Paver Base Prep - Steep Slope & Clay Sub Soil, (Open Grade Base)? Absolutely.
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ค. 2024
- Preparing the base for a concrete paver patio on a steep slope and with dense clay sub soil, This should be fun... Enjoy the video as I show you how we deal with a situation like this!
To see how we would typically prepare the base for paver installs, click this video link right here 👉 • The BEST Backfill Meth...
#pavers #patio #concrete #paverpatio #hardscaping #landscaping #hardscapes
00:00 Excavation
01:58 1st layer of stone
03:17 Fabric & 2nd layer of stone
09:15 1st Layer of Geo-Grid
09:46 3rd layer of stone
13:48 2nd layer of Geo-Grid
14:05 Setting the final grade for the base stone
16:05 All graded, Recap
17:49 Chip stone update
18:41 Getting ready to screed and lay pavers - แนวปฏิบัติและการใช้ชีวิต
![เบิ้ล ปทุมราช - อ้ายกินดอง น้องลาบงัว ft. สแน็ก อัจฉรีย์ [OFFICIAL MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/-OK--KaSPcI/mqdefault.jpg)
Oh boy... another new project to watch you pro-gress through.... I am always amazed at how you can take a project through the phases and turn it into a work of art...
This was a pretty cool one, came out nice! Thanks for always leaving feedback man! ✌
I agree love the attention to detail they have and the work they do is of top notch quality.
I swear by 3/4" clean stone. I use it under concrete projects and for many other projects. I recently found 3/4" stone that has a slight texture to it. I feel it has a better compaction rate and it binds better. I used it under walkway and Im using as a base pad for future meat smoker. I'm in NE pa, a must have for rapid seasonal changes.I follow all your videos. Awesome craftsmanship.
That preview is looking really awesome. I just finished my project in my backyard with almost the same shape, the exact same stone and color, I even did the sailor course border the same way. I referenced your video's an absolute ton on my job. Just wanted to put a heartfelt thank you out there for giving me the knowledge and confidence to get my own done. Your video's are fantastic and a pleasure to keep up with.
Thank you very much for this awesome feedback! It is nice to hear from people who are putting the knowledge to use on their projects. It is my pleasure to make these videos and share the skills and knowledge I have gained in my career. I love this work and industry, the more people interested in it, the better! Thanks again, God Bless! ✌
Hey so I'm about to lay down my first patio. Haven't order my pavers yet but is there a difference between a normal paver and a slab? I was looking at some techobloc slabs.. looks like the same shit to me! Lol any tips?
Nice work! Woven textile, geo-grid, deep base...this patio is built to last 💯 I like your permeable base construction!
Thank you, good base prep is key! I love this open grade base method. ✌
Thank you for your excellent videos. I work for a GC but love doing landscaping work at my place. I've learned so much from your channel. Thanks again!
Great to hear it! I appreciate the feedback and I’m glad the videos have been helpful ✌🏻
Learning a lot
Wow! You guys have been so helpful, I'm working our small patio on a really sloped clay yard here in Australia. This channel has been so helpful, I can't wait to see how this turns out. Thanks!
That's awesome, I'm glad the videos are helpful! Good luck with your project, this method will not let you down. ✌
Looking good brother.👍🏻🇺🇸🇺🇸
Yea buddy! ✌🏻
Thank you, may I have another awesome video
Thank you, More to come! ✌
Man I am just learning so much. I was hoping in your videos you would go into a little more detail the process of laying down the screed rails and how you start that process and make the adjustments AND THEN add bedding. Those key points are gold for a DIY like me. Can't wait to start my patio. I think for your channel maybe a short video on that process, like I said brother - gold. So very helpful. ✌️
Glad to hear it man! I have an entire playlist of videos dedicated to screeding and laying pavers. Here is a link to that playlist 👉th-cam.com/play/PLo6xdtKoDxWYz29TMaLCDyCtH56napPrg.html
Love your work! Would absolutely hire you in a heartbeat if you were in SC. God bless brother. You and Benny stay say and keep on keeping on.
Thank you for the support, God Bless! ✌
Thanks
✌
Thanks!
No problem, thank you! ✌
To get my grades for the base stone I get my benchmark and mark perimeter steaks level with my lazer and measure down (paver height, sand, and slope). Then I run and string to all the marks and fill in from there
I use to set up all that kind of stuff too, after installing hundreds of patios / walkways, you realize all that work is not quite necessary. Especially for a simple install that is not meeting any structure. Just finding your bench mark and using the screed rails to check is very simple, I like simple... LOL ✌
I found the excavation portion very interesting, using the excavated soil to raise the lower section of the patio. Is that a common thing with building on a heavy slope? Would you ever raise the lower section with wall block instead of raising it with the excavated soil?
Great videos! Thanks for putting in the extra time to record and narrate step by step. It’s helped a lot in my prep for a patio build that I’ll be DIYing in MA in a few weeks.
1. My supplier can only provide 3/8 clean chip vs 1/4 chip. Will the 3/8 clean be sufficient for the top layer of stone?
2. What is your method to track your depth of stone. Do you mark your metal stakes? I’ll be adding 2 lifts at 4”.
Thank you, it is my pleasure to make the videos. I love hearing from people that they are helping them with their project! 3/8" chip stone is just fine, I have used that dozens of times. It is just a bit harder to screed than the 1/4" chip stone. And for the base stone, Once I know I excavated deep enough, I spread the thin layer and compact, then lay the fabric and spread out the 1st lift somewhat level and then compact. Then on my final layer is when I use the screed pipes to make sure I am to the correct height. I measure and mark as little as possible.... ✌
Absolutely incredible videos! I’m a former professional carpenter but have never done hardscapes before. Watching your videos gives me the confidence to build my own small paver patio. What’s your opinion on downspouts draining onto a patio vs burying a French drain under the patio? Our patio will be against the house and we have 4 downspouts that would drain onto the patio…
Thank you, I'm glad the videos have been helpful! I always recommend burying the downspouts or else letting them drain on top will wear out the polymeric sand and slowly fade / deteriorate the pavers in that spot. I would link them all into a french drain that goes out past the patio into a dry well or send the drain pipe to an area it can drain to a lower area.
Thank you - why chip stone and not sand for leveling?
Hey, I'm loving your videos! Been bingeing them lately as I'm looking to start a fairly large project for my backyard which will involve a large amount of paver and concrete installs. I live in Arizona, where the dirt is a sandy dirt that basically turns into dust when dug into. I'm curious what you think about the type of sub-base and base materials to use for this type of terrain when doing pavers, concrete and artificial grass? Thank you for any suggestions!
Nice, glad to hear it! This base prep method is excellent for absolutely any type of soil or geography. You will not go wrong with using clean, crushed stone. Especially in a sandy sub soil application. Good luck on your project!
What’s the brand of the geo textile fabric and geo grid roll?
Hi! Been watching a ton of videos, I currently just excavated my paver walkway space. Should the subsoil be sloped to match the pavers? Or does it not matter as much? I excavated about 13 inches down on heavy clay soil, it will have about 9 inches of 57 limestone, and then will use #9 limestone as the base before pavers. Just curious on if it matters on the subsoil being sloped or should be flat?
What was the reason for compacting this multiple times? Whereas in other jobs you only compacted the first 3/4 stone layer below the fabric? Do you recommend compacting the 3/4 layer above the fabric? Thanks!
great videos and information, Kyle. I'm in the process of planning my paver project for a 12 x 24 gazebo and walkway. Was wondering about why Geogrid was used in this project and not in others. I have seen other TH-cam videos were they've used both Geo textile woven fabric and Geogrid. What is the purpose of the Geogrid? and is it necessary for all paver projects?
So we had to put almost 16" of stone on the low side of this patio, the geo grid helps lock all that stone together and helps prevent sinking or shifting. That is something you want to do in between the base stone layers of a paver driveway also. But 90% of installs do not require it, that's why you don't see me do it often.
Thank you! Exactly what I was looking for. I have a super clay backyard and it looks like a pool yesterday after it rained. Are you going to install French drains for this patio?
Glad to hear it! I did not put in a french drain, It is not necessary in my opinion. Water will permeate through the clay but at a very slow rate. Take your backyard for example, after heavy rain it puddles right? But then after a few days that puddle disappears I assume. Some of that is due to evaporation but a very small amount. The vast majority of that water is just slowly permeating through the grass and into the subsoils. So the rule of thumb that I tell people is that if you do not currently have a water issue there now (meaning no standing water even days after rain) than you well absolutely not have a water issues after because you are adding so much more space for water to permeate into. That is the huge benefit of this method, it accepts water. Compared to a dense grade / sand base. That method will not help water issues, it will only make them worse. Water washes out sand and causes sink holes under the pavers.
@@TheChristianHardscaperHi, You mentioned that the Geotextile Soil Separation/Stabilization Fabric will open up once the 3/4” is compacted onto it and so you don’t have issues with drainage as it makes it more permeable…
Would this then not make it more susceptible to weeds growing through eventually if it’s opening up that much for water?
What type/brand of geo-grid do you use? I'm having to lift mine up 12-15 inches too.
Ever had to build on pure clay? That stuff turns into jello when you disturb it and add even a little moisture. No stability whatsoever until it's entirely dry. I always try to give the water a place to go out from underneath pavers or concrete whenever it's at all possible just for extra peace of mind.
Nice way to get the grade before the chip stone. I have usually just estimated but your method really takes the guesswork out with minimal effort.
I have built on pure clay a few times, very jelly like.... LOL This 3/4 stone really helps in those situations, it stabilizes much better than dense grade because it doesn't hold onto water. And I hear you about creating an outlet for the water, I would too if it was the lowest spot in the area. This patio is in the lowest spot on the customers property, but the neighbors property slopes severely, so the water under the patio will permeate down the hill behind it. The screed rails work really good to find top of base stone grade. ✌
IDK who you use for small engine stuff, check out Alexander's in Sutton. I still drive 30 minutes to bring my stuff to them. Very honest and quick compared to the hardware store repairs like Ace/Robinsons etc
Did the you/customer have any issues with the neighbor down the slope being concerned about the surface water or no because they should have things in place already since they are lower to begin with?
I actually used a small engine guy in Charlton, they did good but they did not blow me away... I will have to check out Alexanders, that is right down the street from me. And we were not concerned about the water because the grade was already sloped towards the neighbor already, so I don't think the patio will make it better or worse. Thanks for the feedback as always man! ✌
Incredible work like always!!! love your videos.
I have a question about small retaining walls. How deep do you usually dig? What base do you use? Is it only 3/4 in stone as base for walls or do you add a small layer of 3/8 in crushed stone on top of 3/4 in for walls?
Thank you! If i am building a 3-4' wall, I dig a minimum of 12 inches. That includes 6 inches of clean stone and 1 full block buried under the grade. For 1-3 ' walls, you only have to bury 3-4 inches of the 1st block, so you can dig 8-10 inches. But if you have clay sub soil, you want 8-12 inches of base stone...
@@TheChristianHardscaper thank you for your valuable feedback. Its all clay here in Alabama unfortunately
My neighbor/friend recommended your channel for my DIY patio project - his patio turned out great! Thanks so much for sharing your knowledge! We're looking to use tumbled bluestone pavers (cut to uniform thickness). Would the base prep be the same as for concrete pavers?
That is very cool, I appreciate you sharing that with me! And yes, the base prep would be the exact same for natural stone as it is for pavers. Good luck with your project! ✌
@@TheChristianHardscaper - thank you! I'll let you know how it turns out. 😊
great video, as I'm only going to do this once and i don't want to buy pipes which i don't have a purpose afterwards for, can i use wider pipes that i already have available (they were from a fence)? thanks in advance
Thank you, you certainly can use fence posts. However if they are more than 1.5" thick, I would set them into the base stone a little so that you do not have more than 1.5" of bedding stone. Also make sure they are nice and straight so that there are no dips in the patio / walkway. Good luck ✌
Still havent done a video using your new skid steer
Unfortunately not yet... I am pretty far behind on my videos, this project is from back in May. a couple months before I got my skid
I’m working on a paver patio in my backyard. We excavated some 30yo poured concrete and beneath is mostly solid bed rock (some clay soil in a few spots). Excavating that lower sounds like a nightmare. We have probably 4” below final grade at the highest point and 8” below at the lowest point. Would you recommend doing a few inch layer of 3/4” open grade for the first few inches then an inch or so of 3/8” on top?
If you only have 4" below final grade, that only gives you about 1.5 inches of stone under the pavers if you include the height of the pavers. If you mean you have 4" below the bottom of the pavers with bed rock under that, you should be fine. That gives you 3" of 3/4 stone and 1" of bedding stone. That is about the minimum base prep I recommend to people.
Hi I'm loving your videos. Just one question.. I know that you said it will cause water to not penetrate through the soil but what if I didn't put any stones over the sub soil before laying then geo-textile.. will that have a serious effect?
Glad to hear it! It is definitely better to spread the thin layer and compact before the fabric, but if you have already laid the fabric and backfilled, I don't think it is worth taking it out to do it over... Just be sure to compact the stone very well, that will help open the fabric strands and push it into the subsoil.
I keep looking for 3/4 “clean” crushed stone but I can only find 3/4 driveway gravel gray or limestone 3/4. Is that appropriate, or clean clean crushed is a must?
I always use 3/4 clean crushed but I know it is difficult to find in some areas of the country. If you can't find the clean stone you can use the dense grade material you are talking about but it certainly will not drain as well....
Really enjoy the videos. What state are you working in? We are in Western New York, and pretty much have stuck with a dense graded base and a chip bedding layer. I've wanted to try open graded base, but am concerned about getting the water away from the patio area. I was under the assumption that it had to be piped out to a spot further in the property, or at the very least excavate and slope away (well past the patio area) so the water cannot rest at the sub-base level. Can you share your general thoughts when you can?
Glad to hear it! We work in southern Massachusetts. You definitely do not have to pipe out the water. Any water that gets under the pavers will naturally permeate into the subsoil and drain just fine. 95% of installs with Open Grade Base do not need extra drainage to divert the water. If the customer does not currently have water issues in the proposed area before, they will have 0% chance of having water issues after you install a patio on open grade base. The only time you need to pipe the water out is when installing in the lowest grade of a property that has heavy clay soil. That is literally the only time I would recommend extra drainage. I hope that helps ✌
@@TheChristianHardscaper Hey, certainly appreciate the response. Thank you very much. What's the soil like by you guys? We've got a lot of clay here... And I guess my concern was just the water not penetrating through that.
How do you install edging support, when you have so much gravel
We use concrete around the edges, not plastic or metal edging
The place local to me has 3/4" clean bluestone. Is that good for the base or do you think I should find another place that has 3/4 granite? They also have 1/4" bluestone which they said is usually for filling joints in a permeable application. They have the 3/4" bluestone for screeding.
3/4" clean bluestone will be just fine and the 1/4" bluestone is exactly what you want for screeding. That is the best bedding material you can use.
@@TheChristianHardscaper Thanks for the info. Your videos are very well done. Packed with useful information. I especially like how you show us exactly what you're talking about with the close up shots and also how to avoid common mistakes. I've watched a ton of your videos getting ready for a spring project and I'm feeling confident!
I've been going through a lot of your videos as I've started my project. Never laid a paver in my life, so I'm trying to figure it out as I go with your videos. I'm in FL so I'm not dealing with clay. Would you say 8-9" deep is a good depth to start at before laying the 3/4" and compacting? And do I need to get the 3/4" up to 6" before starting the chip stone? I appreciate any advice. Thank you
Nice, hopefully the videos are helping! In a situation like yours, you definitely do not need more than 6 inches of base stone. ✌
They definitely are. Thank you sir!
How do you choose whether to use a woven or nonwoven fabric?
I use woven on 99% of my projects. I only use non woven when they don't have woven... LOL
Your videos are very helpful. I'm getting ready to do my yard and had a question: can I use road crush as a paver base? It's half the price of 3/4 minus crushed rock. Want to do it right so I thought I'd ask
I'm glad they are helpful! You can use it if you want nut it will not drain as well as the clean 3/4. So if you are in an area with freeze / thaw cycles or an area with a lot of rain, it may cause issues down the road... But it is up to you ✌
@TheChristianHardscaper Thanks, I appreciate the response. I live in Canada so deep freezes and thaw cycles. I think I'll bite the bullet and get the clean 3/4. Thanks
@@user-dc5sq5pb5x No problem, It will be worth it in the end.
What about water draining off onto other properties?
Doing this prep does not change the natural water flow. Before we excavated and backfilled, the grade was already sloped to the other properties. So this did not change anything. The only time that is a problem is when you change a grade that was preventing water to flow a certain way that now allows water flow. That is something you never want to do.
Is mountain granite 3/4 inch same as crushed clean 3/4inch? We get the same mountain granite in 3/8 inch. Would these work as layers to lay pavers ?
Yes it is. Depending on where you are geographically, there are different types of aggregate. If Granite is the type near you, that's excellent because it is a strong / durable stone. That is what I mainly use here in Massachusetts. That will work perfect ✌
Great info, as always! Can you do an estimate and all the materials for a 600 sq ft patio? DIY? I was quoted $ 15000 - 17000 by a contractor( Georgia)
600 sq ft patio without custom cuts would be in the $12,000 - $14,000 range. With custom cuts would be in the $14,000 - $16,000. So I think those quotes are pretty decent.
Can your paver technique be used as a shed foundation?
Absolutely. I have done this method for a ton of shed pads... Works great 👌
I have a heavy clay subsoil. I've been told it's "good" clay. I want to add a patio in the corner of my house. The slope is already what it needs to be. Can I just add paver base right on top of the clay soil without digging down?
If the base does not need to be excavated, then yes. Just be sure to spread the thin layer of stone and compact. then follow the the other instructions of the video ✌
What is the geo grid material you are using?
It is a product that helps lock the base stone together and helps prevent shifting / sinking. Here is a link to the product (GeoGrid). 👉srwproducts.com/products/geogrid/
What do you guys figure in for compaction when figuring height for the screed pipes? Thanks!
We figure a 1/4" extra for compaction ✌
@@TheChristianHardscaper Thanks! That's what we do too. But we just switched to using the open grade base last year so I wanted to make sure haha. Your videos have been such a huge help with the switch, I can't thank you enough!!!
@@Chris-bn5cv That's awesome! How are you liking it so far? I love this method, so many benefits ✌
@@TheChristianHardscaper I love it! Vastly superior coming from 3/4 process base and sand bedding. Couldn't pay me to go back haha. So much nicer to work with. I'm in CT and I think it has definitely helped with the crazy freeze thaw cycles we have been getting the last few winters.
@@Chris-bn5cv Where are you sourcing the 3/8 or 1/4 chip stone from? I am northwest of Hartford and I am having trouble finding the chip stone for the screed base.
Seem like you using 3/4 stone only. You not using crush n runs at all?
Correct, I use only clean, crushed stone for my base material. Then smaller clean, crushed stone for the bedding material. Here is another video which explains my base prep in more detail 👉 th-cam.com/video/ChaJe3JqD6I/w-d-xo.html
Is 3/4 stone the same as #78 granite?
Yes, basically the same thing ✌
Do you have to dig 15 inches down?
In dense clay situations, it is a really good thing to do.
Where you purchased the fabric
I buy it from a couple local masonry supply stores.
What happen to your Kubota. What, you want to keep it new. 😊
🤣 The Kubota is doing great! Unfortunately I am very far behind on job videos, this is from back in May, a couple months before I got the Kubota. I have been using it though, a few jobs in already and it is running awesome ✌
has stone went up in your neck of the woods? I went to sleep one day and it was 50 per ton woke up it was 75 per ton. massive loss. im going to have to invest in some of those pipes. I normally form it up like concrete and i end up losing my sticks, I so hate when my clients walk on my screed rocks. I had one that had a dog, and i came back the next day and the d*** dog ruined my base.
Stone has went up a little around here, but not too much. I have heard from others a few times that 3/4 clean stone is very expensive in their area.... I get 3/4 stone for $30 - $45 per cubic yard. If you had a nice shop and were able to buy in bulk, you can get it for around $20-$25 per cubic yard. And I totally hear you on the dog thing. That has happened to me a couple times, very frustrating.... 🤣✌
tell you he ordered the wrong stone after he dumps.