How About Many Other Videos: How Strong Is Itachi? : th-cam.com/video/Iw5hIWAniAQ/w-d-xo.htmlsi=SAU14aCOfECFY4SJ Minato vs Hashirama!? : th-cam.com/video/c6qKEjlRjQs/w-d-xo.htmlsi=-mvJbJvfHule44-o Akatsuki Duo Free For All!? : th-cam.com/video/JECi7G1GJGA/w-d-xo.htmlsi=0VPgfJTeh5tSEJH4
If a sage mode Naruto, with all the info in the world on Pains abilities, 2 sage frogs who are also incredibly strong supporting him, prepped with some shadow clones with sage mode to be able to enter sage mode multiple times and even fighting in Ninetails form (4+ Tails) barely beats Pain, who wasn’t even trying to kill him and had used up some power fighting and destroying the leaf prior to that, how would Sasuke at that point in the story compete? If anyone actually thinks that Sasuke at that point in the story could beat Pain, they are just simply delusional.
I have always had this take that Pain is the strongest character up until White Mask Obito shows up. I think everyone else, including Itachi and OM Obito, are below him in power/strength, but I regularly find I'm alone in that thought.
Ppl always forget that Itachi has no stamina cuz of the war arc edo stuff. Itachi would gas out if he was forced to use any of his higher end abilities early. Outside of Obito knowing Nagato's main body secret I'm pretty sure no one at that point narratively can compete with Pain's raw power. Power creep gets goofy during the war arc though
@doodoobuttah It's hard to tell because, in my opinion, because, believe it or not, Itachi uses a decent amount of MS abilities. For example, in Part 1, you could argue he was holding back against Kakashi and Jiraiya and Sasuke and you could argue that Part 1 to Part 2 Itachi got stronger, and by the time he fights Sasuke, he's quote literally just killing himself (he stopped taking his medicine to hold back his illness and he was effectively blind). I counted how many jutsus he used, but I don't remember how many it was, but I was surprised, given how often Itachi is said to have "low stamina." He definitely doesn't have the stamina that Pain, Obito, or Kisame have, but he isn't a slouch, in my opinion.
@@CH1C4N0444 I think Obito's broken kamui could give him a win even as orange mask, but itachi has no chance in hell, I understand why people wanna put them together narratively but its not close at all to me
Sasuke (vs the 5 Kage) was helped by Zetsu (because he recharged Sasuke's chakra while draining the enemies' one) and was saved in a clutch moment from Dust Release from Ohnoki by Obito.
Sasuke lost to bee even with his whole crew + healz who then lost to kisame who is weaker than pain. Sasuke kind of got beat by that mizukage as well. And yes, he also had zetsu helping him with chakra to keep him going or he would have been going "ugh muh chakra". I also don't consider Danzo that strong if we assume him and the third were of the same generation and the third was clearly stronger than him and yet orochimaru killed him who again is weaker than pain. Both were old effecting their ability...Danzo was even older due to time skip and still gave sasuke trouble...danzo was both older and was originally weaker then a Hiruzen who lost to orochimaru. My confidence in sasuke beating pain is not very high.
@@aymanriki1018 Sasuke would only beat Gaara and Danzo at that point. Raikage would've killed him and lost his leg as a result, and Ohnoki one shots him with ZERO difficulty. Based on the limited info we have on him vs Mizukage, she beats him as well, as his defense literally melts away from her lava style, and Sasuke at this point needs his defense to be able to survive any of them.
Pain scales to War Arc so easily. Naruto fought Pain with so many clear advantages (capture objective, fatigued, knowledge, Nine Tails). It’s clear Nagato is stronger than Pain but Pain is much more versatile for the objectives he was sent out to achieve. I think we get carried away with amps that characters get later in the series and discount earlier characters (Pain, Orochimaru, etc.) too harshly. We have to remember that amps aren’t multipliers, they’re enhancers. Pain/Nagato are a notch below Obito and would still contend with Obito to some degree.
@@Virhtue Nagato IS Pain, that's the problem this community seems to have: they don't understand that. Ergo, the notion Nagato is stronger than Pain is as ridiculous as me claiming "I'm smarter than myself!"
@@TRJ42 Not really didn't know where he was or that he had sage energy which was essential to defeating pain. His intel was old intel. Dude was in hiding. The intel they had on pain was more significant and was stated by the toad sage himself that Jiraya's decision to stay and deliver the message to konoha would be essential and effect the course of events. Quite possible they could have lost without the intel. Jiraya's sacrifice for that info was considered essential or at least thats the impression I got from the series as they really stress its importance.
I think the only version of sasuke thats up for debate is the sasuke that fought juubito every version before that gets easily beat and rinnegan sasuke obviously stomps pain neg diff
@@VirhtuePersonally I think the only version of EMS sasuke Pain stands a chance against is the one that fought kabuto. And I only say that because Sasuke didn't surpass Itachi at that point. Even then sausage still probably takes it high dif.
@@Virhtue I think it’s because of how insane Payne comes off in the story. It’s hard to imagine him losing for people. At least until it is a clear stomp in Sasuke’s favor. I think it’s psychological, as a reader/ watcher when Payne is fighting no one can hold a candle to him and this makes him feel unstoppable and invincible. Compare this to EMS Sasuke, who is insanely strong, but he is around people who are relative to him or stronger than him. Because of this he feels less imposing than Payne.
Something silly I just realized is that Sasuke acknowledges he couldn't have beaten Orochimaru if he wasn't weakened by his "illness". And yet he thinks he's capable of beating Itachi at that level? That doesn't track 🤔
@@bluemm4231 did u watch it tho? or even the anime or the manga? sasuke had more chakra, more regen, more mobility, speed, and strenght when he had the curse mark. yall be choosing sides without even knowin nothing
0:09 "Following his Victoriy over Killer Bee" didn't Bee kill Sasuke 3 times, knocked Jugo out and left Suigetsu in a coma before he tricked them into thinking they won to escape without being pursued by his own village and his brother???
Rinnegan Sasuke is seeing every six paths of pain connection, the host, and the abilities. Basically six paths Sasuke could beat Nagato faster than six paths Naruto would beat him.
@@sageofthickcalvesthis is why you TH-camrs in the anime Community such as virtual you don't know who that person is stop saying you love someone on the internet when you don't know who that person that you made a video with is he probably could be a pedophile or a sexist or could be anybody don't trust people you don't know I learned this ever since I was a child
@@Virhtuedo you even know what the hell you talking about instead of using the word interpretations stop saying that fucking word it's irritating get to the points you people are fucking annoying
One thing I also think about pain is how on top of his crazy powers, for their oponents to just figure them out is very hard. I think at least a few heavy hitting attacks that drain a lot of stamina would be wasted just by not knowing who he is and what he can do
@@RunRunRun1901You think he would've beaten 6 if they were all there out gate and he had knowledge? I feel Jiraiya really just lucked out on the fact he was in the Hidden Rain. Pain could've just village bust or made a moon trapping him in any other location no?
Great video, finally someone that brings up a Pein going all out in a versus, usually I feel like he gets scaled on his compromised screen times such as him fatigued, not going all out and powers exposed against Naruto.
22:35 Black Zetsu directly said Itachi is quicker on the uptake than Sasuke is, even all the way to the war. Pain is also more difficult to blind than Nagato since Nagato only has the Summons to extend his vision, whilst Pain has six Paths. Usually this is compensated for by the fact Nagato is much stronger, but since even a few Paths are already stronger than Sasuke, it just makes it hopeless for him. I think a good way of establishing Taka Sasuke's ceiling is that he was pushed to his limit to defeat someone who conceded inferiority to Hiruzen, who by Danzō's estimate is likely inferior to Pain. Pain would have easily swept through the individual Gokage at the summit, whilst Sasuke nearly died multiple times.
@@VirhtueBulshit itachi is nowhere near pain lvl with or without ninja AIDS. The Rinegan is superior to Sharingan, MS and EMS and cant be caught in a visual genjutsu. Amaterasu gets absorbed, Tsukiomi gets blocked without even trying, Susano cant handle All summonings + 6 pains, Shisui eye cant do shit either against pain on top of that Pain can use Chakra rods to suppress and control other ppl movements and chakra (itachi cant even touch them), can rip souls out, can respawn and he can shoot missiles and lasers and use other Sci-fi weapons with ausra path. Wtf can Itachi even do gainst that not to mention that the individual pains get stronger the more pains get Knocked out. Long story short itachi cant do shit to Pain
@@silverlightning4995yep, the problem is people always forget Pain had those ‘rods’. Look at the way Madara handled Sausage in 10 secs with Deva Path power. The power of Black Receiver is criminally underestimated.
Not that it makes a difference but Sasuke is much stronger after absorbing Orochimaru, he told Team 7 that neither he or Orochimaru alone or together were strong enough to fight Itachi. After absorbing Orochimaru he believes he's strong enough to take on Itachi alone.
That’s also nearly a seventy chapter difference and we know that Sasuke was more confident because he had more of Orochimaru’s abilities such as his poison resistance and recovery ability along with Hebi who he needed to make sure nobody could intervene
From my own interpretation and what I’ve read, Pain is “stronger” than any non Juubi version of Obito in terms of “how much stuff can I blow up and how hard do I hit”. Obito would probably still beat him in a fight because Kamui is just an absolutely ridiculous ability and Hashirama cells are an absurd boost. Could (pre Juubi absorption) Obito blow up the leaf village? Absolutely not. Could he beat someone who can through hax, speed, and battle IQ? Definitely. As much as I love his character, Itachi is definitely the third strongest member of the Akatsuki. He doesn’t have the stamina to go the distance with Pain or Obito, who are shown to be two absolute juggernauts when it comes to stamina. He could probably cook up some kind of trap/ambush to take out either Obito or Nagato, but in a “fair” fight he just doesn’t have enough gas in the tank. His biggest win cons just don’t apply to Pain specifically, sealing one path is just not enough and his genjutsu is shown to mostly be a 1 on 1 thing. I don’t know if Obito could Kamui through the totsuka blade or Tsukuyomi but those would be fair win cons for Itachi. Weirdly, even though I believe Obito would beat Pain, I think Itachi would have a better chance against Obito just due to the matchup.
He could phase through Totska blade has to touch you to seal you and the way Kamui works his intangibility comes from the part/or parts of his body being attacked literally get shifted to Kamui dimension. (Kakashi is ability to abuse this during War Arc) Tskoyomi is a win con if it hits but Tobi would be aware of that risk and either not look Itachi in the eye or have Izanagi prepared for it. Madara showed that you could program Izanagi in advance
I don’t see how Itachi is a rival to pain. He cannot beat pain either. That’s just fans glazing Itachi. Uchiha too ninjutsu heavy to beat pain when he has a body that absorbs ninjutsu. Even Amaterasu and susanoo gets absorbed. Itachi is prob slightly faster but pains shared vision. 16:40 it’s import to realize that path fighting jiraiya while he wasn’t looking, a diff path was, so shared vision was how he seen the attack to block.
In terms of raw power and gifts, pain/nagato would win. Itachi is gifted though, because of his mind. The ONLY way itachi would win, would not be through his physical/visual prowess, but in a battle of wits and outsmart pain somehow.
@@ttkrystal8329 You mean when Nagato was being controlled remotely by Kabuto like he was playing Ninja Storm and wasn't even paying attention to Itachi and was focused completely on Naruto and Bee and Itachi merely blind sided him? Kabuto can't utilize the person better than they themselves can. Kabuto having to control directly is already a nerf.
I know we don't need ANOTHER point to state why hebi sasuke is not on pains level, but since kakashi is a lightning timer since he cut lightning and pain could react to kakashi while using raikiri, couldn't we say that the paths could react to kirin and absorb it or repel it since its the speed of lightning. Just an interesting point.
Well kirin isnt really a jutsu you can absorb since its made from actual lightning instead of being chakra based, the chakra is really just to make the lightning be controlled and shaped. If pain can absorb it before its fully shaped sure but after sasuke actually aims it thered be no point to absorbing the chakra cause the actual lightning would still hit you during the absorption
@@Seatly372 fair enough, some people have stated it absorbs energy as apposed to just chakra but there is no real way to prove that. he could absolutely repel it though with the deva path of just straight dodge it
@@shafeckbrown496 theres no proof that the oil wasnt made by chakra as jiraiya was the one to shoot the oil. He didnt just summon it from the mountain nor did ma and pa bring it
Summit Sasuke is the most brutal thing I've seen from a character in Naruto. Dude fought the kages, fought/killed Danzo then throw hands with a fully rested Kakashi and clashed with Naruto. That durability was crazy. For me Sasuke character is one of the more well written ones dispite the hate he gets from people. After the summit I actually started to like him waaay more than Naruto, cause that's when I started to understand his character more in depth.
He was constantly aided by Karin. Sasuke was virtually dead in many scenarios but Obito and Taka saved his ass all the time. Hell, he was almost killed by Bee if his squad would not had intervened.
Not even sage Naruto beat Pain. He basically lost then went to Pain and talk-no-jutsued him into doing rinne-rebirth. He also had Ma and Pa helping him as well as being bailed out by other leaf shinobi like Hinata. I feel like the fair comparison would be team Taka vs Pain which I totally see Sasuke's team winning.
Sasuke should individually scale above the paths of pain in raw strength and speed. Only one who is contentious is the deva due to its feats against 6 tails Naruto. Sasuke has counters for all of pains abilities besides chibaku tensei. If hebi sasuke fights in Naruto’s position, than I actually see sasuke performing slightly better than sage Naruto mainly due to his superior IQ. I genuinely can not see sasuke losing this fight if he knows all of pain’s abilities.
@@justthefacts6902can you even explain how sasuke counters all the pain abilities? I think you downplay naruto’s battle iq hear because clearly you do not understand that in terms of fighting iq naruto and sasuke are not that far off because if they were sasuke would win most if not all of their encounters. Yet in the final valley he needed cm2 and in the last he needed the rest of the bijuu to even come close. Naruto simply just presents himself as dumber but if you actually watch the show he clearly isnt.
@@gershonreisagario5875 sure firstly sasuke is fast enough to speed blitz all of the paths of pain except the deva. Meaning he can also simply evade most of their attacks. The animals paths summons would just give sasuke ammunition because he can genjutsu them. Also fly if he ever needs to. The only pain that sasuke would have trouble with is the deva path. Im assuming sasuke can defeat the fodder paths before the deva’s power returns. However pains win con is the deva paths power returning because sasuke would be powerless against his abilities. Just like sage Naruto was. Actually sasuke is light years ahead of Naruto in terms of battle Iq. This has been flat out showcased in the series. And also commented on by super intelligent characters like madara and jigen. They both make similar observations about Naruto and sasuke’s intelligence compared to one another. Sasuke can only compete with Naruto because of his higher battle IQ and over all skill level. Naruto simply has far more raw power than sasuke and his IQ is basically how he makes up for it. If Naruto was even remotely as smart as sasuke in combat then he’d just low diff sasuke every time they fight. But Naruto’s stupidity is actually what gives sasuke a chance in their fights.
Sasuke getting folded by Pain if they fought during that time. Also Pain is above Itachi as well. Itachis stamina is his weakness. Just like he said everyone has a weakness. Pain is too much power for them to fight for a long time.
I mean its not really even a debate is it. Tobi himself tells Sasuke that Sage Naruto was stronger than him Edit: Karin also implies shortly after this that Base Summit Sasuke was above his Stage 2 cursemark self. So theres no way Hebi Sasuke scales above that.
I feel like pain, despite having some prep-time and and help from Konan was basically fighting at as big of a disadvantage known to any character in the series, other than Madara + obito vs everyone at the end of the series. Having to solo (nearly, konan helped) the entire leave village, defeating several named Jonin, Tsunade, as well as plenty of other relevant characters, and having to go up against a prepped naruto without even having time to rest is only the start of his disadvantage. He also had to contend with the 9 tails (half of its chakra) and was doing decently well despite the previous setbacks. I feel like Sasuke's arsenal that stage of the series just simple doesn't have the stopping power to deal with some of Pain's bread and butter mechanics. The summoning path alone could probably out-pace sasuke's ability to deal with them, as Kirin is probably the only thing strong enough to incapatitate one, and maybe a few of the summons if we're being generous. Deva path's earth style definitely would have an issue with Chidori, but the path that can absorb ninjutsu would also be pivotal in support, at any stage of the fight. Even once sasuke gets susanoo, I think the summoning path alone would be able to keep Sasuke busy, whilst using earth style to mess with sasuke while he's in the Susano (we know gaara's sand could do it, I see no reason why pain's earth style couldn't do similar. It'd depend how effective the Totska blade would be against the summons, imo. (idk how to spell that thing) all in all, I feel like Madara/endgame sasuke are the only uchiha's that could handle such a task, being outnumbered + rinnegan just outgears the sharingan quite hard
Its not crazy at all. The Deva Path is beyond Sanin level. The man was fist fighting 7 tails Naruto and he almost captured him. Thats not a feat any of the Sanin could accomplish. Orochimaru could only handle the kyuubi up to 4 tails.
This Konohamaru agenda is absolute rat stuff, the Naraka was turned around not looking and got back up after. Yes, each individual path was contending Jiraiya and could react to his Sage attacks which would imply they would be more than capable of reacting to base Jiraiya; a sannin
@@avaliausd. Nobody fist fought 7 tails, you mean 6 tails. Also, Orochimaru wasn't even in his prime when he fought 4 tails, and his durability is insane for being able to tank some of those hits. There's no evidence that Orochimaru would die against 6 tails or higher.
Not only is it that pain never wanted to kill Naruto because he was there to capture him, he fought with half his strength due to nagato being sick and drained from his last fight with jiraiya, he still took on the kyubi transformation and dealt with it, Naruto had perfect sage mode and help from 2 toad masters. Yeah pain stomps many people’s favorite characters and it’s not even close.
Look at it more practically. If Orochimaru, Jiraya or Itachi were stronger or as strong as Pain the events of the show would've absolutely never played out the way that they did. A lot of shadier elements of the Akatsuki were dragged along by the idea that ultimately Pain was in charge and the other's had to play the waiting game. Zetsu, Obito, Orochimaru, and Itachi all had conflicting goals and at some point each one has to concede that Pain's goal is the one that matters for their own sake
Tsykyomi is very much better duh that's not saying itachi is just clear of ms sasuke like I agree he is stronger but ur reasoning is wrong. Itachi genjutsu is better than adult sasuke. But ms sasuke Amaterasu is better than itachi
Actually it’s stated that Boruto era sasuke has the strongest genjutsu amongst all uchiha, so Sasuke’s genjutsu in Boruto era would be better than Itachi’s
We tend to forget that Pain did not fight one v one against Naruto. It was Pain versus the entire Konoha (and then a stronger Naruto defeated a Pain who's Chakra was depleted, and chose to sacrifice himself)
Pain would fold that young man and send him back to Konoha with a wedgie😂😂 Hebi sasuke wasn’t even strong enough to beat Orochimaru that’s why he waited until he was bed ridden and came to kill him😂 frankly sasuke only beats pain when he gets EMS and rinne and even EMS sasuke beating him is shaky because he got EMS and went after killer bee and got viciously fcked over💀 like…it was very bad😭Rinne sasuke absolutely stomps but EMS sasuke I can’t really say I don’t see that version winning against pain… though the god of shinobi Kakuzu himself in the flesh would absolutely slam both through just raw durability iykyk😂😂 he no diffs both uncontested with minimal effort 🗿
@@Vulpesioended what fight?? You mean the guy who got his ribs opened up 😂failed to capture bee after falling for a shadow clone?? You mean that guy? Lmfao he would’ve got NO diffed by killer bee had it not been for jugo and Karin keeping him alive lmfao there won’t be any plot armor here for him pain is giving him the kakashi treatment lil bro😂😂 little sasuke goon thinking his boyfriend stands a chance😂 pain literally overpowers sasuke’s whole arsenal and has various ways to literally ONE SHOT him…the same doesn’t doesn’t apply to sasuke…and saying EMS sasuke is kcm2 level is diabolical work but I’m just gonna let you go on that one sasuke goon😂 your boyfriend gets puts down by pain cope harder😂
@@VulpesioBro your brain okay? Killer Bee was was massively stronger than that Sasuke. He died twice and had to be saved by Taka. Amaterasu came in clutch but he would have been dead.
@@Vulpesio maybe EMS sasuke later in like the WA scales and could beat pain but from five kage summit sasuke and any sasuke below that is simply getting curb stomped though granted rinne sasuke absolutely stomps and manages to live longer and adult forms are just not fair😂
@@Virhtue hey you should make a video about the kinkaku and ginkaku brothers (with 9 tails chakra and their weapons) running the gauntlet against the Akastuki Could be a cool vid
People keep forgetting the fact that Naruto was getting fed intel about Pain during the fight. He didn’t have to figure it out as he fought. Which is how Jiraiya got killed. This is a HUGE advantage. Also Naruto did not defeat Pain. The end fight between him and Nagato never happened because Nagato used his last remaining chakra to revive the whole hidden leaf village which must have taken an enormous amount of chakra. People forget Nagato himself is more powerful than the 6 pains! Remember him summoning the Gedo statue to wipe out Hanzo’s army and the Anbu? Pain annihilated the hidden leaf village. Then he pretty much toyed with sage mode Naruto and all of his toad friends then faced 6 tails Kyuubi with only Yahiko Pain then revived the whole village. Come on now!
I would say Obito is not stronger than Pain, he's just indestructible. It's impossible to kill him. The only way to beat him is to use the other kamui which teleports you to his realm. The sharingan that obito has is the defensive portion of his power. The sharingan that he gave to kakashi, is the offensive portion. Had Obito *both* the offensive and defensive sharingan, he could quite literally be the most powerful human being. It would be almost impossible to defeat his gimmick. He just teleports you away if he finds you a nuisance, or he teleports himself away to dodge an attack.
Obito beats Pain just because he hard counters him. Pain has no answer to Kamui and Kamui counters all his abilities. Hell Obito could literally just leave and kill Nagato directly and just ignore the Paths. Destructive capability though? Yeah Pain (until White Mask Obito)
@@Virhtue How would the susano arrows and enton do anything to the chibaku tensei other than burning himself when he gets pulled into the burning rock?..
If Pain wasn’t the antagonist in this story I don’t think anyone would have beat him, as far as actual abilities he ridiculous he has like 50 one hitter quitters it’s nuts.
Nagato's powers are too much. It had to be nerfed by the six paths with only one ability in each individual. And even after that, Pain was defeated by a lot of plot armors that doesn't even makes sense, even though the writer has to defeat Pain as he was the villain.
Nice vid but the Orochimaru scaling based on _only_ Karen's statement is quite disingenuous when Orochimaru _himself_ says BOS Sasuke, not even Hebi Sasuke who is significantly stronger, plainly states BOS Sasuke is stronger than him. And this is before the 4 Tails fight So No arm Orochimaru is absolutely weaker than BOS Sasuke who again is weaker than Hebi Sasuke. Hebi Sasuke is pretty comfortably above the Sannin mid-high diff
SM Naruto is nowhere near pain's level. He got help of kurama and he got intel and pain has just destroyed the village. Even kcm1 looses to pain. I think Kcm 2 is a perfect match
SM Naruto is way below Tendo. That Naruto with a very fatigued Pain who fought a entire village because fight him. And that Pain needed Naruto to be alive, otherwise… 💀
My chakra is low so i couldn't use my ftg like comment run time blitz. But i still have enough for a combined attack. I love the team ups with u and sage. just fire content all around
Sasuke vs 6 Pains: Hebi Sasuke loses extreme diff. Hebi Sasuke is relative to, albeit slightly weaker than, SM Naruto who himself still ended up losing to the 6 Pains Taka Sasuke loses mid-high/high diff. Taka was stated weaker than Hebi and his MS causes too much damage and he's not used to the pain that it causes. FKS Sasuke mid diffs the 6 Pains. FKS Sasuke is _SIGNIFICANTLY_ more powerful than SM Naruto and unlike him.... he doesn't have a SM timer. And FKS Speed + Battle IQ + Susanoo is too much for the Pains Basically Taka < Hebi ≈< SM Naruto < 6 Pains
@@Virhtue Hebi Sasuke is stronger than the version of Sasuke (BOS Sasuke) that was stated by Orochimaru himself to be stronger than him. And Orochimaru has constantly been considered the strongest Sannin and considering Jiraiya did an ok job fighting 6 Pain, Hebi Sasuke will do FAAAR better Plus Hebi Sasuke annihilates PA Kakashi in all aspects, and even Kakashi managed to hold off 2 Pains on his own for a while
hebi sasuke loses to the three pains jiraya fought Taka sasuke might lose to the animal path or the three pains 5ks sasuke fights the 6 paths of pain and defeats 4 or 5 with intel and 3 without intel but loses still Early Ems sasuke defeats 5 pains without intel due to chibaku tensei and defeats pain with intel Ems sasuke against juubito defeats him mid diff
@@plavsk hebi sasuke isnt even sannin level as it was stated that he couldnt beat orochimaru on multiple statements like the deidara statement karin statement in itachi pursuit arc and suigetsu statement in war arc where he said he wouldve lost if orochimaru was healthy and “we just surpassed our masters” which means that fks sasuke was above orochimaru but not hebi. the animal path alone was strong enough to stalemate base jiraya who is relative to orochimaru which can mean that just the animal path may be enough to stalemate sasuke atleast and then it forced jiraya to use sage mode which makes jiraya stated “above sannin” and he was gonna lose to the three pains if ma and pa didnt use frog song unless hebi survives long enough to use kirin and actually hits them before animal path summons them out which i doubt he loses and then if he hits them, he’ll die anyways when they’re revived
@@dr.dragonballz4865 i highly doubt that the animal path summons will hit sasuke, he can see the chamaeleon with his sharingan and take out the animal path, after all the pain bodies dont really have the best durability and speed. as for the human path, his ability isnt going to work mid battle and sasuke could take him out and for the preta path he can use kirin, and since its actual lightning and not ninjutsu the preta path cant absorb it, and it doesnt spend sasukes own chakra, and in the rain village he may be able to use multiple kirins
@@plavsk those summons speedblitzed kcm naruto and ik hebi sasuke isnt close to kcm narutos speed and also all hebi sasuke has as a summon is manda while it took 3 of the great toads to defeat those summons and especially the dog hebi sasuke has no counter to
Finally someone who doesn't completely dunk on Jiraya mindlessly. The Sannin were High Tier Kage level, it's BS people low ball him so badly. Also Jiraya went into the fight with limited info too. Yeah Jiraya was weaker than all the Pain paths, but he wasn't powerless.
Pain would stomp Sasuke up until the mid to end point of the War Arc. I even think Pain beats Itachi 10/10 times. Pain has too much stamina, durability, AoE, feats, versatility, etc. Itachi is great and could probably beat any one or two Paths, but he couldn’t answer the full group.
I agree with everything except you guys continously saying that Itachi and Pain are rivals. They're absolutely not rivals, in fact Itachi is in the same boat as Sasuke. I'd bet my money that MS Sasuke would do better than sick Itachi against Pain. So we know out of the two, Itachi has more intenl, cause he knows not to dare launch Tsukiyomi at Nagato, cause he already knows that that won't work which is a bummer since Itachi's main win cons when it comes to debates is Tsukiyomi. But Itachi does not have complete intel on Pain as he stupidly throws amaterasu at Nagato. Why would he do that if he knew he could either repel it or absorb it. Not that amaterasu would make an impact in the fight at all anyways. So Tsukiyomi is useless. Amaterasu is useless. Even if Itachi stays in Susanno and can possibly tank a full fledged almighty push, he cannot stay in there forever, he can barely hold up the Susanno due to the side effects of it and his sickness. So Susanno not good enough either. The only thing Itachi got going for him is his intelligence and speed, which is the same with MS Sasuke. Pain has no Raikage lvl speed feats. But as we know just being smarter and faster than Pain is not enough to beat him. His stamina and hax will make up for that. But that's all I wanted to say, they aren't rivals in no way.
You are incorrect about one thing. Pain's speed. Pain was lightening fast in the fight against Nine Tails. Pain can match Raikage and Guy in speed and that is shown in the amine itself. Just watch the fight again.
@___________0Z0X I mean I'm asking why you think I got something against Thunder Woof? Idk if Bark God would want me to spill the beans on the lore though lmao
Question. You were saying that Sasuke can't see certain attacks from pain with his sharingan which makes some sense to me. I'm just struggling with the fact that Sasuke could see deidara Nano bombs because the sharingan allows him to see chakra as colors. He was even able to see them in his blood stream if I'm not mistaken. But idk maybe it works differently since something like Almighty Push is not a physical object.
Lmaooo Sasuke literally uses pains powers now as an upgrade. Shits hilarious knowing pain would've one tapped him around that time 😂 that's when the debate of who's strongest was the most serious between the fanbase
I’m not a huge lore addict like I used to but if I recall when jiraiya lost to pain. A huge reason why is because jiraiya was trying to get info and didn’t understand that all the paths of pain shared their vision between each other. I doubt he would have lived if he figured it out sooner but the fight would have been much closer.
Thats true that he didn't know how Pains powers worked but Pain wasn't jumping him with the Paths at first either. Whereas with Naruto he immediately summons all the Paths in.
Obviously people think obito can defeat pain.. imagine this, karaiya vs konan, jiraiya easily defeated konan. Obito vs konan. Obito barely survived. It's simple analogy, konan and pain were always together. Don't you think pain didn't plan to counter obito like conan did. Even if obito used izanagi, it wouldn't still be enough. Coz, nagato isn't there in actual. Even obito doesn't know their hiding place.
I'm very relieved to see the comment section. In the summary of what was discussed for a second, I thought I was entering one of those delusional rant about how heavy Sasuke or taka Sasuke can solo the entire verse essentially.
Obviously, which is why they don't try to kill the hosts, but extract the powers. Despite Akatsuki being Sannin-Kage level ninja, none of them are trying to outright fight the tailed beasts, especially the nine tails.
0:11 imma stop you right there bro☝🏽 He did not beat killer bee, he got tagged with a hit that would surely kill him TWICE in a row while trying to jump him 4v1. And then he pulled out a plot armor jutsu and bee decided to substitute & escape making sasuke think he won, sir. 😭 ik you knew that already but still 😂
Pain without his secrets being known would have bodied anyone any character before war arc(alive, not like hashirama, madara etc). He was such a monster.
Sasuke def stands no chance vs pain until eos! When he gets his own rinnegan. Lol he has nothing to take pain out until that point. Rinnegan> EMS . He can’t do anything. He could have manda out with a full susanoo and the animal path , ninjutsu absorbing path and yahiko path alone would take sasuke down. His susano gets absorbed . And he needs taijutsu to take that one but he’d have to get thru the other 2 paths shooting missles and attacking. Even killing one, he couldn’t prevent the last one from reviving the one he beats.
Naruto literally had giant frogs, Ma & Pa, multiple shadow clones, Hinata, & Kurama help him beat pain who wasn’t even blood lusted but only wanted to capture Naruto. What the FUCK is Sasuke doing against paths of Pain?
I disagree that Pain could’ve killed Naruto anytime because he was trying to kill Jirayi and still had a bit of trouble w him despite having the intel and environment advantage. The outcome of the fight between Naruto and Pain was exactly how it should have been compared to Jiraya. He got down to the very last Pain and due more to inexperience I would argue, lost. Pains main advantage came from his numbers and coordinated visions. One of them was able to be defeated by even Konohamaru from just one rasengan.
FKS Sasuke can actually win this by spamming the battlefield with Amaterasu and using the heat generated to create permanent storm clouds for Kirin. This happened during Sasuke vs Itachi when clouds immediately reappeared after Kirin was used, due to the effects of Itachi's amaterasu which means technically Sasuke could've used it again if necessary. Sasuke also has knowledge on this so i think he'd use it in character once he sees Pain's power level. I heard people say Pain can dispel rainy clouds but we've only seen this in Amegakure and aren't sure if this is chakra or natural clouds. Otherwise i don't see Pain having the physical reactions to deal with Kirin. If we assume he can, we must also say that large scale ST requires other paths to be disabled. Of course it all depends on Sasuke's stamina since he'll need to spam MS abilities like a madman, but i don't think it's farfetched to say this tactic can wipeout Pain 3 times out of 10 and i'd say 5+/10 if Deva is as nerfed as he was against Naruto.
Hebi sasuke>Orochimaru. He notes himself that he cant take on itachi at the start of shippuden but after training more he finally decides he can. The bare minimum he knows of itachis strength is that he is stronger than orochimaru. So he simply trained to be that strength before going to challenge itachi or gained that strength after absorbing orochimaru. Or both.
doesnt change anything as he could just be incorrect/in over his head like how he belived he could kill itachi when they fought. this argument lingers on him being correct when his basis of why is inccorect, he also isnt contentiouis to ororchimaru being above him and doesnt even refute against it when brought up..
I can't fully remember if the manga portrayed it differently, but a lot of the time I hear this notion "Jiraiya thought Naruto is the child of prophesy". Only at the very end before his death did he confirm this to himself, Jiraiya never saw him as the one until this point, so a beloved student who he didn't want to harm yes! COP no!
@@Virhtue Yea it was a realisation made at the final moments. Nagato had to be stopped, decided Naruto would be the one to stop him. That is probably when fate was set in motion, I think the choice Jiraiya made led Naruto to be CoP (inferring from the story).
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If a sage mode Naruto, with all the info in the world on Pains abilities, 2 sage frogs who are also incredibly strong supporting him, prepped with some shadow clones with sage mode to be able to enter sage mode multiple times and even fighting in Ninetails form (4+ Tails) barely beats Pain, who wasn’t even trying to kill him and had used up some power fighting and destroying the leaf prior to that, how would Sasuke at that point in the story compete? If anyone actually thinks that Sasuke at that point in the story could beat Pain, they are just simply delusional.
Agreed
Thank you for saving me the time to type this.
💯 agree 😂
COOK
Sasuke lucked out on Orochimaru, Pain simply doesn't let Orochimaru touch him.
That discrepancy is enough.
I have always had this take that Pain is the strongest character up until White Mask Obito shows up. I think everyone else, including Itachi and OM Obito, are below him in power/strength, but I regularly find I'm alone in that thought.
Ppl always forget that Itachi has no stamina cuz of the war arc edo stuff. Itachi would gas out if he was forced to use any of his higher end abilities early. Outside of Obito knowing Nagato's main body secret I'm pretty sure no one at that point narratively can compete with Pain's raw power. Power creep gets goofy during the war arc though
@doodoobuttah It's hard to tell because, in my opinion, because, believe it or not, Itachi uses a decent amount of MS abilities. For example, in Part 1, you could argue he was holding back against Kakashi and Jiraiya and Sasuke and you could argue that Part 1 to Part 2 Itachi got stronger, and by the time he fights Sasuke, he's quote literally just killing himself (he stopped taking his medicine to hold back his illness and he was effectively blind). I counted how many jutsus he used, but I don't remember how many it was, but I was surprised, given how often Itachi is said to have "low stamina."
He definitely doesn't have the stamina that Pain, Obito, or Kisame have, but he isn't a slouch, in my opinion.
I mean, I don’t think it’s a bad take if you consider a few factors
@@CH1C4N0444 I think Obito's broken kamui could give him a win even as orange mask, but itachi has no chance in hell, I understand why people wanna put them together narratively but its not close at all to me
I’m with you
Sasuke (vs the 5 Kage) was helped by Zetsu (because he recharged Sasuke's chakra while draining the enemies' one) and was saved in a clutch moment from Dust Release from Ohnoki by Obito.
yea sasuke is at most beating 1 or maybe 2 of the 5 then getting his ass whooped
Sasuke at that point bests no one
Sasuke lost to bee even with his whole crew + healz who then lost to kisame who is weaker than pain. Sasuke kind of got beat by that mizukage as well. And yes, he also had zetsu helping him with chakra to keep him going or he would have been going "ugh muh chakra". I also don't consider Danzo that strong if we assume him and the third were of the same generation and the third was clearly stronger than him and yet orochimaru killed him who again is weaker than pain. Both were old effecting their ability...Danzo was even older due to time skip and still gave sasuke trouble...danzo was both older and was originally weaker then a Hiruzen who lost to orochimaru. My confidence in sasuke beating pain is not very high.
@@aymanriki1018 Sasuke would only beat Gaara and Danzo at that point. Raikage would've killed him and lost his leg as a result, and Ohnoki one shots him with ZERO difficulty. Based on the limited info we have on him vs Mizukage, she beats him as well, as his defense literally melts away from her lava style, and Sasuke at this point needs his defense to be able to survive any of them.
@@christopherdsuza7531 Sasuke lost to Bee before he gained the Susano. He would still lose to Bee until EMS, but it would've been much closer.
Pain scales to War Arc so easily. Naruto fought Pain with so many clear advantages (capture objective, fatigued, knowledge, Nine Tails). It’s clear Nagato is stronger than Pain but Pain is much more versatile for the objectives he was sent out to achieve. I think we get carried away with amps that characters get later in the series and discount earlier characters (Pain, Orochimaru, etc.) too harshly. We have to remember that amps aren’t multipliers, they’re enhancers. Pain/Nagato are a notch below Obito and would still contend with Obito to some degree.
Nagato is more versatile than pain, pain just has numbers
Obito knowing Nagatos secret realistically gets him an easy dub
To be fair pain did also have Intel on Naruto
@@Virhtue Nagato IS Pain, that's the problem this community seems to have: they don't understand that. Ergo, the notion Nagato is stronger than Pain is as ridiculous as me claiming "I'm smarter than myself!"
@@TRJ42 Not really didn't know where he was or that he had sage energy which was essential to defeating pain. His intel was old intel. Dude was in hiding. The intel they had on pain was more significant and was stated by the toad sage himself that Jiraya's decision to stay and deliver the message to konoha would be essential and effect the course of events. Quite possible they could have lost without the intel. Jiraya's sacrifice for that info was considered essential or at least thats the impression I got from the series as they really stress its importance.
I think the only version of sasuke thats up for debate is the sasuke that fought juubito every version before that gets easily beat and rinnegan sasuke obviously stomps pain neg diff
Why do people think ems Sasuke is close to pain
@@VirhtuePersonally I think the only version of EMS sasuke Pain stands a chance against is the one that fought kabuto.
And I only say that because Sasuke didn't surpass Itachi at that point. Even then sausage still probably takes it high dif.
@@Virhtue I think it’s because of how insane Payne comes off in the story. It’s hard to imagine him losing for people.
At least until it is a clear stomp in Sasuke’s favor.
I think it’s psychological, as a reader/ watcher when Payne is fighting no one can hold a candle to him and this makes him feel unstoppable and invincible.
Compare this to EMS Sasuke, who is insanely strong, but he is around people who are relative to him or stronger than him. Because of this he feels less imposing than Payne.
@@___________0Z0X Pain is weaker than Nagato who is arguably weaker than Edo-Itachi, which initial EMS Sasuke is equal to.
@@numberhunter62 Dude, I said Payne has a chance. Not that he would win.
Pain: "Don't move, don't move, you already lost"
The second the battle starts
😭😭😭😭💀
💀💀💀
Why do I hear music when reading that? 😂
@@user-wd1gj1dg2p 😂
Something silly I just realized is that Sasuke acknowledges he couldn't have beaten Orochimaru if he wasn't weakened by his "illness". And yet he thinks he's capable of beating Itachi at that level? That doesn't track 🤔
The Sasuke that fought Itachi was stronger than the one that fought Orochimaru due to having absorbed him.
@@John-r7rdid you watch the video? They literally say that absorbing orochimaru doesn’t make him stronger in the first 10 minutes
@@bluemm4231 did u watch it tho? or even the anime or the manga? sasuke had more chakra, more regen, more mobility, speed, and strenght when he had the curse mark. yall be choosing sides without even knowin nothing
@@kironilo 6:55 in the video. Watch it
@@kironilo also that’s the curse mark, not absorbing orochimaru. Yes the curse mark makes him stronger but not absorbing orochimaru. Wow
0:09 "Following his Victoriy over Killer Bee" didn't Bee kill Sasuke 3 times, knocked Jugo out and left Suigetsu in a coma before he tricked them into thinking they won to escape without being pursued by his own village and his brother???
Nah
Bee was in his walls
Sasuke doesnt touch nagato until he get rinnegan.
EMS Sasuke violates
@zeyyyboggiee your deluded. Sasuke may win 2/10 times but nagato is opening his booty hole 8/10 times
Rinnegan Sasuke is seeing every six paths of pain connection, the host, and the abilities.
Basically six paths Sasuke could beat Nagato faster than six paths Naruto would beat him.
@@zeyyyboggieeNot even close. Rinnengan is above EMS. Dream more
@@extraterrestrial4597your super wrong
Always a pleasure, brother 🔥
4:14 your opinion is wrong bud
Many more to come
@@SUPREME_NARUTARDliterally has him pinned with chakra rods and doesn’t kill him because he needs to seal him 💀
@@sageofthickcalvesthis is why you TH-camrs in the anime Community such as virtual you don't know who that person is stop saying you love someone on the internet when you don't know who that person that you made a video with is he probably could be a pedophile or a sexist or could be anybody don't trust people you don't know I learned this ever since I was a child
@@Virhtuedo you even know what the hell you talking about instead of using the word interpretations stop saying that fucking word it's irritating get to the points you people are fucking annoying
One thing I also think about pain is how on top of his crazy powers, for their oponents to just figure them out is very hard.
I think at least a few heavy hitting attacks that drain a lot of stamina would be wasted just by not knowing who he is and what he can do
This is a big point that isn't brought up enough.
This lets Pain have an extra edge against people who are relative to him.
It’s why Jiraya loses.
@@RunRunRun1901You think he would've beaten 6 if they were all there out gate and he had knowledge?
I feel Jiraiya really just lucked out on the fact he was in the Hidden Rain. Pain could've just village bust or made a moon trapping him in any other location no?
@@John-r7r probably. It’s easier to adjust the story board to give Jiraya intel than it is to have them fight anywhere else though.
It’s actually hard to believe your channel isn’t big because it’s really high quality
I appreciate that, I do try
That's why we got a comment like and subscribe!
fr i thought i was watching like a swagkage video but i just checked and this guy only has 4k subs
Great video, finally someone that brings up a Pein going all out in a versus, usually I feel like he gets scaled on his compromised screen times such as him fatigued, not going all out and powers exposed against Naruto.
Thank you guys for bringing up the four tails.
People be using that to downplay my boy Jeriah.
Anytime
Sasuke : look at me I can traumatize you.. look deep into my eyes and cry.
Pain : waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
The rest of the paths : what the fu-
Oh no
canon
Dope thumbnail
Indeed
Thank you for that!
22:35 Black Zetsu directly said Itachi is quicker on the uptake than Sasuke is, even all the way to the war. Pain is also more difficult to blind than Nagato since Nagato only has the Summons to extend his vision, whilst Pain has six Paths. Usually this is compensated for by the fact Nagato is much stronger, but since even a few Paths are already stronger than Sasuke, it just makes it hopeless for him.
I think a good way of establishing Taka Sasuke's ceiling is that he was pushed to his limit to defeat someone who conceded inferiority to Hiruzen, who by Danzō's estimate is likely inferior to Pain. Pain would have easily swept through the individual Gokage at the summit, whilst Sasuke nearly died multiple times.
In fact Sasuke was stated to have underperformed. Tobi expected Sasuke to at least be able to take one of the Kage hostage.
Too much hype for itachi 😂😂 when did itachi bacame Pains level?
Always was, when did Pain become EMS Sasuke level
Itachi was never at any point in time on Pain's level at all lol
@@VirhtueBulshit itachi is nowhere near pain lvl with or without ninja AIDS. The Rinegan is superior to Sharingan, MS and EMS and cant be caught in a visual genjutsu. Amaterasu gets absorbed, Tsukiomi gets blocked without even trying, Susano cant handle All summonings + 6 pains, Shisui eye cant do shit either against pain on top of that Pain can use Chakra rods to suppress and control other ppl movements and chakra (itachi cant even touch them), can rip souls out, can respawn and he can shoot missiles and lasers and use other Sci-fi weapons with ausra path. Wtf can Itachi even do gainst that not to mention that the individual pains get stronger the more pains get Knocked out.
Long story short itachi cant do shit to Pain
@@silverlightning4995💯💯
@@silverlightning4995yep, the problem is people always forget Pain had those ‘rods’. Look at the way Madara handled Sausage in 10 secs with Deva Path power. The power of Black Receiver is criminally underestimated.
Virthue on his hatred arc with Sage, DMS Virthue gonna be hype 🙌
Fr I’m getting amps on amps
Not that it makes a difference but Sasuke is much stronger after absorbing Orochimaru, he told Team 7 that neither he or Orochimaru alone or together were strong enough to fight Itachi. After absorbing Orochimaru he believes he's strong enough to take on Itachi alone.
We saw how that ended
How does sasuke get stronger when he's suppressing orochimaru?
@vaughnjackson6297 to be honest it sasuke probably met he was above a massively weakened orochimaru that he fought.
That’s also nearly a seventy chapter difference and we know that Sasuke was more confident because he had more of Orochimaru’s abilities such as his poison resistance and recovery ability along with Hebi who he needed to make sure nobody could intervene
Even after absorbing itachi he couldn’t defeat itachi 💀
From my own interpretation and what I’ve read, Pain is “stronger” than any non Juubi version of Obito in terms of “how much stuff can I blow up and how hard do I hit”. Obito would probably still beat him in a fight because Kamui is just an absolutely ridiculous ability and Hashirama cells are an absurd boost.
Could (pre Juubi absorption) Obito blow up the leaf village? Absolutely not. Could he beat someone who can through hax, speed, and battle IQ? Definitely.
As much as I love his character, Itachi is definitely the third strongest member of the Akatsuki. He doesn’t have the stamina to go the distance with Pain or Obito, who are shown to be two absolute juggernauts when it comes to stamina. He could probably cook up some kind of trap/ambush to take out either Obito or Nagato, but in a “fair” fight he just doesn’t have enough gas in the tank. His biggest win cons just don’t apply to Pain specifically, sealing one path is just not enough and his genjutsu is shown to mostly be a 1 on 1 thing. I don’t know if Obito could Kamui through the totsuka blade or Tsukuyomi but those would be fair win cons for Itachi. Weirdly, even though I believe Obito would beat Pain, I think Itachi would have a better chance against Obito just due to the matchup.
He could phase through Totska blade has to touch you to seal you and the way Kamui works his intangibility comes from the part/or parts of his body being attacked literally get shifted to Kamui dimension. (Kakashi is ability to abuse this during War Arc) Tskoyomi is a win con if it hits but Tobi would be aware of that risk and either not look Itachi in the eye or have Izanagi prepared for it. Madara showed that you could program Izanagi in advance
Pain would destroy Sasuke period.
What if he doesn't have his period?
@@bearwitty9690 if you have anything intelligent to say I'd be happy to opine.🤓
@@iamsj6342 what're you, the joke police? I don't owe you anything bro 😄 the hubris.
@@bearwitty9690 i never said you owe anything, clearly you got reading problems lol.
@@iamsj6342loosen up will ya'. 😁
“He’s still my pookie” had me rolling 😂😂
😭😭
Second comment, Loko finna come with a Hebi Sasuke slams Pain video after seeing that section of the video
W
he doesnt know what a powercliff is lmao
Tbh I'm surprised someone brought up kid 4tails vs a holding back jiriaya( high ASF can't spell)
Your good
High as shit watching this too
I don’t see how Itachi is a rival to pain. He cannot beat pain either. That’s just fans glazing Itachi. Uchiha too ninjutsu heavy to beat pain when he has a body that absorbs ninjutsu. Even Amaterasu and susanoo gets absorbed. Itachi is prob slightly faster but pains shared vision. 16:40 it’s import to realize that path fighting jiraiya while he wasn’t looking, a diff path was, so shared vision was how he seen the attack to block.
In terms of raw power and gifts, pain/nagato would win. Itachi is gifted though, because of his mind. The ONLY way itachi would win, would not be through his physical/visual prowess, but in a battle of wits and outsmart pain somehow.
He literally no diffed Edo Nagato...
He doesn't even have to absorb Amaterasu. Deva Path can blow it off. Thats how Nagato got it off during War Arc.
@@ttkrystal8329 You mean when Nagato was being controlled remotely by Kabuto like he was playing Ninja Storm and wasn't even paying attention to Itachi and was focused completely on Naruto and Bee and Itachi merely blind sided him? Kabuto can't utilize the person better than they themselves can. Kabuto having to control directly is already a nerf.
@@FantomMisfittotsuka blade one shots him just like it did in the war arc
This was really good analysis and screenshot evidence. Very well done boys
Appreciate it
Sasuke at that point in the story gets absolutely humiliated.
bro droppin heat back 2 back 🔥
You already know!
When did Sasuke beat B? He was stomped by B
And Bee was just playing around.
I know we don't need ANOTHER point to state why hebi sasuke is not on pains level, but since kakashi is a lightning timer since he cut lightning and pain could react to kakashi while using raikiri, couldn't we say that the paths could react to kirin and absorb it or repel it since its the speed of lightning. Just an interesting point.
Well kirin isnt really a jutsu you can absorb since its made from actual lightning instead of being chakra based, the chakra is really just to make the lightning be controlled and shaped. If pain can absorb it before its fully shaped sure but after sasuke actually aims it thered be no point to absorbing the chakra cause the actual lightning would still hit you during the absorption
@@Seatly372 fair enough, some people have stated it absorbs energy as apposed to just chakra but there is no real way to prove that.
he could absolutely repel it though with the deva path of just straight dodge it
True
Naa. Pain literally absorbed oil!!!
@@shafeckbrown496 theres no proof that the oil wasnt made by chakra as jiraiya was the one to shoot the oil. He didnt just summon it from the mountain nor did ma and pa bring it
Thanks for clearing up the Hebi Sasuke scaling Loko is being very disingenuous for views. Virtue been dropping bangers lately.
No doubt!🔥🔥
Loko prolly punching air right now
Me and Loko are cool
Everyone knows our Lord and Savior hebi Sasuke will wreck pain 🙏🏾 thank you Loko for showing me the way
Dude your wierd
that mf hebi sasuke went high diff with dedera lamo
W vid
Yo sup eternal
@@blazemastermind3168 yooo
Thank you my man
Who tf is putting Hebi Sasuke above KCM1 Naruto!?
Nobody in particular but there has just always been the devils advocate topic for it and it’s been popping back up
loko
I heard dygoknight made a video calming this very thing. Never sought it though because that topic doesn't deserve that much attention
@@Katokhann i dont think dygoknight did that
Im wondering why sasuke didnt get the spirit tools seeing that he got itachis eyes???
We simply don’t know although I have heard some really good theories for it
Maybe proof that Itachi found them?
That's for Sarada to unlock not papa 😂
Ems doesn’t grant sasuke powers of itachi it just gives sasuke eternal light
Plot
Summit Sasuke is the most brutal thing I've seen from a character in Naruto. Dude fought the kages, fought/killed Danzo then throw hands with a fully rested Kakashi and clashed with Naruto. That durability was crazy. For me Sasuke character is one of the more well written ones dispite the hate he gets from people. After the summit I actually started to like him waaay more than Naruto, cause that's when I started to understand his character more in depth.
He is my favorite character but he was wrong Naruto saved him
He still gets dominated by Pain lol
@@thelegacyofgaming2928 Just like how Naruto got dominated by Pain with prep time lmao
He was constantly aided by Karin.
Sasuke was virtually dead in many scenarios but Obito and Taka saved his ass all the time.
Hell, he was almost killed by Bee if his squad would not had intervened.
Summit Sasuke was literally saved by Obito lmao.
Not even sage Naruto beat Pain. He basically lost then went to Pain and talk-no-jutsued him into doing rinne-rebirth. He also had Ma and Pa helping him as well as being bailed out by other leaf shinobi like Hinata.
I feel like the fair comparison would be team Taka vs Pain which I totally see Sasuke's team winning.
Yo, the GOATs! Putting respect on my boy Payne.
Always
Sasuke should individually scale above the paths of pain in raw strength and speed. Only one who is contentious is the deva due to its feats against 6 tails Naruto. Sasuke has counters for all of pains abilities besides chibaku tensei. If hebi sasuke fights in Naruto’s position, than I actually see sasuke performing slightly better than sage Naruto mainly due to his superior IQ. I genuinely can not see sasuke losing this fight if he knows all of pain’s abilities.
Nope
The crack this One smokes is S Rank
@@travisstatik2573 nah I just actually watched the show and know exactly how powerful pain and hebi sasuke are. I suggest you do the same
@@justthefacts6902can you even explain how sasuke counters all the pain abilities? I think you downplay naruto’s battle iq hear because clearly you do not understand that in terms of fighting iq naruto and sasuke are not that far off because if they were sasuke would win most if not all of their encounters. Yet in the final valley he needed cm2 and in the last he needed the rest of the bijuu to even come close. Naruto simply just presents himself as dumber but if you actually watch the show he clearly isnt.
@@gershonreisagario5875 sure firstly sasuke is fast enough to speed blitz all of the paths of pain except the deva. Meaning he can also simply evade most of their attacks. The animals paths summons would just give sasuke ammunition because he can genjutsu them. Also fly if he ever needs to.
The only pain that sasuke would have trouble with is the deva path. Im assuming sasuke can defeat the fodder paths before the deva’s power returns. However pains win con is the deva paths power returning because sasuke would be powerless against his abilities. Just like sage Naruto was.
Actually sasuke is light years ahead of Naruto in terms of battle Iq. This has been flat out showcased in the series. And also commented on by super intelligent characters like madara and jigen. They both make similar observations about Naruto and sasuke’s intelligence compared to one another. Sasuke can only compete with Naruto because of his higher battle IQ and over all skill level. Naruto simply has far more raw power than sasuke and his IQ is basically how he makes up for it. If Naruto was even remotely as smart as sasuke in combat then he’d just low diff sasuke every time they fight. But Naruto’s stupidity is actually what gives sasuke a chance in their fights.
Sasuke getting folded by Pain if they fought during that time. Also Pain is above Itachi as well. Itachis stamina is his weakness. Just like he said everyone has a weakness. Pain is too much power for them to fight for a long time.
Ms Sasuke that fought danzo gets high diffed from pain , itachi high diffs pain , healthy nagato mid diffs itachi
@@ThinkLoudeRR Pain mid diffs MS Sasuke, mid-high diff alive Itachi, Nagato extreme diff/either way Edo Itachi
I mean its not really even a debate is it. Tobi himself tells Sasuke that Sage Naruto was stronger than him Edit: Karin also implies shortly after this that Base Summit Sasuke was above his Stage 2 cursemark self. So theres no way Hebi Sasuke scales above that.
@@ThinkLoudeRR Itachi is definitely not beating Pain. He can’t handle that many strong ninjas at once. He will get folded eventually.
Really well done!
I feel like pain, despite having some prep-time and and help from Konan was basically fighting at as big of a disadvantage known to any character in the series, other than Madara + obito vs everyone at the end of the series.
Having to solo (nearly, konan helped) the entire leave village, defeating several named Jonin, Tsunade, as well as plenty of other relevant characters, and having to go up against a prepped naruto without even having time to rest is only the start of his disadvantage. He also had to contend with the 9 tails (half of its chakra) and was doing decently well despite the previous setbacks.
I feel like Sasuke's arsenal that stage of the series just simple doesn't have the stopping power to deal with some of Pain's bread and butter mechanics. The summoning path alone could probably out-pace sasuke's ability to deal with them, as Kirin is probably the only thing strong enough to incapatitate one, and maybe a few of the summons if we're being generous. Deva path's earth style definitely would have an issue with Chidori, but the path that can absorb ninjutsu would also be pivotal in support, at any stage of the fight.
Even once sasuke gets susanoo, I think the summoning path alone would be able to keep Sasuke busy, whilst using earth style to mess with sasuke while he's in the Susano (we know gaara's sand could do it, I see no reason why pain's earth style couldn't do similar. It'd depend how effective the Totska blade would be against the summons, imo. (idk how to spell that thing)
all in all, I feel like Madara/endgame sasuke are the only uchiha's that could handle such a task, being outnumbered + rinnegan just outgears the sharingan quite hard
Saying 1 path is sannin level is crazy is konohamaru sannin level😂😂
Its not crazy at all. The Deva Path is beyond Sanin level. The man was fist fighting 7 tails Naruto and he almost captured him. Thats not a feat any of the Sanin could accomplish. Orochimaru could only handle the kyuubi up to 4 tails.
This Konohamaru agenda is absolute rat stuff, the Naraka was turned around not looking and got back up after. Yes, each individual path was contending Jiraiya and could react to his Sage attacks which would imply they would be more than capable of reacting to base Jiraiya; a sannin
Rasengan is Sannin level at least
@@TheReZisTLust Rasengan is a Kage level technique.
@@avaliausd. Nobody fist fought 7 tails, you mean 6 tails. Also, Orochimaru wasn't even in his prime when he fought 4 tails, and his durability is insane for being able to tank some of those hits. There's no evidence that Orochimaru would die against 6 tails or higher.
You just gained one more subscriber. 😊
Not only is it that pain never wanted to kill Naruto because he was there to capture him, he fought with half his strength due to nagato being sick and drained from his last fight with jiraiya, he still took on the kyubi transformation and dealt with it, Naruto had perfect sage mode and help from 2 toad masters. Yeah pain stomps many people’s favorite characters and it’s not even close.
Look at it more practically. If Orochimaru, Jiraya or Itachi were stronger or as strong as Pain the events of the show would've absolutely never played out the way that they did. A lot of shadier elements of the Akatsuki were dragged along by the idea that ultimately Pain was in charge and the other's had to play the waiting game. Zetsu, Obito, Orochimaru, and Itachi all had conflicting goals and at some point each one has to concede that Pain's goal is the one that matters for their own sake
Tsykyomi is very much better duh that's not saying itachi is just clear of ms sasuke like I agree he is stronger but ur reasoning is wrong. Itachi genjutsu is better than adult sasuke. But ms sasuke Amaterasu is better than itachi
Actually it’s stated that Boruto era sasuke has the strongest genjutsu amongst all uchiha, so Sasuke’s genjutsu in Boruto era would be better than Itachi’s
I didn't expect the random diatribe of Jiraiya respect, but I'm so here for it
We tend to forget that Pain did not fight one v one against Naruto.
It was Pain versus the entire Konoha (and then a stronger Naruto defeated a Pain who's Chakra was depleted, and chose to sacrifice himself)
True
Pain would fold that young man and send him back to Konoha with a wedgie😂😂 Hebi sasuke wasn’t even strong enough to beat Orochimaru that’s why he waited until he was bed ridden and came to kill him😂 frankly sasuke only beats pain when he gets EMS and rinne and even EMS sasuke beating him is shaky because he got EMS and went after killer bee and got viciously fcked over💀 like…it was very bad😭Rinne sasuke absolutely stomps but EMS sasuke I can’t really say I don’t see that version winning against pain… though the god of shinobi Kakuzu himself in the flesh would absolutely slam both through just raw durability iykyk😂😂 he no diffs both uncontested with minimal effort 🗿
Taka sasuke literally ended the fight the moment he used his MS against killer bee. EMS sasuke is easily kcm2 naruto level bruh...
@@Vulpesioended what fight?? You mean the guy who got his ribs opened up 😂failed to capture bee after falling for a shadow clone?? You mean that guy? Lmfao he would’ve got NO diffed by killer bee had it not been for jugo and Karin keeping him alive lmfao there won’t be any plot armor here for him pain is giving him the kakashi treatment lil bro😂😂 little sasuke goon thinking his boyfriend stands a chance😂 pain literally overpowers sasuke’s whole arsenal and has various ways to literally ONE SHOT him…the same doesn’t doesn’t apply to sasuke…and saying EMS sasuke is kcm2 level is diabolical work but I’m just gonna let you go on that one sasuke goon😂 your boyfriend gets puts down by pain cope harder😂
@@VulpesioBro your brain okay? Killer Bee was was massively stronger than that Sasuke. He died twice and had to be saved by Taka. Amaterasu came in clutch but he would have been dead.
@@Vulpesio maybe EMS sasuke later in like the WA scales and could beat pain but from five kage summit sasuke and any sasuke below that is simply getting curb stomped though granted rinne sasuke absolutely stomps and manages to live longer and adult forms are just not fair😂
He would beat up hebi
Do you think Tobirama would be able to beat Pain ?
No but it's probably close af.
Yeah
didn’t he lose to those ninetail brothers ?
@@Virhtue hey you should make a video about the kinkaku and ginkaku brothers (with 9 tails chakra and their weapons) running the gauntlet against the Akastuki
Could be a cool vid
@@saddoggo5822No he lost to the squad that brought them down and he was out of chakra at the time.
People keep forgetting the fact that Naruto was getting fed intel about Pain during the fight. He didn’t have to figure it out as he fought. Which is how Jiraiya got killed. This is a HUGE advantage. Also Naruto did not defeat Pain. The end fight between him and Nagato never happened because Nagato used his last remaining chakra to revive the whole hidden leaf village which must have taken an enormous amount of chakra. People forget Nagato himself is more powerful than the 6 pains! Remember him summoning the Gedo statue to wipe out Hanzo’s army and the Anbu? Pain annihilated the hidden leaf village. Then he pretty much toyed with sage mode Naruto and all of his toad friends then faced 6 tails Kyuubi with only Yahiko Pain then revived the whole village. Come on now!
I would say Obito is not stronger than Pain, he's just indestructible. It's impossible to kill him. The only way to beat him is to use the other kamui which teleports you to his realm. The sharingan that obito has is the defensive portion of his power. The sharingan that he gave to kakashi, is the offensive portion.
Had Obito *both* the offensive and defensive sharingan, he could quite literally be the most powerful human being. It would be almost impossible to defeat his gimmick. He just teleports you away if he finds you a nuisance, or he teleports himself away to dodge an attack.
Obito beats Pain just because he hard counters him. Pain has no answer to Kamui and Kamui counters all his abilities. Hell Obito could literally just leave and kill Nagato directly and just ignore the Paths. Destructive capability though? Yeah Pain (until White Mask Obito)
What answer does EMS Sasuke has for the chibaku tensei?
the susanoo would just tank it and hed attack pain from range
@@AidenB1010 cap Sasuke's susano aint the kyubi
Susanoo arrows and enton
@@Virhtue How would the susano arrows and enton do anything to the chibaku tensei other than burning himself when he gets pulled into the burning rock?..
@@eloquitodelaesquinahe has no answer,he dies
Hebi sasuke gets stomped
FKS sasuke loses maybe high or mid diff
Peak EMS sasuke just stomps pain
correct
Agreed
If Pain wasn’t the antagonist in this story I don’t think anyone would have beat him, as far as actual abilities he ridiculous he has like 50 one hitter quitters it’s nuts.
Nagato's powers are too much.
It had to be nerfed by the six paths with only one ability in each individual.
And even after that, Pain was defeated by a lot of plot armors that doesn't even makes sense, even though the writer has to defeat Pain as he was the villain.
I never thought about the fact that pain was not fighting to kill Naruto, that’s crazy
Nice vid but the Orochimaru scaling based on _only_ Karen's statement is quite disingenuous when Orochimaru _himself_ says BOS Sasuke, not even Hebi Sasuke who is significantly stronger, plainly states BOS Sasuke is stronger than him. And this is before the 4 Tails fight
So No arm Orochimaru is absolutely weaker than BOS Sasuke who again is weaker than Hebi Sasuke. Hebi Sasuke is pretty comfortably above the Sannin mid-high diff
Too bad sasuke agrees with her statement So hes barely in the base sanin.
@@Archer170 Sasuke says Orochimaru was sick...... that's like basic knowledge and logic, what are you on about
Orochimaru doesn’t say BOS sasuke is stronger. He says he’s more difficult than him, and implies he’s more of a prodigy than he was.
Oh brother💀
SM Naruto is nowhere near pain's level. He got help of kurama and he got intel and pain has just destroyed the village. Even kcm1 looses to pain. I think Kcm 2 is a perfect match
SM Naruto is way below Tendo. That Naruto with a very fatigued Pain who fought a entire village because fight him. And that Pain needed Naruto to be alive, otherwise… 💀
w vids as always virhtue !
Thanks king
My chakra is low so i couldn't use my ftg like comment run time blitz. But i still have enough for a combined attack. I love the team ups with u and sage. just fire content all around
Thank you!!
Sasuke vs 6 Pains:
Hebi Sasuke loses extreme diff. Hebi Sasuke is relative to, albeit slightly weaker than, SM Naruto who himself still ended up losing to the 6 Pains
Taka Sasuke loses mid-high/high diff. Taka was stated weaker than Hebi and his MS causes too much damage and he's not used to the pain that it causes.
FKS Sasuke mid diffs the 6 Pains.
FKS Sasuke is _SIGNIFICANTLY_ more powerful than SM Naruto and unlike him.... he doesn't have a SM timer. And FKS Speed + Battle IQ + Susanoo is too much for the Pains
Basically Taka < Hebi ≈< SM Naruto < 6 Pains
Brother Hebi Sasuke is no where near Pain and there isn’t any support for that claim
@@Virhtue Hebi Sasuke is stronger than the version of Sasuke (BOS Sasuke) that was stated by Orochimaru himself to be stronger than him. And Orochimaru has constantly been considered the strongest Sannin and considering Jiraiya did an ok job fighting 6 Pain, Hebi Sasuke will do FAAAR better
Plus Hebi Sasuke annihilates PA Kakashi in all aspects, and even Kakashi managed to hold off 2 Pains on his own for a while
If you make pain full power and take away the intel you know FKS sasuke is getting washed 10/10 times right?
@@Archer170 you know FKS destroys the 6 Pains because he's far faster, smarter and has higher AP right?
@@thmistrapillay1811I like Kakashi but he got cooked easily. He needed a lot of help and still got cooked in the end.
hebi sasuke loses to the three pains jiraya fought
Taka sasuke might lose to the animal path or the three pains
5ks sasuke fights the 6 paths of pain and defeats 4 or 5 with intel and 3 without intel but loses still
Early Ems sasuke defeats 5 pains without intel due to chibaku tensei and defeats pain with intel
Ems sasuke against juubito defeats him mid diff
Agreed
i disagree, i think he could win against 3 pains alone, full power pain definitely wins against hebi sasuke
@@plavsk hebi sasuke isnt even sannin level as it was stated that he couldnt beat orochimaru on multiple statements like the deidara statement karin statement in itachi pursuit arc and suigetsu statement in war arc where he said he wouldve lost if orochimaru was healthy and “we just surpassed our masters” which means that fks sasuke was above orochimaru but not hebi. the animal path alone was strong enough to stalemate base jiraya who is relative to orochimaru which can mean that just the animal path may be enough to stalemate sasuke atleast and then it forced jiraya to use sage mode which makes jiraya stated “above sannin” and he was gonna lose to the three pains if ma and pa didnt use frog song unless hebi survives long enough to use kirin and actually hits them before animal path summons them out which i doubt he loses and then if he hits them, he’ll die anyways when they’re revived
@@dr.dragonballz4865 i highly doubt that the animal path summons will hit sasuke, he can see the chamaeleon with his sharingan and take out the animal path, after all the pain bodies dont really have the best durability and speed.
as for the human path, his ability isnt going to work mid battle and sasuke could take him out
and for the preta path he can use kirin, and since its actual lightning and not ninjutsu the preta path cant absorb it, and it doesnt spend sasukes own chakra, and in the rain village he may be able to use multiple kirins
@@plavsk those summons speedblitzed kcm naruto and ik hebi sasuke isnt close to kcm narutos speed and also all hebi sasuke has as a summon is manda while it took 3 of the great toads to defeat those summons and especially the dog hebi sasuke has no counter to
Finally someone who doesn't completely dunk on Jiraya mindlessly. The Sannin were High Tier Kage level, it's BS people low ball him so badly. Also Jiraya went into the fight with limited info too. Yeah Jiraya was weaker than all the Pain paths, but he wasn't powerless.
Pain would stomp Sasuke up until the mid to end point of the War Arc. I even think Pain beats Itachi 10/10 times. Pain has too much stamina, durability, AoE, feats, versatility, etc. Itachi is great and could probably beat any one or two Paths, but he couldn’t answer the full group.
I agree with everything except you guys continously saying that Itachi and Pain are rivals. They're absolutely not rivals, in fact Itachi is in the same boat as Sasuke. I'd bet my money that MS Sasuke would do better than sick Itachi against Pain. So we know out of the two, Itachi has more intenl, cause he knows not to dare launch Tsukiyomi at Nagato, cause he already knows that that won't work which is a bummer since Itachi's main win cons when it comes to debates is Tsukiyomi. But Itachi does not have complete intel on Pain as he stupidly throws amaterasu at Nagato. Why would he do that if he knew he could either repel it or absorb it. Not that amaterasu would make an impact in the fight at all anyways.
So Tsukiyomi is useless. Amaterasu is useless. Even if Itachi stays in Susanno and can possibly tank a full fledged almighty push, he cannot stay in there forever, he can barely hold up the Susanno due to the side effects of it and his sickness. So Susanno not good enough either. The only thing Itachi got going for him is his intelligence and speed, which is the same with MS Sasuke. Pain has no Raikage lvl speed feats. But as we know just being smarter and faster than Pain is not enough to beat him. His stamina and hax will make up for that. But that's all I wanted to say, they aren't rivals in no way.
Bro that's a bunch of malarkey 😩 stop .. 🛑
You are incorrect about one thing. Pain's speed.
Pain was lightening fast in the fight against Nine Tails.
Pain can match Raikage and Guy in speed and that is shown in the amine itself.
Just watch the fight again.
Hebi Sasuke takes his lunch money
What?
@@stephenking2895 Pain gets his pockets violated.
@@whispr_2ME not by hebi sasuke that almost got cooked by deidara. Bro could barely beat a sick orochimaru
Why!
@@stephenking2895 Wrong.
These two are the new swag and Seth… with out the allegations ofc.
Love to hear it
Boosting Virthue in the algorithm by spamming comments
Sage of Thick Calves, Bark God/Thunder Woof, Virtue, SatoriYT GOATed fr
W king
Seriously, what do you have against TG?😂
I’m gonna need an explanation about the bark stuff. You’ve been at this for like a month.
@___________0Z0X Why you think I got beef with Woof God? I literally said Thunder Bark GOATed
@@CH1C4N0444idk about any beef, but where did the bark come from?
I need to know the lore lol.
@___________0Z0X I mean I'm asking why you think I got something against Thunder Woof?
Idk if Bark God would want me to spill the beans on the lore though lmao
bro been spamming trash takes all week whats going on???😭
Saying that like I wouldn’t slam your face in the dirt on every one of them is crazy😭
You gotta be trolling lol..
@@Virhtue im trying to see the vision but i can’t man even with the high end
Hebi Sasuke is fodder
I mean, I wouldn’t say fodder but compared to the typical marches he’s placed in, for sure
Recently found your and sage's channel I hope you both keep up the good content and grow further 🙏🙏
We will!
No sasuke did get something from orochimaru..he had access to orochimarus forbidden jutsu
Sage’s channel: youtube.com/@sageofthickcalves?si=uukXg53mkvGzXHwZ
Got some solid work over there, definitely worth checking out🔥
Another thing ppl don't pay attention to or consider is, jiraya in Naruto is NOT as powerful as jiraya in Naruto Shippuden 😅😅😅
@streetsharksbedfordpoint6.933 please explain, he got the same bag of tricks in pretime skip.
Folks! today is a new day, let it be a new start for you with the Almighty Jesus Christ. God awaits you✝️
Question. You were saying that Sasuke can't see certain attacks from pain with his sharingan which makes some sense to me. I'm just struggling with the fact that Sasuke could see deidara Nano bombs because the sharingan allows him to see chakra as colors. He was even able to see them in his blood stream if I'm not mistaken. But idk maybe it works differently since something like Almighty Push is not a physical object.
I think it shows that generally the Uzumaki Clan is a cut above the Uchiha Clan as most of all Uzumaki vs Uchiha matchups end in Uzumakis winning
Lmaooo Sasuke literally uses pains powers now as an upgrade. Shits hilarious knowing pain would've one tapped him around that time 😂 that's when the debate of who's strongest was the most serious between the fanbase
I’m not a huge lore addict like I used to but if I recall when jiraiya lost to pain. A huge reason why is because jiraiya was trying to get info and didn’t understand that all the paths of pain shared their vision between each other. I doubt he would have lived if he figured it out sooner but the fight would have been much closer.
Thats true that he didn't know how Pains powers worked but Pain wasn't jumping him with the Paths at first either. Whereas with Naruto he immediately summons all the Paths in.
I’m glad u brought pookie bear back 🥰🥰
Hell yeah
Happy to see you again
You too
Obviously people think obito can defeat pain.. imagine this, karaiya vs konan, jiraiya easily defeated konan. Obito vs konan. Obito barely survived. It's simple analogy, konan and pain were always together. Don't you think pain didn't plan to counter obito like conan did. Even if obito used izanagi, it wouldn't still be enough. Coz, nagato isn't there in actual. Even obito doesn't know their hiding place.
I'm very relieved to see the comment section. In the summary of what was discussed for a second, I thought I was entering one of those delusional rant about how heavy Sasuke or taka Sasuke can solo the entire verse essentially.
You dont need a 37min video to know that Sasuke at the end of Shippuden is wayyyy ahead of Pain
Even if pain was trying to kill Naruto I feel like the 9 tails would have given or taken over Naruto chakra so he doesn’t die.
Obviously, which is why they don't try to kill the hosts, but extract the powers. Despite Akatsuki being Sannin-Kage level ninja, none of them are trying to outright fight the tailed beasts, especially the nine tails.
Tailed beasts can't be killed I think.
It was stated in the anime somewhere.
0:11 imma stop you right there bro☝🏽 He did not beat killer bee, he got tagged with a hit that would surely kill him TWICE in a row while trying to jump him 4v1. And then he pulled out a plot armor jutsu and bee decided to substitute & escape making sasuke think he won, sir. 😭 ik you knew that already but still 😂
Pain without his secrets being known would have bodied anyone any character before war arc(alive, not like hashirama, madara etc). He was such a monster.
For sure!
Sasuke def stands no chance vs pain until eos! When he gets his own rinnegan. Lol he has nothing to take pain out until that point. Rinnegan> EMS . He can’t do anything. He could have manda out with a full susanoo and the animal path , ninjutsu absorbing path and yahiko path alone would take sasuke down. His susano gets absorbed . And he needs taijutsu to take that one but he’d have to get thru the other 2 paths shooting missles and attacking. Even killing one, he couldn’t prevent the last one from reviving the one he beats.
Naruto literally had giant frogs, Ma & Pa, multiple shadow clones, Hinata, & Kurama help him beat pain who wasn’t even blood lusted but only wanted to capture Naruto. What the FUCK is Sasuke doing against paths of Pain?
Naruto did have a lot of support which is sort of, neglected in this discussions
I disagree that Pain could’ve killed Naruto anytime because he was trying to kill Jirayi and still had a bit of trouble w him despite having the intel and environment advantage.
The outcome of the fight between Naruto and Pain was exactly how it should have been compared to Jiraya. He got down to the very last Pain and due more to inexperience I would argue, lost.
Pains main advantage came from his numbers and coordinated visions. One of them was able to be defeated by even Konohamaru from just one rasengan.
FKS Sasuke can actually win this by spamming the battlefield with Amaterasu and using the heat generated to create permanent storm clouds for Kirin. This happened during Sasuke vs Itachi when clouds immediately reappeared after Kirin was used, due to the effects of Itachi's amaterasu which means technically Sasuke could've used it again if necessary. Sasuke also has knowledge on this so i think he'd use it in character once he sees Pain's power level. I heard people say Pain can dispel rainy clouds but we've only seen this in Amegakure and aren't sure if this is chakra or natural clouds.
Otherwise i don't see Pain having the physical reactions to deal with Kirin. If we assume he can, we must also say that large scale ST requires other paths to be disabled. Of course it all depends on Sasuke's stamina since he'll need to spam MS abilities like a madman, but i don't think it's farfetched to say this tactic can wipeout Pain 3 times out of 10 and i'd say 5+/10 if Deva is as nerfed as he was against Naruto.
Hebi sasuke>Orochimaru.
He notes himself that he cant take on itachi at the start of shippuden but after training more he finally decides he can.
The bare minimum he knows of itachis strength is that he is stronger than orochimaru. So he simply trained to be that strength before going to challenge itachi or gained that strength after absorbing orochimaru. Or both.
doesnt change anything as he could just be incorrect/in over his head like how he belived he could kill itachi when they fought. this argument lingers on him being correct when his basis of why is inccorect, he also isnt contentiouis to ororchimaru being above him and doesnt even refute against it when brought up..
Point blank sasuke gets wrecked by bee without his team there and pain absolutely annihilates him as well
I can't fully remember if the manga portrayed it differently, but a lot of the time I hear this notion "Jiraiya thought Naruto is the child of prophesy". Only at the very end before his death did he confirm this to himself, Jiraiya never saw him as the one until this point, so a beloved student who he didn't want to harm yes! COP no!
He saw it in realizing Nagato was a bringer of destruction
@@Virhtue Yea it was a realisation made at the final moments. Nagato had to be stopped, decided Naruto would be the one to stop him. That is probably when fate was set in motion, I think the choice Jiraiya made led Naruto to be CoP (inferring from the story).
Fresh EMS sasuke gets booty clapped by all pain paths.
Wtf
@@Virhtue becuase its true ems sasuke wouldnt last 10 mins against pain bro lol.
Guy is stronger than Kakashi.. that’s why he attacks leaf when he was gone
Can tell that with the tone of these kids voices they never saw this fight on release. Arguing about a question that is from 10 years ago lol 😅
Oro took alot of jutsu from tobirama😂
That’s true