I wanted to buy a Rolex for almost 3 years now from an authorized dealer, for a good while I was under the spell of the marketing of these luxury watch brands. I eventually grew tired of waiting and realized the cheap watches ive worn every single day have been more then enough for me. Im glad my money is saved and going into more interesting things
Why buy a watch that you have to get on your knees and beg for ? Realise that most of what you pay goes to advertising, fancy franchises, sponsorship and celebrity endorsements. If people knew how much it costs to simply make a Rolex we would be shocked at the markup.
From my personal experience, I think the biggest threat to the watch industry is that the younger generations overall simply have no interest in watches anymore.
My 17 year old nephew contradicts your POV. After buying a quartz fashion brand (we all make mistakes) at 15, he came back from a trip in Japan and bought his first PRX (thank you sinking Yen and duty free). Great way to start his collection
I think it is the same with photography. The iPhone killed the entry level Point and shoot camera but the higher end cameras for enthusiasts are still there.
That’s a good comparison, but also remember that for many buyers a high end camera is a tool to do their job. I don’t have any job that requires a Rolex.
@@asotomayorme too. I’ve realized that in my early 30s. The motto I live by “stop buying things to impress people that don’t give a fuck about you.” And also if I can’t buy with twice with cash, I’m not buying it at all. “Luxury” items have to have a meaning for me…for me…not to impress anyone.
A. Lange & Sohne is the watch you wear for yourself, no one else. But there are a ton of independents joining those ranks like Trilobe etc mentioned in the video.
I am a technology geek and IT professional. I do have a Suunto Smart GPS watch that I use for hiking and such where I like to leave my phone behind. But I find mechanical watches fascinating in their mechanical complexity and enjoy working on them, building them and wearing them. Its a nice change from computer technology that I work with everyday and appreciate how these mechanical devices were made long before computers and often by hand.
I'm also a software engineer, but I studied mechanical engineering. I like to build watches as well, but I also enjoy factory ones. To this day I did not use a smartwatch. For me it's a statement to wear a mechanical watch in a high tech business, especially when in meetings with customers who are in the chemistry and engineering industry.
I can't believe nobody else seems to be mentioning it, but this is a wealth disparity problem. On one side of the equation, there are more people than ever with the funds to spend well into the 5, 6, or even 7 figures on a watch. And this is where brands make the highest margins, so of course it's a big focus. On the other side, the masses have less disposable income to spend on superfluous luxuries than they have in generations. Someone who might have celebrated a big promotion in 1975 by spending the equivalent of 4 figures on a watch (a steel Daytona was $500, that's under $3k adjusted for inflation) simply isn't getting promoted in 2024.
@@MH5tube true but there are a lot of people on the fringe who are opting out of the market including myself. Ive put together a collection of Omegas, Breitling, Tag, a Datejust but further purchases dont make sense anymore. In fact i wouldnt mind reducing the number from 12 to 5
I'm 67 & when I was young we didn't have the internet as a way to make $$. You had to work a factory job or go into the military,even athletes were crazy rich till the mid 70s. You are right about the big gap between em.
He hasn't got more subscribers, precisely because he is an intellectual. Lol. This video on watch market decline is ironically reflective of society's trend to become dumber.
The only thing watchmakers are accomplishing by raising their prices to insane levels is making people realize that their watches that they bought just a few years ago were a great value and that new watches aren't needed.
I do not agree with you, making a mechanical watch is very hard specially when it comes to assembling/producing the watch pieces. All the people that are working in these watch houses have amazing manual skills and they really put passion in what they are doing that reflect in the way a watch works and finish of the watch, it's almost like a jewel. The prices are so high because of the high finishing of the watch and all the manual labor that involves making a watch, all these cost money and Switzerland is Switzerland the standards are a little bit higher and also the life cost :).
@@weisseadleri'm a watchmaker and i disagree with you. The finishing in recent releases are simply not there, a lot of machine finishing and forgoing of inner angles for easier round corners for some of the big brands. Less innovation and higher usage of basic etachron regulators in luxury models
@@tristanho1533 I presume if the sell it's not there of course they will try to machine everything or cut corners in order to reach their financial goals and exploit the brand as much as possible to get through. But thanks to the insight, good to know.
Go to the watch shops in Interlaken and Zurich There will be 40 or 50 Chinese tourists in each. Happily buying Swiss Army Knives at $2,000 and watches at $20,000.
I don't think too many are priced out. The high end luxury swiss...yes. But REAL luxury watches have always been for the rich. The rich are still buying $200K watches as we speak. But there are good swiss watches for under $500. The money isn't the issue. The real issue is that watches aren't needed. In addition a cheap $200 quartz watch is better and more accurate, so for those that actually need a watch, a swiss watch is not needed.
I had considered buying a Rolex, but decided to just pay off my house instead. Since then, I asked myself if I even need a watch and now I think I will avoid even buying any watch. Time is everywhere. On my computer, on my stove, on the wall and on my cell phone. I rarely have a need for a watch unless I am traveling, then a cell phone is a little cumbersome.
I tried smartwatches but only as a tool. I think of regular watches as a fashion statement. Its fun to wake up each day and think which watch i will wear that day. They are also a work of art to the beholder.
If you have a modern cellphone you don't NEED a smartwatch. You WANT a smartwatch. The only exceptions are people that use it for the gym, or people that want to monitor sleep and heart rate constantly. But MOST just want a cellphone on their wrist to give them social media notifications in 1 second, instead of 4 seconds getting your phone. To me a smartwatch is not a watch. Its a cellphone without the ring ring, and I don't need another procrastination tool. A watch is different.
100%. I’ve had two smart watches (gifts) and came to the same conclusion. Yes, for counting my steps it’s ok, but my GShock can do that if I need to. I prefer wearing an automatic watch in almost every situation. I was wearing a Super Ocean daily for almost two decades of military and federal LE work, I’m retired now and was recently gifted a Monaco so that’s my daily. No interest in a smartwatch, I think their utility is overrated.
thats crazy to say because a watch is one of the most useless things in the digital era. the same you said of checking notifications 3 seconds faster can also be said for checking the time. watches are objectively brinking on obsolete for their main purpose of keeping time.
I use my smart watch for work as I normally get around 70 phone calls per day, and will oftentimes miss the calls when I’m running around. It also helps me screen a call to see if I need to answer it when I’m mid conversation with someone. Lastly, if I need to do something physical, I take that my watch since I don’t care to beat it up, and allows me to pick up calls on my wrist vs digging in my pocket with dusty or dirty hands. It’s simply a tool. I do prefer and will more often than not wear a mechanical watch to work though whenever my schedule allows me that. Usually it will be meeting days or more casual visits to sites where I’m just checking in. Both have their place. I also will purposefully wear a mechanical watch when I want to disconnect, since it’s hard for me to get away.
You make zero sense. A smart watch actually does something other than keep time. It’s much more useful than a mechanical watch. I wear my smart watch 90% of the time but I collect mechanical watches. I don’t collect smart watches.
Anecdotal evidence: I work in tech consulting and I see that more and more smartwatches are being abandoned in favor of, uh, watches. From my personal experience, a 24/7 tactile notification on my wrist started to drive me crazy; seemingly it's also the case for people I work with.
Yeah, I have noticed that once people get used to having something that tells the time on their wrist they're much more likely to get a regular watch, whether they keep using a smart watch or not.
I have a Fitbit Smart watch and eventually stopped wearing it because charging it became just another chore and getting notifications on both my watch and my phone was really annoying if I was trying to concentrate. I think a subset of people are finding that it's better to be less connected instead of more connected.
@@denis888red I have both a smart watch and quartz watches tbh I don’t have a lot of love for mechanical watches maybe I’m too hard on them?😅 I’m 32 and I’ve kept an interest on them but at the end of the day smart watches are not the enemy per se it’s just a tool watch that’s easy to comprehend. I know you can do math with a navitimer it’s just not very user intuitive
Every time you make a video I’m amazed at your knowledge. I listen to everything you say carefully and find myself rewinding to make sure I’ve understood what you’ve said. On other channels I find myself constantly fast forwarding as there’s so much irrelevant information.
Thanks - Very kind of you. To be fair - For a video like this the last bit is very much me "crystal balling". I could be wrong but I think it's a fun discussion regardless 😊😊
The Casio F91W is all I need. A legendary watch for every day. I wear it to work, in the shower, when I go swimming, and even when I go to bed. This watch has started many conversations because so many people know this legendary watch and love it for its simplicity.
@@arnoldd7073 The claimed water resistance isn't good but the actual water resistance is superb. I think the size is perfect for the average man's wrist. It's only in recent years that big watches have become fashionable. Personally I think it looks like a kid wearing his dad's watch.
luxury watches are just status symbol since the quartz watch crisis. why would people pay 10 of thousands dollar to read incorrect time (off by couple to tens of second per day)??
Lets be real, Young adults are struggling financally in alot of countries and are less welloff than their parents were. Anyone who spends multiple thousands on a watch while not owning a home is an idiot in my eyes aswell
Slot of it is young people get that credit card & get behind an eight ball. People were generally more conservative in their spending buying starter homes,now everyone has to have master suites & pools . Many young people opted out of the work force to live off the land,good luck w/ that
This is why I bought an Invicta Pro Diver. I was like, "Lemme get this straight: I can have a great watch that will last me years and years, will go down to 200m under the ocean, AND I can dilute the Rolex brand at the same time?? Good lord, sign me up!" hahahaha
@@XxXHardcoreshredderxXXxxxxxxxx I know. I'm weird. haha But in my own defence, I'm the GOOD type of weird. (Good weird ends up finding the cure for cancer. Bad weird runs naked down main street.)
@@Maplecook I'm neutral weird. (We do a little bit of both from time to time for character development) I learn from my mistakes, so I make as many as I can. It's a life hack if you think about it. I'm not an Invicta fan but I think I like them genuinely more than Rolex at this point. Current Rolex anyway. The special editions are usually cool, but the vintage Rolex stuff is the Grail worthy stuff. But either way I'd rather have a chronometre Bleu than 6 rolexs lol
Wonderful content as always, Mike, and the comment section is a goldmine of alternate opinions. It took an (enjoyable) half an hour to watch and another half an hour (easily) to read the comments!!!!
Thanks. Yes. I can sometimes be a bit forceful in the way I state my opinions in the videos, but I do honestly not believe that I am the owner of a "truth". I have a view. I share it and people are free to discuss, expand, challenge and disagree. I learn something every time from the comments. 😊😊😊
Whether it's $10 or $10,000, a wristwatch of any kind is a luxury these days. That means it's nice to have, not need to have. As you mentioned, most people can just check the time on their smartphones. It's challenging enough to get some people to consider wearing a watch at all, let alone one that costs a few hundred dollars. Collectors consider $500-1,000 watches "budget," but the average person will laugh at that label. Best of luck to watchmakers. They really need to capture the non-enthusiast audience now.
very true... I only started to wear a watch since I needed a timer and could not use a phone. Most people do not like wearing them, or do not like the ideas of jewelry on their hand or worst find them tacky. Most I see are F91w, calculator casio since they are cool and retro, and sadly rarely see automatic since NO ONE WANTS TO WIND THEM! Also, now that I have 2 automatics frankly I got bored of them their soul bs.
True. 99% of people consider a budget watch to be under $50. These guys here talking about how $500 is "budget" almost made me quit the video right away. $500 for something that only tells the time and nothing else is an absolute disgrace and unless you are a collector, you will never find that acceptable. Smartwatches cost $500 because they are a full computer in your wrist. Something that just tells the time, cannot cost the same, for 99% of people. I have a few $20-$50 watches and I love them, and the moment casual brands started raising their prices I started looking at Pagani Design (chinese) and others because I dont care about the brand, and if a brand asks $2000 for something that just tells the time, those brands can die for all I care. You can buy a Xiaomi Band for $29 that does thousands of things. You just cannot convince the average joe to buy a watch anymore, let alone a $500-$2000 one
"They really need to capture the non-enthusiast audience" This is totally incorrect because it's not something they will ever be able to do now. Watches are pointless with everyone having cellphones and other smart devices. The only people who care are enthusiasts and people who want to wealth signal. They know this and they are pricing and marketing to match
@@btt449 True, but the sad part even the rich do not care about it, they care more about tech more than anything else and are over 40, not under. I see the rich always jumping on the top iphone, latest tesla and latest iwatch, not latest rolex, etc. Most that get a watch do not want a smart watch or the privacy orientedh.
This is the same as Harley-Davidson’s problem - younger people aren’t buying them. A cell phone is their way of telling time. Include the Apple Watches and it is making regular watches a niche item sadly. F Rolex - too expensive and there are lots of other great brands out there!
Many folk talk about how the majority of the smartwatch-wearing populace won't use most of its features, but honestly, I never used a tachymeter or chronograph on my watch; in fact, I never dived 200 meters to check my dive watch. Watches for me are a piece of luxury, not an everyday necessity.
@@MK-ri2ks I do agree that fancy expensive watches are not my cup of tea either. I do like a basic watch on my wrist for a quick glance at the time rather than having to pull out my phone. It will do the rest. That being said, I do appreciate mechanical movements for what they are, enjoy working on them and building them from parts as a break from my technology job. I wouldn’t spend the money on status symbols though either. Although those expensive watches are a piece of art, I feel people buy those more for ego than anything. It’s often people who can’t afford them, not unlike expensive cars. I do have a couple of rich friends, and they don’t wear expensive watches either.
I am currently wearing a dive watch rated for 1,000 feet. If it is ever that far beneath the surface and on my wrist, I am fish food. Watches are jewelry that tell time in my book. I enjoy them but think that retail prices for many are absurd.
I wear a smart watch when I do “activities”, gym, MTBing etc etc, but I love a “proper” watch for the rest of the time. Once Apple makes a smart ring I’ll probably get one of those and use the smart watch even less.
I've been a Garmin sports watch user for about 3 years now, prior to that I used my phone as a watch. Smart watches are useful but have no character or visual appeal. I bought a Casio Duro 2 weeks ago because l liked the look of the dial and it's general appearance, simplicity and functionality. The Duro is cheap and cheerful but beats a smartwatch on looks any day. The Garmin will now be used as a fitness tracker as it has zero wrist appeal to me. Thank you for your great insights, professional delivery and channel content. Be greeted from South Africa.
This is the best watch content on TH-cam . Some of these brands are delusional because they will never appeal in the same way that the top brands do, IWC come straight to mind. their prices are absolutely ridiculous. The 2.5-4k customer has traditionally been the bread and butter of many of these companies.
The most underrated WatchTuber on TH-cam once again gives us a C-suite executive leadership overview of the state of the industry and business mentality. Aka: why the hell do brands do what they do and what are they hoping to achieve? I could listen to Mike talk about freight shipping and paper mills and find it interesting
@@jeririce4928 He's thinking the same, being a post-doctoral researcher in cutting edge physics is very badly paid. I've suggested that he should get a job designing advanced guidance systems for smart weapons, good pay and perks I'm told.
I really hate smartwatches. It’s turning everyone into social handicaps. Every time I’m with someone with a smartwatch they stop their conversation mid-sentence to look at their watch to check a text or email they got. It’s incredibly rude and inconsiderate of those around you. I will never believe that a smartwatch should replace a good mechanical watch, even if they do keep better time. There’s something pure and special about owning and using a mechanical watch. It’s something that you can wear everyday and appreciate for its aesthetics and mechanical design, in addition to accurately keeping track of time (the whole point of a watch). You can do all that, while not being distracted by your watch while in conversations with those around you.
Points 1. Almost every person who bought a premium Swiss watch, started with entry level Seikos, Tissots, etc. If young people don't even venture close to a quartz, forget mechanical, it reduces the probability they'll spend on luxury mechanical movements. It can still happen, just that chances are much lower. 2. Very few "need" a watch. I can get the time from my phone, laptop, microwave, gas stove, refrigerator, tv, car, etc. etc. etc. Even fewer "need" a luxury watch. A $20 Casio may fulfil a need that a microwave watch can't fulfil. Anything above that price, is a "want". Watches ARE jewelry. By definition, they're for adornment. 3. Let's face it. The watch industry has had very little innovation in the last few decades. Every innovation from fumé dials to minute repeaters is decades old tech. A tiny thing like quick-release clasps is standard in most smart watches but NOT in traditional watches. Why not??!! Is it that expensive or are they just lazy? 4. No one has a plan. Apart from a few half-assed attempts from Frederick Constant and Tag, very few are trying to combine smart watch tech with traditional.
I don't want or need to carry a smartphone with me all the time. I don't want or feel the need know my heart rate or how many steps I walked. However, I do need to know what time it is. It's amazing that for 4.5m years of evolution humans ever survived without 'Smart' products 😂
Oh, they have a plan, it's to make it so appealing that you are willing to fork over your Pounds or Dollars in a very short amount of time. Someone had to pay for all those superfluous HQ buildings they have built. :-)
On your third point, mechanical watches have started to reach the peak of what you can do with them in terms of innovations, and there’s not much you can do to really change the game anymore without creating some wild and wacky concepts. The most significant innovation in modern watchmaking is probably the GS spring drive, and that’s from a manufacturer very little normal people know or care about Edit: and on your fourth point, how the hell are you supposed to combine smartwatch functionality and traditional watchmaking with modern day technology? That’s the kind of shit you’d need advanced technology for (seriously; the best thing I can think of is if you had a small projector sitting under the front crystal to act as a display, which would require technology leagues more advanced than anything we have right now if it’s supposed to look good). And not for nothing, but if watchmakers started doing that, I guarantee you that most of us hardcore watch guys would disown the industry for that simple reason
@@dainiu regarding point number four, you remind me of motorcycles. Traditionally folks started in a cheaper bike and wanted a Harley. Some eventually got one. The price continues to rise, and there were periods of supply shortage. Harley determined nobody really wanted to modernize the look of the bike (they did like some improvements but no change to the overall look). I thinks it's the same, generally, with aspirational watches.
Mike, It is so refreshing to hear your unique perspective on the watch industry in every new video. No two are the same. Makes me think and digest your perspective. Most of the time I end up agreeing with you. I do enjoy your perspective on the watch industry all of the time because it is so refreshingly unique. I think it is because you lead the dialogue and don’t tell us what we should think. Instead, you let us connect your dots and make up our own minds like thought leaders should!
Very kind of you. As for agreeing with me? You don't have to. I have a perspective. I share it and then you can make up your own mind as you also state 😀
The problem with the current sub-4k microbrand market is the era in which they exist - mechanical watches are superfluous and outperformed by digital/smart watches AND they dont solve important problems. Once upon a time mechanical watches were the cadence of daily life, tracked dive times in the nascent scuba hobby, they measured elapsed race times, and kept track of multiple time zones when traveling, etc... Modern sub-4k microbrands dont address any new challenges -and are thus relegated to nice looking trinkets. Many will linger in slim profit margins but plenty will vanish.
@@denis888red the hobby won’t die per say but I can see a collapse of the Swiss watch industry, hell with china manufacturing collapsing do they even have the parts to maintain all the watches now. In many ways the Swiss did this to themselves, you can sell the trick once but never twice.
@@NinjaNovice I disagree. The smart watch solved nothing. All it did was extend functionality of a smart phone to a smaller screen on your wrist that happens to display time.
As TAG and IWC. Saw the Ingenieur at the local boutique. No way possible would I pay that much money for that watch. They had a SST/Everose 36mm DJ in stock and I would pay the $14K for that watch, but NOT $11,700 USD for an IWC. My Yachtmaster I just took devilery of was only $12,300 USD. I only waited two months when my AD had it ready for me.
It is a shame about the Ingeneur. That was a great watch once. They could have had a great release, but they had to push the price. I wonder if these brands will be able to buy themselves out of Richemont and try to survive. Baum & Mercier cannot keep going like they are, and JLC seems to be shooting themselves in the foot. There is such a huge gap in the market, and I cannot understand why none of the big brands are trying to exploit this. I assume the conglomerates are forcing prices up. It looks like a miscalculation.@@romanmichaelhamilton8729
The ingeniuer is a gerald genta design from a reputable watch brand that makes quality luxury watches, why should it be priced significantly less than a royal oak or a nautilus?
Completely agree with many of the points in this video. If you see someone in the supermarket wearing an Anordain or Fears, you can’t tell if it’s their only watch or if they are resting their Patek. If I were in marketing, I would tap into this.
I am an IT professional geek too and an early smart watch adopter, from vintage Timex Microsoft DataLinks to Sony's boths SWs. They all are still working. Soon I realized that my smartphone replaced them perfectly. My answer to all the actual smart & iWatches is: On my right hand I am permanently wearing a smart workout & heart & sleep tracker - a now five year old cheap and reliable Honor Band 5 (IP68). So I can daily choose between my collection's 108 extraordinary (and inexpensive) watches on my left hand - from 70ies LED via LCD to quartz analog or mechanical watches. They are mostly vintage throwbacks, beloved outfits and great joy for a boomer like me.
You are absolutely right. People nowadays, are "communicating " with beautiful mechanical, beautiful dial watches ,with basic reliable movements like Selita or Seiko. Consumers are not herd any more . This is why I believe that it is now the era of microbrand mechanical watches and digital ones . People are fed up of the milking techniques of the well known brands . Thanks again Nizar
I am a software engineer working on Apple platforms, Apple fanboy and heavy Apple tech user. However! After four years my Apple Watch died. The cost of repair - by Apple or others - is higher than the cost of a recent generation new. I’m dismayed by the disposable mindset. I’m also fed up with tech - yes even me - encroaching on every aspect of our lives. I’m also bored that everyone has the same watch. Individuality has gone. It’s no longer an accessory nor is it a statement. My replacement will be a mechanical watch. I have gone full cycle.
i am a samsung all the way i am anti apple, same my samsung watch gaved up now garbage.i am buying a OMEGA chronograph 2 tone gold metal and black ceramic 15k am tired also of looking at dumb smart plastic watches.
I bought a used galaxy watch 4 a while back and stopped wearing it because the battery would always drain so quickly. when I looked up a tutorial on how to replace the battery, the replacement parts were more expensive than the price I paid for the entire watch. The reason I switched to a mechanical watch is because that in the rare event that it needs repairs, it's made from "off the shelf" parts. That, and the service was really good when I bought the watch around Christmas last year.
If Rolex calls me and says your watch has arrived, I'm not sure if I want to go and pick it up, and I'm not sure if I'm still enthusiastic about it. I'll probably say that I've given up buying it. Rolex has killed my enthusiasm for mechanical watches.
Beauty is always going to impress. That is why on my watch collecting I focus on the beauty and the story and not the brand. Before entering watch collecting I worn a 48mm smartwatch with 2GB memory, music, speakers, phone calls, 2weeks of battery life. Gifted it as a present and now I own 10 mechanical/automatic and 2 quartz (the dress ones, small second+chrono). I have watched you for a long time. I think you should focus more of beautiful watches instead of brand watches. Love your channel.. As always, John Leatherworks
Great video as always. I love how you take every topic & cover it from all aspects, also providing great insight. This format is great & i appreciate your take on these things, specially when the watch youtube space is full of Shouty & Same type of videos providing Zero insight or any sense of originality/creativity in terms of content. People like you are the True gem of this community. Keep up the good work!
I am also fascinated by how these trends occure with many other products. At one time manufacturers would build low end devices to reduce manufacturing costs by increasing component volumes . . . now they don't seem to care. At one time I provided market analysis for a very lage telecom company. Mike you will be aware of total market, addressable market and served market sizes - I was the numbers person . . . using other people's data plus internal optimism. Sadly we as customers collude with the manufacturers with their increasing specs and rising prices - also the new items are often less reliable, more complex and expensive to service . . . this is happening with many things in life. Now mainly interested in independent manufacturers or where possible I design and build things myself - e.g. modified G-Shock. Recent example . . . sub 8 second car to 60 miles an hour, manual gearbox, petrol engine . . . last built in 2019 . . . keep it simple it may then last 10 years. Audi has now discontinued the A1 range. Once a Saab owner . . . they were renouned for repeat customer purchases.
One downside to the Apple Watch and other smartwatches is that they're only available in one size, which doesn't always fit properly. Given the current fashion trends, it's not uncommon to see people wearing watches that are too big for their wrists and probably uncomfortable to wear. At the end of the day, the most important thing when buying a watch is that it fits your wrist and hand. I think this is also the reason for many bad purchases. It's not just about the shape, but also the size. When it comes to size, a lot of people only think about lug-to-lug width, but the height and shape also make a big difference. Good watch brands usually offer different sizes or even one model in several sizes. It's surprising that this central aspect is ignored, given all the discussions about brands and whether it needs to be smart or not. When you buy jeans, you make sure they fit. So why don't most people do the same when buying a watch?
My Apple Ultra has become my everyday "Beater"... I still own a a couple nice Swiss mechanicals (50 Fathoms & Santos) for "dress" & I enjoy them a lot when they're on my wrist, but Smart watches are here to stay...
My two cents. When approaching a first, or subsequent luxury watch purchase, seems there are three frames of mind. 1). Looking to signal something about success. 2). Not looking to signal anything but cognizant that a luxury watch may signal something and this impacts the buying decision, which brand etc. 3). Not looking to signal anything and either not aware or disinterested that others, who don’t know you, may form an opinion about your motives or character based upon the watch you own. My frame of mind started at #3 and shifted to #2 over time and has never been #1. And the watch people I know have followed the same path. Point is that while I’m sure some first time luxury watch buyers are looking to flex, to fit in with those in their new, elevated strata, I suspect that most don’t. As a watch enthusiast community we need to be cognizant of the inherent risk of assuming anything about another person’s motivations or character.
Watch people can deny all they want but mechanical watches are just jewelry for men. Nobody in this day and age needs a mechanical watch. But are they cool? Hell yeah
Absolutely, but there are some practical and aesthetic benefits to owning mechanical watches. I find they distract me less at work than phones, for example. Watching the seconds hand can also be oddly relaxing, especially if it's powered by a spring drive!
Fun fact: Watches are for everyone ... not 'for men' ... and ... likewise jewellery isn't 'for women'? (Maybe all yall boys who have derpy fighter-jet pfps aren't allowed to wear jewellery; sucks to suck.)
A similar thing happened to Cameras, the Smart phone has a Camera as good as most £100 to £250 cameras. The budget camera has disappeared and the better quality ones are much more expensive.
I’ve always liked to wear a proper watch on my left wrist. Any other jewelry there just feels wrong. An Apple Watch or whatever is ridiculously small for any functions beyond telling the time anyway. I like a nice mechanical watch with display back if possible so I can watch and appreciate its independence. Great video!
Thanks and agree - For me the AW and similar watches are too much of a compromise. It's great for a run, but not in a practical "work" situation. And they don't look good.... Datejust on the wrist. Now that's a looker Cheers 😊😊
In this economy, I would say the bigger flex is having your retirement funds set, your house mortgages paid off, your car loan paid off and steady streams of income in place. After all that is done, THEN I MAY consider a luxury mechanical watch (If I have some funds left aside) For the time being I pretty happy with my rugged G Shock for weekends and traveling and my 30 USD casio quartz dress watch. I cant be broke in the bank and feel happy to carry a Daytona
I see the biggest threat to Swiss watches coming from very affordable and yet reliable and very well manufactured Chinese watches. Smart watches are a different category. They don't directly compete with traditional watches. But to me it looks like the market is flooded with decent looking and well made watches from China with a very low price. Those watches are hard to beat for Swiss watches in the range of 500 to 4000 Euros.
Another looming problem is that only the watch or the end product is luxurious. The moment you bought the watch most luxury is gone. When it comes to servicing the luxury experience rapidly declines. The cherry on top naturally being Rolex who dare to withhold your old parts and only exchanges them for new ones which you obviously have to pay aswell. Where is that a luxurious experience?
As someone that’s been collecting watches for a while it is the younger independent and microbrands that excite me most. I bought a Arcanaut a while ago and the case design, finishing and crazy fordite dials are like nothing else on the market right now.
I've gotten into watches almost a year ago. I've been watching a lot of watch content on TH-cam, and I've been inevitably influenced by the content I've consumed. But here is the thing Mike, even if I wasn't into watches I would still watch your videos -maybe not as frequently. You are the type of person who knows his subject well and articulates whatever he speaks about successfully. Appreciate the videos. Cheers.
I enjoyed this video. I think I diverge quite a bit in that I don't wear any of my watches for prestige or to flex, I wear them just because I love horology and design. There's something special to me knowing that this device on my wrist is beating like a heart and generally keeping perfect time within -5 to +7 seconds a day. That's just remarkable to me. The other point I'd like to touch on is that Smartwatches become obsolete. I purchased an Apple Watch Series 2 a decade ago and it doesn't work any more. The Hamilton Khaki Field I bought around the same point is still running like a champ, and I'd wager it'll still be running when I'm no longer here and it goes to whoever gets it. No one is going to want my current Apple Watch Ultra in 30 years, and that's IF it would even work with iPhone 40 or whatever would be around at that point.
Let's not start that debate. Mechanical watches can have ridiculous servicing costs. The ADs like to say "look no battery" but the downside is the equivalent of dozens of batteries
I'm an IT guy, worked for seven years in IT. My entire life, I have owned various: automatic, wind-up, quartz, and "smart" watches. Flipped all my smart watches. I used them for fitness tools but once they had a few errors and it felt like I had to troubleshoot again on my relaxing hikes, I very quickly lost interest. I do own a non-smart quartz Tag Heuer, which I enjoy a lot. My favorite are my automatics.
In the absence of any change, simply raising the price smells of desperation to recoup losses. It's a gamble that the customer will fold and buy anyway. Unfortunately this business model won't work in this economic reality, and is not sustainable. The next step I see is them cutting back production, staff, and service. Quality will be the last thing to go before it's over. If some of this plays out, most will funnel into the used market, or vintage market. I'm already there.
A friend of mine owns a Patek and he bought a replica to wear, but got them mixed up. Now he can't tell which is which for love nor money. And I find that hysterical.
Personally .. was waitlisted what seems like inevitably for a Daytona. In the interim, I found out how awesome the Garmin is for my active lifestyle. Not sure I’ll pickup the Daytona if/when they eventually call.
Hi Mike, I just wanted to thank you for your videos and the effort you put into creating them. I truly love the way you speak, it's structured and insightful, unlike many other bloggers who can be overly emotional. Thank you, and I wish you many more subscribers!
I believe the luxury, mechanical, sports, watch market is on borrowed "time". (Aside from the Holy Trinity & Lange) The day's of walking into an AD & buying a Sub, will return in a few years. The more formal Dress Watch segment could see a real resurgence, though! Smart watches still can't compete here, yet! The rise of Cartier to the top of the sales charts, isn't a fluke.
Three years ago, my daughter launched her own watch brand, Möels & Co, and I must say it’s incredibly hard work. It requires constant effort, resilience, and a significant amount of cash to succeed in the crowded watch market. Despite the challenges, her passion continues to drive her forward, and she has just launched her second design.
Don’t sell your mechanical watches yet. See how long this garmin lasts. I predict after a few years, your smartwatch will be outdated and unsupported due to Operating System updates until it’ll turn into a non-watch and you need to buy a new one, whilst your mechanical watch will keep going. That’s what happens to our phones.
We need to remember that most of these reports are reporting on the wholesale price and not retail value. It depends and pays to look for what value is base for each report. We can assume a watch with a retail value of $5k is counted as a wholesale or „export“ value of $2,500-$3,000
I mean, there is an elephant in the room. I will give an example of a young university graduate, for example a junior doctor( resident doctor) in the UK. In the year 2000, the net monthly salary of junior doctor in dollars were something around 2500-2700, a rolex submariner then costed 3000-4000 dollars. In the year 2024 a rolex sub from AD is something like 9000-10000 dollars, while the monthly salary of a junior doctor( a resident doctor) in the uk stayed almost the same… the problem is stagnant wages in most of western world, rising living costs, rising luxury watch prices
I am now 55 years old. I have been wearing the Apple Watch (Series 3, 4, 5, 6) for many years. I also have two Casio retro watches, which I wear from time to time. But in recent months I've realised more and more HOW MUCH these smartwatches actually annoy me. Constant charging and overloaded with functions, 95% of which I don't need at all. I'm currently in a phase where my focus is on automatic watches. These little mechanical masterpieces, without any electronics, have a very special appeal. And if we live in the ‘zombie apocalypse’ at some point (😃), they will still work!
I'm 59 years old and I've never understood the appeal of smart watches. Like mobile phones they turn the user into a zombie and they have absolutely no character or soul. Your Casio is cool.
Fortunate that I am and always have been, even since a young boy, enamored with mechanical watches for what they are…brilliant creations of passion and skill. That’s why I prefer mechanical watches.
You are not wrong... I have seen guys who were previously into watches go into other hobbies like cycling or MMA. The times they are'a changing my friend and not in our favor. I am worried about the little guy. The microbrand owner who truly cares about his passion but there is just not enough revenue to keep holding on... As things get tighter for us as consumers we tend to spend less on luxury items and unfortunately as these brands begin to die off we will have less choice and value than before. I hope I am wrong but I expect another quartz crisis in the near future. Hope you are doing well man and still rocking that FXD!
There's no doubt that those small brands have it incredibly tough. 2 watches extra sold can mean the difference between profit in a month or a loss. I do believe it forces you to be creative and customer centric 😊😊
Cherishing anything analogue in the digital age is a rarity. My hobbies of book collecting, fountain pens, and watches often intersect. But sadly most people truly don't care. The main driver for people is utility and convenience.
Sony used to have a smartwatch which you could fit between the already existing bracelet. That way you could wear your regular watch and still get notifications on a tiny OLED screen when looking at the clasp. Too bad they released that too soon as it failed in sales. I'd love to have one of those right now.
I was talking to some pals about a friend who had "the suit, the hat and the watch." Can guarantee nobody was imagining he wore a smart watch. But I think the comments about the 30,000 dollar bike are on point.
a smartwatch is so important for my health tracking, i very often see in the evening "oh only 7k steps, let me take a walk" :) so very helpful plus my heart rate is monitored and i like seeing my notifications without picking up my phone all the time
Hardly! I wouldn't touch one of those PoS if they paid me. A watch is a piece of artwork that I can take with me wherever I go & the bonus is that I can also use them to tell the time....except my two LE Bel Cantos of course. 😁
I have both mechanical watches and Apple Watches, I understand that watches are not investment but the return on purchase ratio on mechanical watches, compared to the disposability of Apple Watches is still amazing. I used to get the Stainless steel Apple Watches that went for $799 new with the Milanese loop a few years ago, now the trade in asking price is like literally less than a 60 bucks, granted if I sell it for myself the most I can get is $100. At some point they will become obsolete hardware, leaving you with an expensive paperweight, which is what happened with the Apple Watch Editions that sold for 17k when they came out. That’s the only problem with smart watches, they are good for short term use which is on average 4-5 years and then you are forced to get a new one, which means I’ll come back full circle with something that can last me decades, if not more.
The advantage of smart watches is that you can sidestep the major problem of navigating the wide world of watches, including the tier system. Rolex or Omega? Longines or Tudor? Seiko or Hamilton? Smart watches eliminate these concerns. This has become especially apparent to me recently after buying 2 relatively expensive watches (Longines Zulu Time and Omega Aqua Terra) and watching people around me with Apple watches react with either indifference or shock/surprise (at the amounts involved). They are not one of our kind and exist in a completely different headspace. As for the future, some argue that only the higher end brands will survive and the rest will die, but as Omega and Rolex continue to move upmarket, I suspect more people will gravitate towards the premium (not entry level luxury, hate that term) brands such as Longines. I cannot see the market for more 'affordable' luxury watches disappearing anytime soon.
@@patrik3450 Medium to long term outlook, not short term, and I was referring more generally to watches in that category. Most watch brands have experienced a decline in sales, relatively speaking. Longines are still one of the biggest watch brands per sales volume, but brands like them will likely benefit when Omega becomes completely unreachable for a larger percentage of the watch buying public. Swatch know this, hence Longines' boutique expansion over the last 5-7 years.
@@patrik3450 shhhh, dont introduce facts, it has to be about confirmation bias and vibes thats why the most common comment about a new watch, typically luxury, under review is "It is overpriced," based on absolutely nothing except perhaps the commenters bank account or their drawer full of shitters that they think are the bees knees of "value for money."
@@davidr2802 It is a meaningless point. The whole market is going down. Swatch is playing the long game. Longines is just one example. Brands in that category of luxury/premium will very likely benefit from higher end brands becoming more unaffordable.
@@davidr2802 when I got to the "drawer full of shitters" I immediately beheld a vision of a large man named Archie, howling about how every man who doesn't own a Rolex before he's 40 is a "loser.....loooooooser......loser". If that's the vibe *you* want to give off, then more power to you, I guess.
I am planning to enter the swiss watch industry after my masters degree, this video has been a great ressource to gauge the market in a birdseye view rarely discussed! Thanks!
Historically, the average person who wore a watch was not a watch enthusiast. A watch enthusiast may have an Apple watch as a tool but a collection of traditional watches as a preference. The non enthusiast will go for the most efficient tool.
At 42, a lot of my friends and I have reached milestones the last decade where they would have celebrated with a Rolex purchase. Unfortunately, it was the same time one had to jump through so many hoops, pay above MSRP, have previous purchases, etc. etc . .that it just turned them off of high end watches in general
Mechanical watches are like suits and ties. When you go to Milan and you see a gentleman wearing this and think, wow that looks good. But back home you'll switch back to the practical option cuz people are generally lazy and simple.
Unless you're a multimillionaire then buying a luxury watch is a waste of money. Not only is it unnecessary, you can't afford it. You're simply falling for the marketing and believing buying something you can't afford will improve your life! Buy a nice Seiko and invest the rest.
Four main points go against the argument of smart watches killing traditional watches: 1) The explosion and proliferation of micro-brands ... And their success. 2) the HUGE success of Aliexpress watches (like them or not). 3) traditional watches will always be status symbols - especially higher end pieces and in the business community. 4) no one ever talks about the smart watched killing a brand like Casio. All smart watches mean (just like Aliexpress and microbrands) is that watch brands can't take things for granted anymore (price specs etc.).
A problem I can see is if the large volume manufacturers disappear or shrink drastically will the movement manufacturers be able to stay in business to provide the microbrands need for much smaller quantities? My experience of chinese movements (with the possible exception of Seagull)suggests they wouldn't be able to take up the slack with dependable alternatives.
Smartwatches also still enjoy of an element of novelty that will wear off sooner than we think. Once that's gone a fair amount of people will turn back to watches simply because as accessories they're nicer things to have on the wrist.
I just am weighing in to thank you. Your videos on the watch industry are qualitatively better than any "content" about watches on the internet. Please keep them coming. Your content is fact based and your "insights" are always "insightful".......
I have tried several Smart Watches until I recognized that theese are NOT watches which I am used to wear to see in an blink of an eye the time and the date.. But I was very used to the notifications of them, so now I have a 40$ Smartband on the right wrist and can use my belowed watches on the left wrist. I'm very happy with this solution.
Some thoughts: 1. I came for the watches. But by the end I'm thinking, that's a *really* nice shirt-jacket. 2. And I'm thinking about pie. Damn, I need some pie. 3. In terms of the pie (pie!), what's fascinated me is just how badly the Swiss smartwatch sector seems to have bombed. It may be that smartwatches are ultimately disposable and mechanical watches are ... well, that PP tagline; a $300 watch is a hit you can take, but no-one wants to think they're writing off the price of a TAG Connected every couple of years.
Vanity is fickle, at the present time, personal time is the flex, so Apple Watches are very popular. It shows you have the ability to "get away" from your responsibilities and also shows you have the ability to engage in hobbies to better yourself physically. I enjoy the intricacy of a mechanical watch and the detail of the finishing of higher quality watches. I'm also a bit of a luddite so I enjoy the traditions of getting a nice watch to celebrate your accomplishments in life or life's milestones (like the birth of your first grandchild). I do think your analysis is spot on, well thought out and perfectly explained.
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I wanted to buy a Rolex for almost 3 years now from an authorized dealer, for a good while I was under the spell of the marketing of these luxury watch brands. I eventually grew tired of waiting and realized the cheap watches ive worn every single day have been more then enough for me. Im glad my money is saved and going into more interesting things
Thats a good comment
I have the Rolex because they hold their value and tend to go up in value unlike some other designer crap that wears out and gets thrown away.
@@maxideas9393 what goes up, eventually must come dow n
@@maxideas9393
There's a world of watches between Rolex and fashion crap.
Why buy a watch that you have to get on your knees and beg for ?
Realise that most of what you pay goes to advertising, fancy franchises, sponsorship and celebrity endorsements.
If people knew how much it costs to simply make a Rolex we would be shocked at the markup.
From my personal experience, I think the biggest threat to the watch industry is that the younger generations overall simply have no interest in watches anymore.
none, zero
My 17 year old nephew contradicts your POV. After buying a quartz fashion brand (we all make mistakes) at 15, he came back from a trip in Japan and bought his first PRX (thank you sinking Yen and duty free). Great way to start his collection
@@PierreLampert Good for him pal but like the guy above, I'd say he's the exception that proves the rule.
That’s not true many buy them but not because they’re interested in them but for status symbols.
@@rey_s90As I said, just in my personal experience 🤷♂️
Swisz watch prices are killing the swiss watch market
Precisely.
That's what designer brands thought a few decades ago, and that's what ruined their reputation honestly
OVERINFLATED.
I think it is the same with photography. The iPhone killed the entry level Point and shoot camera but the higher end cameras for enthusiasts are still there.
Good parallel - Had not consider that one 😊
That’s a good comparison, but also remember that for many buyers a high end camera is a tool to do their job. I don’t have any job that requires a Rolex.
@@GreatNate Every other „Online Coach“ from Dubai would disagree. 😄
I am a few months from being 70 years old. I have realized I don't need to impress anyone. The type that worry about that barely see me anyway!🎉
Luckily I realized that way before, I like something and I buy it for me, not to impress anyone.
What watch(es) do you wear?
@@asotomayorme too. I’ve realized that in my early 30s. The motto I live by “stop buying things to impress people that don’t give a fuck about you.” And also if I can’t buy with twice with cash, I’m not buying it at all. “Luxury” items have to have a meaning for me…for me…not to impress anyone.
A. Lange & Sohne is the watch you wear for yourself, no one else. But there are a ton of independents joining those ranks like Trilobe etc mentioned in the video.
I came to the same realisation. It's rather liberating.
I am a technology geek and IT professional. I do have a Suunto Smart GPS watch that I use for hiking and such where I like to leave my phone behind. But I find mechanical watches fascinating in their mechanical complexity and enjoy working on them, building them and wearing them. Its a nice change from computer technology that I work with everyday and appreciate how these mechanical devices were made long before computers and often by hand.
Same!!!
Good to hear my friend....but you're an absolute rarity.
I'm also a software engineer, but I studied mechanical engineering.
I like to build watches as well, but I also enjoy factory ones.
To this day I did not use a smartwatch.
For me it's a statement to wear a mechanical watch in a high tech business, especially when in meetings with customers who are in the chemistry and engineering industry.
There is nothing more hypnotic than watching a second hand make it way around a dial. Why who knows.
Another great seminar from prof Mike.
@@Javic167 I agree as well. Wearing a tasteful mechanical watch looks businesslike and professional. I don’t think a smartwatch does that.
I can't believe nobody else seems to be mentioning it, but this is a wealth disparity problem.
On one side of the equation, there are more people than ever with the funds to spend well into the 5, 6, or even 7 figures on a watch. And this is where brands make the highest margins, so of course it's a big focus.
On the other side, the masses have less disposable income to spend on superfluous luxuries than they have in generations. Someone who might have celebrated a big promotion in 1975 by spending the equivalent of 4 figures on a watch (a steel Daytona was $500, that's under $3k adjusted for inflation) simply isn't getting promoted in 2024.
My mother bought my father a Rolex datejust in the 1960’s for £12. This was when you could get a new tyre for £1.
people are getting what they wanted with an admin that isn't legit in the first place...
@@MH5tube true but there are a lot of people on the fringe who are opting out of the market including myself. Ive put together a collection of Omegas, Breitling, Tag, a Datejust but further purchases dont make sense anymore.
In fact i wouldnt mind reducing the number from 12 to 5
I'm 67 & when I was young we didn't have the internet as a way to make $$. You had to work a factory job or go into the military,even athletes were crazy rich till the mid 70s. You are right about the big gap between em.
@@lynch42o Okay Ivan!
It’s bananas you haven’t got more subscribers. You’re the most intellectual watch channel out there 🎉
subbed
Very kind of you to say. I'm happy with my growth so far. As long as people enjoy what I'm doing I'm happy actually 😊😊
Subbed…bananas!
He hasn't got more subscribers, precisely because he is an intellectual. Lol. This video on watch market decline is ironically reflective of society's trend to become dumber.
Like listening to a MBA lecture. Mike’s Business Advice.😅
The only thing watchmakers are accomplishing by raising their prices to insane levels is making people realize that their watches that they bought just a few years ago were a great value and that new watches aren't needed.
I do not agree with you, making a mechanical watch is very hard specially when it comes to assembling/producing the watch pieces. All the people that are working in these watch houses have amazing manual skills and they really put passion in what they are doing that reflect in the way a watch works and finish of the watch, it's almost like a jewel. The prices are so high because of the high finishing of the watch and all the manual labor that involves making a watch, all these cost money and Switzerland is Switzerland the standards are a little bit higher and also the life cost :).
@@weisseadlerBut they aren't selling like they once did
@@Boababa-fn3mrDepends, look at Rolex, they are opening a new factory in 2025.
@@weisseadleri'm a watchmaker and i disagree with you. The finishing in recent releases are simply not there, a lot of machine finishing and forgoing of inner angles for easier round corners for some of the big brands. Less innovation and higher usage of basic etachron regulators in luxury models
@@tristanho1533 I presume if the sell it's not there of course they will try to machine everything or cut corners in order to reach their financial goals and exploit the brand as much as possible to get through. But thanks to the insight, good to know.
They priced everybody out, so good riddance.
Go to the watch shops in Interlaken and Zurich
There will be 40 or 50 Chinese tourists in each.
Happily buying Swiss Army Knives at $2,000 and watches at $20,000.
Meanwhile I'm out here I'm buying Chinese mechanical watches because my brain is so small I somehow managed to botch a Tongji movement lmao
I don't think too many are priced out. The high end luxury swiss...yes. But REAL luxury watches have always been for the rich. The rich are still buying $200K watches as we speak. But there are good swiss watches for under $500. The money isn't the issue. The real issue is that watches aren't needed. In addition a cheap $200 quartz watch is better and more accurate, so for those that actually need a watch, a swiss watch is not needed.
I had considered buying a Rolex, but decided to just pay off my house instead. Since then, I asked myself if I even need a watch and now I think I will avoid even buying any watch. Time is everywhere. On my computer, on my stove, on the wall and on my cell phone. I rarely have a need for a watch unless I am traveling, then a cell phone is a little cumbersome.
I tried smartwatches but only as a tool. I think of regular watches as a fashion statement. Its fun to wake up each day and think which watch i will wear that day. They are also a work of art to the beholder.
Excellent analysis. You more or less delivered a top tier management strategy in a TH-cam video.
Just sharing my overcomplicated, nerdy thoughts 😂😂
@@Mike.thiswatchthatwatchI hope Aeschlimann, Grainger and Réiner have their pencils out!!
If you have a modern cellphone you don't NEED a smartwatch. You WANT a smartwatch. The only exceptions are people that use it for the gym, or people that want to monitor sleep and heart rate constantly. But MOST just want a cellphone on their wrist to give them social media notifications in 1 second, instead of 4 seconds getting your phone. To me a smartwatch is not a watch. Its a cellphone without the ring ring, and I don't need another procrastination tool. A watch is different.
100%. I’ve had two smart watches (gifts) and came to the same conclusion. Yes, for counting my steps it’s ok, but my GShock can do that if I need to. I prefer wearing an automatic watch in almost every situation. I was wearing a Super Ocean daily for almost two decades of military and federal LE work, I’m retired now and was recently gifted a Monaco so that’s my daily. No interest in a smartwatch, I think their utility is overrated.
thats crazy to say because a watch is one of the most useless things in the digital era. the same you said of checking notifications 3 seconds faster can also be said for checking the time. watches are objectively brinking on obsolete for their main purpose of keeping time.
They are just trendy right now.
I use my smart watch for work as I normally get around 70 phone calls per day, and will oftentimes miss the calls when I’m running around.
It also helps me screen a call to see if I need to answer it when I’m mid conversation with someone.
Lastly, if I need to do something physical, I take that my watch since I don’t care to beat it up, and allows me to pick up calls on my wrist vs digging in my pocket with dusty or dirty hands. It’s simply a tool.
I do prefer and will more often than not wear a mechanical watch to work though whenever my schedule allows me that. Usually it will be meeting days or more casual visits to sites where I’m just checking in.
Both have their place. I also will purposefully wear a mechanical watch when I want to disconnect, since it’s hard for me to get away.
You make zero sense. A smart watch actually does something other than keep time. It’s much more useful than a mechanical watch. I wear my smart watch 90% of the time but I collect mechanical watches. I don’t collect smart watches.
Anecdotal evidence: I work in tech consulting and I see that more and more smartwatches are being abandoned in favor of, uh, watches. From my personal experience, a 24/7 tactile notification on my wrist started to drive me crazy; seemingly it's also the case for people I work with.
Yeah, I have noticed that once people get used to having something that tells the time on their wrist they're much more likely to get a regular watch, whether they keep using a smart watch or not.
I have a Fitbit Smart watch and eventually stopped wearing it because charging it became just another chore and getting notifications on both my watch and my phone was really annoying if I was trying to concentrate. I think a subset of people are finding that it's better to be less connected instead of more connected.
I'd like to hope you're right but I'm really not seeing it in the street and out and about.
@@denis888red I have both a smart watch and quartz watches tbh I don’t have a lot of love for mechanical watches maybe I’m too hard on them?😅 I’m 32 and I’ve kept an interest on them but at the end of the day smart watches are not the enemy per se it’s just a tool watch that’s easy to comprehend. I know you can do math with a navitimer it’s just not very user intuitive
@@adam_meade Bingo
Every time you make a video I’m amazed at your knowledge. I listen to everything you say carefully and find myself rewinding to make sure I’ve understood what you’ve said. On other channels I find myself constantly fast forwarding as there’s so much irrelevant information.
Thanks - Very kind of you. To be fair - For a video like this the last bit is very much me "crystal balling". I could be wrong but I think it's a fun discussion regardless 😊😊
Your grasp of the industry, brands, and trends consistently leaves me astonished.
The Casio F91W is all I need. A legendary watch for every day. I wear it to work, in the shower, when I go swimming, and even when I go to bed. This watch has started many conversations because so many people know this legendary watch and love it for its simplicity.
It's my daily wearer too, meaning it's on my wrist 95% of the time. It's arguably the best watch of all time.
Its the Toyota pickup of watches. Really all you need but some of us WANT more,don't need more.
Its too small and has no countdown timer, also water resistance is not great. There are better cheap casios or other digitals
@@arnoldd7073 The claimed water resistance isn't good but the actual water resistance is superb. I think the size is perfect for the average man's wrist. It's only in recent years that big watches have become fashionable. Personally I think it looks like a kid wearing his dad's watch.
luxury watches are just status symbol since the quartz watch crisis. why would people pay 10 of thousands dollar to read incorrect time (off by couple to tens of second per day)??
Lets be real, Young adults are struggling financally in alot of countries and are less welloff than their parents were.
Anyone who spends multiple thousands on a watch while not owning a home is an idiot in my eyes aswell
I would agree. House first 😀
Slot of it is young people get that credit card & get behind an eight ball. People were generally more conservative in their spending buying starter homes,now everyone has to have master suites & pools . Many young people opted out of the work force to live off the land,good luck w/ that
Rolex has such arrogance and hostility towards their potential customers that I just can't bring myself to give them money.
This is why I bought an Invicta Pro Diver. I was like, "Lemme get this straight: I can have a great watch that will last me years and years, will go down to 200m under the ocean, AND I can dilute the Rolex brand at the same time?? Good lord, sign me up!" hahahaha
You're wild bro @@Maplecook😂😂😂 I'd rather buy squale or some other Rolex homage brand tbh
@@XxXHardcoreshredderxXXxxxxxxxx I know. I'm weird. haha
But in my own defence, I'm the GOOD type of weird.
(Good weird ends up finding the cure for cancer. Bad weird runs naked down main street.)
@@Maplecook I'm neutral weird. (We do a little bit of both from time to time for character development) I learn from my mistakes, so I make as many as I can. It's a life hack if you think about it. I'm not an Invicta fan but I think I like them genuinely more than Rolex at this point. Current Rolex anyway. The special editions are usually cool, but the vintage Rolex stuff is the Grail worthy stuff. But either way I'd rather have a chronometre Bleu than 6 rolexs lol
@@XxXHardcoreshredderxXXxxxxxxxx Salutations, fellow member of the, "I make mistakes!" Club! hahaha
Wonderful content as always, Mike, and the comment section is a goldmine of alternate opinions. It took an (enjoyable) half an hour to watch and another half an hour (easily) to read the comments!!!!
Thanks. Yes. I can sometimes be a bit forceful in the way I state my opinions in the videos, but I do honestly not believe that I am the owner of a "truth". I have a view. I share it and people are free to discuss, expand, challenge and disagree. I learn something every time from the comments. 😊😊😊
Your understanding and insight on the industry, brands and trends continues to blow my mind.
Just happy that it resonated reasonably 😊😊
This is exactly the kind of analysis that has made this my favorite watch channel.
glad to hear it. Will try to keep it up 😊
Whether it's $10 or $10,000, a wristwatch of any kind is a luxury these days. That means it's nice to have, not need to have. As you mentioned, most people can just check the time on their smartphones. It's challenging enough to get some people to consider wearing a watch at all, let alone one that costs a few hundred dollars. Collectors consider $500-1,000 watches "budget," but the average person will laugh at that label.
Best of luck to watchmakers. They really need to capture the non-enthusiast audience now.
very true... I only started to wear a watch since I needed a timer and could not use a phone. Most people do not like wearing them, or do not like the ideas of jewelry on their hand or worst find them tacky. Most I see are F91w, calculator casio since they are cool and retro, and sadly rarely see automatic since NO ONE WANTS TO WIND THEM! Also, now that I have 2 automatics frankly I got bored of them their soul bs.
True. 99% of people consider a budget watch to be under $50. These guys here talking about how $500 is "budget" almost made me quit the video right away. $500 for something that only tells the time and nothing else is an absolute disgrace and unless you are a collector, you will never find that acceptable. Smartwatches cost $500 because they are a full computer in your wrist. Something that just tells the time, cannot cost the same, for 99% of people. I have a few $20-$50 watches and I love them, and the moment casual brands started raising their prices I started looking at Pagani Design (chinese) and others because I dont care about the brand, and if a brand asks $2000 for something that just tells the time, those brands can die for all I care.
You can buy a Xiaomi Band for $29 that does thousands of things. You just cannot convince the average joe to buy a watch anymore, let alone a $500-$2000 one
"They really need to capture the non-enthusiast audience" This is totally incorrect because it's not something they will ever be able to do now. Watches are pointless with everyone having cellphones and other smart devices. The only people who care are enthusiasts and people who want to wealth signal. They know this and they are pricing and marketing to match
@@btt449 True, but the sad part even the rich do not care about it, they care more about tech more than anything else and are over 40, not under. I see the rich always jumping on the top iphone, latest tesla and latest iwatch, not latest rolex, etc. Most that get a watch do not want a smart watch or the privacy orientedh.
This is the same as Harley-Davidson’s problem - younger people aren’t buying them. A cell phone is their way of telling time. Include the Apple Watches and it is making regular watches a niche item sadly. F Rolex - too expensive and there are lots of other great brands out there!
Many folk talk about how the majority of the smartwatch-wearing populace won't use most of its features, but honestly, I never used a tachymeter or chronograph on my watch; in fact, I never dived 200 meters to check my dive watch. Watches for me are a piece of luxury, not an everyday necessity.
Tachometer is the most useful thing if you ever lost your speedometer in your car lol
My speedometer is working just fine. Besides, one can always buy an actual tachometer instead of splurging an insane amount of money on a Rolex.
@@MK-ri2ks I do agree that fancy expensive watches are not my cup of tea either. I do like a basic watch on my wrist for a quick glance at the time rather than having to pull out my phone. It will do the rest. That being said, I do appreciate mechanical movements for what they are, enjoy working on them and building them from parts as a break from my technology job. I wouldn’t spend the money on status symbols though either. Although those expensive watches are a piece of art, I feel people buy those more for ego than anything. It’s often people who can’t afford them, not unlike expensive cars. I do have a couple of rich friends, and they don’t wear expensive watches either.
I am currently wearing a dive watch rated for 1,000 feet. If it is ever that far beneath the surface and on my wrist, I am fish food. Watches are jewelry that tell time in my book. I enjoy them but think that retail prices for many are absurd.
true 😊
I wear a smart watch when I do “activities”, gym, MTBing etc etc, but I love a “proper” watch for the rest of the time.
Once Apple makes a smart ring I’ll probably get one of those and use the smart watch even less.
I wear a watch and a Garmin vivo 5 on the other hand ha.
Thats why I'm giving the Whoop a try out. I want to get rid of my Apple Watch soon.
I've been a Garmin sports watch user for about 3 years now, prior to that I used my phone as a watch. Smart watches are useful but have no character or visual appeal. I bought a Casio Duro 2 weeks ago because l liked the look of the dial and it's general appearance, simplicity and functionality. The Duro is cheap and cheerful but beats a smartwatch on looks any day. The Garmin will now be used as a fitness tracker as it has zero wrist appeal to me. Thank you for your great insights, professional delivery and channel content. Be greeted from South Africa.
As a relatively new watch enthusiast, I have learned so much from your videos. Probably the most informative channel on watch TH-cam!
Happy to hear that you find my videos worthy of a little bit of your time 😊😊
This is the best watch content on TH-cam .
Some of these brands are delusional because they will never appeal in the same way that the top brands do, IWC come straight to mind. their prices are absolutely ridiculous. The 2.5-4k customer has traditionally been the bread and butter of many of these companies.
Thanks for that. Appreciated. Got a video coming on IWC btw - Touching on specifically that 😊😊
The most underrated WatchTuber on TH-cam once again gives us a C-suite executive leadership overview of the state of the industry and business mentality. Aka: why the hell do brands do what they do and what are they hoping to achieve? I could listen to Mike talk about freight shipping and paper mills and find it interesting
Freight shipping... I'm boring but hopefully not that boring 😂😂😂
@@Mike.thiswatchthatwatch Mike, I'd listen to you talk about industrial painting 😉
My son-in-law is a cosmologist, someone who models galaxy formation on a super computer and what he wants on his wrist is a Nomos.
❤️
he also needs a legitimate job at some point
Would have thought Milgauss but hey. Nomos works 😊😊
@@jeririce4928 He's thinking the same, being a post-doctoral researcher in cutting edge physics is very badly paid. I've suggested that he should get a job designing advanced guidance systems for smart weapons, good pay and perks I'm told.
I really hate smartwatches. It’s turning everyone into social handicaps. Every time I’m with someone with a smartwatch they stop their conversation mid-sentence to look at their watch to check a text or email they got. It’s incredibly rude and inconsiderate of those around you. I will never believe that a smartwatch should replace a good mechanical watch, even if they do keep better time. There’s something pure and special about owning and using a mechanical watch. It’s something that you can wear everyday and appreciate for its aesthetics and mechanical design, in addition to accurately keeping track of time (the whole point of a watch). You can do all that, while not being distracted by your watch while in conversations with those around you.
The moment I become fifty rich, I will buy a Patek Philippe.....a fake one...and everyone's going to think it's real..
So true.
Points
1. Almost every person who bought a premium Swiss watch, started with entry level Seikos, Tissots, etc. If young people don't even venture close to a quartz, forget mechanical, it reduces the probability they'll spend on luxury mechanical movements. It can still happen, just that chances are much lower.
2. Very few "need" a watch. I can get the time from my phone, laptop, microwave, gas stove, refrigerator, tv, car, etc. etc. etc. Even fewer "need" a luxury watch. A $20 Casio may fulfil a need that a microwave watch can't fulfil. Anything above that price, is a "want". Watches ARE jewelry. By definition, they're for adornment.
3. Let's face it. The watch industry has had very little innovation in the last few decades. Every innovation from fumé dials to minute repeaters is decades old tech. A tiny thing like quick-release clasps is standard in most smart watches but NOT in traditional watches. Why not??!! Is it that expensive or are they just lazy?
4. No one has a plan. Apart from a few half-assed attempts from Frederick Constant and Tag, very few are trying to combine smart watch tech with traditional.
I don't want or need to carry a smartphone with me all the time. I don't want or feel the need know my heart rate or how many steps I walked. However, I do need to know what time it is. It's amazing that for 4.5m years of evolution humans ever survived without 'Smart' products 😂
@@robertfeast7691watches are also relatively new in our development.
Oh, they have a plan, it's to make it so appealing that you are willing to fork over your Pounds or Dollars in a very short amount of time. Someone had to pay for all those superfluous HQ buildings they have built. :-)
On your third point, mechanical watches have started to reach the peak of what you can do with them in terms of innovations, and there’s not much you can do to really change the game anymore without creating some wild and wacky concepts. The most significant innovation in modern watchmaking is probably the GS spring drive, and that’s from a manufacturer very little normal people know or care about
Edit: and on your fourth point, how the hell are you supposed to combine smartwatch functionality and traditional watchmaking with modern day technology? That’s the kind of shit you’d need advanced technology for (seriously; the best thing I can think of is if you had a small projector sitting under the front crystal to act as a display, which would require technology leagues more advanced than anything we have right now if it’s supposed to look good). And not for nothing, but if watchmakers started doing that, I guarantee you that most of us hardcore watch guys would disown the industry for that simple reason
@@dainiu regarding point number four, you remind me of motorcycles. Traditionally folks started in a cheaper bike and wanted a Harley. Some eventually got one. The price continues to rise, and there were periods of supply shortage. Harley determined nobody really wanted to modernize the look of the bike (they did like some improvements but no change to the overall look). I thinks it's the same, generally, with aspirational watches.
Mike, It is so refreshing to hear your unique perspective on the watch industry in every new video. No two are the same. Makes me think and digest your perspective. Most of the time I end up agreeing with you. I do enjoy your perspective on the watch industry all of the time because it is so refreshingly unique. I think it is because you lead the dialogue and don’t tell us what we should think. Instead, you let us connect your dots and make up our own minds like thought leaders should!
Very kind of you. As for agreeing with me? You don't have to. I have a perspective. I share it and then you can make up your own mind as you also state 😀
The problem with the current sub-4k microbrand market is the era in which they exist - mechanical watches are superfluous and outperformed by digital/smart watches AND they dont solve important problems. Once upon a time mechanical watches were the cadence of daily life, tracked dive times in the nascent scuba hobby, they measured elapsed race times, and kept track of multiple time zones when traveling, etc... Modern sub-4k microbrands dont address any new challenges -and are thus relegated to nice looking trinkets. Many will linger in slim profit margins but plenty will vanish.
As a watch nerd... Hard to disagree.
@@denis888red I think you nailed it. The smart watch solved today’s new problems.
@@denis888red the hobby won’t die per say but I can see a collapse of the Swiss watch industry, hell with china manufacturing collapsing do they even have the parts to maintain all the watches now. In many ways the Swiss did this to themselves, you can sell the trick once but never twice.
My sub 4K Seikp SPB143 solves the problem of me not feeling my outfit looks cool. Then I put on the watch and I feel that problem is solved 😊
@@NinjaNovice I disagree. The smart watch solved nothing. All it did was extend functionality of a smart phone to a smaller screen on your wrist that happens to display time.
Lots of brands have “shit” the bed on pricing
JLC is the poster child for this.
Was in the market for a reverso - not anymore for a new piece
Agree on JLC 😊
As TAG and IWC. Saw the Ingenieur at the local boutique. No way possible would I pay that much money for that watch. They had a SST/Everose 36mm DJ in stock and I would pay the $14K for that watch, but NOT $11,700 USD for an IWC. My Yachtmaster I just took devilery of was only $12,300 USD. I only waited two months when my AD had it ready for me.
It is a shame about the Ingeneur. That was a great watch once. They could have had a great release, but they had to push the price. I wonder if these brands will be able to buy themselves out of Richemont and try to survive. Baum & Mercier cannot keep going like they are, and JLC seems to be shooting themselves in the foot. There is such a huge gap in the market, and I cannot understand why none of the big brands are trying to exploit this. I assume the conglomerates are forcing prices up. It looks like a miscalculation.@@romanmichaelhamilton8729
@@romanmichaelhamilton8729 15-20% discounts are possible with Tag though.
The ingeniuer is a gerald genta design from a reputable watch brand that makes quality luxury watches, why should it be priced significantly less than a royal oak or a nautilus?
I'm not even 1 minute down the vid and I love it already
yay 😊😊😊
Completely agree with many of the points in this video. If you see someone in the supermarket wearing an Anordain or Fears, you can’t tell if it’s their only watch or if they are resting their Patek. If I were in marketing, I would tap into this.
good point
I am an IT professional geek too and an early smart watch adopter, from vintage Timex Microsoft DataLinks to Sony's boths SWs. They all are still working. Soon I realized that my smartphone replaced them perfectly.
My answer to all the actual smart & iWatches is:
On my right hand I am permanently wearing a smart workout & heart & sleep tracker - a now five year old cheap and reliable Honor Band 5 (IP68).
So I can daily choose between my collection's 108 extraordinary (and inexpensive) watches on my left hand - from 70ies LED via LCD to quartz analog or mechanical watches.
They are mostly vintage throwbacks, beloved outfits and great joy for a boomer like me.
This video is a master class on the watch industry. Bravo, Mike. I'm so glad and proud that your channel has been growing as fast as it has.
I'm not exactly "unhappy" about the growth. It has far exceeded my expectations 😊😊
@Mike.thiswatchthatwatch I'm sure I'll handle fame just fine. It's not that us watch nerds are weird or anything, hahaha.
You are absolutely right.
People nowadays, are "communicating " with beautiful mechanical, beautiful dial watches ,with basic reliable movements like Selita or Seiko. Consumers are not herd any more . This is why I believe that it is now the era of microbrand mechanical watches and digital ones . People are fed up of the milking techniques of the well known brands .
Thanks again
Nizar
I am a software engineer working on Apple platforms, Apple fanboy and heavy Apple tech user. However! After four years my Apple Watch died. The cost of repair - by Apple or others - is higher than the cost of a recent generation new.
I’m dismayed by the disposable mindset. I’m also fed up with tech - yes even me - encroaching on every aspect of our lives. I’m also bored that everyone has the same watch. Individuality has gone. It’s no longer an accessory nor is it a statement.
My replacement will be a mechanical watch.
I have gone full cycle.
Welcome home. 😊😊
i am a samsung all the way i am anti apple, same my samsung watch gaved up now garbage.i am buying a OMEGA chronograph 2 tone gold metal and black ceramic 15k am tired also of looking at dumb smart plastic watches.
never go woke...
I bought a used galaxy watch 4 a while back and stopped wearing it because the battery would always drain so quickly. when I looked up a tutorial on how to replace the battery, the replacement parts were more expensive than the price I paid for the entire watch. The reason I switched to a mechanical watch is because that in the rare event that it needs repairs, it's made from "off the shelf" parts. That, and the service was really good when I bought the watch around Christmas last year.
If Rolex calls me and says your watch has arrived, I'm not sure if I want to go and pick it up, and I'm not sure if I'm still enthusiastic about it. I'll probably say that I've given up buying it.
Rolex has killed my enthusiasm for mechanical watches.
Very insightful as usual! Keep up the good work. Your channel is probably the best I’ve watched in years. Well done!
very kind of you, thank you 😊😊
Beauty is always going to impress. That is why on my watch collecting I focus on the beauty and the story and not the brand.
Before entering watch collecting I worn a 48mm smartwatch with 2GB memory, music, speakers, phone calls, 2weeks of battery life. Gifted it as a present and now I own 10 mechanical/automatic and 2 quartz (the dress ones, small second+chrono).
I have watched you for a long time. I think you should focus more of beautiful watches instead of brand watches.
Love your channel.. As always, John Leatherworks
Great video as always. I love how you take every topic & cover it from all aspects, also providing great insight. This format is great & i appreciate your take on these things, specially when the watch youtube space is full of Shouty & Same type of videos providing Zero insight or any sense of originality/creativity in terms of content. People like you are the True gem of this community. Keep up the good work!
Glad you enjoyed it 😊😊
I am also fascinated by how these trends occure with many other products. At one time manufacturers would build low end devices to reduce manufacturing costs by increasing component volumes . . . now they don't seem to care. At one time I provided market analysis for a very lage telecom company. Mike you will be aware of total market, addressable market and served market sizes - I was the numbers person . . . using other people's data plus internal optimism.
Sadly we as customers collude with the manufacturers with their increasing specs and rising prices - also the new items are often less reliable, more complex and expensive to service . . . this is happening with many things in life.
Now mainly interested in independent manufacturers or where possible I design and build things myself - e.g. modified G-Shock. Recent example . . . sub 8 second car to 60 miles an hour, manual gearbox, petrol engine . . . last built in 2019 . . . keep it simple it may then last 10 years. Audi has now discontinued the A1 range. Once a Saab owner . . . they were renouned for repeat customer purchases.
One downside to the Apple Watch and other smartwatches is that they're only available in one size, which doesn't always fit properly. Given the current fashion trends, it's not uncommon to see people wearing watches that are too big for their wrists and probably uncomfortable to wear.
At the end of the day, the most important thing when buying a watch is that it fits your wrist and hand. I think this is also the reason for many bad purchases. It's not just about the shape, but also the size. When it comes to size, a lot of people only think about lug-to-lug width, but the height and shape also make a big difference.
Good watch brands usually offer different sizes or even one model in several sizes. It's surprising that this central aspect is ignored, given all the discussions about brands and whether it needs to be smart or not. When you buy jeans, you make sure they fit. So why don't most people do the same when buying a watch?
My Apple Ultra has become my everyday "Beater"...
I still own a a couple nice Swiss mechanicals (50 Fathoms & Santos) for "dress" & I enjoy them a lot when they're on my wrist, but Smart watches are here to stay...
My two cents. When approaching a first, or subsequent luxury watch purchase, seems there are three frames of mind. 1). Looking to signal something about success. 2). Not looking to signal anything but cognizant that a luxury watch may signal something and this impacts the buying decision, which brand etc. 3). Not looking to signal anything and either not aware or disinterested that others, who don’t know you, may form an opinion about your motives or character based upon the watch you own. My frame of mind started at #3 and shifted to #2 over time and has never been #1. And the watch people I know have followed the same path. Point is that while I’m sure some first time luxury watch buyers are looking to flex, to fit in with those in their new, elevated strata, I suspect that most don’t. As a watch enthusiast community we need to be cognizant of the inherent risk of assuming anything about another person’s motivations or character.
I recently bought a chinise watch, and I must say the quality has improved amazingly, this is a hole new industry they are bringing out
Watch people can deny all they want but mechanical watches are just jewelry for men. Nobody in this day and age needs a mechanical watch. But are they cool? Hell yeah
I agree, it's jewelry that tells the time and looks good doing it!
Absolutely, but there are some practical and aesthetic benefits to owning mechanical watches. I find they distract me less at work than phones, for example. Watching the seconds hand can also be oddly relaxing, especially if it's powered by a spring drive!
💯 - I don’t want a chain around my neck and earrings… NFW.
Nah, they're toys with buttons you can push that will do things 😁
Fun fact: Watches are for everyone ... not 'for men' ... and ... likewise jewellery isn't 'for women'? (Maybe all yall boys who have derpy fighter-jet pfps aren't allowed to wear jewellery; sucks to suck.)
A similar thing happened to Cameras, the Smart phone has a Camera as good as most £100 to £250 cameras. The budget camera has disappeared and the better quality ones are much more expensive.
Good analogy. Agree 😊
I’ve always liked to wear a proper watch on my left wrist. Any other jewelry there just feels wrong. An Apple Watch or whatever is ridiculously small for any functions beyond telling the time anyway. I like a nice mechanical watch with display back if possible so I can watch and appreciate its independence.
Great video!
Thanks and agree - For me the AW and similar watches are too much of a compromise. It's great for a run, but not in a practical "work" situation. And they don't look good.... Datejust on the wrist. Now that's a looker
Cheers 😊😊
In this economy, I would say the bigger flex is having your retirement funds set, your house mortgages paid off, your car loan paid off and steady streams of income in place. After all that is done, THEN I MAY consider a luxury mechanical watch (If I have some funds left aside) For the time being I pretty happy with my rugged G Shock for weekends and traveling and my 30 USD casio quartz dress watch. I cant be broke in the bank and feel happy to carry a Daytona
I see the biggest threat to Swiss watches coming from very affordable and yet reliable and very well manufactured Chinese watches. Smart watches are a different category. They don't directly compete with traditional watches. But to me it looks like the market is flooded with decent looking and well made watches from China with a very low price. Those watches are hard to beat for Swiss watches in the range of 500 to 4000 Euros.
Another looming problem is that only the watch or the end product is luxurious. The moment you bought the watch most luxury is gone. When it comes to servicing the luxury experience rapidly declines.
The cherry on top naturally being Rolex who dare to withhold your old parts and only exchanges them for new ones which you obviously have to pay aswell. Where is that a luxurious experience?
As someone that’s been collecting watches for a while it is the younger independent and microbrands that excite me most.
I bought a Arcanaut a while ago and the case design, finishing and crazy fordite dials are like nothing else on the market right now.
I've gotten into watches almost a year ago. I've been watching a lot of watch content on TH-cam, and I've been inevitably influenced by the content I've consumed. But here is the thing Mike, even if I wasn't into watches I would still watch your videos -maybe not as frequently. You are the type of person who knows his subject well and articulates whatever he speaks about successfully. Appreciate the videos.
Cheers.
I enjoyed this video. I think I diverge quite a bit in that I don't wear any of my watches for prestige or to flex, I wear them just because I love horology and design. There's something special to me knowing that this device on my wrist is beating like a heart and generally keeping perfect time within -5 to +7 seconds a day. That's just remarkable to me.
The other point I'd like to touch on is that Smartwatches become obsolete. I purchased an Apple Watch Series 2 a decade ago and it doesn't work any more. The Hamilton Khaki Field I bought around the same point is still running like a champ, and I'd wager it'll still be running when I'm no longer here and it goes to whoever gets it. No one is going to want my current Apple Watch Ultra in 30 years, and that's IF it would even work with iPhone 40 or whatever would be around at that point.
Let's not start that debate. Mechanical watches can have ridiculous servicing costs. The ADs like to say "look no battery" but the downside is the equivalent of dozens of batteries
@@bodrulm1 service costs are an entire separate issue from planned obsolescence.
I'm an IT guy, worked for seven years in IT. My entire life, I have owned various: automatic, wind-up, quartz, and "smart" watches. Flipped all my smart watches. I used them for fitness tools but once they had a few errors and it felt like I had to troubleshoot again on my relaxing hikes, I very quickly lost interest. I do own a non-smart quartz Tag Heuer, which I enjoy a lot. My favorite are my automatics.
In the absence of any change, simply raising the price smells of desperation to recoup losses. It's a gamble that the customer will fold and buy anyway. Unfortunately this business model won't work in this economic reality, and is not sustainable. The next step I see is them cutting back production, staff, and service. Quality will be the last thing to go before it's over.
If some of this plays out, most will funnel into the used market, or vintage market. I'm already there.
A friend of mine owns a Patek and he bought a replica to wear, but got them mixed up. Now he can't tell which is which for love nor money. And I find that hysterical.
Personally .. was waitlisted what seems like inevitably for a Daytona. In the interim, I found out how awesome the Garmin is for my active lifestyle. Not sure I’ll pickup the Daytona if/when they eventually call.
Hi Mike, I just wanted to thank you for your videos and the effort you put into creating them. I truly love the way you speak, it's structured and insightful, unlike many other bloggers who can be overly emotional. Thank you, and I wish you many more subscribers!
Thanks a ton for that 😊 I'll do my best to keep it up
I believe the luxury, mechanical, sports, watch market is on borrowed "time". (Aside from the Holy Trinity & Lange) The day's of walking into an AD & buying a Sub, will return in a few years.
The more formal Dress Watch segment could see a real resurgence, though! Smart watches still can't compete here, yet! The rise of Cartier to the top of the sales charts, isn't a fluke.
Three years ago, my daughter launched her own watch brand, Möels & Co, and I must say it’s incredibly hard work. It requires constant effort, resilience, and a significant amount of cash to succeed in the crowded watch market. Despite the challenges, her passion continues to drive her forward, and she has just launched her second design.
Since I bought Garmin instinct 2 a couple of months ago I wear it 90% of the time. I consider selling my mechanical watches
Don’t sell your mechanical watches yet. See how long this garmin lasts. I predict after a few years, your smartwatch will be outdated and unsupported due to Operating System updates until it’ll turn into a non-watch and you need to buy a new one, whilst your mechanical watch will keep going.
That’s what happens to our phones.
Since I have a Garmin 965 my swiss watches are >360 days in the drawer. But its nice to have something nice for the special occasions.
We need to remember that most of these reports are reporting on the wholesale price and not retail value. It depends and pays to look for what value is base for each report. We can assume a watch with a retail value of $5k is counted as a wholesale or „export“ value of $2,500-$3,000
Around 75% of the watch price is distribution, marketing and retail markups (40-50%). The manufacturers make very little money.
This guy is the Giga Chad of watch channels. His knowledge and expertise is simply unmatched imo
I mean, there is an elephant in the room. I will give an example of a young university graduate, for example a junior doctor( resident doctor) in the UK. In the year 2000, the net monthly salary of junior doctor in dollars were something around 2500-2700, a rolex submariner then costed 3000-4000 dollars. In the year 2024 a rolex sub from AD is something like 9000-10000 dollars, while the monthly salary of a junior doctor( a resident doctor) in the uk stayed almost the same… the problem is stagnant wages in most of western world, rising living costs, rising luxury watch prices
I am now 55 years old. I have been wearing the Apple Watch (Series 3, 4, 5, 6) for many years. I also have two Casio retro watches, which I wear from time to time. But in recent months I've realised more and more HOW MUCH these smartwatches actually annoy me. Constant charging and overloaded with functions, 95% of which I don't need at all. I'm currently in a phase where my focus is on automatic watches. These little mechanical masterpieces, without any electronics, have a very special appeal. And if we live in the ‘zombie apocalypse’ at some point (😃), they will still work!
I'm 59 years old and I've never understood the appeal of smart watches. Like mobile phones they turn the user into a zombie and they have absolutely no character or soul. Your Casio is cool.
My sympathy lies with the affordable brands, not the premium brands who keep raising their prices.
Fortunate that I am and always have been, even since a young boy, enamored with mechanical watches for what they are…brilliant creations of passion and skill. That’s why I prefer mechanical watches.
You are not wrong... I have seen guys who were previously into watches go into other hobbies like cycling or MMA. The times they are'a changing my friend and not in our favor. I am worried about the little guy. The microbrand owner who truly cares about his passion but there is just not enough revenue to keep holding on... As things get tighter for us as consumers we tend to spend less on luxury items and unfortunately as these brands begin to die off we will have less choice and value than before. I hope I am wrong but I expect another quartz crisis in the near future. Hope you are doing well man and still rocking that FXD!
There's no doubt that those small brands have it incredibly tough. 2 watches extra sold can mean the difference between profit in a month or a loss. I do believe it forces you to be creative and customer centric 😊😊
Cherishing anything analogue in the digital age is a rarity. My hobbies of book collecting, fountain pens, and watches often intersect. But sadly most people truly don't care. The main driver for people is utility and convenience.
Sony used to have a smartwatch which you could fit between the already existing bracelet.
That way you could wear your regular watch and still get notifications on a tiny OLED screen when looking at the clasp.
Too bad they released that too soon as it failed in sales. I'd love to have one of those right now.
It still exists, it's the Wena3, still sold in Japan.
@@creato938motherf*cker you just cost me 200 dollars 😂😂
Thank you for that rabbit hole
@@creato938what a weird name. Imagine trying to flex your wena, or sharing pictures of your wena online.
Pagani watches are doing well. I’ve just bought one. 👍👍👍👍
I was talking to some pals about a friend who had "the suit, the hat and the watch." Can guarantee nobody was imagining he wore a smart watch. But I think the comments about the 30,000 dollar bike are on point.
a smartwatch is so important for my health tracking, i very often see in the evening "oh only 7k steps, let me take a walk" :) so very helpful plus my heart rate is monitored and i like seeing my notifications without picking up my phone all the time
Hardly!
I wouldn't touch one of those PoS if they paid me. A watch is a piece of artwork that I can take with me wherever I go & the bonus is that I can also use them to tell the time....except my two LE Bel Cantos of course. 😁
Right?? Sapphire caseback, even more a way of appreciating the wonder of the wonder.
I have both mechanical watches and Apple Watches, I understand that watches are not investment but the return on purchase ratio on mechanical watches, compared to the disposability of Apple Watches is still amazing. I used to get the Stainless steel Apple Watches that went for $799 new with the Milanese loop a few years ago, now the trade in asking price is like literally less than a 60 bucks, granted if I sell it for myself the most I can get is $100.
At some point they will become obsolete hardware, leaving you with an expensive paperweight, which is what happened with the Apple Watch Editions that sold for 17k when they came out. That’s the only problem with smart watches, they are good for short term use which is on average 4-5 years and then you are forced to get a new one, which means I’ll come back full circle with something that can last me decades, if not more.
The advantage of smart watches is that you can sidestep the major problem of navigating the wide world of watches, including the tier system. Rolex or Omega? Longines or Tudor? Seiko or Hamilton? Smart watches eliminate these concerns. This has become especially apparent to me recently after buying 2 relatively expensive watches (Longines Zulu Time and Omega Aqua Terra) and watching people around me with Apple watches react with either indifference or shock/surprise (at the amounts involved). They are not one of our kind and exist in a completely different headspace.
As for the future, some argue that only the higher end brands will survive and the rest will die, but as Omega and Rolex continue to move upmarket, I suspect more people will gravitate towards the premium (not entry level luxury, hate that term) brands such as Longines. I cannot see the market for more 'affordable' luxury watches disappearing anytime soon.
But the opposite is happening, longines sales have gone down, while other higher luxuries watches have sold more.. 😅
@@patrik3450 Medium to long term outlook, not short term, and I was referring more generally to watches in that category. Most watch brands have experienced a decline in sales, relatively speaking.
Longines are still one of the biggest watch brands per sales volume, but brands like them will likely benefit when Omega becomes completely unreachable for a larger percentage of the watch buying public. Swatch know this, hence Longines' boutique expansion over the last 5-7 years.
@@patrik3450 shhhh, dont introduce facts, it has to be about confirmation bias and vibes thats why the most common comment about a new watch, typically luxury, under review is "It is overpriced," based on absolutely nothing except perhaps the commenters bank account or their drawer full of shitters that they think are the bees knees of "value for money."
@@davidr2802 It is a meaningless point. The whole market is going down. Swatch is playing the long game. Longines is just one example. Brands in that category of luxury/premium will very likely benefit from higher end brands becoming more unaffordable.
@@davidr2802 when I got to the "drawer full of shitters" I immediately beheld a vision of a large man named Archie, howling about how every man who doesn't own a Rolex before he's 40 is a "loser.....loooooooser......loser". If that's the vibe *you* want to give off, then more power to you, I guess.
I am planning to enter the swiss watch industry after my masters degree, this video has been a great ressource to gauge the market in a birdseye view rarely discussed! Thanks!
Historically, the average person who wore a watch was not a watch enthusiast. A watch enthusiast may have an Apple watch as a tool but a collection of traditional watches as a preference. The non enthusiast will go for the most efficient tool.
yeah... apple watch - Gshock - casio retro is kind of the direction
At 42, a lot of my friends and I have reached milestones the last decade where they would have celebrated with a Rolex purchase. Unfortunately, it was the same time one had to jump through so many hoops, pay above MSRP, have previous purchases, etc. etc . .that it just turned them off of high end watches in general
Mechanical watches are like suits and ties. When you go to Milan and you see a gentleman wearing this and think, wow that looks good. But back home you'll switch back to the practical option cuz people are generally lazy and simple.
Americans are in general, not very interested in dressing well. Facts.
A fascinating take. And I believe you have it right, but I'm certainly no expert. Love your sophisticated reviews/insights. Well done!
Glad you enjoyed it 😊
Unless you're a multimillionaire then buying a luxury watch is a waste of money. Not only is it unnecessary, you can't afford it. You're simply falling for the marketing and believing buying something you can't afford will improve your life!
Buy a nice Seiko and invest the rest.
Totally agree. I have 3 Rolexes and if I can’t afford it in cash I would not buy it. If I lose them all tomorrow it wouldn’t affect my life one bit.
Hear, hear.
I really enjoy your detailed insights - particularly on the psychology of buyers in different markets and segments.
Happy to hear it 😀
Four main points go against the argument of smart watches killing traditional watches:
1) The explosion and proliferation of micro-brands ... And their success.
2) the HUGE success of Aliexpress watches (like them or not).
3) traditional watches will always be status symbols - especially higher end pieces and in the business community.
4) no one ever talks about the smart watched killing a brand like Casio.
All smart watches mean (just like Aliexpress and microbrands) is that watch brands can't take things for granted anymore (price specs etc.).
bingo 😊
A problem I can see is if the large volume manufacturers disappear or shrink drastically will the movement manufacturers be able to stay in business to provide the microbrands need for much smaller quantities? My experience of chinese movements (with the possible exception of Seagull)suggests they wouldn't be able to take up the slack with dependable alternatives.
Microbrands aren't moving the needle at all. They are a niche that mostly appeal to cheapskates.
Smartwatches also still enjoy of an element of novelty that will wear off sooner than we think. Once that's gone a fair amount of people will turn back to watches simply because as accessories they're nicer things to have on the wrist.
@@lamentate07they might not appeal to you, but they are selling like crazy, because people don't like getting ripped off for a name.
Again an awesome “lecture”. Thank you! One of the top 3 watch channels
Thanks again! 😊😊😊
I just am weighing in to thank you. Your videos on the watch industry are qualitatively better than any "content" about watches on the internet. Please keep them coming. Your content is fact based and your "insights" are always "insightful".......
Glad you find the videos worthy of a little bit of your time 😊😊
Good God those Rolex 1908 clips are mesmerizing 🤤😍
pedestrian I say 😂😂😂
I have tried several Smart Watches until I recognized that theese are NOT watches which I am used to wear to see in an blink of an eye the time and the date.. But I was very used to the notifications of them, so now I have a 40$ Smartband on the right wrist and can use my belowed watches on the left wrist. I'm very happy with this solution.
I don't think we're doomed for the affordable side of things. But I think for a while we're going to see price increases
oh yes....
Some thoughts:
1. I came for the watches. But by the end I'm thinking, that's a *really* nice shirt-jacket.
2. And I'm thinking about pie. Damn, I need some pie.
3. In terms of the pie (pie!), what's fascinated me is just how badly the Swiss smartwatch sector seems to have bombed. It may be that smartwatches are ultimately disposable and mechanical watches are ... well, that PP tagline; a $300 watch is a hit you can take, but no-one wants to think they're writing off the price of a TAG Connected every couple of years.
That shirt got me a lot of comments. Wasn't expecting that... 😂
Swiss smartwatches suck. Can't say it in any other way 😊
Vanity is fickle, at the present time, personal time is the flex, so Apple Watches are very popular. It shows you have the ability to "get away" from your responsibilities and also shows you have the ability to engage in hobbies to better yourself physically. I enjoy the intricacy of a mechanical watch and the detail of the finishing of higher quality watches. I'm also a bit of a luddite so I enjoy the traditions of getting a nice watch to celebrate your accomplishments in life or life's milestones (like the birth of your first grandchild). I do think your analysis is spot on, well thought out and perfectly explained.
This
Personal time is the new flex - Agree completely 😊😊