Breaking the LAND SPEED RECORD in Kerbal Space Program!
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 ส.ค. 2024
- We're back in KSP and this time we're trying to break the land speed record on the runway of Kerbal Space Program. Using a variety of engineering techniques can we beat the land speed record and stop in time before reaching the end of the runway and doing a Hammond?
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#realcivilengineer #engineering #ksp
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That feeling when RCE got the record and survived but didn't realise because he accidentally went into cockpit view, then completely redesigns the vehicle...
Yeah i think so too. lol
how did he beat Bradley Whistance? And Stratenblitz?
@@sebdapleb1523 Who?
@@sebdapleb1523 oh yea, you are.
@@Xeridanus a KSP youtuber that does crazy stuff, way crazier than this stuff
As an experienced player and fluid dynamics engineer the pain is real.
yes i
This video gave me chest pains, lol
A mechanical engineer he is not.
I would like to see him try and design a car in one of the games I play... He would get so confused so fast.😑
as an aerospace engineering student the intakes on the solid boosters made me want to cry
5:45 Yes, oxidizer is used for when in a vacuum, but you need it if you're working with rocket engines. Jet engines take their oxygen from the air, so they don't need it. If you want to use jet engines, use a "liquid fuel fuselage" instead of a "fuel tank." However, you then also need an air intake.
exactly
Might be wrong but can’t you use an intake or does that only work for jet engines 6:56
@@aydantaylorellis8200 That only works for jet engines. Rocket engines are designed to use oxidizer.
gamer or rocket engineer?...what are your qualifications?
@@n.v.9000 Kind of both. I know the information from how things work in real life, and I know how they apply to KSP.
The reason for the plane moving on the runway at the start (at least from what I remember in Scott Manley's videos) is that the in-game object for the runway is perfectly flat, but it covers a good bit of distance on the planet's curved surface, which makes it act like a downward slope towards the middle part of the runway
Also these wheels don't have brakes.
It more noticeable in heavy vehicles.
@@jwalster9412 yep downhill more weight gets fast sooner.
@@tropicalvikingcreations I used to play kerbel afew years ago, one time I build a massive (very jiggly) jet and it would alway roll down the runway at high speeds if I didn't hold the brakes.
It's odd that something heavy would go faster - that's not realistic. Consider pinewood derby cars - the weight doesn't make a difference in how fast it goes - aerodynamics/friction are really just about only factors. I suppose something really light would be affected by air resistance a lot more (like a feather) - but it's not like Kerbal has anything that light...
With how many hours I have in KSP, watching RCE try to figure it out is both entertaining... and a bit painful.
It was one of the first games I ever played, been messing around and learning basic aerospace for about 10 years at this point becuase of it, it’s really fantastic
I'm screaming at the screen
@@scottie_2024 same
Having zero time in the game, but seemingly a lot more basic understanding of aerodynamics it was a bit hard to watch...lol(but entertaining of course).
Halos had an urge to scream since he uses mods in a land speed record video but it’s fine he’s just having fun
9:37 'I haven't got enough weight.'
So, you're gonna use downforce to counteract without compromising the acceleratio-
'So I'm gonna add more weight.'
... Welp...
To be fair, he does say "downforce" at least once, even if he doesn't actually use it. lol
or just place the chutes at the same height as the center of mass ...
To be fair he is just a civil engineer not an aerospace engineer.
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exactly. that's exactly how i went
"Speed has never killed anyone. Suddenly becoming stationary, thats what gets you." - Jeremy Clarkson.
Reminds me of a old black and white movie, where a guy is given godly powers for a day. To prevent losing those powers, he stops the rotation of the Earth so the day never ends...
HI
@@SeedlingNL did it work?
The UK space agency is back at it again, with its… interesting ship names and designs
i got the 69 like
I like your profile pic
I thought he was going to break the ksp record not the real life one
Yyyyyyyyyyyy
The parachutes you were using were drogue chutes, which are meant to slow a capsule enough in the upper atmosphere that the main chute won't be destroyed. They are smaller than normal parachutes.
he randomly guess the correct ones though, for normal chutes dont work on very high speeds, but these do.
Ideally he'd add normal chutes after drogue ones, but ... we're very far from "ideally" in every other aspect of this experiment, so...
@@peka2478 Good point. I thought the ~300m/s velocity was low enough for normal chutes, but I just looked it up and it appears that they fail around 250m/s.
@@linuxsbc yeah its like sfs
Matt lowne with 50 tonne ssto uses them
I would highly suggest several reaction wheels for keeping straight, and using actual parachutes for slowing. I've done this exact thing before, using those thrusters. I hit 500s easy. Stayed on runway.
Real engineering: makes a whole video about wheels and their performance on the bloodhound ssc
Meanwhile RCE: Tyre in a pod on a thin stick
The intake cones are for jet engines so that you don't need oxidizer. They're useless if you have only rocket engines, but jet engines don't work without them.
They are for looking cool mostly.
Aerodynamics still count in this game.
@@tropicalvikingcreations True, but nose cones have less drag than intakes.
Intakes are for jet engines, which requires oxygen intake from the atmosphere. The benefit of jet engines over rocket engines is that they don't need to carry their own oxidizer, which makes for a much lighter spacecraft compared to self contained rockets engines.
Jet engines are mainly useful for collecting science by flying around to the various biomes in "Earth" (or whatever that's called in KSP).
@@tropicalvikingcreations also, aesthetics.
Too much fuel.
The more mass, the slower the acceleration and deacceleration.
You can pull over 15G accelerations with a single RT-10 Hammer.
Vectors are a good bet.
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To clear up a few terms
VAC: The thrust of the engine produced in a vacuum (70,000m above kerbin)
ASL: At Sea Level, the thrust produced by the engine at sea level
Oxidiser: All rocket engines require an oxidiser as the combustion is performed in a sealed environment and due to the amount of fuel used. Jet engines do not require external oxidiser as they use the oxygen in the atmosphere to burn the fuel
Also, in the start you were using the red parachuted which are called 'droge chutes' these are often used to slow a craft down from hypersonic speeds to subsonic speeds so the main chutes can be deployed, in your case a normal chute would be better
but he obviously expected to beat 340 m/s, thus supersonic, thuse drogue chutes. See, he planned it all very carefully! ^^
@Pe Ka drove chutes are only used in kerbal for looks or for slowing down planes, a normal parachute can still be deployed at supersonic speeds
@@icmeric ...without getting destroyed?
cool, didnt know that, thanks!
Now lets hope ill never get into a situation where this knowledge becomes important xD
@@icmeric With speeds exceeding 300m/s you will have trouble deploying a regular parachute in KSP.
@DerBlaue that is true. For general re-entry, they are kind of redundant, but here they would be worthwhile (but main chutes would have also been a good idea)
Watching this as an experienced player knowing that reaction wheels, accurate throttling and TWR exists in this game is just painful
*I love it*
Well and then there is a guy which reached kerbins escape velocity on land(something around 3400m/s) so this video is kinda baby mode stuff
@@likilike501 Stratzenblitz75
What a guy, there's bradley whistance too
@@likilike501 yeah lol
Also him not realizing he can just press Z and the rockets will shut off 💀
Kind of picked up this challenge. So far have gotten starts, broken 310, and stopped safely all in the length of the runway. The problem I’m having is between 310 and throttle cut off, it tends to go airborne. Have still managed safe stops and landings, but feel like I don’t merit the challenge win if the vehicle goes airborne, even if only after breaking 310.
Note: there are better radial chutes for stopping you than the ones you used.
To turn engines off and others on without messing with thrust, try using action groups. You can set certain actions (like engines turning on/off or airbrakes deploying) to a hotkey.
they would literally answer all his questions in this video.
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Though if the engine you want to keep running is a solid rocket motor, just throttle to 0 - the Lf/O engines will be "off" and the SRBs will keep going, since they can't be stopped (or throttled) once ignited.
Use wings to create downforce, have them slightly angled Down
That’s a lot of drag
@@thatoneguy611 They'd be small, similar to an F1 car, nothing larger than the wings on an X-15. At crazy speeds wings are the only thing that's going to keep a vehicle doing what you want it to do.
@@OmikronTitan when you’re using jet or rocket power, though, it’s more effective to just angle the engine downwards, losing a bit of thrust instead of gaining a bunch of drag.
@@thatoneguy611 Hm, that seems like something that'd require a lot of physics math that I'm not qualified or knowledgeable enough to take on. I guess the question is can gimbaled engines keep enough control versus having a control surface. From what's I've seen of actual KSP land speed tests there's always a form of control surface. I'm guessing the lift created just by the body of the vehicle is way too much to keep it on the ground without extra control surfaces.
@@OmikronTitan when you angle the engine slightly downwards, you are creating downforce. If you look at images of jet dragsters, you’ll notice the jets are nosed down slightly, and they have no wings, unlike top fuel dragsters.
Jeb's face is hilarious, such a positive outlook despite having seen so many failures, Bill on the other hand in the first test is more like 'here we go again'
ASL:
ASL means ‚at sea level‘
Braking:
Also if you want to slow down there‘s a BRAKE button on the top in the UI (red button to the right of the current height ASL) and I thought that there was also a keybind for it. If the airbrakes aren’t already in the action you can configure it additionally in the action group menu in the hangar, thats the wrench and hammer symbol to the left of the name. You can also make your own custom action group (activated by the number keys, action group 1 => 1, 2=>2 etc) just click on the thing you wish to activate and you can select what to do.
Edit: you found it! But I hope the action group thing helps you…
I hope I‘ve helped :)
P.S. please look at this RCE!
well evne if he got the name wrong, I guess his idea was right honestly then in regards to ASL vs VAC
I always thought it was a bad way to start a conversation.
That was the most engineer based solution to a problem I've ever seen: I can't do it, so I'll change the parameters to give myself success!
If you want to save mass, you can take one of the Kerbals out by clicking on the Kerbal icon in the top left (to the right of the part picker). Alternatively, you can save even more mass by replacing the cockpit with a probe core.
Kerbal can't sit if you replace it with a probe core.
@@tikoko20 That's the point. A probe core is less mass than a cockpit+Kerbal.
@@linuxsbc We're trying to set a land speed record in a piloted vehicle, not a giant RC car!
RCE truly is an engineer,,, 10 years late (on the trend)
No
😂
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9:15 - missed opportunity to demonstrate the highly efficient shape formed by the rocket + the two parachutes.
5:19 the yellow vehicle just did a drift. what a legend
you have to right click the engine and turn off gimbal mode so you don't die since you want to go in a strait line 9:40
For a top speed record to be valid, it needs to be done from both directions of a location, and the average of the 2 runs is considered the top speed.
That would account for all the wind in ksp
never heard of that 😅
@@Freakhealer that's what they have to do with cars, they even had to do it with the jet car that holds the record.
@@jwalster9412 good to know, i was kind of into it but never saw or notice that they require 2 runs. always learning
Just gonna say it: I'm really curious what Freud would have said about RCE's "strongest shape" hyper focus.
to take some drugs and enjoy the shapes he likes
Freud would have projected something about sleeping with his mum
@@TAP7a doesn't explain the strongest shape tho.... I assume
Sometimes a strongest is just a strongest shape.
Firing a rocket booster into the back of your airbrakes wont really do much in the way of slowing you down, although it makes for a nice fireplace I guess
Drogue shutes are used to slow you down to a speed where your parachutes can deploy RCE
Me: reads the first word of the comment - “FINALLY someone who spells “drogue” correctly in the comments!”
Also me: reads one more word - “DAMMIT!”
@@jako7286saem
-Atmosphere at Sea Level (ASL)
-Vaccum (VAC)
-Kerbal Space Program (KSP)
-Pneumatic Operated Oscillation Propulsion (KRKN)
the tiny car in the backround hitting the sickest drift ever at 2:55
You can have powered wheels, but they're generally pretty slow. Other methods of propulsion are liquid fuel rockets (high efficiency, slightly lower thrust, need separate fuel tanks, can be throttled and turned off), solid fuel rockets (low efficiency, high thrust, fuel included, can't be controlled), and jet engines (only work in the atmosphere, lower thrust, extremely efficient, can be controlled).
bro soo smart
But how about Taco Bell fueled rocket?
@@wikansaktianto9215 That's liquid fuel.
You weren't too light, because your chutes were on the top, the pulled on the top and tilted you being heavier majes it harder to accelerate and decelerate
5:45 Yes, there is oxidizer for that exact reason. That is what distinguishes rocket engines from gas turbine engines, the fact that they are not air breathing.
In this episode, a Civil Engineer tries to design something that moves. It goes slightly better than expected.
"now we have more weight for the parachutes"
Does.. does the engineer not understand how inertia works???
Yeah it only makes acceleration hard, but after that it's no longer part of the equation.
Right?
Right?
@@louieberg2942 not really, adding mass also affects how quickly you can decelerate (what he was trying to fix), buckling on the tires leading to instability, and messing with the balance of the vehicle.
This needs a whole lot of 'Check yo' staging!'. 😅🚀
Fun Land Speed Racing Fact: Weighing less the faster you go on the Bonneville Salt Flats is counter-productive. The ThrustSSC streamliner weighs nearly 10 tons, and for good reason, because you need to maintain stability and just the right amount of ground contact to be able to steer. It's even more important for wheel driven land speed racing vehicles, as the salt at Bonneville is very similar to driving on a cross between wet sand and packed snow, so the more weight and downforce you can maintain on your driven tires at speed, the more your tires can maintain the grip required to push you forward without slipping. It's very common for vehicles to hit the 175mph threshold and lose traction and spin out, or not be able to go any faster, as the drag outweighs the grip and the driven tires lose traction. Everyone thinks the key to going fast is being light, but the true key is maintaining a heavy enough load to counteract the drag.
I would highly recommend sepatrons. Facing sepatron masses (like 2-4 rows of 16 sepatrons around a circle) in opposite directions gives you absolutely massive thrust. You can use it to accelerate and break. Lead with a nosecone attached to a decoupler so when you want to brake you have thrust exhaust. Then have sepatrons facing backward in rings surrounded by a payload or faring. Then have your control area e.g. cockpit or computer in the middle. Then create another payload shell to streamline a second set of sepatrons with a hole in the rear for thrust exhaust
^
Right click on items in the parts list to see detailed stats. You can reduce the amount of fuel in tanks in the editor.
There is a toggle for breaks next to the altimeter.
Use the 4 buttons at the top left next to the parts list to edit the placement of parts finely. the buttons at the bottom of the parts list show the center of mass, lift and thrust.
Action groups allow you to make macros for actions.
Matt is either Jeremy Clarkson, son, or a power addicted Englishman like any other Englishman.
Martincitopants : "Look what they have to do to mimic my power"
Matt, you are a very creative, smart, and talented person and your videos bring a lot of joy into my life. Your engineering for roadways and bridges is what one would expect from a seasoned roadway engineer.
However, and I say this with all due respect, your aerospace engineering is PAINFUL to watch. Watching you designe optimal roadways would be equal to solving complex quadratic equations, but watching you design a high speed vehicle is equal to watching you fail to solve 2+2.
Good to see this back on the channel
You're missing so much if you don't get yourself BDArmory!!
Also your sausage thingy crashes because the Vector engine has gimbals, that try to keep the vessel level. Turn it off by right clicking the engine and turning gimbal off.
Some ways to improve the design:
1. Use bigger parachutes, they will slow you down faster. The blue side-mount parachutes would probably work better.
2. If you are using air inlets, may as well use jet engines, although they take some spool up time and don't produce as much thrust. I would recommend swapping out the shock come inlets for regular nose cones in you insist on keeping the side-mounted rockets.
3. Bigger vehicles are not necessarily faster. Newton's 2nd law says F=ma (or a=F/m in our case), so to get the most 'a' for any 'F', you want minimum possible 'm.' That's why the bigger rocket was having a harder time reaching the same speed. Ideally, you should use up all of the fuel just as you reach your planned speed.
4. Solid fuel does not need throttle to work. The braking boosters are solid fuel, so you could have just pressed 'x' to shut down the liquid fuel engines before staging the brakes.
Hope this helps
1. Your original braking boosters were producing no thrust because their exhaust was hitting the ship directly. The game was trying to stop you from blowing your own sail. The real mystery is "why don't the particle effects change to hint that this is happening?"
2. if any part can be deployed outside of the hanger, then its menu inside the hanger will usually have a switch to "start deployed" with which you can preview what it looks like when it is deployed.
Matt releases videos so often I still haven’t caught up. He still has really good quality videos. Great job Matt keep it up.
He releases 1 per day, if you're only watching 1 per day you'll never catch up
The thrust vectoring on the rocket engines was most likely making everything wobbly so maybe try turning it off, that should help
2:53 dude, those vehicles outside the hanger are tearing it up!
Fun fact: vessels on the runway roll forwards because the runway is a flat model, but the curvature of Kerbin means its ends both slope noticeably towards the middle of the runway.
Your videos keep me going every day. Keep doing what your doing man!
Martin got over 1.8billion land speed :)
trying to watch someone figure out a game you have been playing for years and fail is one of the worst forms of torture and the best form of entertainment at the same time.
14:43 "Well yours may have laser eyes, but mine breathes fAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH"
The ThrustSSC almost looks like it was designed with the strongest shape in mind, looking from certain angles.
Watching rce play kerbal is entertaining on a whole other level
6:40 The car just randomly dirfting in the background😂😂
Here's what you need: reaction wheels to stabilize the craft, front and rear spoilers, structural fuselages devoid of fuel, and to TURN ON FUEL CROSSOVER ON THE DECOUPLERS!
4:52 Solid Rocket Fuel...
Gotta love how cheap and powerful it is...
Liquid fuel is better,
But I prefer Antimatter...
Or Ion engines...
E
E
I haven't played KSP in years and even I know there are air breathing jets. "At Sea Level"
The best part about Kerbal Space Program are all the explosions and how everything explodes.
The Thrust SSC didn’t need rocket engines, and used only one chute... so if you use them, you’re...
Also, the speed record got beaten by...
The Bloodhound (awesome names) so...
This comment is...
OG Pro tip for KSP just use SAS for a nose cone, use adapters if needed.
2:47
"I don't think there are any engines or anything"
*me, the guy who could only make planes:* "how DARE you"
Watching Matt through this video, I have noticed that he is now a real life Wil E. Coyote, Super Genius.
"We didn't blow up! We're making progress!" That is the most engineer thing I've heard all day.
The solid boosters to brake are a decent idea, but you discovered early on in the video they can't be stopped. SRBs are either off, or they're 100% throttle till they empty or explode. They won't be affected by zeroing the throttle on the main stage so you can bypass the decoupling entirely. Perhaps try retro-SRBs on frames to get them out away from the car, then decouplers on them for when they get you near zero mps?
100 degrees of angle on the airbrakes would stop you slower than 90, and 100 would be unreasonably unstable
The ThrustING is so incredible, your ThrustING deserves more recognition, your ThrustING deserves to be in the record books, I love when you start the ThrustING
You can bind all your brakes to the same key - shut off engines, deploy chutes, activate brakes and air brakes.
6:07 you can drain fuel from fuel tanks by right clicking and the fuel and oxidizer will have separate sliders you can adjust
15:00 solid rocker boosters (like the sepratrons you were using for brakes) don't give a toss about throttle; you can just hit x with space to turn your main engines off when you start braking.
Also some jet engines have a thrust reverse mode, but they probably won't get you the land speed record in the space of the runway
Me screaming so loud at him using LIQUID FUEL ONLY for a VECTOR THRUSTER instead of liquid fuel AND OXIDIZER!
The wheelshoot in real life would be horrifying. Imagine going 700 miles per hour and you deploy your parachutes to slow down and they just tear off your wheels
5:55 oxidiser is always required for rocket engines. The oxygen present at any point in the atmosphere is nowhere near the required concentration for combustion to effectively occur between it and the fuel
Well, i hit 1400m/s with an SSTO with the W.A.R.P. drive mod as a test for my parachutes. I somehow slowed down in time, just at the end of the runway without taking off!
ASL: in Atmosphere at Sea Level
Vac: Vaccuum
Another thing, you can add custom actions to turn off the engines when braking and the airbrakes were set the wrong way.
The truck outside the hangar lol 2:55
U r absolutely correct when u said that the oxidizer let's the fuel burn in a vacuum. Without it, nothing would burn, however, using it in an atmosphere still gives it a better thrust output in real life, but I don't think it does in Kerbal space program, so it's really just added weight.
I love watching people learn about staging. Also you can adjust how much fuel a tank has in it so you can save on weight without sacrificing a specific engine or setup you'd like. And engines can work on decouplers you just had the staging wrong from the looks of it.
The solid rocket boosters for slowing down aren’t affected by throttle, so they would’ve continued firing if you cut power to the main engines
@6:00 - I'm sure you figure this out in due time in the video, but yes oxidizer is used to make combustion happen in space. However, in KSP, if you want to forego oxidizer you need to use a jet engine of some description and put air intakes on your vehicle so that you can actually utilize the oxygen in the atmosphere for your combustion - the engine you picked is a rocket engine and will not work without oxidizer, however.
2:56 so nobody else sees that truck doing donuts around the tug? 🤣🤣
The land speed record in KSP is somewhere around 4000 m/s.
Stratzenblitz75 and Bradley Whistance both have build impressive contraptions to that goal.
Dear RCE, I am a person that you have inspired. When I saw your channel, I was immediately dug into the hole of engineering. I have been working for three years as an engineer now, thanks to you. Just saying thank you for the inspiration. (Their should have been better wheels in my opinion) -Anonymous(ish) Civil engineer.
I built a replica of Bloodhound SSC in KSP, got it up to over 1000mph in the middle of the desert using a jet engine and a small ROCKET booster (just like the real one) and only exploded on most of the attempts!
This was painful... A few things:
Yes, rocket engines need oxidizer. They can't get oxygen from the air to run correctly.
Putting mass further back is a bad idea because the part with higher mass will always want to be in front of the aerodynamic center.
Drogue chutes are for slowing down when you're already going very fast, and normal chutes are for when you're slower. I would say you should have used normal chutes.
You shouldn't need the intake when you're using rockets. Those are for engines, which don't need oxidizer.
Airbrakes should be on the back, for the same reason as putting mass further forwards.
And yes, the timewarp explosions are a glitch - the game doesn't like timewarping at high speeds for some rockets, especially if they're on the ground or have a very high component count.
Also, you can reduce the amount of fuel in a tank by right clicking on it in the VAB and moving the fuel/oxidizer sliders.
I don't know if the small solid boosters weren't working because they're too weak or if it was because they were blocked by something. My guess is the second, but I'm not really sure.
Anyway, better luck next time :) I think you could do it if you learn a bit more about the game - at the moment you just haven't learned enough yet.
I did build a black bird in ksp too, it fly super fast and go around the world with out refueling. This is my favourite game.
that feeling when a challenge you set on the forums years ago is still being attempted :D
Is noone talking about the truck drifting around the big fuel tanker at 4:45 ish hahahahhaa
typically you'd want the parachutes underneath the center of mass, at the rear of the vehicle, thus dragging the front down into the ground, giving you more friction.
it's science
ASL is At Sea Level. Also use Action Groups to assign buttons to parts. You can start and stop boosters at will, activate air brakes, anything really. Set your rudder for Yaw only and add fins to the sides and angle them to help keep you on the ground. Take your vehicle to the North Pole, plenty of space up there.
RCE doesn’t realize that solid rocket engines don’t stop even if you lower the throttle 😕
You don't actually need fuel ducts - by default, decouplers allow fuel crossfeed between each side. You probably didn't mount the engines properly when you initially used the decouplers, because that normally does work. Also, you might consider adding engine shutdown for the three liquid fuel engines to the brake action group (you can look that up if you don't know what I mean). Finally, throttle setting does nothing on solid rocket boosters, so you could have just set throttle to minimum when you braked and activated the boosters to slow down.
KSP landspeed mode is essentially Richard Hammond Vampire rocket dragster simulator
To be fair, this would be moderately difficult for most KSP players.
I'd absolutely love to see strasenblitz optimize this challenge. Fastest speed and stopped by the end of the runway.
i am pretty sure you are going to find out yourself but i feel like explaining.
Liquid Fuel itself can only be burnt by the Nuclear Engine (NERVA). Normal Rocket Engines need a Oxidizer to burn the fuel.
The science behind it is that the fuel gets sprayed into the combustion chamber and needs to be mixed with the oxidizer to start the ignition and keep the ignition stable and running. The gasses are going so hekkin fast and the pressure in there is so high that oxygen from the outside has no way of reaching the camber. therefore a oxydizer (in most cases liquid oxygen) needs to be used