Nintendo Takes a Disappointing Stand Against Refunds
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ม.ค. 2020
- Nintendo was taken to court in Europe for not refunding people's digital pre-purchases, and it seems for now that they've won.
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BOOKFACE: ArloStuff
"Reloaded Installer #11" by LHS.
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“Gaining money is eventually good, but refunding fans for games they haven’t even downloaded yet is forever bad.”
-Mr. Mario
I don't think that's the quote...
Kinda agree with this.
Wrong Quote,Good Message
*Mr. Mario Miyamoto
@jadresa94 r/itswooooshwith4os
I'm pretty sure they understand the joke too, so...
By the thumbnail, I thought the title was: *“Nintendo takes a disappointing stance against Arlo”*
Luis Cañamar - MediaBros no more free review copies.
Luis Cañamar - MediaBros same
It's called clickbait.
@@mmkm78aaa how is that clickbait, it doesn't even say that.
Nah they love Arlo. He probably brings in a significant amount of revenue for them. Even when he doesn't like a game, he's still pretty charitable.
The world's greatest issue: people defending companies when the company is in the obvious wrong.
Sucking that corporate capitalist D
@Edward Tay They're both wrong.
This is what happens when people can have their own opinions
We are looking to you Disney.
@Alex Hays or you lack the ability to see the big picture.
"They're a company, they need to make money."
Imagine if people said that about microtransactions.
or paid online subscriptions.
Better yet, paid online subscriptions for peer-to-peer internet.
Bootlickers are always like that.
Getindor game company: here’s a free game but yknow so we make money we have optional cosmetics you an buy to support us :).
Sensible people: ok that’s fine
Ppl like you: wtf??! L stfu bootlickers micro transaction are all bad reeeeè
dukeplanter Duke well yes because a small percent actually do it fairly. Not even that but people rightly have the correct assumption that season passes are so old so game companies look for something else to fuck gamers over. They look at the mobile game market and see how so little effort can make big money “Microtransations”.
Preach!
It's worth noting that people have reported getting refunds on digital games in some cases. It seems to be something of a rarity, and done on a case-by-case basis. I'm also not sure yet if this is only regular purchases or preorders too (reply with your experience!) It's nice that it's at least POSSIBLE, but their official policy being to deny refunds is still pretty messed up. And as with the joycon issue, it's weird and frustrating that it varies between regions.
Yeah, pretty weird.
at least theyre being open about it
I feel like digital refunds should have a time limit. Return in a week for a refund
I guess it's a case by case basis? I'm talking about purchases and not pre-purchases if that makes sense? I've bought 2 games in the past on the switch eShop, that I had buyers remorse on (didn't play them at all) Puyo Puyo Tetris and Overlord (anime) Picross (yes it's a real game lol) and they funded me.
They offered anyone who prepurchased tokyo mirage sessions #fe in japan a refund cause of censorship that was unclear in the trailer
I love how your not afraid to be critical sometimes. Blind loyalty will lead to a company to be more complacent and less consumer friendly and that’s not the image I want Nintendo to ever have personally.
omg truee
This guy gets it. People are always so quick to call a huge fan a hater when they give legit criticism for their favorite series or company.
We criticize because we care. We want our favorite things to be better. Not entitlement or empty complaints, nothing wrong with making sure Nintendo stays on top of their game, that's not just their competitors jobs. Want improvements? Speak up.
Nintendo already has that image unfortunately.
This is my opinion on Pokémon SWSH I love the franchise, the new game I have problems with
When it comes to combating return fraud or abuse of the system I can understand Nintendo's refusing refunds but Arlo makes very good points.
Nintendo's corporate people seem to take a disapointing stand on practically everything. The company is full of genius game developers, but their business people are simply awful.
R S while there are certainly examples of poor anti-consumer decisions like this; that argument also gets thrown around in a lot of cases that Nintendo is stuck in a Rock and a Hard place scenario.
Take AM2R as an example. Due to the way copyright is written in the United States, Nintendo has to in essence be the bad guy because otherwise they would essentially be opening the door to EA making their own Metroid Game with Surprise Mechanics and all, and Nintendo could do nothing to stop them because they didn’t stop AM2R when it was brought to their attention.
I love Nintendo but since the Switch, they kinda lost my respect. This console is the least Nintendo-y console yet. 60$ for a gameboy remake. No Twilight Princess or Wind Waker ports but we get Mario Bros U DX? No Metroid or Starfox on the system. And the fact they keep pushing Fire Emblem. goddamn dude. I miss the old Nintendo. This no-refund for preorders is also a dick move too.
Lol what, this is certainly a Nintendo-y console. Literally their only "unrelated" console is the Gamecube, because otherwise all their consoles have either been the portable Nintendo DS line, or the motion controller Wii line. So... put those together and you get the Switch. Pretty much about as Nintendo as it gets.
And asking for remakes isn't what makes Nintendo shine. Yes, remakes are fun, which is why we have dozens of them, but you can literally just pick up an old console or emulate any of the games that already exist. Plus, they are working on a new Metroid as we speak. It's been announced for some time. And theres like what.. 2 Fire Emblem games on the switch?
You're trippin.
@@iRsemple Its the least Nintendo-y console when it comes yo their games, not their gimmicks. im not asking for ports. Im asking to go back in time and smack the fucking thought out of their head to bring SMBU DX to the console instead of Wind Waker or Twilight Princess. And Metroid Prime 4 isnt on its way until its in my hands. Theyve already scrapped it once. And how many Fire Emblem characters are in Smash Bros.? At least Tekken does some cool shit, bringing in FFXV, TWD, Street Fighter and what was that other dude from Final Fight? Nah, Smash Bros might as well be Fire Emblem Fighters featuring Mario and Zelda.
and honestly, man. im not tripping. im upset for a reason because the switch sucks. my main gripe is the ports and lack of awesome Nintendo IPs on the system. 3 years in and this is what we have.
Arlo: This is disappointing, I am very disappointed, Nintendo should be doing better.
The background: Virtual Console
Coincidence?? I think NOT!
Trenton Chandler I think trickling out the Virtual Console is a legitimate strategy Nintendo is pursuing in an attempt to get more third party and indie support on their console. If Nintendo put all of their games on Virtual Console right now, they’d easily take over the eShop. That means they’d lose a lot of developer support which is one of the reasons why the Wii U failed.
Trust me I want VC also. But I understand what they’re doing. It’s gotten me to try some really good indie games that I’d probably never even look at if they just had VC first party games.
@@ITALIANN1NJA1 So why did they do it on the Wii and Wii U, too?
And it wasn't even being trickled out then - they were being released at an utterly glacial pace.
If they could add in Virtual Console on Switch, I would be so happy.
Just a good reason never to pre-order anything.
This show is brought to you by, me, who pre-ordered Sonic Forces
Yep, always wait for reviews and game play footage.
In particular, I don't see much utility in pre-ordering something that is digital. It makes some sense with regards to physical goods, as there are physical limitations in distribution, but digital products don't have those same problems. It's not like Nintendo is going to run out of digital copies. Ostensibly, if Nintendo isn't willing to give out refunds for pre-orders, then pre-orders should be closed until just before the title is released, just ahead of any pre-download window.
@@ArtumTsumia Occasionally, there's some incentive to pre-order digitally. If you had pre-ordered Luigi's Mansion 3 digitally, then you would have gotten 2X the amount of gold points.
@@sprint7412 Certainly there are the occasional incentives. I'm not familiar with what promotions Nintendo does, but I know other platforms will continue such incentives into the first week or so of release. Regardless, it isn't like customers got more coins if they ordered months before release over the night before, so there still isn't really any additional utility here.
As my man Nerrel once said “Just because you have the right to do something doesn’t mean it’s the right thing to do.”
Or like my boy Shirou said "Just because you're correct doesn't mean you're right"
Juan Dlc “People die when they are killed.”
I think it's more appropriate to say "Just because you have the ability to do something, it does not make it right."
note taken.
pay attention on your acts
Very biblical
an eye for an eye? completely fair. That's your right. but if you always claim everything that's coming to you.. you'll get what's coming to you.
"I expected stuff from the *other* big companies..."
*shows Plants vs Zombies*
Well played, Arlo. Well played...
Doesn't even show a versionthat EA had a hand in 😩
Snowka At least ea made the first two garden warfare games good?
@@Joryho where they good? Dont get me wrong I only played the 1st one, but like... it wasn't bad... just not what I'd call Good.
The Protagonist The second one is, from what I hear, really good. Huge improvement over the first.
@@robbyhenton8038 So...Okay?
People need to take off the nostalgia goggles when it comes to Nintendo. They've been getting away with too much lately.
Tru like overpriced accessories and games, shit like that.
kind of like disney,they dont even have to try that much anymore cuz people will just see their movies because of nostalgia
lilkumquat especially with joycon drift and all that
Yeah they have been so weird lately :(
"Making money is the goal...
Making money at all costs... Should NOT be the goal..."
Genius
Making money at NO cost should be the goal.
Yeah and what pays the game dev's and other things definitely not passion
You may find this surprising but:
From what I've heard, according to the Japanese Civil Code, there's no legal obligation to accept returned products or exchange them once they have been sold. So this could very much be a situation regarding lost in translation to the Western audiences.
@Chris Zelum
Businessmen/businesswomen in Japan (as well as in other East Asian/Southeast Asian countries) and businessmen/businesswomen of Japanese descent (as well as of other East Asian/Southeast Asian descent) *_ABSOLUTELY_*_ _*_NEED*_* to learn and understand this, especially if they are elder businessmen/businesswomen from those countries or of those countries' ethnicities!!!
Not to mention Nintendo games *never* get discounted most of the time. Especially the first party ones.
Black friday and new years had p big discounts
Delta lord arms is still full price...like why
Thats not scummy or bad, and they do get discounted on occasion
Publishers don’t ever lower the price just because it’s nice. It’s almost always to bring in more money
What are you talking about? Plenty of first Party Games were on special just after Xmas online for almost a month. Don't lie.
I think a friend not giving me back a game I gave him would totally be enough to not make us friends anymore. Like, dafuq man, thats basically robbery
I had completely broken trust with the entirety of my age group over the theft of a single Pokemon card. Stealing a game is 100% the end of our friendship.
“They’re not selling us an hour long Zelda game and selling it for 60 bucks,”
Link’s Awakening came damn close lol
Real close
If you've played the original so much that you blaze through the remake, it isn't for you.
Florian W Some people just buy remakes simply because they love the original THAT much. I did the exact same thing with Majora's Mask 3D and blazed through most of it in just under a few cycles. I nearly 100% the whole thing in one go! Point is, remakes are supposed to cater to *both* fans AND newcomers.
Exactly. I enjoyed Link’s Awakening and I wouldn’t advocate for any major changes. It simply had no business being a full priced release.
Nintendo has a bad track record when it comes to refunds they are like one purchase and you keep it.
It's the first rule of acquisition: once you have their money you never give it back.
Nintendo is run by ferengi, right?
Still with I could refund NBA2K17
@@wombatkidd inb4 "oMg THaT's RaCisT"
Jokes aside, nice Star Trek reference.
that's why I stick with buying games physically. You don't have to deal with companies ripping you off with non refunds. I understand that if the game is exclusive to eshop thats fine but if its a game that you can just buy in the store just buy it physically.
@Kitsune Metal You better be thankful we got emulators and websites that allow us to get digital copies of games for free.
I alway like listening to your criticism. They're always clear and rational, yet powerful and entertaining.
cake Alro is like a family friendly Jim Sterling in some cases. Pretty sure Arlo watches Jim Sterling actually. I think I recall him citing him in some other videos.
His criticism is RARELY rational. It's often clear and entertaining, but it's almost always wildly biased, ill-informed and overly emotional.
Well said, my friend.
Agreed. Even when im tired of seeing criticisms, its usually due to the smugness. Arlos always made it a point to be fair and talk about it like an adult
@@Jerk7891 I just couldn't disagree more. While he isn't doing it in this video, he often acts like a spoiled child and is mad because he didn't get what he wants, with no regard to logic or how anyone else might feel. He disregarded an entire year of Nintendo games and complained ceaselessly essentially from Xenoblade through Smash Ultimate because they aren't the specific franchises he personally buys, just as one example.
Arlo claims he's been making videos off the cuff, yet when have we ever seen him wear a shirt? Hmmm? How can you have cuffs without sleeves? Huh? What are you hiding Arlo?! Tell me your secrets!
He's clearly a wizard trained in the classical element "cuff."
The others are air, water, fire, and earth.
Classical elements are weird
Maybe they don’t make shirts in his size?
It's a figure of speech.
@@globin3477 no comprende
@@nuclearquailord5311 It's something people say without regard to it's literal meaning. In this case, "off the cuff" means unscripted and impromptu, without any reference to literal shirts or cuffs.
Similar figures of speech include sayings such as "He's a smart cookie", or "Water under the bridge" (meaning that something was not ultimately important), or "burning with rage".
Seriously, Iwata dies and the company is slowly morphing into EA. The reckoning is upon us people!
Us: Hey Nintendo, can we have refunds?
Nintendo: *well yes, but actually no.*
Answer is no, people don't before they click purchase or download, it even says no refund which is total bullshit, customer should have the right to ask for refund
@@kyotheman69 no.
Maybe a 2-day lasting refund chance if the game has no demo.
I wish I could of refunded terra tech... it has a 2500 block allowance. Nothing in game descriptions mentions that..no b.a on computer and 5k on ps4 and xbox.
kyotheman69 It’s a pretty dumb move to preorder a digital game in the first place. It’s not like they’re going to run out of stock...
I remember having to ask for a refund by calling them and only gave it to me as a one time thing since i hadnt asked for one before and that i bought it less than 1-2 hours ago. Compared to steam, it feels weak.
You know it's bad when it's weak compared to Steam, who has a notoriously bad refund service.
@@Thannus steam has had a 2 hour refund policy with no questions asked for about 2 years now. Where have you been.
DFaceG Rebooted Wouldn’t call it bad. Every refund I’ve ever asked for on Steam went through without a hitch.
StabStabStabStabby Yeah, that’s why I said it was bad that Nintendo had a worse refund policy than Steam. Steam’s refund policy of 2 hours is quite honestly unreasonable in its own right - it can sometimes take much longer for users to gauge the quality of their games.
2 hours is more than enough time to judge if a game is good
3:50 "Well look at Steam, they offer refunds!" They fought the Australian government for many many years over that (and lost).
They still have refunds even if it wasn’t intentional.
Nintendo is more evil.
I tried to refund 2 games after I bought like 30 games. That’s when I lost my respect for Nintendo and started to hate it a little. Like that wheird friend you mentioned.
Nintendo has the highest prices on everything but than acts out completely like a scrooge. Like that one friend who never tipps waiters. So awkward.
I'm getting flashbacks to Japan and the Tokyo Mirage Sessions debacle. Main lesson, just preorder physically at best. Never worth fully paying for a digital game that requires jumping through hoops to make a return.
What was the Tokyo mirage sessions debacle? I'm at work so inform me
@@TheFurryInShambles From what I recall, the TMS site had pics that displayed the uncut Japanese images, but after awhile, they replaced the images with the NA censored versions with news that the worldwide Switch Version was gonna be censored. So Nintendo gave refunds to those that had prematurely pre-purchased due to the change in information and backlash.
There's not even utility in making a digital purchase ahead of time, so it's not something people should be doing regardless. Just seems like carry over from people who are still used to pre-ordering physical goods. Ostensibly, there's no need for refunds because there's no need for digital pre-purchase.
@@TheFurryInShambles The game was butchered. Chapter two completely got reworked to pretend the entire plot point of the chapter didn't exist, a bunch of costumes/character designs got altered, dialogue got altered and the entire Hot spring DLC got wiped entirely.
In completely and totally unrelated news the Switch version of the game has so far sold far less than the Wii U original. Thats right a SWITCH version of a game is selling less than the WII U version of the same game. I wonder why that could be Nintendo? Hmmmmm
@@JJAB91 Because the Switch version has been out for 1 week and the Wii U version has been out for 4 years and a month.
it's sad to see that nintendo can seem so corporate sometimes, when they seem like such a consumer friendly company (compared to EA or Microsoft)
jengerang you let them get away with certain things they’ll. Continue to get worse knowing they won’t receive any real backlash
Microsoft has recently been doing basically all the pro consumer moves to be honest.
I've only been seeing this recently. It kinda first started with crappy online that we now have to pay for, lootboxes (at least in there mobile apps), and now this. Im just hoping EA isn't influencing Nintendo.
@@oooooo6308 A lot of people aren't trying to let them do that, hence the big fuss about the joycon drift.
Microsoft in the later half of this generation has been quite friendly, even in the first half, not the launch of the Xbox one god no. Mandatory Kinect is not consumer friendly, and I think they noticed that and changed up their act.
“Nintendo is like this friend”
Friends don’t always sell you their stuff at full price
Bad analogy, because if your has a business, the best thing you can do as his friend is to be a good customer, not trying to get freebies or at cheaper prices.
tumamaencosplay by allowing them to screw us over? Not happening.
I can agree
Because they sell at a higher price
@@bt3743 Which is why I said bad analogy, only a dick "friend" would ask for freebies and discounts out of their entrepeneur friend.
Kinda why arlo didnt talk about that when he did HIS friend analogy,which its more about an old friend that sometimes screws you over a bit, but not enough to cut ties over.
@jesus barrera thats a different topic, because thats just a result of how Nintendo's costumers behave.
You see, most game sell about 70-80% of their lifetime sales on the first month or two, regardless of that number is 1M, or 10M, so soon after the price is cut to get rid of excess stock. Theres also the resell topic where those games are very propmtly resold to second hand shops or directly online very soon after release.
What happens with Nintendo's games? Well nearly all of them are evergreen, meaning even years after release, they still sell quite a bit, specially mainstays like Zelda and Mainline 3D mario, mariokart and Splatoon, they continue to sell 500k to 2M every single year after release, the demand continues well until the console's death (sometimes even longer, as MK Wii managed to chart in amazon's top ten up till 2015.
Meanwhile, Nintendo fans simply dont sell their games, thats why even shops like Gamestop will pay you well for them.
With such plentyfull sales and consistent clients, it would be foolish for Nintendo to cut the price if its going to sell well regardless.
On the bright side, this also means your Nintendo Collection retains value and even years after, you can resell then at a pretty good price. It also means that you can confidently buy a Nintendo game at release, it aint going to lower its price anytime soon, so there's no point to waiting.
The way I see it is this, when you pre-ORDER a game at say Gamestop, you have the ability to request a refund anytime because something hasnt been delivered to you.
If you pre-PURCHASE a game, you are entering into an agreement whereby you are allowed to purchase and download the game before release so that at midnight release day you can play it but the flip side is you absolutely have bought the game.
I see pre-order and pre-purchase to be very different things.
That actually makes a lot of sense
In both of those examples, you are buying a promise. Pre purchasing is still pre ordering with extra steps that should by law mandate the abilty to get a refund, especially if you still aren't able to play it.
What nintendo does with digital pre orders is ludicrous, and should downright be illegal under australian law. Valve couldn't get away with it, nintendo shouldnt either
@@skillorb9963 That's just flat out not the case. There's nothing illegal about what Nintendo does and they won the judgement rightfully so.
@@sanjicook08 They are breaking European Union and Australian laws which can go as far as to a total ban of Nintendo products
@@PeruvianPotato This has been regurgitated by lemmings on social media all week and yet its patently false. There's no such law that affects Nintendo in this way, thus the court ruling.
I'm sorry, but daddy government cant impose whatever dumbass restrictions on business they want. Sort yourselves out.
It’s been about 2 years since Nintendo removed the review function on the eShop immediately after adding it. Still waiting.
Edit: www.polygon.com/2018/2/28/17062248/nintendo-switch-reviews-website? for more details
Wait what?
I honestly didn't know that happened
I remember that, didn't notice it was gone until a few months ago though.
Wow, I thought I couldn't hate Nintendo enough. Thanks for another reason to add why Nintendo should go out of buisness
@@PeruvianPotato what's your issue. Playstation and I think xbox don't have it either
"The money is always right!" - Mr Krabs
I love this comment so much! 🥰🤗😂
I am surprised the court ruled in Nintendo's favor. Here in the EU the refund laws are very pro consumer. There is a law that a company has to give a refund 14 days after purchase no questions asked. Of course there is some freedom to take this law and spin it a bit for companies. That's why on steam you can refund 14 days after purchase if you haven't played the game for more than 2 hours. I know epic games did something similar for their store and they got into some shit for it. I think this story is going to have some follow up because this will probably go to an EU level where they will ban Nintendo from selling games in the EU.
Not that surprising when you know that as a consumer you have agreed to a contract. If the terms and policies Nintendo has are not illegal in your country then they shouldnt have a problem at all since contracts are treated as laws between parties, thus making Nintendo not guilty of anything because the user agreed to it in the first place.
@@lulimdying720 The point is, based on those laws, the contract is illegal. Every other company who tried to enforce this (Sony, Valve) backed down.
It pretty much makes a mockery of the consumer protection law, making them toothless.
I can continue to never buy anything from Nintendo, pirating literally everything, but other companies could follow suit.
Yeah, I'm also very surprised to see an EU court rule in favor of Nintendo on this. Not that it matters to me personally, the one and only time I've ever had something refunded was a preorder of a game that got ourtright cancelled before release... but this ruling is a can of worms that should never have been opened. It's like delivering an empty box on your doorstep with a promise that the actual content will be there later on. Which it will, sure, but in case of a delay it would be quite the claim to insist it was "technically" on time because they'd already sent you the box.
I would expect the appeal to overturn the ruling, or at least lead to further clarification to the directive itself regarding digital pre-orders specifically.
Now let's see them try to withold refunds in Australia
Lol, Yeah I was thing the same thing. Lets see them go up against the ACCC, There is no way they will not come out of that fight without some bruises and stitches.
That's a death trap they fell for
Nintendo: *Why do I hear boss music?*
This is why I never preorder any game digitally.
I’ll sometimes pre-purchase a game if I know that it’s something that I’ll always want in my Switch.
Only game I ever pre ordered was Smash. I knew that was a safe investment.
Preordering games is the most anti-consumer thing ever. you are giving money to a developer with very little information, and no idea if the game is going to be good or if it'll be a buggy pile of steaming... you get the idea.
You should never ever preorder... digital or physical. Not unless you are 100% confident in the game. (Like with Pokemon games, for example)
@@SnowyRVulpix It's almost like buying games in the 80s and 90s.
Anyone still preordering in *any* format is just a fool.
The thing is, Nintendo is not your friend. They are, first and foremost, a company, and they will always care about making money.
Its why when combined with the Pokemon Company, ultimately pokemon sword and shield took a blow for it.
@@imnotoriginalatall6942 people unironically still post r/woooosh holy shit what year am I in because it definitely doesn't feel like 2020
Certainly more of a friend than EA
@@pjspriteanimations4905 It won't die just because it's 2020, lol. Let's see if we can kill people editing top comments, "Literally Nobody" and constant mentions of TH-cam's recommendation algorithm, specifically in that order, before we get to r/woosh.
Their good reputation was part of the formula that made them so much money over the years, they'll throw that away at their own peril.
As yahtzee of Zero Punctuation game once said:
"Nintendo is like a stripper. They only pretend to be interested in you as long as you keep giving them money."
I'm paraphrasing but, it's true.
dragon1130 that’s not really woke. A stripper is providing you a product like any company wants to provide you a product. It’s basic business practice. Every company strives to be personable enough that you feel comfortable buying their services. In this case Nintendo just made a bad move and is actively scaring people from pre ordering from them
@@meganintenbro If people are scared to preorder and that carries over to other Publishers that would be a really good Thing from Nintendo. Those f*ing preorder Bonuses and people buying Games without any idea what awaits them. There is no reason to preorder a Game on a digital Shop other than preloading it which you can do one or two days before release and Not Weeks or months😂
@@meganintenbro btw i still think Nintendo is making a bad move with this. there were so many Games that turned out to be absolut Trash with Publishers lying etc... Preordering is gambling with the devil... That's all i'm saying:)
7:31 *Arlo...you just described nintendo selling the Links Awakening remake for full price $90CAD lmao*
I love Nintendo, but this type of thing is exactly why I have never pre-ordered and will never pre-order anything from them
I don't pre order unless I have a very good reason.
@@TSPH1992 I preorder smash because I would get pirhana plant, and I had seen the game and new I wanted.
@@maxattack3853 aye
I mean, otherwise people could pre-order everything to make sure they get a copy IF they want it, then cancel everything when it comes out.
you should only get a partial refund. a 'restocking fee' is fair.
this idea of the partial download counting as delivery is bonkers though.
The only game I pre ordered from them was smash ultimate. I had complete faith in the final product. I’m also going to pre order botw 2 after some trailers come oit
The problem is that the ones making the laws and are making rulings on those laws are nearly entirely older people that have no idea how these things work. So when Nintendo says it's loaded onto your switch when you pre order it, those old people fully believe that you've gotten the product then. Those in power are, for the most part, entirely out of touch with current culture and technology.
It's a very serious problem in many situations even outside the gaming industry.
Nintendo be like :Ok boomer
Juan Dlc I think he means that Nintendo is the boomer
No he’s saying that the people behind laws are boomers and Nintendo is taking advantage of that
This is the only statement here I completely agree with
@@stuffedanimalwars7692 every company does. Sadly...
Simple solution
Don’t preorder digitally, there’s no point, it ain’t going anywhere.
Its only getting cheaper and you probably have other things you haven't finished.
George Hale exactly, there’s no benefit to preorder digital games, the whole point of preorders were to reserve yourself a copy from a limited stock, digital games are unlimited.
@@firenze6478 only time pre ordering digital games is good is if you wanted to pre load your games before it comes out so you could play it right away the moment it comes out im pretty sure people dont wanna wait for hours just for their games to finish downloading after launch day
thats why i do physical
Pre order bonuses? I digitally pre ordered doom eternal for those.
Nintendo ARE "nickle and diming" us. Games cost sometimes 4X's as much on switch as on other consoles and the "sale" prices are often the the full price on other consoles and pc. This is yet another tone-deaf anti consumer move by Nintendo. I have not recommended the switch after my first year of owning it to my friends bc I know they would hate it. The sub par online and the dreaded "switch tax", the switch lite with the ez-break joycons built in was a huge turn off, and the worst is the fact the virtual console WAS a thing and now we are lucky that Nintendo let us RENT 20 or so NES and SNES games IN 2020! I agree that ppl should not pre order anything ever. Games are digital dl's now! Preorders were for insurance that you got a physical copy of a game on day one bc they may not have enough. Preorders should go the way of the dodo boid.
Caio Coelho shut up imbecile shill. Some Nintendo games are still $60 after a few years and in their discounts they get a $40 price tag at best, whereas you can get pretty much any other AAA title for $10-20 at a steam summer sale two years after release
Hump Yeah switch is very subpar tbh.
Hump K, so I understand a few of your issues, but also, the Switch has some absolutely AMAZING and GROUNDBREAKING titles, as well as ports, travel convenience, etc. Also some of these other guys in this particular comments string have good points, even if they seem a bit aggressive. Just my two cents.
Super smash is 65, and that's entirely Nintendo giving us a ridiculous bottom price!
@Caio Coelho learn to suck it. Its on nintendos store, doosh.
Its really weird that the Switch’s Eshop has no music but the Wii Shop Channel and the Wii U or 3DS’ Eshops do.
It's because we don't have Iwata anymore
@@segunthepikachufan1470 Was the music his idea?
Guess the music would be hard to figure it out.......
@@BossCrazyRoss most likely since he Directed the Wii, DSi, 3ds and Wii U and they all had eShop sound
@@segunthepikachufan1470 You DO realize that Paid DLC was a thing back in the 3DS era, right? Iwata was alive when New Super Mario Bros 2 got paid DLC packs & when Smash 4 got paid DLC.
It’s like having to wait a month to build a lego set
“Nintendo is like this friend-“
Arlo, buddy, corporations are NEVER your friend.
Agreed, no matter what, corporations, including Nintendo, are NOT your friends.
"Like" not is, "Like". Companies want to be seen as friendly and consumers want to see them as friends. Doesn't mean they are
Well your right but not really depends on the company
I'm pretty sure it was more of an example
He wasn't calling Nintendo a friend, he was making an analogy
I just finished watching Oscar The Grouch introduce Arlo via the opening ad. My life is now complete.
I'm not sure if I just didn't notice it as a kid, or if there has been an actual change in Nintendo's ideology, but... Nintendo doesn't feel as respectable as I once felt it was.
It's definitely possible. Iwata seemed to be against anti-consumer practices or even anti-employee practices. Not sure if this type of mindset is still at their core. Especially with their paid online that's pretty much a cruel joke right now.
Ditto, it's a weird feeling.
@@gormlessCreator yeah Iwata would have never wanted paid online or a lame interface that has literally nothing to do besides playing games
MudKevin It’s stuff like this that makes me wish Iwata were still with us. I feel like the magic of Nintendo died with him. It feels so much more corporate now than when he was in charge.
@@chris_wizzudz I wouldn't say the magic died, since people like Nogami, Miyamoto, and Aonuma are still there (and remember Reggie didn't become "The Regginator" in a day), but I do agree. Some of the magic has disappeared, and I don't think it's a coincidence that it disappeared around the same time Iwata passed away
It's a real pity how Nintendo has reacted like this, thought with this new age they'd be more open minded :/
"This is just gonna make people wary of preordering."
GOOD. NEVER EVER EVER PREORDER. When you preorder, you are buying a promise. Don't buy a promise. Buy a game.
Yeah, pre-ordering is kinda dumb if you dont really know what the game has
Buying physical is also generally a lot better since the publisher has a lot more control over digital than they do over physical. You can resell physical if your done with it and you will always be able to play it as long as you own the system. With services like the eshop, you have to hope that the publisher continues to support the system and bring it to a new system or just carry the old system for years and years and hope it never stops working or has a memory issue or something (and never delete old games to save on space, lest those games be removed from the shop or the shop removed entirely). Not a nintendo specific issue but buying physical does put a lot more power in the consumer's hands.
@@Kobolds_in_a_trenchcoat Eh, I support digital. Three big reasons.
First off, digital is better for publishers because they get a much better profit from digital sales. Physical means costs in manufacturing, delivery, stocking in stores, etc.
Second, digital at least means you have the game files that you can keep for yourself. Transfer them to other drives, hack the DRM out of it, modify to your heart's content, emulate it, etc.
Third, environmental impact. Making physical games pours nasty shit in the air and the plastic cases end up as useless clutter more often than not. Digital, that problem doesn't really exist.
Now the real enemy? Streaming. Don't support Stadia. Stadia is evil and bad and yucky and gross. Say no to Stadia.
Swish Fish physical is always better. You actually own the game
@@manwithoutmercy Not anymore. Have you noticed that many "physical" games you buy now require you to run an hour-long update before you can play them? The physical release is basically an access code on a disc. It's not actually the game anymore. One more reason to support digital, you'll actually get the game files.
That background showcase of 3DS and wii u games made me feel legit nostalgia for the systems lol... so many games that i completely forgot about
Diego G Wii U had a lot of great games...honestly up there as one of the most underrated consoles ever.
Weird behavior from a usually decent company
The swinging arms analogy gets a perfect score
Amazon, Steam, and Wal-mart - The largest platforms in their respective areas. If you want pure digital for PC, you go for Steam. When you want to go to a physical store to purchase a physical copy of Zelda or God of War or food/snacks, or whatever else, you go to Wal-Mart. When you want the same things, plus more - a majority of them physical from an online shop, you go through Amazon.
Those three giants in their respective industries all offer full refunds within reason. Whether it be store credit, cash, exchange, or otherwise. You play for less than 2 hours and decide you don't like the game, or the game is broken, you can get a full refund from Steam. You don't have a receipt for the item from Wal-Mart? Up to 3 returns for the month. Amazon? Sometimes they will let you keep the item, especially if you have been with them long-term. Amazon's customer retention is so high because they make things easy and fast and next to no hassle. I mean, Amazon is still a horrible company with how they treat their employees, but no matter what you will keep coming back because everything is so fast and easy. I still purchase a majority of my games physically because of this. Sony has learned from this and now has a decent return policy. Microsoft seems to have grown wise themselves and has a much better return policy than I think people give them credit for. Nintendo should learn. Sadly, this is why I never pre-order digitally.
.. Did you just say go to Walmart if you want a physical game.. rip Amazon I guess, who wants lower costs AND better, easier customer service.
@@MrCODEmaster00 walmart has switch games at 49.99 not 59.99 like xbox or ps. So yes, go to wallyworld.
@@MrCODEmaster00 For a physical store.. Physical shopping experience in general. I'm glad you can read... LOL
And yes, I did mention Amazon you troll. xD
The "Nintendo is a company and needs to make money"" argument is actually an argument in favor of complaining when companies do anti-consumer things, not an argument against it. Nintendo is doing something that is harmful to me personally, and I want it to stop. They are doing it to make money. Therefore, I need to make people aware of it, so that they will stop doing the thing that makes Nintendo money (e.g. stop buying preorders), so that it stops making money for Nintendo, so that they change their behavior.
In other words, it is necessary to talk about these things *because* they make Nintendo money. So any time somebody says "stop complaining, Nintendo is a company and needs to make money", they are actually making an argument in favor of complaining.
The only situation "Nintendo needs to make money" is an argument in favor of Nintendo doing anti-consumer stance is if you are an actual Nintendo shareholder who directly benefits from Nintendo scamming their own customers out of pre-order money.
Issue is they are in the right though. Their argument is valid but also put themselves into a trap. All you have to do is DO NOT PRELOAD the game and you can demand your money back. preload the game when you feel confident enough about the game or the day before it comes out. Also don't preorder if you feel like this is a bad practice. Not like digital game will run out especially ones owned by nintendo.
@Neocereus That is where piracy comes to the rescue (at least for *_older_* first-party Nintendo video game titles)... You get to have have the fun in playing those video game titles *_without_* giving money to a shady, greedy, money-worshiping company like Nintendo for the figurative thousandth time.
@@fasddfadfgasdgs They aren't. The consumer protection law only works if you can actually try out the product during the window when you can get the refund. This is just exploiting a loophole.
@@StevenVillman No reason they have to be old. As long as you have a first gen Switch, you can pirate. And a proof of concept already exists to hack the second gen or Lite consoles (albeit likely a hardware mod).
So boycott Nintendo?
I've always said this: I like (not love) Nintendo the game makers, but I absolutely HATE Nintendo the company. You have no clue how hard it is being a Nintendo user outside the US, Europe or Japan.
Nintendo is great at making games (most of the time) but they are garbage at almost everything else
owo
Stuffed Animal Wars Any company or corporate has these blunders. Why is any one surprised?
@@mrconroy4672 we're not but we are disappointed.
Robert Siereveld True
Nintendo has really been pissing me off, lately. Constant annoying problems, from NSO, to drift, to Pokémon(not _really_ them but still), this and more. It's just been a LOT more bad than good for a bit of a worryingly long period, now
Agreed, they are looking more and more like EA
@@mr.cheesytoad5845 on Nintendo's worst days, they're still country miles better than ea
@@junglezone7323 I agree, but their getting close to being an ugly corporation
@Monkeyking Xbox and Playstation controllers do not have the drift problems Joy Cons do. And they cost even more money than the Xbox and Playstation controllers too!
@@epicbread1310 to quote Kermit the frog: you are 100% wrong
And that analogy about school was really excellent; I would really enjoy to hear more such touching and illuminating descriptions in your videos to come, I know from your previous videos that you have a great talent for it and for words.
Saying "They're a company, they are supposed to make money" is the equivalent of a D&D player saying "that's what my character would do"
Great analogy.
I was just watching Arlo's video on Donkey Kong Tropical Freeze and him talking about the $60 price being too high and I think this point carries over here
Arlo do you dye your fuzz or is it all natural? This keeps me awake at night.
lets take this case to Australia, Nintendo will revive the vale treatment. (ACCC used vale's ToS against them)
"Nintendo is like a stripper, they only like you as long as they keep giving them money." -Yahtzee Croshaw
Both need to change, of course. "Loyalty" built on convenience is nothing more than pragmatism. You could hardly call it loyalty.
Recently Nintendo’s way of handing money has been quite shocking to be honest. Gacha. Refusal to fix hardware and now this...
I'm pretty sure it's not straight up refusal to fix hardware, but just hardware not being accepted for fixes in some regions, unless I'm missing something.
This why there be terrorist attacks on the rise in the world. Because Nintendo won't refund their money.
@@NitwitsWorld
uh...
*Kyoto flashbacks in 2019?*
@@uncleshrek3614 Pretty much but worse if you get the Chinese mob into this mess.
I don’t think it’s a big deal unless a bigger issue comes out of it. Regardless issues like these coming from a company aren’t new. I rather take Nintendo over ea or activision any day.
"Nintendo is like a really good friend"
I'll never understand when people fight against things like pre order refunds. It's literally people fighting against their best interests for a company that doesn't even know who they are outside of their money. I like Nintendo but, unlike a friend, Nintendo won't be there for me to help me move.
Its common for people to give the benefit of the doubt to things that have been around for a long time, like disney, certain franchises, and of course their "best friends"
Nintendo won't help haul the couch up three flights of stairs.
It's called having principles. Just because something benefits you, doesn't always mean it's the right thing.
Personally, I got a ton of games that looked cool on the e-shop, but were actually shit. It’s so frustrating that I can’t refund those games.
Geogamma do ur research first too
Since Iwata death, Nintendo has become greedier and greedier.
Arlo: “I want a Refund!”
Nintendo: Ok but No.
Thanks for being the way you are Arlo. This is why we love your content.
Me: **preorders game and changes my mind before it plays on the system**
Me: Can I have a refund?
Nintendo: No. You already have the game already
Me: Fukkin turn the game on then.
Steam: 14 days to refund
Xbox: 14 days to refund
Sony: No refunds the moment you download
Nintendo: No refunds... period!
Damn... the Japanese are stingy!
Ryoshikari I’ve been told Sony’s return policy varies on if you downloaded the game. Maybe it’s not all that
"I'll never forgive the Japanese!"
That's Asians for you. I believe they have very high standards when it comes to business, and they're damn serious about their money's worth.
7:28 You fool, you've just decided the fate of Breath of the Wild 2 now
Oh, you.
oh no
Kinda like what Gamefreak did to the new pokemon game lmao
Crashmo! That's the name of that game I've been trying to remember for a week. Thanks, random background footage.
Brad Duke the Pushmo series was a lot of fun.
@@MungkaeX Low key, those games need to be on Switch.
Josiah Ferrell everything needs to be on Switch!
Nintendo & it’s higher ups, including it shareholders, really needs to go through a policy change with digital preorders.
This damages their brand loyalty & reinforces some negativity of Nintendo.
We know Nintendo isn’t as cold as like other company’s & publishers, but to perform so stingy behaviour, with such poor reasoning, on PRE-ORDERS & not just exclusively DLC, it’s pretty damm disappointing ngl.
I do like these type of content!
And is kinda surprising the video had no Splatoon footage this time
That whole thing with steam and redeeming games within 2 hours of playing would be *REALLY* nice for Nintendo to have, because I bought Lego incredibles 2 for $22 on sale digitally, and I hadn’t even beaten the first level when I realized I made a mistake and did not like the game. I was really upset, and honestly I still am. Not sure what I was thinking buying the game. I could have bought Rayman legends, and I should have because I loved origins, but didn’t for some reason.
Logan Sandeen and who’s fucking fault was that
Dominic de Martigny I fully take fault for it, I just wish there was a way to return it within an hour of starting the software
sosa chamberlain I would say that Nintendo is one of the only corporations that care about their fans
That sucks, and is why I switched to physical games.
Arlo, could you do a video about your experiences with the Metroid series, or a ranking of the Metroid games? Just thought it would be interesting.
It would be great to here him talk about Metroid!
federation force sucked, not a metroid fan, defended it when it was announced, regretted getting it. thought it'd be like triforce heroes which i enjoyed but it wasn't really cooperative... actually now that i think about it it's like they took what i liked about triforce heroes and ruined it, you compete against your teammates for gear that breaks if you fail in federation force.
Just wait for the ACCC (Australian) to go after them. They got Steam to give refunds.
Based commie
That eshop commercial you had in the background made me so nostalgic.
0:29 What were you making there, bud? /:
I have so many memories of that game. I have nostalgia for a 3DS game. A 3DS game.
But legally, Nintendo is in the right, I've studied contract law for my Business Degree. Its still anti consumer and pretty scummy. Being technically correct isn't the same thing as being morally correct.
In this case, being morally right would tend to sway people in a more favourable attitude towards companies that are pro consumer.
In short, they're legally right, but from a "good business practices" it's completely stupid.
I just want to say, I really enjoy these off the cuff videos. OuO
what is the name of the song thats playing in (at-least) the earlier parts of the video?, it kinda sounds like it is from pokemon mystery dungeon
Every time Nintendo does something very shady, It freaks me out. I have always seen Nintendo as one of the last good guys in an a time when live services are everything, but especially with the switch, they have been scaring me. When DKC: Tropical Freeze released on the switch, they silently pulled it from the Wii U Eshop. Their mobile ventures are getting more and more predatory with Mario Kart Tour having Loot Boxes and Animal Crossing: Pocket Camp having multiple subscription services. Nintendo seems to be reluctant to do anything about the drift on the joy-cons. After 2 years of free online we have to pay for it and this wouldn't be an issue if the online was actually good but It's still as problematic as the 2 years it was free. And finally with Pokemon Sword and Shield and that whole controversy about the national dex and the latest update bringing back old Pokemon when they said it would be too difficult (I know it may not be Nintendo really doing it but it's still not a good look). All of this shady stuff scares me because I've been a Nintendo Fan for as long as I can remember and I don't want to see them go down a dark path. I feel that they are one of the last heroes of gaming and it would be a very sad day for me if they finally caved in and started making live service games similar to EA and Activision.
I highly doubt Nintendo has any control over Game Freak or the Pokemons Company, from what I've read they only have exclusive publishing rights.
So if people wanna complain to someone it should be Game Freak or the Pokemon Company.
The other problems tho are Nintendo's doing.
Their refund policy is garbage and anti-consumer.
Drifting in a 70$+ controller after just a few weeks of use is unacceptable. A lot of my controllers i had for years have no drifting issues.
Games pulled off other digital stores is kinda shady.
I genuinely don't like lootboxes and subscription services that give zero value back.
And the online is still garbage and they have done nothing to improve it, and it's been years.
I would respect Nintendo more if they fixed all of that stuff.
The Pokémon thing makes sense at the very least. GameFreak was tasked with building a brand new revolutionary Pokémon game for new, more powerful hardware within the span of less than a year. They had to make a sacrifice somewhere. Adding the Pokémon to the dlc was maybe a bit much, but it’s not like they’re inaccessible without paying since online trading exists. It sucks and it shouldn’t have happened the way it did, but neither GameFreak or Nintendo are really at fault here, since it was mostly Pokémon’s annual release schedule that caused it. Everything else sucks though, and Nintendo should be held accountable.
Well Nintendo does own shares in Pokemon Comany, which Gamefreak is also apart of. Yeah perhaps they had to meet a deadline, but who is to say Nintendo had absolutely no control other than constant speculation by fans who simply want to believe there precious Nintendo had nothing to do with it? How about we admit we don't know instead of wild speculation based off this wish that "Nintendo isn't like that". Then actually find out with hard evidence rather than assuming the "best" in this attempt to not hurt this apparent fragile world view that Nintendo is on our side?
@@tripkings547 I do wonder how much influence Nintendo has over the Pokemon IP, but whether they had something to do with Sword & Shield's incomplete release is yet to be known.
But there are rumors that the team at Gamefreak was devided into 2 projects, which were a game noone really played and Pokemon S&S.
So people and resources were taken away from Pokemon S&S for Gamefreak's other project. Which would be infuriating if it actually happened. There are also rumors that the devs at Gamefreak are tired of making Pokemon games, I would like another team to get to make Pokemon games, but that ain't happening.
There are reports that the coding for the game is not well optimized and the lies about having to "remake models from scratch" and that they "cut Pokemon for balancing issues " were straight hypocritical. The models are basically the same and the Pokemon expansion will include previous Legendaries, did they suddenly figure out how to balance the game?
I still dislike Nintendo's anti-consumer practices.
Also the Wii U online is free and better
There should be a policy where once you buy it, you can refund it within a few hours or days
Dylan _EXE speed runners would speed run a game and then refund their purchases? Just a unlogical thought.
so get a game, play it for 24 hours straight be done with it and return. oh what a great idea that is. many games nowadays can be played through within a day or 2 if you are really going fo it,
@@FirebladeXXL i get it
"No take-sies backsies!" ... That's exactly what happened to me with links awakening. I didn't know they were going to release a version of the game with a art book attached when I pre-ordered. I tried to fix it but oh well....
Can someone please tell me the name of the tropical freeze song Arlo had playing at the second half of this video?for the life of me I want to listen to it so bad
Arlo should become the CEO of Nintendo
The world’s first muppet CEO!
Pretty sure Gonzo was the CEO of some big oil company in the 2013 Muppets movie. Arlo would be the second Muppet CEO then.
You know you’re a fanboy when you start seeing a corporation as your friend.
Totally not because they've been sticking to good things that companies should do and not screwing over their customers for like the past 5 years like every other gaming company. This is sarcasm btw.
Also, metaphor, look it up.
It was a metaphor.
It was a metaphor tho? And assuming a company is consumer friendly because they have good history of being so and then the company doing stuff like this is by all means surprising
I assume you guys overlook the mobile games.
Your take on company policy and practices is refreshing to hear. Wish more people could make such a clear connection.
Nintendo: When you purchase one of our games, you keep it!
(In an ominous voice)
Whether you like to or not...
This news is on top of the Two Year anniversary of Nintendo removing the review feature from there eShop
In the video, do you mean Costco, not Walmart? I’ve tried returning things to Walmart, but they are super strict about enforcing its lame policy while Costco I can return things at any time for any valid reason.
Costco doesn't even sell games though.
@@BJGvideos do they though?i remeber them selling dvds
BJGvideos Huh. Really? Must be a new policy, since they have yet to tell their website...
www.costco.com/nintendo.html
"I happen to agree with Germany"
-Arlo
Oh.... oh no
".... and Norway"
@@PeruvianPotato
Germany and norway didmt get along very well...
Arlo , I just got to say, I love your analogies. :)
When you gonna upload that Luigi’s Mansion 3 review?
I agree it's strange why he never reviewed it. Probably has to do with the fact it will probably line up with The Bitblock and GameXplain's similar viewpoints with it not being good as the original
Segun The PikachuFan I hate the idea of comparing games to their previous installments. It’s so much better in my perspective to let the game stand out on its own.
@@segunthepikachufan1470 I highly doubt he'll make a negative review on the game, considering in one of his videos, he stated that he really loves Luigi's Mansion 3 & said that it was one of his favorite games of 2019. He doesn't hate the game like TheBitBlock does nor is he have mixed feelings towards the game like Andre does. He did however stated that he still prefers the first Luigi's Mansion game more, but at the same time, he said he still loves LM3 alot & said that LM3 felt like a spiritual sequel to the first game than Dark Moon did. Something that I completely agree with. LM3 is SOO much better than Dark Moon in everyway.
@@segunthepikachufan1470 the bit block has never bought or played the game, so his viewpoint does not count at all. Besides, he's a big fat crybaby who bawls in his youtube community tab whenever Nintendo doesnt make all their games cater to his extremely narrow and shitty taste.
What is the game at 0:30? I remember playing it such a long time ago but I don’t specifically remember the title
I've always loved Arlo's analogies
I'm split on this whole, I can understand why for both cases. Personally, I'm a physical copy person. So, it won't effect me either way.
I'm split on this as well. On the one hand, I understand why customers _think_ they want a refund policy, as they're used to dealing with physical goods. On the other hand, the digital nature of the goods, and the fact that Nintendo rarely has sales, means that customers don't get any utility out of purchasing digital goods before they are ready to play them. As such, there's not actually any reason for Nintendo to even bother with a refund policy. If there is a legitimate issue with a purchase, the customer can contact support.
Arlo: “making money at all costs should NOT be the goal”
Certain AAA game publishers: **chuckles and lights their cigars with 100 dollar bills**
Perfect example of this. I have been having a huge issue with play asia for a while now. Not only did I not receive one of my packages from them, and all they did for 2 weeks was tell me to check the post office, check with customs. Its been missing for a month and I still havnt gotten my refund. I have to wait for them to verify its lost till they refund me. And I want to return a game I bought because if I dont let it access my personal information, I cant play it. Been going back and forth in the emails because they refuse to take it back, because its used. Once I get my refund Im telling them to close my account. Was losing a customer worth the 70 bucks I paid for the game?
Arlo, what are your thoughts on the metroid and paper mario rumors going around right now?
Hey Arlo, what do you think about the paper Mario rumors. Do you believe them? I really want to hear your take on it.