Hello you savages. Get my free Reading List of 100 life-changing books here - chriswillx.com/books/ Here's the timestamps: 00:00 What is Attachment Theory? 05:15 Why Is This Useful in Evolution? 12:53 How Attachment Styles Are Formed 23:07 Attachment Before & After 18 Months 26:15 How to Discover Your Own Style 30:47 The Core of Anxious Attachment 34:42 Tactics to Regulate Anxious Attachment 46:31 Is Anxious Attachment More in Women? 53:27 Understanding Avoidant Attachment 1:03:11 What Does Being Avoidant Feel Like? 1:12:29 How to Regulate Avoidant Attachment 1:24:49 Can You Improve Attachment on Your Own? 1:30:18 Having a Foggy Memory of Childhood 1:35:48 How to Help an Anxious/Avoidant Partner 1:42:44 Where to Find Connor
thank you Chris for having this episode. this is my favourite one so far. i have watched several podcasts on this topic but this is the one that hits the bullseye. it explains everything and also HOW TO MANAGE your attachment style so u can work on moving towards secured... thank you so much for this and keep up the good work! love your channel ❤
The stuff he talks about men refuse getting help and pushing the therapist away even when those men realy interested and trying to move forward.. - Shows how hard and deep men are traumatized from childhood. If girl cries the world stops.. No one gives a f** about boys. Even the own mothers teacher aunts fathers onkels and so on. We all halfway abuse boys but no one screams at girls.. no one punishes girls but boys need to learn. - We literly f** up men. On top of it we have woke culture and fe**ismus who drives woman to behaive more avoidens towards men. And movies and again teacher goverment and so on. Everthing is literly build so that you as a boy get crushed and even as an adult men get crushed. It is so sad if you see all that in the world. - And then the next woman comes out and gives a talk about how men need show emotions and be more in tune with their feelings. -> No one talks about that we(mothers/woman primerarly) as society need to stop "opressing" boys and just meeting their needs instat of giving talks to meet and do more so woman are more "safe", making them behaive more towards men negative.
I know one that is avoidant and one that is anxious! Both lack internal self confidence and love! I figured out super fast with how they carry themselves.
As a fearful avoidant myself, this guy nailed it perfectly on the head. You learn to rely on yourself so much that you just feel frustrated at yourself for not being able to let go and just ask for help. You just lie to yourself and everyone around you about being okay, but inside is this storm of negative emotions and self hate.
He didn’t nail fearful avoidant at all, the research is quite clear that fearful avoidant responses can run the gamut to anxious neediness and avoidant pseudo-independence, this is why they are called disorganized: the researchers could never predict the fearful child’s response, whether he’d be mad the parent had gone away or whether he couldn’t care less. His response characterized them as just a more intense avoidant and he emphasizes their sameness
1:22:33 - For those looking for the same thing I was, the combination of both, he called Fearful-Avoidant or Disorganized-Attachment and he mentions it here. "Really deep desire for intimacy and closeness while feeling completely unlovable and distrusting people to accept who you are and actually support you."
I spent over a decade (IN THE PAST CALM DOWN) in therapy with a whole multitude of issues, and it just took this 1 podcast to COMPLETELY explain my entire life and why I am the way I am. I'm actually in mild shock and disbelief right now. EDIT: To tell people they're freaking out for no reason thinking I'm still in therapy.
@grahamvandyke It was the same for me when I learned about it!!! I've watched loads of videos on Attachment Theory now and am always discovering something new that explains me so well! Enjoy doing a deep dive!
Advice: Get a therapist that focuses on attachment theory ASAP. You can spend years in therapy and it not do much for you if you're with the wrong therapist.
@@ManTalksas I said in the general comments it’s the ONLY podcast/interview/video in the whole internet that answered ones of the big probs that I had until this day since these 6 last years (start of my severe 2 years long depression). And you did that job thanks to you and Chris. Am so grateful for that. So thank you Connor to bring the light to so much darkness 🙏
(Dismissive) Avoidant Attached here. Grew up with a Disorganized Attached father and a Secure Attached mother. My father dealt with war trauma (Japanese Occupation in the 40’s) and he was very verbally violent. All I could do as a 4 year old (and on) is go into freeze, shut off and avoid. I did this for 43 very long years. For you people out there, Avoidant Attached people want to connect! But we feel unsafe in our bodies and we are scared to be vulnerable again because: ‘what if?’. Somatic Experiencing is helping me heal and to move into Secure Attached now and oh boy…. It is worth it!
Similar history, almost in secure zone now, would like to compare methods of recovery. Just drop the dot in the correct place between my German and English parts of the name, and add dog and gmail extension after, if you ok to connect and talk.
The problem is your defense mechanisms with your dad are being used to prevent you from bonding with people who have had nothing to do with the experiences your dad gave you.
Another really good breathing technique a friend taught me when u have trouble breathing when anxious, is to breathe in deep, then try to breathe in just a little more. Hold it for a few seconds, then exhale slowly. Has saved me from a few panic attacks.
What he said about making yourself the center of your own orbit since you know youre not the center of anyone else's... Thats legit how it feels and is good concise description.
Great video. One of the things rarely talked about is how family emeshment can lead to avoidance. Some people felt they had very loving parents when in fact they were quite enmeshed.
@@UnknownHumanOnline Emotional Enmeshment: This is all about feelings. People feel like they're responsible for each other's happiness and sadness. It can be hard to separate your own emotions from everyone else's. - Intellectual Enmeshment: Everyone thinks the same way.
I try to be sympathetic towards avoidant men when it comes to dating but it’s hard to try to show sympathy when they ghost. Did I get played? Did he begin to catch feelings and run from them? Regardless I was heartbroken and never got an explanation as to why they disappeared after seeming so eager to start a relationship. The lesson is, it’s not your job to fix men, hope they go to therapy and improve but don’t destroy your mind trying care for them when they’re giving you nothing
@@mrsherwood2599you people are quicker to blame someone for being deceived (as avoidants are on their best behavior at the start) instead of acknowledging that it’s messed up to switch up and do a full 180…like yea we know they have their own issues but that doesn’t make their actions any less fucked up…
Like many of us, I have watched/listened to what now amounts to hundreds, if not thousands, of videos and PCs pertaining to self-help, mental health, wellness, and the like. Not a single one hit my innermost soul as hard (nor resonated with me as much) as this blessing to the world. Thank you both beyond measure. 💓🙏🏻🌹
I think Chris asked a good question about brain scan differences in people with attachment disorders. I wish there was a bit more of a discussion about this here but I wanted to add that there are differences as evidenced by brain scans and clinical research, and it is fascinating especially when it comes to avoidantly attached individuals. There are numerous published studies that show avoidantly attached individuals suffer more memory issues, respond less to stimuli, and overall show fundamental physiological differences in their brains. 🧠 it’s not as simple as they feel anxiety about intimacy and then ghost; they actually in many cases aren’t wired to even receive and experience closeness the same way secure or anxiously attached individuals are, so their experience of “anxiety” is likely not the same. I personally would be so excited to see an episode with Dr. Kirk Honda who runs the YT channel Psychology in Seattle. His content is high quality. He has hours of discussion on attachment theory on his podcasts and TH-cam channel.
@@smokingcrab2290 How did you enter into a marriage if she can't experience bonding and connection? I think you should reevaluate your marriage and start taking steps to protect yourself and your assets. Think about what you stated, if she can't experience it, then you need to question what motivation she has to be married to you if she is actively combating your attempts to improve your relationship. Does your wife tell you she loves you but then subsequently performs these actions? Please evaluate her on her actions, which from this one comment I can tell are probably abhorrent and exploitative of you. I truly hope I am wrong.
They also don't have serotonin, healthy dopamine, or oxytocin or vasopressin. They mostly survive on cortisol thus the health problems and early death, addictions, impulse etc
It seems like I have a Fearful Avoidant Attachment Style. My mother is Securely Attached and my father is Avoidant Attached. I know I had this fear growing up that if I mess up I will get punished for it. I didn’t get much explicit encouragement but I definitely got some error signals when I made a mistake or messed up. On top of this, although I had a great childhood with a pretty healthy home environment, I was rejected by two girls at 16 and 17 years old who I really really liked and the second one crushed me and I rememeber saying the words “never again” to myself and shoved it deeeeep down. I think that shaped my avoidance mostly as I find it petrifying to trust the relationship developing without me having a guard up. It is my responsibility to let go of. No one is to blame. My biggest takeaways: •You can’t think your way into secure attachment •You have to connect with the experience, the sensations, and the nervous system, rather than memories and thoughts. •You should implement exposure therapy alongside inner work and let go of that charge that arises
Shame is the master emotion that drives change. All emotions are good when used correctly. By denigrating shame you are ironically shaming people for feeling it at all.
It took 5 relationships to recognise i was constantly with emotionally unavailable people as it mirrored my upbringing.. once i figured that out i then began to see my anxious side.. however, through later life trauma i also inevitably swung to avoidant to cope (though i didnt realise that) suffice it to say, after several years of then feeling like i just couldnt seem to make friends, partners or keep a job and had a mental breakdown did i finally understand i had disorganised attachment and was only ever keeping one plate in the air. Trying to keep both up was hard and for the most part i have the anxious side sorted in external relationships though still get triggered by my parent - the avoidant side is much harder to handle as its become somewhat of a shield now. Trusting that others will stay and actually care is the core issue left to tackle. And now in therapy to do that. Love this in depth video- great to hear it all so well explained and in one video not ten! Lol Have saved to share with others in the future.
Disorganized attachment is what everything has pointed to for me but I had a hard time accepting it because I was never physically abused or in fear physically. In the rear view mirrow..my family/home/care providers went to crap during my teen years. I actually had 2 primary father figures at same time(1 was grandfather). Grandfather murdered in robbery at 13, father diagnosed with severe illness during same month and eventually became extremely needy physically and needy as in selfishly demanding, tons more shock traumas in the family, then my mother started to lose her mind trying to hold us all together. I was emotionally closest to her before all of this. She became highly emotionally unstable and unsafe for me to be around emotionally and she'd lash out so I walked on egg shells. I even remember holding my breath in the mornings when i heard her foot steps going down the hall never knowing if she was coming to attack me for not being more helpful or if she was going to ignore me. These teen years are years I remember learning to withdraw from conflict and withdraw from bonding with my parents emotionally even though i strongly desired the bond we used to have before the world fell apart. Now I'm married to an avoidant woman and our relationship is extremely difficult for us to bond and I just recently discovered all these attachment issues and have no idea how to fix it all. (It was nice just to type this out somewhere where I'm anonymous)
I wasn't always, but have been an avoidant individual for the past decade or so. I'm decent looking, fairly intelligent, and have average social skills, but after experiencing trauma I detached myself socially. I'm now afraid to go out and have no one to go out with. I'm also a perfectionist, so I only want to show the best version of myself and afraid to show vulnerabilities.
This year has been the most helpful in knowing who I truly am than any year I've lived. I was in a, what I felt, loving relationship with this person who was in a 10 year relationship 2 years ago. For the past few months her and I really hit it off until the first of April where she completely flipped and by the end of the month she completely shut off and ended the relationship without any communication or way to work on it. For months I tried no contact and thought she'd come around (she didn't) and it only took until me missing her birthday she decided to block me on almost everything. This whole time I had been anxious thinking it was me even after working incredibly hard by going through therapy, AA, working out, and eating right to know it wasn't mostly my fault. My anxiety kept telling me that I wasn't good enough or she'll reach out if I did this or that but, in reality she needed to work on her emotions because I did the work and didn't warrant being blocked or not talked to at least since the break up.
I watch a lot of TH-cam videos but I’m half way through this one and I already want to send it to everyone I know. This guy can truly change peoples lives!
For an avoidant, questions framed as are u WILLING, rather than do u WANT TO, can be powerful. They likely will NoT “want to”. But they may be willing & it then puts it into their court to decide
Fearful Avoidant here👋 It's not a beautiful thing, it sucks pus😂 It's hard! I'm even studying psychology and trying to heal this is hard! Thank goodness the urge for connection is greater than avoiding everything, disappearing into the woods, and becoming crazy old cat lady. Seriously though, great podcast❤️❤️❤️
As you get older it improves. Marriage and legal attachment helps. As does actually inventing a life you could lead if your relationship ended. Good luck.
I have a Secure/Avoident attachment style. I am the eldest and was given responsibilities at a young age and therefore have had to rely on myself to ensure that things got done! This has nade me a "man of the world" which is very attractive especially to a female who is anxious attached but conversely can cause issues with their fear of abandonment. Sadly, these individuals can suck the life out of you! All had been through a lot and overshared but eventually you feel burdened by them! I think also that your attachment style can change with age and circumstances and is hard to break away from! I like being in a relationship, do not fear connection and have never worried about being left. What I think I fear in a relationship is engulfment!
Recovering anxious here. What has worked for me is breathwork (Buteyko method), meditations from Dr Joe Dispensa to rewire my somatic patterns and self esteem work (Six Pillars of Self Esteem and learning to trust myself by keeping my word and unraveling my need for external validation). And Stoicism as a framework.
by "worked for me" do you mean you were/are able to be in a relationship/talking stage/etc. in a secure manner without your anxiety flaring up again? Or that in the moment you feel these techniques are helping your mind shift towards secure attachment (ie; "recovering"). Just asking because I also believed I was in the same boat right up until the avoidant person reached back out again and the anxiety creeped back up again. I'm also working on self esteem work mainly, but am interested in the other things you've listed as well. Thing is, self improvement in this area of life seems inconsequential just working on yourself on your own, instead of engaging in another relationship with preferably a secure partner that can lead you to being secure. Would love to hear your thoughts on this.
@@burningspeed2096 bro I am in the exact same boat. I know exactly how you feel. That being said its for sure the second one. At the moment our best bet is to use the techniques when they flare up but subconsciously practice them every single day so it rewires your nervous system. But also before you jump back into the relationship think long and hard if its worth going through all those anxious feelings. Just because you worked on yourself doesnt mean your partner has too. Avoidants typically just process how they felt months later but usually dont do the internal work like us anxious do. (we reflect fast and want to change fast however we think were better until we flare up and then realize nothing has worked)
Connor and Chris are some of the best masculine role models I came across in my Life, especially for modern men. Thank you both for your massive work for Men's mental health and healthy Life.
Chris, I want to thank you for ASKING about the difference between the dismissive avoidant and the fearful avoidant attachment style. If it weren't for you, your guest wouldn't have even mentioned it. His short response also shows he doesn't know much about that third insecure AS, or - what's worse - believes it's just a subtype of the dismissive avoidant one that doesn't even deserve to be mentioned. As a fearful avoidant woman, I do not relate 100% to the dismissive avoidant people - one of the things I'm scared of is how anxious and dependent I get once I start to care about someone. They never experience that. I do want to thank Connor for a few things though: for making it clear that you can't think yourself into the secure attachment style and that you need to use other ways and methods of healing yourself; and that you can't do it alone - you get hurt in your relationships so that's where you heal as well.
I’m anxious, my ex is avoidant, but it almost seems like he has a lot of narcissistic attributes as well. He would turn off his phone and leave for 2 days to go party with friends…. While I was home with the kid…. Took 13 years and I finally left. He also has addictions so that was an issue too
This was so insightful. As a woman that grew up in an unstable home (alcoholic father) and raised in a country that was in war we fled our home and I had to grow up quickly. at age 10 I was filling in my parents taxes, taking responsibility early on. Didnt really have a childhood. Now I have trouble trusting people and being in relationships. Feelings overwhelm me and i have an emotional wall around me. I often wonder what my life would look like if I was raised in a calm and stable home but I also know I am resilient because of it.. This helped understand myself much better..
The problem with Attachment Theory is its presumed causality (i.e. you’re this way because of the way you learned to connect with others during your early childhood, largely with your mother). This is disproven by twin studies showing relational impacts of temperament (specifically in the domains of neuroticism and agreeableness). At best, Attachment Theory is personality theory for agreeable people who prioritize the view of the world through the lens of relationships. This is useful, but imprecise. As long as it’s sold a relational heuristic, which it is, then we’re all good. However, most mid-level psychotherapy practitioners aren’t sufficiently versed in research operationalization or psychometrics and we end up with an industry-wide case of concept creep. Highly agreeable people are disproportionately represented in the field of psychotherapy (which is largely a good thing) but they’re certainly inclined to view psychology through a relational lens even if it’s the wrong tool to lead to a solution.
This is why I come to these videos. It's not to watch the video - I can generally guess what they're gunna to say. I've watched enough of them to not be at all surprised - but to read the comments. There be gold in these comment sections - one needs patience to find them, but sometimes they float right to the top like this one.
I see your point but I doubt that any other theory is this simple and yet directly explains so many relationships outcomes. It doesn't have to be an all-encompassing predictor of personality traits to serve its general purpose of helping people understand and relate to each other better in a romantic context.
@@vettie But lets be honest, does it actually explain anything? Or is it just the latest excuse used for toxic or failed relationships? Survivorship bias is a hell of a thing to shake.
Chris, I urge you to invite Canadian developmental psychologist Gordon Neufeld to have a chat. He's buddies with the very famous Gabor Mate and they have written books together. He is really great at communicating attachment theory so it's really easy to understand. Sadly he's not very present in the podcast universe, but he really should be, and I'd love to have someone get him to comment on present topics like the culture wars, politics, the psychedelic renaissance, etc. He's a hidden gem!
I know a lot of people who talk about their 'great childhood' because that is the family story that they are told, and it's the story they want to believe, even though it's clear that can't be the case.
After 54 years on this planet with more heart-ship that one person should have, the best attachment for me is to have NONE..zero..only to myself. This redeemed me and made me whole and happy
I have avoidant style, recognised a few years ago by a friend in mental health. I was a ‘mail order’ adoption via a London agency and at four months I was flown out to my adoptive parents living in an African colony. My new mother, a single child who’s father died when she was two, didn’t warm to me and struggled to bond, frequently leaving me with a neighbour, my dad was on an upward career path and his time was limited. At 3.5 years my sister arrived after fertility treatment and she became the focus. I was a mischievous kid , a handful and would often escape the house to explore. Primary school was stabilising, weekends and school holidays would be daily escapes into the bush with my school pals, on my returns I would be punished, hand, shoe, dog lead, swinging broom, belt whatever was to hand. At nine after being brought home by the police for the third time I was sent to boarding school, 1200 miles away in South Africa, to be ‘straightened out’ left there 3 days before school started. I became a scrapper to manage the bullying, a behaviour which came with frequent canning. After starting I didn’t return home for two terms, there was a problem with my adoption which delayed a passport being issued. When I got home, we were sitting around a pool where my parents told me I was adopted, that I wasn’t their natural son and about the passport issue. I got up and sat the other side of the pool and cried, my sister came round and gave me a hug and told me I was always going to be her brother. That pool became symbolic, I felt unwanted, school became ‘home, I dreaded end of term and became independent. At 14, my folks returned to the U.K. and a whole new set of experiences. There’s more but whilst my folks were indifferent to my sports and career successes, my sister always kept me tied into family events. This cast covers much of what I felt and feel, experienced and experience.
I still don’t understand after all this time, these decades and experience of life how we can still be in this situation where our parents didn’t want us at the time and haven’t developed an inner maturity enough to maintain our level of psychological sanity. So much waste 🤦♂️
@@dominostimes2119This style is more common than you think. Everyone is different in how maturity and experience develop their coping mechanisms, something a psychiatrist and a cast like this will help you understand. This communication style starts as a baby, adopted or natural, it is about the level of attention and affection it gets from its parents, a connection pattern that continues between them into adulthood and even onto how the grandchildren are treated. I never had therapy but over the years I would write down my thoughts to help me figure out and work through the moments, which I’ve pulled into a script for family record so my children understand how dad became dad.
@@dominostimes2119 time alone doesn’t heal psychological wounds. They are really hard to heal. So much damage is done in those early years that has long term effects. Its so unfair that the victims are the ones that suffer the effects until we die it seems, except if we do a lot of ongoing work to recover.
@@universaltruth2025 that was my case 6 years ago. Been on severe depression for 2 years minimum with regular suicidal thoughts, on my complete own to recover and dig in this whole mess. Self educating again and again, inner work constantly. Here for the avoidant style that still remains and have no solution for, didn’t acknowledge it and my regular incoherent interpersonal and intimate relationships.
I am really emotionally avoidant. Though I cannot say this has anything to do with my upbringing. Actually my mother was always very caring and approachable, and frequently complained that I never shared with her. This avoidance definitely fortified itself when I understood how terrible people are at listening and understanding. So I grew up becoming a good listener and a great avoidant. I always carried the mantra with me that "If it's my problem, it's mine to worry about, and up to me to find a way to fix it"
People who never accept help unintentionally (or not) constantly put out the message that they are superior to everyone. Other people need help-not me. You need help because you are weak and I’m not etc etc. I’ve talked to my husband a lot about that. It’s not a message he intends to send at all. Just thought I’d mention it. People often feel very proud of never receiving help, without realizing how actually demeaning it can be to others in the long run. Accepting influence is important.
@@andianderson3017 I don't ask for help because whenever I do they use it as a way to dominate/shame me either in that moment or in the future. It creates vulnerability, whether you like it or not.
Something I realised as listening to this... there are 3 Identities at play.. I, them, us.. how much you trust each of those identities is key.. we can think our way to trust. We must do activities that build trust for each of those identities.. this way of thinking about it is far superior to the current connection model.
I'm not sure if this is even possible but i've always seen myself as avoidant and noticed my avoidant tendencies through various relationships. But as im listening to this podcast and reflecting on my last relationship of 4 years i realised that i'd cycled through all 3 attachment styles. I started the relationship secured but after a year my partner started to complain more and more about my behaviour. One day he admitted to breaching my privacy behind my back (which im fine sharing when we're in front of one another), I realised how little trust he has for me. I suddenly turned into the most anxious person clinging onto him, asking and checking if my behaviours were satisfactory to him (seeking validation). After another year nothing changed and I just became avoidant. I stopped sharing my thoughts, what i needed, i just grew hyper independent within the relationship -wanting to do everything on my own, disregarding his feelings. And slowly the r/s went towards the end. So based on this story did i actually display all 3 attachment styles? Or am i understanding this topic wrongly?
Personaly I chose to not go into therapy just because I had the firm belief that it would be completely useless, tried to manage the whole thing on my own. Had both anxiety and avoidant type, now got rid of the anxiety one thanks to the ton of self education on the internet, but the avoidant one still remaining for no reasons. This episode is completely relieving for me. « Someone finally understood my problem »..
Forced into responsibility? By what? By who? No one can ever force you to take responsibility for ANYTHING. At the end of the day you can always just curl up in a ball and refuse to do anything. Taking responsibility for things is always something you choose to do because you want the benefits. I promise the benefits are worth it. Abusive/semi-abusive parents are never fair, but they arent going anywhere. Someday you might meet a young person thats dealing with the same shit you are and you might save their life with the insights you gain from taking responsibility for yourself. I believe in you.
@seraph...4473 you don't help anyone by shaming them even more for their feelings and reactions. Trying to "fix and prescribe" for other people is its own dysfunction.
@@Rut-vi7iz I didnt shame them, and its the yt comments, they agreed to have responses in the act of leaving their own comment. I also understand that you think saying what I said is a dysfunction and I disagree. Have a good day.
@@seraph...4473 you can't make those choices as a kid if you're groomed into responsibility even if your parent is in the wrong for cursing you with it. As a kid you just don't know.
If you're with an avoidant, just run. Fucking run. You will never feel more alone than with an avoidant. You will be guessing your sanity all the time. You will be gaslit into oblivion for merely desiring a baseline connection. You will have to cater to all of their needs while getting nothing out of the relationship. Avoidants need to just be left alone in the woods. They are so not worth it. I'm married to one and I hate my life. Every single day is a battle of "how busy can I make myself so that I stop thinking about my miserable relationship?". It's the worst ball & chain I've ever dealt with.
I put my running shoes on a year ago and have never looked back. I can be peaceful and not need to wait for their breadcrumbs or deal with the psychological drama. Trust that you will be okay without this dysfunction. Life is too short for that misery
Hahahahaha they need to be left alone in the woods. I’m so sorry you are suffering and aren’t having your needs met. Too many people always jump to defend avoidants but they don’t even try to improve most times. Most times it’s anxious attachers who at least admit their issues. A lot of avoidants simply don’t care how they treat others or care to meet their partner halfway.
Thank you, Chris, for bringing up the dual attachment style, "fearful avoidant,". I haven't really looked into attachment styles, but I'm sure there are a few people out there who can relate.
Not sure if this was mentioned in the video, but I'd like to add this before I forget. What is considered secure attachment may look different for different cultures (at least that's what I heard, but I forgot who said this). Most of the time (like in psychology), we view things through a Western lens. There are many different perspectives, so what is considered a secure attachment style in the US, Canada, of the UK may be different from what is considered secure in Asia or the non-Westernised parts of Oceania.
amazing ......i have watched hundreds videos, listened huge amount of podcasts...read 2 books a weeks, but this video BRILLIANT...absolutely GOLD.....GOD BLESS YOU
I know this was for men, but this helped me more than so many books and podcasts. I realized I may be one of the few that have disorganized attachment. I always thought that I was anxiously attached but a lot of the techniques really didn't help me. I run away from relationships also and this was the first time I heard someone so clearly describe the avoidant piece in an empathetic sort of way. The strategies and techniques provided are something I'm going to speak to my therapist about and this may be the start of a whole new chapter for me, thank you both.
The section regarding the foggy childhood memory is interesting, because I've heard from my neighbors that my home life growing up was stressful and chaotic, cop cars coming and going, screaming matches on a weekly basis mixed with physical abuse, the whole gamut of an unstable family life with emotionally taxing events happening more often than they should. I don't remember a whole lot, because a lot of it seems to just blur together; same shit, different day. I remember very vividly the things that happened to me, but I feel like my experience doesn't have credibility because I can't recall every single unfortunate that happened to me at home. I don't need to be validated for my misfortunes and stress growing up, but I wish I knew more about what I experienced so I can learn and more effectively move past it. Not being able to recall as much makes me feel defunct, like I am stunted in my memory recall and that I shouldn't feel justified in thinking I still have things I can resolve to achieve emotional "fullness".
I’m not a professional in any way but I was wondering if you think it’s the thing your brain does to protect you from trauma. It just blocks the memory so you don’t have it?
@@debslagel1132 Perhaps. I'm more lamenting the possibility that I'm not 100% of the person I want to be, and I've spent years training my perspective to be a person who is able to look forward absolutely as opposed to being half in the past and half in the present. I have behaviors and beliefs that can be attributed to things I experienced (for example, being admonished by my father in front of my mom for my childhood obesity, leading to complications with self-image, self esteem, and needless perfectionism), but I feel that not being able to see the whole picture leaves me unable to fix the whole problem, if that makes sense. An easy way to get around this is to believe wholeheartedly that I don't have a problem anymore, but it's difficult to believe that when you've had friends who can't give you the benefit of the doubt in regards to how you perceive things; I can only act upon what I know, and no one else knows what I know unless I inform them. The trouble is finding people who can accept you once you've given them that knowledge, and perhaps forgive you for needing the reassurance that you're as worthy of kindness and love as they are.
@@debslagel1132 I unrepressed my childhood. I think what happened is basically my mother did everything to ensure I forgot. And since my father stopped living with us full time things got better... i just forgot until my brother died. Then i remember growing up with him and WOW...oh boy...the memories were rough as hell. I think it was just nothing reminded me, and i was too young/emotional/alive to even care about my childhood until my forties. The day i got a bike and was able to leave home alone to see my friends until night time i just put my childhood in a box under the bed as I was free..and i remained free. I rarely spent time at home from 10 years old onwards.
@@XxIsolationistxX try cbt therapy? deb is onto something - dr nicole lepera talks about dissociation and trauma, worth looking into.. also eckhart tolle teaches living in the present moment and other stuff. also worth learning, good luck
I've argued/yelled at my phone/you guys on other topics, other chats & podcasts, but this is your best work yet! (not womanhating/projection/patronizing to the ladies) Emotionally 'in tune' intelligent and humble and honest. Beautiful! (for quite some time lately lol) Ive wished i was a lesbian. But I still love men! ❤
Need and want are words of the lower consciousness. We are in a huge shift in consciousness and vibration of words plays a huge role in this. We recognize we are capable of meeting our own needs and we become clear on that which we VALUE. We recognize we are capable of getting what we want and we become clear on that which we ENJOY. Value and enjoy do not imply lack whereas need and want imply it is lacking. Literally practice this and you’ll see a difference in how energy materializes in your reality.
Love how healthy and Amazingly both expressed love and appreciation to each other in the end. That brings me joy that gorgeous men can be loving. There is humanity and goodness in them 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼 hope more men become like these 2 are ❤
Regulation tactics summary: Anxious: - Understand roots - Meditation (guided) - Breath work (pranayama style) 35:00 - You cannot think your way into secure attachment due to integration of the body. Physical work is needed - training for lack of better word. 39:20 - For anxious work on self-worth is needed. What are you bringing into relationship. - Robust system of self-validation (gratitude journaling (for, important to me because, it makes me feel) 43:05 - Detach worth and safety from external sources 44:00 - Exposure therapy - saying NO to a partner 44:50 Avoidant: - Understand roots - Prioritize experience and expression of it (speak about what you want or don’t want, how you feel) 1:13:00 - Shift from blame to ownership 1:14:00 - Start to use shutdown as a bridge to reconnect (race to repair) 1:15:40 - Relation regulation (physical exercise). Co-regulate exercise in relationship: forehead to forehead, hands on bottom of ribs of partner, follow partners breathing. 40 to 50 breaths. 1:17:30 Fearful avoidant (disorganized attachment): deep desire for intimacy and closeness, while feeling completely unlovable and distrusting people to except who you are and support you. Work on both above summarized attachments. 1:23:30
I was always a stable attached person until I was in a relationship with an avoidant who was cruel. It turned me into an anxious mess. It’s hard to get back to that stable medium after something like that. Probably more of a trauma response than attachment style. It’s been a year and I’m still an anxious mess at times. So unlike me.
Chris and Conner-amazing!! Love the sweet comraderie that you have as the conversation unfolded later. All was amazing and learned way too much-need to re-listen again-but what stood out was about gratitude-I always found it completely meaningless and thought terrible things of maybe I’m ungrateful! Thanks for clarifying immensely how to talk about gratitude. I’ve hated gratitude talks and manifestation talks too and just couldn’t put my finger on what it was that didn’t sit right. Thank you, thank you, thank you. I have three amazing sons (teen, preteen, and younger preteen) and I’m pro-female and pro-male and they know it! Such a poignant episode.
THANK YOU for discussing the drawbacks of mediation for people with trauma. I've never heard this on a podcast before; typically meditation is seen as a prescription for everything, but it can be a stressor for some. I love all the actionable suggestions in this episode.
Attachment theory was very helpful for me (f, dismissive-avoidant). I kept asking myself what was wrong and couldn't find a solution, and I'm one of those hyperindependent people, who press through every obstacle without help. By all means, I should have been able to solve this stupid problem. I had fixed myself before in other ways, like developing good social skills from scratch. I had even pushed myself out of my comfort zone and had difficult discussions with people, although I just wanted to run. I SHOULD have the skill set and will and endurance to make things work. But they just don't. And it's getting worse with age. The more I improve socially, the more friendly and open and caring I become, the worse I am treated. People treated me better 20 years ago, when I was a recluse, who couldn't hold a conversation. Fixing myself has done nothing for me; in fact it feels like it has harmed my ability to brush over abuse, like I did as a child. But attachment theory did something for me. I only got diagnosed last year, but it has changed things. I realised that I was damaged by my caregivers before I could even speak, and that this did cause a subtle form of brain damage (or rather an abnormal form of brain development, that can't be reversed). I will always have a crippled amygdala situation, that no amount of therapy or medication can reverse. It doesn't matter what I do or say in social settings. This time I can't fix it on my own, and professional help is insufficient in a case, where I would need a functioning relationship with a person willing to help. Which leads to the next problem - normal people don't want a nutcase, that they have to fix to get along with, and they're right. A relationship partner should not be misappropriated as a therapist. It's too much, it isn't fair, and I don't want to feel like I'm dating a caregiver. And that's apart from the fact, that I couldn't find someone willing to go the extra mile, even if I wanted to. So here's what attachment theory did for me: It gave me permission to finally quit this $hitshow. I'm not continuing to date people. I will keep my friendships on a superficial level - get rid of friends, who show toxic behaviour, and not open up much with new friends. I've had enough of being treated like dirt, and sadly (based on the environment I grew up in) I attract Cluster B personalities (narcs and borderliners), even when we're just talking about friendship. This stops here, and finding out that I'm avoidant and never stood a fighting chance to find a single safe relationship helped me to come to this decision. That took away a lot of pressure and made me feel better, because all those years I thought I needed to fix something that was unfixable from the start.
That's what you took away from this?! I actually feel great relief as a fearful avoidant knowing that I wasn't born like this and I can heal from it. I'm excited. I don't understand the point of you seeking friendship with others only to keep it shallow. That gets old real quick for you and your friends. I wish you well either way. I'm not going to stay in the cesspool with you.
He talks about avoidants who are in relationships, but what about avoidants who don't/won't engage in relationships, who accept their lot, and have learned to manage living without?
You should interview Adam Lane Smith if you wanna talk about attachment. I think he's the best person to talk to if you wanna cut through the fat and get rid to the lean information about attachment theory and attachment in practice. He's changed my life
This was a brilliant exchange of wonderful thoughts , not that I would presume to be intellectually capable to qualify this marvelously instructive sharing of most helpful ideas. Thank you so much, gentlemen.
What a great video, I honestly needed this video. I know have a better understanding of myself. I’m an avoidance person and often shut down when I get to a point.
As an empath who grew up with an avoidant attachment (narcissistic parents)--but have long since healed from that trauma--I still strongly dislike being with folks who have an anxious attachment. Guys with anxious attachments usually aren't that bad, because they've learned a modicum of self regulation, but gals with anxious attachments register entirely as vampiric. My red flags start flying the moment I see them...and I don't even have to know nor speak with them. Guys with avoidant attachment styles tend to be "mildly" annoyed with me, because try as they want...they can't hide their emotions from my "radar". Lol. Ultimately, my tip for guys who are dealing with being avoidant is to come to terms with the emotions. Even the simple acceptance of "I feel X" does wonders in helping to unpack that boiling monstrosity of emotional trauma bubbling under the surface.
Any advice for an anxious attacher who thought he had it together and then it blew out in the first 2 weeks into a limerance and full mental breakdown😅 I'm OK now.
If these labels are based off the strange situation, it makes sense. And generally people will fall into a general category. But I think we all display varying levels of each trait and behave differently with different people. Ive found attachment styles to be extremely useful to understand but looking at circumstances and asking “what am I doing?” rather than taking on a specific label seems like the most accurate approach.
Young women put in caregiving roles early in life can end up as avoidant ppl later in life. Everyone is a child or childish to them. They don’t want to be responsible for others.
@@chilloften true but a lot of it comes from mothers spoiling their sons out of supposed "love". They do all the feeding, clothing, buying this or that for them and also DO things for them instead of teaching them how to do those things, let them fail and struggle while providing support and guidance. It's also a failure of fathers not teaching boys how to be a man with skills...
I think it's all genetics - the environment will affect the epigenetics. Individuals are born with a temperament that predisposes them to particular reactions to environmental cues. In other words - an anxious person is born with this tendency and if exposed early on to environments that provoke anxiety they will learn that the tendency to be anxious is well founded. The environment reinforces the anxious predisposition. If that same person is exposed early on to environments that do not reinforce the anxious behavior, then they learn that the tendency is not well founded. The environment does not reinforce the anxious predisposition. The upshot being that everyone is not born with a clean slate - meaning that we all have personality predispositions and someone can be born into environments that are stable and still turn out to be an anxious/avoidant adult because their tendency toward that trait is strong.
Absolutely. I think as well as that, the modern environment of status competition leads people toward being anxious/avoidant by means of social media highlight reels being represented as commonplace. As well as the sexual revolution leading to a romantic market that values not getting too attached, and therefore disallowing the romantic market from rewarding traits that result in secure attachment.
I agree, it's a big factor. Even in Traditional chinese medicine they allowed for this. they say the Pre-natal Qi (energy) and post natal... so "temperament" and nurture. I think it goes even deeper... into more of "types" as well.. that have many other characteristics other than this framework. I was also thinking about Willhelm Reich's types in relationship to this. there is some correlation for sure.
@@seraph...4473 Yes - culture is a huge environmental influence that shapes an individual through epigenetic changes. But, the 'character' you were born with gauges just how much influence each factor will have. People who are born with less interest in fitting in, for instance, will be less influenced by their culture. Those who have a greater need for acceptance will be swayed more easily.
@@JSiracusan I think genetics do not get taken into account enough - 'always blame the mother' - is far too often used by therapists to explain individual behavior. Identical twin studies seem to uphold my point of view.
Thankyou! Such a wondrrful and helpful discussion. For me and others that struggle in relationships, forming and maintaining them this is wonderfully practical and i hope it helps others in creating a more satisfied and locing life!
For the anxious attached out there. "You cannot think your way into a secure attachment" And.. " You have to begin to give yourself the validation you are seeking from others." I find this very helpful. I have always been very confident and viewed myself as happy etc. But a lot of my confidence comes from other people and their validation of me and my personality. I've realized recently it doesn't necessarily come from inside myself. I definitely lean on the anxious side. But I know how to perform and act avoidant if that is what will get me what I need as well.
I think a main point missing from this conversation is how your attachment traits/style will vary depending on the person you’re spending time with. You can be totally secure with one person, yet anxiously attached with another.
@4:38 he says an avoidant is afraid of connection. Thats not what the book says or what my psychotherapist says. An avoidant just learned a different strategy to get connection and this is a theory - they learnt that it didn't seem to matter what they did, that their caregiver wouldn't provide connection consistently, so they shut down, or turn the shoulder to protect themselves until the caregiver eventually provided them connection (if at all). its just a different strategy to get connection.
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Hello you savages. Get my free Reading List of 100 life-changing books here - chriswillx.com/books/ Here's the timestamps:
00:00 What is Attachment Theory?
05:15 Why Is This Useful in Evolution?
12:53 How Attachment Styles Are Formed
23:07 Attachment Before & After 18 Months
26:15 How to Discover Your Own Style
30:47 The Core of Anxious Attachment
34:42 Tactics to Regulate Anxious Attachment
46:31 Is Anxious Attachment More in Women?
53:27 Understanding Avoidant Attachment
1:03:11 What Does Being Avoidant Feel Like?
1:12:29 How to Regulate Avoidant Attachment
1:24:49 Can You Improve Attachment on Your Own?
1:30:18 Having a Foggy Memory of Childhood
1:35:48 How to Help an Anxious/Avoidant Partner
1:42:44 Where to Find Connor
thank you Chris for having this episode. this is my favourite one so far. i have watched several podcasts on this topic but this is the one that hits the bullseye. it explains everything and also HOW TO MANAGE your attachment style so u can work on moving towards secured... thank you so much for this and keep up the good work! love your channel ❤
The stuff he talks about men refuse getting help and pushing the therapist away even when those men realy interested and trying to move forward..
- Shows how hard and deep men are traumatized from childhood. If girl cries the world stops.. No one gives a f** about boys. Even the own mothers teacher aunts fathers onkels and so on. We all halfway abuse boys but no one screams at girls.. no one punishes girls but boys need to learn.
- We literly f** up men. On top of it we have woke culture and fe**ismus who drives woman to behaive more avoidens towards men. And movies and again teacher goverment and so on. Everthing is literly build so that you as a boy get crushed and even as an adult men get crushed.
It is so sad if you see all that in the world.
- And then the next woman comes out and gives a talk about how men need show emotions and be more in tune with their feelings.
-> No one talks about that we(mothers/woman primerarly) as society need to stop "opressing" boys and just meeting their needs instat of giving talks to meet and do more so woman are more "safe", making them behaive more towards men negative.
I know one that is avoidant and one that is anxious! Both lack internal self confidence and love! I figured out super fast with how they carry themselves.
As a fearful avoidant myself, this guy nailed it perfectly on the head. You learn to rely on yourself so much that you just feel frustrated at yourself for not being able to let go and just ask for help. You just lie to yourself and everyone around you about being okay, but inside is this storm of negative emotions and self hate.
I'm anxious and my wife avoident and he nailed both.
He didn’t nail fearful avoidant at all, the research is quite clear that fearful avoidant responses can run the gamut to anxious neediness and avoidant pseudo-independence, this is why they are called disorganized: the researchers could never predict the fearful child’s response, whether he’d be mad the parent had gone away or whether he couldn’t care less. His response characterized them as just a more intense avoidant and he emphasizes their sameness
Can relate
@michaelhowington4205Completely uncalled for, dude.
@@dant3175I think he meant it as a symptom not an insult. Be well .✌️
1:22:33 - For those looking for the same thing I was, the combination of both, he called Fearful-Avoidant or Disorganized-Attachment and he mentions it here.
"Really deep desire for intimacy and closeness while feeling completely unlovable and distrusting people to accept who you are and actually support you."
Thanks!
The worst kind of attachment to have imo. I have this type. It’s exhausting.
@@universaltruth2025 I think I have disorganized-attachment too. Married to a dismissive avoidant after listening to this video...
@@JoanneGuelke Yes same. I think FAs are attracted to DAs to begin with as they seem calm and prob have a familiar style as the family of origin.
I hope it gets more attention and good protocols. I think it's better to take what improvemes both avoidant and anxious type and apply to get better
I spent over a decade (IN THE PAST CALM DOWN) in therapy with a whole multitude of issues, and it just took this 1 podcast to COMPLETELY explain my entire life and why I am the way I am. I'm actually in mild shock and disbelief right now.
EDIT: To tell people they're freaking out for no reason thinking I'm still in therapy.
Attachment Theory is mindblowing, I agree. Learned about it a few years ago and it transformed the way I view myself and others.
@@refreshingtwist It was kind of like every single aspect of it slotted into my life perfectly, there wasn't a single thing I didn't exhibit.
@grahamvandyke It was the same for me when I learned about it!!! I've watched loads of videos on Attachment Theory now and am always discovering something new that explains me so well! Enjoy doing a deep dive!
Advice: Get a therapist that focuses on attachment theory ASAP. You can spend years in therapy and it not do much for you if you're with the wrong therapist.
@@og8425 I'm actually not in therapy anymore, but if I ever did go back I would 100% look for someone who focuses on this.
Connor’s the man. Great male-oriented approach to self-development without the limitations of the red-pill worldview
Love his podcast and book!
Red Pill is messed up. The misogyny and hostile sexism towards women is appalling.
Male oriented? Really?
Red pill is the beginning from there you have to explore further.
@@sherriflemming3218it's a response. What is it a response to?
Connor articulates men’s emotions extremely well. A wise man to follow gents.
Appreciate the shout out brother.
And women's as well. Avoidant here.
@@ManTalksas I said in the general comments it’s the ONLY podcast/interview/video in the whole internet that answered ones of the big probs that I had until this day since these 6 last years (start of my severe 2 years long depression). And you did that job thanks to you and Chris.
Am so grateful for that.
So thank you Connor to bring the light to so much darkness 🙏
There’s no such thing as men’s or women’s emotions. There are only human emotions
Women too…
(Dismissive) Avoidant Attached here. Grew up with a Disorganized Attached father and a Secure Attached mother. My father dealt with war trauma (Japanese Occupation in the 40’s) and he was very verbally violent. All I could do as a 4 year old (and on) is go into freeze, shut off and avoid. I did this for 43 very long years. For you people out there, Avoidant Attached people want to connect! But we feel unsafe in our bodies and we are scared to be vulnerable again because: ‘what if?’. Somatic Experiencing is helping me heal and to move into Secure Attached now and oh boy…. It is worth it!
Similar history, almost in secure zone now, would like to compare methods of recovery. Just drop the dot in the correct place between my German and English parts of the name, and add dog and gmail extension after, if you ok to connect and talk.
The problem is your defense mechanisms with your dad are being used to prevent you from bonding with people who have had nothing to do with the experiences your dad gave you.
@@smokingcrab2290 Captain Obvious at our service
Good for you man
@@finalthoughts2762but . . But I thought I was Captain Obvious these last 40 years!
Another really good breathing technique a friend taught me when u have trouble breathing when anxious, is to breathe in deep, then try to breathe in just a little more. Hold it for a few seconds, then exhale slowly.
Has saved me from a few panic attacks.
What he said about making yourself the center of your own orbit since you know youre not the center of anyone else's... Thats legit how it feels and is good concise description.
Great video. One of the things rarely talked about is how family emeshment can lead to avoidance. Some people felt they had very loving parents when in fact they were quite enmeshed.
Yes totally agree
What do you mean ? Not English speaker so the word "enmeshed" doesn't make sense to me ?
@@UnknownHumanOnline Emotional Enmeshment: This is all about feelings. People feel like they're responsible for each other's happiness and sadness. It can be hard to separate your own emotions from everyone else's. - Intellectual Enmeshment: Everyone thinks the same way.
I try to be sympathetic towards avoidant men when it comes to dating but it’s hard to try to show sympathy when they ghost. Did I get played? Did he begin to catch feelings and run from them? Regardless I was heartbroken and never got an explanation as to why they disappeared after seeming so eager to start a relationship. The lesson is, it’s not your job to fix men, hope they go to therapy and improve but don’t destroy your mind trying care for them when they’re giving you nothing
Preach girl!!
Dont set yourself on fire to keep someone else warm
Like Tony Soprano says. Those that want respect give respect.
What if you learned to make better choices? Did you not hear one word of this?
@@mrsherwood2599you people are quicker to blame someone for being deceived (as avoidants are on their best behavior at the start) instead of acknowledging that it’s messed up to switch up and do a full 180…like yea we know they have their own issues but that doesn’t make their actions any less fucked up…
Like many of us, I have watched/listened to what now amounts to hundreds, if not thousands, of videos and PCs pertaining to self-help, mental health, wellness, and the like.
Not a single one hit my innermost soul as hard (nor resonated with me as much) as this blessing to the world.
Thank you both beyond measure. 💓🙏🏻🌹
I think Chris asked a good question about brain scan differences in people with attachment disorders.
I wish there was a bit more of a discussion about this here but I wanted to add that there are differences as evidenced by brain scans and clinical research, and it is fascinating especially when it comes to avoidantly attached individuals. There are numerous published studies that show avoidantly attached individuals suffer more memory issues, respond less to stimuli, and overall show fundamental physiological differences in their brains. 🧠 it’s not as simple as they feel anxiety about intimacy and then ghost; they actually in many cases aren’t wired to even receive and experience closeness the same way secure or anxiously attached individuals are, so their experience of “anxiety” is likely not the same.
I personally would be so excited to see an episode with Dr. Kirk Honda who runs the YT channel Psychology in Seattle. His content is high quality. He has hours of discussion on attachment theory on his podcasts and TH-cam channel.
I wish Chris had asked if psychedelics might be helpful.
Wow this explains why my wife shuts down all my bids for bonding and connection. She simply can't experience it.
@@smokingcrab2290 How did you enter into a marriage if she can't experience bonding and connection? I think you should reevaluate your marriage and start taking steps to protect yourself and your assets. Think about what you stated, if she can't experience it, then you need to question what motivation she has to be married to you if she is actively combating your attempts to improve your relationship.
Does your wife tell you she loves you but then subsequently performs these actions? Please evaluate her on her actions, which from this one comment I can tell are probably abhorrent and exploitative of you. I truly hope I am wrong.
They also don't have serotonin, healthy dopamine, or oxytocin or vasopressin. They mostly survive on cortisol thus the health problems and early death, addictions, impulse etc
@@hspinnovators5516Do you have some recommendations? Like videos or books?
I would really appreciate this 🫂🙏
It seems like I have a Fearful Avoidant Attachment Style. My mother is Securely Attached and my father is Avoidant Attached. I know I had this fear growing up that if I mess up I will get punished for it. I didn’t get much explicit encouragement but I definitely got some error signals when I made a mistake or messed up. On top of this, although I had a great childhood with a pretty healthy home environment, I was rejected by two girls at 16 and 17 years old who I really really liked and the second one crushed me and I rememeber saying the words “never again” to myself and shoved it deeeeep down. I think that shaped my avoidance mostly as I find it petrifying to trust the relationship developing without me having a guard up.
It is my responsibility to let go of. No one is to blame.
My biggest takeaways:
•You can’t think your way into secure attachment
•You have to connect with the experience, the sensations, and the nervous system, rather than memories and thoughts.
•You should implement exposure therapy alongside inner work and let go of that charge that arises
Guilt results in a desire to atone. Shame results in a desire to hide. "Love is always stronger than fear."
Guilt is not appropriate if you haven't done anything wrong. The same applies to shame.
Guilt is…something you did wrong.
Shame is…I am bad.
Shame is the master emotion that drives change. All emotions are good when used correctly. By denigrating shame you are ironically shaming people for feeling it at all.
@@ReallgeemachineWhat about feeling guilty , if you did something wrong ? I would say if you don't have it , change is impossible? What do you think?
It took 5 relationships to recognise i was constantly with emotionally unavailable people as it mirrored my upbringing.. once i figured that out i then began to see my anxious side.. however, through later life trauma i also inevitably swung to avoidant to cope (though i didnt realise that) suffice it to say, after several years of then feeling like i just couldnt seem to make friends, partners or keep a job and had a mental breakdown did i finally understand i had disorganised attachment and was only ever keeping one plate in the air. Trying to keep both up was hard and for the most part i have the anxious side sorted in external relationships though still get triggered by my parent - the avoidant side is much harder to handle as its become somewhat of a shield now. Trusting that others will stay and actually care is the core issue left to tackle. And now in therapy to do that.
Love this in depth video- great to hear it all so well explained and in one video not ten! Lol
Have saved to share with others in the future.
Disorganized attachment is what everything has pointed to for me but I had a hard time accepting it because I was never physically abused or in fear physically. In the rear view mirrow..my family/home/care providers went to crap during my teen years. I actually had 2 primary father figures at same time(1 was grandfather). Grandfather murdered in robbery at 13, father diagnosed with severe illness during same month and eventually became extremely needy physically and needy as in selfishly demanding, tons more shock traumas in the family, then my mother started to lose her mind trying to hold us all together. I was emotionally closest to her before all of this. She became highly emotionally unstable and unsafe for me to be around emotionally and she'd lash out so I walked on egg shells. I even remember holding my breath in the mornings when i heard her foot steps going down the hall never knowing if she was coming to attack me for not being more helpful or if she was going to ignore me. These teen years are years I remember learning to withdraw from conflict and withdraw from bonding with my parents emotionally even though i strongly desired the bond we used to have before the world fell apart. Now I'm married to an avoidant woman and our relationship is extremely difficult for us to bond and I just recently discovered all these attachment issues and have no idea how to fix it all. (It was nice just to type this out somewhere where I'm anonymous)
I wasn't always, but have been an avoidant individual for the past decade or so. I'm decent looking, fairly intelligent, and have average social skills, but after experiencing trauma I detached myself socially. I'm now afraid to go out and have no one to go out with. I'm also a perfectionist, so I only want to show the best version of myself and afraid to show vulnerabilities.
This is technically rather a trauma response than being avoidant per se. work through the trauma could resolve this.
This year has been the most helpful in knowing who I truly am than any year I've lived. I was in a, what I felt, loving relationship with this person who was in a 10 year relationship 2 years ago. For the past few months her and I really hit it off until the first of April where she completely flipped and by the end of the month she completely shut off and ended the relationship without any communication or way to work on it. For months I tried no contact and thought she'd come around (she didn't) and it only took until me missing her birthday she decided to block me on almost everything. This whole time I had been anxious thinking it was me even after working incredibly hard by going through therapy, AA, working out, and eating right to know it wasn't mostly my fault. My anxiety kept telling me that I wasn't good enough or she'll reach out if I did this or that but, in reality she needed to work on her emotions because I did the work and didn't warrant being blocked or not talked to at least since the break up.
I watch a lot of TH-cam videos but I’m half way through this one and I already want to send it to everyone I know. This guy can truly change peoples lives!
Lack of attachment to a caregiver leads to attachment to the need itself. I never heard that idea before
Check out Lisa A Romano.
For an avoidant, questions framed as are u WILLING, rather than do u WANT TO, can be powerful. They likely will NoT “want to”. But they may be willing & it then puts it into their court to decide
Very useful reframing, thanks. 👍
This is the first time I have heard someone acknowledged meditation can be harmful for those with severe PTSD. It's so refreshing to hear.
Fearful Avoidant here👋 It's not a beautiful thing, it sucks pus😂 It's hard! I'm even studying psychology and trying to heal this is hard! Thank goodness the urge for connection is greater than avoiding everything, disappearing into the woods, and becoming crazy old cat lady. Seriously though, great podcast❤️❤️❤️
As you get older it improves. Marriage and legal attachment helps. As does actually inventing a life you could lead if your relationship ended. Good luck.
I have a Secure/Avoident attachment style. I am the eldest and was given responsibilities at a young age and therefore have had to rely on myself to ensure that things got done! This has nade me a "man of the world" which is very attractive especially to a female who is anxious attached but conversely can cause issues with their fear of abandonment. Sadly, these individuals can suck the life out of you! All had been through a lot and overshared but eventually you feel burdened by them! I think also that your attachment style can change with age and circumstances and is hard to break away from! I like being in a relationship, do not fear connection and have never worried about being left. What I think I fear in a relationship is engulfment!
I am the same as you but female.... :)
This entire conversation is an absolute goldmine. Thank you, Chris & Connor!
❤️ the gratitude list! This method is gold :
grateful for ->is important for me because-> how it makes me feel is
Recovering anxious here. What has worked for me is breathwork (Buteyko method), meditations from Dr Joe Dispensa to rewire my somatic patterns and self esteem work (Six Pillars of Self Esteem and learning to trust myself by keeping my word and unraveling my need for external validation). And Stoicism as a framework.
by "worked for me" do you mean you were/are able to be in a relationship/talking stage/etc. in a secure manner without your anxiety flaring up again? Or that in the moment you feel these techniques are helping your mind shift towards secure attachment (ie; "recovering"). Just asking because I also believed I was in the same boat right up until the avoidant person reached back out again and the anxiety creeped back up again. I'm also working on self esteem work mainly, but am interested in the other things you've listed as well. Thing is, self improvement in this area of life seems inconsequential just working on yourself on your own, instead of engaging in another relationship with preferably a secure partner that can lead you to being secure. Would love to hear your thoughts on this.
@@burningspeed2096 bro I am in the exact same boat. I know exactly how you feel. That being said its for sure the second one. At the moment our best bet is to use the techniques when they flare up but subconsciously practice them every single day so it rewires your nervous system. But also before you jump back into the relationship think long and hard if its worth going through all those anxious feelings. Just because you worked on yourself doesnt mean your partner has too. Avoidants typically just process how they felt months later but usually dont do the internal work like us anxious do. (we reflect fast and want to change fast however we think were better until we flare up and then realize nothing has worked)
@@diegomarroquin-rutgers5674 yea so basically we’re cooked 😂 the only way out of this is being saved by a secure person that’s very very patient.
Connor and Chris are some of the best masculine role models I came across in my Life, especially for modern men.
Thank you both for your massive work for Men's mental health and healthy Life.
for me, best podcast to date. exactly what I needed eternally grateful
Chris, I want to thank you for ASKING about the difference between the dismissive avoidant and the fearful avoidant attachment style. If it weren't for you, your guest wouldn't have even mentioned it. His short response also shows he doesn't know much about that third insecure AS, or - what's worse - believes it's just a subtype of the dismissive avoidant one that doesn't even deserve to be mentioned. As a fearful avoidant woman, I do not relate 100% to the dismissive avoidant people - one of the things I'm scared of is how anxious and dependent I get once I start to care about someone. They never experience that.
I do want to thank Connor for a few things though: for making it clear that you can't think yourself into the secure attachment style and that you need to use other ways and methods of healing yourself; and that you can't do it alone - you get hurt in your relationships so that's where you heal as well.
I’m anxious, my ex is avoidant, but it almost seems like he has a lot of narcissistic attributes as well. He would turn off his phone and leave for 2 days to go party with friends…. While I was home with the kid…. Took 13 years and I finally left. He also has addictions so that was an issue too
This has been eye-opening. I've misunderstood attachment styles this whole time.
This was so insightful. As a woman that grew up in an unstable home (alcoholic father) and raised in a country that was in war we fled our home and I had to grow up quickly. at age 10 I was filling in my parents taxes, taking responsibility early on. Didnt really have a childhood. Now I have trouble trusting people and being in relationships. Feelings overwhelm me and i have an emotional wall around me. I often wonder what my life would look like if I was raised in a calm and stable home but I also know I am resilient because of it.. This helped understand myself much better..
The problem with Attachment Theory is its presumed causality (i.e. you’re this way because of the way you learned to connect with others during your early childhood, largely with your mother). This is disproven by twin studies showing relational impacts of temperament (specifically in the domains of neuroticism and agreeableness).
At best, Attachment Theory is personality theory for agreeable people who prioritize the view of the world through the lens of relationships. This is useful, but imprecise. As long as it’s sold a relational heuristic, which it is, then we’re all good.
However, most mid-level psychotherapy practitioners aren’t sufficiently versed in research operationalization or psychometrics and we end up with an industry-wide case of concept creep. Highly agreeable people are disproportionately represented in the field of psychotherapy (which is largely a good thing) but they’re certainly inclined to view psychology through a relational lens even if it’s the wrong tool to lead to a solution.
Some good food for thought tbh 🤔
Yap, it sounds inaccurate and only applicable in a certain context/fantasy
This is why I come to these videos.
It's not to watch the video - I can generally guess what they're gunna to say. I've watched enough of them to not be at all surprised - but to read the comments.
There be gold in these comment sections - one needs patience to find them, but sometimes they float right to the top like this one.
I see your point but I doubt that any other theory is this simple and yet directly explains so many relationships outcomes. It doesn't have to be an all-encompassing predictor of personality traits to serve its general purpose of helping people understand and relate to each other better in a romantic context.
@@vettie But lets be honest, does it actually explain anything? Or is it just the latest excuse used for toxic or failed relationships? Survivorship bias is a hell of a thing to shake.
Chris, I urge you to invite Canadian developmental psychologist Gordon Neufeld to have a chat. He's buddies with the very famous Gabor Mate and they have written books together. He is really great at communicating attachment theory so it's really easy to understand. Sadly he's not very present in the podcast universe, but he really should be, and I'd love to have someone get him to comment on present topics like the culture wars, politics, the psychedelic renaissance, etc. He's a hidden gem!
I’m not a man, but this guy is great and this is one of the best discussions I’ve heard. He helps me understand my husband better.
I know a lot of people who talk about their 'great childhood' because that is the family story that they are told, and it's the story they want to believe, even though it's clear that can't be the case.
After 54 years on this planet with more heart-ship that one person should have, the best attachment for me is to have NONE..zero..only to myself. This redeemed me and made me whole and happy
That is not healthy, we need connections in life to fully enjoy it
@@jghetto85 Why dont you leave it to me to decide, if something works or it does not`??
I agree, we don’t need romantic attachments. They are more trouble than they are worth. Attachments to good family and friends is better.
I have avoidant style, recognised a few years ago by a friend in mental health. I was a ‘mail order’ adoption via a London agency and at four months I was flown out to my adoptive parents living in an African colony. My new mother, a single child who’s father died when she was two, didn’t warm to me and struggled to bond, frequently leaving me with a neighbour, my dad was on an upward career path and his time was limited. At 3.5 years my sister arrived after fertility treatment and she became the focus. I was a mischievous kid , a handful and would often escape the house to explore. Primary school was stabilising, weekends and school holidays would be daily escapes into the bush with my school pals, on my returns I would be punished, hand, shoe, dog lead, swinging broom, belt whatever was to hand. At nine after being brought home by the police for the third time I was sent to boarding school, 1200 miles away in South Africa, to be ‘straightened out’ left there 3 days before school started. I became a scrapper to manage the bullying, a behaviour which came with frequent canning. After starting I didn’t return home for two terms, there was a problem with my adoption which delayed a passport being issued. When I got home, we were sitting around a pool where my parents told me I was adopted, that I wasn’t their natural son and about the passport issue. I got up and sat the other side of the pool and cried, my sister came round and gave me a hug and told me I was always going to be her brother. That pool became symbolic, I felt unwanted, school became ‘home, I dreaded end of term and became independent. At 14, my folks returned to the U.K. and a whole new set of experiences. There’s more but whilst my folks were indifferent to my sports and career successes, my sister always kept me tied into family events. This cast covers much of what I felt and feel, experienced and experience.
That sounds like a nightmarish experience. I cannot imagine how you survived that 😞 really awful.
I still don’t understand after all this time, these decades and experience of life how we can still be in this situation where our parents didn’t want us at the time and haven’t developed an inner maturity enough to maintain our level of psychological sanity. So much waste 🤦♂️
@@dominostimes2119This style is more common than you think. Everyone is different in how maturity and experience develop their coping mechanisms, something a psychiatrist and a cast like this will help you understand. This communication style starts as a baby, adopted or natural, it is about the level of attention and affection it gets from its parents, a connection pattern that continues between them into adulthood and even onto how the grandchildren are treated. I never had therapy but over the years I would write down my thoughts to help me figure out and work through the moments, which I’ve pulled into a script for family record so my children understand how dad became dad.
@@dominostimes2119 time alone doesn’t heal psychological wounds.
They are really hard to heal. So much damage is done in those early years that has long term effects. Its so unfair that the victims are the ones that suffer the effects until we die it seems, except if we do a lot of ongoing work to recover.
@@universaltruth2025 that was my case 6 years ago. Been on severe depression for 2 years minimum with regular suicidal thoughts, on my complete own to recover and dig in this whole mess. Self educating again and again, inner work constantly.
Here for the avoidant style that still remains and have no solution for, didn’t acknowledge it and my regular incoherent interpersonal and intimate relationships.
I am really emotionally avoidant. Though I cannot say this has anything to do with my upbringing. Actually my mother was always very caring and approachable, and frequently complained that I never shared with her. This avoidance definitely fortified itself when I understood how terrible people are at listening and understanding. So I grew up becoming a good listener and a great avoidant. I always carried the mantra with me that "If it's my problem, it's mine to worry about, and up to me to find a way to fix it"
People who never accept help unintentionally (or not) constantly put out the message that they are superior to everyone. Other people need help-not me. You need help because you are weak and I’m not etc etc. I’ve talked to my husband a lot about that. It’s not a message he intends to send at all. Just thought I’d mention it. People often feel very proud of never receiving help, without realizing how actually demeaning it can be to others in the long run. Accepting influence is important.
@@andianderson3017 I don't ask for help because whenever I do they use it as a way to dominate/shame me either in that moment or in the future. It creates vulnerability, whether you like it or not.
And your dad...?
@@williambryant1672 Who’s “they”?
@@andianderson3017 parents and women I've dated.
Something I realised as listening to this... there are 3 Identities at play.. I, them, us.. how much you trust each of those identities is key.. we can think our way to trust. We must do activities that build trust for each of those identities.. this way of thinking about it is far superior to the current connection model.
The amount of insights in this episode are mind boggling! Thank you Chris and Connor, I found this exactly when I needed it.
I'm not sure if this is even possible but i've always seen myself as avoidant and noticed my avoidant tendencies through various relationships. But as im listening to this podcast and reflecting on my last relationship of 4 years i realised that i'd cycled through all 3 attachment styles.
I started the relationship secured but after a year my partner started to complain more and more about my behaviour. One day he admitted to breaching my privacy behind my back (which im fine sharing when we're in front of one another), I realised how little trust he has for me. I suddenly turned into the most anxious person clinging onto him, asking and checking if my behaviours were satisfactory to him (seeking validation). After another year nothing changed and I just became avoidant. I stopped sharing my thoughts, what i needed, i just grew hyper independent within the relationship -wanting to do everything on my own, disregarding his feelings. And slowly the r/s went towards the end.
So based on this story did i actually display all 3 attachment styles? Or am i understanding this topic wrongly?
Personaly I chose to not go into therapy just because I had the firm belief that it would be completely useless, tried to manage the whole thing on my own. Had both anxiety and avoidant type, now got rid of the anxiety one thanks to the ton of self education on the internet, but the avoidant one still remaining for no reasons. This episode is completely relieving for me. « Someone finally understood my problem »..
It's incredibly frustrating having been forced into responsibility for my parent's emotions then responsible ONCE AGAIN to dig my way out.
Forced into responsibility? By what? By who? No one can ever force you to take responsibility for ANYTHING. At the end of the day you can always just curl up in a ball and refuse to do anything.
Taking responsibility for things is always something you choose to do because you want the benefits.
I promise the benefits are worth it. Abusive/semi-abusive parents are never fair, but they arent going anywhere. Someday you might meet a young person thats dealing with the same shit you are and you might save their life with the insights you gain from taking responsibility for yourself.
I believe in you.
@seraph...4473 you don't help anyone by shaming them even more for their feelings and reactions. Trying to "fix and prescribe" for other people is its own dysfunction.
@@Rut-vi7iz I didnt shame them, and its the yt comments, they agreed to have responses in the act of leaving their own comment. I also understand that you think saying what I said is a dysfunction and I disagree. Have a good day.
@@seraph...4473 you can't make those choices as a kid if you're groomed into responsibility even if your parent is in the wrong for cursing you with it.
As a kid you just don't know.
@@kubasniak 100% true. I was making an assumption they were an adult. Fair point.
Great episode! I always enjoy conversations with Connor. Today he helped me learn I'm both anxious and avoidant 👍
30 minutes into this episode and it’s an absolute classic already
If you're with an avoidant, just run. Fucking run. You will never feel more alone than with an avoidant. You will be guessing your sanity all the time. You will be gaslit into oblivion for merely desiring a baseline connection. You will have to cater to all of their needs while getting nothing out of the relationship. Avoidants need to just be left alone in the woods. They are so not worth it. I'm married to one and I hate my life. Every single day is a battle of "how busy can I make myself so that I stop thinking about my miserable relationship?". It's the worst ball & chain I've ever dealt with.
I put my running shoes on a year ago and have never looked back. I can be peaceful and not need to wait for their breadcrumbs or deal with the psychological drama. Trust that you will be okay without this dysfunction. Life is too short for that misery
Hahahahaha they need to be left alone in the woods. I’m so sorry you are suffering and aren’t having your needs met. Too many people always jump to defend avoidants but they don’t even try to improve most times. Most times it’s anxious attachers who at least admit their issues. A lot of avoidants simply don’t care how they treat others or care to meet their partner halfway.
Thank you, Chris, for bringing up the dual attachment style, "fearful avoidant,". I haven't really looked into attachment styles, but I'm sure there are a few people out there who can relate.
Not sure if this was mentioned in the video, but I'd like to add this before I forget. What is considered secure attachment may look different for different cultures (at least that's what I heard, but I forgot who said this). Most of the time (like in psychology), we view things through a Western lens. There are many different perspectives, so what is considered a secure attachment style in the US, Canada, of the UK may be different from what is considered secure in Asia or the non-Westernised parts of Oceania.
12:52 Allowing the guest to pick what they want to talk about from the host’s options. Powerful.
amazing ......i have watched hundreds videos, listened huge amount of podcasts...read 2 books a weeks, but this video BRILLIANT...absolutely GOLD.....GOD BLESS YOU
My god, this explains so much. Im in tears
I know this was for men, but this helped me more than so many books and podcasts. I realized I may be one of the few that have disorganized attachment. I always thought that I was anxiously attached but a lot of the techniques really didn't help me. I run away from relationships also and this was the first time I heard someone so clearly describe the avoidant piece in an empathetic sort of way. The strategies and techniques provided are something I'm going to speak to my therapist about and this may be the start of a whole new chapter for me, thank you both.
The section regarding the foggy childhood memory is interesting, because I've heard from my neighbors that my home life growing up was stressful and chaotic, cop cars coming and going, screaming matches on a weekly basis mixed with physical abuse, the whole gamut of an unstable family life with emotionally taxing events happening more often than they should. I don't remember a whole lot, because a lot of it seems to just blur together; same shit, different day. I remember very vividly the things that happened to me, but I feel like my experience doesn't have credibility because I can't recall every single unfortunate that happened to me at home.
I don't need to be validated for my misfortunes and stress growing up, but I wish I knew more about what I experienced so I can learn and more effectively move past it. Not being able to recall as much makes me feel defunct, like I am stunted in my memory recall and that I shouldn't feel justified in thinking I still have things I can resolve to achieve emotional "fullness".
I’m not a professional in any way but I was wondering if you think it’s the thing your brain does to protect you from trauma. It just blocks the memory so you don’t have it?
Same.
@@debslagel1132 Perhaps. I'm more lamenting the possibility that I'm not 100% of the person I want to be, and I've spent years training my perspective to be a person who is able to look forward absolutely as opposed to being half in the past and half in the present. I have behaviors and beliefs that can be attributed to things I experienced (for example, being admonished by my father in front of my mom for my childhood obesity, leading to complications with self-image, self esteem, and needless perfectionism), but I feel that not being able to see the whole picture leaves me unable to fix the whole problem, if that makes sense.
An easy way to get around this is to believe wholeheartedly that I don't have a problem anymore, but it's difficult to believe that when you've had friends who can't give you the benefit of the doubt in regards to how you perceive things; I can only act upon what I know, and no one else knows what I know unless I inform them. The trouble is finding people who can accept you once you've given them that knowledge, and perhaps forgive you for needing the reassurance that you're as worthy of kindness and love as they are.
@@debslagel1132 I unrepressed my childhood. I think what happened is basically my mother did everything to ensure I forgot. And since my father stopped living with us full time things got better... i just forgot until my brother died. Then i remember growing up with him and WOW...oh boy...the memories were rough as hell. I think it was just nothing reminded me, and i was too young/emotional/alive to even care about my childhood until my forties. The day i got a bike and was able to leave home alone to see my friends until night time i just put my childhood in a box under the bed as I was free..and i remained free. I rarely spent time at home from 10 years old onwards.
@@XxIsolationistxX try cbt therapy? deb is onto something - dr nicole lepera talks about dissociation and trauma, worth looking into.. also eckhart tolle teaches living in the present moment and other stuff. also worth learning, good luck
I've argued/yelled at my phone/you guys on other topics, other chats & podcasts, but this is your best work yet! (not womanhating/projection/patronizing to the ladies) Emotionally 'in tune' intelligent and humble and honest. Beautiful!
(for quite some time lately lol) Ive wished i was a lesbian.
But I still love men! ❤
We need to build trust ourselves, our relationships and us as a team.
TH-cam is an incredible resource, thank you for making these!
Need and want are words of the lower consciousness. We are in a huge shift in consciousness and vibration of words plays a huge role in this. We recognize we are capable of meeting our own needs and we become clear on that which we VALUE. We recognize we are capable of getting what we want and we become clear on that which we ENJOY. Value and enjoy do not imply lack whereas need and want imply it is lacking. Literally practice this and you’ll see a difference in how energy materializes in your reality.
Chris you did a great job of asking the right questions, at least the ones I personally wanted the answers to.
Wow this is a goldmine thank you
Love how healthy and Amazingly both expressed love and appreciation to each other in the end. That brings me joy that gorgeous men can be loving. There is humanity and goodness in them 🙏🏼🙏🏼🙏🏼 hope more men become like these 2 are ❤
Such a great talk ♥️🫠🫶 Very informative & healing to listen to ♥️
Regulation tactics summary:
Anxious:
- Understand roots
- Meditation (guided)
- Breath work (pranayama style) 35:00
- You cannot think your way into secure attachment due to integration of the body. Physical work is needed - training for lack of better word. 39:20
- For anxious work on self-worth is needed. What are you bringing into relationship.
- Robust system of self-validation (gratitude journaling (for, important to me because, it makes me feel) 43:05
- Detach worth and safety from external sources 44:00
- Exposure therapy - saying NO to a partner 44:50
Avoidant:
- Understand roots
- Prioritize experience and expression of it (speak about what you want or don’t want, how you feel) 1:13:00
- Shift from blame to ownership 1:14:00
- Start to use shutdown as a bridge to reconnect (race to repair) 1:15:40
- Relation regulation (physical exercise). Co-regulate exercise in relationship: forehead to forehead, hands on bottom of ribs of partner, follow partners breathing. 40 to 50 breaths. 1:17:30
Fearful avoidant (disorganized attachment): deep desire for intimacy and closeness, while feeling completely unlovable and distrusting people to except who you are and support you. Work on both above summarized attachments. 1:23:30
Thank you so much
You are welcome
I was always a stable attached person until I was in a relationship with an avoidant who was cruel. It turned me into an anxious mess. It’s hard to get back to that stable medium after something like that. Probably more of a trauma response than attachment style. It’s been a year and I’m still an anxious mess at times. So unlike me.
Chris and Conner-amazing!! Love the sweet comraderie that you have as the conversation unfolded later. All was amazing and learned way too much-need to re-listen again-but what stood out was about gratitude-I always found it completely meaningless and thought terrible things of maybe I’m ungrateful! Thanks for clarifying immensely how to talk about gratitude. I’ve hated gratitude talks and manifestation talks too and just couldn’t put my finger on what it was that didn’t sit right. Thank you, thank you, thank you. I have three amazing sons (teen, preteen, and younger preteen) and I’m pro-female and pro-male and they know it! Such a poignant episode.
Very good interview; lots of useful information. Thanks
THANK YOU for discussing the drawbacks of mediation for people with trauma. I've never heard this on a podcast before; typically meditation is seen as a prescription for everything, but it can be a stressor for some. I love all the actionable suggestions in this episode.
Attachment theory was very helpful for me (f, dismissive-avoidant). I kept asking myself what was wrong and couldn't find a solution, and I'm one of those hyperindependent people, who press through every obstacle without help.
By all means, I should have been able to solve this stupid problem.
I had fixed myself before in other ways, like developing good social skills from scratch. I had even pushed myself out of my comfort zone and had difficult discussions with people, although I just wanted to run. I SHOULD have the skill set and will and endurance to make things work.
But they just don't. And it's getting worse with age.
The more I improve socially, the more friendly and open and caring I become, the worse I am treated. People treated me better 20 years ago, when I was a recluse, who couldn't hold a conversation. Fixing myself has done nothing for me; in fact it feels like it has harmed my ability to brush over abuse, like I did as a child.
But attachment theory did something for me. I only got diagnosed last year, but it has changed things. I realised that I was damaged by my caregivers before I could even speak, and that this did cause a subtle form of brain damage (or rather an abnormal form of brain development, that can't be reversed). I will always have a crippled amygdala situation, that no amount of therapy or medication can reverse.
It doesn't matter what I do or say in social settings. This time I can't fix it on my own, and professional help is insufficient in a case, where I would need a functioning relationship with a person willing to help.
Which leads to the next problem - normal people don't want a nutcase, that they have to fix to get along with, and they're right. A relationship partner should not be misappropriated as a therapist. It's too much, it isn't fair, and I don't want to feel like I'm dating a caregiver.
And that's apart from the fact, that I couldn't find someone willing to go the extra mile, even if I wanted to.
So here's what attachment theory did for me: It gave me permission to finally quit this $hitshow. I'm not continuing to date people. I will keep my friendships on a superficial level - get rid of friends, who show toxic behaviour, and not open up much with new friends.
I've had enough of being treated like dirt, and sadly (based on the environment I grew up in) I attract Cluster B personalities (narcs and borderliners), even when we're just talking about friendship. This stops here, and finding out that I'm avoidant and never stood a fighting chance to find a single safe relationship helped me to come to this decision. That took away a lot of pressure and made me feel better, because all those years I thought I needed to fix something that was unfixable from the start.
That's what you took away from this?! I actually feel great relief as a fearful avoidant knowing that I wasn't born like this and I can heal from it. I'm excited. I don't understand the point of you seeking friendship with others only to keep it shallow. That gets old real quick for you and your friends. I wish you well either way. I'm not going to stay in the cesspool with you.
Brilliant, brilliant interview, thank you! This has been invaluable.
This is a really densely valuable interview
Thank you men 👍👍 a brilliant conversation ❤
A very meaningful discussion. Loved this one. Feel like I learned so much.
He talks about avoidants who are in relationships, but what about avoidants who don't/won't engage in relationships, who accept their lot, and have learned to manage living without?
You should interview Adam Lane Smith if you wanna talk about attachment. I think he's the best person to talk to if you wanna cut through the fat and get rid to the lean information about attachment theory and attachment in practice. He's changed my life
I wish my FA ex knew just how much I adore him just exactly as he is ❤💔this gives great insight. Thank you.
When it comes to this topic...chris is one of the best ❤
I really needed this right now.
Wonderful episode! Thank you both!
This was a brilliant exchange of wonderful thoughts , not that I would presume to be intellectually capable to qualify this marvelously instructive sharing of most helpful ideas. Thank you so much, gentlemen.
What a great video, I honestly needed this video. I know have a better understanding of myself. I’m an avoidance person and often shut down when I get to a point.
listening to this hurt a lot
very insightful and really personal...
As an empath who grew up with an avoidant attachment (narcissistic parents)--but have long since healed from that trauma--I still strongly dislike being with folks who have an anxious attachment.
Guys with anxious attachments usually aren't that bad, because they've learned a modicum of self regulation, but gals with anxious attachments register entirely as vampiric. My red flags start flying the moment I see them...and I don't even have to know nor speak with them.
Guys with avoidant attachment styles tend to be "mildly" annoyed with me, because try as they want...they can't hide their emotions from my "radar". Lol.
Ultimately, my tip for guys who are dealing with being avoidant is to come to terms with the emotions. Even the simple acceptance of "I feel X" does wonders in helping to unpack that boiling monstrosity of emotional trauma bubbling under the surface.
Any advice for an anxious attacher who thought he had it together and then it blew out in the first 2 weeks into a limerance and full mental breakdown😅 I'm OK now.
Really needed this pod, thank you both fellas.
This is fantastic and has given me alot of insight into some of my own relationships -- thank you.
If these labels are based off the strange situation, it makes sense. And generally people will fall into a general category. But I think we all display varying levels of each trait and behave differently with different people. Ive found attachment styles to be extremely useful to understand but looking at circumstances and asking “what am I doing?” rather than taking on a specific label seems like the most accurate approach.
Podcast like this hitting every point you people know me wow thank you so much for these videos ❤👏 God bless you doctors
Chris nailed the questions.
He asked some killer questions
Young women put in caregiving roles early in life can end up as avoidant ppl later in life. Everyone is a child or childish to them. They don’t want to be responsible for others.
Truth in this. Too many personsibilities at a young age.
So many of the men want mothers.
@@chilloften true but a lot of it comes from mothers spoiling their sons out of supposed "love". They do all the feeding, clothing, buying this or that for them and also DO things for them instead of teaching them how to do those things, let them fail and struggle while providing support and guidance. It's also a failure of fathers not teaching boys how to be a man with skills...
I think it's all genetics - the environment will affect the epigenetics. Individuals are born with a temperament that predisposes them to particular reactions to environmental cues. In other words - an anxious person is born with this tendency and if exposed early on to environments that provoke anxiety they will learn that the tendency to be anxious is well founded. The environment reinforces the anxious predisposition. If that same person is exposed early on to environments that do not reinforce the anxious behavior, then they learn that the tendency is not well founded. The environment does not reinforce the anxious predisposition. The upshot being that everyone is not born with a clean slate - meaning that we all have personality predispositions and someone can be born into environments that are stable and still turn out to be an anxious/avoidant adult because their tendency toward that trait is strong.
Absolutely. I think as well as that, the modern environment of status competition leads people toward being anxious/avoidant by means of social media highlight reels being represented as commonplace. As well as the sexual revolution leading to a romantic market that values not getting too attached, and therefore disallowing the romantic market from rewarding traits that result in secure attachment.
I agree, it's a big factor. Even in Traditional chinese medicine they allowed for this. they say the Pre-natal Qi (energy) and post natal... so "temperament" and nurture. I think it goes even deeper... into more of "types" as well.. that have many other characteristics other than this framework. I was also thinking about Willhelm Reich's types in relationship to this. there is some correlation for sure.
@@seraph...4473 Yes - culture is a huge environmental influence that shapes an individual through epigenetic changes. But, the 'character' you were born with gauges just how much influence each factor will have. People who are born with less interest in fitting in, for instance, will be less influenced by their culture. Those who have a greater need for acceptance will be swayed more easily.
@@JSiracusan I think genetics do not get taken into account enough - 'always blame the mother' - is far too often used by therapists to explain individual behavior. Identical twin studies seem to uphold my point of view.
Thankyou! Such a wondrrful and helpful discussion. For me and others that struggle in relationships, forming and maintaining them this is wonderfully practical and i hope it helps others in creating a more satisfied and locing life!
Great episode. One thing I disagree with - overbearing parent is likely to create an avoidant attachment and not anxious.
Thank much needed and anticipated
For the anxious attached out there.
"You cannot think your way into a secure attachment"
And..
" You have to begin to give yourself the validation you are seeking from others."
I find this very helpful.
I have always been very confident and viewed myself as happy etc. But a lot of my confidence comes from other people and their validation of me and my personality. I've realized recently it doesn't necessarily come from inside myself. I definitely lean on the anxious side. But I know how to perform and act avoidant if that is what will get me what I need as well.
Hello sirs, this is a great video and very thorough explanation of how attachment works. ❤
I think a main point missing from this conversation is how your attachment traits/style will vary depending on the person you’re spending time with.
You can be totally secure with one person, yet anxiously attached with another.
@4:38 he says an avoidant is afraid of connection. Thats not what the book says or what my psychotherapist says. An avoidant just learned a different strategy to get connection and this is a theory - they learnt that it didn't seem to matter what they did, that their caregiver wouldn't provide connection consistently, so they shut down, or turn the shoulder to protect themselves until the caregiver eventually provided them connection (if at all). its just a different strategy to get connection.
Holy crap. I needed this at exactly this moment.
I needed this ages ago.
No mention fearful avoidance is also disorganized so it's a combination of avoiding and anxious that is my lucky duck Go to under stress