PROTO-CELTIC & PROTO-ITALIC
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ส.ค. 2023
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I heard somewhere something like that: when Romans were about to conquer Gaul they ordered to send commands and basically use Greek because Romans worried that Celts could deduct the meaning of orders due to lingual similarities of their languages
Can you provide a source on that please?
@@michaelm-bs2er Unfortunately, I can't find it. It was a reddit post or a comment by someone where they mentioned that.
@@pawelsz007locp fair. I'll look for it online. Thanks
Roman = Hellenicized Celts.
@@elvyn8709 Celts = Germans west of the Rhine
It is ironic that Romans and Gauls were actually close cousins.😅
It's surprising that both groups diverged from common ancestors rather recently and yet differed so much in terms of physical appearance. As Italics, the Roman majority would perhaps be brunette while the Gauls struck contemporary authors with their characteristic fair complexion. Environment can do wonders to phenotypes of even the closest relatives.
@Mirko1913 Etruscan and Greek civilization heavily influenced Romans and it made the great cultural differences between Romans and Gauls
@@Mirko1913 both of them mixed with the Old European substrate, which was different in Italy vs northwestern Europe. The substrate populations themselves were ultimately related to each other, but they had split far earlier
No. The Celtici came to Europe much later, in bronze age.
@@bil2102 There were ligurian too, everbody avoid mention them, in south piemont- liguria extended into Cuntea de Nissa, its huge ligurian also complexion rooted
Celtic and Italic languages should be groupped as Italo-Celtic languages just like the Balto-Slavic languages
& Indo-Iranian
Great observation. I've always wondered if Romance and Celtic languages are more related to each other than to other IE languages.
Some, do group them together
Это уже сделано. Такая группа языков, как итало-кельтская уже существует. Просто многие об этом не знают. ))
@NerdyLlama21 as Pole living in Italy and speaks both languages, i can assure you that i understand quite a bit more of Lithuanian and Latvian than i can understand any Welsh or Irish. Both with or without text shown.
Italian and Irish
🇮🇹 🇮🇪
1 uno aon
2 due dó
3 tre trí
4 quattro ceathair
5 cinque cúig
6 sei sé
7 sette seacht
8 otto ocht
9 nove naoi
10 dieci deich
Ukrainian:
1-odyn
2-dva
3-try
4-chotyry
5-piat’
6-shist’
7-sim
8-visim
9-dev’yat’
10-desyat’
it is so magic how similar they are! proto celtic and proto italic it is like one language but with a different accent / dialect.
Well, both languages are sons of Proto Indoeuropean language.
The Proto (ancient) languages in the world are cool to learn (perhaps these two languages), but if anyone’s interested in learning about ancient languages; this channel is right for you
In Latin:
Ovis, cui lana non erat,
vidit equos,
tum vehiculum grave vehentem,
tum onus magnum,
tum hominem ociter ferentem.
Ovis equis dixit:
Cor(d) dolet mihi videnti hominem equos agentem.
Equi dixerunt:
Audi, ovis, cor dolet nobis (hoc) videntibus:
homo potis lanam ovium facit sibi formam(?) vestem,
ovibusque lana non (iam) est.
Hoc audito ovis (in) agrum confugit.
Finally! I was expecting so long for this kind of video from you. My main expectations are the comparisons with the most primary proto-languages, such as proto-turkic, proto-uralic and proto-austronesian, those of which you have videos in this channel. But the many proto-languages of individual branches are also more than welcomed!
Great video as usual. In Northern Italy, Proto Italic borrowed from Etruscan (Tyrsenian Family) because the PI tribes interacted a lot with both Etruscans and Rhaetics (another Tyrsenian population), and specialists say Tuscany still has a big deal of Etruscan DNA in its population, due to ages of mixing with Italics long after the fall of the Etruscan kingdoms.
Congratulations and keep it up
💖🌹🤠
Genetically speaking, the etruscans were not different from other central italic populations
But in north we're a cross of Anatolian farmers with Ligurians and some Celtic
were Etruscans y-haplogroup i ?
I’m curious to know where the haplogroup came from because most european people are a variant of haplogroup R
@@GolAcheron-fc4ug J2 and R1b with the first arrive of the Italo-Celtic (especial R1b-U152)
@@Ajemone Wow! Etruscans were J2? That’s interesting. Perhaps they were related to the original Minoans!
_Celtic languages are most intelligible within the Indo-European family, especially with other Celtic languages. However, there are also some similarities and limited intelligibility with other Indo-European families such as Germanic languages and Romance languages_
🏆👏🍾🥂👍👍🍻🍹🌟🎖️🥇🥳⭐🙏🫂💙
Thank you so much😊
Very cool, thank you!
Seems like the same distance between Portuguese and Italian, whilst Proto-Germanic to Proto-Italic seems like the same distance as Portuguese to Wallon.
@ILoveLanguages will there be a video about proto-Slavic and proto-Baltic?
My thinking is both proto Italic and proto Celtic tribes pushed into Northern Italy together, the dominant Celts held the northern plains known as Cisalpine Gaul while the Italian tribes had to go south. The italic tribes came under Etruscan and Hellenic influences, they slowly began to be civilized as Mediterranean peoples and diverge strongly in culture from their Celtic cousins.
Yea you are pretty correct, and the Etruscans where 74% R1b by haplogroups and a dna and haplogroups very close to the Latins/first Romans. Meanwhile the Greeks they never be Indoeuropeans but Anatolian Neolitch Farmers (with a strong presence of North West African haplogroups E-V13) with really low Indoeuropean dna like 15%, now they have the 30-35%. And when they started to colonize Suth Italy they brings whit them more Neolitch dna and East Mediterranean in the Population of Italics mixed with the Neolitchs here before and change the genetics of Italy even today.
Etruscans were to Italy what Basques are to Spain and Ainu to Japan.
Can you do a comparison of Gothic compared to Old Low German please?
What about Proto-Germanic? Can it be placed in the middle between Italo-Celtic languages and Balto-Slavic ones among IE languages?
amazing💕
Nice.
As a speaker of one, it's nice that I almost completely understand the other.
Nice video ❤️💪💪
Is Zazaki similar to the Parthian language?
Someone: Who are these 9?
Proto-Celtic: No one!
Do Tetum and Fijian, I saw the numbers looked somewhat similar
What about "Italo-Celtic" ?
Were they dialects at that time?
Can you do toki pona? It's easy!
I heard somewhere that the gauls could read and understand roman texts taken from messengers, so high was the intelligibility
Didn't help much in the end but anyways
The Romans switched to Greek
@@caioluccatone4725 the east ones
@@danielbrzozowski2930no, he meant that during the gaul campaign the romans used to write letters using the greek language, since the gauls were already used to latin
@@esti-od1mz oh such educating, thank you for an explanation!
@@danielbrzozowski2930 no worries, the other comment could be easily misunderstood
Did the Celtic and Italic languages originate from the same root called proto-celto-italic?
Possibly
It's likely that when the Proto-Indo-European Speakers left the Pontic Steppe, and west into Europe, they spoke a variety of Proto-Indo-European called Northwest Proto-Indo-European. This Daughter language of PIE is likely the ancestor of the Germanic Languages, Italic Languages, and Celtic Languages, before their respective Proto-Languages. Years back we believed that before Proto-Italic, and Proto-Celtic, and after Northwest Proto-Indo-European, there was Proto-Italo-Celtic, which makes sense, however that idea has lost favour in recent years, so it's likely that Proto-Italic and Proto-Celtic diverged equally from Northwest Proto-Indo-European (along side Proto-Germanic).
italics and celts both come from the same mixes of bell beaker peoples who had r1b y-dna (which doesnt matter but it suggests the male populations all had common origins). Mixtures of EEF and Early Steppe arrivals concluded by many to be earlier yamnaya related peoples. Both have a common origin around the north balkans and then made a drastic split with some moving through the italian mountains and some crossing the adriatic and probably becoming rather hellenized. Eventually most will be hellenized regardless. You can see in the metallurgy cultures of both early celts and italics they have great similarity. Early Villanovans use Antennae swords and montefortino like helmets which are reminiscent of their celtic counterparts. The Oscan tribes of Southern and South-Central italy also maintained a high similarity with their Celtic cousins especially in regards to their lifestyle and appearance. Oscans use to practice a sort of democratic elder government same as the Gauls are described. Choosing a Dictator from among the common representatives during wartime. They have seriously apparently commonalities with the Ibero-Celts in their arms and methods of war. Similar level of hellenizing as well. Samnites, Lucani, Campani and Ausones also were not quite fond of Rome and often tried to sack them or raid their related city states in italy. As far as siding with Pyrrhus and Hannibal. Linguistically Oscan bears many similarities as well.
@@nsa6865 Hai ragione su tutto
@@Ajemone grazie fra 💪
Damn, that sounded so foreign to me, like Latin + Etruscan + Gaul? + Greek?
I can only understand 30% of this, knowing Spanish, Italian, and some Portuguese and French…with a small understanding of Latin. 😮
Me knowing only English and Spanish, I understand 0% of this
Many of the comments are saying that Celtic and Italic should be lumped together as Italo-Celtic. I can definitely see where that comes from, but the general consensus among linguists is that they form a sprachbund, which is two languages or language groups that exchanged features over time, therefore becoming more similar. It’s just like the Altaic hypothesis.
Until now I'm wondering if France is actually a Romance country from the language or Celtic of the population, especially from the name of the country that comes from Germanic tribes
It’s definitely Romance, but nonetheless the similarities between Gaulish and Latin in particular are a bit jarring. It seems those simulators went quite a ways back as well
😅😅😅😅 France is a salad which that strongs influences and bases are latin and celitcs and iberics too, germanics in France were assimilated by others ethnicies 👍👍👍🍻
Let's see a comparison with proto indo european, proto celtic and sanskrit.
What language branch are the germanic languages closest to?
baltic
@@alajira552 Not really. Germanic languages are Centum while Baltic are satem.
@@Mothman156 Yes Baltic languages had the early palatalisation changes that Germanic ones did not, but nevertheless they are a bit closer to the Germanic branch than Celtic is. Balto-Slavic had an east to west dialect continuum and the westernmost speakers who lived near modern-day Poland and Hungary were closer to Germanic languages. Baltic languages like Old Prussian and Lithuanian are arguably closer to Germanic languages than Welsh and Irish Gaelic.
Celtic languages may seem closer because of high influence from English but I think Baltic are genetically less distant
Sounds similar to Lithuanian/Latvian
Almost similar!
1. Vulgar Latin and Gaulish,
2. Ancient Greek and Thracian, Illyrian and Dacian
3. Old English and Frisian
please 🙏
@Turkish__ModelMayhaps what You're saying is not true, ever thought of that?
ItaloCeltic, BaltoSlavic, IndoAryan and Germanic...
Tamangic language please
원시 켈트어
원시 이탈리아어
compare Sanskrit and Latin
Proto-Italic = Etruscanized Celtic.
What evidence is there to support the idea that two split off from an earlier common ancestor?
How reliable is the reconstruction of either?
Read up on proto Indo European
@@empyrionin I meant within indo European. How do we know they didn't split off from Indo-European in separate branches
*Outside the tree 🌲🌳 Indo-European linguistics Celtic languages are isolated at a high level and do not communicate in any way with other language trees in the real world.*
🍻👍💙🫂🙏⭐🥳🥇🎖️🌟🍹🥂🍾👏🏆🌷🌆🌃💪
Ex Soviet Languages
Armenia
Azerbaijan
Belarus
Georgia
Kazakhstan
Kyrgistan
Moldova
Russia
Tajikistán
Turkmenistán
Ukraine
Uzbekistan
Best proof against all the latinization theories out there!
Take the later Latin borrowed words (mostly scientific, cleric or administrative) out of French, and you won't be able to say for sure if French is a Latin language or a Gaulle one!
The same is true for Spanish, Portuguese and most likely for Romanian as well.
Italic is civilised the other is not
There's something wrong with you.
Can you please do Proto-Albanian next