CineStill 800T Color Film Review | All About Film
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 ก.ค. 2024
- I like the idea behind CineStill. I like the brothers Wright; they seem very nice and have always answered my e-mails. I also really like the innovation it brings to the film marketplace and the thinking behind it. I also like the film. It’s not my favorite. It’s not top ten. CineStill 800T definitely fills a much-needed gap in the film marketplace for fast, readily-pushable film stocks. And that it has a unique and identifiable characteristic is, I think, a huge part of the brand.
Another key thing about CineStill 800T, the color cast and tone are unique within the film marketplace. They differ from 5219 and they have a distinct look and aesthetic. You do need to buy into that look to use this stock. If you buy into it. If you use this stock to complement that look, then the results can be decidedly eye-catching.
I don’t like halation, at all, and though sometimes I do think it works in images - mostly those I’ve seen online taken by other people - I find it to be distracting in my own work with CineStill 800T. That stems, mostly, from the fact that my own work does not lend itself well to the aesthetic in which 800T thrives. But the halation, it’s part of the film and it can’t be worked around. So my advice to you, from someone who never did this well to someone I hope will do this well, embrace the halation and learn to incorporate it into your images as an element that sets or creates the image mood and atmosphere.
800T is a green Labrador puppy, a cow bird in a cardinal’s nest. It’s there, it’s an oddity, something that was no longer is so that it can exist, and it fills a space in the market. Anyone looking at an 800T image knows that it is an 800T image. It’s a signature written large on a contract, and that contract says that if you put this film into situations that complement the aesthetic, then it will deliver unique and captivating results. CineStill 800T lives up to its end of that bargain.
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Video Index:
0:00 - Intro
0:13 - CineStill 800T Film
1:48 - CineStill 800T Characteristics
7:09 - CineStill 800T Spectral Sensitivity
8:12 - CineStill 800T Halation
10:52 - CineStill 800T Reciprocity Failure
11:40 - CineStill 800T Recommended Camera Settings
13:35 - CineStill 800T Review
References:
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"Rock this Joint" by Edward Joe Meyers used under active license from Epidemic Sound at the time of this video's upload. - แนวปฏิบัติและการใช้ชีวิต
Spot on review - great stuff! XP2 Super in B&W chemistry is something nobody on TH-cam has covered yet. There's an article with examples right on Ilford's website using hc-110 and ISO 50 through 1600. Gratz on the Kickstarter - looking forward to trying pinhole for the first time:)
Thank you!
Great video as always.
1. Have u tried Cinestill's ECN-2 kit with either Vision 3 or 800T?
2. How about the various Cinestill E-6 kits (on E-6 films)
3. Would like to see your thoughts on Bergger Pancro 400 and Acros II, e.g. what film speed, what developer/development times.
Thank you, David!
1- I have not. I want to do a video n Kodak 5207 (I'm making on on cross-processing as black and white, but I want to make one for it with ECN-2 processing.) So I might try that on some rolls before I order another 500 feet of 5207.
2- Also no. I haven't tried any CS chemistry yet, but I do have a D96 monobath packet in the darkroom for when some of my current chemistries run low.
3- Me, too. So Across I I have used a bit (I have about ten rolls right now and I'm shooting it off an on.) I haven't used it enough yet to have a preliminary judgement. I haven't used Bergger film in a long time. I was about 50% through a Bergger AAF video when they canceled the stock I was working on, so I haven't been back. Nothing against them; there are just higher-priority stocks right now.
David, thanks for the video and thanks for all the hard work you put into. I like to ask: Did you used a filter to shoot in day light?
Thank you and no I didn't.
Please do another 800T with night time or low light or neon lights. I've seen some amazing pics, and would like to see what you can do with it
I'll give it some thought. I recognize that the work I usually do is outside of where this film is typically used to best effect.
Great review, as always! I wonder if as time goes by Cinestill 400D will become their most popular stock, because it’s certainly the better product-daylight balanced and a reduced but still pleasant halation.
Thank you! I started shooting 400D a bit and I think it's a good film, a much different look than 800T. So I think it would be for a different market than is 800T.
Its worth noting that if you use a 1/8 or 1/4 black pro mist, the red from the halations disappears. You still get the glow or "bloom" from you light sources and pinged highlights, but the red glow is gone.
Source: the tens of rolls ive shot on 6x7 that ive used the promist on.
Thank you! I did not know that.
I'm trying out every film I can get my hands on just to get the feel of them and by far the one I've liked most is Kodak 250D Cinefilm. There's something about it I really like. The grain is so smooth (I don't know technical terms) to the point you can hardly see it yet it still has a filmic look. I will keep on testing film stocks but I think I might end up using it exclusively.
I LOVE 250D. I'm going to make a video about cross-processing that as black and white. It's fantastic as a black and white film.
Something seems weird about 250D in sample images I've seen. I can't tell if the colors aren't quite to my taste, or if it's the fact that most images I see are probably cross processed in C-41.
I just ordered a 100' roll of 50D specifically because I was unsure about the colors of 250D. Otherwise I would have gone with the faster film, as the grain is very smooth and unobtrusive.
If you have tried 50D as well, is it the cross processing that ruins it like I suspect? Or is it actually a different look even when processes correctly?
@@lobsterbark I had mine processed the recommended way, ECN-2, at the lab. To me they came out pretty neutral with possibly a slight magenta tinge with sunset pics. From the samples I've seen a lot of them have a strong yellow cast and sometimes a blue cast. I'm pretty sure they're not supposed to look like that because none of mine do. 250D is really sharp and grain almost non-existent in full daylight.
@@doozledumbler5393 Damn, sounds like I should have gone for the 250D. I now have 100' of 50D to go through before ordering any more cine film.
I have shot three rolls of 50d at this point, and the only real color cast I've noticed from it is a yellow. It's like the yellow cast that Gold 200 often has, but much less overwhelming, and easier to remove in post if you don't like it.
So I think the colors are probably noticably different than 250D, as I never noticed a magenta cast in any photos I have taken. But still, if there isn't anything strong I would like it.
Inspired by this video, I shot a roll of 35mm 800T and it came back from the lab with static discharge marks on every single shot. So yes, apparently it is still an issue.
Dangit. I'm sorry to hear that. That absolutely sucks.
@@DavidHancock Thanks. Oh well, it was a risk I was taking. I feel like using an automatic camera with prewind loading contributed to it.
Cost factor is what makes Cinestill a non-starter for me. Portra 800 would be my choice for all of the reasons in this otherwise a very well articulated review.
I also, as a personal preference, prefer the look of Portra. For the work I do, it's just a better match. I think CS 800T has a specific look that really suits a pretty specific aesthetic.
Did you use an 85B filter for the daylight images ?
Nope.
@@DavidHancock So, you corrected the white balance with the scans later ?
@@Ryan-lc4bl The lab scanner did it automatically. The lab I use has a really good Norita and it corrects colors well.
@@DavidHancock
Nice.
I thought most people would shoot it under tungsten lights, but apparently it works well without a filter in daylight too.
Will you be reviewing the other Cinestill film stocks?
I did 5222 a few years back before it was a CineStill stock. 50D I shoot off and on. I will review it but not this year or next, I don't think. I have some really exciting films in the queue right now.
The "magic" by which Cinestill manages to not have remjet is "Asking Kodak to leave the remjet off of their custom large scale order, and Kodak saying ok sure". Cinestill doesn't remove it anymore, they just get it direct special for them.
Oh interesting. I wonder if that's a change since I made this video.
@@DavidHancock Maybe, they did initially back in the day remove it themselves.
I would prefer much cheaper Kodak Vision 3 500T which is actually the same film stock not deprived of a necessary antihalation layer processed as intended in ECN-2 process which is very doable and cheap at any home bathroom lab. (I personally did 20+ rolls of ECN-2 at home) Unfortunately not every film photographer likes measuring and mixing powders and liquids. But still a great film stock
I would be willing to try that. I plan to buy and ECN-2 kit for next year and run some rolls of one of the motion films through it to see how I like the results.
@@DavidHancock Here is a few very important details people often miss when processing ECN-2 film. Stop bath seems to be very crucial to get proper color balance and has to be 40ml per 1 liter of 1.28g/l density car battery electrolyte (sulphuric acid). Some people use 1:7 white vinegar. Bleach and fixer can be used from any C-41 kit but ferricyanide bleach works the best and is simple to make. Any neutral rapid fixer is a good fixer. Blix is absolutely not recommended. Ready to use kits would work just fine but keep in mind importance of a stop bath. Process must go at 41.1C. Experiment with temperature drop to get that temperature right after pouring developer into a tank. It's also best to remove remjet prior to developing. Its 10-20 seconds of a borax based bath with a little agitation then the solution is to be reused (comes out yellowish and clear) and a decent shaking with 1/2 tank of regular tap water is what removes it all. Don't use baking soda. It works but not enough and your tank spools will get covered with remjet. Is not simple to clean. Washing soda doesn't work at all. People often confuse it with baking soda. Recommended borax bath keeps everything clean. Also the way developer gets into wet film in comparison with dry film affects colors as well. C41 is designed to go directly into developer while ECN-2 should be wet and free of remjet and some coloring/masking dyes which come out during remjet removal bath. You CAN open the tank after a stop bath (and a 2-5 min rinse). Is absolutely safe. You can get film out of the tank to remove remaining remjet with fingers under the tap then proceed to bleaching. Also it's cheaper to find CD-3 developing agent (at Artcraftchemicals for example) and get other chemicals at a local store then mix according to available recipes. Any decent 0.01g chinese scale would work just fine. Good luck!
@@DavidHancock I've been using FPPs super color negative kit, and it's great for cine films. I'm pretty sure it's an ecn-2 kit, they just don't advertise it as such to get more people to buy it. It's quite cheap, and the powder is very convenient because because it's easy to store without worrying about it going bad before you mix it.
Hey, I wanted to know, is mixing powders and liquids is cheaper than buying a ready ECN-2 kit?
@@Bartosz10000 Sure it is. If you find a good source of CD-3. I've seen it on eBay from a seller called AlexColor but it's even cheaper on Alibaba. Other components should be a couple of $ per kilo. You need a good jewelry scale though
Not enough pictures of gas stations at night. 😁
:D I didn't want to risk making all the Californians jealous of our low gas prices here.
I was wondering if anyone could help me please. How do u shoot film speed at 800 iso in the day. Thank you for any help at all
You would need either a camera with a fast shutter speed of up to about 1/8,000th or you would be limited to f/16 and f/22, or you need a strong neutral density filter (adjustable neutral density filters also work.)
@@DavidHancock thank you very much for your help. It been such along since I use film. So I'm trying to learn new things and film stock. Thank you again very much.
@@bobbydiamonddazzler3939 Nikon F90X has a 1/8000th shutter speed :)
I'm shooting Ilford Pan 400 @ 1600 ISO in daylight and all is perfect ;)
@@Bartosz10000 thank you for your advice. I have zenza Bronica ETRSi, it fastest shutter speed is only 500th
@@bobbydiamonddazzler3939 That's a little bit slow for me :)
I had Revueflex AC1 and there is 1/1000th and I think that the most of cameras have shutter speed like this or maybe 1/500, I mean the old ones ofcourse. Only if I remember correctly the Nikon FM2 has 1/4000, that was alot in those times 😀 Like Nikon D1 was very fast with 1/16000th 🙆♂️ it was 1999 I think when it came out.
Thumbs down for those halation ring socks!
BTW, how's your coffee reserve doing?
I know. I keep the coffee pretty well stocked. I have something like six pounds in the freezer right now.
@@DavidHancock So, during the imminent apocalypse, what gets shoved out of the freezer first...the film or the coffee?
@@ZommBleed LOL, the film. It will last longer. And so will my patience if I run out of it before I run out of coffee.
@@DavidHancock You can't see it, but I hit the thumbs up 1001 times. Ha ha
I've watched most of your All About Film videos, and I have to say that while you generally do a great job, this particular video is confusing and not super helpful. Your description says you don't like the halation effect, so why make this video at all? You took the fish out of water and judged its walking abilities. It's really surprising that you'd do this, considering the conscientiousness usually apparent in your content.
Fair question. A lot of people asked me to make the video. I don't happen to like the halation look, but that's purely an aesthetic preference. Lots of people do like it and for them this film could be a useful creative tool. There will just be films, from time to time, that I am not as well suited for because of my subjects. And some films I'll be well suited for. As long as people can walk away from these with an idea of how the tool could potentially fit their style or work, that's a success.
I‘m sorry David but there a lot of factual errors in this video. Plus some anecdotal things that I will share because CineStill 800T is the film I shot by far the most of. And I’m a cine film guy. I won’t get around to do that right now but maybe this evening. Just one thing I want to say right now because it drives me nuts. Movies are shot with 24 frames per second! And they have been since the introduction of sound.
What did I say on movies, 23 fps?
@@DavidHancock yes that’s what you said. I’m interested to hear what they have to say because I don’t hear any factual errors other than the simple 23 frames which isn’t even the point of the video. If someone came to this video to learn about frames per second I’d be surprised.