This card is also a counterpart of Zane's Cyberdark End Dragon and Chazz's Armed Dragon Catapult Cannon.
Honestly I’m happy with this but we REALLY need support for the original 5 E heroes. Though I guess making Neos actually playable first is cool too (this is unfortunately not enough though)
not tier level, but apparently as a deck neos already playable. but same cant be said about original heroes
This supports the OG Heroes actually.
Spirit SS a OG Hero and can add a OG Hero support card to your hand.
Shining Neos tempts me to play with Heroes again. Lately I’ve been focused on my Red Eyes Egyptian Gods hybrid deck.
The amount of Jaden Yuki’s support is pretty good today.
4 hours to edit this masterpiece, worth every second.
Agreed
All these new cards are weird and have weird effects but these are fire arts
what weird effects means?
@@Bestretribution1 Gimmicky/dumb. Spirit of Neos searches a wide range of cards for the archetype, but Konami, the brainlets that designed the card, decided to make it search on YOUR OPPONENT'S TURN. Completely ruined any potential it could've had.
@@REvoLverj98 You use engage, mill 1 neospacian (panther or mole) + shadow mist then special summon Spirit. On resolution both Spirit and Shadow Mist search 3 cards (a card with spirit, a hero with mist and the poly from engage)
Then with Convert Contract, Connector, Contact Gate and Cross Porter you have at least a second Neo-Spacian name. Spirit can tag out of Neos so if you searched the trap contract you can have Nebula Neos or Cosmo Neos during your opponent's turn.
@@babrad you can't use the trap to summon Cosmo Neos
@@SpaceCowBoyRay Narrator: But indeed, you could, for not only did the Trap ignore Summoning conditions, but it specifically lists an Elemental HERO - Neos - as material!
Red-Eyes: KOnami can please get a support Besides Black Meteor!
Konami:.....
Neos: I got you hommie! *gives them an instant fusion for a lvl 7*
RE: Thank you Hommie!
Tmw everything OUTSIDE of Red Eyes, is better support for Red Eyes 😹 😹
Also konami not reprinting Air Neos
Air hummingbird: :(
@@blackfiresprout LMAO actually true tho!
@@sugarsmile7852 NOn ironicly the best Neos Fusion for Red-Eyes because it is Wind for Dragon Ruler of Storm, Tempest. which can matter. Also I think they aren't reprinting because of the issues with the Ultraman series and how much Air Neos looks like one of them. Hence why Air Neos isn't even in any of the art work at all as well as not getting reprinted.
@@HeartYgo but all HERO monsters are inspired By popular superheroes,Masked HERO inspired by karman rider,density inspired by more darker superhero comics and elemental heroes inspired by marvel and DC so does air neos isn't fine while the others are fine
Am I the only one who still wishes Konami would finish the NEX group of Neo-Spacians and their Neos HERO forms?
They do be taking their time with them don't they
At least Wingman is back on top
But that's just me
@@NightBlaze911 it’s still a win, for sure.
no ma man, yuo are not alone xD I just hope it gets a soft once per turn !
I did think of possible effect like hummingbird would burn 500 for each card in hand as for its neos counterpart it would boost its atk for the difference you have ! the plus
Panther can select any card in GY to copy its effect ! (or reveal any monster from your deck and it takes its effect ? we should leave it for its neos counterpart)
scarab would pop S/T ? or make the oppoennts monsters lose 400 for each S/T ? or even make it gains 400 for each ST in GYs! and scarab NEX fused with neos allowed it to gain and lose xD
Grand mole would return any card on field to hand, as for its neos counterpart it would allow to return any card in GYs to hand!
@@otangakudyokeman7124 I love those effects! That mixed in with great card art, I can retire from the game. 😆
@@herrickmenry same ma man same XDDD
Konami: Makes an E Hero that can SS Neos from the Deck
Players: *wHy It NoT tReAt ItSeLf As NeOs On FiElD?*
If he is tread as neos all the time we could play him alone and we will NOT need to have vanilla neos in the deck which is the point
I always like Shinning Flare Wingman over Neos because of Jadens battle with Zane
YOOO what?! A fusion of my 2 favorite Heroes?! Yeah, Imma need that.
I was just going on about how those two were my favorite heroes in a FB group; finding out about that fusion (and this new support) just made my day lol. When are these coming out in the States?
(Still need to pick up a copy of Kluger, too.)
Ooh, Flame Wingman and Neos combined? That's really nice to see.
I love any and all HEROes support. Fan of the archetype.
The “but not really” clip after showing the rainbow dragon fusions was hilarious
I geeked out so hard when I saw Shining Neos Wingman.
3:30 "Cuz your still WATCHING ME"
Me: Damn straight I am
You had me dying with that clip at 1:29 xD
I love that Neos is getting more support now but 0:04 is the biggest part for me. That art is just absolutely beautiful.
Cross keeper pretty good ngl.
Able to place garnets at the bottom of the deck, and can be draw power and recorvery
Wingman is now officially an archetype inside the hero archetype. More wingman when?
Naked wild wingman incoming
@@Saixjacket bear gryls the card
This is a very interesting lineup of support. I’m actually still deciding how I feel about most of these cards, but I wouldn’t call any of them bad.
A random thought, but it’s kindof funny how similar Spirit of Neos is to Red Eyes Soul (in that they’re both counterparts of Level 7 normal monsters that rely on your opponent to special summon themselves.)
"Cuz ya still watchin me"
Me: Ignister!
love the new neos support hopefully we get evolutions to the other neo spacians and new neos evolution fusions
Damn straight i’m still watching your vids. Hell yeah best way to find out about new cards.
Yeah but what sucks is that Konami has not released Neos Kluger on TCG which makes Yubels card useless 😭
Cosmo/Nebula Neos turbo really looking like the go to build for this deck
Convert Contact is still an amazing draw card that can dump almost all your materials in one go and having Miracle Contact as a trap makes both boss monsters just game winners. The fact that they can't be returned to the extra deck also means they can't be removed with anything like a unicorn or a bouncing effect
Like this is easily the most playable the deck has been
And this support literally came out in one batch. Meanwhile Crystal Beasts still struggling 😩
The best yugituber on youtube. Right to the point. And fanastic edits
Catchy video ! Rewatch it 5 times now !
Definitely my favorite video of yours so far!
Like the new firewall some day we will have more monsters that count as multiple attributes thus making this a scary card down the line...
Can you go over pendulum monsters and summonings? I love the way you break shit down for real ones
Dp need 1 hour special for explaining these cards please! Love your dry humour
How Much Neos does it take to Win a Duel?
A LOT MORE THAN THIS
*Utopia watching in the distance, making sure Neos doesn't get more evolutions*
@@blackfiresprout Wouldn't Surprise me if Neos gets a Structure Deck
@@Black_Revue not anytime soon. The 20th anniversary for GX & 10th anniversary for Arc V ain't for another 2 years in 2024 👀
I guess that last bit was directed to the people who'll bring up the Air Neos conspiracy
3:09 Can a fusion substitute like Neos Alius (UGHH!) be used to bypass the 2nd effect of Favorite Contact? I don't know.
Neos and Wingman will be the storm that is approaching
While I do appreciate that they made new Neos support, I do wish they continue the NEX Neo-Spacians and the better Attribute Neos fusions like they did Marine Neos.
True Grand Mole Air Hummingbird Dark Panther and Flare Scarab imagine their Evolutions and Neo Contact Neos is basically a KAMEN rider/Ultraman and Neo Spacians are Super Sentai/Toku Heroes Expy in the form a Space Life forms also I want to See a Twinkle Moss and Neos Fusion imagine the First "Feminine" Neos
Don't forget Clay Guardian. That one dude from the first time he dueled Aster/Edo
@@takeruneverborn4740 dude for real. I've wanted a twinkle neos as soon as Jaden made twinkle moss during the duel with yubel. It is half male and female so I totally thought they were gonna go for a twinkle neos female. The day they make that card I'm gonna have a new waifu.... Sorry burstinatrix
NEX have a lot of problems and take too much space. Honestly, It's hard to imagine them being too useful in the current game. However I could see something like, NEX triple contact Neos fusions happening: Just replace the specific Neo-spacians with "level 4 or higher [insert attribute] Fusion monster". In fact, imo, it kind of feels like a wasted opportunity that a fan of *Yugi Moto* and student at *Seto Kaiba's* academy that has fought creatures of *Light* and *Darkness* doesn't have an "Elemental Hero Chaos MAX Neos" or something like that.
I just hope it gets a soft once per turn !
I did think of possible effect like hummingbird would burn 500 for each card in hand as for its neos counterpart it would boost its atk for the difference you have ! the plus
Panther can select any card in GY to copy its effect ! (or reveal any monster from your deck and it takes its effect ? we should leave it for its neos counterpart)
scarab would pop S/T ? or make the oppoennts monsters lose 400 for each S/T ? or even make it gains 400 for each ST in GYs! and scarab NEX fused with neos allowed it to gain and lose xD
Grand mole would return any card on field to hand, as for its neos counterpart it would allow to return any card in GYs to hand!
i also said favorite contact was by far the best with shining neos as second
The way I summon him is by using armed neos once it attack I can special summon any fusion
NEOS NEOS NEOS! LETS GO NEOS!!!!
This is why Neos is the GOAT
He the goat, sheep & the whole herd.
EN Shuffle can bring out Spirit Neos. His searcheffect triggersupon being SpSummon in any way
The trap card + cosmos neos = summoning kali yuga on opp turn.
how do you get three neos spacians out of the deck ? they aren't hero there is no way of dumping 3 of them out of the deck
@@gokudz3227 The new support provides piss easy ways to dump Neo Spacians, we’ve also got Neos Fusion for dumping and it’s not like the Neo Spacians need to even just be in the GY anyway.
No freaking way! I craated this guy years ago. Never thought it would ever happen.
Ngl, that Shining Neos is better than I thought when combined with the new flame wingman.
So Phoenix Enforcer is Aster's and Flame Wingman is Jayden's, does that this the new direction of Anime Hero support.
Favorite contact makes contact gate playable now so happy this deck got new support cards
They made a alternative dragon for neos, what a time to be alive
More like they made an Abominable Unchained Soul for Neos.
alternative dragon ?
This woulda been so lit in the anime
I thought we already have Verte as the best support for Neos to summon Rainbow Neos
All we need now is a retrained Neos Space. All it needs is to be treated as the original (ALWAYS) and to give protection to your field from your Triple Fusions effects when they leave the field. Turn the dual-sided field nukes into one-sided field nukes.
not like I have a MASSIVE hero extra deck (yes I have all but Inferno since i couldnt fit heat and lady heat in it). this is gonna be great for an update. now I just have to figure out how to get yubel in the deck for kruger when it's released
I think if this stuff ever comes out in the tcg, it’ll be alongside neos kluger’s stuff
2:43 can we use it to summon any hero monster like dpe?
you can uses keeper of dragon magic and branded engine, bcs engage already locks you in fusion anyway, so lets use the best fusion engine in the game
The neos support gonna be great with stratos and shadow mist ppl sleeping on it but it’s great to mix with regular heroes
Umm people been mixing heroes for a while now, don't know what you're on about.
@@IrrelevantOaf he means to mix them wirh neo spacian its kinda obvious
@@Dio____Brando lmao Ty 🤣. Mixing heroes with neo spacians always been bad but now with this support and the right set up u can summons heroes and neo spacians from the extra deck. I hope they continue to give support that can mix both of them. Get that jaiden feel fr 🤟🏾
meanwhile crystal beasts & fossils crying in the background waiting to even be viable in a casual setting.
Instant contacts.. is a fucking E-Hero extender!!!!!
In the words of Simplyunlucky
Oooooooh baaaaby
Lowkey good support!
Heroes out here lookin good again
As much as I don't like slutty engines getting rammed into every deck imaginable, I can't help but feel like protags are done dirty when their support generally is super specific and not really that great while rivals get stuff like RDA Abyss and the new town bicycle Destiny HERO.
You have a point, but I still feel like some of em being a bit more specific is kinda good in the sense that it makes their deck a bit more unique and less abusable, than let's say Albaz, whose whole purpose is to mesh itself into alot of different decks as an engine, who in of itself helps to cause potential abuse of its cards (an example being branded fusion and the whole dragoon combo)
But like I said, you do have a fair point in the whole *super specific* category, as alot of their cards don't benefit too well from outside support, which can cause them to lose alot of relevance outside of causal play.
not even that the protag cards are super generic, but rather every other card in the game is splashable & exploitable in some way, shape or form. And so generic that ANY deck can play them.
if you have 2 effect monsters, you get to summon Accesscode, completely free uninterruptible destruction of 4 cards on your opponent field. 👀 Don't even get me started with Eldlich
IWAE! The Ultra Man has invoked the Power of the Elements. And his name is Elemental HERO Shining Neos Wingman.
Are you playing Master Duel and if yess do you plan to stream?
En wave works with pot of avarice right
I'd give up evening twilight for 4 star normal to get both the shuffle effect and one banish per turn.
Man I wish we got a new god neos 😩😩😩but these cards are FIREEE!
Clearly, Divine Neos needs A LOT of help to actually be divine.
Also, here's an idea for a name of a retrain of God Neos: "E HERO God Neos - Legendary Strike"
I just thought of that. God neos should be the strongest neos yet he's hot trash.
Which is bad for a fusion that requires so much.
It's unfortunate. Retrain needed.
@@zekiel2533 Can he get the Wiseman/Kluger treatment? Or something else?
@@leandroroman7053 would be nice. And make him divine type. Would be cool
For what it's worth, you can still punish your opponent during the End Phase if you use a Fusion Substitute like King of the Swamp since it won't count as returning Neos back into the Deck.
1:23 hahahaha bro i love ur videos
Finally neos got a good support
Meanwhile, Rata: i guess i have to rewrite my script for the Heroes archetype archive AGAIN...
If new masked beasts support or/and new bakura support (ZORC NECROFADES) comes, I'm the first one who watch your Videos for that.
It is about time that flame wing man is getting the love he deserves.
Secretly I've always wanted a retrain simply named "Elemental HERO Flaming HOT Wingman".
You mean Shining Flare 😭😭
We need a card called Precious Times, glory days where Flame Wingman is doing his pose from that opening.
Instant Contact is Marine Neos support xD
Don't forget bout Twinkle Moss 😏
@@blackfiresprout YES
Every protagonist, should have their own magician's soul. Too bad, Konami only care about Yugi and Seto.
I mean jaden has emergency call which searches any elemental hero and isn't a once per turn. But yeah drW power can be hard to come by if you didn't get or search either liquid soilder or cross keeper
I love you man keep it up
Konami really love heroes (my favorite archetype BTW)
Neos is just straight up glistening
Instant Contact is actually great for plant decks since there was no instant fusion target before and this sort of remedies that
@@denvvver2 Theres no plant target for instant fusion and due to how important Jasmine is it would be great if there was. Now with this there basically is an instant fusion that can summon a plant albeit not searchable.
Spirit of Neos can search all the other spell and Traps for the original E Heros too xD
Woo Burst Return :D
So the trap is basically revolt , but you run it at 1 for a back up plan mid or late game?
you use it lock out your opponent for a turn
I love the subtle gag of how you not only didn't show either Glow Moss among the Neo-Spacians, but also didn't show Glow Neos among the Neos fusions. Probably because the phrase "Nobody fucking cares" is the perfect reaction to both cards.
Konami constantly having to pump life into this archetype. You think every day Konami curses whoever’s idea it was to have a protagonists archetype be initially centered around contact fusing with a level 7 normal monster?
i don't think it, cuz a lot of the cards mention specifically having the og Neos in field, deck or GY in order to fully resolve their shizz 😹
RIP Air Neos
This is actually real solid support. I don’t anything terrible or downright bad.