The History of King Dedede: Self-Proclaimed to Self-Made
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 มิ.ย. 2024
- I've done a few videos on the lore of the Kirby series--as promised, here's one on King Dedede, and his growth from a "self-proclaimed king" to a "self-made king."
CHAPTERS
00:00 Preamble
00:33 Early Kirby (Dream Land-Kirby 64)
03:17 The 2000s (Squeak Squad)
03:50 The Subspace Emissary (Super Smash Bros. Brawl)
06:02 Revenge of the King (Kirby Super Star Ultra)
10:57 The Modern Era (Return to Dream Land-Star Allies)
13:10 Dedede and Meta Knight (Kirby Fighters 2)
14:44 Forgo Dedede (The Forgotten Land)
16:24 The "Self-Made King"
20:12 Closing Thoughts
25:44 Outro
GAMEPLAY FOOTAGE SOURCES
Kirby's Adventure: Kusa9
Dream Land 2: clawlightning
Dream Land 3: dakirbydude
Nightmare in Dream Land: BossBattleChannel
Super Star Ultra: RetroArchive
Triple Deluxe: YTSunny
Planet Robobot: Zephiel810, YTSunny
Blowout Blast: Mephilia
Star Allies: BossBattleChannel
Kirby Fighters 2: Boss Fight Database, YTSunny
The Forgotten Land: MonkeyKingHero - เกม
I think your idea of dedede not being a king by the definition is a little flawed, to be a king one must first conquer a country, there is always a first of lineage who was the original to gain control over their land, dedede is an example of this, I think self proclaimed implies he does no actual “ruling” early in the series but rather claims to be in charge because he is the strongest fighter and few others could challenge him as its fairly reasonable to think his takeover was entirely forceful rather than political. Whilst later he does become someone who works to aid his people and lead them properly, changing from a merely “proclaimed” king to an actual functional one, thus gaining the title of “self made”
Basically Right of Conquest over God Given Right
Yea that is what I think they were going for.
So basically more like the definition of dictator (not actually acts like irl ones in the series) that an actual monarch.
Because if I remember correctly, a monarch is a ruler who was originally chosen by the people to have absolute authority cus they believe they’re powerful, or is the descendant of one of said situation. A dictator on the over hand is someone or a group who takes control by force with the masses having no say on it.
@@catvanbrian9470 yes, as such he is labeled a self proclaimed “king”, being not a ruler but a bully and a tyrant. The most accurate example that comes to mind to compare is the character king knight from the shovel knight series. Though eventually through his actions and the waddle dee’s loyalty to him, he did become a person who was honestly revered by his people and became someone who served his people, thereby becoming self made and an actual “king” when the people began to believe in him.
"When you multiply by Kirby even Zero leaves the equation"
Okay that's clever
I think there's a big part you missed when you were discussing self- made King. Is thar he's was also called something else, self-proclaimed King. King Dedede was King in the first game because he was strong, a social darwinists. He basically could force anyone to do whatever he wanted because of his strength. However Kirby took that away when he beat him in the first game. I think looking into revenge of the king you actually see the moment when he became the self-made King. He tried desperately to prove his strength and feel like he was a king again but failed. He ddi not have the strength to beat Kirby, and on that moment felt like he did not deserve to be king but then the waddle Dees come to comfort him. They did not care that he was weak compared to Kirby. To them he was there King and that's the moment he became a self-made King.
An authoritarian to an elected and respected individual.
This is how I always imagined it
pretty sure "King" here is used not to refer necessary to a monarch, but more of what we call "a chad", "the alpha male", "the dude with the biggest dong", "the champion", etc. The Waddle Dees consider Dedede their leader for... reasons, and they like him for his goofy attitude and him being laid back most of the time, and Dedede likes his "subjects" because of them being in a long time relationship of mutual respect and comraderism with him. In Epic Yarn (not the most character-consistent game in the series I know), Dedede gets upset when Yin-Yarn starts replacing the Waddle Dees with yarn dopplegangers, and he gets upset because "only I can be mean to my Waddle Dees", which imo perfectly summarizes what kind of "King" Dedede is: in other words, he's the older brother to the Waddle Dees, their "Aniki", the cool kid they like to hang out in school who often plays pranks on them
DEDEDE HAS THE BIGGEST DONG OF THEM ALL.
i don't really like what you are implying with dedede as the alpha...
*a-are the waddle dees his soldier-concubines?..*
@@BobbinRobbin777 NO!? It just means he rules them by being the biggest and strongest of them as well as being protective of them. Alpha, omega, beta ect, as a sexual term is purely a modern thing that didn't exist a couple decades ago
@@jimvoozhenzhan8435 absolutely correct! the modern version just corrupted the entire term for me...
thank god.
The thing people always forget is that a royal family HAD to start with SOMEONE.
Someone had to declare themselves as the first king in a line and then earn that position through genuine authority. Their children who inherit that title don't necessarily have to have all the same qualities that created the title in the first place, they're self proclaimed, unlike their original forefather, who was self made. That's the true problem with royal lines, the vast majority of then people given the title of king never earned it, they were simply born into it, but it's always possible for someone to actually deserve the respect that the title carries, making it a genuine title rather than the imposed farce we're all familiar with.
This is what the transition between "self proclaimed" to "self made" actually means for Dedede, he was originally a monarch in name only, either through the pure nepotism of royal lines if he did inherit the title from a hypothetical predecessor, or because he simply showed up and insisted people think of him as the king of Dream Land, but over the course of the series he earns the authority and virtue that gives the title of "King" actual value.
Dedede Originally gained his power via Right of Conquest.
Dedede isn’t going to have kids. He’s the only Penguin on pop star so him being a Heretical Monarch is a kinda silly example to bring up.
On a fundamental level he is a guy with power and the waddle dees have surrounded him because he is powerful and they respect him.
Dedede to me can be compared to Issac from Castlevania at the end of his arc. He rules because he wants to teach people
Dedede rules because he’s strong and he wants to protect people
Aren't there little snowball-rolling penguins in some games? (I think it was Dreamland 3, but i might be wrong)
@@syweb2 there might be but I think they are enemies on Shiverstar. That is a frozen planet with one moon i belive
@@johnwhittington2998 no the penguins appear in Planet pop star, in dream land 3, and in the forgotten world
“My jokingly calling meta knight a neoliberal” what have i walked into
I really love your little dissection of Kirby in the RotK portion. I always find it funny how in a world filled with deities beyond belief, ancient artifacts that go back centuries and pieces of lore that can twist your mind, the one who knows the least about it is the one interacts the most with it. Someone could spoon feed him the plot and Kirby probably still would just sit there staring blankly since he's such a simple minded creature. He saves worlds and galaxies without while being unaware of almost everything going on. The only things on Kirby's mind are eat sleep and friendship and I find about as fascinating as I find it adorable.
All Kirby needs to know is that there are people who are sad and need friends and he is shaped like a friend.
Okay my actually comment for the my video. I’m happy you made this video and I am satisfied especially because by the end it goes into a whole different can of worms and questions like what always happens by the end of your videos.
I do think in the Kirby series titles like “King” and “Knight” represent more general concepts of Honor and Power rather than what they exactly mean in the real world. Although Queen Sectonia seems to possibly gotten her title because of hereditary rule due to the Robobot description of Sectonia Clone.
Regardless what I like about Dedede is that he earned his status through respect and kindness overtime. It shows a shift by self proclaimed meaning that he probably got that respect in the first place maybe through bullying and fear; then transformed that into respect due to his altruism and kindness to look after others and to protect his home from harm. It’s a common theme in the Kirby series that the characters that become Kirby’s friends always do something altruistic to help by the end of the game by putting themselves on the front lines and helping Kirby win the final battle. For Dedede this is seen in multiple games (64 and Return to Dreamland) However is most clearly seen in Triple Deluxe. He earns his respect by helping Kirby defeat Sectonia by going on the front lines and knocking Kirby from Sectonia’s grasp. This shifts him from a character that is respected out of authority and fear to a character respected out of his willingness to help the ones below him in life.
Thank you for reading my long comment about Dedede. I really like him and while his story is simple compared to many other series I like, it’s one about a character that is over 30 years old and it shows how the Kirby team at HAL isn’t afraid to do something different with a well beloved character.
Also congratulations for getting 100 views within the first hour. Your channel is steadily growing and I’m happy for that.
i'm glad you liked it! a big part of why i wanted to make this a separate video was that i found myself getting really invested in the subject lol. imo his progressing altruism makes him the most compelling/interesting character in the series by a mile
you're probably right about the titles. i still can't stop myself from wondering how the fictional applications of titles like 'king' might reflect certain biases--ie, what is the root behind the idea that someone can "deserve to be a king"?, etc.
i did consider talking about dedede helping kirby in triple deluxe, but i was trying to keep that segment of the video short. it probably cwouldnt have hurt to mention it regardless though. oh well~
and thank you for the congratulations! i noticed that this video's gotten views faster than any of my videos ever has... mind boggling lol!
@@indigo_f I am thinking a lot more about how the terms King and Queen are used today.
I see people referring to others as “King” and “Queen” as positive traits. Like “yes king” and “let’s go queen”.
This is seen even in elected events such as for prom. People vote for Prom King and Queen despite that being the furthest thing from monarchy.
I think people today forget that monarchy is a dictatorship that the power is passed down hereditary instead of the “rightful ruler” as it is seen as today.
It’s an interesting thought and I guess that is the takeway for the video for me.
Also just another shout out to you. This channel has become one of my favorites and your videos either make me think harder about subjects I thought I understood or new topics I never considered. So thank you.
I think the idea of canon is more connected to how the story and characters of a series will be portrayed in the future, than which one is real within that universe. Like for your void example, it doesn't matter if void is or is not dark matter, because none of it is real to begin with. However, moving forward in the series, I'm willing to bet that void will be treated as dark matter, and that's the important part.
Dedede has had at LEAST 6 hammers over the series.
Dedede going feral is the funniest thing in Forgotten Land
i love that man regardless of who he is. he's just a cool sexy penguin
I get a 26 minute video. Awesome and will make a more in-depth video later.
I love Dedede. I hold him as my favourite character. I know there are better, more fleshed out, nuanced characters out that probably objectively beat Dedede by a mile but I personally enjoy this subtle growth in character. From this greedy, selfish monarch to someone who does the right thing but for his own selfish reasons or in a way that only half fixes things now to this good person who gets his followers through respect and when he's evil, it's not even him (I swear they just keep possessing him so they have an excuse to remix his theme and somehow make it better than the last.) It's not ground breaking, but it's there if you look hard enough past the surface and I really like that sense of subtle and simple yet sort of deep typeof thing. Great video. Really brought up a lot of interesting points I haven't heard talked about just like your other Kirby videos.
I think a lot of the Kirby Fanon comes from the anime, and Dedede is very characterized in the anime
Very true. This is why people can’t understand the true version of Dedede, and not a weird clone named Dan.
This video is so weird to me
Like, you are perfectly able to grasp the fairy-tale inspirations in Triple Deluxe with a Queen corrupted by greed and vanity through a cursed mirror, and the beanstalk reaching into the clouds, but then you take the meaning of "King" in the most literal way possible when in fantasy settings it doesn't follow the "leadership passed down by heritage" trait of monarchy, more often than not, hell even the tale of King Arthur doesn't follow this, "King" is just used to describe someone worthy of being a leader, the alpha male, the top dog, Etc.
For a better example of what I'm trying to say, Meta-Knight, if we follow your conclusion, should be serving under someone because he has Knight in his title, despite the fact that he operates under his own agency, and it's a leader of his own.
A self-proclaimed King is someone who claims to be worthy of leadership, a self-made king is someone who, trough self-reflection and self improvement has become worthy of leadership
7:11 i fUCKIN LOVE YOUR VIDEOS THEY'RE SO GODDAMN GOOD
the when you multiply by kirby even zero leaves the equation bit is a great line i love it so much
Tbh my headcanon is that dedede told every waddle dee he was the king and they played along because why not
I read from a comment somewhere that a good way to tell if Dedede is possessed, is if he abandons his hammer at any point in the fight.
That is some characterization right there.
Not in a weird way but guys I think I'm in love with Dedede
Yea, most kirby villains fallow this trend:
Evil->Beat up->Friend
i feel that one of the most interesting parts of dedede's portrayal in katfl is that he seems to actually remember what he did when he was possessed this time? when you talk the waddle dee he saved, the dee keeps being like "hey we love our great king hes so kind also he feels very bad about what he did. can you please give him some space to recover?" as opposed to the other 50 times he got possessed wherein he didnt seem to react all that much and just kept getting possessed again and again and again. contrast this with meta knight, whom could not be possessed by [insert katfl spoilers here lol] due to his sheer force of will. this, to me anyway, implies that due to not being able to really see the consequences of what happens when he's possessed, dedede kinda became complacent with his whole situation and was unable to care as much as he should. it feels like because he was conscious for his possession stunt in forgotten land and actually feels bad, he'll have the force of will to resist from now on.
in regards to whether dedede is a "self-made king": i'm also pretty ambivalent?? but i'm leaning more towards the title "king" in kirby not meaning a hereditary title but rather just an honorful leader and therefore yeah sure why not his citizens respect him and all that. but also, if that is the case, should the title "king" even be portrayed that way? like, if we accept the premise that being a monarch is fine in the kirby world, why should it be that way? what did the devs intend to communicate when they made dedede a benevolent and "deserving" king? what are they communicating about monarchs regardless of their intentions? what do the kids who are playing the game think about the premise of a "self-made king"? obviously i'm not claiming that a kirby game of all things is gonna like, implant monarchism into little kids' brains or anything just because of the funny penguin nor do i even think the devs thought that hard about it. but i don't know. it's interesting. awesome video again btw!! ^__^
I didn't expect you to talk about the concept of canon in video games but it was interesting.
I just like to believe dedede claimed he was a king at first, that made him the self proclaimed king but he then earned his title
Your other Kirby videos made me want to play Dedede in Smash
and then I got destroyed because I have no clue what I'm doing and then haven't played him since
You mean Dededestroyed?
@@geschnitztekiste4111 I did, in fact. Thank you for the correction.
@@charl2182 the secret to playing Dedede is to meme on your opponents. Your moveset is surprisingly chaotic if you know how to use it. Trap enemies at ledges, and play mind games with your enemy.
Also, use the down special. You get super armor during the swing, and you can bait out counters or suddenly jump with it.
Play with your foes, become a goofball, and then beat their asses into the ground with your insane air moves. Nair to get an opening in lightning time (it's your down tilt but in the air, basically), fair to launch people towards killboxes. Up air for your multihit, bair for a kill, and dair for a slow but valuable hut that can spike.
Let me know if this helps.
@@15stargamer98 I feel bad that you typed out all that um because it wasn't really that big of a deal but thanks, and I will keep that in mind.
@@charl2182 nah, dw about it. It's always fun to see a person trying dedede out for the first time
0:57 I think your MK one was just shocking enough that it dislodged any thoughts relating to Dedede.
1:36 It looks more like he's _about_ to explain himself, but Kirby runs off before he can.
3:05 This is Peak Kirby, and you can't convince me otherwise.
Dang, those closing thoughts were a rollercoaster of emotion.
I think it depends on the viewer. If there's multiple authors, we should be able to pick and choose what we interpret as canon, headcanons included. If that means giving Dedede the mannerisms of, as much I loathe to give refer to that character with the same name, the anime version of Dedede, then so be it.
Ah, finally a video on the SUPERSTAH WARRIAH. Great work on this one! Hope you cover more Kirby characters in the future!
I think in the context of Kirby, self-proclaimed and self-made are basically synonyms.
If anything, self-made might indicate that while he once merely proclaimed himself as king, now he's actually recognized as such.
Following Kirby's Dream Land, Dedede was never really seen as a bad guy. He fights and inconveniences Kirby in numerous side games, but he isn't really doing anything bad or evil.
My personal theory about why Dedede stole the food in KDL, is because he was asserting his kingship. He had proclaimed himself to be king, and everyone just kinda accepted it, but he realized that he doesn't have any power or control. He gets kinda selfish and steals all the food so he can feel like he's in control of his kingdom. People throughout dreamland follow him out of fear, but Dedede ends up getting defeated in the end. This started Dedede's grudge against Kirby, and made him realize that he doesn't need to have forced control over his people to be a true king. This is reflected in Kirby's Adventure, where instead of asserting himself over everyone, he does what he think is right. In the end, Dedede's solution was flawed, but we know his heart was in the right place. Perhaps withholding his reasoning for doing things is part of how he feels in control. He doesn't need to explain himself, because he's the king, and the king is always right.
By Revenge of Dedede, we can see that his following is much more loyal now. Dedede is now seen as a king not just because he proclaimed he was, but because he's strong and dedicated to his people.
I love your Kirby videos! I have no idea what you're saying sometimes, but that just makes them even better!
that ending bit of putting the Dededes on a political chart was hilarious
How the fuck is berni lib right tho?
@@quedtion_marks_kirby_modding Why are you asking me...I didn't even notice him on said chart
Okay originally I was going to make this my big comment for the video but I will make that into a separate one.
Nice Metal Gear 2 reference 9:51
All I know is that he's gonna clobba dat dere kirbeh!
I am genuinely surprised by how in depth this video is on the Kirby lore, it’s views, it’s ideals, so much that makes my brain go into mush trying to comprehend it all. I can’t believe you don’t have more subscribers, you totally deserve it lad. Keep up the amazing work!
I'm so happy someone other than me directly mentioned that Kirby went out of his way to attack Dedede in Squeak Squad, personally I think that's the reason Revenge of the King happened in Super Star Ultra
I Don't know if you'll do more Kirby Lore Videos, I mean after three banger Kirby Lore Videos I expect you'd be exhausted but since this is kinda relevant to the topic about cannon at the end, what do you think the timeline is for the Kirby Games? Since we all have different definitions of what's cannon for the Kirby Games I'd be interested to see your take. Thanks for making wonderful Kirby Lore Videos!
I love your Kirby videos so fucking much it's crazy.
6:58 wait a minute
6:56 "kirby has a lot in common with goku"
pulls up a picture of Sasuke
I'm pretty sure the 'Self-Proclaimed' tag line pretty much out right states that Dedede was not a King by hereditary lines. He literally just showed up one day say "I'm King" and the Waddle Dees followed him because of his Charisma and or Strength and the 'Self-Proclaimed' bit basically means his actual authority outside of his castle is dodgy at best. I don't think King Dedede has any sort of political power, if anything the original game showed that the moment he actually tried to impose his will on Popstar (stealing all the food probably was a 'tax' he came up with) he gets his shit pushed in by Kirby. 'Self-Made' line is basically implying that now King Dedede actually is starting to take the responsibility of being a king more seriously (at least with his Waddle Dees) I don't think it's a 'bootstraps pulling' moment: EVERY Royal Lineage was started by a self-made warlord or chieftain proclaiming their power and people going along with it due to their political/military might.
YES!! Hi Indigo
You forgot the scene with Dedede and Kirby before the fight against Tabuu in Brawl. As soon as Dedede sees Kirby he throws himself at him and hugs him, super happy to see the puffball! that is, even in that game he shows that he cares about Kirby to the point of hugging him!
Alright you've earned yourself a sub for making an impressive and thought provoking video analyzing a Nintendo character who, until now, was my favorite only because he was the big silly penguin with a hammer. I look forward to future content.
Some minimal subspace trio love and an out of nowhere deconstruction of the sociopolitical factors behind the term 'self-made'
Love this channel, instantly subscribed
Coming back to this again, it may be worth considering watching Designing For's video on King Dedede, "Designing for Kindness". I'm curious what your thoughts on it might be.
At this point Dedede is just has a fetish of being controlled, micro-managed, scrutinized & completely possessed by every cosmic horror.
Dedede picking up a halberd has layers of puns and I appreciate it.
I saw the mask as a sort of way of saying “I’ve accounted for my weaknesses” because then he can’t get hit in the face.
The reason Dedede was a "self-proclaimed king" back then was because he basically waltzed up and said "I'm in charge, deal with it".
He's definitely grown past that.
"It's not gonna be that long of a video" -> proceeds to make it longer than the original video and almost as long as the follow-up
I kind of got the sense that early on in the series, Dedede was King in name only and no one outside of the Waddle Dees and maybe a handful of others actually took him seriously as the ruler of Dreamland, so in this way one might assume that at this point the people of Dreamland in general are starting to take him seriously as a king.
"The fifth ace attorney game is decidedly worse than the first four" oh my god I was already loving your videos and you're BASED TOO
In regards of canon
I agree
I accept whatever canon I like and that makes sense
I don’t think that going deep into the idea of a “neoliberal lie of a self made man” was all that necessary here. It injected a layer of spite towards specific individuals out here in the real world that kind of distracted from the main point of the question rather than supplemented it to any degree, in my own opinion anyway. I think topics like those have merit elsewhere, but not here.
For the record, I do at least agree that there is an undue amount of victim blaming in the “self made man” theology of sorts, but people that actually did succeed by merit and merit alone actually do exist out there. Not everyone can do something like that and that’s fine. Some people have luck and fortune on their side and some don’t; some people succeed in life and some don’t. It may not be true that you never NEED fortune to succeed, but success without fortune can and does happen. Again, though, I must stress that this is all accessorial and/or tangential to the topic at hand.
So, on another note, “king” doesn’t necessarily have to mean “heir”. A king is just a decidedly autocratic ruler of some kind, doesn’t necessarily matter how it happened. In fact, I remember a book series that put it quite nicely and in a way that I think is topical to the triple D over here.
Becoming a king is an easy two step process:
1. Declare yourself king.
2. *Get everyone to agree.*
The only thing that makes an heir special is that they’ve completed step two without even having to have thought about it. Every other king (of one sort or another) would naturally have had to get such through conquest or charisma or some combination of the two, which is exactly what they did. And, by extension, the only thing separating a king from other manners of ruler is the declaration. If someone gets to a seat of power by some kind of democracy, they are not a king because naturally, they either lack the nigh autocracy of a king or they didn’t complete step 1. Kingship is, in a way, defined by the declaration.
In this sense, King Dedede of early series has completed step 1 and hasn’t really gotten far into step 2, making “self proclaimed” more apt. Meanwhile, nowadays, with the loyal following he has and the adoration he’s garnered, the two step program is completely completed, rendering him “self made”.
Lastly though, I do like your point about what canonicity “means”. I don’t think that canonicity is defined solely by copyright as much as by some form of common consensus, but nevertheless it is interesting to wonder about changing authors and companies and things all the same. PS I actually thought Dual Destinies was pretty good in spite of its strange relationship with the rest of the series, and I don’t think it’s fair to call all those girls “the same character” when I feel like “upbeat genki girl maybe with a boohoo backstory of some kind” is still a wide umbrella.
All in all a great analysis video, albeit turning a bit overly existential and political in the latter part there, and I’ll definitely consider checking your other stuff out!
The thing people always forget is that a royal family HAD to start with SOMEONE.
Someone had to declare themselves as the first king in a line and then earn that position through genuine authority. Their children who inherit that title don't necessarily have to have all the same qualities that created the title in the first place, they're self proclaimed, unlike their original forefather, who was self made.
This is what the transition between "self proclaimed" to "self made" actually means for Dedede, he was originally a monarch in name only, either through the pure nepotism of royal lines if he did inherit the title from a hypothetical predecessor, or because he simply showed up and insisted people think of him as the king of Dream Land, but over the course of the series he earns the authority and virtue that gives the title of "King" actual value.
You guys have said the thing I wanted to say
23:17 Hold It! (I remember that line)
I'd be cool with living under a monarchy if Dedede was leading it. He might as well be his own military, and he was already shown to have more humanity than most politicians.
How is King Dedede so wealthy? I'm curious for the answer but cannot find any information online or perhaps I'm too lazy to read each link. In the anime provided "Kirby: Right Back At Yah," Dedede owes an evil trading organization about $50 milliom Dedede(Dollars). As "they" opened the vault, various coin pouches filled the vault almost to the brim. And the debt collector only took one pouch to compensate roughly $38+ million Dedede from their online purchases
"Certain people"
DRAWCIA
here for it
I think the way kirby games generally represents the term "king" is more in a general leader and ruler sense where its not actually a king by real world standards but instead just a way to get across that this person is the "boss/leader" as well as a way to add a bit of a visual florish as opposed to mario or zelda where theyre ACTUAL monarchies. I get that impression from other characters like sectonia and magalor, like magalor is basically a king in the sense that hes literally a powerful dude wearing a crown but like other than that he really isnt a king/monarchy honestly and we dont really see sectonia be very queenlike outside of just the general aestetics of royalty like a crown and castle and the fact shes a leader. I dont think any of these royalties even have families we know of for the most part which is a big defining part of royalty.
The royal titles are way less explicit to what they actually mean in real life vs say what haltman is to something like a capitalistic man for a comparison. Halfman is VERY explicitly taking concepts and using them for what he's meant to represent. Even the anime kinda makes fun of how not king like dedede is with how it just implies hes a guy that showed up and started calling himself a king. I assume they just do this because its easy to show "how they gave this person a crown there for they're a leader" in the same way calling metaknight "knight" mainly just implies "honor bound swordsman" as opposed to an actual knight.
That horror movie video is about the recent Halloween sequels isn’t it?
good guess! it's not, but you're pretty close
I love how you went into the weeds in how some fans can just outright reject elements of canon that they don't feel work with the rest of it. Subjective art consumption, we love it! Incidentally, we agree on Battle Royale being so superfluous as to not be canon.
THE POLITICAL COMPASS MEME IS BACK FUCK YESSSSS
I’m actually really interested in your discussion on how much a character’s personal arc can be defined or even properly exist on a meta level in a series that gets passed through multiple development heads. I would argue that Dedede’s development is something you actually can consider at least akin to a character arc given that its progression wasn’t without precedent under his own original creator. Sakurai depicted Dedede as a bully-dictator in _Kirby’s Dream Land_ only to make him the well-intentioned center of a plot twist in _Kirby’s Adventure._ You make a point of Dedede not trying to explain himself, and while I don’t disagree (I mean Meta Knight has this same problem, it got his airship assimilated by power-copying robot armor when he supposedly was _trying_ to just offer Kirby a ride for one thing), I do think it’s worth noting that the manual also says that Kirby ran off before Dedede could finish his sentence. I don’t mean this as a jab at Kirby, though. At this point, Kirby hasn’t been given any reason to think this wasn’t just more of Dedede being a dick, and Triple-D certainly didn’t make a very good case for himself by using the Fountain of Dreams as a swimming pool. That thing’s basically Dream Land’s sacred waters, dude.
But it was definitely a major, yet not unbelievable, shift due to how it was presented. Taking everyone’s food is one thing; letting everyone in a generally happy land with a big cultural emphasis on sleep suffer from horrible nightmares is another, but the guy realized this and evidently thought that not having dreams at all would be preferable to having bad ones. But because he was antagonistic about it, we don’t get to know that he was actually trying to do something good until _after_ Kirby finds out the hard way what the real problem is, and in the end, Kirby does acknowledge that he wasn’t trying to be mean this time, and in fact was trying to protect everyone. Under Sakurai alone, the king already managed to have some good Dededevelopment. And, like you mentioned, this development is referenced almost wholesale the next time Sakurai has his hands on the character’s role in a story, i.e., in the Subspace Emissary. (I consider Dedede’s story presence in _Super Star_ a bit more negligible given he’s originally only in the abridged remake of _Kirby’s Dream Land_ and the racing subgame, so his relationship with Kirby is more like a rivalry than anything else now, and it’s kinda come back there again in modern _Kirby.)_ There’s not really anything I can say about Dedede in _Brawl_ that you didn’t already say, but if nothing else, Dedede’s progression from bully to someone who actually cares somewhat was definitely intended even in his early days. Later directors and other developers expanding on that little by little helps flesh it out and make it feel more genuine imo
But back to the point of how a series develops when it’s passed through multiple developers, things like this are why I’d like to examine _Kirby_ lore myself if I had proper recording and editing equipment. When you step away from the fictional ’verse and look at the patterns of behind-the-scenes development of the games themselves, there are definite shifts from director to director. Masahiro Sakurai gave the world a fun, storybook-like few games specifically designed to be approachable for anyone. Shinichi Shimomura, director of the “Dark Matter Trilogy,” went “I have an idea!” and used the same story for three games with slight cast expansions and different systems being the main distinguishing factors between them (not to say any of them are necessarily bad games), in the process solidifying the series’ precedent for possessed Dedede and eldritch final bosses. Flagship and co. just had a bunch of game ideas with stories that really truly *don’t* go that deep, and Shinya Kumazaki might as well have pinned all of the previous _Kirby_ games to a cork board and is constantly figuring out where the strings connect and adding sticky notes of backstories for his own OCs.
He’s still trying to figure out a good spot to actually put Nightmare.
*EDIT:* also “sacrifice Dedede for Lent” I am CACKLING 🤣
hey indigo this entire ending about continuous fictions makes me think you'd love homestuck or at the very least what homestuck and it's continuations try to say about canon and continuity
there's some not great elements in the story itself that need to be viewed critically but like everything you mentioned is touched on in at least some "post-canon" works
also if you do read it use the unofficial homestuck collection you can download the website is breaking apart now
homestuck recommendation aside i love your work and your kirby videos are absolutely wonderful from an actual thematic analysis of the series and i think even when you think you're overanalyzing there's worth to be found in what you're talking about
Just subscribed to you and I ain't regretting it! Solid content in your whole catalouge.
7:47 I think there might be an error here...
Kirby Air Ride doubts that he's a real king fyi
"King Dedede on a bike. Is he really a king?"
Amazing video!
I personally love AA5 personally but iryo, I feel Athena is one of the more unique assistants as her story is extremely different to other assistants.
Also I would've liked you to talk about Dedede helping out against Sectonia, since while Dedede isn't the hero of the lower land Sectonia wouldn't have been beaten, so he deserves to be a king imo (in universe)
turnabout tommorow is personally one of my favorite cases in the history of ace attorney
@@Someone_adachi its my fave mainline case
I think Dedede is a king in the sense of a "tyrant" king, and by this I mean by the old definition of a leader who came to power through some unofficial means, usually through a show of force, but not necessarily a cruel one as the modern usage implies. Considering the nature of Dreamland, I feel like Dedede probably either didn't have anyone to actively oppose him, or whoever he did oppose was FAR worse, until of course he actually *did* start abusing the power he took by force, so before that point everyone just rolled with it at the very least. Personally, I definitely lean more toward preferring decentralized power structures, and a monarchy is literally as centralized as you can get, but as far as tyrant kings go, I feel like Dedede was actually a pretty competent and perhaps even well-liked one, or he would've easily been deposed entirely. We see several times throughout the series that the Waddle Dees and his other minions do seem to genuinely care about him, after all. So the self-proclaimed started from his tyrannical (in the old sense, at least) take-over, making him a king by that definition, while we end with self-made in that he grew to be a genuinely respected leader because despite his shortcomings, and by that point the title of "king" was most likely a hold-over and he'd be more comparable to an official that stays in power because he's a genuinely competent, charismatic, and well-respected leader.
Hmm yes accurate lore
I think the validity of cannon parts of a series is entirely subjective.
Okay so addressing the whole "canon" topic and how corporatism factors into that, while I do think you have a legitimate point of sorts here, I also think you're a bit too laser-focused into the capitalism and politics side without factoring in artistic merit at all. There is still a team of creatives behind the Kirby games, and I'd argue out of all the major franchises Nintendo has its grasp on, Kirby feels like it has some of the most pure passion and love and artistic integrity still. While I doubt it's like dedede's character arc or morpho knight's very existence was planned from the start (I mean considering Sakurai's philosophy, I doubt the original Kirby was even planned to have sequels at all), video games are a collaboration. Multiple writers and what have you all working together, and regarding writers, there are undoubtedly lore and character documents for future lead writers to look back on, and assuredly new writers can consult the old ones, and this system is not one that relies on capitalism to work. Collaborative storytelling even predates capitalism.
"Canon" is what the original writer defines it as, or any subsequent writer should the original decide to pass on the torch (or in a capitalistic setting, sometimes be required to sadly). Character arcs absolutely can be planned, general notes on how a character should progress can be written out, ideas can sit on the back burner to be further fleshed out. The most recent games we've gotten have been revived and polished ideas from over ten years ago, games and content planned for the GameCube reworked into Switch titles. Morpho Knight was confirmed to have been in the works since that era, planned to be introduced in one of the GCN games *over 10 years ago* . There have always been parallels as well between Kirby and Dark Matter, what with Gooey also being able to use copy abilities (the only non-Kirby character I'm aware of to do so), and while it's hard to tell how long Void has been in the planning, it's almost certainly been longer than you think, in some form or another, because from an *artistic* perspective, that's how game development works, especially for long-running series. Lots of planning and collaboration and letting ideas simmer.
New Bible dropped!!!
...that last part was kinda odd...
I mean, both dedede's voice actors are sakurai and kumazaki.
...plus it does seem that kumazaki is trying to continue the "Dark Matter" stuff, along with dedede's Character arc.
You would unironically love one piece like everything In that shit was planned from day one like everything little detail has meaning
Kirby = Goku
Dedede = Vegeta
Meta Knight = Piccolo
I'd like to argue that Smash is at least semi-canon to the Kirby Series in particular. I mean there's Master and Crazy Hand in Amazing Mirror, there's literally a Smash Bros Copy Ability in mainline games, Dedede and Meta Knight start to use moves in mainline games that originated in Smash. There's a few more examples here and there but yeah I feel like Smash can be a viable source for some bits of Kirby Lore.
it's funny you bring that up==the brawl section originally had a little preamble about exactly that. it made the section too long imo and i was like "if i just start talking it'll be fine lol" so i ended up cutting it
Also Samus canonically exists in the Kirby universe, and while it's probably not the same one from Metroid, it *could* be the one from Smash.
Ah yes,
SACRIFICE DEDEDE FOR LENT
The joke about Goku and Saski is too complicated.
12:07 s u s (it literally says sus there on the dialogue thingy)
Also when you showed Masked Dedede in Tripe Deluxe I was hoping I'd hear the theme but no :{
oh and I like that the political alignment chart gets more absurd with every video
I need the Kirby political compass to fill up so much it's basically incomprehensible
I love everything you go over in this video, but I'm not gonna write a paragraph or two about points I disagree/have a different thought of. I'm just gonna say the inverted, overlapping footage in the background is distracting as hell and kind of unpleasant to look at.
MAH PENGUIN BOI🐧
7:38 Kirby is an atheist, not because he doesn't believe in God, but because he's so fucking astronomically powerful he doesn't understand what God is. Kirby thinks God is just a guy.
The Kirby political chart is just too good
i think that although, supposedly, it is a video dealing with issues like, dedede becoming a "self-made" king, very little is said about it and it is mostly because, you over think a lot of things and put a lot of other things in a too simple point, like calling kirby an equal merely to goku is just insulting, merely because in the face of very objective reasons, kirby if he is the strongest entity so far of his saga for defeating certain individuals does not mean, and this is a common mistake that people with power have that kirby is able to do what they can, nova comets or clockworks are able to fulfill wishes technically create and alter reality, but kirby is not, therefore you left a character that although, he has not developed enormously, if he has a much more competent evolution and characterization than the character he is compared to, kirby is not merely haha power, he is a character, and there are reasons for him to have no idea of the lore, we as viewers can clearly know that information because the game using things that only games can do as for example, the descriptions of bosses through pause screens we can know, something that inside his own world, that he is incapable of knowing, and even if you explain it to kirby he would not understand, obviously not when, it has been shown that he is a character with a childish mind, but that doesn't mean he is stupid either, that can be clearly seen in the ending of kirby mass attack and his thinking about the stars, out of it, the theme of self-proclaimed, as self-made, it is also clearly stated as, dedede was a self-proclaimed evil king, that is, he took control by force to do what he wanted with his subjects, while self-made, is referring to the fact that now he has earned the title of king, and by putting political positions in this, it just seems stupid, when the saga has never been about that, and it doesn't have to be, even if there was the concept of government there, the fact that Dedede earns the right to be king and without knowing very well what it is or how the monarchy works, which obviously is NOT necessary to explain because the series is about the bounds of the characters in general and the stories around them, it is about someone (dedede) who earned it by learning and improving, the power to rule his kingdom in a fair way, looking for the best for them, so, this is really with all respect to you, you are a small channel and so on, but you really do not have to overthink or take things to such a simplistic point in your videos, much less put concepts that are not relevant, about what is being talked about, and with the video games being individual things each one, if it is complicated to talk about it, but in general I think that some sagas like mario can choose to merely skip the fact that the story does not matter, therefore can go to other things see mario kart and etc without any problem, is something that only video games can do, and to prove otherwise, there is for example the saga metal gear, that would be all, I hope I explained myself the best I could, goodbye have a good day.
im not trying to be rude, but when you started talking about dedede and somthing about neoliberalism, i had no fucking idea what was going on
i think im just too small brain to understand i guess
i think every video should end with a political compass from now on
What the fuck was the last stretch, I understood none of it.
Kirby characters r 2 deep 4 u.
UwU you are very cute
i could be wrong but king dedede is king of nothing.
he has proclaimed himself king but he has no power.
I believe that the self made king may be due to the fame of king dedede, maybe the waddle dee come king dedede as their protection after all waddle dee do not have special abilities.
meta knight wanted to start a war to help pop star people defend themselves or out of pure frustration seeing everyone doing nothing in life or having no goals or ideals, living their lives like monkeys just eating and sleeping lol
"that goes for king dedede too"
Was scared the political charts were gone at the end lol
Algorithm comment lets GOOOO
I don't know if that's a common thing with your content, but by the end I feel like you strayed a little too far away from the original topic, that being King Dedede and his character development. The discussion about monarchy and the importance of canon is nice, I guess, but that feels a little too off-topic.
Maybe that's the whole deal? Like "lol look at how deep I'm looking into kirby of all things, isn't it surreal and funny that I'm assigning a political party to Dedede?", but I genuinely think there's more potential for character analysis.
Get your anime characters right! You used a picture of Saske from naruto, when talking about GOKU! 😠😠
it's overall good, but my point still stands, even with grammer errors!
17:45 not "Neo-liberal" if anything it's conservative, or upper class "I did it so why can't you" people
Neoliberal is a conservative ideaology with a progressive sheen that barely moves.
@@unionjacker1531 thank you for educating me
the reason people thought you were serious about Dedede being a fascist is because one your snobby tone, and two that hyperbolic statement does line up with your shallow worldview that is peak pseudointellectualism. Also the anime implies that Dedede is part of a clan, implying there are more of him so there's that. The fact that the anime is ignored despite being the best adaptation of a Nintendo series is disheartening
And I do disagree Dedede is a fascist I think he's a monarchist if anything.
this is the best comment ive ever gotten. thank you so much for giving me something to smile about :) i hope you have a great day
@@indigo_f I actually really like your content I just disagree with your take on dedede's Ur fascism
I too currently make very well written kirby reviews
@@thedarkmasterthedarkmaster i get the impression of earnestness from you, so i'm going to be open
let me explain the dedede-fascist thing: my first kirby vid was made at a time when i had ~20 subs. i expected it to have very little reach beyond people who knew me personally, so i was a bit blase about my jokes, thinking "oh lol, my friends will understand my meaning," you know? i don't really think dedede is fash: i thought it would be funny in an absurd way to say it (and that it would add levity, as if to say "yeah, yeah, i know that taking this approach to the lore of this series is a little silly"), and i thought that the statement would be so self-evidently hyperbolic that no one would think it was sincere. obviously that joke (and more so the meta knight gag) was read seriously by a few commenters, so i've adjusted by delivering lines like that with a more overtly goofy tone (e.g. the running bit about drawcia advocating for strict copyright law)
in this vid, my saying "nobody disagreed with dedede being fash, so i'm just gonna assume everyone accepts that" is an example of me using that more fun tone. the basis of the joke is that despite multiple people seemingly taking offence to my joke about meta knight, the strongest disagreement i got to the dedede joke was "he's not a fascist *ANYMORE*." my joke was: "dedede is obviously NOT fash, but since nobody flamed in the comments about it, i guess he must actually be"--i.e. occupying the 'realm' of the running gag, the self-evidently ridiculous notion of levying a serious political accusation at a largely harmless children's game character
having said all of that, i like to be disagreed with! i enjoy being challenged. i genuinely believe it's crucial to listen to other people's perspectives.
re: "pseudointellectualism"
i don't claim to be an intellectual. i'm a very earnest person, and i put that into my content (you can see it in my meandering back-and-forth about the morality of kingship in this vid--i tried to depict the real mental process i underwent when i thought about the concept). i've been called pretentious before (and i've called myself pretentious more than once, but i use it rhetorically to mean "nitpicky," "overthinking," "expressing opinions that don't seem to be commonly held," etc), but my videos aren't really intended to impress anyone or demonstrate any "intellectual superiority." i don't choose my vocabulary to impress people: i use the words that i like. i don't express opinions to demonstrate "intellectualism": i express the opinions i believe, or i speak on the topics that interest me. i try not to be shy about expressing when i doubt myself, when i welcome differing opinions, when i recognize that my takes might be uncommon or silly, etc.
i can't deny that academia is something i enjoy. i like to read academic papers and philosophical texts as a hobby, and they definitely do impact my content (i ummmm may or may not have multiple videos with works cited lists in the desc lol), but that's all in the sense of "i want to bring my interests together, i want to reflect my interests in what i create." i run this channel for the love of it, and because of that i can't pretend it doesn't sting a little to be insulted (called 'shallow', 'pseudointellectual', 'snobby') in the comments.
a close friend once told me that i sound excited in my videos--like i'm sharing something that matters to me. she said that she never felt that i was "talking down" (i'm not interested in being a didact anyway). that's what i go for. i regard making videos like these as something that requires a little bit of vulnerability, something that benefits from a personal touch
re: my "snobby tone"
i'm literally just gay, man. my cadence is flamboyant from time to time, and i'm sorry if that makes me sound snobby.
anyway, i'm glad that you enjoy my content on the whole. i hope you really meant it when you said that
@@indigo_f sorry if I came off as rude I was just trying to explain why some people might have taken issue with any of your statements in the past. Delivery can be half the message in a visual medium and that's the thing.
"re: my "snobby tone"
i'm literally just gay, man." Oh sorry I thought, and had been told by your fans, that you were trans.
@@thedarkmasterthedarkmaster oh, that's surprising...? where did you hear i was trans? i have been vocal about opposing transphobia before, but i am not trans myself (sorry if that was sarcasm and i missed the joke lol)