@9000Redline when you cost out the cosmetic upgrades and mechanical, the upcharge for GTS is a deal. Go on the visualize and see. The GTS also gives you access to options that are normally on GT3 and not accessible for the S. Carbon sport seats, center lock wheels. Etc. For some this important
I don't currently own a Porsche but I very much enjoy your sincerity and sense of humour. These are the ingredients missing from most online reviews, for obvious reasons. Do keep it up, thumbs up from me!
My experience with these 2 pretty much mirrors your opinion too Nick. I have a 20’ 992 S Coupe with PDCC/PDK/PSE and my business partner recently picked up a 22’ 992 GTS Coupe this fall. I can say after driving them back to back that the ride is considerably more crashy on the GTS than the S, it sounds like the sound symposer is def tuned to be more loud but no more tuneful but that’s about it. I can’t give a apples to apples comparison in regards to handling because my car has PDCC and his is just standard GTS spec PASM but whatever changes those helper springs from the Turbo are supposed to do aren’t very noticeable on aggressive street driving. On a separate note I was able to spend some time in a 992 GT3 TOURING also and if anyone says that a GTS is even remotely close to that car I’d seriously question their abilities to properly evaluate cars, infact, I’d go as far as to say it’s hard to believe that they start off as the same basic car. The GT3’s steering and front end grip are so sharp and precise that it practically takes everything you’ve learned about driving 911’s hard for decades and throws it out the window , also surprisingly once you’re moving with some speed I don’t think the ride was significantly worse than the other 2 models, infact although stiffer I’d say it was actually less crashy than the GTS. The GT3 has absolutely no roll or slack in its standard ride setting so it’s not like you’d ever need to hit the harder suspension setting. And when it comes to engine there’s nothing that Porsche can do with the 3.0L turbo motors that will ever come close to the 4.0L’s immediate response and insane sound as it revs to 9,000RPM. I wasn’t completely surprised by any of this as I had owned a 997 GT3 in the past and know it’s a different animal but I too have often read or watched reviews claiming the new 992 GTS is a fine substitute if you can’t get a GT3, or that it delivers most the thrills but is just a better daily for most people …..it’s a COMPLETELY different experience as a drivers car and while the GTS feels like a (very) slightly turned up Carrera S, the GT3 experience is closer to a Cup car in comparison
Agree. I’m blesses enough to own a 991.2 GT3 Touring and a 991.2 GTS manual cab. Totally different cars. Non-Porsche folks think I have two same year 911s because one is a coupe and one is a convertible. They have no idea.
You are making the same mistake that many make, because saying the GTS is close to the GT3 only means that it's also track focused, while still daily drive able and that is not the case with the lower Carrera line up. Especially if you add the light weight pack and with all the additional sport oriented features that even Nick confirmed, the GTS clearly is closer to a track version than any standard S can be. When you then add the fact that the GT3 is not available for most people, the GTS does indeed get to be a 'mini GT3' for the common buyer, because that and maybe the GT4 is as close as you can get to the GT3 on track.
@@DonJupp321 The point I was making is that a lot of folks are insinuating that a GTS is a slightly less focused GT3 when it’s really a glorified Carrera S as much as it appears you want it to be something more. Not being rude but there’s no components of the GTS that would make it a significantly more track focused: The lightweight package (assuming you go all out and get carbon buckets) is like 45lbs which won’t be a night/day difference on a 3,300lb car (and if you don’t get buckets it’s only like 8-12lbs different!), the larger Turbo brakes are nice but Carrera S brakes don’t have any issues with track work, and although I’m sure the rear helper springs provide some slight benefit on track, but again nothing transformative.
I’m sure Nick will get a lot of criticism for this, just like the Macan S vs GTS comparison but I’m really pleased someone is prepared to do side by side real world tests and not just rely on Porsche marketing terms ‘sweet spot’ ‘unique handling setup’ etc. thanks for the great work Nick, keep them coming.
Well done, Nick, you’re right. Having said that, it’s probably worth noting that depreciation has verifiably been kinder to GTS variants, so it’s probably wise to consider that, too, when buying. Therefore, if a friend asked me which one to buy, I’d advise them to buy the GTS if, given the choice to spec an S the way they’d want, they would do a “sportier” build (Sport Chrono, Sport Exhaust, manual transmission, black wheels, louder colors, etc), since on resale most buyers looking for that type of build would prefer and pay more for a GTS. If on the other hand they would spec an S as more of a luxury car (all leather, PDK, muted color, silver wheels, etc) then get an S.
Sometimes I wonder what it would be like to be like Nick’s neighbor. This man used to have an M car. Then a lemon brand new 911 that switched to Grey Macan which later turned into a green one. Then, he bought an old 911. He also regularly has 911 GT3, GTS cars come visit him. Not to mention he has a gorilla in the back seat and waters his plants naked sometimes… Anyway great video and thank you for your unbiased opinion Nick. Merry Christmas to to you, William, Tui, Smudge and the fish!
There's a point being missed by everyone, when talking about the firm/crashy suspension on the GTS - it is a free option to downgrade from the Sport PASM (with the stiffer springs) to the normal PASM as fitted to an 'S for free, so you can get a GTS with a better ride.
Love the comparisons over the years and stories from a Nick. As a 2016 GTS Targa owner, “S” vs “GTS” today’s car breakdown is a semantic. But, it is not about “what you own” from the 911 family…but knowing that you have one of the best exotic daily driver cars in one’s driveway that puts a smile on one’s face every day. Enjoy the ride.
Hi Nick, long time lurker and watcher of your content. I’ve actually owned both 992 S and GTS models and I agree with your review. The S I owned was a mess, it kept going back to Porsche for electrical gremlins, before I finally returned it and ordered a GTS which came a year later, and bought a Macan S Diesel as a “temporary” daily. I was so, so disappointed. The suspension was simply crashing over anything but perfect roads. I live in Germany, and outside the autobahn network you can find some really sketchy tarmac. The S was ok with bad surfaces, the GTS bounced everywhere and made me grit my teeth more than once. The power, yeah, no difference, the noise… Let me tell you how annoying the GTS is on long trips. I took my S all the way from Dortmund to Budapest, really nice car for a long trip. The GTS gave me a headache at autobahn speeds (150-280km/h) after 30 mins. Overall, I was glad my Porsche Center made errors with my GTS order, enabling me to decline the compensation they offered and return the car citing breach of contract. I’m actually not a fan of the technical over engineering Porsche have put into their cabins, nobody needs that much tech and it failed a lot for me anyway… I’m currently in the process of buying a 991 Turbo S, and passing my Macan onto my partner to replace a very elderly BMW X1. For me, the better build quality and simpler tech of the 991 lets me focus on enjoying the drive. If I miss GPS linked front lift or a wraparound touch screen… I can always order a 992.2 and wait another year, but something tells me I’m keeping the Turbo S for a while. I’m no good at math, because for me 991 > 992 😂
Hi Nick - you’re correct in saying it’s a personal choice. I have 21 C2S manual that I daily, and would hate the stiffer ride in the GTS. Thanks for your honest review!
As someone who is currently looking at both cars and trying to make a decision between what is out there on the market now, I greatly appreciate this video and thank you for the information you have provided.
Very fair review Nick. I'd go S over GTS. I drove a GTS recently and I totally agree on the ride. Maybe I'm getting old but the S makes a better daily.
100000% agree with you Nick! I never understood why people very so frantic about the GTS. Sure, some people are into the looks of black tones combined with Alcantara, but honestly, it's nothing more than one huge option package with a GTS sticker on it. The speed boost is absolutely negligible and I would rather have the added flexibility of options the regular 911S offers while having a lower base price!
Same here, but there are far more GTS build slots than the S as Porsche wants to squeeze most $ from us. So if you want to get one within 12 months GTS was the way to go
Given your argument, why not just buy the base 911? Save additional money (spend a little money on a tune and upgraded exhaust)… If anything, I believe the “S” to be the redundant model. Go GTS or base model.
Brilliant. Well researched, charmingly presented and helpful. Those dyno results were the most surprising thing IMO. Nice one, chap. Enjoyed that. Hope you get a ‘T’ soon. Merry Christmas!
I can't stress enough that it's not just that the difference between the cars is minuscule in the sense that the "upgrade" to the GTS isn't worth the money. More importantly, and often overlooked by reviewers, is the fact that 99% of Porsche buyers won't notice the difference anyway. It's not just that the cars are hardly different. It's also true (and more important) that most Porsche owners just have no clue about the vehicles they are driving. They'll go for the GTS because they think it's more prestigious. Not because they are experienced enough drivers to understand the minimal mechanical differences. Great video as usual!
somebody had to say it! it's badge-chasing and dick measuring, nothing more. for 99% of buyers, the question is whether they should buy the base model or carrera s and which of a handful of important options are worth their hard-earned money. most couldn't take a base model to its limits, myself included.
@@romulus_ When I price out my two builds of a GTS and an S with the options I like I get a $14000 price difference ($147 K versus $161 K) or 9.5%. The better sound, shorter shift throw, quicker delivery, and upgraded badge which should increase the retail value, is worth the extra money to me. I am getting a manual with ivory interior and regular chrome wheels (not the center lock wheels). I'm probably the poster child example of the 99% of the buyers who won't notice the difference - ha ha
@@Ggh052453 that can definitely happen depending on what you want in the car, which is why some people go for the gts. there are cases where it is worth it, particularly if you're a track guy.
This was a great video Nick. It’s great cos you compared the two cars in a manner most relevant to 95% of the buyers of these vehicles. On the things that matter most to folks in everyday driving situations. Nice. 👍🏾
Will the engine in the GTS perform better after a proper run-in? The GTS in this video has only done 475 miles. Obviously the boost will stay the same but the engine may improve in efficiency. Nick, thanks for another great video!
Great video. One day I’ll see these videos being filmed as I’m just down the road in Darien! Always felt the gts needed it’s own motor. A cayman gts 4.0 in the 911 gts and a back seat makes the ultimate dad 911!
As someone who is angling for an S, this was extremely helpful since I had wondered to myself “should I consider the GTS?” Thanks. Keep up the good videos.
Great review. I owned a 992 PDK S and now own a Manual 992 GTS. Its a totally personal thing which you would like. If I was using the car as a daily I would have stuck with the PDK S. My 911 is a fun weekend car so the GTS for me is more enjoyable (I drive UK twisty A/B roads). Both great cars though but I think the spec and the options can have a bigger effect than just the S/GTS badge in terms of performance and dynamics.
Nick; I just placed my order for 992.1 S based on your recommendation. Dealer markup was only 5k but I guess that’s common. Another stealership here in SOCAL was marking up S 30k and GTS 35k
Super review Nick. Excellent to see such an objective and unbiased review. Shame that Porsche marketing team put out so much BS to confuse the realities.
You covered the cost but not the future value or depreciation. How many of each model type are being made and does the GTS hold a better value in future over the S….
Not surprised at all. As a car, that you use for random tasks and also like to enjoy on the weekends, a Carrera S with a few options in a nice color is more than enough and will only be more comfortable and usable on the street.
Another excellent Video on 911s thanks Nick, with a 2S on order I specced it to exactly what I want and I will not be changing to a GTS. Your impartial review reinforces my decision to stay with the 2S . Originally I had the 4S on order but driving the two back to back (Porsche experience day)made it clear , lighter, more agile, more fun. Cheers John
GTS is the clear winner despite Nick's bias. Solid comparison although disregards resale on the GTS is better. Turbo chassis and brakes are also unavailable on the S. If you like to potter around town then get a Mumba Green Macan otherwise if you want a 911 get a GTS.
Notes on my bias 😋The retail is no better, they ask on average 10k more for the GTS but you pay 20k more new. Interesting that people think the Turbo chassis is better when that is the worst handling 911 there is?
Great review. Makes me feel better now on our order. We had a gts allocation for September but ruby star cut off date was April. They traded it to another dealer for a Targa 4S that I was able to order for my wife in Ruby Star. Granted, the options made the price nearly the same as what our GTS configuration was going to be.
Great review Nick! How about comparing the S models across different generations? E.g. 997.2, 991.1 and .2 and 992.1. It could be comparing how fun they are to drive and how it would be to own one. I have a quite reliable 991.2 4S cabriolet which I absolutely love, but I have considered both older and newer 911s.
Terja Vatle, I also thought a comparison across models would be interesting. Partly based on Nicks early reviews I chose a 991.2 base 911. No PSE because I’m now installing an aftermarket exhaust. I chose the base rather than an S because the exhaust and ECU tune improves performance to more than factory S levels. Only thing I’m missing is torque vectoring differential which I really would like. But honestly, both tires spin when I floor it so I’m not sure I would benefit. I want to say that I really believe the 991.2 is going to be the all time sweet spot for 911 models. No exhaust particulate filter. No frivolous electric door handles. And to me the 991.2 hood and rear end are more attractive. And the 3 liter twin turbo engine outperforms the NA 991.1 engine even if S or GTS trims because of the torque produced from low RPM on up. I do however like that all 992 have the slightly wider fenders. Enjoy your 991.2 Brother. IMHO you’ve got a keeper 😎🎩♠️
I have a 2022 Carrera 4S convertible and my friend a 2023 GTS convertible. Both cars are equally enjoyable. Found the video informative and well narrated.
Great video, thanks for the unbiased opinions and calling out certain car 'journalists' who are doing little of their own investigations, other than reading a brochure.
Great review Nick, we need this type of transparency in car reviews. In my personal experience, my Macan S differs little from the latest GTS. Given similar specifications, ie torque vectoring differential etc. However something as simple as 20 inch / versus 21 inch wheels has a huge impact on road noise, and pot-hole suppression. Keep up the good work, and Merry Christmas!
@@tamasszabo8824 I’ve driven the new face-lifted GTS, it develops it’s maximum torque higher up the rev-range, so it felt less tractable to me, at lower revs. If you drive in Porsche’s Normal driving-mode, the car principally lives in the 1000 - 2,500 rev range, which is exactly where low down torque matters. I’ve got the 2019 facelift S
Great review. The GTS goodies are always tempting, but when I bought my 991.2 C2s there was no GTS. Might have gone GTS but certainly very happy with my S and no plans to upgrade.
After months of test driving between S and GTS finally pulled the trigger on GTS. There is a significant difference if you push the cars on the twisties, GTS is a far more rewarding experience, with not much difference in freeway or straight-line driving. The seats on GTS seem to have more padding, felt far comfier in it. Because you feel a lot less of the car, S is often boring. I say go for low-optioned GTS lot of the stuff is standard on it.
Absolutely agree, I was in Germany on a Porsche experience and everyone in our group wanted the GTS. All cars were 4S and one GTS. Definitely.a marked difference when you push the cars on the B roads.
Having the pleasure of enjoying a Porsche International Experience in Germany, I have a slightly different opinion. We had 9 cars (Boxster GTS, 911 4GTS, the rest were 4S's and Targa 4S -all were PDK) and over the course of 5 days, pushing the cars on B roads, the GTS was noticeably a better. I certainly realize in the US we are unlikely able to drive in that manner frequently, so may not be that applicable. I enjoyed the GTS so much, I ordered one (PDK), delivery in June. I currently have a 991.2 T manual that I will keep.
I’ve been driving the S model for quite some time. Now driving a 2018 S Cab, manual. My last S was a 2014, also Cab with manual. It had something called the Power Kit which is supposedly the GTS tuned engine. Seemed more responsive but who knows? I agree, I think the GTS needs to be a clearer step up from the S. The center locking hubs give me pause because the local garage I use can’t deal with them. Great review. Whichever version you select, you’re driving a 911!
Like it or not P-car fans, and I’m a huge P-car fan/owner myself, Nick is 100% correct with his analysis & opinion! Well done, Nick! Spot on, mate! Cheers / B👍🏎🇩🇪😎
Always love your clips. With a 2017 911 S recently sold, and a 2019 Macan (green like yours) I am now in the market for another 911 or Taycan. Can't decide which is best for me but I like the idea of not putting poison into the air and I live in Quebec where charging is essentially free. I'll keep watching your videos until you make up my mind for me.
Good point on the center lock wheels. They are the stupidest thing ever. I got a screw in the back tire and no tire shop wanted to deal with taking off the CL. I had to go buy a Precision Instruments Torque wrench to get them off. And for track oriented cars they are too fragile. Wish the GT3s didn’t have them.
I have the Carrera base which is what I prefer and desire. It has plenty of power, you have to rev it out to get the most of it and it's exilerating when you do so.
Depending on which market you are, the GTS comes standard with different packages. I have driven both - actually 4S and 4 GTS - and agree with your conclusions. On twisties and mountain passes, the GTS has the edge, no question about it. But for daily driving in ordinary conditions, the S/4S is quite a bit more compliant and comfortable. As you very well put it, all is down to a matter of preferences (and budget !).
Thanks for doing this. I bought a 992.1 GTS specified to my liking (noselift / 18-ways / porsche crest / black calipers / RWS / carbon / rear wiper / glass sunroof / car in white). I had a 991.1 C2S with Sports PASM before. TBH - both great cars. I've had the new car since March 2024 after a 19 month wait in AU and have done 4K kms in it. It's good to have a new 992, but I was mighty pi**ed when the 992.2 GTS launch popped up on youtube three months after I took delivery. I went to the track and had I never driven a GT3 on track, I would have thought the GTS was amazing. I also had a rear wheel puncture and of course, the centre locks are daft. Only a garage can remove the wheels. I guess all I really wanted was a C2S with a heritage design interior, but adding that took me into GTS territory. Not sure I will buy new again. But hey. Great video though. I still pine after my 991..... hmmm.
I share your experience with GTS v S regarding suspension. In fact had to sell my GTS after 4 months(from new!!!) because I was fed being joogled in it! Fab on open roads, distinctly unpleasant around patchwork city. I'm now looking for a used S when a suitable one comes up. You mentioned noise insulating glass. I think that is the reason the GTS sounds better. The glass suppresses outside noise and so makes the engine note from back seats be more prominent. By the way rear axle steering is simply awesome on S or GTS. PS I think Porsche have just modified the GTS suspension mid year (2023). Configurator used to say suspension was -20mm on standard. It now says -10mm. I heard they have had a lot of issues/complaints with "crashy" suspensions on the GTS.
It depends on what you want to do with the car… if you want a daily, then the S is probably better, but if you want a track and weekend explorer then the GTS is for you. I am a 992 GTS owner and can attest that the ride is stiff, which I deeply appreciate for the type of driving I’m doing. I choose the manual and 2WD specifically for the driving experience, and the GTS for the connection to the road when being pushed.
I’ve resubscribed again! Finally, significant reduction in pre-bias against certain models before the review. Great job! 👏🏽 You should compare the 992 GTS and a 992 or 991.2 GT3 suspension on the road next. People daily GT3’s, and I would love to hear your thoughts!
Great review and long awaited. Thank you 🙏 But you mentioned the lightweight and noise-insulating glass being the opposite - you MUST elaborate on this?? Thx again mate...
Whether it’s warranted or not, the GTS will likely support stronger resale values over time than the S. That could make the price difference palatable on its own not including the other merits of the GTS. I just got my ‘23 992 GTS and I haven’t tracked it yet but am looking forward to it and comparing it to my previous 991.2 GT3 on the same tires and track alignment. Should be fun.
992 is my next step, question is do I go GTS or stick with the C4S like I already have? It could be this video has helped me make up my mind, hopefully I’ll get to drive both at Silverstone Porsche Experience to cement my views first. Thanks for a realistic real world review!
I would be interested to see your views on an "S" vs a "GTS" if they were both manual transmissions - seems that it would be down to the suspension and the brakes
The difference 55 lbs makes on a 3,450+ lbs car is all in the fertile imagination of the people that pay $8,000 for this stupid option. If it made a difference then people would notice the weight difference between the PDK and MT models which is 80 lbs and they do not.
@@NickMurray completely agree with you on that. Though I was more looking at this car as a potential track tool ... So, unless you want to daily it which makes no sense since you said the ride is too firm, then why not remove the rear seats ?
Good comparison. Does the lightweight glass giz e less cabin noise, I've seen some Porsche fans say it does ?? Love the blue and lighter inside, very classy 😍👍
I love that community is coming together to get unbiased Porsche comparisons.
I would have to disagree. He owns a Carrera S. 😉
@@Raven77844 I don't own either car and his comparison seemed fair. Porsche did to little to justify the markup of the GTS.
@9000Redline when you cost out the cosmetic upgrades and mechanical, the upcharge for GTS is a deal. Go on the visualize and see.
The GTS also gives you access to options that are normally on GT3 and not accessible for the S. Carbon sport seats, center lock wheels. Etc. For some this important
I have the 992 S and I think it is the best Carrera ever. I put the chip in and picked up 65 more HP for $2500. I love the Carrera 992 S!!!!
I don't currently own a Porsche but I very much enjoy your sincerity and sense of humour. These are the ingredients missing from most online reviews, for obvious reasons. Do keep it up, thumbs up from me!
My experience with these 2 pretty much mirrors your opinion too Nick. I have a 20’ 992 S Coupe with PDCC/PDK/PSE and my business partner recently picked up a 22’ 992 GTS Coupe this fall. I can say after driving them back to back that the ride is considerably more crashy on the GTS than the S, it sounds like the sound symposer is def tuned to be more loud but no more tuneful but that’s about it. I can’t give a apples to apples comparison in regards to handling because my car has PDCC and his is just standard GTS spec PASM but whatever changes those helper springs from the Turbo are supposed to do aren’t very noticeable on aggressive street driving. On a separate note I was able to spend some time in a 992 GT3 TOURING also and if anyone says that a GTS is even remotely close to that car I’d seriously question their abilities to properly evaluate cars, infact, I’d go as far as to say it’s hard to believe that they start off as the same basic car. The GT3’s steering and front end grip are so sharp and precise that it practically takes everything you’ve learned about driving 911’s hard for decades and throws it out the window , also surprisingly once you’re moving with some speed I don’t think the ride was significantly worse than the other 2 models, infact although stiffer I’d say it was actually less crashy than the GTS. The GT3 has absolutely no roll or slack in its standard ride setting so it’s not like you’d ever need to hit the harder suspension setting. And when it comes to engine there’s nothing that Porsche can do with the 3.0L turbo motors that will ever come close to the 4.0L’s immediate response and insane sound as it revs to 9,000RPM. I wasn’t completely surprised by any of this as I had owned a 997 GT3 in the past and know it’s a different animal but I too have often read or watched reviews claiming the new 992 GTS is a fine substitute if you can’t get a GT3, or that it delivers most the thrills but is just a better daily for most people …..it’s a COMPLETELY different experience as a drivers car and while the GTS feels like a (very) slightly turned up Carrera S, the GT3 experience is closer to a Cup car in comparison
GT3 is always the answer. Almost no one is dailying their 911 anyway, why not get the one that’s the most fun.
Agree. I’m blesses enough to own a 991.2 GT3 Touring and a 991.2 GTS manual cab. Totally different cars. Non-Porsche folks think I have two same year 911s because one is a coupe and one is a convertible. They have no idea.
You are making the same mistake that many make, because saying the GTS is close to the GT3 only means that it's also track focused, while still daily drive able and that is not the case with the lower Carrera line up. Especially if you add the light weight pack and with all the additional sport oriented features that even Nick confirmed, the GTS clearly is closer to a track version than any standard S can be. When you then add the fact that the GT3 is not available for most people, the GTS does indeed get to be a 'mini GT3' for the common buyer, because that and maybe the GT4 is as close as you can get to the GT3 on track.
@@DonJupp321 The point I was making is that a lot of folks are insinuating that a GTS is a slightly less focused GT3 when it’s really a glorified Carrera S as much as it appears you want it to be something more. Not being rude but there’s no components of the GTS that would make it a significantly more track focused: The lightweight package (assuming you go all out and get carbon buckets) is like 45lbs which won’t be a night/day difference on a 3,300lb car (and if you don’t get buckets it’s only like 8-12lbs different!), the larger Turbo brakes are nice but Carrera S brakes don’t have any issues with track work, and although I’m sure the rear helper springs provide some slight benefit on track, but again nothing transformative.
@@ptstouring49 People very much do daily a 911 that’s the whole point of the car it’s a sports car not a super car.
I’m sure Nick will get a lot of criticism for this, just like the Macan S vs GTS comparison but I’m really pleased someone is prepared to do side by side real world tests and not just rely on Porsche marketing terms ‘sweet spot’ ‘unique handling setup’ etc. thanks for the great work Nick, keep them coming.
Well done, Nick, you’re right. Having said that, it’s probably worth noting that depreciation has verifiably been kinder to GTS variants, so it’s probably wise to consider that, too, when buying.
Therefore, if a friend asked me which one to buy, I’d advise them to buy the GTS if, given the choice to spec an S the way they’d want, they would do a “sportier” build (Sport Chrono, Sport Exhaust, manual transmission, black wheels, louder colors, etc), since on resale most buyers looking for that type of build would prefer and pay more for a GTS. If on the other hand they would spec an S as more of a luxury car (all leather, PDK, muted color, silver wheels, etc) then get an S.
I though manual wouldnt be something people look for
Sometimes I wonder what it would be like to be like Nick’s neighbor. This man used to have an M car. Then a lemon brand new 911 that switched to Grey Macan which later turned into a green one. Then, he bought an old 911. He also regularly has 911 GT3, GTS cars come visit him. Not to mention he has a gorilla in the back seat and waters his plants naked sometimes…
Anyway great video and thank you for your unbiased opinion Nick. Merry Christmas to to you, William, Tui, Smudge and the fish!
It’s the naked strolls often chasing his rolling cars from garage to main road forgetting parking break or being pushed by Smudge
There's a point being missed by everyone, when talking about the firm/crashy suspension on the GTS - it is a free option to downgrade from the Sport PASM (with the stiffer springs) to the normal PASM as fitted to an 'S for free, so you can get a GTS with a better ride.
That’s what I did… standard PASM instead of the GTS PASM.
My car will arrive next week. I’m curious to see if I will not regret of this option 😂
@@mcunhabrWhat did you think of the choice to go Standard vs. GTS PASM? You loving it?
@@DesignMonkey2000 I think it’s perfect, since I have no plans of using the car in a track. I’m loving the car. Drove around 650 miles in 40 days.
@@mcunhabrThank you so much! This is great real world feedback. I also have 0 intention of tracking this car.
Love the comparisons over the years and stories from a Nick. As a 2016 GTS Targa owner, “S” vs “GTS” today’s car breakdown is a semantic. But, it is not about “what you own” from the 911 family…but knowing that you have one of the best exotic daily driver cars in one’s driveway that puts a smile on one’s face every day. Enjoy the ride.
Nick, Great Review! Glad you could use my car and it’s cool to be part of the “Nick Murray Experience”! Happy Holidays, Tom
Thank you for making it happen Tom
This video is the nail in the coffin in my already low willingness to upgrade my manual S to GTS. Thank you!
I went with a 992 GTS that came with a sport aero package. Love it.
Aerokit?
@@RB-xv4siyes. The one provided by Porsche at manufaktur
@@charlesfrusa5049 yeah, it’s called Aerokit.
Sweet as Nick. I've been searching YT for an S v's GTS comparison and you've nailed it, keep the reviews coming mate
Thanks Nick. As someone more interested in track days, the GTS is a no brainer and worth the extra dough.
Hi Nick, long time lurker and watcher of your content. I’ve actually owned both 992 S and GTS models and I agree with your review. The S I owned was a mess, it kept going back to Porsche for electrical gremlins, before I finally returned it and ordered a GTS which came a year later, and bought a Macan S Diesel as a “temporary” daily. I was so, so disappointed. The suspension was simply crashing over anything but perfect roads. I live in Germany, and outside the autobahn network you can find some really sketchy tarmac. The S was ok with bad surfaces, the GTS bounced everywhere and made me grit my teeth more than once. The power, yeah, no difference, the noise… Let me tell you how annoying the GTS is on long trips. I took my S all the way from Dortmund to Budapest, really nice car for a long trip. The GTS gave me a headache at autobahn speeds (150-280km/h) after 30 mins. Overall, I was glad my Porsche Center made errors with my GTS order, enabling me to decline the compensation they offered and return the car citing breach of contract. I’m actually not a fan of the technical over engineering Porsche have put into their cabins, nobody needs that much tech and it failed a lot for me anyway… I’m currently in the process of buying a 991 Turbo S, and passing my Macan onto my partner to replace a very elderly BMW X1. For me, the better build quality and simpler tech of the 991 lets me focus on enjoying the drive. If I miss GPS linked front lift or a wraparound touch screen… I can always order a 992.2 and wait another year, but something tells me I’m keeping the Turbo S for a while. I’m no good at math, because for me 991 > 992 😂
Hi Nick - you’re correct in saying it’s a personal choice. I have 21 C2S manual that I daily, and would hate the stiffer ride in the GTS. Thanks for your honest review!
Certainly worth waiting for a while, I think you did a great job presenting an unbiased review.
As someone who is currently looking at both cars and trying to make a decision between what is out there on the market now, I greatly appreciate this video and thank you for the information you have provided.
What a great comparison video. That handling/suspension info was the deciding point for me. Thanks Nick.
Very fair review Nick. I'd go S over GTS. I drove a GTS recently and I totally agree on the ride. Maybe I'm getting old but the S makes a better daily.
100000% agree with you Nick! I never understood why people very so frantic about the GTS. Sure, some people are into the looks of black tones combined with Alcantara, but honestly, it's nothing more than one huge option package with a GTS sticker on it. The speed boost is absolutely negligible and I would rather have the added flexibility of options the regular 911S offers while having a lower base price!
Same here, but there are far more GTS build slots than the S as Porsche wants to squeeze most $ from us. So if you want to get one within 12 months GTS was the way to go
Given your argument, why not just buy the base 911? Save additional money (spend a little money on a tune and upgraded exhaust)… If anything, I believe the “S” to be the redundant model. Go GTS or base model.
There are mechanical upgrades in suspension and braking that are not on the S
@@yyz4165imo its T or GTS. T brings a better natural experience while GTS brings all the equipment
I THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS VIDEO AS IT EXTREMELY HELPED ME IN MY DECISION PROCESS FOR MY NEW PORSCHE 911... I'LL BE GOING WITH THE S THANK YOU
Great video Nick, this just confirms what you've been saying. Save the $20k and spec an S the way you'd like it. Have you done a video on base v S?
Not even in the market for a 911 and you somehow make me love these vids!
That Gentian blue Carrera S really pops! Nice video.
Brilliant. Well researched, charmingly presented and helpful. Those dyno results were the most surprising thing IMO. Nice one, chap. Enjoyed that. Hope you get a ‘T’ soon. Merry Christmas!
Wow! Good on you. I have never seen such honest review! I love it!
I can't stress enough that it's not just that the difference between the cars is minuscule in the sense that the "upgrade" to the GTS isn't worth the money. More importantly, and often overlooked by reviewers, is the fact that 99% of Porsche buyers won't notice the difference anyway. It's not just that the cars are hardly different. It's also true (and more important) that most Porsche owners just have no clue about the vehicles they are driving. They'll go for the GTS because they think it's more prestigious. Not because they are experienced enough drivers to understand the minimal mechanical differences.
Great video as usual!
somebody had to say it! it's badge-chasing and dick measuring, nothing more. for 99% of buyers, the question is whether they should buy the base model or carrera s and which of a handful of important options are worth their hard-earned money. most couldn't take a base model to its limits, myself included.
@@romulus_ When I price out my two builds of a GTS and an S with the options I like I get a $14000 price difference ($147 K versus $161 K) or 9.5%. The better sound, shorter shift throw, quicker delivery, and upgraded badge which should increase the retail value, is worth the extra money to me. I am getting a manual with ivory interior and regular chrome wheels (not the center lock wheels). I'm probably the poster child example of the 99% of the buyers who won't notice the difference - ha ha
@@Ggh052453 that can definitely happen depending on what you want in the car, which is why some people go for the gts. there are cases where it is worth it, particularly if you're a track guy.
Great review Nick, been here for years and this been very fair review. I think Porsche should have done more for the 992 GTS
Missed the conclusion, was too distracted by all the lip licking 😂. Great vid as usual Nick!
GREAT review! I am currently deciding between these two, so this is invaluable advice.
More of these types of comparison tests please. Thank you Nick.
This was a great video Nick. It’s great cos you compared the two cars in a manner most relevant to 95% of the buyers of these vehicles. On the things that matter most to folks in everyday driving situations. Nice. 👍🏾
Nick is incorruptible. The Eliot Ness of car youtubers.
Will the engine in the GTS perform better after a proper run-in? The GTS in this video has only done 475 miles. Obviously the boost will stay the same but the engine may improve in efficiency. Nick, thanks for another great video!
My experience jives exactly, thanks for always great content Nick!
Great video. One day I’ll see these videos being filmed as I’m just down the road in Darien!
Always felt the gts needed it’s own motor. A cayman gts 4.0 in the 911 gts and a back seat makes the ultimate dad 911!
As someone who is angling for an S, this was extremely helpful since I had wondered to myself “should I consider the GTS?” Thanks. Keep up the good videos.
Excellent comparison! You answered my question and the S is the one for me. Thanks!
Thanks for continuing to put out Porsche content Nick ! 😊
Love the honesty here. Great job Nick!
Wonderful video Nick. Looking forward to your T review.
Great review. I owned a 992 PDK S and now own a Manual 992 GTS.
Its a totally personal thing which you would like.
If I was using the car as a daily I would have stuck with the PDK S.
My 911 is a fun weekend car so the GTS for me is more enjoyable (I drive UK twisty A/B roads).
Both great cars though but I think the spec and the options can have a bigger effect than just the S/GTS badge in terms of performance and dynamics.
Agree with the 18 way seats. Well worth the upgrade.
I look forward to watching your content as a fellow 911 enthusiast always eager to learn. I appreciate the no-nonsense approach. Good work Nick.
Nick; I just placed my order for 992.1 S based on your recommendation. Dealer markup was only 5k but I guess that’s common. Another stealership here in SOCAL was marking up S 30k and GTS 35k
Super review Nick. Excellent to see such an objective and unbiased review. Shame that Porsche marketing team put out so much BS to confuse the realities.
Great job Nick. Been waiting for someone to do a descent comparison of these two cars.
You covered the cost but not the future value or depreciation. How many of each model type are being made and does the GTS hold a better value in future over the S….
Not surprised at all. As a car, that you use for random tasks and also like to enjoy on the weekends, a Carrera S with a few options in a nice color is more than enough and will only be more comfortable and usable on the street.
Another excellent Video on 911s thanks Nick, with a 2S on order I specced it to exactly what I want and I will not be changing to a GTS. Your impartial review reinforces my decision to stay with the 2S . Originally I had the 4S on order but driving the two back to back (Porsche experience day)made it clear , lighter, more agile, more fun. Cheers John
GTS is the clear winner despite Nick's bias. Solid comparison although disregards resale on the GTS is better. Turbo chassis and brakes are also unavailable on the S. If you like to potter around town then get a Mumba Green Macan otherwise if you want a 911 get a GTS.
Notes on my bias 😋The retail is no better, they ask on average 10k more for the GTS but you pay 20k more new. Interesting that people think the Turbo chassis is better when that is the worst handling 911 there is?
that GTS at 474.8 miles on the odometer (3:30) is still in its run-in period. probably shouldn't redline it like that
Great review. Makes me feel better now on our order. We had a gts allocation for September but ruby star cut off date was April. They traded it to another dealer for a Targa 4S that I was able to order for my wife in Ruby Star. Granted, the options made the price nearly the same as what our GTS configuration was going to be.
GTS vs S has always been an options game. Sometimes its a bargain, but its never been a significant change over the S
Fab review, thanks Nick, makes perfect sense, S seems the one to live with. Cheers.
Great review Nick! How about comparing the S models across different generations? E.g. 997.2, 991.1 and .2 and 992.1. It could be comparing how fun they are to drive and how it would be to own one. I have a quite reliable 991.2 4S cabriolet which I absolutely love, but I have considered both older and newer 911s.
Terja Vatle, I also thought a comparison across models would be interesting. Partly based on Nicks early reviews I chose a 991.2 base 911. No PSE because I’m now installing an aftermarket exhaust. I chose the base rather than an S because the exhaust and ECU tune improves performance to more than factory S levels. Only thing I’m missing is torque vectoring differential which I really would like. But honestly, both tires spin when I floor it so I’m not sure I would benefit. I want to say that I really believe the 991.2 is going to be the all time sweet spot for 911 models. No exhaust particulate filter. No frivolous electric door handles. And to me the 991.2 hood and rear end are more attractive. And the 3 liter twin turbo engine outperforms the NA 991.1 engine even if S or GTS trims because of the torque produced from low RPM on up. I do however like that all 992 have the slightly wider fenders.
Enjoy your 991.2 Brother. IMHO you’ve got a keeper 😎🎩♠️
FINALLY AN HONEST VIDEO THANK YOU THAT WAS GREAT CONTENT
I can literally make a better informed decision now
I have a 2022 Carrera 4S convertible and my friend a 2023 GTS convertible. Both cars are equally enjoyable. Found the video informative and well narrated.
Great video, thanks for the unbiased opinions and calling out certain car 'journalists' who are doing little of their own investigations, other than reading a brochure.
Great review Nick, we need this type of transparency in car reviews. In my personal experience, my Macan S differs little from the latest GTS. Given similar specifications, ie torque vectoring differential etc. However something as simple as 20 inch / versus 21 inch wheels has a huge impact on road noise, and pot-hole suppression. Keep up the good work, and Merry Christmas!
Interesting observation! The latest GTS has the pre-facelift Turbo engine, so it should be noticeably faster than the pre-facelift S.
@@tamasszabo8824 I’ve driven the new face-lifted GTS, it develops it’s maximum torque higher up the rev-range, so it felt less tractable to me, at lower revs. If you drive in Porsche’s Normal driving-mode, the car principally lives in the 1000 - 2,500 rev range, which is exactly where low down torque matters. I’ve got the 2019 facelift S
@@stuartbrowning3074 Makes sense. I have a Cayman GTS 4.0 and it loves to upshift at 2000 rpm 😀
Probably the best and most fair GTS review out there.
Very objective Nick. GTS sounds slightly better. Nick, we would love to have you show your favorite build for a 992 s.
Definitely leaning towards the S for my next car. Too, I like the idea of ordering my S to my wants, etc.
Thx for the review 👍🏼
what a comparison video mate, well done. best one on youtube.
Great review. The GTS goodies are always tempting, but when I bought my 991.2 C2s there was no GTS. Might have gone GTS but certainly very happy with my S and no plans to upgrade.
After months of test driving between S and GTS finally pulled the trigger on GTS. There is a significant difference if you push the cars on the twisties, GTS is a far more rewarding experience, with not much difference in freeway or straight-line driving. The seats on GTS seem to have more padding, felt far comfier in it. Because you feel a lot less of the car, S is often boring. I say go for low-optioned GTS lot of the stuff is standard on it.
Absolutely agree, I was in Germany on a Porsche experience and everyone in our group wanted the GTS. All cars were 4S and one GTS. Definitely.a marked difference when you push the cars on the B roads.
Having the pleasure of enjoying a Porsche International Experience in Germany, I have a slightly different opinion. We had 9 cars (Boxster GTS, 911 4GTS, the rest were 4S's and Targa 4S -all were PDK) and over the course of 5 days, pushing the cars on B roads, the GTS was noticeably a better. I certainly realize in the US we are unlikely able to drive in that manner frequently, so may not be that applicable. I enjoyed the GTS so much, I ordered one (PDK), delivery in June. I currently have a 991.2 T manual that I will keep.
GTS is faster here because it’s red . Automatic adds 50 bhp
I agree
Great video Nick, firm suspension everyday wouldn’t be enjoyable, thanks for the honest review.
I’ve been driving the S model for quite some time. Now driving a 2018 S Cab, manual. My last S was a 2014, also Cab with manual. It had something called the Power Kit which is supposedly the GTS tuned engine. Seemed more responsive but who knows? I agree, I think the GTS needs to be a clearer step up from the S. The center locking hubs give me pause because the local garage I use can’t deal with them. Great review. Whichever version you select, you’re driving a 911!
Like it or not P-car fans, and I’m a huge P-car fan/owner myself, Nick is 100% correct with his analysis & opinion! Well done, Nick! Spot on, mate! Cheers / B👍🏎🇩🇪😎
I don't agree with "not noticible" performance difference argument. GTS was one to two car length ahead of C2S in every drag race I had.
Awesome video man 👍🏻 more comparisons please.. very helpful
Loved this review, especially that sound comparison!
Always love your clips. With a 2017 911 S recently sold, and a 2019 Macan (green like yours) I am now in the market for another 911 or Taycan. Can't decide which is best for me but I like the idea of not putting poison into the air and I live in Quebec where charging is essentially free. I'll keep watching your videos until you make up my mind for me.
Good point on the center lock wheels. They are the stupidest thing ever. I got a screw in the back tire and no tire shop wanted to deal with taking off the CL. I had to go buy a Precision Instruments Torque wrench to get them off. And for track oriented cars they are too fragile. Wish the GT3s didn’t have them.
Well done, seems fair to me as owners of S and GTS variants over the years
I have the Carrera base which is what I prefer and desire. It has plenty of power, you have to rev it out to get the most of it and it's exilerating when you do so.
nice
Depending on which market you are, the GTS comes standard with different packages. I have driven both - actually 4S and 4 GTS - and agree with your conclusions. On twisties and mountain passes, the GTS has the edge, no question about it. But for daily driving in ordinary conditions, the S/4S is quite a bit more compliant and comfortable. As you very well put it, all is down to a matter of preferences (and budget !).
Thanks for doing this. I bought a 992.1 GTS specified to my liking (noselift / 18-ways / porsche crest / black calipers / RWS / carbon / rear wiper / glass sunroof / car in white). I had a 991.1 C2S with Sports PASM before. TBH - both great cars. I've had the new car since March 2024 after a 19 month wait in AU and have done 4K kms in it. It's good to have a new 992, but I was mighty pi**ed when the 992.2 GTS launch popped up on youtube three months after I took delivery. I went to the track and had I never driven a GT3 on track, I would have thought the GTS was amazing. I also had a rear wheel puncture and of course, the centre locks are daft. Only a garage can remove the wheels. I guess all I really wanted was a C2S with a heritage design interior, but adding that took me into GTS territory. Not sure I will buy new again. But hey. Great video though. I still pine after my 991..... hmmm.
Loved the part where you highlighted those comments from 'influencers' and so-called journalists in the access media!
I share your experience with GTS v S regarding suspension. In fact had to sell my GTS after 4 months(from new!!!) because I was fed being joogled in it! Fab on open roads, distinctly unpleasant around patchwork city. I'm now looking for a used S when a suitable one comes up. You mentioned noise insulating glass. I think that is the reason the GTS sounds better. The glass suppresses outside noise and so makes the engine note from back seats be more prominent. By the way rear axle steering is simply awesome on S or GTS. PS I think Porsche have just modified the GTS suspension mid year (2023). Configurator used to say suspension was -20mm on standard. It now says -10mm. I heard they have had a lot of issues/complaints with "crashy" suspensions on the GTS.
It depends on what you want to do with the car… if you want a daily, then the S is probably better, but if you want a track and weekend explorer then the GTS is for you. I am a 992 GTS owner and can attest that the ride is stiff, which I deeply appreciate for the type of driving I’m doing. I choose the manual and 2WD specifically for the driving experience, and the GTS for the connection to the road when being pushed.
I’ve resubscribed again! Finally, significant reduction in pre-bias against certain models before the review. Great job! 👏🏽 You should compare the 992 GTS and a 992 or 991.2 GT3 suspension on the road next. People daily GT3’s, and I would love to hear your thoughts!
I honestly would just get the base with the options I wanted. The base is more than enough for a daily driver
Great video. Thanks Nick. Happy Holidays!!!
Great review and long awaited. Thank you 🙏 But you mentioned the lightweight and noise-insulating glass being the opposite - you MUST elaborate on this?? Thx again mate...
Yes Nick please elaborate! Inquiring minds (and those who’ve invested in lightweight glass) want to know! 😂
Whether it’s warranted or not, the GTS will likely support stronger resale values over time than the S. That could make the price difference palatable on its own not including the other merits of the GTS.
I just got my ‘23 992 GTS and I haven’t tracked it yet but am looking forward to it and comparing it to my previous 991.2 GT3 on the same tires and track alignment. Should be fun.
I feel the exact same with new Taycan 4S vs GTS. Sounds like 4S in both 911 & Taycan is the sweet spot! Great video! Well Done!
This was a fantastic review. I'm shocked to see how close these two really are.
992 is my next step, question is do I go GTS or stick with the C4S like I already have? It could be this video has helped me make up my mind, hopefully I’ll get to drive both at Silverstone Porsche Experience to cement my views first. Thanks for a realistic real world review!
Solid video Nick.
Merry Christmas 🎅 🎄 to you and yours
i had a 2022 S and now have a 2024 GTS. Love them both!
Nick Murray and Carl Orff team up to bookend a most excellent comparison test!
I would be interested to see your views on an "S" vs a "GTS" if they were both manual transmissions - seems that it would be down to the suspension and the brakes
Never cared for the GTS package. Always prefer to load up a C4S with the options I want rather than grab the GTS package.
Great review Nick.
Subscribed, excellent comparison!!
Most comprehensive review so far ! thanks Nick. What is your opinion on the GTS with light weight package option ? Would it make sense ?
The difference 55 lbs makes on a 3,450+ lbs car is all in the fertile imagination of the people that pay $8,000 for this stupid option. If it made a difference then people would notice the weight difference between the PDK and MT models which is 80 lbs and they do not.
@@NickMurray completely agree with you on that. Though I was more looking at this car as a potential track tool ... So, unless you want to daily it which makes no sense since you said the ride is too firm, then why not remove the rear seats ?
Good comparison. Does the lightweight glass giz e less cabin noise, I've seen some Porsche fans say it does ??
Love the blue and lighter inside, very classy 😍👍