Why I just quit my Product Manager job at TikTok
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 พ.ค. 2024
- i just quit my job at tiktok. last week. ⊙﹏⊙
this isn't super easy for me to talk about, but I hope my story can help give insight to how people like me think through big career transitions. we always see the successes on people's linkedins, but how one chapter ends and another begins isn't always talked about. i hope this perspective brings more transparency and helps others tackle their own career questions so they can make more meaningful and intentional decisions in their professional journeys.
so what's next? well, i'm gonna share how i'm figuring all of that out in next week's video (& on ig), so stay tuned ~ (subscribe w/ notifs!) for now, i really just gotta chill and take care of all the things i've neglected while working. ✌️💖
yours,
chlo・ᴗ・
📚 chapters 📚
0:00 - intro
1:36 - reason #1
4:35 - reason #2
8:30 - reason #3
10:34 - reason #4
11:48 - my reflections
13:14 - why I share this
✨ faq ✨
name: chloe (she/her)
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what's this channel about? my career as a product manager in tech and my adulting diaries going thru life
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Just got rejected for a Product role at TikTok after 5 rounds over the course of almost 2 months…and this video just popped up. Maybe its for the best, thanks for sharing!
Take your skills somewhere else king! ✊🏾
Things happen for a reason. Take it as a blessing in disguise.
You’ll end up where you need to be 🙏 I know that pain, this happened to me recently with my dream job.
I hate tech interviews for this reason exactly
5 rounds? Seriously. I feel like that is so disrespectful for the time of the interviewee. 5 rounds is not necessary to determine if someone is a good candidate, period.
My wife works at TikTok as a Product Manager. And it's 100% what you described.... Personally, I think it's a distorted lifestyle and I'd always said treat this as a landing pad from something greater and better. Well done to you Chloe for mustering up the courage to quit! I also like your direct style in performance meetings - that is 100% the way to do it.
No company is worth giving up 16 hours a day for, especially since you're not an owner of the company.
Right? That's insane! I work 30-40 hrs a week & can barely keep up...
exactly
Hi Chloe! I'm also a product manager at TikTok and I 100% relate. The work culture is very toxic (esp. in China offices), people would compete who stayed the latest at work and blamed people who left at 8pm (which is already pretty late for me). PUA culture is also very true and it keeps making myself questioning whether I'm a capable PM. I do not get recognized for the hard work I've done, the leadership encouraged taking over other people's scope in order to get a promotion, co-workers backstabbing everyone... unfortunately I've experienced all of this and it's been making me really sad and wanting to quit :( I really appreciate you sharing this and just wanted to say that you made the right choice and I'm accumulating my courage to make the decision too !
It's true. The word toxic accurately describes the current vibe here in TikTok.
It's still a good company with an abundance of talents and kind people that I do not regret working with. it's still a good company if you want to do exciting projects or try crazy thoughts, as long as you don't expect to climb the corporate ladder with certain fairness. Otherwise, choose teams cautiously. Hope for the best for all bytedancer!
It takes a lot of courage to post this, so thank you! Managers who just judge your performance but don’t help you with the clear path to growth is so relatable. I actually worked at TikTok (when it had just rebranded) before making the decision to jump to esports & looking back, it was the right decision (even though I absolutely loved my coworkers there) but the problems are pervasive across all companies.
Omg! Hello ex-TikToker!
These problems are definitely not new, unfortunately. :( I'm glad you made the switch into esports and I hope your new role has been treating you far better!
How did you jump into esports please, currently looking at moving into gaming and esports
Do you have a direct contact with workers, I’ve been trying to recover my account & no one has got back to me and I can’t get in it b/c they changed my email and number
I promise no one there is handling that culture "just fine." Everyone is burnt out and upset about it. Some people are just better at hiding it. Remind yourself of that when you feel like you failed because you didn't stay longer.
Hi Blue! Thank you for your support! I did get a lot of messages after posting this video that they’re going through extremely similar things and it was great to feel seen here. We really don’t talk about this in enough specificity to be actionable. :(
As a career manager of 20+ years, my biggest trigger was a lack of clearly defined goals for leveling. Completely unacceptable in 2021. That would be the first in warning sign to leave ANY company. Not even for leveling but for anything. As seen in your example this leaves too much room for... "opinions. Which never works and leaves room for discrimination, nepotism, favoritism and many other isms. Imagine if the board of directors measured the top brass in the same way... in fact... actually nevermind.
Thank you very much for this post. Well done and well said. This needs to be done more often!
20 years! Super seasoned!! Thank you for validating this experience as well. A lot of senior execs tell us that “we’re on a rocket ship. We won’t have all the processes figured out, but we’re working on it. You should just be focused on making big impact”. These all sounds “fine” at first, but in the end, leveling and concrete career development are pushed aside, which then leads to all the things you mentioned. It is a yellow flag that turns in a red one real fast!
This comment is so valuable and it took me so long to figure it out. Ask the company or hiring manager how he defines success (and bonus points if it is a number). If he can't give you a straight answer, he probably hasn't thought about it. This is a red flag! You don't want to extend the pain of working in the wrong environment because you failed to ask these questions when you got hired.
what does leveling mean
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
This is a great video, Chloe. We all can tell this has not been an easy decision for you, but seriously GOOD FOR YOU to put yourself first and walk away from a situation that was no longer serving you and respecting your boundaries. A lot of good will come out of this, and the fact that you are so candidly paying it forward on YT will also bring you many good things that you can’t even predict yet. Wishing you all best, and thanks for sharing this experience.
Hi Nelson 👋 Ahh yes it was pretty hard. I went back and forth a lot while filming, editing, and almost uploading. Im glad you found it helpful!! That’s all I was hoping for. :)
I’m interviewing for Tiktok right now and culture is sooo important to me. Thanks for giving a heads up on what it might be like there.
Glad you’re getting extra signals! I do want to say that not every team will have this experience. Honestly, I really wish I could have stayed. There were plenty of other teams that recruited me and I think their situations were pretty great. I just didn’t see a full fit for my career focus, team culture, and leadership opportunities all in one. Make sure you do your due diligence with the direct teams you’re interested in!
It certainly made me think thrice about considering a career at Tik Tok in future
Culture has been underestimated in the sense that it drives people and things.
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
This is the first video I ever watched from you, but you're incredibly brave for posting this. I feel like more and more people, especially women, are opening up on their workplace experiences. I find this really important that we can finally start talking openly about our workplace experiences, good or bad, since the workforce is usually forced to remain quiet out of fear for retaliation. Especially women. You're doing yourself and a lot of people a huge service by sharing this. So thank you. I can only imagine how much consideration this must have taken to post this.
Thank you for sharing these stories publicly. I have worked back to back at a handful of very toxic companies over the last few years, many with similar themes to what you've shared. It made me feel absolutely crazy and gaslit, and it has taken me over a year of therapy to even START to feel somewhat better. Hearing stories like yours helps me feel less crazy, less alone in these struggles.
I am very saddened to hear you experienced this, and applaud your bravery at sharing these stories. I hope you find peace and greener pastures.
Hey Chloe, thanks for speaking up about this. I experienced this myself working in a SEA office 2 years ago. I thought that maybe things might have changed since then but your video shows otherwise. Honestly, you really need to be in tune with their way of doing things if you want to climb in the company. Glad you’re moving onto a place that really appreciates you! All the best in your future endeavours!
Love this video so much Chloe! So refreshing to hear someone share their work experiences because it really is something that's never discussed and everyone always feel alone when going through these things! Thank you for sharing with us!
I'm so, so glad you shared your experience, Chloe!!! I don't think I could ever be as articulate as you, and I hope you know that a lot of folks are going to feel so validated hearing your story. I'm wishing you all the best in finding a workplace that gives you what you're looking for
Hi Pam!! Thank you for your words of support! I wish I could’ve shared more details. There were so many WOC stories that happened to my friends that I wanted to bring to light. There were also so many tense microaggression moments that are so nuanced to talk about in a 15 min video :(. I just wish that being a WOC doesn’t hold people back in their careers soon. Wishing you the best in your career as well!! 🥰
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
Thank you for sharing publicly about this, Chloe. I'm frankly shocked about some of the feedback managers shared with you, terrible! I'm glad you found the courage to pick up your stuff and leave, to pursue a life that's more aligned with your values. I also appreciate that this is not a 'kicking back' video, but that you shared your personal experience and also noticed the good/interesting things that happen there.
Girl! The way that I can relate to every thing you are saying! You explained this so well and very respectfully. I’m proud of you for taking that leap and thank you for the courage to admit that things were not working out. It sounds so difficult to go through what you dealt with. I hope your health continues to improve more. I recently left my last employer for just about the same reasons and also has issues sleeping.
Chloe,
I'm so glad you posted this. It is so hard to know what is a toxic work culture when you are living it. Your outline helps us all recognize the signs. So many of those examples were truly unbelievable to hear. I am glad you made the decision that was right for you.
I can't wait to see what's in store for your future. I look forward to more updates/videos!
Hi Roy! I’m glad you found this video helpful! Seeing the signs made it so much easier for me when I realized what was happening. I’m glad this information helps others see the patterns to help make the right decisions in their lives! I definitely plan on sharing more about my journey on this channel ~
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
Whoa so cool of you to share this! You sound like an exceptional leader!!
Ah thank you for the kind words! I'm def just trying to share some of my honest thoughts in this process. Appreciate your support on this!
So insightful! I'm glad you're teaching others about this. It takes a lot to change the culture of a company and industry.
I think it may be the case where it's a function of insisting on an 80s working culture in today's environment. True it now will take a lot to change, but that needed not have happened in the first place.
Thank you @Stella!! You’ve seen me through the years struggling at different companies haha. It’s been a long time coming and I hope to share more of these battles publicly to bring more awareness to how people treat each other when there’s no accountability.
A lot of this is more to do with Chinese working culture bleeding over to overseas entities as well.
Most American tech companies are notoriously lax in their work culture (e.g. LinkedIn).
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
Thank you for speaking out and for giving ex employees like myself a voice to speak the truth in such a graceful way ❤️
One thing I have learned in my entire career life, being too outspoken doesn’t brings you anywhere but actually created the air of intimidation especially to your superior.
I support you, Chloe. Thank you for sharing. I understand you deeply, you are strong and better things are coming. Grateful for you and your experience!
Thank you so much for sharing this. This really hit home for me, about the division I used to be a Product Manager for, that I left for good. Once you go through that it's hard to recover and get used to a healthier work environment. Thank you for highlighting all of these. Especially the part about negging / gas-lighting. I had gone through that before but haven't realized how toxic that was till now.
Thank you so much for sharing your story! It’s so helpful to hear things like this so that other people know it’s okay to walk away from an environment that just isn’t suiting their needs. Hope you find a great new opportunity that empowers you and gives you some work life balance!
Hi Alisa!! Wow - another PM!! :D And yes, learning to walk away isn't an easy thing, but I'm glad I've been able to exercise that muscle this time around.
What I learned from this clip is that we need to set clear boundaries and identify our non-negotiatabels. This will be the foundation of any decision we make throughout our careers.
This is so valuable! Thank you so much for sharing ❤️
My goodness, coming across this video today is a blessing. Ive just been thrashed of hike, let alone a promotion after slogging a whole year! Thankyou for being honest and open about it.
Amazing amount of self reflection.. I truly appreciate authentic content like this that comes from a space of vulnerability. Thank you Chloe and all the best to you :)
Thank you for the transparency on this! It takes a lot of courage to share about these topics, my fear has been the backlash of potential new employers. But when I shared my video on being fired from a toxic job, it was scary yet therapeutic.
So happy to hear from you on this topic. I have faced few of those and yes, life is so short to take any form of negativity. Found out tests should really be carried out by employees on companies they would work for, regardless of their assumed workplace culture. The words in the book "You don't have to be mad to work here..." still ring bells in my head when I evaluate companies I would want to work with.
Totally agree. I had to have very honest conversations with my friends and therapist that I can also choose not to work at a place that brings me negativity. Life's too short to deal with these kinds of places!
I appreciate your transparency & honesty in this video Chloe! I too recently left my job due to toxic culture. A culture which I unfortunately see with my own eyes over the years of how the act of 'constantly looking out for each other' is a facade. It's like exactly what you said of "people who thrive are the ones who put people down when they’re being chewed out". Looking forward to you being able to work in a better workplace and not experiencing this horror again! 😊
Thank you for sharing Chloe! You’re amazing! Bravo to you for doing what’s best for you, I know it’s hard. Sending you good vibes and positivity! 😊❤️
It's not easy to speak up for a topic like this. I agree health should be the first priority. Thank you so much for sharing, Chloe!
Ah it took so much going back and forth for me to finally decide. I was even scared wild filming and while editing. I’m glad the message got through. Thank you for your support, Alice!
Thanks for articulating the various issues which "leaders" or "maangement" always try to make it seem an non-issue, probably because it's due to themselves not having any incentive to deal with it. You take care and I think you are really a amazing individual, clearly intelligent and a go-getter who dare to share what you want. You are my new role model.
Thank you for being vulnerable and share this publicly.
Thanks for sharing this. It took a lot of courage & vulnerability to post this. It shows that the grass isn’t greener on the other side. And gives a great warning to newer people in the work place. Not to mention, what women deal with in the workplace as a whole. Super proud of you and thanks for sharing your experience and being a role model. 💕
Thanks Chloe for coming out and sharing this story. I could 100% relate to you, as someone who used to work in a tech company with similar leadership and culture as TikTok (I shall not name it - it’s a public listed company in the US market and one of the very first unicorns in SEA). I totally agree that health took a big toll on me, not just physical but also mental health, and was one of the main reasons for my resignation. It took me a year to realize and had the courage to quit, despite the fact that I had to take a pay cut in the next company. But I felt so much relieved and I never regretted it. As your friend said, health cannot be traded for anything.
Having said that, it doesn’t mean the company is totally bad. On a bright side, I have met so many great colleagues who still remain friends until today and I’ve learned sooo much in such a short period of time. It’s just that this culture is not for everyone, and we all have different priorities in our career.
Ah I’m sorry to hear you went through this before :( I wish this weren’t so common. Health really cannot be traded. I gotta challenge myself to put health first in my next step.
I am so sorry to hear what you have gone thru and happy at the same time as you have decided to move on. You will do great in other places. I truly understand the importance of mental peace while working as a PM and it should be non-negotiable.
Hi Sam 👋 thank you for your words of support. Mental peace does so much for us. Will always cherish that!
thank you so much for your vulnerability. ALL of your experiences (sadly) resonated with me and this video makes me feel .. so many feelings-- Less alone, seen, and enraged that so many others go through this, etc. Cheers to you and your honesty. Thanks for speaking out for the rest of us!
Chloe you articulated this so well! I went through a very similar thing and it is awful to feel your feelings are invalid. Excited for your future and sending you so much love🌞
Thank you for being so open and putting this together so well! This is incredibly well done and you are doing what's right for you. Excited for your growth and future!
Felix!! Thank you for continued support. Excited for the next step as well!
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
Toxic environments still exists, And while I've experience a good bit of them, I've never experienced what you did so directly like that. You're such a strong woman Chloe! I'm glad you took action and at the same treated it as a learning experience and improved from it. (I keep adding something more to say, but keep removing it cause, well it's mean. Let's just say I'm super aggravated that you had to experience this kind of treatment. I probably would not have taken it so well.) I'm proud of you Chloe!
Hi Kevin! Ah I know. Unfortunately, my time here wasn’t the worst that I’ve experienced in my career. In an unfortunate way, my previous toxic workplaces built up a lot of my skin so I was pretty prepared coming here. I really don’t think it should be the norm for people to experience this, and I hope employers set up accountability to encourage treating people right all over the industry
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
I love that you posted this video. This topic is usually “hushed”. The same experience you had happened to me recently as well. I am a Sr PM in Tech as well. I am very happy you posted about this, it’s common in the industry but never talked about.
LinkedIn brought me here. I'm glad you shared your story. Definitely something that does not get talked about enough! Thank you again for sharing and bringing awareness to this topic so others can learn from your experience. It's always important to put yourself first over your job!!
I can totally relate from working at another company. What I’ve learned is a job is just a job, and you should always be prepared to leave. Also, while feedback is good and helps you grow, there can be so many awful people who just give bad feedback and with bad intentions, so just take it as a grain of salt and always always always know your worth! Find a place where they value you. I’m happy to say I’m working at a much better place and getting paid more. I had to think through and deal with some of the trauma I had from my old work. It’s not easy but I believe it made me stronger and more resilient. There are bullies in the workplace and they are actively trying to push people down just for the sake to make themselves look better and/or they really want to hurt someone they deem as a threat. They know how to play the system and be buddies with the right people. They will not hold back because in their mind it’s you or them. Every company has these kinds of people but when the company and its culture encourages and is apathetic to these types of people and their behavior, it’s a huge sign this place is toxic.
Hey Chloe, thanks for being so bold to step up & voice out your experience. It's a courageous action to put a limit to things and to prioritize what is truly important to you. Keep goin gurl! Believe that your body & mind will thank you for taking care of them :)
Hi Jie! 👋 Ah yes it very much is. I’m still very not good at it haha, but that’s my next big growth focus. Thank you for your support!!
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
Wow! Thanks so much for having the courage to share this! I had a similar experience at a tech company, and hearing your story helped me validate a lot of my own feelings and that I wasn't crazy to expect more. I also quit! Best decision of my life! Please keep sharing your experience, you have an incredibly warm personality and the ability to articulate things so eloquently! Keep on creating! :)
Wow I'm really shocked you posted this but I'm so happy you did. Not enough people do this. I just started talking to a tiktok recruiter and your video is extremely helpful. I had heard gossip about your reason #2 but it's good to hear it from the source.
This was amazing, Chloe. Super strong & courageous. As you said, “Connection, relationships, mentorship, team building.” These are the foundations of a truly great culture which can sustain companies, communities, and nations for generations. Thank you for doing this! 👍🏻
Hey Chloe! As a fellow girl working in Tech over in Sydney (and small TH-camr), thank you for sharing your experience with everyone!
Work culture is SO important and I'm so sorry to hear you had to experience that. I'm glad you took the steps and I'm excited to hear about the next steps of your career :)
Hi Vivian! Ah yesss! Another woc in tech!! Great to chat with you. It was a tough experience but I’m excited for the next step!
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
I am sorry you had to go through all of these challenges Chloe, I am glad you made the right decision and shared your journey with us. Wish you all the best.
I’m happy you shared this, Chloe, a lot of us go through so much to get into a company just to learn that it’s agonizing, and its scary to go through that whole process again so we live with it and end up with going to therapy thrice a week
I recognized some of the burnout and unhappiness sprinkled throughout your videos. I have been in a similar situation and I'm SO happy for you. Those hours are unsustainable.
Haha I know! I definitely wanted to keep things more authentic on the vlogs. It really was not a sustainable schedule. Thank you for your continued support, KT!
Chloe! Thank you so much for putting this video out - I know it wasn't easy but it is incredibly insightful. I interviewed for TikTok this year and was extremely hesitant with going through due to the reasons you listed, which I kinda gauged from Glassdoor. As a woman of colour - psychological safety, career growth, internal sponsorship, and work-life balance is CRITICAL. TikTok is a fast-growing startup company but if it doesn't have the internal infrastructure to create a good team environment, then that's a full-stop. Success is not a success if it is at the expense of our mental health and growth. I am super glad you are putting yourself first and know your worth.
Hi Halla! Also check Blind too! I feel lots of reviews are moving there nowadays. I’m glad you were able to get the right signals for your decision. My psychological safety was truly impacted. :( Im definitely looking out for these signals for myself too!
@@chloeshih LOL I actually found your video from blind! You've come full circle girlie 👏👏
Thank you so much for sharing this. It’s hard to find guidance when you’re unhappy in a career. But you articulate your experiences so well, and I feel like you’ve helped a lot of people by doing so.
Had a similar experience as well but as a senior product designer. It's good to know that we're all starting to openly talk about how the culture can effect both our career growth and our mental / physical health. For me it got to a point where I have to take medical leave for therapy, and I hope everyone watching this video takes the most important tip here: save yourself before you need serious medical help. It's not worth it. Your relationships with friends and loved ones, your health, your outlook on life is the most important thing. You lose that health mindset, and you will be spending more money recovering over time, than what you're earning on the job. Thanks for being open and starting the conversation here Chloe.
I recently left an internship with a company I loved and hearing you talk helped me think about the reasons I left + what hope for in my next job. Thank you so much for sharing your experience!
this happens so often at companies that use 'entrepreneurial spirit' as a cop-out for unstructured development and disjointed support
I know! It’s a total cop-out. They’re like “we’re on a rocket ship and we have 10x growth which means we won’t have all the processes in place”. Which honestly is fine in principle, but it turns out to be an excuse to never think about how to make sure there’s equity and fairness for talent to develop
They’ll be like « comfortable working in an ambiguous environment! » 🙄
SO GLAD you made this video. You’re giving others the courage to speak up! And you’re also inspiring me to continue making more videos. 🚀🚀🚀
Thank you so much for sharing this - Very appreciate that you are so candid & transparent on the challenges that you faced. One of the most helpful videos on Chinese tech culture & PM work I've seen. Good luck on your next endeavor.
Good for you Chloe! No amount of money or high status position justifies ruining your mental and physical health! I think you are a very bright inspiring person and I look up to you! Cheers Martin
Agreed! But honestly I’m still struggling with that. It’s definitely easy to say but hard for me to judge when the hard work weeks come. :( hope I can keep growing to develop healthier habits and boundaries! Thank you for dropping a comment.
I felt so much from watching this and hearing you speak your truth Chloe. I've been thru this before. Except i didn't know how to express it. People didn't believe me when I tried to explain it. Proud of you for sharing and esp documenting the incidents.
It took me a while to write this 😭😭 there was so much I initially wrote but trimmed out a lot and kept things vague in fear of retaliation or idk anything really. I’m sorry to hear that you went through something similar too. Hope you’re in a much better place!
Thank you for sharing Chloe!!! Your thoughts are insightful and trustworthy. Wish you luck and health with the upcoming journey!!!
Thank you so much Chloe for sharing your story. I truly admire your bravery, vulnerability and authenticity.
It takes a lot of courage to speak about these issues openly, big kudos!
Hi JJ!! 👋 It really is. :( thank you for the kudos!
I was so triggered the entire time. I've experienced all of this before in a toxic company and I'm proud of you for leaving!
Ahhh I should have provided a trigger warning. I’m sorry to hear that you experienced this too. It really should not be this common!! :( thank you for your words of support, DivineFeelings!
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
Chloe Shih's space is incredible! Her tech and product management videos are a game-changer for me. I've learned so much and feel inspired to pursue a career in these fields. Thank you, Chloe, for sharing your expertise and making it accessible to aspiring professionals like me!
I am so glad I watched this video before I apply! Thank you!! Work wellbeing is so important for me to perform well at work. I'm happy for you to get out of the toxic environment. May you have a new, happy & healthy career ahead! ❤️👍
Appreciate your courage and transparency, Chloe!
Thank you for sharing your support, Evelyn!!
This was so incredibly insightful - particular your first reason, about progression and unclear growth. Such an important thing to consider - yes a team can be great, but if they aren't transparent about your growth 👀
Unclear growth is such a trap!! :( such a red flag because they don’t ever prioritize it.
👏YES👏 GIRL👏
So proud of you Chloe! Thank you for your bravery in sharing your story. It's vital we share these stories with the world. Your courage here is deeply appreciated.
Rooting for you in your next journey!
Thank you Sonya!!! 🥰🥰🥰 appreciate your support!
Appreciate your voice. These types of things are so important to air publicly. Support.
Hi Chloe, I remember commenting on your video, Day in a Life as a PM, and I am just so proud of you for taking your stand here and realizing how toxic the environment is. I wish you all the best in your next move and I can't wait to hear more from you soon. Thank you so much for being transparent.
Haha yes I’m sure some people can tell it was not a sustainable schedule. Thank you for your continued support!
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
This was so hard to watch because it was triggering. I experienced a lot of paper cuts at a company that is supposed to be a “good culture” and it came to a point that I can no longer stand to be in the industry anymore. Thanks for sharing and normalizing this conversation. Sending you healing vibes ✨
Chloe you are a very strong and successful person. All this should not bring you down, as it might be done intentionally to break you and force you to give up. I went through the same situation in one of the start-ups and went through the same as you just said. I will carefully choose the company I would want to work with and it's okey if it takes time. It took me a little effort to gear back and now I am unstoppable. Love to you, lady.
Love this video. Most of us just get pushed by the waves and never realize what and where we are in. Your videos really help things into perspective so people can have a chance to make the right decision for themselves. Thanks for sharing!
Thank you for sharing this Chloe. I appreciate your voice, intent and optimism. It seems that most of the individuals you dealt with at Bytedance carries similar gaslighting and suppresive traits. I suppose these aren’t a concern during HR screening for a company which I dare to say still defining its values and culture. Am glad you have transcended from this episode and will definitely move on to greater heights. Thank you!
It was unfortunate, but I’m sure the people I’ve worked with are all good, hardworking people. I think it is really the system and the lack of accountability that allows for this type of behavior to happen. Interviews are actually pretty disorganized there D: we had a lot of inconsistencies, but I hope they improve!
Thanks for sharing this Chloe! As a mum of 2 myself, hearing about the Culture part and how many hours you were working, it's ridiculous and impossible (and just wrong) to ask that of you or anyone. Sounds like you made the best decision. Remember no job is worth your mental health. All the best in your career path x
Thank you for being brave enough to share your experiences. This is helpful, not only to those that may be considering working for TikTok, but for everyone that is in the workforce and may be facing similar challenges.
Thanks for sharing Chloe. This is super helpful for emerging managers and leaders. I know I struggle with guiding careers and advice. it’s helpful to hear such a candid and considerate account of how culture has an impact on team members
Speaking from further down the line Chloe, you've absolutely made the right decision. I resigned from the UN late last year, after many of the issues you've experienced affected me also. So much so, it was not only affecting my own health, but my family's directly too. I had missed my daughters first year entirely due to 70+hr working weeks and with my Chief of Mission's callous and sociopathic leadership style, I couldn't give any more of myself to facilitate her journey to the top. It's been the best decision I've ever made. However, with similar negging and gaslighting behaviours from my CoM, prepare yourself for bouts of self-doubt, esteem rebuilding and a feeling of loss or grief. They will pass, of course. But, if I could give you any one piece of advice it's this... be kind to yourself, be proud and reassured that you were in the role for a reason and particularly give yourself enough time to step into a new role again. Don't rush. Just breathe.
Hi Eoghanaldo 👋 I’m sorry to hear about your insanely rough experiences at the UN. :( you would think such a reputable place would have accountability for this, but the reality doesn’t reflect that. I’m honestly so worried about this trend in the workplace to dedicate so many waking hours to “emergencies” at work especially when I will have children. I definitely don’t ever want to miss special events for my family in the future and am building the muscles to keep healthy boundaries now.
Thank you for your kind messages and words of wisdom!
I’ve heard UN is highly political and toxic. Such an irony because they stand for human rights. 🤦🏻♀️
@@chloeshih Being honest Chloe, it was rough indeed, but I'm a white European male and know it could've been so much worse if I had been of other demographics. I've heard of, and seen, people at a variety of other locations and of other ethnicities, gender and cultural backgrounds loaded with far more additional behaviours linked to those factors.
That being said, I share your thoughts in having to highlight that the misbehaviour I experienced is often displayed at senior leadership levels. These are levels where a corporate race attitude purveys. It's 1%. I couldn't and cannot say anything to the detriment of the hundreds of thousands of general and lower professional staff within the UN who sacrifice so much daily. They're the ones really who keep the ship steered the right way 🙂.
I think it's interesting though the contrast, or lack thereof, between agile and modern leadership often highlighted within tech and the hierarchical archaic version seen in older institutions. Often, they come full circle to the classic, kill or be killed carnivore leader who is threatened by collaboration and resistent of supporting others along their journey. It's a certain human nature for some to abuse their way to seniority.
Thank you for shining a light on an industry that often goes under the radar when it comes to employee welfare. Wishing you all the very best in your next steps Chloe! Enjoy this time 🙂
You have no idea how much your post resonated with me! Thank you for sharing your experience and advice.
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
So proud of you!!! Moving away from a toxic environment is not easy, you go girl!!! X
I really isnt! Thank you for your words of support!
Thanks for boldly sharing your experience! I feel very relevant to your story. When I perform well, my female manager were encouraging me and was always happy for me, but my new male manager just got jealous of me getting along with people who are new to the team and helping them. I am very proud of you and love to help others to grow like you in the future.
Wow, I needed to hear this 10 years ago. I know exactly how you're feeling. My advice to you is to do something you're passionate about and would love to do. I mean, something you get up in the morning and want to do. You can work for yourself or someone else, but always enjoy what you do. It won't feel like a job anymore but more like a part of who you are.
This is wild. Thank you so much for sharing Chloe and putting it all out there! Really hard to get true behind the scene experiences and people are so taboo talking about the impact on their mental health.
It really is quite taboo! I always hear it in my private chats or 1:1s with friends, but on our socials, we always post how great it’s been and how excited we are. Hope this helps reveal the harder decisions we make in career!
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
Omg I had never heard of workplace PUA before, it’s wild that there is even a term for this behavior 😢 thank you for sharing your experiences here, Chloe! It is so brave of you and also so importantly for others out there to know that they are not alone and there are other possibilities out there in life!
Same here! Was so wild for me to learn about that! I’m not the expert on it though - just heard it from another colleague who shared a few articles. Wish I never had to make a video about this in the first place :(
As a guy, I never heard of it either. Kind of sleazy! And weird! Who goes to work with that kind of mentality? I just want to do my job and best of my ability!
to whomever is reading this, wishing you the best possible day/night -- remember, what we think, we become!
i really like how real this topic is and how brave you are.
Not so many people have the courage to share.
Thank you so much for this video and for telling us Chloe, it's tough... I've been experiencing some of the things you mention here and it's just not worth getting frustrated constantly from work. I really hope you join a workplace where you feel all your needs and desires are met! And also get the recognition and growth you deserve! Sending lots of love 💕 I love your channel so much 😊
I work remotely from Colombia for a US tech startup and there are a lot of moments that have me constantly feel like I'm not good enough as a PM, and I've been stuck as a Junior for 2 years now. I'm the only PM and leading Product but I'm not really getting any recognition and I'm constantly chasing a bar that seems to go higher everytime I speak to my manager, who's the CEO. We're only 2 women who are direct hires out of 16 people. It just feels so frustrating to be demanded for improvement but not really having any training and most of what I do I have to figure it out myself. But still, I will "eventually demonstrate that I'm a PM"...
You explained everything I went through in my last position. When I tried reaching out to HR they came back and called me a liar which is when I knew enough was enough. It's unfortunate that this happens way more than it should, especially for females in the tech field. Good for you for getting out and talking about it!
Ally!! Omg this happens just way too often. I’m constantly shocked at how HR at companies tend to react when there are sticky situations at work. More often than not, the person at the “lower rank” gets booted out even when the senior manager is the person at fault. :( calling you a liar is so out of pocket. I’m glad you’re out of there too!!
@@chloeshih When the overall working environment is bad in a company, don’t expect how good the HR team can be, they partially represent the working culture already. Some signs can be found even during the first round interview with them.
Chloe you have no idea how much this video means to me and prob a lot of others! I've experienced similar toxic work cultures and I'm glad you're speaking out on them. I hope more people can speak out and things will change. But I wish you the best in your career and I look forward to more of your videos. Ooo, also would love to see the template :)
I absolutely love this insight and transparency. Also a very relatable experience as a WOC in tech. So glad you put you first!
Ah it is such a difference experience as an WOC in tech! Glad this video resonated with you - wishing you the best on your career journey!
I’ve been exploring product roles recently to try and see if I want to pivot into it as it is so glorified online. thank you for sharing a side that most people don’t and hope your new role is way more healthy for you!
Good for you Chloe for standing up for what you believe in. I've read so much about the toxic culture at bytedance in Chinese media, (people resign within a month is not rare). You're so awesome, and I'm sure other top tech companies would be lucky and happy to have you.
Hi Amy 👋 ah yeah tenure is pretty low here and onboarding is very challenging to do remote, across time zones, and across cultures. I’m glad you enjoyed this video!! I’m excited for the next chapter as well!
Thank you for speaking up! I'm in Monetization rn looking to head into Product later, hopefully we can contribute to a healthier environment and push leadership. Best of luck and happiness to you
can't thank you enough for putting this out. Went through so much of this same shit. "Not every hill is worth dying on". you got me.
Thank you, sincerely, for sharing your experience. I went through a similar experience at my last company and came to very similar conclusions. Your courage for sharing your experience publicly has definitely help validate, in part, similar decisions to focus on what makes sense for me. Double high five on the aspect around health and time with loved ones. Late night zoom meetings with China meant not being able to spend time with my children and that just killed me inside. I spent so much time trying to convince my partner that this is worth it that I stopped believing it myself. Absolutely agree that no amount of money can be traded for your health and happiness. No amount of money can buy back time. Congrats and good luck. Not sure how this video came across my TH-cam feed, but I'm glad it did and I wish to continue to follow your journey onwards!
ngl, I had an identical experience with my product manager job in digital bank that I left recently. crappy culture behind closed doors, unreasonable expectations placed on a PM's shoulders to have thought of everything and unclear paths of progress moving up the promotional ladder. It's comforting to know that others are experiencing similar stuff too, thanks for sharing!
oof sounds like a tough environment and glad you got out of it. i've worked in banking and while i didn't go through the same struggles as you, definitely know what toxic co-workers and a no-sleep work culture is like. this was a very insightful video looking into the cultures of one of the most successful companies of all time - thank you for sharing and wish you all the best with your next opportunity!
Omg banking sounds so scary to me based on what I’ve heard. I joined tech because I thought the culture would be nicer.
Thank you for your words of support! I hope to continue to share!
This story is so shocking! I’m so glad you have decided to share your story! Hopefully this would influence changes in the organization for others to benefit from your courage and actions.
I hear the courage, reflection, and self awareness it took to think this through and take a carefully considered decision and put plans in place to give yourself the freedom of your decision. Sounds like it was their loss! I hope you find work that is rewarding and fulfilling going forward. You share excellent learning points. Thankyou.
It’s so unfortunate that this happens to far too many people in so many tech companies, moving goal posts when it comes to promos, managers putting pressure on their reports to “prove” to them that they deserve to be promoted when it’s literally their job to manage to your success… backstabbing between a colleagues, list go on for ages. Good for you for drawing a line in the sand and getting out of there. Hope your next role is more rewarding professionally and interpersonally.